I think ppl get too caught up in the stupid WoW / MacDonalds analogy. It becomes their generic answer to any thread about WoW's popularity. Some gamers might get frustrated when trying to have a conversation about why ppl dislike WoW and the reponse is "WoW is like MacDonalds". It doesnt really make sense. You can say it has too many instances, it's become too gear focused, you don't like the quest system, it's not immersive enough, etc. Those are some of the reasons I quit playing after a couple of months a few years ago. The MacDonalds, Brittney Spears, and Walmart comparisons are just comments made by trolls who get off on pissing ppl off, judging by the last few posts, anyway.
Disliking wow is not because it's like McDonalds. I have many reasons for disliking wow and many reasons why I liked it. The McDonalds analogy is solely for people who argue WoW is the best mmo because it makes the most money and has the most subscribers.
McDonalds makes the most money and is the most popular as well. McDonalds analogy is a retort to your reasons for liking wow, not a reason for not liking it...
HAHa That's a good one.
Answer me please what does a fast food market and a PC video game market have in common ?
Nothing.
Actually this is very easy to answer.
Both are examples of businesses that sell goods or services to the general public. They thrive off customer money, but selling or offering services/products to these customers to compete with other companies within thier fields.
The Video Game market does the same thing as the Fast Food market: They sell products to customers.
That's a very accurate analogy to WoW and MacDonalds, but it's not the reason trolls make the comparision.
The whole McDonald's anology (and most anologies for that matter) always gives me a good laugh. That said ... while I agree that popularity doesn't always equate to quality, some times it does. I'd argue that WoW's continued success and dominance in the market is a reflection of the game's quality.
And the fact this dominance is reflected by a monthly subscription fee that needs to be "earned" by Blizzard every month again.
Month after month after month.
Just like any other mmorpg.
There is your difference of why this "earned" monthly subscription fee is not only based on "popularity" but also on the game's "quality".
Without that quality, the game would not retain that monthly paying player base for 6 years straight.
How is that any different than going to McDonalds once a week. You go back because of the "quality." Just because WoW and any other p2p mmo requires a monthly subscription somehow makes the McDonald's analogy less apt? That's a distinction without any difference.
And this is why analogies are luaghable: you can make any arguement with using any random point of reference. Why not just compare WoW to the Beatles? The Beatles were (are) popular, they continue to repeatedly sell ... etc. All analogies result in is circular logic.
@LordMunkus ... tone down the rhetoric and maybe you can expect a response ... just suggesting.
Ok...I'll take the bait.
My issue in all this is that many WoW fanbois believe the sole measure of "BEST" is the quantitative measurement of subcription numbers. They extend it further by stating that the subscription numbers are a reflection of the games quality. Here's where I disagree, a games quality is determined by a million different things, or which may include popularity. The remaining "things" that make a game "the best" are purely subjective... opinion....can never be quantitively proven.
So because WoW is the most popular, therefor it has the best PvE?, Best PvP? Best Graphics? Or maybe it also has to do with the fact that it is the most accessible? It is casual friendly? All these are subjective considerations. WoW is the lowest common denominator, it does enough things well to appear to mass audiance.
Unlike your analogy of the Beatles, the prevailing consideration with the Beatles is whether your like to dislike the music. I, personally believe that a far greater portion of the Beetles financial success is tied in to the quality of the music. Where as WoW has many more considerations listed above. It's when Wowfanbois pick and choose the most prominent consideration and state that it's the final word, is where I have a problem agreeing.
Not to beat a dead horse, but as a personal example, I have friends who can't play many of the new mmo's because their computers can't handle it. I have a cousin who only plays wow in order to keep in touch with friends. It's a glorified instant messenger. I also have friends who log on, take laps around Dalaran, and log off.
There's a million reasons why one MMO has more subscription numbers than another... and it's far from being the best.
Edit: I guess it's also "the best" because my cousins nine year old computer can run it.
