From what I understand of Guild Wars, a class has 1 primary attributes and some secondary attributes. right?
What about an option to create customizeable classes. You would choose 1 primary attributes from the list of all primary attributes for all pre made classes. Then you would choose 5 secondary attributes from all available secondary attributes. This covers both your primary and secondary classes.
If there is still limitation on armor and looks, then you would choose the class model for your character looks and armor. For example, archer looks.
2)
I don't know if they have this already in GW1, but the ability to have an epic battle where maybe 5 guilds storm a castle or a dungeon. Or maybe armies battling armies, like a mock Medieval style battle. Both PvP and PvE epic battle.
3)
Chat logging features. Also, the ability to copy and paste to and from chat.
4)
Friend list like an IM telling you when your friend is on.
1. The Primary attributes are bound to the Primary profession because it's what best fits that profession. Assassins get a extra % to land a critical strike plus energy gain when they do, Warriors get a % of armour penetration, Monks get a bonus to heals, Elementalists get a larger energy pool to fuel their spells etc etc.
Also you have a limited amount of attribute points you can get (maximum 200). Spending those points incurs an exponential cost. You can raise one attribute to 12, which requires as many points as having 2 attributes at 9. So having too many different attributes would most probably be unpractical and/or uneffective, you'd spread your attribute points too thin.
Also let's consider the PvP implication: "Ok what's that guy? A Nuker? A tank? wtf he's healing... And raising minions? Err..." You'd spend half of the match trying to figure out just what the heck those guys are.
2. There are already similar skirmishes. Three teams battling it out to control an altar. Alliance Battles are kind of close, it's 3 groups of 4 players per sides.
3. Chat logging, why not... Might not even have to wait for GW2. Copy/paste is already available in a way: You can send your Skill setup to chat using a few clicks. Also you can scroll through your own lines and send them to different channels if needed, though not other players' comments.
4. Already in game!! Friend list even tracks the whole account, meaning if you add a player, you will also see when they are online on an alt.
I am probably going to sound harsh though seriously, have some experience of GW before posting that kind of stuff.
I like to have something specific to do like "go to X and stay there and defend it" or something along those lines.
That's pretty much the Factions-specific PvP matches.
Yep. My point was I personally do better with more specific instructions and duties rather than going in and running around like a chicken with my head cut off. I'll never make a very good group leader 'cause I'm not a leader at all. I play a few other MMO's and have never played a tank because for the most part, they are expected to lead the group and if someone told me to take the lead I'd just start laughing. "Get yer rez ready"
Sunspear and Lightbringer ranks are a major timesink and grind, which is surprising coming from a game and devs that have always promoted GW as being "grind-free." If GW feels "bloated" (according to a recent quote from one of the devs), it's because Nightfall moved it that way.
If it weren't for the heroes and some cool end-game weapons, I wouldn't spend another minute there. Just had a blast running a couple of characters through the Southern Shiverpeak missions. Ahhh, the classics.
Sunspear and Lightbringer ranks are a major timesink and grind, which is surprising coming from a game and devs that have always promoted GW as being "grind-free."
Yet titles have never been mandatory in any way whatsoever. The PvP component is still grind free. That way they gave PvE players something to chew on without impairing the competitive side of the game. Rather smart if you ask me...
Sunspear and Lightbringer ranks are a major timesink and grind, which is surprising coming from a game and devs that have always promoted GW as being "grind-free."
Yet titles have never been mandatory in any way whatsoever. The PvP component is still grind free. That way they gave PvE players something to chew on without impairing the competitive side of the game. Rather smart if you ask me...
I love it when people complain about optional items... If you don't like it, don't do it. Game wise, you get all the SS points you need to progress by just following the mission and quest arc. Just because you don't have to grind, doesn't not mean you can't grind. I am going after the SS/LB titles, so guess what I am farming/grinding those.
As for GW 2
* Auction House
* Increased PvP options
* A Team Kick Option - Team leader has ability to kick (/kick *insert name*) a member of a party of three or more by voting much like the /resign feature. This won't happen unless everyone but that person types that in, and this removes the player and all his or her heros/henchies.
"It is easier to be cruel than wise. The road to wisdom is long and difficult... so most people just turn out to be assholes" Feng (Christopher Walken)
Actually Lightbringer ranks are somewhat mandatory as you progress towards Nightfall's endgame. As for Sunspear points, they are mandatory for Nightfall characters to progress through primary quests until you reach rank 7 (Sunspear General). So while Lightbringer points aren't completely mandatory, they're not completely optional, either, unless you plan on spending the endgame face down in the dirt more often than not.
