I got owned by someone who hasn't even played the game, but judged it by a bunch of youtube videos? I'm at work btw. Oh he only has blue gear in WOW and plays fps's he's the expert on Darkfall alright.
Blue more like green. I am very casual in WoW And since Darkfall is.. yes ... an FPS at heart... yes FPS genre players are going to judge DF targetting and compare. Mount and Blade fans are going to shit on DF combat system due to Tasos comment. As I said in my post it simply is not "like. Someone jumped on someone elses success methinks.
Actually DF reminds me a lot of "Snakes on A Plane" the self proclaimed cult hit movie.
Of course... DF should be immune to these kind of cross genre critcisms because its an MMO and made AV and thus is by default revolutionary. Sorry .... it does not work like that.
That's really the only thing preventing me from buying the game, maybe some of you could change my mind lol because I really want to get into it.
I watched a lot of videos, for melee you click the LMB and attack, but the animation is the same every freakin' time! It's this vertical slash animation, and you have to do it for like 10 times. No other animation. That's it.
And the same thing for the magic. Little blue balls flying around the place. And I doubt those balls turn green when you get more skill.
Basically the animations suck in term making the combat more boring. There's the vertical slash, and the little 'cast the blue ball' animation. Now if it had AoC combat/animations it would own.
If you don't like circle-jerk, LMB mash then DF is not for you. I'm still waiting for a vid that shows the " deep " combat that DF is supposed to offer. In that regard it seems like every other MMO......... gotta level up your skills so you can get to the good skills that can turn the tide of a battle.
your going on and on? Ok so you went from blue gear to green gear at level 50 in WOW...Funny your experience seems to keep changing... and you play first person shooters...ok good for you.. You haven't played Darkfall and you don't know what your talking about... it's an mmo based on UO and Asheron's call. Yes you can swing you sword anyway you want. even if noone is around to attack since there is no auto target and other hand holding tools. Actually when you go into melee its 3rd person, when you cast and fire a bow its first person. Just because thats the view doesn't mean its a first person shooter at heart. There are a multitde of skills and different skill based abilities at work as well. Why don't you actually try the game first before you act like you know what your talking about. I don't care if you've played every mmo on earth.and the Everquest world map hanging on your bedroom wall, If you haven't played the one your bitching about then you don't know what your talking about. my god
if that is not enough to excite and convince you then I guess there is no hope for you, your obviously not a fan of twitch player skill games. If you enjoy combat involving pressing 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 with one hand in sequence with a drink in one hand then thats fair enough. but some of us find that boring, each to his own.
I love twitch games, non twitch combat is what is holding MMO's back. as soon as I played aoc's semi switch(mele anyway) combat I could not go back to auto attack MMO's. WAR was a good game but the (wow/generic watch auto attack while hitting special attacks) combat killed it for me completely.
the mele combat does look pretty awfully simple but compared to auto-attack there is no comparison, because you aim yourself.
That's really the only thing preventing me from buying the game, maybe some of you could change my mind lol because I really want to get into it.
I watched a lot of videos, for melee you click the LMB and attack, but the animation is the same every freakin' time! It's this vertical slash animation, and you have to do it for like 10 times. No other animation. That's it.
And the same thing for the magic. Little blue balls flying around the place. And I doubt those balls turn green when you get more skill.
Basically the animations suck in term making the combat more boring. There's the vertical slash, and the little 'cast the blue ball' animation. Now if it had AoC combat/animations it would own.
If you don't like circle-jerk, LMB mash then DF is not for you. I'm still waiting for a vid that shows the " deep " combat that DF is supposed to offer. In that regard it seems like every other MMO......... gotta level up your skills so you can get to the good skills that can turn the tide of a battle.
The thing is this is mainly set up around large scale battles, other than Magic's AOE"s theres not really any skills that you would level up in order to change the tides of the battle. If a mage were to use his AOE's in a group of melees of course hes gonna hit his peers, which makes you learn when and how to use your spells.
And leveling the skills goes alongside playing the game, alot of folks are worried about "The grind" when its set up that as you play, the skills will come. They dont add alot of addition (other than strength dex etc etc) other than being able to use higher tiered equipment (Which you can at any time anyhow) w/o it losing as much durability.
If they were able to bring in the directional combat that dark messiah and M and B have for the melee system, then sure I can definately say it would be an improvement. But even as is, if your into these kinda games, i guarantee you can have a great time.
Good for you. your the forum winner. I'll be in Darkfall fighting with my guild defending our territory and building our city. Enjoy watching your youtube videos writing your novels here. honestly i didn't even read that wall of nerd rage bullsh&t. ROFL
Meh.. its for anyone who comes close
You see unlike DF.. posts here tend not to vanish when a tiny bit of critical thought is leaked out. Which is why in turn these forums are reviled on DF offical forums. Despite the fact the Df forums are outright vicious fanbots and elitist pricktards.
Enjoy your facist regime.
Lol you mean as facist as people going into game forums they dont even like just ot make sure in every thread they mention how it sucks?
on top of that how the majority of players will say whether a game is good are bad depending on their graphics, and then the rest will go into saying OH HES RIGHT, WHO CARES ABOUT LARGE SCALE BATTLES AND HOW THEY AFFECT FPS THAT GAME SUX!!!
Really, i read your post, and the majority of what you found wrong has already been fixed, or is not exactly required to have a good game. And even though its not exactly like Mount and blade combat, it doesnt mean it ruins the rest of the game. Try it for 2 weeks then decide for yourself.
Not its fine to have a opinion. This is the internet. If you don't opinons then this is the wrong place to be. If you want one sided moronic view points just go over to the DF forums. You can pretend you didn't see that sizeable crtical post just vanish. Just shout "go back to WOW" loud enough or simply engage in the "teh lulz" behaviour. This is an open community forum. Many people here have followed the game and are fed up with AV and the bullshit - o - meter is beyond anything seen form any release previously. The contradictory amount of material from. This game will be trolled for a long time to come. And it deserves a bit of a ass kicking. Its developers little profitable(?) bubble needs a little bit of a poke.
The game has zero chance of evolving whilst this censorship goes on. But we all know that the NDA... the closed pay for beta... ( yes it is)... is all part of how AV works. Whereas the game is probably not a scam ... its developers are borderline immoral idiots. Heck I don't rule out Lord Tasos doing a runner, such is my faith in AV and its openess.
I do not want to see any other MMO produced like this one. This doesn't mean no indie. It means lengthy NDA... no stress testing... snotty arsed secretive interviews, over hyped lists of items, citing other game directly which are known success and leaching off them and finally pushing out of potential critical review sites.
