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What Do You Want Us Gays To Do ?
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Yeah, and one could quote all other parts of the bible to point out the anti-gay parts. The one implicit approval doesn't do much against all of the explicit disapprovals. But then again, the Bible is a work used to justify lots of hateful things and should be tossed out all right.
Yeah, and one could show you challenge after challenge to those anti-gay parts as well.
Look, I'm not defending the Bible. I am Unitarian and believe a lot of it is of fantasy and lore in the least. It's a great book, but I think it's full of flaws and doesn't fit into our modern times much at all, except for the general theme of love and compassion.
Like I told that other dude, I think it's cool that someone as important in our nations history as Thomas Jefferson put together a Bible that ripped out the magical stories. It's not just telling of how things in the Bible should be challenged, but it's also a great kick in the ass to get people to doing it. It's more than okay to question and challenge those stories and verses.
We live in a modern time, and to apply ancient laws to modern people is in itself a bit of insanity.
-----------------------
</OBAMA>
It is simply not possible to deduce what a middle eastern male over 2000 years ago thought about anything.
It comes down too, today, what people feel in their heart. Extreme conservative religious groups, from all denominations, want to make it about a strict set of rules or laws. This allows them to control, and set up hierarchies, within their groups.
Set your mind Free young man! Set your mind Free!
Then why not base our philosophy/morality on a more modern setting instead of perpetuating this old book and it's baggage by acknowledging it? I'll admit, there are some things one can take from the Bible, but it's like eating around a worm in an apple. There's plenty of other works out there one can hold up to as an ideal and follow, and without the undesirable bits to pick through and without giving more support to other people that do follow/practice the not-so-nice parts.
Religion is kinda scary and relies partly on herd mechanics. One guy says, "Jesus had a lot of good things to say," And then another person feels a little more convinced of himself when he puts on his pointed white sheet. An extreme example, I'll admit, but we just toss Jesus out altogether and focus on a different philosophy, that person is left feeling a little silly if they don't have anyone to turn to to help justify their poor views.
What evidence is there that it was a male love thing?
I think Jesus is silent on homosexuality, pro or against.
I am curious, though, and would appreciate an answer to my first question; this is what happens when I do not go out on Friday nights. I ask questions.
There are lots of theologians that interpret the centurion story that way. It's out there for you to read and easy to find if you Google it. I'm not big on just posting links to things, so just look it up. It's just another story that you can choose to read one way or the other. I choose to read it as a love affair because it makes more sense to me that way. When you look at the society, the way living arrangements were setup at that time, and other clues to the story, it just makes sense.
I will just take your word for it. The guy was gay.
Actually, I will not.
Question, in the story where Jesus encounters a man that identifies himself as Legion, how do you interpret that? Is the man possessed, crazy, or something else?
Christ was silent on the issue of homosexuality, no matter how post-liberal, liberal, conservative, anti-conservative, or otherwise theologians "interpret" the story.
I interpret is as written, which is a story of faith and healing. Nothing - at all- about gays.
Aside: at first blush, I thought you were referring to "Legion" - for we are many.
I interpret is as written, which is a story of faith and healing. Nothing - at all- about gays.
Aside: at first blush, I thought you were referring to "Legion" - for we are many.
That's exactly the story I was referring to.
At the end of ROMANS 1...
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
------------
http://castlehaven.wikia.com/home/
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
None of these words come from the time of Christ and you delude yourself, in the extreme, if you think there concept of love, family, marriage, or homosexuality is in any way similar to ours. Even within that small passage, you are probably looking at 7 or 8 authors spread out over several hundreds of years.To use it as a bases for anything other than historical literature is comical to the point of sadness
With the best will in the world, I'm not gay and I don't want to be.
I like gay people, we hang out and we have fun together.
Gay adoption?
No thank you.
You may be able to offer a better life for an individual child somewhere, but I am highly uncomfortable about bringing up children around gay people. You see, I'm not just not gay, I don't want my kids to be gay either.
In some circumstances, it's cool to be gay, in others it isn't.
I hang out with my gay friends and do stuff we all have in common like discos and drinking and stuff. But they aren't invited home. They will never be the godparents of my children.
