This game ruled. Can I get a shout out for Midgard Percival? I am so back if they bring the original pre-ToA DAoC or a DAoC 2 just like it. I think it was my all-time favorite game.
DAoC was the best pvp game I have ever played until they killed it with some of those expansions. I would play an updated game in a heartbeat. It also had crowd control issues though. You think they would have learned.
You now, I wouldn't advise them to "revamp" DAOC, even if that's what they end up doing. I think there would be more interest in releasing a DAOC 2 (and calling it that). They should retain the guts of DAOC, update all graphics, UI, and systems, then release an entirely new game called DAOC 2. Folks would be all over that, I'm guessing.
I know I would be. I loved the old DAOC and think an updated version of the classic game would be a game worth playing. It may not be ground breaking but still fun. Guess we'll have to wait and see.
DAoC was the greatest MMO ever. I loved it so much(until ToA, of course). Now, though, the controls are just archaic, and they let the mages and CC get out of control.
just in case anyone was interested they have now finished off merging all the servers into one super server called ywain.
You can now purchase ALL aspects of toa equipment with bountypoints, AND you can now trade those items over, they also got rid of /level so now everyone starts from 1 although i still hate the tutorial area.
you get 200% exp bonus in frontiers / battlegrounds. Most of the classes are pretty balanced except for warlocks that are still a roll your face on the keyboard to win class.
DAoC 2 . I'm telling you, who ever studied marketing anywhere, would understand that there is indeed a void full of screaming need, want and unfulfilled desire that could be filled with a product with this name
What ever is gonna happen from Mythic related to old daoc, this united mega server with TOA and all the candy, or if they're rolling out Old Frontiers Classic server. Even with the new and very, very sweet looking engine, the days of 9000 polygons on screen and MySQL based engine aint going to roll anymore. Even with 4x 3ghz processors, dual graf cards - top end computer, you're still having inc lag.
While waiting for the realization slowly going into the investors mind, that DAoC2 would sell silvers, golds, platinas and mithrils both sides of all the seas, we got to hang around. My church of choise has been fre esha rds. Still active player base, specially on Uthgard, stripped from all the generally considered "problems". No buffbots, no doubleboxing, no bots, farmers, no addon material. NF_ and _OF. No fees.
Hang around there boys and girls. Make a lot of noise of your wish to have DAoC2, keep the spirit up, eventually someone with the ability to make the right call and big enough title to make it happen will read about it. Infact, I'd do it myself if I'd be given the funding.
Greets to go Mirage, The Chosen, Hibernian Dragonslayers and Golden Age teams in EU Prydwen. I miss you all.
DAoC - 00-06 - And every now and then WoW - Online since launch - and now back again. EVE - Online since 07 - and still on, and on, and on.. WHO - Online 08-10 LOTR-O - Online 06-08 Also played : Asherons Call, EverQuest, EQ2, Dungeons & Dragons, Cabal, Dark & Light, GW, GW2, LA2, Ryzom, Shaiya, SWG, Allods, Forsaken World, ArcheAge, Secret World, Darkfall, Rift, ESO, Tera.
They wouldn't spring for a new engine for Warhammer. Why would you expect them to do so for DAoC?
They don't need a new engine for DAoC.
Both WAR and DAoC use different versions of the Gamebryo engine. The differences in version can make a big difference, as is evident when you look at screens of DAoC and screens of Warhammer. Texture processing capabilities, poly counts, resolution.. This engine is just fine as long as you implement it correctly.
And has everyone already forgotten the easter egg on the Chaos side in WAR? If you jump in to the portal at one of the starting Chaos zones, you're transported to one of the Albion starting zones just outside of Camelot (Can't even remember the name, it's been so long), only the ENTIRE TOWN is redone in the new version of the engine..... And it is GLORIOUS to look at.
Not only is updating DAoC with the WAR version of the Gamebryo engine a good idea that should be persued.. They've already shown it can be done. It's almost a foregone conclusion that they will at this point.
