After reading through the expansion notes, it is clear that Blizzard believes the vast majority of their subscribers are below the age of 12, or below the average IQ threshold. The game used to be challenging, but has been slowly becoming simpler and easier since BC. With 3.2, the game took a huge step in this direction, but I could never have expected Blizz to dumb the game down as much as they are proposing to do in the new xpac.
Some of the highlights: "Talent trees should be more fun." - More fun? So a well thought out spec will no longer be neccessary to maximizing the potential of your toon?
"Multi-gains will be added, while you level up your trade skills, rare items will give you more points as you skill up." - Crafting was always a joke, now it is even more superficial.
"We want to remove all unnecessary stats, make all existing stats understandable, and make all "core" stats more appealing." - Code for "You are too dumb to understand some basic math, so we will remove the mystery of itemization." This is what is going to force me not to buy the xpac. Theorycrafting is out the window, and itemizing no longer takes any thought.
"Armor Penetration: This ability is too confusing and "mathy." This sums it all up for me. We, as wow players, are too dumb to play this game anymore. They must dumb it down for us to understand it. They are insulting us, destroying our game, and most of us will still stand in line at midnight to give them money.
Gone is the challenge WoW 1.0 offered. Gone is the rivalry between the Alliance and Horde. Gone is any skill requirement. Gone is the ability to gain an advantage over other players because you put in the time to theorycraft and research. Long-gone is the epic feeling the game once held.
I want my game back, and you should too.
*Yawns* Another whine post, move along. You can quit, I'll keep playing. Enjoy finding another game that will keep your attention for years to come.
Oh I see now, you're one of those that obtained all this awesome gear from places like ToC and such and are a little annoyed that the stats and stuff on them are going away. I can see why you'd be pissed. But I am not. LOL! I hope they take the game back to when player skill mattered more and not the gear they wore.
Do you always pull random things out of your ass? The only time I have done ToC was on alts I didn't have time to raid on. If I said I have been playing since open beta all I would get is random angry people like yourself saying "LAWL HE FALLED BACK ON BEING A ORGINAL PLAYER". When player skill mattered? I can almost garentee you tried arena once got rolled and said WTF IS THIS SHIT.
No...that you think it is easy after looking at your list of different stats and stat sets and what works best for what and where. Look at all the combos and you're not even taking into consideration gear, potions, buffs and what not are you. No I did not think so. You're average gamer isn't going to want to whip out their handy dandy caculator to figure out all that BS. So yeah...you put it all up there for everyone to see that it is complicated. It may not seem like it to you, but to your average gamer...that looks like a lot of work.
First off. Gear is so simply laid out anymore it's not even a problem picking and choosing whats best for you. Most of the tier sets are now on the right track with stats that are viable to you. Potions only ever serve as a stat you have lack of such as hit, or a strait damage increas, AttP, SP. Not sure what that has to do with it, but umm ok.
I'm a pretty average gamer. I start a game, enjoy what it has to offer, I enjoy some competition and just conversing with the community. Not once have I had to break out a calculator. When It comes to MMOs studying your class is pretty much a given, unless you really wanna figure out how your class works on your own.
It's not a lot of work. Half of those stats are so class dependent it's not even funny. WoW has taken some good and bad turns. I agree with the ones that make sense, Mp5 removal as a start. But this, no, this is just silly.
Oh I see now, you're one of those that obtained all this awesome gear from places like ToC and such and are a little annoyed that the stats and stuff on them are going away. I can see why you'd be pissed. But I am not. LOL! I hope they take the game back to when player skill mattered more and not the gear they wore.
Oh I see now, you're one of those that obtained all this awesome gear from places like ToC and such and are a little annoyed that the stats and stuff on them are going away. I can see why you'd be pissed. But I am not. LOL! I hope they take the game back to when player skill mattered more and not the gear they wore.
Do you always pull random things out of your ass? The only time I have done ToC was on alts I didn't have time to raid on. If I said I have been playing since open beta all I would get is random angry people like yourself saying "LAWL HE FALLED BACK ON BEING A ORGINAL PLAYER". When player skill mattered? I can almost garentee you tried arena once got rolled and said WTF IS THIS SHIT.
Out of curiosity what class did you play?