Parenthood is about providing your children positive role models upon which they will shape their lives in a way you consider best for them.
So speaking personally, I'm not looking for any gay role models around children. Especially not my children. Once you set the precedent that gay adoption is acceptable, you can't take it back.
So here is what I want you to do if you are gay, stop sticking it up other peoples noses. If you choose a life style that is socially unacceptable to many other people, or even if you find yourself unwillingly or unwittingly caught up in it, just keep it to yourself and get on with it. Work out when and where it is OK to be openly gay, and when and where it isn't.
As long as you are aware that it puts peoples noses out of joint, it is your responsability to run a low profile. No drama queen action. Just be mature about it.
I kill foxes, but I also know to shut up about that when I'm in the company of the animals rights brigade. I consider their opinions morally wrong and in need of re-adjustment for the betterment of mankind, but mainly, I just shut up about it. It's a psycho trigger for them.
Being gay around kids makes all known parents squirm everywhere. As far as I'm concerned any gay person who openly discusses their sexuality around children, isn't welcome.
If you are gay, you can't have your own kids. And since I would not be happy about you having guardianship over my kids either, I'm going to have to say I don't want you to have any other persons kids either as a general rule
I'm sure I can find exceptions. I'm sure I could give examples of people who are gay that I would like to provide positive roles for my kids, but a precedent is a precedent and it should never be set be set lightly.
I don't want gay kids any more than your father did, and I don't want my kid falling out with me and running away from home over it, you like your fathers son did.
I don't even want this as a point of conversation on the table. You've fucked your family life up, try not to spread it any further. You know the issues. You know what it has cost you.
You are a role model. Anything you do, children will imitate. Not just your own children or your adopted children, but any children you come into contact with or hear about you.
Children are a responsability, they cramp your style and nerf your fun. There are things you are not allowed to do in front of children. Beat people up, take drugs, chew glass etc, dance naked while swearing at policemen...so many things that I would otherwise approve of.
Being gay is on that list.
You can be gay. That's alright. But you don't get to do it in front of the kids.
On the subject of legal gay partnerships, anything that keeps the tax man off your money is fine with me.
Christ was silent on the issue of homosexuality, no matter how post-liberal, liberal, conservative, anti-conservative, or otherwise theologians "interpret" the story.
I interpret is as written, which is a story of faith and healing. Nothing - at all- about gays.
Aside: at first blush, I thought you were referring to "Legion" - for we are many.
Was Christ silent on the issue of homosexuality, or were the people who wrote his story silent?
-----------------------
</OBAMA>
I don't want my child around the influences of people like you. I would rather a child be adopted by an inclusive loving gay couple rather than someone who teaches them how convenient it is for people like you to make a group illigitimate based on fear of someone being different.
I just had my first child. I want him to know that there are all kinds of different families and households and there is not a single standard that we can hold them all up to. If you think there is, then I'd like to see it. Otherwise, put up or shut up, because I bet I can show you some very stable and socially functional kids who were raised by gay parents.
I fear people like you coming into influence of my child. My wife is black and I am white. Our racially mixed child would have been scorned just a few decades ago because of our family situation. My suspicions are that he is going to have to put up with some of that scorn even now. And to me, that is not at all that much different from your scorn of gay couples and their parenting skills.
-----------------------
</OBAMA>
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
I agree we are all equal in God's eyes, but note what Romans 3:10-11 says:
"10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
I do not believe I am better than anyone else, I just believe that the Bible is true and that many others are lost and don't want to believe in it. If you don't want to believe it I don't fuss at you.
But I do believe that God wrote the WHOLE Bible, not 6-7 authors like qazyman and Porgie suggested.
2 Timothy 2:16 says:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
and 2 Peter 1:21:
"21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
So that is what I believe. I will not condone anyone who disagrees.
------------
http://castlehaven.wikia.com/home/
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
I agree we are all equal in God's eyes, but note what Romans 3:10-11 says:
"10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
I do not believe I am better than anyone else, I just believe that the Bible is true and that many others are lost and don't want to believe in it. If you don't want to believe it I don't fuss at you.