Sunspear points - on the other hand - ARE required for NF characters until you get 2500 of them. After that, they're completely pointless for everybody (and pointless for all non-NF characters even before that).
As to the rest, you guys are missing the point: in a game that is promoted and sold as "grind-free", SS and LB points ARE a grind, especially for someone - like me - who has rolled 4 NF characters on two separate accounts.
Taking bounties whenever available makes Sunspear and LB points really REALLY easy to obtain, come on... Getting LB Gaze took me like 2 runs in the north eastern corner of the Mirror of Lyss. Conveniently enough the lvl 24 Roaring Ethers carry resurrection signets, and a rezzed Ether you kill again with bounty on grants you LB points.
As for the kicking option, it's been mentioned before, and I still think it's dangerous if you end up in a PuG with lamers... Say you get a nice drop, and they kick you so they can loot it...
"...and a rezzed Ether you kill again with bounty on grants you LB points."
Nope. Checked. A rezzed foe returns no LB points whatsoever. I thought they did, too, until I watched my hero stats while farming there.
You get LB Gaze at Rank 2, which is 300 LB points. Granted, you can get to rank 2 in your sleep. But you don't get rank 3 until you hit 1,000, rank 4 until you hit 2500, and rank 5 until you hit 7500. And many DoA teams won't take you UNLESS you have TS, or Vent AND at least Rank 5 in LB points (7500).
Now consider this: to farm your way to Rank 5 in Lightbringer Points in Normal Mode, which gives you a whopping 2 points per kill on unrezzed monsters, you would have to grind out 3450 monster kills outside Dzagonur Bastion (assuming you start farming at Rank 2. Most people aren't at Rank 2 when they get there). The run there generally yields 80 LB Points per run (10 groups of 4 elementals in that small area). In other words, to farm your way to Rank 5, you're going to be making 90 farming runs there. Tell me you're not grinding doing 90 repetitions of anything.
Sure, you could go to Hard Mode and double your LB points per kill, but you're still making at least 40 runs there if you do nothing else, and Hard Mode runs aren't nearly as quick and easy as Normal Mode runs.
Yes DoA is optional. And yes, farming is optional. But for people who want to participate in either - optional or not - it's still a grind. I got my first Paragon to Rank 4. He's at 2973 LB points. Haven't farmed another LB point on him since. It's simply way too freaking boring.
Again, your mileage may vary.
P.S. Sunspear points are much easier to get (once you get to Vabbi, you get 7 SS points per kill in NM, 14 in HM). But guess what? SS Points are worthless. Sunspear ranks give you hero skill points, but if you've been playing as long as I have with as many characters as I have, you've already got most of those skills unlocked anyway.
GW2 is going to have a kind of PvP like that, called world vs. world. You can bring your character into this kind of PvP at anytime you wish and accomplish certain goals to help your fellow players.
Life is 10% what happens and 90% how you react to it!
Taking bounties whenever available makes Sunspear and LB points really REALLY easy to obtain, come on... Getting LB Gaze took me like 2 runs in the north eastern corner of the Mirror of Lyss. Conveniently enough the lvl 24 Roaring Ethers carry resurrection signets, and a rezzed Ether you kill again with bounty on grants you LB points.
As for the kicking option, it's been mentioned before, and I still think it's dangerous if you end up in a PuG with lamers... Say you get a nice drop, and they kick you so they can loot it...
Secrom, that is a pretty easy fix though, just hard lock the items to the owners name. I really don't see why this isn't done now. I guess it allows people to scavenge an area but how often does that happen and you are not moving on to the next zone.
Serling - I usually agree with your points, but you have some crazy connection in your head that just because you CAN grind some things in GW that somehow GW advertising "Grind Free Game Play" is false advertising and you HAVE to grind. I beat Nightfall without having to farm LB points, so what is your complaint. If you want to do DoA but dont have r5 then start your own group without a rank req...I sure there are others like you, I was until last night. BTW...currently farming LB/SS points for titles...currently SpearMarshall (r9) and Vanquishing Lightbring (r5)
"It is easier to be cruel than wise. The road to wisdom is long and difficult... so most people just turn out to be assholes" Feng (Christopher Walken)
Well two of the things I liked about GW was the storyline and the (compared to most MMoRPGs) great monster AI. So I'd like to see the storyline to be more dramatic (maybe on par with the Final Fantasy games) than in the previous installments. Nightfall, in my opinion, had a greatly improved storyline over Prophecies but the way the story was told still wasn't quite up to with what some single player RPGs had to offer.