Edit: wow my post is on top wtf o_O
LOL. Do you think I care if you were an original player? LOL! I feel for you. Truly I do. I do not know how you could stand the game back then. I so disliked this game back then. To me it was just overly easy. Yes I beta'd it. Yes I played it at release all of 3 months and never touched it again until just after BC. Game got better because they added Blood Elves and Flying Mounts - really it made a difference to me. I do not play this game to be l33t.. I play it to have fun. When it stops being fun and it is fun killing Alliance players in the BG's, I'll move on. Do I hate the way the stats crap is done in the current version of WoW's, yep. It sucks. I live with it though. Just as many others do and I cannot wait until the next x-pac tears it all down and makes it less of a hastle and we can get back to playing our characters and not our spreadsheets.
LOL. Do you think I care if you were an original player? LOL! Nope so don't insist that all my gear came from a 5 man heroic. I feel for you. Truly I do. Thanks. I do not know how you could stand the game back then. It was a good game, and still is today. I so disliked this game back then. To me it was just overly easy. And now that it's overly complicated, you want it overly easy? Yes I beta'd it. Yes I played it at release all of 3 months and never touched it again until just after BC. "LOL. Do you think I care if you were an original player? LOL! " Game got better because they added Blood Elves LOL blood elves. and Flying Mounts Flying mounts are good. I do not play this game to be l33t Nor do I. I play it to have fun. Agree When it stops being fun and it is fun killing Alliance players in the BG's.I'll move on. Agree completely. Do I hate the way the stats crap is done in the current version of WoW's, yep. It sucks. I live with it though. You still have not answered what class you play, I would need that to give you a decent response. Just as many others do and I cannot wait until the next x-pac tears it all down and makes it less of a hastle and we can get back to playing our characters and not our spreadsheets. You're not playing the game, you are letting the game play you. Those players that use spreadsheets are "serious" gamers that have to be at the top of there game in every raid. Not once have I used a spreadsheet, this coming from a person that almost tops the dps meter every raid. I play the game with my own style. I don't follow cookie cutter builds. Most of the time I wing a build and it often turns out like most of the builds out there. But that's blizzs fault for making talents so screwed up anymore. What I'm getting at, is if you have to use a spread sheet, then maybe you are to focused on being leet. Follow " I do not play this game to be l33t" and you would have more fun.
Not to be mean but maybe you should consider trying a new MMO or taking a break? WoW is so old now I personally could care less what they do to it. The fact that their making it easier only shows me that they have bigger and better projects on the horizen. The more broad the crowd is that can play it (once they decide to not expand on it anymore) the better.
Sadly WoWs days on top are coming to an end in the near future...just as all MMOs eventually loose their spotlight. I predict in 2011ish WoW will be old news to most gamers but I'm sure the big fans and hardcores will stick with it no matter how bored they are.
Seems to me that Blizz is taking the best part of the game (1-60) and turning it into what the game has become. I dont think im alone in thinking the BC was a POS and Wrath was little better. Im sure they will sell a bazillion copies and will trot out a couple of burnt out rock stars to say how great it is but what im seeing is filler, with the obligatory nerfs, for lack of any desire to create.
LOL. Do you think I care if you were an original player? LOL! Nope so don't insist that all my gear came from a 5 man heroic. I feel for you. Truly I do. Thanks. I do not know how you could stand the game back then. It was a good game, and still is today. I so disliked this game back then. To me it was just overly easy. And now that it's overly complicated, you want it overly easy? Yes I beta'd it. Yes I played it at release all of 3 months and never touched it again until just after BC. "LOL. Do you think I care if you were an original player? LOL! " Game got better because they added Blood Elves LOL blood elves. and Flying Mounts Flying mounts are good. I do not play this game to be l33t Nor do I. I play it to have fun. Agree When it stops being fun and it is fun killing Alliance players in the BG's.I'll move on. Agree completely. Do I hate the way the stats crap is done in the current version of WoW's, yep. It sucks. I live with it though. You still have not answered what class you play, I would need that to give you a decent response. Just as many others do and I cannot wait until the next x-pac tears it all down and makes it less of a hastle and we can get back to playing our characters and not our spreadsheets. You're not playing the game, you are letting the game play you. Those players that use spreadsheets are "serious" gamers that have to be at the top of there game in every raid. Not once have I used a spreadsheet, this coming from a person that almost tops the dps meter every raid. I play the game with my own style. I don't follow cookie cutter builds. Most of the time I wing a build and it often turns out like most of the builds out there. But that's blizzs fault for making talents so screwed up anymore. What I'm getting at, is if you have to use a spread sheet, then maybe you are to focused on being leet. Follow " I do not play this game to be l33t" and you would have more fun.
I do not wish it to be easy. I just wish it to be fun. Having to crunch numbers to make sure you fit int the criteria of what certain players expect to be able to raid with them at their level is what sucks. Hopefully, once Blizzard goes in and takes out all this BS stuff we can get back, as I said earlier, from playing spreadsheets to playing our characters again.