But I do believe that God wrote the WHOLE Bible, not 6-7 authors like qazyman and Porgie suggested.
2 Timothy 2:16 says:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
and 2 Peter 1:21:
"21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
So that is what I believe. I will not condone anyone who disagrees.
To believe that is one thing. To force it on others is another. That is what Proposition 8 just did to Californians. It forced a Biblical belief system on them that they do not accept. They are consensual adults who reject your intepretation of the Bible. Now they're having the government force feed them a manipulative law. It's not fair or American.
-----------------------
</OBAMA>
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
I agree we are all equal in God's eyes, but note what Romans 3:10-11 says:
"10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
I do not believe I am better than anyone else, I just believe that the Bible is true and that many others are lost and don't want to believe in it. If you don't want to believe it I don't fuss at you.
But I do believe that God wrote the WHOLE Bible, not 6-7 authors like qazyman and Porgie suggested.
2 Timothy 2:16 says:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
and 2 Peter 1:21:
"21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
So that is what I believe. I will not condone anyone who disagrees.
To believe that is one thing. To force it on others is another. That is what Proposition 8 just did to Californians. It forced a Biblical belief system on them that they do not accept. They are consensual adults who reject your intepretation of the Bible. Now they're having the government force feed them a manipulative law. It's not fair or American.
Prop 8 did not force a biblical belief system on our citizens, a Democracy was used and the people spoke.
There is a difference of what you enforce from your beliefs (the Bible ect.) and what you allow from the people's say (Democracy).
The gay marriage law shouldn't have passed in the first place. It passed from a series of Homosexual Lobbyists and pressure on the government which resulted in four judges who passed the law.
IMO, I'm not against homosexual love (even though I don't believe in it), but homosexual marriage is what I oppose. And as long as the people has a say in it, I'm ok with that.
------------
http://castlehaven.wikia.com/home/
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
I agree we are all equal in God's eyes, but note what Romans 3:10-11 says:
"10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
I do not believe I am better than anyone else, I just believe that the Bible is true and that many others are lost and don't want to believe in it. If you don't want to believe it I don't fuss at you.
But I do believe that God wrote the WHOLE Bible, not 6-7 authors like qazyman and Porgie suggested.
2 Timothy 2:16 says:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
and 2 Peter 1:21:
"21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
So that is what I believe. I will not condone anyone who disagrees.
To believe that is one thing. To force it on others is another. That is what Proposition 8 just did to Californians. It forced a Biblical belief system on them that they do not accept. They are consensual adults who reject your intepretation of the Bible. Now they're having the government force feed them a manipulative law. It's not fair or American.
Prop 8 did not force a biblical belief system on our citizens, a Democracy was used and the people spoke.
There is a difference of what you enforce from your beliefs (the Bible ect.) and what you allow from the people's say (Democracy).
The gay marriage law shouldn't have passed in the first place. It passed from a series of Homosexual Lobbyists and pressure on the government which resulted in four judges who passed the law.
IMO, I'm not against homosexual love (even though I don't believe in it), but homosexual marriage is what I oppose. And as long as the people has a say in it, I'm ok with that.
I've seen many people post it here before, so I know you've read it at least on this site, but we don't live in a democracy. Democracy's are scary, scary, scary. Think about it, and picture a large crowd with pitchforks and torches storming the castle to kill the "monster" inside. Mob rules is not America, man. It's not what we were founded on and if someone has told you that's what we are, then they lied to you.
-----------------------
</OBAMA>
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
I agree we are all equal in God's eyes, but note what Romans 3:10-11 says:
"10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
I do not believe I am better than anyone else, I just believe that the Bible is true and that many others are lost and don't want to believe in it. If you don't want to believe it I don't fuss at you.
But I do believe that God wrote the WHOLE Bible, not 6-7 authors like qazyman and Porgie suggested.
2 Timothy 2:16 says:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
and 2 Peter 1:21:
"21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
So that is what I believe. I will not condone anyone who disagrees.