It would also be cool if the aforementioned monster AI could be improved. Maybe to the point where mobs could learn more advanced tactics. Something that would really make them harder to outsmart. I'm not sure to what degree that would be possible but the more the better in my opinion.
What's more is that I would like GW2 to be more about teamplay again. Heroes were cool but it still bothered me that many of the parties I joined In NF had more heroes than real players.
Lastly I really hope that Anet will continue to build upon the individual strong points of Guild Wars rather than introducing more traditional MMoRPG elements. I am fairly certain that no one who has played Guild Wars would want GW2 to be "more like WoW".
Originally posted by RPGnub It would also be cool if the aforementioned monster AI could be improved. Maybe to the point where mobs could learn more advanced tactics. Something that would really make them harder to outsmart. I'm not sure to what degree that would be possible but the more the better in my opinion.
I agree. Although Hard Mode tries to offer a more challenging AI, they only tweaked the existing AI parameters to make it harder. Adding more variety to their AI would be a welcome addition, especially now that more forms of movement is possible.
Anet really sounded determined that GW2 would not be a WoW clone in the PC Gamer issue. Eye of the North is supposed to feature much better monster AI, atleast for bosses anyway. I would expect that much since the expansion features just content for max level characters, I just wish i would spend more time hunting down skills. I miss the fact that you could get skills for just about every quest in Prophecies.
Life is 10% what happens and 90% how you react to it!
Anet really sounded determined that GW2 would not be a WoW clone in the PC Gamer issue. Eye of the North is supposed to feature much better monster AI, atleast for bosses anyway. I would expect that much since the expansion features just content for max level characters, I just wish i would spend more time hunting down skills. I miss the fact that you could get skills for just about every quest in Prophecies.
Most any fantasy based MMO is going to be compared to WoW and EQ...and if it has any similar traits (and how can it not, there is not exactly many new inventions in the MMO arena), it is going to be called a WoW or EQ clone. "What you can jump and swim...oh it is just a WoW clone. You can craft, definately a EQ clone."
Kegboyii I also never understood why they stoped giving skill quests in the other campaigns...I loved that about Prophecies. I never new what skills a NPC would give me, and it made it exciting. Now it is such a brutal gold sink that it is ridulous. I feel bad for the newbies that try to get skills that they have to purchase much earlier on. So add that the the list of things I would REALLY like to see in GW2, Skill Quests.
"It is easier to be cruel than wise. The road to wisdom is long and difficult... so most people just turn out to be assholes" Feng (Christopher Walken)
Just wanted to hijack my own thread for a brief moment to introduce you to some of my 20 characters (Yes, I have 2 accounts and zero life). Made these composite images using Photoshop CS3. I placed each grouping over the map of the campaign to which they belong. Lords of Lochmoor is my "solo" guild.
"...and a rezzed Ether you kill again with bounty on grants you LB points."Nope. Checked. A rezzed foe returns no LB points whatsoever. I thought they did, too, until I watched my hero stats while farming there.You get LB Gaze at Rank 2, which is 300 LB points. Granted, you can get to rank 2 in your sleep. But you don't get rank 3 until you hit 1,000, rank 4 until you hit 2500, and rank 5 until you hit 7500. And many DoA teams won't take you UNLESS you have TS, or Vent AND at least Rank 5 in LB points (7500). Now consider this: to farm your way to Rank 5 in Lightbringer Points in Normal Mode, which gives you a whopping 2 points per kill on unrezzed monsters, you would have to grind out 3450 monster kills outside Dzagonur Bastion (assuming you start farming at Rank 2. Most people aren't at Rank 2 when they get there). The run there generally yields 80 LB Points per run (10 groups of 4 elementals in that small area). In other words, to farm your way to Rank 5, you're going to be making 90 farming runs there. Tell me you're not grinding doing 90 repetitions of anything.Sure, you could go to Hard Mode and double your LB points per kill, but you're still making at least 40 runs there if you do nothing else, and Hard Mode runs aren't nearly as quick and easy as Normal Mode runs.Yes DoA is optional. And yes, farming is optional. But for people who want to participate in either - optional or not - it's still a grind. I got my first Paragon to Rank 4. He's at 2973 LB points. Haven't farmed another LB point on him since. It's simply way too freaking boring.Again, your mileage may vary.P.S. Sunspear points are much easier to get (once you get to Vabbi, you get 7 SS points per kill in NM, 14 in HM). But guess what? SS Points are worthless. Sunspear ranks give you hero skill points, but if you've been playing as long as I have with as many characters as I have, you've already got most of those skills unlocked anyway.