God forbid SOE figures out just how far you can abuse an audience and still get box sales. We'd be shafted.
Anyways I suspect the Df forums wil shrtly go private so you may never frequent anyhere again that says anything bad about the game.
Meanwhile the freedom exists everywhere else ... well alomst everywhere
I do agree to a point. I understand AV didnt conduct themselves in a professional manner, but the thing is they were upfront and honest about it. Forums were being flooded (as they shouldve) an dthey actually had to deny use of the forums so they could post and communicate with the community about the goings on of what was going on those initial 2-3 days.
But my thing is people talking down the game of Darkfall because of the actions that occured on their release. Should they have STress tested? Sure. But they didnt, and other than the 1 day they needed to patch its working fine now. Mainly why they had a strict NDA is because they wanted to stay low Key. With an indie developer that know that they couldnt handle so much at launch they wanted to make sure they took it slow, then once they had the support, they could possibly flourish. But of course thats too good of wishful thinking. They should have got more servers and better billing support blah blah blah, but that didnt happen. And even with all that I do find this game very well built, its fun and brings back the sense of the kind of game that WE (the ones this game was aiming towards) would like to play.
And of course Darkfall forums are going to be biased towards darkfall, thats why its there. But the fact that people go out of their way to come into the darkfall forums on MMORPG.com just to say its trash, w/o any actual ingame knowledge other than some videos and reading, instead of witnissing it first hand is actaully kinda funny to me.
And usually its the bigger companies that if you post something bad about the game, and give any type of meaningful criticism that they'd warn you, remove the post and expect you not to do it again.
Have you played the game Tombear81, Or are you somehow making your conclusions based on some Utube videos. Yes combat looks simplistic as it was designed to be. congratulations on your eppifany. There is also archery which is pretty deep, full blown mounted combat, ship to ship combat, naval bombardments, and magic which which goes deeper than any game i've seen since asheron's call . The pvp is not mindles (it can be if you want to be a rogue outcast) but if you actually played the game and were in a guild trying to build a city, you would realize its more political than a game of diplomacy. I assure you there is ALOT more in the overworld than trees.. lol. My advice? Go back to your theme park games click auto attack, and spank it over your purple gear.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
That's really the only thing preventing me from buying the game, maybe some of you could change my mind lol because I really want to get into it.
I watched a lot of videos, for melee you click the LMB and attack, but the animation is the same every freakin' time! It's this vertical slash animation, and you have to do it for like 10 times. No other animation. That's it.
And the same thing for the magic. Little blue balls flying around the place. And I doubt those balls turn green when you get more skill.
Basically the animations suck in term making the combat more boring. There's the vertical slash, and the little 'cast the blue ball' animation. Now if it had AoC combat/animations it would own.
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
That's really the only thing preventing me from buying the game, maybe some of you could change my mind lol because I really want to get into it.
I watched a lot of videos, for melee you click the LMB and attack, but the animation is the same every freakin' time! It's this vertical slash animation, and you have to do it for like 10 times. No other animation. That's it.
And the same thing for the magic. Little blue balls flying around the place. And I doubt those balls turn green when you get more skill.
Basically the animations suck in term making the combat more boring. There's the vertical slash, and the little 'cast the blue ball' animation. Now if it had AoC combat/animations it would own.
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
That's really the only thing preventing me from buying the game, maybe some of you could change my mind lol because I really want to get into it.
I watched a lot of videos, for melee you click the LMB and attack, but the animation is the same every freakin' time! It's this vertical slash animation, and you have to do it for like 10 times. No other animation. That's it.
And the same thing for the magic. Little blue balls flying around the place. And I doubt those balls turn green when you get more skill.
Basically the animations suck in term making the combat more boring. There's the vertical slash, and the little 'cast the blue ball' animation. Now if it had AoC combat/animations it would own.
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
You mean every character is a melee-archer mage?
Potentially.
If you have played skill based PvP games, you know that focusing on 1 thing will typically be gimping yourself.
A melee that can not heal himself w/ magic will have more problems against a melee that can. A melee without some sort of ranged combat such as Magic or Archery will have problems against someone who is kiting them as well. And spells like stamina to mana could be useful for either of those situations.
Before anyone starts saying there is no character individuality - The difference in DF is that certain skills are polar opposites so you have to choose. Look in to the magic system and you will see what I mean. And you wont be able to reroll a new character to use the rest - your choices mean something.
Good for you. your the forum winner. I'll be in Darkfall fighting with my guild defending our territory and building our city. Enjoy watching your youtube videos writing your novels here. honestly i didn't even read that wall of bs. ROFL
you should stop talking and play your game cause you sound like someone who just got OWNED bad.
Go go, come on play it wait are the server down? Anyways... he makes valid points and it was a very nice post while the only thing you say is nonsense crap that finish with "go back to your wow theme park".
Veeeeery mature. But you reflect the DF fanbase pretty well thanks for making us really not want to buy their product.
You can't be owned by leet speak and broken english sorry
Originally posted by Mr_Hand
Originally posted by Vince_G
Have you played the game Tombear81, Or are you somehow making your conclusions based on some Utube videos. Yes combat looks simplistic as it was designed to be. congratulations on your eppifany. There is also archery which is pretty deep, full blown mounted combat, ship to ship combat, naval bombardments, and magic which which goes deeper than any game i've seen since asheron's call . The pvp is not mindles (it can be if you want to be a rogue outcast) but if you actually played the game and were in a guild trying to build a city, you would realize its more political than a game of diplomacy. I assure you there is ALOT more in the overworld than trees.. lol. My advice? Go back to your theme park games click auto attack, and spank it over your purple gear.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
MO's combat isn't any different. Its still LMB "spam" the only difference in MO is that you can hold down LMB and time your strike a little better. Thats it. Oh and MO isn't being designed for siege warfare, which imo removes guild meta politics from the game.
Until people skill up and we see more than just newbies playing the game we won't see how in depth the combat will be. Friendly fire, large special melee attacks, AoE Healing and DMG, siege mechanics, ship warfare (I agree they should of let merchants exist and forgone the "Global" banking system, international trade still possible though), etc are going to be visible in maybe another month. Only when this happens will people be able to see what combat is all about.
For those of you that play AoC, picture how much more involved combat would be if siege engines could be manned, and AoE spells hit allies. That picture in your mind is exactly what DF has; minus DDR melee combos.