I think ppl get too caught up in the stupid WoW / MacDonalds analogy. It becomes their generic answer to any thread about WoW's popularity. Some gamers might get frustrated when trying to have a conversation about why ppl dislike WoW and the reponse is "WoW is like MacDonalds". It doesnt really make sense. You can say it has too many instances, it's become too gear focused, you don't like the quest system, it's not immersive enough, etc. Those are some of the reasons I quit playing after a couple of months a few years ago. The MacDonalds, Brittney Spears, and Walmart comparisons are just comments made by trolls who get off on pissing ppl off, judging by the last few posts, anyway.
Disliking wow is not because it's like McDonalds. I have many reasons for disliking wow and many reasons why I liked it. The McDonalds analogy is solely for people who argue WoW is the best mmo because it makes the most money and has the most subscribers.
McDonalds makes the most money and is the most popular as well. McDonalds analogy is a retort to your reasons for liking wow, not a reason for not liking it...
HAHa That's a good one.
Answer me please what does a fast food market and a PC video game market have in common ?
Nothing.
Actually this is very easy to answer.
Both are examples of businesses that sell goods or services to the general public. They thrive off customer money, but selling or offering services/products to these customers to compete with other companies within thier fields.
The Video Game market does the same thing as the Fast Food market: They sell products to customers.
That's a very accurate analogy to WoW and MacDonalds, but it's not the reason trolls make the comparision.
Aye, for that look at the post that came before you posted this one.
But yeah, the analogy is used mostly as a way to draw a mental picture for some of the people who can't seem to understand a lot of peoples reasoning for not liking the game. Most of the trolls do use it as some retarded soapbox catch phrase, I agree, but the rest of us only use it because forum post windows make it hard for us to draw pictures that would easily show the parallel argument we are trying to get across.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I think ppl get too caught up in the stupid WoW / MacDonalds analogy. It becomes their generic answer to any thread about WoW's popularity. Some gamers might get frustrated when trying to have a conversation about why ppl dislike WoW and the reponse is "WoW is like MacDonalds". It doesnt really make sense. You can say it has too many instances, it's become too gear focused, you don't like the quest system, it's not immersive enough, etc. Those are some of the reasons I quit playing after a couple of months a few years ago. The MacDonalds, Brittney Spears, and Walmart comparisons are just comments made by trolls who get off on pissing ppl off, judging by the last few posts, anyway.
Disliking wow is not because it's like McDonalds. I have many reasons for disliking wow and many reasons why I liked it. The McDonalds analogy is solely for people who argue WoW is the best mmo because it makes the most money and has the most subscribers.
McDonalds makes the most money and is the most popular as well. McDonalds analogy is a retort to your reasons for liking wow, not a reason for not liking it...
I understand what your saying. But I still think the WoW / MacDonalds analogy is mostly made by ppl not articulate enough to explain their dislike of WoW or just wanting to flame the "fanboi". Like you said, it's a retort for reasons for liking WoW. So if you like WoW, you like generic mmorpgs or only like it because it is the most popular. It's is a comment meant purely to insult the original poster and not productive to the conversation.
In most cases the analogy is thrown in after someone tries to state their reasons for not liking WoW and gets flamed by the fans.
Anyone who states their reasons for not liking the game are most often attacked for their reasons (because apparently people are not allowed to have different opinions on the subjects) with crap like "Link your amory page and show me your ICC 25man Hard Mode gear or STFU" or "Well you must be wrong because 11million other people dont agree with you"
That last line is usually what invokes the use of the analogy because rational people try to show that just because a lot of people do it, it doesnt mean its the best thing to do.
It looks like we're both talking about the extremists on both sides of the argument. Most of us are rational ppl with common sense, but we get caught up in these flame threads that are carefully choreographed by trolls and fanbois alike.