Well they patched it. That's 1/2 extra run for LB rank 2. Also, AFAIK you can't get more than LB rank 2 outside the Bastion. "Tell me you're not grinding doing 90 repetitions of anything." I'll just tell you those 90 repetitions aren't mandatory to finish the game. And if I ever do DoA, the first one to complain about TS and that kind of bull gets my middle finger. "But guess what? SS Points are worthless. Sunspear ranks give you hero skill points, but if you've been playing as long as I have with as many characters as I have, you've already got most of those skills unlocked anyway." Then again, that shows that the "grind" isn't mandatory. Ok well what are your ideas of a "not a grind at all"?
Also, AFAIK you can't get more than LB rank 2 outside the Bastion.
I farmed my Paragon to Rank 4 there before I gave up on the whole LB farming/grinding thing. But just like killing Margonites in Realm of Torment areas, you still only get 2 LB points per kill in Normal Mode, and the Bastion is a much quicker, easier run.
Like I said, optional or not, SS and (especially) LB point farming introduced grind to a game that had none to speak of, which is why I prefer Prophecies and Factions to Nightfall. Neither had grind. Hell, even getting 10,000 Kurzick or Luxon Faction to progress through Factions could be done in a few quests in less than a couple of hours. But bulding on that concept, the devs took the approach way too far the other way, IMHO.
From what I understand of Guild Wars, a class has 1 primary attributes and some secondary attributes. right?
What about an option to create customizeable classes. You would choose 1 primary attributes from the list of all primary attributes for all pre made classes. Then you would choose 5 secondary attributes from all available secondary attributes. This covers both your primary and secondary classes.
If there is still limitation on armor and looks, then you would choose the class model for your character looks and armor. For example, archer looks.
2)
I don't know if they have this already in GW1, but the ability to have an epic battle where maybe 5 guilds storm a castle or a dungeon. Or maybe armies battling armies, like a mock Medieval style battle. Both PvP and PvE epic battle.
3)
Chat logging features. Also, the ability to copy and paste to and from chat.
4)
Friend list like an IM telling you when your friend is on.
1.
Also you have a limited amount of attribute points you can get (maximum 200). Spending those points incurs an exponential cost. You can raise one attribute to 12, which requires as many points as having 2 attributes at 9. So having too many different attributes would most probably be unpractical and/or uneffective, you'd spread your attribute points too thin.
Also let's consider the PvP implication: "Ok what's that guy? A Nuker? A tank? wtf he's healing... And raising minions? Err..." You'd spend half of the match trying to figure out just what the heck those guys are.
5. I am probably going to sound harsh though seriously, have some experience of GW before posting that kind of stuff.
1) That is the beauty of custom classes! Your enemies don't know what they are up against. And just when they think they have you figure out, surprise, you pull out a hidden card!
As for the attribute pools cap (200 or something like that), just leave it as it is. I don't see how it would be spread too thin. In GW1, you have a primary class and a secondary class, that is a total of 1 primary attribute and 4-6 secondary attributes, depending on what combination you choose. With custom class, you again have 1 primary attribute and 5 secondary attributes. So it would be just as balance, only more flexible.
Beside, why should there be a stereotype "tank" or "nuker". Unpredictable variety is good. It allows you to figure to come up with a truly unique style.
5) I think my ideas are good for any game. Plus I have experience with enough game. While there are differences, there are also a lot of similarities with many games. Beside, GW2 can use some fresh ides, and maybe it will attract more new players, who otherwise may overlook it.
I the idea of customizable classes, I dont know why most mmorpgs have to have set classes I havent customized a character to my liking since SWG pre CU. I doubt thats the sort of thing we'd see from a GW game though
Id like to see mounts, and I'd like to see them done really well, where as the mount levels with you as opposed to you trashing your mount and buying new ones, and also with customization and with the mount being a true entity, as in it can exist without you sitting on it, and when you call it it doesnt just appear out of your pocket and when you dismiss it it doesnt just go away in a puff of smoke.
