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Are you tired of MMOs?
Saryk
Member UncommonPosts: 476
There are very few MMOs out there I haven’t played, starting with UO through WAR.
More than likely I will play Warhammer several more months, help take a city, and then Warhammer is gone. Eve will continue to get my bucks as long as they are open for business.
BUT, any MMO game that is coming out, I just can’t say I want to play. Yes KOTOR sounds good, but it will be the same old thing with a different shell. I really don’t see any MMOs that are coming out that are truly unique or innovative (or am I wrong).
Some of the single player games are awesome (FarCry 2, Crysis Warhead). Some of the games that will be released next year are sounding great (Diablo 3, Project Origin).
Do you think that the current load of MMOs will have some kind of shake up, closing down several games, aka banking crisis.
Do you think that the MMO industry has past their Golden Age?
I could be just burnt out on MMOs.
Comments
I'm not playing any MMO for the moment, and since SWG I have not activly been playing any specific game. Have bought and tried most of them. But never played more than tops 10 hours.
In EQ2 I'd might have 50 hours playtime.
So yes I'm tired of MMOs. Hoping Darkfall, Earthrise or Fallen Earth will give me some joy back.
______________________________
The Sceptics, yes they're special but we've need them to.. I guess.
And if they're put more effort MMORPG.com can create a 'Team Sceptic'
and send them to the Special Olympus.
I'm very tired of all current mmo's, same everyvere reach max level and then start raiding to gear up your character, I dont like this.
I'm tired of all the WOW wannabe MMO's yes. I've been playing MMO's since 1999 and all the game i've played for an extend period of time we're innovative for their time.
1999-2002 : Asherons Call (True Sandbox)
2002-2004 : Anarchy Online (Deepest most complex MMO i ever played, Sci-Fi theme)
2004-2008 : World of Warcraft
So today all the game are trying to be the next WOW and i feel playing them that i already done all that before.
Yes, I'm tired of current MMO's, but I think the future of MMO's is bright, with Earthrise, Jumpgate Evolution, and Fallen Earth coming out next year.
Tried: LotR, CoH, AoC, WAR, Jumpgate Classic
Played: SWG, Guild Wars, WoW
Playing: Eve Online, Counter-strike
Loved: Star Wars Galaxies
Waiting for: Earthrise, Guild Wars 2, anything sandbox.
If they would of made a Anarchy Online 2---
I would of played. I never played the first one just because, well when I got into the market I was already spoiled on current graphics.
WHy oh why did they make Age of Conan when they could of made a better Anarchy Online.
As to the topic, yeah Im tired. My first MMO was Shadowbane and from there I played DAOC, SWG, WoW, AOC, WAR. I had the most fun with Shadowbane, DAOC and WoW.
I look back on the last couple of years and think to myself....what have I gained. Ive wanted a online business for a number of years and I think...hmm how much money would I be making now if instead of playing all these games had I spent HALF the time towards that one goal.
After I wrote the previous post, I thought about my lack of faith in the MMO world. I think my main problem is that I am tired of role playing games. I like Warhammer a lot, but it is not because of the quest. I think it is the competition in scenarios and RvR, not the role playing. But once I take part in the conquest of a home city, I think that will be about it for me. Eve is a lot different in my mind, because of the Sci-fi nature of the game and the differences that it has compared to other games. I can train in Eve while offline, so I don’t have to spend a ton of time in game.
Isn’t Earthrise a MMO FPS?
I am not tired of mmo's. I'm sort of tired of the bitching and moaning of many mmo players have been doing because they have unrealistic expectations.
Granted, if you don't like something you don't like it. More power to you and of course you should just move on.
But with the steady and unyielding stream of "I quite, here's why" posts as well as lists of demands that quite frankly sometimes border on unrealistic, it's really hard to listen to it all.
It's as if mmo players think that game dev's should only be guys who are doing this solely for the love of it and who should have no other desires other than creating a great game. No lives, no hopes for job security, just live to create games and to take as many chances as they can with millions upon millions of dollars as if the well won't dry up if they don't hit it correctly.
I'm pretty sure that people who are working in game development are all like you except they decided to try to find jobs in game development. They then work for a company and that company needs to create a successful product or else they won't stay in business.
People keep yelling for something new but it seems that they all just want old style gameplay, essentially just hanging around in a glorified chat channel why the grind mobs or pvp.
Quite franky the new Star Wars game seems intriguing because of expanded story line. But many vocal players don't seem to want that, even for a few to be shouting that the game should be like the "old" game SWG or at least incorporate its elements.