What they do with game mechanics (Balancing classes, abilities, Old/New Frontier hybrids - Does anyone NOT like the fact that walls are destructible in NF?) is the bigger question, and if it warrants a "2" moniker.
I do like the idea of coming back to Camelot though. If they do just do an upgrade and somehow revert some aspects of the game, I hope they keep all the zones, even if it's just for random PvE, because I'd love to see SI, ToA, and Catacombs areas done in the new engine.
I have not played DAoC but do you trust Mythic can deliver DAoC2?
See how badly they messed WAR which came after DAoC. With all their experience with DAoC they still managed to mess up badly with WAR.
What is worrying is that if the success of DAoC was down to 3 realms, (if being the operative word here) then Mythic either knew WAR would fail or think they could make it work with two. Either way they failed. Hence putting the success of DAoC 2 in serious doubt.
What was the lag like in DAoC and if it was not bad then why is it so bad in WAR?
I have not played DAoC but do you trust Mythic can deliver DAoC2? See how badly they messed WAR which came after DAoC. With all their experience with DAoC they still managed to mess up badly with WAR. What is worrying is that if the success of DAoC was down to 3 realms, (if being the operative word here) then Mythic either knew WAR would fail or think they could make it work with two. Either way they failed. Hence putting the success of DAoC 2 in serious doubt. What was the lag like in DAoC and if it was not bad then why is it so bad in WAR?
Warhammer was already created product, there was not really even an option to make that into a 3 way fight. So its not compareable directly.
What ever arguments there might be against Mythics DEV teams cabability to produce a product that would please everyone expecting it, the fact remains ,they hold the copyright, and if its really a DAoC, its gonna be Mythic who produces it. I'd be damn glad if someone would rip the idea tho, and make it happen faster and if possible better
One has to understand also that DAoC has such a long history and thus so many stages on its past, it was PVE game, it became PVP game, it was new and different at the time, then it became a korean grind for a while, and then eventually it is a niche game for super elites. There was and always will be haters and lovers depending the time phase or aspect the enjoyed. Opinnions will be fiercely defended and attacked, castels will burn, people will die. End result DAoC2 is going to make many people cry, but many people rather cry in Midgard of Hibernia, than in Azeroth
Lag in daoc was and is never an issue if your iron was up to date. Infact, its the only game that almost promoted, or atleast was taken into some sort of consideration that you may want to be able to run several instances of it simultaneously. There has always been something in the engine that caused the legendary inc-lag. I would also add that even with the best configuration of any server structure, even with the latest dynamic load distribution methods is going to cause annoying lag on the end user when there is just too much action going on. In DAoC 50 people on screen was not a problem, 200 was already laggy, but still suistainable in relic raids.
DAoC - 00-06 - And every now and then WoW - Online since launch - and now back again. EVE - Online since 07 - and still on, and on, and on.. WHO - Online 08-10 LOTR-O - Online 06-08 Also played : Asherons Call, EverQuest, EQ2, Dungeons & Dragons, Cabal, Dark & Light, GW, GW2, LA2, Ryzom, Shaiya, SWG, Allods, Forsaken World, ArcheAge, Secret World, Darkfall, Rift, ESO, Tera.
I have not played DAoC but do you trust Mythic can deliver DAoC2? See how badly they messed WAR which came after DAoC. With all their experience with DAoC they still managed to mess up badly with WAR. What is worrying is that if the success of DAoC was down to 3 realms, (if being the operative word here) then Mythic either knew WAR would fail or think they could make it work with two. Either way they failed. Hence putting the success of DAoC 2 in serious doubt. What was the lag like in DAoC and if it was not bad then why is it so bad in WAR?
They messed up with WAR for several reasons:
1) They were bound by the IP. Everything they did had to go through Games Workshop. EVERYTHING. With DAoC, they had complete freedom. It was their own IP, and they did what they wanted.
2) 3 realms DOES make a big difference. Tension between 2 sides is predictable. Throwing in a third makes things a lot more interesting. Had you played DAoC, you might have known that.