GW2 is going to be the poor mans WoW though, IMO, and itll lose all the originality that GW1 had, but thats okay. I mean, they cant just make another game like GW1... Theres not much they'd be able to add to it to warrant recreating the game and labeling it more than just another expansion. GW1 has just reached that point where theres not a ton that can be done to it without changing its structure (ie the skill system, the level cap, the way everything is instanced, ect), which I think is great actually, and it reminds me of the way I feel about (non-WoW) blizzard games, like Diablo II and Starcraft, both which I could not think of a single thing to make them better except improving the graphics or adding more quests and classes (and we've already seen more quests and classes for GW1 for a while now, so I'm happy).
Lady, having read your post (cross-posted from another thread, no less) several times now, I'm still not sure what you're asking for that GW1 doesn't already have.
Could you specify EXACTLY what it is you'd like to see in GW2 that GW1 doesn't already have?
Ok, this may sound blunt, but I'm that sort of person and obviously a lot of people here don't know what GW is or how GW1 plays, let alone any true information about GW2, so i shall recap:
Taken from the Official Wiki
Guild Wars 2 is the new Guild Wars game currently in development by ArenaNet. It was first announced in the May 2007 PC Gamer Magazine which outlines several core changes from the original Guild Wars. It is expected to go to beta test in the second half of 2008. No release date has been confirmed.
General
Races
Guild Wars 2 will introduce playable races other than human. The four new playable races announced so far are:
* Sylvari
* Asuras
* Charr
* Norn
Different races will have different advantages and disadvantages, for example the Norn will be able to shapeshift into a half-bear half-human, with increased health and melee damage. It is presently not known what advantages other races will have.
Character development
There will be a single character system, a character will not have a type like at present. A single character can be used for any of the three types of game play; PvE, World PvP and Structured PvP.
The level cap of 20 will be raised, no maximum level has been given and it has been suggested that there may be no maximum. The exact implementation has not been announced and is the subject of speculation in the community as it is not clear how this will affect gameplay such as area design and game balance. There has been mention of a side-kick system when a higher level character will enhance a lower level companions abilities, although there are few concrete details available about this system.
The skill system will be modified. There will be fewer, less complex skills which may behave differently in different situations, such as if the character is jumping or is surrounded by monsters.
Marriages and auction houses may be implemented.
Controls
The control system is going to be significantly changed (in particular mouse movement in the form "click to move" will be removed from the game), however target locking will still function. Guild Wars 2 will introduce a Z-axis to the game which will allow characters to jump over obstacles. Actions which have characters interacting with the environment, such as sliding, climbing trees and swimming will also be introduced.
Pricing and continued support
The original Guild Wars will continue to be supported after release of Guild Wars 2. This will include continued holiday events and tournaments.
There will be no monthly fee associated with Guild Wars 2. Mike O'Brien has stated that expansions or mini-expansions are more likely than standalone campaigns, but a final decision hasn't been made yet.
The game will be on multiple servers or "worlds", however unlike region transfer in Guild Wars 1, transferring between "worlds" will be unrestricted.
PvE
Setting
The campaign will be set in Tyria two hundred and fifty years into the future from the original campaign.
Guild Wars 2 will still have instances, but also claims more advanced persistence. For example, this might include different quests becoming available depending on the outcome of a particular fight.
There will be changes to instancing system used. Persistent areas, similar to those traditionally used in other online multiplayer games, will be introduced to Guild Wars which may allow players to meet and interact while exploring. Guild Wars 2 will depart from a single monolithic storyline, instead using smaller story arcs - allowing the player more of a sandbox environment to play in.
Characters
Characters from the original Guild Wars campaign will not be migrated to play in Guild Wars 2. Some of the items and titles will be available to players of Guild Wars 2 through a Hall of Monuments created as part of Guild Wars Eye of the North.
The professions are being designed so that they are all viable for both solo and group play.
Companions
The system of companions and allies is being reworked. Companions will have customisability similar to Heroes. Players will be allowed to bring a single companion with them, who will not take up a party slot. When a player chooses not to bring a companion, their character will instead be buffed so that they will not be disadvantaged by not bringing a companion.
PvP
There will be two types of PvP available in Guild Wars 2; World PvP and Structured PvP.
World PvP
World PvP will allow you to play characters of any level, using the skills that you have in your possession at that particular time. It is intended to be a more relaxed bridging point between PvE and structured PvP. It will be on a larger scale than the original Guild Wars PvP with large battles which could take place over a long period with people coming and going. Each battle will have a number of different objectives which can be met such as taking guard towers or defending choke points or joining a larger battle to take a castle. Battles will take place in the Mists. According to the Gamespy interview, there will be 4 factions players can belong to fighting against each other, as well as a 5th faction representing a common enemy. Whether players can switch allegiance is currently unknown, but likely.