I think ppl get too caught up in the stupid WoW / MacDonalds analogy. It becomes their generic answer to any thread about WoW's popularity. Some gamers might get frustrated when trying to have a conversation about why ppl dislike WoW and the reponse is "WoW is like MacDonalds". It doesnt really make sense. You can say it has too many instances, it's become too gear focused, you don't like the quest system, it's not immersive enough, etc. Those are some of the reasons I quit playing after a couple of months a few years ago. The MacDonalds, Brittney Spears, and Walmart comparisons are just comments made by trolls who get off on pissing ppl off, judging by the last few posts, anyway.
Disliking wow is not because it's like McDonalds. I have many reasons for disliking wow and many reasons why I liked it. The McDonalds analogy is solely for people who argue WoW is the best mmo because it makes the most money and has the most subscribers.
McDonalds makes the most money and is the most popular as well. McDonalds analogy is a retort to your reasons for liking wow, not a reason for not liking it...
I understand what your saying. But I still think the WoW / MacDonalds analogy is mostly made by ppl not articulate enough to explain their dislike of WoW or just wanting to flame the "fanboi". Like you said, it's a retort for reasons for liking WoW. So if you like WoW, you like generic mmorpgs or only like it because it is the most popular. It's is a comment meant purely to insult the original poster and not productive to the conversation.
In most cases the analogy is thrown in after someone tries to state their reasons for not liking WoW and gets flamed by the fans.
Anyone who states their reasons for not liking the game are most often attacked for their reasons (because apparently people are not allowed to have different opinions on the subjects) with crap like "Link your amory page and show me your ICC 25man Hard Mode gear or STFU" or "Well you must be wrong because 11million other people dont agree with you"
That last line is usually what invokes the use of the analogy because rational people try to show that just because a lot of people do it, it doesnt mean its the best thing to do.
It looks like we're both talking about the extremists on both sides of the argument. Most of us are rational ppl with common sense, but we get caught up in these flame threads that are carefully choreographed by trolls and fanbois alike.
You mean Mc. Trolls or Mc. Fanbois in carefully choreographed Mc. Threads.
Wasn't this thread called "why do people hate WOW".
And who exactly comes out with the MacDonalds analogy every time and again?
Right. I just showed there is no analogy, because WOW= PC video games and Blizzard does not have a fast food chain.
But they offer "quality" for a LOT of people or they wouldn't be as succesful.
"Hate" is there for WOW's success and its dominant position in the MMO market.
Well still using the Macky D's Analogy. The big mac is a quality sandwich but yet its still not good for you. Or a Salad lets get rid of macky d's. You get a quality salad but when you drinch it in dressing its tastes like quality but its not good for you.
So Yeah WoW is a polished MMO but its not good for you!!! So therefor WE HATE IT!!!
It's interesting to note that everyone who's voiced their opinion on why they "hate" wow was once a WoW player.
Which means, when people make the argument "11 million people choose Wow" over any other game is factually incorrect. Many people play multiple mmo's at once. If you were to ask the 11 million WoW playes, you will not get 11 million people saying WoW is the best.
Case in point,... i played Wow and many other MMOS....
Wow is not the best mmo I've played.
It's the same as Avatar the movie. Just because I paid to watch it and contributed to it being the highest grossing film of all time... it doesn't mean that my paid ticket = me believing it's the best movie i've ever seen.
Wasn't this thread called "why do people hate WOW".
And who exactly comes out with the MacDonalds analogy every time and again?
Right. I just showed there is no analogy, because WOW= PC video games and Blizzard does not have a fast food chain.
But they offer "quality" for a LOT of people or they wouldn't be as succesful.
"Hate" is there for WOW's success and its dominant position in the MMO market.
Well, maybe for some, but for me its more that nearly every MMO maker out there has taken WoWs success and turned it into this ridiculous mindset of "We should all make games exaqtly like WoW, but with a different name/skin". All they see is the $$$$ attached to WoW and they try to copy that success and are too stupid to see that youre not going to bring down the most succesful brand of anything by copying it, especially when anything you do, they already do better. There are just too few companies out there willing to actually try anything new and innovative. Just think if WoW had never existed, would some other company have come up with something even better, rather than trying to copy it? Would there have never been a game as succesful as WoW in it's absence? Would we still have ended up with dozens and dozens of games just like WoW even without it's presence, or would we have seen a completely different genre of MMOs taking over?