To believe that is one thing. To force it on others is another. That is what Proposition 8 just did to Californians. It forced a Biblical belief system on them that they do not accept. They are consensual adults who reject your intepretation of the Bible. Now they're having the government force feed them a manipulative law. It's not fair or American.
Prop 8 did not force a biblical belief system on our citizens, a Democracy was used and the people spoke.
There is a difference of what you enforce from your beliefs (the Bible ect.) and what you allow from the people's say (Democracy).
The gay marriage law shouldn't have passed in the first place. It passed from a series of Homosexual Lobbyists and pressure on the government which resulted in four judges who passed the law.
IMO, I'm not against homosexual love (even though I don't believe in it), but homosexual marriage is what I oppose. And as long as the people has a say in it, I'm ok with that.
I've seen many people post it here before, so I know you've read it at least on this site, but we don't live in a democracy. Democracy's are scary, scary, scary. Think about it, and picture a large crowd with pitchforks and torches storming the castle to kill the "monster" inside. Mob rules is not America, man. It's not what we were founded on and if someone has told you that's what we are, then they lied to you.
Well, yeah we don't live in a true Democracy, and the law does require a lot of limitations to limit mob rule. But then who is going to decide this radical change?
And as far as I see it here in California (And I live near San Fransisco), the homosexuals are the mob.
If you haven't heard they had some violent protests the past several days.
------------
http://castlehaven.wikia.com/home/
Contradiction? No, everything that you just wrote down is crap brought forth from a mind that see's what they wish to see.
#1. Delusional? Hardly. I have a strict set of moral guidelines that no matter how much I'd enjoy bending them sometimes, conscience will not afford me to. It brings about great clarity.
#2. 21st century thinking? You're kidding me right? Homosexuality, and the homosexual movement has been around for thousands of years. Some cultures included homosexuality in as a very strong part of their culture. Some ancient kodakian tribes would inititate young men in by older men having sex with them. They considered the seminal fluid a to endow strength.
#3. Who says I allow my hormones to control me? Who says I don't practice celibacy? If I allowed my hormones that reiterate the fact that I'm still a young man, to control me; I'd be screwing like a rabbit.
#4. As previously stated, the rest of your post is just a bunch of drivel. Try debating intellectually, not by cheap psychological trickery that holds no foundation.
"The greatest trick the devil played on humanity in the 20th century was convincing them that he didn't exist." (Paraphrasing) C.S. Lewis
"If a mother can kill her own child, what is left before I kill you and you kill me?" -Mother Teresa when talking about abortion after accepting the Nobel Peace Prize in 1979
I know it's probably a thing hard to comprehend, but people like myself who are still in their twenties happen to believe in this archaic silly thing valled ethics and morality, and don't believe that it's arbitrary.
I understand it's probably lost on people like you...But it'll never die.
So now I don't have any ethics or morality? Do you see the hole you put us in?
I think you individually have an arbitrary set of morality/ethics. You claim to be a Christian, and say you believe what the Bible says about Yeshua the Annointed One dieing on the cross for your salvation of sin, but then in the same breadth say that you don't believe in all that "magic", and don't believe what the bible says about homosexuality.
One man dieing for the sins of all others...Kind of defines magical doesn't it? Especially the part about him being raised from the dead...Wounds still in tact?
That's ultra magic. At least 20th level cleric.
I understood what he was saying completely.
Ever heard of Jefferson's Bible? He was pretty Unitarian (like myself) and separated the works of Jesus from the magic stories in the Bible. He was a wise man, that Jefferson.
Yes i've heard of Jefferson's Bible, and honestly it takes an arrogant person to re-arrange the bible not based upon mis-translations, or any type of faulty tampering, but because of personal belief and opinion. Makes him of the same ilk as those involved in the council of niacea.
"The greatest trick the devil played on humanity in the 20th century was convincing them that he didn't exist." (Paraphrasing) C.S. Lewis
"If a mother can kill her own child, what is left before I kill you and you kill me?" -Mother Teresa when talking about abortion after accepting the Nobel Peace Prize in 1979
I am not one to quote the Bible, but I appreciate theology a great deal. It is wisdom.