For those people who play/have played EvE picture EvE being "reset" and all guilds/players having to start from scratch clustered in the beginning star system. Remember how tedious combat and getting from one place to another was due to guild conflict and asshats? This is where DF is now. Remember how it took a couple of months for EvE to become more involved as people finally started trading, escorting, and making equipment? Remember how even more order was bestowed onto the galxy when guilds began controlling sectors of space and politics eveolved? This is where darkfall will go. From Chaos to Order for its human nature.
That's really the only thing preventing me from buying the game, maybe some of you could change my mind lol because I really want to get into it.
I watched a lot of videos, for melee you click the LMB and attack, but the animation is the same every freakin' time! It's this vertical slash animation, and you have to do it for like 10 times. No other animation. That's it.
And the same thing for the magic. Little blue balls flying around the place. And I doubt those balls turn green when you get more skill.
Basically the animations suck in term making the combat more boring. There's the vertical slash, and the little 'cast the blue ball' animation. Now if it had AoC combat/animations it would own.
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
You mean every character is a melee-archer mage?
Potentially.
If you have played skill based PvP games, you know that focusing on 1 thing will typically be gimping yourself.
A melee that can not heal himself w/ magic will have more problems against a melee that can. A melee without some sort of ranged combat such as Magic or Archery will have problems against someone who is kiting them as well. And spells like stamina to mana could be useful for either of those situations.
Before anyone starts saying there is no character individuality - The difference in DF is that certain skills are polar opposites so you have to choose. Look in to the magic system and you will see what I mean. And you wont be able to reroll a new character to use the rest - your choices mean something.
My naked dexer with a spear did pretty well in UO. So did my dexer with a deadly poisoned newbie katana. They were pure melee classes with all needed supporting skills including hiding and the skill to use bandages (I don't remember the name). In EVE, I had a tackler, who was also did pretty well.
The difference between UO and EVE (great skill-based games) and Darkfall (a mediocre skill-based game) is that in UO and EVE you had an option. In this game, you technically have an option but you'd be gimping yourself if you don't level up all melee archery and magic.
Since most players in a competive environment like a FFA PVP game will gravitate towards the best skill set up, more than likely every one will be the same and those who choose a different, yet more unique path will always be considered ez newbs because they will be.
Originally posted by Vince_G Good for you. your the forum winner. I'll be in Darkfall fighting with my guild defending our territory and building our city. Enjoy watching your youtube videos writing your novels here. honestly i didn't even read that wall of bs. ROFL
you should stop talking and play your game cause you sound like someone who just got OWNED bad.
Go go, come on play it wait are the server down? Anyways... he makes valid points and it was a very nice post while the only thing you say is nonsense crap that finish with "go back to your wow theme park".
Veeeeery mature. But you reflect the DF fanbase pretty well thanks for making us really not want to buy their product.
You can't be owned by leet speak and broken english sorry Originally posted by Mr_Hand
Originally posted by Vince_G Have you played the game Tombear81, Or are you somehow making your conclusions based on some Utube videos. Yes combat looks simplistic as it was designed to be. congratulations on your eppifany. There is also archery which is pretty deep, full blown mounted combat, ship to ship combat, naval bombardments, and magic which which goes deeper than any game i've seen since asheron's call . The pvp is not mindles (it can be if you want to be a rogue outcast) but if you actually played the game and were in a guild trying to build a city, you would realize its more political than a game of diplomacy. I assure you there is ALOT more in the overworld than trees.. lol. My advice? Go back to your theme park games click auto attack, and spank it over your purple gear.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
MO's combat isn't any different. Its still LMB "spam" the only difference in MO is that you can hold down LMB and time your strike a little better. Thats it. Oh and MO isn't being designed for siege warfare, which imo removes guild meta politics from the game.
Until people skill up and we see more than just newbies playing the game we won't see how in depth the combat will be. Friendly fire, large special melee attacks, AoE Healing and DMG, siege mechanics, ship warfare (I agree they should of let merchants exist and forgone the "Global" banking system, international trade still possible though), etc are going to be visible in maybe another month. Only when this happens will people be able to see what combat is all about.
For those of you that play AoC, picture how much more involved combat would be if siege engines could be manned, and AoE spells hit allies. That picture in your mind is exactly what DF has; minus DDR melee combos.
For those people who play/have played EvE picture EvE being "reset" and all guilds/players having to start from scratch clustered in the beginning star system. Remember how tedious combat and getting from one place to another was due to guild conflict and asshats? This is where DF is now. Remember how it took a couple of months for EvE to become more involved as people finally started trading, escorting, and making equipment? Remember how even more order was bestowed onto the galxy when guilds began controlling sectors of space? This is where darkfall will go.
From Chaos to Order for its human nature.
Other than looting players eve and DF are alot different.
Originally posted by Vince_G Good for you. your the forum winner. I'll be in Darkfall fighting with my guild defending our territory and building our city. Enjoy watching your youtube videos writing your novels here. honestly i didn't even read that wall of bs. ROFL
you should stop talking and play your game cause you sound like someone who just got OWNED bad.
Go go, come on play it wait are the server down? Anyways... he makes valid points and it was a very nice post while the only thing you say is nonsense crap that finish with "go back to your wow theme park".
Veeeeery mature. But you reflect the DF fanbase pretty well thanks for making us really not want to buy their product.
You can't be owned by leet speak and broken english sorry Originally posted by Mr_Hand
Originally posted by Vince_G Have you played the game Tombear81, Or are you somehow making your conclusions based on some Utube videos. Yes combat looks simplistic as it was designed to be. congratulations on your eppifany. There is also archery which is pretty deep, full blown mounted combat, ship to ship combat, naval bombardments, and magic which which goes deeper than any game i've seen since asheron's call . The pvp is not mindles (it can be if you want to be a rogue outcast) but if you actually played the game and were in a guild trying to build a city, you would realize its more political than a game of diplomacy. I assure you there is ALOT more in the overworld than trees.. lol. My advice? Go back to your theme park games click auto attack, and spank it over your purple gear.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
MO's combat isn't any different. Its still LMB "spam" the only difference in MO is that you can hold down LMB and time your strike a little better. Thats it. Oh and MO isn't being designed for siege warfare, which imo removes guild meta politics from the game.
Until people skill up and we see more than just newbies playing the game we won't see how in depth the combat will be. Friendly fire, large special melee attacks, AoE Healing and DMG, siege mechanics, ship warfare (I agree they should of let merchants exist and forgone the "Global" banking system, international trade still possible though), etc are going to be visible in maybe another month. Only when this happens will people be able to see what combat is all about.