I personally don't like WoW. I dont absolutely hate it, and i can certainly see its appeal to the masses but on the several times that ive tried getting into playing it over the years, i just get bored within a few weeks and cant wait to find something else to play. Unfortunately, that something new to play usually ends up being 90% identical to WoW after you get over the "newness" of it. That's why i hate it, not for the game itself, but for the stagnant state of MMOs that it's success has caused.
Wasn't this thread called "why do people hate WOW".
And who exactly comes out with the MacDonalds analogy every time and again?
Right. I just showed there is no analogy, because WOW= PC video games and Blizzard does not have a fast food chain.
But they offer "quality" for a LOT of people or they wouldn't be as succesful.
"Hate" is there for WOW's success and its dominant position in the MMO market.
/facepalm
Look up Analogy and you will see where your thinking makes no sense what-so-ever...
a·nal·o·gy
1.a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
2.similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.
5.Logic. a form of reasoning in which one thing is inferred to be similar to another thing in a certain respect, on the basis of the known similarity between the things in other respects.
Now above is the definition of 'Analogy', and #5 is highlighted because that is how the McD/WoW analogy is being used in disscussion. The known similarities being that they are both businesses selling a product/service to its customers and that they are both popular and their quality is highly subjective.
Note #3 and #4 of the definition have been removed because they reffered to Biology and Linguistics.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I'm not going to read 26 pages just to stay current with my answer, so i will just reply to the thread topic.
Personally, I think that WoW is a very solid, stable game... I'm just bored of playing it.
Aye, there are a lot of people who are bored of the game. There are a lot of people who are also put off by the direction the game is going.
Think is that when someone even bothers to state a reason such as the one above, they get attacked with "You haven't done everything" or "Show me your 'I killed Arthas 25 hard mode' achievement, cause if you dont have that you havent done everything and therefore cannot be bored" style comments.
I myself lost interest in the game after Uld (a lil after TOC). Before that I would sign in now and then just to help the guild run a raid, but once you've done a raid once, it gets boring real quick (and I'm weird cause to me fun > loot chasing...).
I don't need to have to kill Arthas in 25 man on hard mode or get my Gear Score to XXX in order to know that the game is boring to me. Because to me, the location might change but the game is still the same. And that game got old to me a long time ago...
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Wasn't this thread called "why do people hate WOW".
And who exactly comes out with the MacDonalds analogy every time and again?
Right. I just showed there is no analogy, because WOW= PC video games and Blizzard does not have a fast food chain.
But they offer "quality" for a LOT of people or they wouldn't be as succesful.
"Hate" is there for WOW's success and its dominant position in the MMO market.
/facepalm
Look up Analogy and you will see where your thinking makes no sense what-so-ever...
a·nal·o·gy
5.Logic. a form of reasoning in which one thing is inferred to be similar to another thing in a certain respect, on the basis of the known similarity between the things in other respects.
Now above is the definition of 'Analogy', and #5 is highlighted because that is how the McD/WoW analogy is being used in disscussion. The known similarities being that they are both businesses selling a product/service to its customers and that they are both popular and their quality is highly subjective.
They are not popular, they are "succesful". And you can't have "sustained succes" if your quality is "highly subjective".
As the quality of a video game simply can't be compared to the quality of a hamburger, the analogy fails.
And why cant the two companies be compaired based on quality of their products and services?
To me it just looks like you are just looking for a way fr the analogy to fail, even though no matter how hard you try, the analogy still works as it still fits within the parameters of its definition.
And you can have sustained success over the long term if your quality is subjective. Look at companies such as MS and Apple. They remain successful even though a lot of thier products tend to be low on the quality scale (specially when you look back at the launch of Vista). Still today they remain successful even though the quality of thier products can be debated.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I'm not going to read 26 pages just to stay current with my answer, so i will just reply to the thread topic.