Structured PvP
Structured PvP is similar to today's GvG. It will allow you to enter the game at maximum level with all skills, races, items and classes automatically unlocked.
Notes
* On March 27th Gaile Gray said that Guild Wars 2 will have Holiday events too.
Comments
1. The Primary attributes are bound to the Primary profession because it's what best fits that profession. Assassins get a extra % to land a critical strike plus energy gain when they do, Warriors get a % of armour penetration, Monks get a bonus to heals, Elementalists get a larger energy pool to fuel their spells etc etc.
Also you have a limited amount of attribute points you can get (maximum 200). Spending those points incurs an exponential cost. You can raise one attribute to 12, which requires as many points as having 2 attributes at 9. So having too many different attributes would most probably be unpractical and/or uneffective, you'd spread your attribute points too thin.
Also let's consider the PvP implication: "Ok what's that guy? A Nuker? A tank? wtf he's healing... And raising minions? Err..." You'd spend half of the match trying to figure out just what the heck those guys are.
2. There are already similar skirmishes. Three teams battling it out to control an altar. Alliance Battles are kind of close, it's 3 groups of 4 players per sides.
3. Chat logging, why not... Might not even have to wait for GW2. Copy/paste is already available in a way: You can send your Skill setup to chat using a few clicks. Also you can scroll through your own lines and send them to different channels if needed, though not other players' comments.
4. Already in game!! Friend list even tracks the whole account, meaning if you add a player, you will also see when they are online on an alt.
I am probably going to sound harsh though seriously, have some experience of GW before posting that kind of stuff.
__________
Ever wondered what a hardcore WoW raider looked like?
R.I.P. Laura "Taera" Genender
That's pretty much the Factions-specific PvP matches.Yep. My point was I personally do better with more specific instructions and duties rather than going in and running around like a chicken with my head cut off.
I'll never make a very good group leader 'cause I'm not a leader at all. I play a few other MMO's and have never played a tank because for the most part, they are expected to lead the group and if someone told me to take the lead I'd just start laughing. "Get yer rez ready"
What grinding does Guild Wars have? I don't think I once had to grind, unless I wanted to get Sunspear points...
Sunspear and Lightbringer ranks are a major timesink and grind, which is surprising coming from a game and devs that have always promoted GW as being "grind-free."
If GW feels "bloated" (according to a recent quote from one of the devs), it's because Nightfall moved it that way.
If it weren't for the heroes and some cool end-game weapons, I wouldn't spend another minute there. Just had a blast running a couple of characters through the Southern Shiverpeak missions. Ahhh, the classics.
Yet titles have never been mandatory in any way whatsoever. The PvP component is still grind free. That way they gave PvE players something to chew on without impairing the competitive side of the game. Rather smart if you ask me...
__________
Ever wondered what a hardcore WoW raider looked like?
R.I.P. Laura "Taera" Genender
I love it when people complain about optional items... If you don't like it, don't do it. Game wise, you get all the SS points you need to progress by just following the mission and quest arc. Just because you don't have to grind, doesn't not mean you can't grind. I am going after the SS/LB titles, so guess what I am farming/grinding those.
As for GW 2
* Auction House
* Increased PvP options
* A Team Kick Option - Team leader has ability to kick (/kick *insert name*) a member of a party of three or more by voting much like the /resign feature. This won't happen unless everyone but that person types that in, and this removes the player and all his or her heros/henchies.
"It is easier to be cruel than wise. The road to wisdom is long and difficult... so most people just turn out to be assholes" Feng (Christopher Walken)
Sunspear points - on the other hand - ARE required for NF characters until you get 2500 of them. After that, they're completely pointless for everybody (and pointless for all non-NF characters even before that).
As to the rest, you guys are missing the point: in a game that is promoted and sold as "grind-free", SS and LB points ARE a grind, especially for someone - like me - who has rolled 4 NF characters on two separate accounts.
YMMV.
As for the kicking option, it's been mentioned before, and I still think it's dangerous if you end up in a PuG with lamers... Say you get a nice drop, and they kick you so they can loot it...
__________
Ever wondered what a hardcore WoW raider looked like?
R.I.P. Laura "Taera" Genender
"...and a rezzed Ether you kill again with bounty on grants you LB points."