The number of stats and crap we have to juggle these days to min/max is absurd
Wrong, you just fall into the average player that doesn't know wtf they are doing.
DPS Physical Required Stats
Crit Rating
Hit Rating
Attack Power
DPS Physical Personal Choice Stats (these stats often come on pieces of gear without even focusing on it)
Haste
Armor Pen
DPS Physical PvP Stats
Resilience
Attack Power
DPS Physical Personal Choice PvP Stats
Hit Rating
Crit Rating
Haste
Armor Pen
Dodge
Armor
Apparently the only complex part of physical dps is PvP. Even then half the stats are listed under personal choice, even then only some of those are viable dependant on what class you play.
DPS Caster Required Stats
Crit Rating
Spell Power
Hit Rating
DPS Caster Personal Choice Stats
Haste
DPS Caster PvP Stats
Spell Power
Spell Pen
Resilience
DPS Caster Personal Choice PvP Stats
Hit Rating
Crit Rating
Haste
Armor
Warrior Tank Stats
Armor
Defense
Dodge
Parry
Block
Druid Tank Stats
Armor
Defense (easy as hell to even deal with as a druid)
Dodge
Death Knight Tank Stats
Armor
Defense
Dodge
Parry
Paladin Tank Stats
Armor
Defense
Dodge
Parry
(Block is less viable due to Holy Shield)
Warriors seem to have it worse when it comes to tanking. And as far as tanking goes. Hit is viable but you don't need much so it's not even worth listing.
Weapon skill was listed for what reason? If you're weapon skill is not maxed for your current weapon then that should be one of your top priorities when hitting 80.
Resistances use to be the main thing in vanilla. Listing it here is pointless considering most fights which require any resistances anymore only takes maybe one piece of gear with the current element you are against because of Totems/Auras/Buffs.
Mp5 removal was the only smart move. It's only cause was mana regen. Where spirit has the exact same effect with health regen, as if health regen ever mattered.
As far as stats go (agi, str, stam etc) most of that comes with gear dependant on what class you play(look at Tier sets).
Nothing was complicated. Most of you guys that seem to like these changes don't even play WoW currently. Apparently blizzard has targeted lazy crybabys that want everything handed to them without little to no work. So basically brain dead zombies is the current target.
All of the so called omitted stats that the next Xpac will bring won't really be gone. Min maxers will still be around.
AP and Crit will be in Str or agility depending on armor class, just mouse over the stat. Armor pen and haste will be achieved through talents so they wont be gone. Same with Defense and avoidance stats they will also be through talents.
Mana/5 will be spirit, Int will be spellpower and mana. Everything is still there.
you will still need half a brain to set up your gear also I read nothing about the removal of +hit or resilience gear.
If the "complicated" stats are given through talents and masteries what's the difference? you still need to gather info and figure out the perfect amount of particular stats to maximize yourself.
I do not wish it to be easy. I just wish it to be fun. Having to crunch numbers to make sure you fit int the criteria of what certain players expect to be able to raid with them at their level is what sucks. Hopefully, once Blizzard goes in and takes out all this BS stuff we can get back, as I said earlier, from playing spreadsheets to playing our characters again.
Eh, fun is a matter of opinion so I can't argue that. I just don't get how people began crunching numbers in the first place. I. being very sucessfull in Raids,Arena, and BGs (as if that matters) has never had to crunch number or use a spreadsheet of anykind. I just enjoy veriety, I'm an avid pvper. I prefer classes to be different and not operate the same. And this change seems to be throwing everybody on the same road.
Also, quit avoiding my question. What class did or do you play. ( Guess you are dodging the question, bet it's DK or Paladin)
All of the so called omitted stats that the next Xpac will bring won't really be gone. Min maxers will still be around.
Yeah I know, I just don't see a problem with the current set up.
AP and Crit will be in Str or agility depending on armor class, just mouse over the stat.
Already knew that. And is already that way to begin with.
Armor pen and haste will be achieved through talents so they wont be gone.
How exactly is it the benefit from spending X amount of points in a certain talent tree. Or it is through actual points.
Same with Defense and avoidance stats they will also be through talents.
I don't like this idea. This gives any newbie tank the ability to hit 80, not know shit and jump strait into instances. This is one of the reasons pugging is so bad in this game.
Mana/5 will be spirit, Int will be spellpower and mana. Everything is still there.
Again, I know that. And I have already said that.
you will still need half a brain to set up your gear also I read nothing about the removal of +hit or resilience gear.
Never said hit or resilience was being removed. I was simply saying these things are not hard to balance/collect. More then half of the gear from instances has large amounts of hit on it.
If the "complicated" stats are given through talents and masteries what's the difference? you still need to gather info and figure out the perfect amount of particular stats to maximize yourself.
Because I would have rather collected it from gear then taking 2 min to select talents and be ready. Thats part of the learning process.
All of the so called omitted stats that the next Xpac will bring won't really be gone. Min maxers will still be around. Yeah I know, I just don't see a problem with the current set up. AP and Crit will be in Str or agility depending on armor class, just mouse over the stat. Already knew that. And is already that way to begin with. Armor pen and haste will be achieved through talents so they wont be gone. How exactly is it the benefit from spending X amount of points in a certain talent tree. Or it is through actual points. Same with Defense and avoidance stats they will also be through talents.
I don't like this idea. This gives any newbie tank the ability to hit 80, not know shit and jump strait into instances. This is one of the reasons pugging is so bad in this game. Mana/5 will be spirit, Int will be spellpower and mana. Everything is still there.
Again, I know that. And I have already said that. you will still need half a brain to set up your gear also I read nothing about the removal of +hit or resilience gear.
Never said hit or resilience was being removed. I was simply saying these things are not hard to balance/collect. More then half of the gear from instances has large amounts of hit on it. If the "complicated" stats are given through talents and masteries what's the difference? you still need to gather info and figure out the perfect amount of particular stats to maximize yourself. Because I would have rather collected it from gear then taking 2 min to select talents and be ready. Thats part of the learning process.
Even if talents and mastery replaces alot of the gear choices you have you will still beable to see the bad players within minutes of playing with them. Also even if a person is geared right doesn't mean they play Well.
You can easily be carried to your gear and with guides all over the forums the min maxing concept in WoW is basically paint by numbers.
This game needs to be fun again and for most of the players the fun wasn't reading guides on a website. We need to focus less on gear and more on player ability.
Even if talents and mastery replaces alot of the gear choices you have you will still beable to see the bad players within minutes of playing with them. Also even if a person is geared right doesn't mean they play Well. You can easily be carried to your gear and with guides all over the forums the min maxing concept in WoW is basically paint by numbers. This game needs to be fun again and for most of the players the fun wasn't reading guides on a website. We need to focus less on gear and more on player ability.
I don't have a problem spotting bad players. My problem is most of the time players turn out bad due to not getting the required experience in how the game works. Also I agree that a geared person doesn't prove they will be a good player. But It does show they have had experience and that helps when looking for people for raids/heroics.
Most of the people being carried have knowledge about the mechanics, they could be an alt, past player, or just a new guy that was informed about everything by a friend.
The game is fun. And what do you mean by readin guides? Most of the people I play with only look at tank spot guides for bosses. And part of player ability is learning how to play your class. If you was sitting there googling "How To" guides about your class. The problem is your inability to learn how to play.
Obviouslly, none of you experienced WoW 1.0 raiding in all its glory. Like so many fail players these days that love the dumbing down of the game, you were the bitter ones who couldn't raid when it required skill. I hate the direction of the game, and so does my whole guild and everyone on my 10 man teams. I haven't talked to anyone who hasn't lol'd or groaned at the notes becuase the people I play with are...ya know...good. So go collect your free epics, and I will lament the loss of my game.
On a side not, a forums is for expressing opinions. You saying no one want to hear my opinion, is an opinon. I hope that paradox didn't explode your head.
Vanilla WoW raids were boring and a pain. I don't know how things are now but I presume the decision for 25 man raids was a step in the right direction in BC.
All of the so called omitted stats that the next Xpac will bring won't really be gone. Min maxers will still be around. Yeah I know, I just don't see a problem with the current set up. AP and Crit will be in Str or agility depending on armor class, just mouse over the stat. Already knew that. And is already that way to begin with. Armor pen and haste will be achieved through talents so they wont be gone. How exactly is it the benefit from spending X amount of points in a certain talent tree. Or it is through actual points. Same with Defense and avoidance stats they will also be through talents.
I don't like this idea. This gives any newbie tank the ability to hit 80, not know shit and jump strait into instances. This is one of the reasons pugging is so bad in this game. Mana/5 will be spirit, Int will be spellpower and mana. Everything is still there.
Again, I know that. And I have already said that. you will still need half a brain to set up your gear also I read nothing about the removal of +hit or resilience gear.
Never said hit or resilience was being removed. I was simply saying these things are not hard to balance/collect. More then half of the gear from instances has large amounts of hit on it. If the "complicated" stats are given through talents and masteries what's the difference? you still need to gather info and figure out the perfect amount of particular stats to maximize yourself. Because I would have rather collected it from gear then taking 2 min to select talents and be ready. Thats part of the learning process.
Even if talents and mastery replaces alot of the gear choices you have you will still beable to see the bad players within minutes of playing with them. Also even if a person is geared right doesn't mean they play Well.
You can easily be carried to your gear and with guides all over the forums the min maxing concept in WoW is basically paint by numbers.
This game needs to be fun again and for most of the players the fun wasn't reading guides on a website. We need to focus less on gear and more on player ability.
Exactly. Some players might have awesome gear, but they suck at playing their class. I have seen this and wonder how it is that they got the gear they haev if they play so badly. I guess it does matter who you know.
If games would move away from this type of game design and into the realm of the designing games that have combat like Mount and Blade all this stuff would not be necessary. Give me an MMORPG with a huge world to explore and combat and skill progression ala Mount and Blade and I'll pay 50$ a month to play it!
Even if talents and mastery replaces alot of the gear choices you have you will still beable to see the bad players within minutes of playing with them. Also even if a person is geared right doesn't mean they play Well. You can easily be carried to your gear and with guides all over the forums the min maxing concept in WoW is basically paint by numbers. This game needs to be fun again and for most of the players the fun wasn't reading guides on a website. We need to focus less on gear and more on player ability.
I don't have a problem spotting bad players. My problem is most of the time players turn out bad due to not getting the required experience in how the game works. Also I agree that a geared person doesn't prove they will be a good player. But It does show they have had experience and that helps when looking for people for raids/heroics.
Most of the people being carried have knowledge about the mechanics, they could be an alt, past player, or just a new guy that was informed about everything by a friend.
The game is fun. And what do you mean by readin guides? Most of the people I play with only look at tank spot guides for bosses. And part of player ability is learning how to play your class. If you was sitting there googling "How To" guides about your class. The problem is your inability to learn how to play.
Reading about cookie cutter spec builds, Optimal Dps rotations, Optimal gear for specific spec and "How to play" guides already make WoW a paint by numbers min maxing game. Not much will change with the next Xpac.
You will still have gear, talent and Dps rotation guides along with the new Mastery specs.
Reading about cookie cutter spec builds, Optimal Dps rotations, Optimal gear for specific spec and "How to play" guides already make WoW a paint by numbers min maxing game. Not much will change with the next Xpac.
You will still have gear, talent and Dps rotation guides along with the new Mastery specs.
The game will still be just as min max heavy tbh.
But now it's set on 2-3 stats per class/spec. Which kills the large variety of choices which in turn kills the fun, for me anyways.
Reading about cookie cutter spec builds, Optimal Dps rotations, Optimal gear for specific spec and "How to play" guides already make WoW a paint by numbers min maxing game. Not much will change with the next Xpac.
You will still have gear, talent and Dps rotation guides along with the new Mastery specs.
The game will still be just as min max heavy tbh.
But now it's set on 2-3 stats per class/spec. Which kills the large variety of choices which in turn kills the fun, for me anyways.
Well I'm sorry that it kills the fun for you. I'm not really attached to particular stats like that. I always felt the system was bloated. Hopefully you have a wait and see approach and atleast test it all out. If not I wish you luck with your next game.
But now it's set on 2-3 stats per class/spec. Which kills the large variety of choices which in turn kills the fun, for me anyways.
Well I'm sorry that it kills the fun for you. I'm not really attached to particular stats like that. I always felt the system was bloated. Hopefully you have a wait and see approach and atleast test it all out. If not I wish you luck with your next game.
I really see no need in testing something I'm sure won't keep me glued to the game. Either way if you enjoy the changes have fun with it. Here's to waiting for ToR and Global Agenda.
MMORPGs are in general for dummies. That's not to say they ain't fun, but if they are very deep and complicated, the masses won't play them. And if the masses don't play the game, how should it be a "massive multiplayer online roleplaying game"?
Some MMORPGs are even shallower then others of course, but saying "this MMO is for dummies" is like saying "this burger is making me fat". Oh really? Oô?
I do not know how you could stand the game back then. I so disliked this game back then. To me it was just overly easy. Yes I beta'd it. Yes I played it at release all of 3 months and never touched it again until just after BC.
So you are qualified to judge the difficulty of end game raiding in WoW 1.0 when you didn't even play long enough to step foot in a 40 man? You said earlier that 40 mans were boring, but Lucifron wasn't killed until 2 months after release, and that was by Conquest, a guild still getting world firsts.
Based on your own timeline, I'm guessing you were one of the bitter people who couldn't raid, and love to put "Vanilla WoW' down. At best, you got a look at Luci and maybe Maggy.
While Rag and Major Domo were somewhat difficult for the time, the difficulty level didn't ramp up until BWL (how many guilds broke up on Razorgore or Vael?). With that being said, you are not qualified to judge the difficulty of raiding in Pre-BC. You can talk about it when you fire up the way-back machine and get a C'thun and 4 Horsemen kill. Until then, stop pulling things out of your ass.
MMORPGs are in general for dummies. That's not to say they ain't fun, but if they are very deep and complicated, the masses won't play them. And if the masses don't play the game, how should it be a "massive multiplayer online roleplaying game"? Some MMORPGs are even shallower then others of course, but saying "this MMO is for dummies" is like saying "this burger is making me fat". Oh really? Oô?
Massive for me is enough to fill up a server 3k+ the more on one server the better. But if they do make the game complicated enough it weeds out most of the dumbasses of the world. I really only care that my server is populated, I could care less if a 10million people play just as long as I see people when I run around and adventure im happy.
Comments
*Yawns* Another whine post, move along. You can quit, I'll keep playing. Enjoy finding another game that will keep your attention for years to come.
Do you always pull random things out of your ass? The only time I have done ToC was on alts I didn't have time to raid on. If I said I have been playing since open beta all I would get is random angry people like yourself saying "LAWL HE FALLED BACK ON BEING A ORGINAL PLAYER". When player skill mattered? I can almost garentee you tried arena once got rolled and said WTF IS THIS SHIT.
Out of curiosity what class did you play?
Edit: wow my post is on top wtf o_O
First off. Gear is so simply laid out anymore it's not even a problem picking and choosing whats best for you. Most of the tier sets are now on the right track with stats that are viable to you. Potions only ever serve as a stat you have lack of such as hit, or a strait damage increas, AttP, SP. Not sure what that has to do with it, but umm ok.
I'm a pretty average gamer. I start a game, enjoy what it has to offer, I enjoy some competition and just conversing with the community. Not once have I had to break out a calculator. When It comes to MMOs studying your class is pretty much a given, unless you really wanna figure out how your class works on your own.
It's not a lot of work. Half of those stats are so class dependent it's not even funny. WoW has taken some good and bad turns. I agree with the ones that make sense, Mp5 removal as a start. But this, no, this is just silly.
Oh I see now, you're one of those that obtained all this awesome gear from places like ToC and such and are a little annoyed that the stats and stuff on them are going away. I can see why you'd be pissed. But I am not. LOL! I hope they take the game back to when player skill mattered more and not the gear they wore.
Do you always pull random things out of your ass? The only time I have done ToC was on alts I didn't have time to raid on. If I said I have been playing since open beta all I would get is random angry people like yourself saying "LAWL HE FALLED BACK ON BEING A ORGINAL PLAYER". When player skill mattered? I can almost garentee you tried arena once got rolled and said WTF IS THIS SHIT.
Out of curiosity what class did you play?
Edit: wow my post is on top wtf o_O
LOL. Do you think I care if you were an original player? LOL! I feel for you. Truly I do. I do not know how you could stand the game back then. I so disliked this game back then. To me it was just overly easy. Yes I beta'd it. Yes I played it at release all of 3 months and never touched it again until just after BC. Game got better because they added Blood Elves and Flying Mounts - really it made a difference to me. I do not play this game to be l33t.. I play it to have fun. When it stops being fun and it is fun killing Alliance players in the BG's, I'll move on. Do I hate the way the stats crap is done in the current version of WoW's, yep. It sucks. I live with it though. Just as many others do and I cannot wait until the next x-pac tears it all down and makes it less of a hastle and we can get back to playing our characters and not our spreadsheets.
Not to be mean but maybe you should consider trying a new MMO or taking a break? WoW is so old now I personally could care less what they do to it. The fact that their making it easier only shows me that they have bigger and better projects on the horizen. The more broad the crowd is that can play it (once they decide to not expand on it anymore) the better.
Sadly WoWs days on top are coming to an end in the near future...just as all MMOs eventually loose their spotlight. I predict in 2011ish WoW will be old news to most gamers but I'm sure the big fans and hardcores will stick with it no matter how bored they are.
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
Seems to me that Blizz is taking the best part of the game (1-60) and turning it into what the game has become. I dont think im alone in thinking the BC was a POS and Wrath was little better. Im sure they will sell a bazillion copies and will trot out a couple of burnt out rock stars to say how great it is but what im seeing is filler, with the obligatory nerfs, for lack of any desire to create.
I do not wish it to be easy. I just wish it to be fun. Having to crunch numbers to make sure you fit int the criteria of what certain players expect to be able to raid with them at their level is what sucks. Hopefully, once Blizzard goes in and takes out all this BS stuff we can get back, as I said earlier, from playing spreadsheets to playing our characters again.
Wrong, you just fall into the average player that doesn't know wtf they are doing.
DPS Physical Required Stats
Crit Rating
Hit Rating
Attack Power
DPS Physical Personal Choice Stats (these stats often come on pieces of gear without even focusing on it)
Haste
Armor Pen
DPS Physical PvP Stats
Resilience
Attack Power
DPS Physical Personal Choice PvP Stats
Hit Rating
Crit Rating
Haste
Armor Pen
Dodge
Armor
Apparently the only complex part of physical dps is PvP. Even then half the stats are listed under personal choice, even then only some of those are viable dependant on what class you play.
DPS Caster Required Stats
Crit Rating
Spell Power
Hit Rating
DPS Caster Personal Choice Stats
Haste
DPS Caster PvP Stats
Spell Power
Spell Pen
Resilience
DPS Caster Personal Choice PvP Stats
Hit Rating
Crit Rating
Haste
Armor
Warrior Tank Stats
Armor
Defense
Dodge
Parry
Block
Druid Tank Stats
Armor
Defense (easy as hell to even deal with as a druid)
Dodge
Death Knight Tank Stats
Armor
Defense
Dodge
Parry
Paladin Tank Stats
Armor
Defense
Dodge
Parry
(Block is less viable due to Holy Shield)
Warriors seem to have it worse when it comes to tanking. And as far as tanking goes. Hit is viable but you don't need much so it's not even worth listing.
Weapon skill was listed for what reason? If you're weapon skill is not maxed for your current weapon then that should be one of your top priorities when hitting 80.
Resistances use to be the main thing in vanilla. Listing it here is pointless considering most fights which require any resistances anymore only takes maybe one piece of gear with the current element you are against because of Totems/Auras/Buffs.
Mp5 removal was the only smart move. It's only cause was mana regen. Where spirit has the exact same effect with health regen, as if health regen ever mattered.
As far as stats go (agi, str, stam etc) most of that comes with gear dependant on what class you play(look at Tier sets).
Nothing was complicated. Most of you guys that seem to like these changes don't even play WoW currently. Apparently blizzard has targeted lazy crybabys that want everything handed to them without little to no work. So basically brain dead zombies is the current target.
All of the so called omitted stats that the next Xpac will bring won't really be gone. Min maxers will still be around.
AP and Crit will be in Str or agility depending on armor class, just mouse over the stat. Armor pen and haste will be achieved through talents so they wont be gone. Same with Defense and avoidance stats they will also be through talents.
Mana/5 will be spirit, Int will be spellpower and mana. Everything is still there.
you will still need half a brain to set up your gear also I read nothing about the removal of +hit or resilience gear.
If the "complicated" stats are given through talents and masteries what's the difference? you still need to gather info and figure out the perfect amount of particular stats to maximize yourself.
Playing: WoW, EvE
Interested in: TOR, ER, GW2, WoD, Dust514
Eh, fun is a matter of opinion so I can't argue that. I just don't get how people began crunching numbers in the first place. I. being very sucessfull in Raids,Arena, and BGs (as if that matters) has never had to crunch number or use a spreadsheet of anykind. I just enjoy veriety, I'm an avid pvper. I prefer classes to be different and not operate the same. And this change seems to be throwing everybody on the same road.
Also, quit avoiding my question. What class did or do you play. ( Guess you are dodging the question, bet it's DK or Paladin)
Even if talents and mastery replaces alot of the gear choices you have you will still beable to see the bad players within minutes of playing with them. Also even if a person is geared right doesn't mean they play Well.
You can easily be carried to your gear and with guides all over the forums the min maxing concept in WoW is basically paint by numbers.
This game needs to be fun again and for most of the players the fun wasn't reading guides on a website. We need to focus less on gear and more on player ability.
Playing: WoW, EvE
Interested in: TOR, ER, GW2, WoD, Dust514
I don't have a problem spotting bad players. My problem is most of the time players turn out bad due to not getting the required experience in how the game works. Also I agree that a geared person doesn't prove they will be a good player. But It does show they have had experience and that helps when looking for people for raids/heroics.
Most of the people being carried have knowledge about the mechanics, they could be an alt, past player, or just a new guy that was informed about everything by a friend.