Personally, I think that WoW is a very solid, stable game... I'm just bored of playing it.
Aye, there are a lot of people who are bored of the game. There are a lot of people who are also put off by the direction the game is going.
Think is that when someone even bothers to state a reason such as the one above, they get attacked with "You haven't done everything" or "Show me your 'I killed Arthas 25 hard mode' achievement, cause if you dont have that you havent done everything and therefore cannot be bored" style comments.
I myself lost interest in the game after Uld (a lil after TOC). Before that I would sign in now and then just to help the guild run a raid, but once you've done a raid once, it gets boring real quick (and I'm weird cause to me fun > loot chasing...).
I don't need to have to kill Arthas in 25 man on hard mode or get my Gear Score to XXX in order to know that the game is boring to me. Because to me, the location might change but the game is still the same. And that game got old to me a long time ago...
Lessons learned.
Because I AM bored of the game, I seek refugee with other bored posters to post constantly negative post on the WOW forum, so I can terrorize the fans in "I hate WOW" threads.
Is that it ?
Or is there another catch?
Well for one I responded to this thread back when it was in the Pub, not when it was moved to the WoW forums. The title is also a question asking why people hate WoW, which pretty much asks people why they dont like the game. If you like the game, why are you in this thread?
And two, how am I here terrorizing anyone? Is my use of logic and reasoning scaring anyone? Because to terrorize means to scare, which means my points are somehow scaring someone.
But yeah, I mostly post because its a forum and I have full right to post my opinion just as you do yours. Sadly the theme with anything related to WoW is that if your opinion isnt sunshine and rainbows about the game, you are hence forth a troll.
But even though I no longer play WoW, I still hold a lidetime account that expires in 2030 (odd for a lifetime account to have an expiration date....) That Vivendi Universal awarded to employees of EB games back at the launch of WoW (store in a region who sold the most pre orders won, giving each employee of that store a lifetime account). So this means I hold an active subscription and have full right to talk about the game in any public forum.
But oddly enough the point you are trying to make can be used against yourself as well.
Because I AM a fan of the game and love it with all my heart, I can jump into threads and attack peoples reasons/arguments on not liking the game because they are nothing more than Trolls.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I'm not going to read 26 pages just to stay current with my answer, so i will just reply to the thread topic
Personally, I think that WoW is a very solid, stable game... I'm just bored of playing it.
Aye, there are a lot of people who are bored of the game. There are a lot of people who are also put off by the direction the game is going.
Think is that when someone even bothers to state a reason such as the one above, they get attacked with "You haven't done everything" or "Show me your 'I killed Arthas 25 hard mode' achievement, cause if you dont have that you havent done everything and therefore cannot be bored" style comments.
I myself lost interest in the game after Uld (a lil after TOC). Before that I would sign in now and then just to help the guild run a raid, but once you've done a raid once, it gets boring real quick (and I'm weird cause to me fun > loot chasing...).
I don't need to have to kill Arthas in 25 man on hard mode or get my Gear Score to XXX in order to know that the game is boring to me. Because to me, the location might change but the game is still the same. And that game got old to me a long time ago...
Lessons learned.
Because I AM bored of the game, I seek refugee with other bored posters to post constantly negative post on the WOW forum, so I can terrorize the fans in "I hate WOW" threads.
Is that it ?
Or is there another catch?
Well for one I responded to this thread back when it was in the Pub, not when it was moved to the WoW forums. The title is also a question asking why people hate WoW, which pretty much asks people why they dont like the game. If you like the game, why are you in this thread?
And two, how am I here terrorizing anyone? Is my use of logic and reasoning scaring anyone? Because to terrorize means to scare, which means my points are somehow scaring someone.
But yeah, I mostly post because its a forum and I have full right to post my opinion just as you do yours. Sadly the theme with anything related to WoW is that if your opinion isnt sunshine and rainbows about the game, you are hence forth a troll.