Nope. Checked. A rezzed foe returns no LB points whatsoever. I thought they did, too, until I watched my hero stats while farming there.
You get LB Gaze at Rank 2, which is 300 LB points. Granted, you can get to rank 2 in your sleep. But you don't get rank 3 until you hit 1,000, rank 4 until you hit 2500, and rank 5 until you hit 7500. And many DoA teams won't take you UNLESS you have TS, or Vent AND at least Rank 5 in LB points (7500).
Now consider this: to farm your way to Rank 5 in Lightbringer Points in Normal Mode, which gives you a whopping 2 points per kill on unrezzed monsters, you would have to grind out 3450 monster kills outside Dzagonur Bastion (assuming you start farming at Rank 2. Most people aren't at Rank 2 when they get there). The run there generally yields 80 LB Points per run (10 groups of 4 elementals in that small area). In other words, to farm your way to Rank 5, you're going to be making 90 farming runs there. Tell me you're not grinding doing 90 repetitions of anything.
Sure, you could go to Hard Mode and double your LB points per kill, but you're still making at least 40 runs there if you do nothing else, and Hard Mode runs aren't nearly as quick and easy as Normal Mode runs.
Yes DoA is optional. And yes, farming is optional. But for people who want to participate in either - optional or not - it's still a grind. I got my first Paragon to Rank 4. He's at 2973 LB points. Haven't farmed another LB point on him since. It's simply way too freaking boring.
Again, your mileage may vary.
P.S. Sunspear points are much easier to get (once you get to Vabbi, you get 7 SS points per kill in NM, 14 in HM). But guess what? SS Points are worthless. Sunspear ranks give you hero skill points, but if you've been playing as long as I have with as many characters as I have, you've already got most of those skills unlocked anyway.
I would like to see Guild Wars have like a realm vs realm type deal..
Man, DAoC RvR was the shiznit! Best PvP I have ever played.
Life is 10% what happens and 90% how you react to it!
Serling - I usually agree with your points, but you have some crazy connection in your head that just because you CAN grind some things in GW that somehow GW advertising "Grind Free Game Play" is false advertising and you HAVE to grind. I beat Nightfall without having to farm LB points, so what is your complaint. If you want to do DoA but dont have r5 then start your own group without a rank req...I sure there are others like you, I was until last night. BTW...currently farming LB/SS points for titles...currently SpearMarshall (r9) and Vanquishing Lightbring (r5)
"It is easier to be cruel than wise. The road to wisdom is long and difficult... so most people just turn out to be assholes" Feng (Christopher Walken)
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree then.
It would also be cool if the aforementioned monster AI could be improved. Maybe to the point where mobs could learn more advanced tactics. Something that would really make them harder to outsmart. I'm not sure to what degree that would be possible but the more the better in my opinion.
What's more is that I would like GW2 to be more about teamplay again. Heroes were cool but it still bothered me that many of the parties I joined In NF had more heroes than real players.
Lastly I really hope that Anet will continue to build upon the individual strong points of Guild Wars rather than introducing more traditional MMoRPG elements. I am fairly certain that no one who has played Guild Wars would want GW2 to be "more like WoW".
I agree. Although Hard Mode tries to offer a more challenging AI, they only tweaked the existing AI parameters to make it harder. Adding more variety to their AI would be a welcome addition, especially now that more forms of movement is possible.
Life is 10% what happens and 90% how you react to it!
Most any fantasy based MMO is going to be compared to WoW and EQ...and if it has any similar traits (and how can it not, there is not exactly many new inventions in the MMO arena), it is going to be called a WoW or EQ clone. "What you can jump and swim...oh it is just a WoW clone. You can craft, definately a EQ clone."
Kegboyii I also never understood why they stoped giving skill quests in the other campaigns...I loved that about Prophecies. I never new what skills a NPC would give me, and it made it exciting. Now it is such a brutal gold sink that it is ridulous. I feel bad for the newbies that try to get skills that they have to purchase much earlier on. So add that the the list of things I would REALLY like to see in GW2, Skill Quests.
"It is easier to be cruel than wise. The road to wisdom is long and difficult... so most people just turn out to be assholes" Feng (Christopher Walken)
Hey guys...
Just wanted to hijack my own thread for a brief moment to introduce you to some of my 20 characters (Yes, I have 2 accounts and zero life). Made these composite images using Photoshop CS3. I placed each grouping over the map of the campaign to which they belong. Lords of Lochmoor is my "solo" guild.