The game is fun. And what do you mean by readin guides? Most of the people I play with only look at tank spot guides for bosses. And part of player ability is learning how to play your class. If you was sitting there googling "How To" guides about your class. The problem is your inability to learn how to play.
Vanilla WoW raids were boring and a pain. I don't know how things are now but I presume the decision for 25 man raids was a step in the right direction in BC.
Even if talents and mastery replaces alot of the gear choices you have you will still beable to see the bad players within minutes of playing with them. Also even if a person is geared right doesn't mean they play Well.
You can easily be carried to your gear and with guides all over the forums the min maxing concept in WoW is basically paint by numbers.
This game needs to be fun again and for most of the players the fun wasn't reading guides on a website. We need to focus less on gear and more on player ability.
Exactly. Some players might have awesome gear, but they suck at playing their class. I have seen this and wonder how it is that they got the gear they haev if they play so badly. I guess it does matter who you know.
If games would move away from this type of game design and into the realm of the designing games that have combat like Mount and Blade all this stuff would not be necessary. Give me an MMORPG with a huge world to explore and combat and skill progression ala Mount and Blade and I'll pay 50$ a month to play it!
I don't have a problem spotting bad players. My problem is most of the time players turn out bad due to not getting the required experience in how the game works. Also I agree that a geared person doesn't prove they will be a good player. But It does show they have had experience and that helps when looking for people for raids/heroics.
Most of the people being carried have knowledge about the mechanics, they could be an alt, past player, or just a new guy that was informed about everything by a friend.
The game is fun. And what do you mean by readin guides? Most of the people I play with only look at tank spot guides for bosses. And part of player ability is learning how to play your class. If you was sitting there googling "How To" guides about your class. The problem is your inability to learn how to play.
Reading about cookie cutter spec builds, Optimal Dps rotations, Optimal gear for specific spec and "How to play" guides already make WoW a paint by numbers min maxing game. Not much will change with the next Xpac.
You will still have gear, talent and Dps rotation guides along with the new Mastery specs.
The game will still be just as min max heavy tbh.
Playing: WoW, EvE
Interested in: TOR, ER, GW2, WoD, Dust514
But now it's set on 2-3 stats per class/spec. Which kills the large variety of choices which in turn kills the fun, for me anyways.
But now it's set on 2-3 stats per class/spec. Which kills the large variety of choices which in turn kills the fun, for me anyways.
Well I'm sorry that it kills the fun for you. I'm not really attached to particular stats like that. I always felt the system was bloated. Hopefully you have a wait and see approach and atleast test it all out. If not I wish you luck with your next game.
Playing: WoW, EvE
Interested in: TOR, ER, GW2, WoD, Dust514
Well I'm sorry that it kills the fun for you. I'm not really attached to particular stats like that. I always felt the system was bloated. Hopefully you have a wait and see approach and atleast test it all out. If not I wish you luck with your next game.
I really see no need in testing something I'm sure won't keep me glued to the game. Either way if you enjoy the changes have fun with it. Here's to waiting for ToR and Global Agenda.
MMORPGs are in general for dummies. That's not to say they ain't fun, but if they are very deep and complicated, the masses won't play them. And if the masses don't play the game, how should it be a "massive multiplayer online roleplaying game"?
Some MMORPGs are even shallower then others of course, but saying "this MMO is for dummies" is like saying "this burger is making me fat". Oh really? Oô?
Let's play Fallen Earth (blind, 300 episodes)
Let's play Guild Wars 2 (blind, 45 episodes)
So you are qualified to judge the difficulty of end game raiding in WoW 1.0 when you didn't even play long enough to step foot in a 40 man? You said earlier that 40 mans were boring, but Lucifron wasn't killed until 2 months after release, and that was by Conquest, a guild still getting world firsts.
Based on your own timeline, I'm guessing you were one of the bitter people who couldn't raid, and love to put "Vanilla WoW' down. At best, you got a look at Luci and maybe Maggy.
While Rag and Major Domo were somewhat difficult for the time, the difficulty level didn't ramp up until BWL (how many guilds broke up on Razorgore or Vael?). With that being said, you are not qualified to judge the difficulty of raiding in Pre-BC. You can talk about it when you fire up the way-back machine and get a C'thun and 4 Horsemen kill. Until then, stop pulling things out of your ass.
Room for one more
Massive for me is enough to fill up a server 3k+ the more on one server the better. But if they do make the game complicated enough it weeds out most of the dumbasses of the world. I really only care that my server is populated, I could care less if a 10million people play just as long as I see people when I run around and adventure im happy.