For those of you that play AoC, picture how much more involved combat would be if siege engines could be manned, and AoE spells hit allies. That picture in your mind is exactly what DF has; minus DDR melee combos.
For those people who play/have played EvE picture EvE being "reset" and all guilds/players having to start from scratch clustered in the beginning star system. Remember how tedious combat and getting from one place to another was due to guild conflict and asshats? This is where DF is now. Remember how it took a couple of months for EvE to become more involved as people finally started trading, escorting, and making equipment? Remember how even more order was bestowed onto the galxy when guilds began controlling sectors of space? This is where darkfall will go.
From Chaos to Order for its human nature.
Other than looting players eve and DF are alot different.
I wasn't talking about game mechanics, I was talking about how it took time for EvE to be more involved than just killing and skilling up. Player politics is one of EvE best selling points, but player politics didn't just happen over night. It took time for players and guilds to establish themeselves and find various niches to fill. That was my point. It will take DF time to evelove past the phase and get to player interaction level that EvE currently has.
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required... See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
try to stun them.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Basically clicking away text windows ruins every MMO, try to have fun instead of rushing things. Without story and lore all there is left is a bunch of mechanics. Reply Add Multi-Quote
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
try to stun them.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
If you can apply poison to a weapon, I wouldn't see why you couldn't make a naked spearmaster in this game and still be effective instead of healing spells you'd use healing pots. Same affect as long as you can maintain DPS and use skill effectively.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
try to stun them.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
try to stun them.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy and speed hacking in WoW).
And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
try to stun them.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy).
And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Technically, boss, if you look at the game objectively it's a complete fail. It's as if someone took every single negative thing from other MMOs and added them to DF.
-Failed launch. Can you even call it a launch?
-Broken billing/ordering. Of course it's the customer's problems - they entered the wrong information. And of course the banks don't trust Global Collect, a company with 15 years of international e-commerce experience - practically shady newbs, right?
-Macroing the only real way to advance. Let's be honest here, you can level your magic missile in combat but it's much more painless to do it overnight while you sleep.
-Hacking/exploiting. Your top guilds exploited the broken mobs to get their player cities on day 1-2. It can't get worse that this, man. People started exploiting as soon as they were able to log on.
-Made a boo-boo and became red? No problem, get one of your boys from a different faction to let you kill him a few times and you're as good as new.
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required... See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another. Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either: A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build. try to stun them. C) attack them. In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot? I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days. In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP. If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only). 1) Stam Leech 2) Stone Skin 3) Brawn Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!! you cant block the attacks with your shild?! You cant aim for the legs?! You cant crash his head into peices?! Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night. Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside. BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy). And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Technically, boss, if you look at the game objectively it's a complete fail. It's as if someone took every single negative thing from other MMOs and added them to DF. -Failed launch. Can you even call it a launch? -Broken billing/ordering. Of course it's the customer's problems - they entered the wrong information. And of course the banks don't trust Global Collect, a company with 15 years of international e-commerce experience - practically shady newbs, right? -Macroing the only real way to advance. Let's be honest here, you can level your magic missile in combat but it's much more painless to do it overnight while you sleep. -Hacking/exploiting. Your top guilds exploited the broken mobs to get their player cities on day 1-2. It can't get worse that this, man. People started exploiting as soon as they were able to log on. -Made a boo-boo and became red? No problem, get one of your boys from a different faction to let you kill him a few times and you're as good as new. Shall I go on or do you get the picture?
All of which are problems that are inherent with nearly every game during intial launch in fact I listed examples of other games many AAA titles, which had the same problem. Heres a list:
Marcoing: UO, FFXI, WoW all have/had people marcoing on a large scale to get resouces (biggest in nearly every game), kill bosses that drop rare loot (this was huge in FFXI), or exp farm (WoW has some really sophisticated macros, WAR has some for rep farming).
Hacking: AoC had AoCbuddy, people report WoW was hacked with God mode and Speed hacks (didn't play it at launch so I can't be certain)
Exploits: Duping has been in pretty much every MMORPG released to date on some form or another. WoW had people soloing 40 man raids, AoC had broken raid times and stuck monster fighting.
Faction exploiting: UO tricked people to go gray, AoC had murders farmed for PvP exp. WAR has faction farming.
Failed Launch:-If you mean limited launch then EvE. if you mean poor launch with broken game then VG, WAR, AoC, SWG, and maybe Shadowbane (can't say for sure didn't play it)
Billing Skrew-Ups: AoC was huge on this. Go through the AoC forums on this site and you'll see people being charged for subs they canceled or being charged 2x.
What the point of this list? Basically, if you are going to say DF is utter fail for these reason then all these other games are/were utter fails for the same reason. Because if you look at it objectively, nearly every MMO, has had every single one of these problems. But you know these things tend to get fixed with Ghasp time. Get the picture now?
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
See my point?
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
try to stun them.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy).
And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Technically, boss, if you look at the game objectively it's a complete fail. It's as if someone took every single negative thing from other MMOs and added them to DF.
-Failed launch. Can you even call it a launch?
-Broken billing/ordering. Of course it's the customer's problems - they entered the wrong information. And of course the banks don't trust Global Collect, a company with 15 years of international e-commerce experience - practically shady newbs, right?
-Macroing the only real way to advance. Let's be honest here, you can level your magic missile in combat but it's much more painless to do it overnight while you sleep.
-Hacking/exploiting. Your top guilds exploited the broken mobs to get their player cities on day 1-2. It can't get worse that this, man. People started exploiting as soon as they were able to log on.
-Made a boo-boo and became red? No problem, get one of your boys from a different faction to let you kill him a few times and you're as good as new.
Shall I go on or do you get the picture?
All of which are problems that are inherent with nearly every game during intial launch in fact I listed examples of other games many AAA titles, which had the same problem. Heres a list:
Marcoing: UO, FFXI, WoW all have/had people marcoing on a large scale to get resouces (biggest in nearly every game), kill bosses that drop rare loot (this was huge in FFXI), or exp farm (WoW has some really sophisticated macros, WAR has some for rep farming).
Hacking: AoC had AoCbuddy, people report WoW was hacked with God mode and Speed hacks (didn't play it at launch so I can't be certain)
Exploits: Duping has been in pretty much every MMORPG released to date on some form or another. WoW had people soloing 40 man raids, AoC had broken raid times and stuck monster fighting.
Faction exploiting: UO tricked people to go gray, AoC had murders farmed for PvP exp. WAR has faction farming.