Anyway, thought you might enjoy these.
P.S. Bring back skill quests for GW 2!!!
Life is 10% what happens and 90% how you react to it!
Well they patched it. That's 1/2 extra run for LB rank 2. Also, AFAIK you can't get more than LB rank 2 outside the Bastion. "Tell me you're not grinding doing 90 repetitions of anything." I'll just tell you those 90 repetitions aren't mandatory to finish the game. And if I ever do DoA, the first one to complain about TS and that kind of bull gets my middle finger. "But guess what? SS Points are worthless. Sunspear ranks give you hero skill points, but if you've been playing as long as I have with as many characters as I have, you've already got most of those skills unlocked anyway." Then again, that shows that the "grind" isn't mandatory.
Ok well what are your ideas of a "not a grind at all"?
Nice family pic there still.
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Ever wondered what a hardcore WoW raider looked like?
R.I.P. Laura "Taera" Genender
I farmed my Paragon to Rank 4 there before I gave up on the whole LB farming/grinding thing. But just like killing Margonites in Realm of Torment areas, you still only get 2 LB points per kill in Normal Mode, and the Bastion is a much quicker, easier run.
Like I said, optional or not, SS and (especially) LB point farming introduced grind to a game that had none to speak of, which is why I prefer Prophecies and Factions to Nightfall. Neither had grind. Hell, even getting 10,000 Kurzick or Luxon Faction to progress through Factions could be done in a few quests in less than a couple of hours. But bulding on that concept, the devs took the approach way too far the other way, IMHO.
Also you have a limited amount of attribute points you can get (maximum 200). Spending those points incurs an exponential cost. You can raise one attribute to 12, which requires as many points as having 2 attributes at 9. So having too many different attributes would most probably be unpractical and/or uneffective, you'd spread your attribute points too thin.
Also let's consider the PvP implication: "Ok what's that guy? A Nuker? A tank? wtf he's healing... And raising minions? Err..." You'd spend half of the match trying to figure out just what the heck those guys are.
5. I am probably going to sound harsh though seriously, have some experience of GW before posting that kind of stuff.
1) That is the beauty of custom classes! Your enemies don't know what they are up against. And just when they think they have you figure out, surprise, you pull out a hidden card!
As for the attribute pools cap (200 or something like that), just leave it as it is. I don't see how it would be spread too thin. In GW1, you have a primary class and a secondary class, that is a total of 1 primary attribute and 4-6 secondary attributes, depending on what combination you choose. With custom class, you again have 1 primary attribute and 5 secondary attributes. So it would be just as balance, only more flexible.
Beside, why should there be a stereotype "tank" or "nuker". Unpredictable variety is good. It allows you to figure to come up with a truly unique style.
5) I think my ideas are good for any game. Plus I have experience with enough game. While there are differences, there are also a lot of similarities with many games. Beside, GW2 can use some fresh ides, and maybe it will attract more new players, who otherwise may overlook it.
Id like to see mounts, and I'd like to see them done really well, where as the mount levels with you as opposed to you trashing your mount and buying new ones, and also with customization and with the mount being a true entity, as in it can exist without you sitting on it, and when you call it it doesnt just appear out of your pocket and when you dismiss it it doesnt just go away in a puff of smoke.
GW2 is going to be the poor mans WoW though, IMO, and itll lose all the originality that GW1 had, but thats okay. I mean, they cant just make another game like GW1... Theres not much they'd be able to add to it to warrant recreating the game and labeling it more than just another expansion. GW1 has just reached that point where theres not a ton that can be done to it without changing its structure (ie the skill system, the level cap, the way everything is instanced, ect), which I think is great actually, and it reminds me of the way I feel about (non-WoW) blizzard games, like Diablo II and Starcraft, both which I could not think of a single thing to make them better except improving the graphics or adding more quests and classes (and we've already seen more quests and classes for GW1 for a while now, so I'm happy).
Play as your fav retro characters: cnd-online.net. My site: www.lysle.net. Blog: creatingaworld.blogspot.com.
Lady, having read your post (cross-posted from another thread, no less) several times now, I'm still not sure what you're asking for that GW1 doesn't already have.
Could you specify EXACTLY what it is you'd like to see in GW2 that GW1 doesn't already have?
Ok, this may sound blunt, but I'm that sort of person and obviously a lot of people here don't know what GW is or how GW1 plays, let alone any true information about GW2, so i shall recap: