Can there be a hybrid fee structure, part cash shop, part monthly fee?

Ihmotepp

I recently read an article discussing monthly subs vs cash shops. It seems the hardcore game, wants the monthly sub for many reasons. Teh hardcore gamer wants the game to be "equal" to everyone that plays, with no one gaining an advantage using money. For example, I kill you, I gain more xp, because I spent 1.95 or a sword or potion, and you didn't.

The casual gamer, however, is drawn to the cash shop. The casual gamer doesn't have the time to do the actual quests, mob grinding, etc. to get the items all the time, so they'd prefer to just BUY them. Plus, the casual gamer isn't playing as much, so may not feel they are getting their money's worth in a sub. With a sub you pay, whether you play or not, so it's "all or nothing".

But with a cash shop, you can not play for a week, and you don't pay for a week. Then if you play, makes no difference you didn't play for a week, you can catch up to anybody by buying items.

Where does that leave us? Well, there are MORE casual players than "hardcore" players. If you want to go after the biggest market, you go for the casuals, which means you lean towards Cash Shop.

I think this would make the game not as fun, if it's just all hardcore gamers, or all casuals.

Could you devise a cash shop for the casuals, and a sub fee for the hard core players?

Perhaps a transition from cash shop to monthly? You spend X amount of dollars in the cash shop, why not move to the monthly fee?

Perhaps the way it will go, is we end up with two sorts of games. Teh casual game, like WoW 1-70 will go cash shop.

The more hardcore game, your EQ, EQ2, DAoC, sort of game will go subscription fee, and become a smaller niche market.

Blazz

I have thought long and hard about this topic in the past - and money should never give a player an advantage in a game

(excluding technology - computer power, internet speed etc.)

Xanthorn2008

I tried to find the best words for this... "No".  Yep thats the word I was looking for.  I believe its an either/or senario (f2p or p2p), once you start trying to mix the two, I would be suprised if anyone bites on the ideal.  Though, I have been wrong before. 

I personally have played p2p (EQ, Wow) and f2p (Runes of Magic), and both have there positives and negatives, but for sure, if Wow offered up a way to pay for an advantage, they would lose atleast half there base players today... And vice versa, Runes of Magic went subscrition, while keeping a cash shop, I would quit in a heart beat.  There is an underlying reason I play each game and they started with the foundation of wether they were p2p or f2p!

 

paulscott

Actually there are a bunch of text and web games that do just that.   Basically there's a premium package that unlocks all your features for a month/quater/year,  the package itself is ofcourse tradable.

Some new MMO-traditional, text, and web item shop games are designed so that you WILL use the item shop or buy item shop things from players who have done so(with game currancy).

______________

It works quite well you get a player base that won't shrink because it's free to start and keep playing(more in than out).  And in the first case people know exactly what they're getting(all premium features) and aren't worried about people investing more cash than them or the sort.

Gammit100

I would like a model that resembles what SOE USED to do: separate these by servers.  Free servers with RMT or MT, and subscription servers without.

Abrahmm

I will NEVER touch a game with a cash shop. Simple as that. And I wouldn't consider myself a hardcore game.

BarCrow

I think it should be free with cash shops...or no RMT"S and monthly sub only. At the least ...if it is both...ahem.**cough***SOE***cough**..then if someone spends more than the subscription price at the cash shops...the normal fee should be waived.

dave6660

I don't understand the mentality of buying items in a game to get better.  Isn't that defeating the purpose of playing the game?  Do people really feel a sense of accomplishment by buying their way to the top?  Are these the same people who cheat at Solitaire?

Maybe it's partly overly competitive behavior where people feel "the ends justify the means".

Abrahmm

Originally posted by dave6660


I don't understand the mentality of buying items in a game to get better.  Isn't that defeating the purpose of playing the game?  Do people really feel a sense of accomplishment by buying their way to the top?  Are these the same people who cheat at Solitaire?
Maybe it's partly overly competitive behavior where people feel "the ends justify the means".

 

It's the "Gimme NOW!" generation, what do you expect?

Briansho

It has already begun.

 

EQ2 - Monthly subscription/item mall on toolbar while in game.

WoW - Monthly subscription/Subtle things like server transfers and haircuts/appearance changes.

Ihmotepp

Originally posted by Briansho


It has already begun.
 
EQ2 - Monthly subscription/item mall on toolbar while in game.
WoW - Monthly subscription/Subtle things like server transfers and haircuts/appearance changes.

 

I wasn't thinking of just adding a cash shop on top of a monthly sub fee. More like, the game starts out with no sub fee and a cash shop, but you can graduate to the monthly sub fee.

Or maybe you can play the first 15 levels with a cash shop and after that it's a monthly sub.

 

Seems from what I read the cash shop players are afraid of commitment. Then don't mind an impulse purchase but they don't want to commit to a month of game play. I want this item RIGHT NOW, I don't mind paying for it. But I don't wan't to pay up front for a month of game play. What if I don't feel like playing this month? Then I'll feel ripped off.

At least that's what I got out of it. They end up paying more than a monthly sub, but they don't mind because they got what they wanted when they wanted it, without worrying if they'll get their money's worth out of a month of gaming. Like, they don't want to feel obligated to play because they paid the sub fee or something.

Sort of like signing up to go to the gym or something. I want to pay to go work out today, but not sign uup for a contract. What if I don't want to work out tomorrow?

Doesn't make sense to me, but apparently that's teh way a large segment of gamers feel.

x_rast_x

The whole cash shop vs sub fee is just another example of why this genre must diversify if it is to continue to grow.

I can kind of see allowing a cash shop in a montly fee game for things that have no impact on the actual game - if someone wants to pay $5 for a cute little whatever that follows them around, or a nifty bow in their hair, that's fine in a monthly fee game.  The worst that will happen is people will laugh at them for paying real money for the sake of vanity.

But actual, in-game, useful stuff is a whole 'nother story.  I don't think the montly fee crowd will put up with people being able to buy max-level characters, powerful items, etc.  And the cash-shop crowd, as was already pointed out, isn't interested in committment or having to work in-game for things.  They just want to drop some money and get it now.

So, yes, we do need cash shop games.  There's a demand for them and there's no reason not to make them, they money's there, why not.  Just like we need sandbox games, sci-fi games, crafting-oriented games, console  games, and all the other things people bring up here on a regular basis.  There's too much demand for too many mutually-exclusive features to expect them all to magically show up in some big-budget AAA title.  The big budget AAA titles will always take the easy road and make a lot of compromises in the name of appealing to the biggest audiance possible, which isn't a strategy that seems to be working - I'm with the guys who think indie MMOs are the future, though they'll start small, almost by definition.

njdevi66

I think it should all come down to a having both, but both would be provided by the server you chose to play on... meaning, if you are a hardcore player, then you would chose the server that would be monthly subscription based. Now the casual gamer who wanted a cash shop would chose to play on the RMT server, where they can all purchase till their hearts are content, and nobody would be complaining b/c they chose to play on the RMT server.

 

So, thats the only way i can see it working is if it was server based, sub-fee server or RMT server.

dave6660

Originally posted by x_rast_x


I can kind of see allowing a cash shop in a montly fee game for things that have no impact on the actual game - if someone wants to pay $5 for a cute little whatever that follows them around, or a nifty bow in their hair, that's fine in a monthly fee game.  The worst that will happen is people will laugh at them for paying real money for the sake of vanity.

Even "cute little whatever" items have the potential to damage the game economy.  What happens when people start trading them for good gear or selling them for game currency.  Essentially the game companies just became bona fide gold sellers.

Daffid011

The bigger problem than fair gameplay is the motivations of the game designers.

 

 

A company that makes a pure subscription game is motivated to make the game so much fun that people want to keep playing.

A company that sells items is motivated to make items/tasks more difficult to encourage people to use the cash mall.

 

I don't think I could trust a company to resist the temptation to treat subscription players as second class citizens, because there is always more money to be made by catering to the cash mall shopper. 

 

 

 

Something I just don't understand is the mentality that if someone doesn't have as much time as the next player that it somehow is ok to pay for character advancement.  When did it become a problem to play a game at your own pace?   MMOs are designed around item aquisition.  Buying something just changes the next item needed.  If someone doesn't have time to play for the first item they buy, then they sure arne't going to have time for the next one. 

guiltyone

Ragnarok Online has a "hybrid" system like this. Pay to play servers that also feature an item mall. And a free to play server that is just supported by the item mall. 

techlord

A hybrid could be offered in a very simple manner. You can either earn the item over time through character advancement, quests etc or buy it from the mall. Either way as the Developer, you provide the players more than one option to achieve a goal. The more options, the better.