God perceives ALL people -yes, even YOU- as EQUAL. Oh, I know, you think you are slightly better, smarter, or a bit more "special" than everyone else.
Gay, straight, or otherwise, we are ALL equal in God's eyes. All love.
Legally, to a deep dishonor I suspect we, as a nation, will regret, treat homosexuals as something less than a person. Simply put, gay couples cannot exist, in the eyes of the law.
I have warned the people, in a limited and cowardly way, not to "change" their Constitutions to limit rights.
They did that, unwisely, in my view, in California. It is shameful.
Edit: They limited their right, legally, to contract.
I agree we are all equal in God's eyes, but note what Romans 3:10-11 says:
"10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God."
I do not believe I am better than anyone else, I just believe that the Bible is true and that many others are lost and don't want to believe in it. If you don't want to believe it I don't fuss at you.
But I do believe that God wrote the WHOLE Bible, not 6-7 authors like qazyman and Porgie suggested.
2 Timothy 2:16 says:
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"
and 2 Peter 1:21:
"21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost."
So that is what I believe. I will not condone anyone who disagrees.
To believe that is one thing. To force it on others is another. That is what Proposition 8 just did to Californians. It forced a Biblical belief system on them that they do not accept. They are consensual adults who reject your intepretation of the Bible. Now they're having the government force feed them a manipulative law. It's not fair or American.
Prop 8 did not force a biblical belief system on our citizens, a Democracy was used and the people spoke.
There is a difference of what you enforce from your beliefs (the Bible ect.) and what you allow from the people's say (Democracy).
The gay marriage law shouldn't have passed in the first place. It passed from a series of Homosexual Lobbyists and pressure on the government which resulted in four judges who passed the law.
IMO, I'm not against homosexual love (even though I don't believe in it), but homosexual marriage is what I oppose. And as long as the people has a say in it, I'm ok with that.
I've seen many people post it here before, so I know you've read it at least on this site, but we don't live in a democracy. Democracy's are scary, scary, scary. Think about it, and picture a large crowd with pitchforks and torches storming the castle to kill the "monster" inside. Mob rules is not America, man. It's not what we were founded on and if someone has told you that's what we are, then they lied to you.
Well, yeah we don't live in a true Democracy, and the law does require a lot of limitations to limit mob rule. But then who is going to decide this radical change?
And as far as I see it here in California (And I live near San Fransisco), the homosexuals are the mob.
If you haven't heard they had some violent protests the past several days.
This same kind of thing happened in this quirky little state called Alabama with a governor named George Wallace a while back too. People said the judicial branch was legislating at that time too. I see it different though. And I'm pretty much a Libertarian. But I can see the legislative branch stepping in when people are not being treated equally. At that point, the Constitution is being disregarded. I'm all for state rights, but if you're a state that lives under the umbrella of the United States of America there is a set of foundational rules you've got to live by.
Those protests are just a sign of the times man. I disagree with violence too, but people get a little angry when they are denied their basic rights. Especially when they are being forced to pay taxes like this country does to them. You can't expect people to take part in a system that favors one group over another. And it scares me that just because so many people happen to be in the majority they are so apathetic on this issue. Maybe they're scared of the same things that happened to the white people who tried to support blacks during the civil rights protests during the 60's?
-----------------------
</OBAMA>
I know it's probably a thing hard to comprehend, but people like myself who are still in their twenties happen to believe in this archaic silly thing valled ethics and morality, and don't believe that it's arbitrary.
I understand it's probably lost on people like you...But it'll never die.
So now I don't have any ethics or morality? Do you see the hole you put us in?
I think you individually have an arbitrary set of morality/ethics. You claim to be a Christian, and say you believe what the Bible says about Yeshua the Annointed One dieing on the cross for your salvation of sin, but then in the same breadth say that you don't believe in all that "magic", and don't believe what the bible says about homosexuality.
One man dieing for the sins of all others...Kind of defines magical doesn't it? Especially the part about him being raised from the dead...Wounds still in tact?
That's ultra magic. At least 20th level cleric.
I understood what he was saying completely.