But even though I no longer play WoW, I still hold a lidetime account that expires in 2030 (odd for a lifetime account to have an expiration date....) That Vivendi Universal awarded to employees of EB games back at the launch of WoW (store in a region who sold the most pre orders won, giving each employee of that store a lifetime account). So this means I hold an active subscription and have full right to talk about the game in any public forum.
But oddly enough the point you are trying to make can be used against yourself as well.
Because I AM a fan of the game and love it with all my heart, I can jump into threads and attack peoples reasons/arguments on not liking the game because they are nothing more than Trolls.
Just an advice: don't wait.
Don't wait?
Am I missing something?
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I will never try World of Warcraft because I think that the graphics are too cartoony and the game has instances with millions of subscribers. I enjoy MMORPG games that are competetive and challenging but I will not give anything a chance that does not have FFA PVP server.
Also, since I have been enjoying Darkfall as my primary game for over a year now, I think that it will be very hard returning to an ALT+1+2+3 (auto-attack/auto-aim) type of game. I cannot see this type of game giving me a rush of adrenaline or anything like that. If I were to try it, I would probably quit because it is probably too laid back for my taste.
I like to put on headphones and pretend that I am in the game. It is easy to do this with Darkfall because the UI is much like Oblivion (one of my all time favorite solo games). If I were to try doing this with WOW than there would be fluffy/flashy things all over reminding me that it is just a game (floating exclamation points? arrows showing you where to go? most annoying is circles around the mobs! watching floating numbers rise above enemies telling you how much damage you are dealing . ..).
I loved Vanguard and that totally died . .. and there are many games out there that in my opinion are probably a lot funner than WOW but die because the population is just too low. This makes a lot of people angry toward WOW for taking so many subscribers away from other games . ..
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Because every time you even mention another game someone brings this shit up like WOW was the first and end all MMO. Hell, this crap is even on going in my gaming guild of 13 years when I talk about single player games that are great I get some of our cement headed brethren piping up about WOW. People with low mentalities and strong links to addiciton cannot seem to get past it and need to simply disconnect from it.
Once the game is over, the king and the pawn go back in the same box. ~ Italian proverb
people hate WoW for 3 simple reasons or atleast general reasons
1) every new game put on the market is automaticalled compaired to WoW even if its a 900000AD based space sim.. its WoW..
2) most of the big name game companies are now too scared by investers to do anything but rehash WoW items to make WoW clones...
3) WoW just sucks.... its far too easy a game to play, hell even WC was pretty simple to play
personally i tried WoW back before BC on a buddys lowby mage... wasnt impressed with it, tho i did enjoy the hour i spent killing rabbits and deer in the alliance forests.. still not my kind of game.
far too used to grindy korean games and FPS/RTS games to play WoW even less now that its gone cruise control... may as well make every max level as the XP boost pretty much does that... (buddy went back got max level in a month or some jazz with a brand new toon)
while i give WoW props for making a decently stable game, i dislike it simply do to the cheesyness of it. sorry if you disagree with me BUT thats your choice
The first being people who have never played it but don't like what its done to the mmo genre .
The second being people that have played WoW and feel let down in the direction that Blizzard have taken the game in recent years .
I think people tend to overlook the benefits of having a game like Warcraft out there . It tends to attract the younger players because it is the in-game amongst school age children leaving many of the smaller mmos to have more mature and generally speaking nicer or more mature communitys .
It was'nt always like this . Warcraft in its initial couple of years or so had a pretty good community . I think a lot of whats happened in regard to this matter is that WoW has attracted increasing numbers of school age players .
I don't blame Blizzard for aiming it increasingly at children they obviously identified thier demographic and adapted the game accordingly .
You have ZERO proof of what you are talking about.
On the contrary up to 2009 there were social studies proving the average age was 28 years in WOW. A study of the buro of Nielsen even showed WOW was played by 400K women in the US alone between the age of 23 and 50.