Failed Launch:-If you mean limited launch then EvE. if you mean poor launch with broken game then VG, WAR, AoC, SWG, and maybe Shadowbane (can't say for sure didn't play it)
Billing Skrew-Ups: AoC was huge on this. Go through the AoC forums on this site and you'll see people being charged for subs they canceled or being charged 2x.
What the point of this list? Basically, if you are going to say DF is utter fail for these reason then all these other games are/were utter fails for the same reason. Because if you look at it objectively, nearly every MMO, has had every single one of these problems. But you know these things tend to get fixed with Ghasp time. Get the picture now?
OMG I had an ephiphany!
ALL MMO's are failures at launch if you expect them to compete with established games!
its so clear now.... maybe I should have listened to everyone who has been saying that for years?
All of which are problems that are inherent with nearly every game during intial launch in fact I listed examples of other games many AAA titles, which had the same problem. Heres a list:
Marcoing: UO, FFXI, WoW all have/had people marcoing on a large scale to get resouces (biggest in nearly every game), kill bosses that drop rare loot (this was huge in FFXI), or exp farm (WoW has some really sophisticated macros, WAR has some for rep farming). UO had macro problems but the game was also one of the first MMOs, released over 10 years ago. Hacking: AoC had AoCbuddy, people report WoW was hacked with God mode and Speed hacks (didn't play it at launch so I can't be certain) AoC sucks ass, no dispute there. I've played WoW since launch and there were no God mode hacks. There were some floating hacks and speed hacks but those were dealt with seriously quick. Like almost the next day. Exploits: Duping has been in pretty much every MMORPG released to date on some form or another. WoW had people soloing 40 man raids, AoC had broken raid times and stuck monster fighting. The people who soloed 40 man raids were able to solo due to a pally bug which required other people to make it work. If I remember correctly after a certain patch, a pally was given a skill which allowed him to dish out damage based on the damage he received as long as he didn't attack. However the pally soloing the raid needed 39 other people to get to the boss and needed a dedicated healer to keep him up until the damage built up. So it wasn't really soloing. Besides that, that exploit was done away with literaly within days. Faction exploiting: UO tricked people to go gray, AoC had murders farmed for PvP exp. WAR has faction farming. UO is over 10 years old and was one of the first MMOs - they are allowed to make mistakes, they were pioneers of the genre and had to learn the hard way. AoC sucks and WAR's faction farming required doing their battlegrounds over and over again which isn't an exploit. Failed Launch:-If you mean limited launch then EvE. if you mean poor launch with broken game then VG, WAR, AoC, SWG, and maybe Shadowbane (can't say for sure didn't play it) EVE did not have a limited launch. The game was very buggy but it was available to anyone willing to pay. VG, AoC and SWG did have horrible launches. WAR, on the other hand was smooth. I've played it since day 1 as well. Eventhough there were some server disconnects, they weren't frequent and it wasn't a big deal. Billing Skrew-Ups: AoC was huge on this. Go through the AoC forums on this site and you'll see people being charged for subs they canceled or being charged 2x. AoC and Funcom in general are notorious for this. They had a similar problem with their other game: Anarchy Online. However, Funcom's incompetence is pretty much on the same level as Aventurine's, so I wasn't surprised. What the point of this list? Basically, if you are going to say DF is utter fail for these reason then all these other games are/were utter fails for the same reason. Because if you look at it objectively, nearly every MMO, has had every single one of these problems. But you know these things tend to get fixed with Ghasp time. Get the picture now? DF is serious fail.
Comments
Blue more like green. I am very casual in WoW
And since Darkfall is.. yes ... an FPS at heart... yes FPS genre players are going to judge DF targetting and compare. Mount and Blade fans are going to shit on DF combat system due to Tasos comment. As I said in my post it simply is not "like. Someone jumped on someone elses success methinks.
Actually DF reminds me a lot of "Snakes on A Plane" the self proclaimed cult hit movie.
Of course... DF should be immune to these kind of cross genre critcisms because its an MMO and made AV and thus is by default revolutionary. Sorry .... it does not work like that.
If you don't like circle-jerk, LMB mash then DF is not for you. I'm still waiting for a vid that shows the " deep " combat that DF is supposed to offer. In that regard it seems like every other MMO......... gotta level up your skills so you can get to the good skills that can turn the tide of a battle.
your going on and on? Ok so you went from blue gear to green gear at level 50 in WOW...Funny your experience seems to keep changing... and you play first person shooters...ok good for you.. You haven't played Darkfall and you don't know what your talking about... it's an mmo based on UO and Asheron's call. Yes you can swing you sword anyway you want. even if noone is around to attack since there is no auto target and other hand holding tools. Actually when you go into melee its 3rd person, when you cast and fire a bow its first person. Just because thats the view doesn't mean its a first person shooter at heart. There are a multitde of skills and different skill based abilities at work as well. Why don't you actually try the game first before you act like you know what your talking about. I don't care if you've played every mmo on earth.and the Everquest world map hanging on your bedroom wall, If you haven't played the one your bitching about then you don't know what your talking about. my god
YOU AIM YOURSELF.
if that is not enough to excite and convince you then I guess there is no hope for you, your obviously not a fan of twitch player skill games. If you enjoy combat involving pressing 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 with one hand in sequence with a drink in one hand then thats fair enough. but some of us find that boring, each to his own.
I love twitch games, non twitch combat is what is holding MMO's back. as soon as I played aoc's semi switch(mele anyway) combat I could not go back to auto attack MMO's. WAR was a good game but the (wow/generic watch auto attack while hitting special attacks) combat killed it for me completely.
the mele combat does look pretty awfully simple but compared to auto-attack there is no comparison, because you aim yourself.
My blog:
If you don't like circle-jerk, LMB mash then DF is not for you. I'm still waiting for a vid that shows the " deep " combat that DF is supposed to offer. In that regard it seems like every other MMO......... gotta level up your skills so you can get to the good skills that can turn the tide of a battle.
The thing is this is mainly set up around large scale battles, other than Magic's AOE"s theres not really any skills that you would level up in order to change the tides of the battle. If a mage were to use his AOE's in a group of melees of course hes gonna hit his peers, which makes you learn when and how to use your spells.
And leveling the skills goes alongside playing the game, alot of folks are worried about "The grind" when its set up that as you play, the skills will come. They dont add alot of addition (other than strength dex etc etc) other than being able to use higher tiered equipment (Which you can at any time anyhow) w/o it losing as much durability.
If they were able to bring in the directional combat that dark messiah and M and B have for the melee system, then sure I can definately say it would be an improvement. But even as is, if your into these kinda games, i guarantee you can have a great time.
IT brought back so many memories of AC DT
Meh.. its for anyone who comes close
You see unlike DF.. posts here tend not to vanish when a tiny bit of critical thought is leaked out. Which is why in turn these forums are reviled on DF offical forums. Despite the fact the Df forums are outright vicious fanbots and elitist pricktards.
Enjoy your facist regime.
Lol you mean as facist as people going into game forums they dont even like just ot make sure in every thread they mention how it sucks?
on top of that how the majority of players will say whether a game is good are bad depending on their graphics, and then the rest will go into saying OH HES RIGHT, WHO CARES ABOUT LARGE SCALE BATTLES AND HOW THEY AFFECT FPS THAT GAME SUX!!!
Really, i read your post, and the majority of what you found wrong has already been fixed, or is not exactly required to have a good game. And even though its not exactly like Mount and blade combat, it doesnt mean it ruins the rest of the game. Try it for 2 weeks then decide for yourself.
Not its fine to have a opinion. This is the internet. If you don't opinons then this is the wrong place to be. If you want one sided moronic view points just go over to the DF forums. You can pretend you didn't see that sizeable crtical post just vanish. Just shout "go back to WOW" loud enough or simply engage in the "teh lulz" behaviour. This is an open community forum. Many people here have followed the game and are fed up with AV and the bullshit - o - meter is beyond anything seen form any release previously. The contradictory amount of material from. This game will be trolled for a long time to come. And it deserves a bit of a ass kicking. Its developers little profitable(?) bubble needs a little bit of a poke.
The game has zero chance of evolving whilst this censorship goes on. But we all know that the NDA... the closed pay for beta... ( yes it is)... is all part of how AV works. Whereas the game is probably not a scam ... its developers are borderline immoral idiots. Heck I don't rule out Lord Tasos doing a runner, such is my faith in AV and its openess.
I do not want to see any other MMO produced like this one. This doesn't mean no indie. It means lengthy NDA... no stress testing... snotty arsed secretive interviews, over hyped lists of items, citing other game directly which are known success and leaching off them and finally pushing out of potential critical review sites.
God forbid SOE figures out just how far you can abuse an audience and still get box sales. We'd be shafted.
Anyways I suspect the Df forums wil shrtly go private so you may never frequent anyhere again that says anything bad about the game.
Meanwhile the freedom exists everywhere else ... well alomst everywhere
I do agree to a point. I understand AV didnt conduct themselves in a professional manner, but the thing is they were upfront and honest about it. Forums were being flooded (as they shouldve) an dthey actually had to deny use of the forums so they could post and communicate with the community about the goings on of what was going on those initial 2-3 days.
But my thing is people talking down the game of Darkfall because of the actions that occured on their release. Should they have STress tested? Sure. But they didnt, and other than the 1 day they needed to patch its working fine now. Mainly why they had a strict NDA is because they wanted to stay low Key. With an indie developer that know that they couldnt handle so much at launch they wanted to make sure they took it slow, then once they had the support, they could possibly flourish. But of course thats too good of wishful thinking. They should have got more servers and better billing support blah blah blah, but that didnt happen. And even with all that I do find this game very well built, its fun and brings back the sense of the kind of game that WE (the ones this game was aiming towards) would like to play.
And of course Darkfall forums are going to be biased towards darkfall, thats why its there. But the fact that people go out of their way to come into the darkfall forums on MMORPG.com just to say its trash, w/o any actual ingame knowledge other than some videos and reading, instead of witnissing it first hand is actaully kinda funny to me.
And usually its the bigger companies that if you post something bad about the game, and give any type of meaningful criticism that they'd warn you, remove the post and expect you not to do it again.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
____________________________
Moved to next page...
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
You mean every character is a melee-archer mage?
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
You mean every character is a melee-archer mage?
Potentially.
If you have played skill based PvP games, you know that focusing on 1 thing will typically be gimping yourself.
A melee that can not heal himself w/ magic will have more problems against a melee that can. A melee without some sort of ranged combat such as Magic or Archery will have problems against someone who is kiting them as well. And spells like stamina to mana could be useful for either of those situations.
Before anyone starts saying there is no character individuality - The difference in DF is that certain skills are polar opposites so you have to choose. Look in to the magic system and you will see what I mean. And you wont be able to reroll a new character to use the rest - your choices mean something.
(Edit: Here I'll help you out - darkfallnews.blogspot.com/2009/01/full-darkfall-spell-list.html - Take Air magic since it is right on top - Can you deny that spells like "Come Hither" will not immensely help any melee character?)
MO's combat isn't any different. Its still LMB "spam" the only difference in MO is that you can hold down LMB and time your strike a little better. Thats it. Oh and MO isn't being designed for siege warfare, which imo removes guild meta politics from the game.
Until people skill up and we see more than just newbies playing the game we won't see how in depth the combat will be. Friendly fire, large special melee attacks, AoE Healing and DMG, siege mechanics, ship warfare (I agree they should of let merchants exist and forgone the "Global" banking system, international trade still possible though), etc are going to be visible in maybe another month. Only when this happens will people be able to see what combat is all about.
For those of you that play AoC, picture how much more involved combat would be if siege engines could be manned, and AoE spells hit allies. That picture in your mind is exactly what DF has; minus DDR melee combos.
For those people who play/have played EvE picture EvE being "reset" and all guilds/players having to start from scratch clustered in the beginning star system. Remember how tedious combat and getting from one place to another was due to guild conflict and asshats? This is where DF is now. Remember how it took a couple of months for EvE to become more involved as people finally started trading, escorting, and making equipment? Remember how even more order was bestowed onto the galxy when guilds began controlling sectors of space and politics eveolved? This is where darkfall will go. From Chaos to Order for its human nature.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Combat in ALL MMO's looks boring in videos lol.
But to be honest, DF's melee does look a bit basic. But you need to understand that every character is a hybrid. If you have played Asherons Call in the past, you know what this means.
Also, the majority of the skills are not going to be available until players have played for awhile. We've only seen the basics up to this point.
Point is, you or I should not judge the combat until we actually play it, and things may be different then it seems because characters in games w/ skill systems are more then just Melee, Archery, or Spells alone.
You mean every character is a melee-archer mage?
Potentially.
If you have played skill based PvP games, you know that focusing on 1 thing will typically be gimping yourself.
A melee that can not heal himself w/ magic will have more problems against a melee that can. A melee without some sort of ranged combat such as Magic or Archery will have problems against someone who is kiting them as well. And spells like stamina to mana could be useful for either of those situations.