All I know is that I buy a game, if I like it I play it and if I don't then I move on. I have had a lot of fun in today's games and don't expect anything more than some entertainment for my money. And certainly not a second life (no pun intended).
As far as the quality of the games being delivered, yeah, there are issues. I don't know what to tell you. but it seems very few people can get it right. So either they are all just incompetant, have incompetant project managment or else it really is as hard as one can imagine to make a bug free game that works out of the box.
It also seems that the give and take between developer and customer is just not working as they want to make games that they want to make but they need to be able to sell them (see above for job security).
Sure, games like Eve are successful and quite frankly I really admire what they have done. But for every dev that tries for something different I think you have less Eves and more failures.
I just think that online games can't be anything more than pastimes that take however much time it takes for us to want to go on to something new.
And quite frankly I tend to wonder if players are really as unhappy as these boards paint them to be. Is it just a highly vocal and disgruntled minority? Are they just people who like to complain? Are they a small group of disenfranchised players who have been left behind because mmo's have moved into the mainstream and average people don't expect them to be life changing experiences?
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
MMOs, to me, are like a series of abusive girlfriends. I stay with them for a while, but we eventually have a bad break-up for one reason or another, with only alot of ill will and a lighter wallet to show for it. Afterward, I go through a withdrawl period where I alternate between wanting to go back to a game and wondering what I ever saw in it in the first place. Sometimes I do go back to a game. I went back to Maple Story, and then I went back to World of Warcraft, and I felt stupid each time.
But then, eventually, another hot little number comes along, and I fall for it. I keep hoping that, maybe, this will be the game that'll finally give me the experience that will keep me coming back, and won't treat me as horribly as all the games that have come before.
So, yeah, a little tired.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Playing: Nothing
Played: Champions Online, CoX, STO, PSO, WoW, lots of free-to-play crap
Looking Forward To: DC Universe Online, Blade and Soul
I'm not vocal on these forums and I'm as unhappy with the genre as others make out. That said it is for the reasons you mention. I don't expect "a life changing experience" but your sentiment is correct. I do however expect a game to furfill for my wants. It's not to much to expect even if we are a vocal minority. A niche game done rightly could count on thousands of subscribers and decent profits.
If they would of made a Anarchy Online 2---
I would of played. I never played the first one just because, well when I got into the market I was already spoiled on current graphics.
WHy oh why did they make Age of Conan when they could of made a better Anarchy Online.
As to the topic, yeah Im tired. My first MMO was Shadowbane and from there I played DAOC, SWG, WoW, AOC, WAR. I had the most fun with Shadowbane, DAOC and WoW.
I look back on the last couple of years and think to myself....what have I gained. Ive wanted a online business for a number of years and I think...hmm how much money would I be making now if instead of playing all these games had I spent HALF the time towards that one goal.
They are applying a graphic update to Anarchy Online. I wish they made Anarchy Online 2 also.
Sorry if this is a double-post.
I have a big problem with this statement because I do actually think that people making games should be motivated in part by the love of it.
Game development is creative process, it is not like working in a sausage factory.
They will have good and bad days like everyone else but their core motivation should be that they like the job.
Painters like painting, poets like poetry, writers like writing, directors like directing. They do it because they like it, this is obvious because when they start their career there is no guarantee of getting paid for it.
If you like your job you put your heart and soul into it and it shows in the end result.
People complain about souless games. If half the people working on the project hate their job and the big corporation that they work for and are just doing it for the money then it's not surprising that games turn out like this. If someone was sat in a book writing factory writing books then I am sure that their work would not be as enjoyable to read as a freerange writers would be.
This is why I have largely given up hope on the big publishers ever making a good game again. Independant studios is where gaming history is going to be made in the future in my opinion.
I have a big problem with this statement because I do actually think that people making games should be motivated in part by the love of it.
Game development is creative process, it is not like working in a sausage factory.
They will have good and bad days like everyone else but their core motivation should be that they like the job.
Painters like painting, poets like poetry, writers like writing, directors like directing. They do it because they like it, this is obvious because when they start their career there is no guarantee of getting paid for it.
If you like your job you put your heart and soul into it and it shows in the end result.
People complain about souless games. If half the people working on the project hate their job and the big corporation that they work for and are just doing it for the money then it's not surprising that games turn out like this. If someone was sat in a book writing factory writing books then I am sure that their work would not be as enjoyable to read as a freerange writers would be.
This is why I have largely given up hope on the big publishers ever making a good game again. Independant studios is where gaming history is going to be made in the future in my opinion.
But the important word you missed was "solely".
I'll tell you this. I consider myself a composer and have made some money off of it. And I love composing and do want to make something that I am proud of as well as to eventually make my entire living from it.