Ever heard of Jefferson's Bible? He was pretty Unitarian (like myself) and separated the works of Jesus from the magic stories in the Bible. He was a wise man, that Jefferson.
Yes i've heard of Jefferson's Bible, and honestly it takes an arrogant person to re-arrange the bible not based upon mis-translations, or any type of faulty tampering, but because of personal belief and opinion. Makes him of the same ilk as those involved in the council of niacea.
I think it takes an arrogant person to use the government to force their beliefs on others. Jefferson was completely against that, which to me makes him one of the most gracious defenders of human rights that ever lived.
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</OBAMA>
This same kind of thing happened in this quirky little state called Alabama with a governor named George Wallace a while back too. People said the judicial branch was legislating at that time too. I see it different though. And I'm pretty much a Libertarian. But I can see the legislative branch stepping in when people are not being treated equally. At that point, the Constitution is being disregarded. I'm all for state rights, but if you're a state that lives under the umbrella of the United States of America there is a set of foundational rules you've got to live by.
Those protests are just a sign of the times man. I disagree with violence too, but people get a little angry when they are denied their basic rights. Especially when they are being forced to pay taxes like this country does to them. You can't expect people to take part in a system that favors one group over another. And it scares me that just because so many people happen to be in the majority they are so apathetic on this issue. Maybe they're scared of the same things that happened to the white people who tried to support blacks during the civil rights protests during the 60's?
Hmm... I still think Prop 8 was fair and square. You can still love. To me it's not about love but to get a certificate of their bond.
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http://castlehaven.wikia.com/home/
This same kind of thing happened in this quirky little state called Alabama with a governor named George Wallace a while back too. People said the judicial branch was legislating at that time too. I see it different though. And I'm pretty much a Libertarian. But I can see the legislative branch stepping in when people are not being treated equally. At that point, the Constitution is being disregarded. I'm all for state rights, but if you're a state that lives under the umbrella of the United States of America there is a set of foundational rules you've got to live by.
Those protests are just a sign of the times man. I disagree with violence too, but people get a little angry when they are denied their basic rights. Especially when they are being forced to pay taxes like this country does to them. You can't expect people to take part in a system that favors one group over another. And it scares me that just because so many people happen to be in the majority they are so apathetic on this issue. Maybe they're scared of the same things that happened to the white people who tried to support blacks during the civil rights protests during the 60's?
Hmm... I still think Prop 8 was fair and square. You can still love. To me it's not about love but to get a certificate of their bond.
And all the legal rights that come along with that certificate.
Get the government out of the marriage business and problem solved. Until then, you've got to make the rules equal for everyone.
Just another example of how big government does nothing but divide us so it can grow even bigger.
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</OBAMA>
Jesus was not silent about homosexuality. Indeed, Jesus not only spoke to his apostles about homosexuality, Jesus also promised salvation for homosexuals.
In the book of St. Luke in chapter 17, Jesus discusses the second coming with his disciples. To enlighten his apostles, in verse 34 of chapter 17, Jesus claims, "I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left."
This, then, is the mystery, the parable of his telling, for Jesus used this example of two men in one bed for his disciples to understand. Jesus could have said, "a man and woman in one bed", or "two men fishing", or two men doing anything else but being in bed. Jesus does go on to state in verse 36 that, "Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left."
Why then did Jesus specifically say two men in one bed? Why this example? Jesus knew the truth.
In the time of Jesus, homosexuality was condemned, punishable by death. The law of Moses so stated (Leviticus 20:13). This law, however, in no way diminished homosexuality, and this is the point that Jesus wished to make to his followers. That even the most hated and reviled, those condemned by the law, were subject to salvation by a loving God; not bound by the laws of Moses.
True, Jesus did not state the the two men had engaged in or were having sex, yet neither is there to be found a denial in the illustration. Jesus knew this "abomination" had been practiced,and would continue thousands of years following his death. Jesus spoke not only of past homosexuals, or homosexuals contemporary to his time, but Jesus also included those homosexuals yet to live.
Jesus, on the other hand, is the living Son of God. He could speak not but the truth.
Trade in material assumptions for spiritual facts and make permanent progress.