Before anyone starts saying there is no character individuality - The difference in DF is that certain skills are polar opposites so you have to choose. Look in to the magic system and you will see what I mean. And you wont be able to reroll a new character to use the rest - your choices mean something.
(Edit: Here I'll help you out - darkfallnews.blogspot.com/2009/01/full-darkfall-spell-list.html - Take Air magic since it is right on top - Can you deny that spells like "Come Hither" will not immensely help any melee character?)
My naked dexer with a spear did pretty well in UO. So did my dexer with a deadly poisoned newbie katana. They were pure melee classes with all needed supporting skills including hiding and the skill to use bandages (I don't remember the name). In EVE, I had a tackler, who was also did pretty well.
The difference between UO and EVE (great skill-based games) and Darkfall (a mediocre skill-based game) is that in UO and EVE you had an option. In this game, you technically have an option but you'd be gimping yourself if you don't level up all melee archery and magic.
Since most players in a competive environment like a FFA PVP game will gravitate towards the best skill set up, more than likely every one will be the same and those who choose a different, yet more unique path will always be considered ez newbs because they will be.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
MO's combat isn't any different. Its still LMB "spam" the only difference in MO is that you can hold down LMB and time your strike a little better. Thats it. Oh and MO isn't being designed for siege warfare, which imo removes guild meta politics from the game.
Until people skill up and we see more than just newbies playing the game we won't see how in depth the combat will be. Friendly fire, large special melee attacks, AoE Healing and DMG, siege mechanics, ship warfare (I agree they should of let merchants exist and forgone the "Global" banking system, international trade still possible though), etc are going to be visible in maybe another month. Only when this happens will people be able to see what combat is all about.
For those of you that play AoC, picture how much more involved combat would be if siege engines could be manned, and AoE spells hit allies. That picture in your mind is exactly what DF has; minus DDR melee combos.
For those people who play/have played EvE picture EvE being "reset" and all guilds/players having to start from scratch clustered in the beginning star system. Remember how tedious combat and getting from one place to another was due to guild conflict and asshats? This is where DF is now. Remember how it took a couple of months for EvE to become more involved as people finally started trading, escorting, and making equipment? Remember how even more order was bestowed onto the galxy when guilds began controlling sectors of space? This is where darkfall will go.
From Chaos to Order for its human nature.
Other than looting players eve and DF are alot different.
You may one of the most dilusional posters here. Good luck with actually seeing any of that as a modern mechanic within Darkfall. You'll be playing MO like the rest of us in 4 months time. Stop supporting a game you know will not offer any of what you just said.
MO's combat isn't any different. Its still LMB "spam" the only difference in MO is that you can hold down LMB and time your strike a little better. Thats it. Oh and MO isn't being designed for siege warfare, which imo removes guild meta politics from the game.
Until people skill up and we see more than just newbies playing the game we won't see how in depth the combat will be. Friendly fire, large special melee attacks, AoE Healing and DMG, siege mechanics, ship warfare (I agree they should of let merchants exist and forgone the "Global" banking system, international trade still possible though), etc are going to be visible in maybe another month. Only when this happens will people be able to see what combat is all about.
For those of you that play AoC, picture how much more involved combat would be if siege engines could be manned, and AoE spells hit allies. That picture in your mind is exactly what DF has; minus DDR melee combos.
For those people who play/have played EvE picture EvE being "reset" and all guilds/players having to start from scratch clustered in the beginning star system. Remember how tedious combat and getting from one place to another was due to guild conflict and asshats? This is where DF is now. Remember how it took a couple of months for EvE to become more involved as people finally started trading, escorting, and making equipment? Remember how even more order was bestowed onto the galxy when guilds began controlling sectors of space? This is where darkfall will go.
From Chaos to Order for its human nature.
Other than looting players eve and DF are alot different.
I wasn't talking about game mechanics, I was talking about how it took time for EvE to be more involved than just killing and skilling up. Player politics is one of EvE best selling points, but player politics didn't just happen over night. It took time for players and guilds to establish themeselves and find various niches to fill. That was my point. It will take DF time to evelove past the phase and get to player interaction level that EvE currently has.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Umm newsflash dude. In just about every other MMO you press the 1 key once and sit back while your character does the exact same hack animation repeatedly. For spells you press tab to auto target your enemy and then click the corresponding button for whatever you want to cast, sit back while a cast bar fills up and it shoots off, no aiming or timing required...
See my point?
playing: darkfall
waiting: earthrise
I'll give you an easy to understand example. I'll assume that you have played WoW before, most MMO gamers have at one point or another.
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Basically clicking away text windows ruins every MMO, try to have fun instead of rushing things. Without story and lore all there is left is a bunch of mechanics.
Reply
Add Multi-Quote
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
If you can apply poison to a weapon, I wouldn't see why you couldn't make a naked spearmaster in this game and still be effective instead of healing spells you'd use healing pots. Same affect as long as you can maintain DPS and use skill effectively.
Actually... you can do all.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy and speed hacking in WoW).
And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Say you're a rogue in WoW and you're fighting a priest or a mage. They start casting a spell, what do you do? You can either:
A) kick and distrupt their spell casting or silence them for a few seconds depending on your build.
C) attack them.
In DF, what would you do faced with a similar situation? Oh, my bad, you wouldn't be faced with a similar situation because both of you will be the melee-archer mage and you'll wind up sprinting back and forth pressing the left mouse button trying to time each other as if you were knife fighting in Counter Strike until one of you decided that he has had enough and takes off running. Then you'll be chasing each other around for 10+ minutes and for what? Some gold and lame ass goblin loot?
I like how people downplay the "auto-attack" feature in other MMOs. Especially since most of them offer a more strategic approach to combat. You make it seem like I can press auto-attack in PvP and go grab a sandwich and by the time I get back, I've killed the whole zone. It's not like that and you know it. As it is now the combat in WoW, LOTRO and WAR is more strategic than in DF.
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy).
And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Technically, boss, if you look at the game objectively it's a complete fail. It's as if someone took every single negative thing from other MMOs and added them to DF.
-Failed launch. Can you even call it a launch?
-Broken billing/ordering. Of course it's the customer's problems - they entered the wrong information. And of course the banks don't trust Global Collect, a company with 15 years of international e-commerce experience - practically shady newbs, right?
-Macroing the only real way to advance. Let's be honest here, you can level your magic missile in combat but it's much more painless to do it overnight while you sleep.
-Hacking/exploiting. Your top guilds exploited the broken mobs to get their player cities on day 1-2. It can't get worse that this, man. People started exploiting as soon as they were able to log on.