But I can't eat off of pride. Nor can I pay the rent, go on vacation or a date or buy clothes.
So though I love writing music the idea is to get paid for it. So let's say a game company hires me to write music for them. I'm not going to start experimenting and creating something that I will feel is good art. I will write music that will fit the game or game scene. And if my employers want something different then I will write something different.
Same thing happened to a friend of mine. He was hired to write music for a modern dance performance. Everything he wrote they didn't like. Finally, one day he wrote something a bit new age sounding. Bingo! That's what they wanted and he was able to finish the project.
The problem is that many game players are so caught up in the idea of "great games" they forget that creating them it is also a job. It is a vocatioin. Same with art.
I can't be hired and then suddenly say that the muse hasn't hit and I'm not inspired. If you are a composer, artist, actor or game developer you do the best you can do but it is a job and you do what is needed to finish the job.
If a game company has x amount of dollars from investors who want to see a return on that money (or if theyh borrow it and have to pay it back) they aren't going to sit there and necessarily think "hey, let's do something completely different and ss if it works". They are going to try to find some balance so that they can make some money back but have a product that shows some quality.
And the real kicker is that they will want to do it again. you guys have jobs where you can go back day after day and put money aside for retirement, investments, vacations, families etc so the game dev's are going to desire a bit of job security as well.
Not much job security if you finish a game, it tanks and the company owes money and you are out of business. On top of that, if these game were to always tank then no one would invest money and all thse game developers who want to make games for a living will have to apply their skills elsewhere.
So remember, in the end "you have to eat".
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
It depends on how you define the "golden age".
I recall the early MMOs being rather grindy...to the point of masochism. EQ was merciless, AC was brutal, UO was mind numbing....
Yes these games were pioneers and they where "great" in their day but really, standing in corners waiting hours for respawns and running through the same field for days killing the same 5 or 6 wolves just to gain a level...not to appealing anymore.
Todays MMO's are a lot different from the first ones. IMHO, they are no better or worse. The basic formula is still in there, mindlessly do the same thing over and over for numbers. Its just fluffed up a lot more and much faster. The primary difference is that because of the speed these days, restrictive "endgames" are all the rage.
MMO's should be about "open worlds" like the pioneer games of the first generation. Where they need to evolve is in that the focus needs to be taken off of the math of "levels, loot and classes" and more focus on the open ended, non-linear adventure.
Sure the math aspect is important, you need mechanics but today it acts as content.
Im just tired of the same type of MMo's out there personally. I wish they would make some different type ones though.
Ill be playing WAR and EVE until then. AOC i may give another go if everything pans out for it.
Im looking forward to STO, Earthrise, WOD, and maybe the KOTOR.
Played : WOW, LOTRO, COH/COV, EQ2, SWG, and WAR.
Playing EVE Online and AOC.
Wtg for SW:TOR and WOD
Real quick let's look at the acronym, Massive MULTIplayer Online yadda yadda.......PvP should be present in ALL MMOs, IMHO, and the future is true skill based active targeting mechanics, I.E. TCoS to an extent, Darkfall, MortalOnline, these are the ones I am aware of that feature much of these aspects.......
I am tired of the targeting button mashing that is so prevelent in any MMO out atm, hehe....regardless of the way I may break down current MMOs into sub genres within the MMO genre, fact is besides EVE (being it's combat mechanics are VERY diff regardless of targeting, but targeting and spaceships go hand & hand) there isn't an MMO out that isn't a button masher to some major extent, and die roll based.......parry, dodge, strike, so on.....all mathematical formulas waiting on whatever game you play's server to resolve it's 10 sided die roll on........
Let's see some real dodging, and parrying, and make sure you cast that HoT over your party only, cause the spell effect should effect everything in range IMO =P
Then it's just a First Person Shooter. There are good FPS games out there already.
It depends on how you define the "golden age".
I recall the early MMOs being rather grindy...to the point of masochism. EQ was merciless, AC was brutal, UO was mind numbing....
Yes these games were pioneers and they where "great" in their day but really, standing in corners waiting hours for respawns and running through the same field for days killing the same 5 or 6 wolves just to gain a level...not to appealing anymore.
Todays MMO's are a lot different from the first ones. IMHO, they are no better or worse. The basic formula is still in there, mindlessly do the same thing over and over for numbers. Its just fluffed up a lot more and much faster. The primary difference is that because of the speed these days, restrictive "endgames" are all the rage.