From movie stars to housewives.
The above is one of those typical pre judgements from haters against the game. Always putting out nonsense without any proof.
The others are Brittney Spears, Mac Donalds, community, easyness and the usual 4 letter words.
The arguments have all one thing in common: they are not even related to what makes a game fun to play, but they try to make the game less interesting as "the haters" fear their preferred games will be even more deserted.
Just as if the desertion of other MMO's is the fault of Blizzard.
There are games that are deserted like Vanguard but there are plenty of smaller mmos that maintain pretty decent populations on their servers ( theres just not as many servers ) .
Of course Warcraft attracts all ages but you only have to play it for a short while to realise many of them are children by what they say in general chat and how they act in PUGs or if what you say is true suggests there has to be some very immature 28 year olds playing WoW . Either way they arn't the sort of people I want to know .
Any statement including yours in these forums is going to be a generalisation but broadly speaking most people with a little common sence will see that Warcraft is being made increasingly child-friendly . That not to say theres content adults wont enjoy but it is a general trend in the game . Thats also not to say there is anything wrong in it being child friendly . Kids subs are worth the same as adults .
WoW is fun . I dont hate it but I find it boring now . If I was of a school age and all my friends were playing it I would think its the best game ever . But if you like a game with friendly , mature and helpful community there are better mmos to play .
I will never try World of Warcraft because I think that the graphics are too cartoony and the game has instances with millions of subscribers. I enjoy MMORPG games that are competetive and challenging but I will not give anything a chance that does not have FFA PVP server.
Also, since I have been enjoying Darkfall as my primary game for over a year now, I think that it will be very hard returning to an ALT+1+2+3 (auto-attack/auto-aim) type of game. I cannot see this type of game giving me a rush of adrenaline or anything like that. If I were to try it, I would probably quit because it is probably too laid back for my taste.
I like to put on headphones and pretend that I am in the game. It is easy to do this with Darkfall because the UI is much like Oblivion (one of my all time favorite solo games). If I were to try doing this with WOW than there would be fluffy/flashy things all over reminding me that it is just a game (floating exclamation points? arrows showing you where to go? most annoying is circles around the mobs! watching floating numbers rise above enemies telling you how much damage you are dealing . ..).
I loved Vanguard and that totally died . .. and there are many games out there that in my opinion are probably a lot funner than WOW but die because the population is just too low. This makes a lot of people angry toward WOW for taking so many subscribers away from other games . ..
Holy Cow! Someone answered the question without mentioning MacDonalds, which I think is the basis for much of the argument of the last few pages. I completely understand what Sid said because he was articulate, to the point and obviously gifted with common sense.
Holy Cow! Someone answered the question without mentioning MacDonalds, which I think is the basis for much of the argument of the last few pages. I completely understand what Sid said because he was articulate, to the point and obviously gifted with common sense.
Lol, too right.
As I said earlier, analogies are nonsensical because they simply end in circular arguments (see previous pages as an example). In my opinion, it's just lazy to use anologies in a debate.
I digress though ...
I'm not sure why people would 'hate' any one game really. As to previous players getting bored, etc. I just see that as a natural occurence. At some point I'll get bored with a game and move on. That's not necessarily a reflection of the game though.
WoW has ruined the potential for variety. No studio in their right mind is going to spend 100 mil on a game that isn't a a wow like themepark.
You're never going to see an SWG again. You may get small studios making sandbox games, but the big boys will never touch them.
That is why I hate wow. It caused the industry to turn away from virtual world games before they got a chance to get it right.
I have to agree.
Let me start by saying I don't hate WoW... I enjoyed my time in game yet I have moved on. The following is what I believe is a reason of the 'hate'.
WoW has set the template on how to make an insane amount of money in an MMO... and every other studio will attempt to stick to the format (with small variations) for their chance at the big bucks..
WoW killed diversity.
Of the flip side WoW brought a lot of attention to MMO's so now there is a lot more money being invested into the industry. A larger MMO market does mean more titles in the future.