3) They were trying to compete with WoW and counting on the IP alone to make it happen. They dropped everything unique about DAoC to make it as close to WoW as possible, just with different skins. There are no destructable keeps in WAR, no third faction, classes have mirrors on either side only with minor differences, and the attempt at unique trades was a horrible failure (DAoC's weren't GREAT, but the major ones like weaponcrafting and the like were at least THERE).
4) They focused TOO much on PvE, not enough on RvR. Anyone who played DAoC can tell you, originally, PvE was bare minimum. People would spend days in Albion (Before Shourded Isles) waiting to get a tree group in Lyoness so they could finish to 50.. Then getting your class armor for RvR (And it was THE RvR armor to have in it's day) took at least 30 people, but you needed to do it to be competitive. Everyone helped because they all knew eventually they'd need it too.
5) Global cooldowns.. You didn't have that in DAoC. That makes a BIG difference in a PvP game.
6) Casters could be interrupted in DAoC.. That makes a BIG difference in a PvP game.
7) Did I mention destructible keeps? I know everyone loved old frontiers, and in a lot of ways, that's what the new keeps in WAR are like, with only certain points of entry, but I LOVED that I could take down almost any wall and go through it in NF. That was the one big selling point for NF in my opinion.
What was the lag like in DAoC and if it was not bad then why is it so bad in WAR?
Collision Detection and Tome updating.
If they took those off one server, I think you would see a huge improvement in performance.
I don't know how much of an issue they were in DAoC, but there are a ton of buffs and debuffs and AoE effects in Warhammer also. The engine has to keep track of all of that stuff.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Interesting Interview, however why aren't they getting it?
The reasons stated as "mistakes" are not relevant.
1 - First 10 levels too easy in Warhammer.
That was really irelevant, I only did the quests and PQ's for the first 10 levels during beta. Come Launch I leveled all of my Toons the first 10 levels with PvP, and so did all of my guildmates.
People expected to play a PvP game set in the World of Warhammer.
I mean common, how can you make a PvE game with that IP, when all of its IP is based on PvP...Table top games of Warhammer are played between the people...All of the Fans of Warhammer play against eachother in countless battles...
Even the Live re-enactment fans all over the world..it is all about the PvP.
2 - "While guild leveling was an important element, players still had very little reason to play together unless they joined a PvP scenario"
Pardon? I mean, why else would people come together if it is not for PvP activities relating to the Realm? I do not think anyone needs a game where guilds have to make alliances to defeat the AI...because that game already exists and it is called WoW raiding.
Guilds did not have reason to play together because there was not enough emphasis to Realm PvP.
3 - Mail System...
I agree it was frustrating. Specially since the game's design called for it to be used very extensivelly all these tons of drops of items all over the place with limited storage space. Then again, why so much emphasis on collection of Items?
I came back to WAR at the begining of this last summer I could not play more than a month, while some things have improved, the lastest Expansion just killed it for me, they added a bunch of PVE content and a whole new host of Collectible Items from PVE..it was disgusting for me...
I can not understand why warriors of Warhammer have to farm for collectibles? I have been playing many games of Games Workshop for year on the table top, including Warhammer fantasy, Space Marines, Gothic etc...and I never felt the Warhammer Universe in WAR...
4- Economy
I could not disagree more here, if there was one thing that was done really good it was the economy, it is good that come to level 20 people did not have to go RMT gold to buy a Mount, and it is good that money was not a big focus. This is suposed to be Warhammer...not Monopoly, the goal is to fight and defeat your enemies not accumulate wealth.
----
All in all...
I simply think that WAR went wrong in the implementation. Instead of making a game that was really focused on PvP within the cruel harsh and very dangerous world of Warhammer, they made a game more for the WoW crowd...I think Mythic's mistake was to try and capitalise on the Warhammer IP by offering a WoW type game, and that is why it did not work.
----
That being said, and while the prospect of a DAoC2 seems very exciting I am worried that same mistake maybe made in the process...
If you want to beat WoW, you have to come up with something radically different than it, that is very thoughtfully prepared to be different and please at the same time.
IMHO
- Duke Suraknar - Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
I'd love to see a DAOC 2, just not sure EA/Mythic could deliver a good game. I'd feel better if Mythic was sold off to a firm that gave them a little more autonomy.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
If they make DAoC 2 two things i would like to see deal with crafting.
I loved UO open skills system, most of the time i just enjoyed herding the sheep and taking their wool to sell or make stuff from. No other MMO has done that to the extent of UO.
Some of us Enjoy the occasional PvP/RvR but my heart will still always seek out the more peacefull things in games. I use the game to socialize herding, farming, crafting just filled the time while i would talk with my friends.
Some of us Enjoy the occasional PvP/RvR but my heart will still always seek out the more peacefull things in games. I use the game to socialize herding, farming, crafting just filled the time while i would talk with my friends.
I hope some element like this is implemented.
How about taking Warhammer's cultivation farther and turn it into a sort of Harvest Moon minigame? Where you have your own field, and grow things on a larger and more varied scale?
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Some of us Enjoy the occasional PvP/RvR but my heart will still always seek out the more peacefull things in games. I use the game to socialize herding, farming, crafting just filled the time while i would talk with my friends.
I hope some element like this is implemented.
How about taking Warhammer's cultivation farther and turn it into a sort of Harvest Moon minigame? Where you have your own field, and grow things on a larger and more varied scale?
UO was and still is the best MMOG I ever played. It is true that UO had many Interesting things, that were not tied to Competition directly like every single system in almost all MMO's is today.
And that is what gave UO its inner beauty that generated much passion to its community.
Cultivation in Warhammer is the one I liked most honestly, expanding on the same system and fleshing it out in to the actual world the player exists in is a very interesting idea!
- Duke Suraknar - Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
The reasons stated as "mistakes" are not relevant. 1 - First 10 levels too easy in Warhammer. That was really irelevant, I only did... I leveled all of .... People expected....
2 - "While guild leveling was an important element, players still had very little reason to play together unless they joined a PvP scenario" Pardon? I mean ... I do not think ... 3 - Mail System...
I came back to WAR ... I could not play ... Expansion just killed it for me, they added ... it was disgusting for me... I can not understand ... I have been playing many .... and I never ... 4- Economy I could not disagree more ... I simply think ... I think Mythic's mistake ... ---- That being said, and while the prospect of a DAoC2 seems very exciting I am worried that same mistake maybe made in the process... If you want to beat WoW, you have to come up with something radically different than it, that is very thoughtfully prepared to be different and please at the same time. IMHO
I just want to point out with these limited quotes of your writing : hey, really fu c king scientific and objective views here! I think this, I disagree with that, and then generalize that you are "the people", Mythic fucked up and their professionals designers cant even identify problems in a product they made. Its your personal view and you've got the right for it, but seriously should rethink these "I wasn't pleased" generalizations.
"That being said, I'm worried that the same mistake of not pleasing me may be made again"... ))
Again the casual reference of "beating WoW", but this time together with suggestion to be radically different (wich game in topic already is). Interesting, because games that aren't similar, aren't competing against each other, the target customer / market is not the same.
DAoC - 00-06 - And every now and then WoW - Online since launch - and now back again. EVE - Online since 07 - and still on, and on, and on.. WHO - Online 08-10 LOTR-O - Online 06-08 Also played : Asherons Call, EverQuest, EQ2, Dungeons & Dragons, Cabal, Dark & Light, GW, GW2, LA2, Ryzom, Shaiya, SWG, Allods, Forsaken World, ArcheAge, Secret World, Darkfall, Rift, ESO, Tera.
Cultivation in Warhammer is the one I liked most honestly, expanding on the same system and fleshing it out in to the actual world the player exists in is a very interesting idea!
I agree. I actually liked Apothecary + Cultivation more than I liked Alchemy + Herbalism in WoW. Fleshing it out even more would make it even more fun.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I don't want DAOC 2. There's no need to wait that long and by then blizzard new mmo will probably be out and even less people will care about DAOC 2.
You have a limited window now in that the next WoW expansion is about a year away, WAR is losing numbers and people want a good pvp experience that isn't a boring korean grind fest.
You have the technology, NOW, to release Origins. Do it. If you have any tweaks for the engine you want to release, add them but don't take more then a month to do so. I can force AA and AF on in original DAOC engine and it'll be pretty enough for a while, giving you a chance to work on the engine.
Hehe Blizzard certainly has its eyes all over the place, I saw how they implemented most of the greatest features WAR had in to WoW within less than a year.
- Duke Suraknar - Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
I don't know if a DAoC2 would cut it. If you did a LOT of advertising and revamped original DAoC. I will come back in a heart beat! I love DAoC. I can't play a MMO anymore without comparing PvP to DAoC. It was just AMAZING how they did it.
BRING IT BACK! I WANT TO PLAY MY BERSERKER... MY NECRO... MY BARD... MY BONEDANCER... MY... okay you get the point I have a lot of chars....
It's a shame that they dont even have a clue as to why WAR didnt work. While I want a DAoC 2 more than anything else Im not sure I want these folks making it.
Comments
This game ruled. Can I get a shout out for Midgard Percival? I am so back if they bring the original pre-ToA DAoC or a DAoC 2 just like it. I think it was my all-time favorite game.
DAoC was the best pvp game I have ever played until they killed it with some of those expansions. I would play an updated game in a heartbeat. It also had crowd control issues though. You think they would have learned.
I know I would be. I loved the old DAOC and think an updated version of the classic game would be a game worth playing. It may not be ground breaking but still fun. Guess we'll have to wait and see.
Mid zerg FTL!
DAoC was the greatest MMO ever. I loved it so much(until ToA, of course). Now, though, the controls are just archaic, and they let the mages and CC get out of control.
just in case anyone was interested they have now finished off merging all the servers into one super server called ywain.
You can now purchase ALL aspects of toa equipment with bountypoints, AND you can now trade those items over, they also got rid of /level so now everyone starts from 1 although i still hate the tutorial area.
you get 200% exp bonus in frontiers / battlegrounds. Most of the classes are pretty balanced except for warlocks that are still a roll your face on the keyboard to win class.
other than that rvr is still fun
DAoC 2 . I'm telling you, who ever studied marketing anywhere, would understand that there is indeed a void full of screaming need, want and unfulfilled desire that could be filled with a product with this name
What ever is gonna happen from Mythic related to old daoc, this united mega server with TOA and all the candy, or if they're rolling out Old Frontiers Classic server. Even with the new and very, very sweet looking engine, the days of 9000 polygons on screen and MySQL based engine aint going to roll anymore. Even with 4x 3ghz processors, dual graf cards - top end computer, you're still having inc lag.
While waiting for the realization slowly going into the investors mind, that DAoC2 would sell silvers, golds, platinas and mithrils both sides of all the seas, we got to hang around. My church of choise has been fre esha rds. Still active player base, specially on Uthgard, stripped from all the generally considered "problems". No buffbots, no doubleboxing, no bots, farmers, no addon material. NF_ and _OF. No fees.
Hang around there boys and girls. Make a lot of noise of your wish to have DAoC2, keep the spirit up, eventually someone with the ability to make the right call and big enough title to make it happen will read about it. Infact, I'd do it myself if I'd be given the funding.
Greets to go Mirage, The Chosen, Hibernian Dragonslayers and Golden Age teams in EU Prydwen. I miss you all.
DAoC - 00-06 - And every now and then
WoW - Online since launch - and now back again.
EVE - Online since 07 - and still on, and on, and on..
WHO - Online 08-10
LOTR-O - Online 06-08
Also played : Asherons Call, EverQuest, EQ2, Dungeons & Dragons, Cabal, Dark & Light, GW, GW2, LA2, Ryzom, Shaiya, SWG, Allods, Forsaken World, ArcheAge, Secret World, Darkfall, Rift, ESO, Tera.
They don't need a new engine for DAoC.
Both WAR and DAoC use different versions of the Gamebryo engine. The differences in version can make a big difference, as is evident when you look at screens of DAoC and screens of Warhammer. Texture processing capabilities, poly counts, resolution.. This engine is just fine as long as you implement it correctly.
And has everyone already forgotten the easter egg on the Chaos side in WAR? If you jump in to the portal at one of the starting Chaos zones, you're transported to one of the Albion starting zones just outside of Camelot (Can't even remember the name, it's been so long), only the ENTIRE TOWN is redone in the new version of the engine..... And it is GLORIOUS to look at.
Not only is updating DAoC with the WAR version of the Gamebryo engine a good idea that should be persued.. They've already shown it can be done. It's almost a foregone conclusion that they will at this point.
What they do with game mechanics (Balancing classes, abilities, Old/New Frontier hybrids - Does anyone NOT like the fact that walls are destructible in NF?) is the bigger question, and if it warrants a "2" moniker.
I do like the idea of coming back to Camelot though. If they do just do an upgrade and somehow revert some aspects of the game, I hope they keep all the zones, even if it's just for random PvE, because I'd love to see SI, ToA, and Catacombs areas done in the new engine.
I have not played DAoC but do you trust Mythic can deliver DAoC2?
See how badly they messed WAR which came after DAoC. With all their experience with DAoC they still managed to mess up badly with WAR.
What is worrying is that if the success of DAoC was down to 3 realms, (if being the operative word here) then Mythic either knew WAR would fail or think they could make it work with two. Either way they failed. Hence putting the success of DAoC 2 in serious doubt.
What was the lag like in DAoC and if it was not bad then why is it so bad in WAR?
Warhammer was already created product, there was not really even an option to make that into a 3 way fight. So its not compareable directly.
What ever arguments there might be against Mythics DEV teams cabability to produce a product that would please everyone expecting it, the fact remains ,they hold the copyright, and if its really a DAoC, its gonna be Mythic who produces it. I'd be damn glad if someone would rip the idea tho, and make it happen faster and if possible better
One has to understand also that DAoC has such a long history and thus so many stages on its past, it was PVE game, it became PVP game, it was new and different at the time, then it became a korean grind for a while, and then eventually it is a niche game for super elites. There was and always will be haters and lovers depending the time phase or aspect the enjoyed. Opinnions will be fiercely defended and attacked, castels will burn, people will die. End result DAoC2 is going to make many people cry, but many people rather cry in Midgard of Hibernia, than in Azeroth
Lag in daoc was and is never an issue if your iron was up to date. Infact, its the only game that almost promoted, or atleast was taken into some sort of consideration that you may want to be able to run several instances of it simultaneously. There has always been something in the engine that caused the legendary inc-lag. I would also add that even with the best configuration of any server structure, even with the latest dynamic load distribution methods is going to cause annoying lag on the end user when there is just too much action going on. In DAoC 50 people on screen was not a problem, 200 was already laggy, but still suistainable in relic raids.
DAoC - 00-06 - And every now and then
WoW - Online since launch - and now back again.
EVE - Online since 07 - and still on, and on, and on..
WHO - Online 08-10
LOTR-O - Online 06-08
Also played : Asherons Call, EverQuest, EQ2, Dungeons & Dragons, Cabal, Dark & Light, GW, GW2, LA2, Ryzom, Shaiya, SWG, Allods, Forsaken World, ArcheAge, Secret World, Darkfall, Rift, ESO, Tera.
They messed up with WAR for several reasons:
1) They were bound by the IP. Everything they did had to go through Games Workshop. EVERYTHING. With DAoC, they had complete freedom. It was their own IP, and they did what they wanted.
2) 3 realms DOES make a big difference. Tension between 2 sides is predictable. Throwing in a third makes things a lot more interesting. Had you played DAoC, you might have known that.
3) They were trying to compete with WoW and counting on the IP alone to make it happen. They dropped everything unique about DAoC to make it as close to WoW as possible, just with different skins. There are no destructable keeps in WAR, no third faction, classes have mirrors on either side only with minor differences, and the attempt at unique trades was a horrible failure (DAoC's weren't GREAT, but the major ones like weaponcrafting and the like were at least THERE).
4) They focused TOO much on PvE, not enough on RvR. Anyone who played DAoC can tell you, originally, PvE was bare minimum. People would spend days in Albion (Before Shourded Isles) waiting to get a tree group in Lyoness so they could finish to 50.. Then getting your class armor for RvR (And it was THE RvR armor to have in it's day) took at least 30 people, but you needed to do it to be competitive. Everyone helped because they all knew eventually they'd need it too.
5) Global cooldowns.. You didn't have that in DAoC. That makes a BIG difference in a PvP game.
6) Casters could be interrupted in DAoC.. That makes a BIG difference in a PvP game.
7) Did I mention destructible keeps? I know everyone loved old frontiers, and in a lot of ways, that's what the new keeps in WAR are like, with only certain points of entry, but I LOVED that I could take down almost any wall and go through it in NF. That was the one big selling point for NF in my opinion.
Collision Detection and Tome updating.
If they took those off one server, I think you would see a huge improvement in performance.
I don't know how much of an issue they were in DAoC, but there are a ton of buffs and debuffs and AoE effects in Warhammer also. The engine has to keep track of all of that stuff.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Interesting Interview, however why aren't they getting it?
The reasons stated as "mistakes" are not relevant.
1 - First 10 levels too easy in Warhammer.
That was really irelevant, I only did the quests and PQ's for the first 10 levels during beta. Come Launch I leveled all of my Toons the first 10 levels with PvP, and so did all of my guildmates.
People expected to play a PvP game set in the World of Warhammer.
I mean common, how can you make a PvE game with that IP, when all of its IP is based on PvP...Table top games of Warhammer are played between the people...All of the Fans of Warhammer play against eachother in countless battles...
Even the Live re-enactment fans all over the world..it is all about the PvP.
2 - "While guild leveling was an important element, players still had very little reason to play together unless they joined a PvP scenario"
Pardon? I mean, why else would people come together if it is not for PvP activities relating to the Realm? I do not think anyone needs a game where guilds have to make alliances to defeat the AI...because that game already exists and it is called WoW raiding.
Guilds did not have reason to play together because there was not enough emphasis to Realm PvP.
3 - Mail System...
I agree it was frustrating. Specially since the game's design called for it to be used very extensivelly all these tons of drops of items all over the place with limited storage space. Then again, why so much emphasis on collection of Items?
I came back to WAR at the begining of this last summer I could not play more than a month, while some things have improved, the lastest Expansion just killed it for me, they added a bunch of PVE content and a whole new host of Collectible Items from PVE..it was disgusting for me...
I can not understand why warriors of Warhammer have to farm for collectibles? I have been playing many games of Games Workshop for year on the table top, including Warhammer fantasy, Space Marines, Gothic etc...and I never felt the Warhammer Universe in WAR...
4- Economy
I could not disagree more here, if there was one thing that was done really good it was the economy, it is good that come to level 20 people did not have to go RMT gold to buy a Mount, and it is good that money was not a big focus. This is suposed to be Warhammer...not Monopoly, the goal is to fight and defeat your enemies not accumulate wealth.
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All in all...
I simply think that WAR went wrong in the implementation. Instead of making a game that was really focused on PvP within the cruel harsh and very dangerous world of Warhammer, they made a game more for the WoW crowd...I think Mythic's mistake was to try and capitalise on the Warhammer IP by offering a WoW type game, and that is why it did not work.
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That being said, and while the prospect of a DAoC2 seems very exciting I am worried that same mistake maybe made in the process...
If you want to beat WoW, you have to come up with something radically different than it, that is very thoughtfully prepared to be different and please at the same time.
IMHO
Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
I'd love to see a DAOC 2, just not sure EA/Mythic could deliver a good game. I'd feel better if Mythic was sold off to a firm that gave them a little more autonomy.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
If they make DAoC 2 two things i would like to see deal with crafting.
I loved UO open skills system, most of the time i just enjoyed herding the sheep and taking their wool to sell or make stuff from. No other MMO has done that to the extent of UO.
Some of us Enjoy the occasional PvP/RvR but my heart will still always seek out the more peacefull things in games. I use the game to socialize herding, farming, crafting just filled the time while i would talk with my friends.
I hope some element like this is implemented.
How about taking Warhammer's cultivation farther and turn it into a sort of Harvest Moon minigame? Where you have your own field, and grow things on a larger and more varied scale?
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
How about taking Warhammer's cultivation farther and turn it into a sort of Harvest Moon minigame? Where you have your own field, and grow things on a larger and more varied scale?
UO was and still is the best MMOG I ever played. It is true that UO had many Interesting things, that were not tied to Competition directly like every single system in almost all MMO's is today.
And that is what gave UO its inner beauty that generated much passion to its community.
Cultivation in Warhammer is the one I liked most honestly, expanding on the same system and fleshing it out in to the actual world the player exists in is a very interesting idea!
Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
I just want to point out with these limited quotes of your writing : hey, really fu c king scientific and objective views here! I think this, I disagree with that, and then generalize that you are "the people", Mythic fucked up and their professionals designers cant even identify problems in a product they made. Its your personal view and you've got the right for it, but seriously should rethink these "I wasn't pleased" generalizations.
"That being said, I'm worried that the same mistake of not pleasing me may be made again"...
))
Again the casual reference of "beating WoW", but this time together with suggestion to be radically different (wich game in topic already is). Interesting, because games that aren't similar, aren't competing against each other, the target customer / market is not the same.
DAoC - 00-06 - And every now and then
WoW - Online since launch - and now back again.
EVE - Online since 07 - and still on, and on, and on..
WHO - Online 08-10
LOTR-O - Online 06-08
Also played : Asherons Call, EverQuest, EQ2, Dungeons & Dragons, Cabal, Dark & Light, GW, GW2, LA2, Ryzom, Shaiya, SWG, Allods, Forsaken World, ArcheAge, Secret World, Darkfall, Rift, ESO, Tera.
I agree. I actually liked Apothecary + Cultivation more than I liked Alchemy + Herbalism in WoW. Fleshing it out even more would make it even more fun.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
3 Faction says it all.
yesterday in Aion i was in Et.... on my 23 Chanter doing quest and gather , i got jumped of a mage and gladiater,
i was lucky there was a lvl 20 cleric close at me and we managed to kill both asmo...
later there was great rvr with around 15 from both side
this remind me of still the greates game i have played Daoc and what there is missing in Aion the 3. faction
i ofc vote for Daoc 2 and i want this name for it !!!!!
i can wait for it , dont care if it takes 2 year
there is only 1 game out right now there can come alittle close to Daoc = Aion and i hope i can play it to i see no.2 from mystic
I don't want DAOC 2. There's no need to wait that long and by then blizzard new mmo will probably be out and even less people will care about DAOC 2.
You have a limited window now in that the next WoW expansion is about a year away, WAR is losing numbers and people want a good pvp experience that isn't a boring korean grind fest.
You have the technology, NOW, to release Origins. Do it. If you have any tweaks for the engine you want to release, add them but don't take more then a month to do so. I can force AA and AF on in original DAOC engine and it'll be pretty enough for a while, giving you a chance to work on the engine.
Release origins now before you miss your mark!
You make a good point there BJ.
Hehe Blizzard certainly has its eyes all over the place, I saw how they implemented most of the greatest features WAR had in to WoW within less than a year.
Order of the Silver Star, OSS
ESKA, Playing MMORPG's since Ultima Online 1997 - Order of the Silver Serpent, Atlantic Shard
I don't know if a DAoC2 would cut it. If you did a LOT of advertising and revamped original DAoC. I will come back in a heart beat! I love DAoC. I can't play a MMO anymore without comparing PvP to DAoC. It was just AMAZING how they did it.
BRING IT BACK! I WANT TO PLAY MY BERSERKER... MY NECRO... MY BARD... MY BONEDANCER... MY... okay you get the point I have a lot of chars....
It's a shame that they dont even have a clue as to why WAR didnt work. While I want a DAoC 2 more than anything else Im not sure I want these folks making it.