MMO's should be about "open worlds" like the pioneer games of the first generation. Where they need to evolve is in that the focus needs to be taken off of the math of "levels, loot and classes" and more focus on the open ended, non-linear adventure.
Sure the math aspect is important, you need mechanics but today it acts as content.
What I find is….
Games are certainly more interactive and more content wise rich. But something is missing and that is all about coordination between players and players do not need much to be together nowadays to play a Mmo. We seriously have the issue of healers getting not that importance and crafters not making that much gold as they used to and all in all it is just a lack luster effort of a few players logging in and killing and logging out. Mmo world has now become a big grind garden where you just go in and kill and be bored and leave the game and try and learn the other new game and then you switch out. Back in Anarchy Online days logging back in a game was like logging back in a friendly place where there is going to be some action and players are going to form teams and try out some new adventure. Crafters are going to make something new and healers are going to go for a nap when you least expected them to be.
I sense the onset of free to play games and their game balance dependent on cash shop items and all in all the business portion of it is like a new generation of people trying to make something that needs you to pay more and get less. Pay to play wonderful games are there but then again their population is being cut by free to play games and no one is interested to play one game seriously and reach all the targets that reach somewhere good.
Also we see that gaming worlds are getting dependent on support of not players but player like game bots and that doesn’t make much sense either. Geek armor hunting and geek gold farming and solo content rich gaming is making many Mmos as good as a stand alone PC game and yet the population is always fluid and moving from one game to the other.
Seriously its time some company should come up with a high player driven gaming world that just needs players and nothing more. The game should be able to get all the free to play players and as well the one who do not mind paying for an online game. The game world needs to be dependent on players and each other should come and work together to make the system look good.
But Alas! We do not see much of it. We just see competitive games and geek character building PvP oriented games to the extent that some are going as lame as offering cash too nowadays to get the player base built up through whatever way possible be it making the whole gaming world a pseudo competitive environment. (Atlantica Online)
I would still go for games like Anarchy Online, City Of Heroes and the likes if also they are so old and so known now.
Cheers
Sourajit Nandi
" Don't listen to anyone who tells you that you can't play this or that. That's nonsense. Make up your mind,and you'll never whine or repent about gaming hours anymore, then have a go at every Game. Open up the Internet, join in all the Mmorpgs you can. Go make the Guild. But never, never let them persuade you that things are too difficult or impossible. "
Once An Addict Always An Addict .
Well, Ryzom is there. Go spread the word.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Then it's just a First Person Shooter. There are good FPS games out there already.
But there are a lot of mmorpg pvp players who dont' like or seem to do well in the fps games. I think they can't do well and so come to mmorpgs to pvp because you get more casual players who are easier to beat.
Then it's just a First Person Shooter. There are good FPS games out there already.
But there are a lot of mmorpg pvp players who dont' like or seem to do well in the fps games. I think they can't do well and so come to mmorpgs to pvp because you get more casual players who are easier to beat.
How many players can go and learn and play Ryzom?
You need to have certain experience for playing Ryzom. I tried the game last time and it all went out of my head and then i went for a easy kiddish game (Atlantica Online). But i will surely try it a second time and see if i can make me out of the newbie island. All know that it is a standard game but then again it is too hard for the newcomers to play that game too. We all love dungeons and stuff but then i have not quite seen any in the little time i devoted to that game. Why not we have a detailed information link about that game with all that we can do and all that can be acieved with time?
Cheers
Sourajit Nandi
" Don't listen to anyone who tells you that you can't play this or that. That's nonsense. Make up your mind,and you'll never whine or repent about gaming hours anymore, then have a go at every Game. Open up the Internet, join in all the Mmorpgs you can. Go make the Guild. But never, never let them persuade you that things are too difficult or impossible. "
Once An Addict Always An Addict .
Then it's just a First Person Shooter. There are good FPS games out there already.
Umm negative, rofl.....name me a true FPS with in depth crafting, with other aspects of game play that are only gonna be seen in an MMO, like Vanguards Diplomacy system, so on.......there are FPS hybrids out now with progression, but what do you get, unlock new weaps, and some such?!
There are viable ideas, and some implemented systems in games currently, or in dev that can deal with the griefer ganker aspect that MOST PvE ers don't like to deal with and thus don't play on the PvP server for their chosen time waster........my point is, if your gonna have a game that's mythos and lore inherently depicts one race at odds with another, then those two races shouldn't be all frollicing about together like common place, doing MC Hammer dances and other trendy dance moves, rofl.......I mean you want to have true lore emmersion in your game you are developing, MAKE it RP, and I don't mean "Aye, I RP, see how I used aye in my text" BS.