-Made a boo-boo and became red? No problem, get one of your boys from a different faction to let you kill him a few times and you're as good as new.
Shall I go on or do you get the picture?
All of which are problems that are inherent with nearly every game during intial launch in fact I listed examples of other games many AAA titles, which had the same problem. Heres a list:
Marcoing: UO, FFXI, WoW all have/had people marcoing on a large scale to get resouces (biggest in nearly every game), kill bosses that drop rare loot (this was huge in FFXI), or exp farm (WoW has some really sophisticated macros, WAR has some for rep farming).
Hacking: AoC had AoCbuddy, people report WoW was hacked with God mode and Speed hacks (didn't play it at launch so I can't be certain)
Exploits: Duping has been in pretty much every MMORPG released to date on some form or another. WoW had people soloing 40 man raids, AoC had broken raid times and stuck monster fighting.
Faction exploiting: UO tricked people to go gray, AoC had murders farmed for PvP exp. WAR has faction farming.
Failed Launch:-If you mean limited launch then EvE. if you mean poor launch with broken game then VG, WAR, AoC, SWG, and maybe Shadowbane (can't say for sure didn't play it)
Billing Skrew-Ups: AoC was huge on this. Go through the AoC forums on this site and you'll see people being charged for subs they canceled or being charged 2x.
What the point of this list? Basically, if you are going to say DF is utter fail for these reason then all these other games are/were utter fails for the same reason. Because if you look at it objectively, nearly every MMO, has had every single one of these problems. But you know these things tend to get fixed with Ghasp time. Get the picture now?
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Read my post above for a more in depth explanation but...
In Themepark MMOs, and generally non-skill based sandbox MMOs, a player can get to level "20" in a about a weeks playing time and be handed all the skills you've just described. This is why in those games you have people that plow though and see "strategic" combat in a matter of days.
In a skill based system such as DF, you actually have to train skills groups in order to get more than Swing and Magic missile. This is why right now all you see are people using what they have to kill people and get loot. You aren't seeing very many people froward planning and training to get skill that actually offer a strategic advantage because 1) No one would post about them training or how they plan to make their character, and 2) Most people are getting their kicks out of FFA Full Loot PvP.
If you look at the blog post of magic spells one of the previous posters linked you can see the potential for in depth strategic combat there. Hers is a very basic off the top of my head skill set that would sever someone well that wants to do light melee and magic (picked at random earth only).
1) Stam Leech
2) Stone Skin
3) Brawn
Gah I couldn't find a complete skill list or I would have made more "builds" for people but I think you get the idea. A person can be just an Arch type such as a buff specialist, healer, dmg, melee, etc and still be good without being a jack of all trades, but it will take people time to get there. In fact, a person can't be a jack of all trades since skill degrade from lack of use past 50 skill up.
Originally posted by rensta
Wow this is bull shit!!
you cant block the attacks with your shild?!
You cant aim for the legs?!
You cant crash his head into peices?!
Fuck this.... go play ~Risk Your Life2~ Has the same grafhic and combat system!
Actually... you can do all.
Let me be the first to tell you that you're full of it. I know that you're trying to make your game out to be better than it actually is but come on, bro. Everyone knows how the game really is. Of course by training you mean macro, right? I might as well get "Kick" at lvl 8 or whatever rather than having to AFK macro it on my friend over night.
Stop lying to people. DF is an MMOFPS of lower caliber than Planetside.
BTW, how's that international banking campaign is going? Did you find more evidence besides your guild mate's plane ticket?
I'm not making DF to be greater than it is. Does a person have to AFK macro to skill up? I don't know how long it takes to skill up so I can't answerer that. Are people macroing in the game? Yes. Are people cheating in the game? Yes. Dose DF need some twinking? Of course. But you are making it sound like that game is complete fail based on 1) Launch, 2) Newbie phase of a skill based level system, 3) Macroing (present in different degrees in every game. EX Macro farming exp in WoW, Bosses in FFXI, Rep points in WAR), and hacks (present in different degrees in every game EX: AoC buddy).
And international banking problems do occur outside DF and MMOs. Is it very common? Not with countires that operate soly in the western world, but its there. Was it DFs main problem? No.
Technically, boss, if you look at the game objectively it's a complete fail. It's as if someone took every single negative thing from other MMOs and added them to DF.
-Failed launch. Can you even call it a launch?
-Broken billing/ordering. Of course it's the customer's problems - they entered the wrong information. And of course the banks don't trust Global Collect, a company with 15 years of international e-commerce experience - practically shady newbs, right?
-Macroing the only real way to advance. Let's be honest here, you can level your magic missile in combat but it's much more painless to do it overnight while you sleep.
-Hacking/exploiting. Your top guilds exploited the broken mobs to get their player cities on day 1-2. It can't get worse that this, man. People started exploiting as soon as they were able to log on.
-Made a boo-boo and became red? No problem, get one of your boys from a different faction to let you kill him a few times and you're as good as new.
Shall I go on or do you get the picture?
All of which are problems that are inherent with nearly every game during intial launch in fact I listed examples of other games many AAA titles, which had the same problem. Heres a list:
Marcoing: UO, FFXI, WoW all have/had people marcoing on a large scale to get resouces (biggest in nearly every game), kill bosses that drop rare loot (this was huge in FFXI), or exp farm (WoW has some really sophisticated macros, WAR has some for rep farming).
Hacking: AoC had AoCbuddy, people report WoW was hacked with God mode and Speed hacks (didn't play it at launch so I can't be certain)
Exploits: Duping has been in pretty much every MMORPG released to date on some form or another. WoW had people soloing 40 man raids, AoC had broken raid times and stuck monster fighting.
Faction exploiting: UO tricked people to go gray, AoC had murders farmed for PvP exp. WAR has faction farming.
Failed Launch:-If you mean limited launch then EvE. if you mean poor launch with broken game then VG, WAR, AoC, SWG, and maybe Shadowbane (can't say for sure didn't play it)
Billing Skrew-Ups: AoC was huge on this. Go through the AoC forums on this site and you'll see people being charged for subs they canceled or being charged 2x.
What the point of this list? Basically, if you are going to say DF is utter fail for these reason then all these other games are/were utter fails for the same reason. Because if you look at it objectively, nearly every MMO, has had every single one of these problems. But you know these things tend to get fixed with Ghasp time. Get the picture now?
OMG I had an ephiphany!
ALL MMO's are failures at launch if you expect them to compete with established games!
its so clear now.... maybe I should have listened to everyone who has been saying that for years?
=D