The means and tech are here now that we could see the players TRULY emmersing themselves in this fantasy realm of whatever, but so much pandering, and carebear tip toeing goes on that 9 times out of 10, a large chunk of a player base either "submits cause everyone else is doing it" or is on a constant search for the next "one"
EVE is a good example, not in any MMO out atm can you truly sub up and decide, you know what, I want to be a pirate, and ACTUALLY friggin do it! Not by some A,B,C templeted means that was from teh devs, no, I mean.....you wanna live on teh outter rim, and get by on your own means (gonna take awhile) but you can do it, and build a real reputation too.....heh.....
And if you use your skills you have learned in a manner that allows you to overcome "whatever" differently then teh last guy, that is truly making it your own experience. If dev company xyz puts in a game the ability to not only learn how to do back flips, but as you progress in this skill, you actually become better, and the W W SPACEBAR W S move you did to make the flip happen actually makes your toon flip, and depending on the physics and terrain you pull off some amazing back flip throat stabbing move that wins a fight, how friggin cool would that be?! This is just small examples......FPS, nay, I am sure you missed my point my friend....
Then it's just a First Person Shooter. There are good FPS games out there already.
Well, not exactly. Though I respect his opinion and can even on a certain level understand why he would say this, the truth of the matter is that pvp doesn't have to be in an mmo.
Also, an mmo that has pvp and even pvp as a focus is also not a fps. It might incorporate fps fighting mechanics but usually an mmo has much more. This is usually content that most fps players aren't interested in.
massive, multiplayer, online game.
I think players are too hung up on this name and it's concepts. Oftentimes you will see a game introduced on this site only to see someone shout "it's not an mmo... it doesn't belong here".
Truth be told, there are a lot of things in life that started as one thing and evolve into another.
As far as I'm concerned the term means that a large amount of people can interact with each other in an online game.
there is no reason why all those people should have to be able to interact with each other at the same time nor is it necessary for them to interact in a certain way.
He is saying that in an open massive world, players should be able to interact with each other and one of those ways must be pvp.
Since I am a proponent of the idea that there is more than one way to interact with your fellow players, I make the agrument that you don't need pvp. You can just talk with them. Say hi. Group. Sell to them, etc. In no way does one have to pvp in order to have it be a mmorpg.
To that point I would also say that using fps mechanics does not invalidate a game that is a mmorpg.
As long as the world alows for interaction among a great amount of players in one way or another then that shouldn't matter.
What isn't brought up in the title is that there is usually some sort of economy as well as a way for a player to progress his/her character. otherwise a fps game could be considered an mmo because you have a large amount of people who are interacting.
What I find is that usually fps players hate mmo conventions such as leveling or raiding or even the economy. However, it doesn't invalidate the idea that an mmo could use fps conventions as it is just a fast, actiion based fighting mechanic. I don't see why a game that uses pvp could not have it.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Then it's just a First Person Shooter. There are good FPS games out there already.
But there are a lot of mmorpg pvp players who dont' like or seem to do well in the fps games. I think they can't do well and so come to mmorpgs to pvp because you get more casual players who are easier to beat.
How many players can go and learn and play Ryzom?
You need to have certain experience for playing Ryzom. I tried the game last time and it all went out of my head and then i went for a easy kiddish game (Atlantica Online). But i will surely try it a second time and see if i can make me out of the newbie island. All know that it is a standard game but then again it is too hard for the newcomers to play that game too. We all love dungeons and stuff but then i have not quite seen any in the little time i devoted to that game. Why not we have a detailed information link about that game with all that we can do and all that can be acieved with time?
Ryzom is not hard at all its even simple.
WoW players come ingame the start area that is small there standing npc everywhere, but they dont see ! or ?
So if you have a brain and start thinking a littlebit, just try several npc's to find out what they have to say.
But no, a wow player starts shouting in CAPS where the fuck are npc's for quest i cant find any, while they stand about 15mtrs away from npc's that give them a quest GO FIGURE how stupid they are:P
Or shouting in caps that they cant jump like in wow and start shouting in CAPS that game SUCKS becouse in wow you can why not in this game:P
Thats today,s new generation of gamers bah:(
You just need to use your brain instead of guided by gamemachanics:P
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
I'am not tired of MMO so much im tired of how there level progress works and there in game features needs more freedom of choice and more game play... I wish they would do away with the leveling system and take another approah at character advancement, like darkfall online is doing. I'am just tired of quests if they would revamp the questing system and do somethign different and fun with it then I may not hate it so much.
You are burnt out != the market is burnt out. WOW is still growing like 1M subscribers a year. Bioware may have the next big success.
Who knows.