WoW has ruined the potential for variety. No studio in their right mind is going to spend 100 mil on a game that isn't a a wow like themepark.
You're never going to see an SWG again. You may get small studios making sandbox games, but the big boys will never touch them.
That is why I hate wow. It caused the industry to turn away from virtual world games before they got a chance to get it right.
I have to agree... WoW has set the template on how to make an insane amount of money in an MMO... and every other studio will attempt to stick to the format for their chance at the big bucks..
WoW killed diversity.
....
Two issues here:
1. You could argue (and it has ad nauseum) Blizzard copied existing games, and therefore didn't bring anything new to the market. With that, how can you blame Blizzard for something that it didn't do? and,
2. Don't you think blaming Blizzard for it's success is a bit misguided? Blizzard simply responded to the market.
WoW has ruined the potential for variety. No studio in their right mind is going to spend 100 mil on a game that isn't a a wow like themepark.
You're never going to see an SWG again. You may get small studios making sandbox games, but the big boys will never touch them.
That is why I hate wow. It caused the industry to turn away from virtual world games before they got a chance to get it right.
I have to agree.
Let me start by saying I don't hate WoW... I enjoyed my time in game yet I have moved on. The following is what I believe is a reason of the 'hate'.
WoW has set the template on how to make an insane amount of money in an MMO... and every other studio will attempt to stick to the format (with small variations) for their chance at the big bucks..
WoW killed diversity.
Of the flip side WoW brought a lot of attention to MMO's so now there is a lot more money being invested into the industry. A larger MMO market does mean more titles in the future.
I think WoW killing mmorpg diversity was more true in the past then the present. More and more mmorpgs are being developed and being touted as nothing like WoW. Devs in interviews are actually using those words, "We're nothing like WoW.' Whether those games are in fact the polar opposite of WoW is open for debate. I think a lot of gamers see quests, instances, etc., in an mmorpg and immediately shout, "WoW clone" and are being unfair. What devs have to do is learn to be more original and creative while keeping what works well and ignore the fringe hardcore gamers who will never be happy.
Comments
That's a very accurate analogy to WoW and MacDonalds, but it's not the reason trolls make the comparision.
Ok...I'll take the bait.
My issue in all this is that many WoW fanbois believe the sole measure of "BEST" is the quantitative measurement of subcription numbers. They extend it further by stating that the subscription numbers are a reflection of the games quality. Here's where I disagree, a games quality is determined by a million different things, or which may include popularity. The remaining "things" that make a game "the best" are purely subjective... opinion....can never be quantitively proven.
So because WoW is the most popular, therefor it has the best PvE?, Best PvP? Best Graphics? Or maybe it also has to do with the fact that it is the most accessible? It is casual friendly? All these are subjective considerations. WoW is the lowest common denominator, it does enough things well to appear to mass audiance.
Unlike your analogy of the Beatles, the prevailing consideration with the Beatles is whether your like to dislike the music. I, personally believe that a far greater portion of the Beetles financial success is tied in to the quality of the music. Where as WoW has many more considerations listed above. It's when Wowfanbois pick and choose the most prominent consideration and state that it's the final word, is where I have a problem agreeing.
Not to beat a dead horse, but as a personal example, I have friends who can't play many of the new mmo's because their computers can't handle it. I have a cousin who only plays wow in order to keep in touch with friends. It's a glorified instant messenger. I also have friends who log on, take laps around Dalaran, and log off.
There's a million reasons why one MMO has more subscription numbers than another... and it's far from being the best.
Edit: I guess it's also "the best" because my cousins nine year old computer can run it.
Aye, for that look at the post that came before you posted this one.
But yeah, the analogy is used mostly as a way to draw a mental picture for some of the people who can't seem to understand a lot of peoples reasoning for not liking the game. Most of the trolls do use it as some retarded soapbox catch phrase, I agree, but the rest of us only use it because forum post windows make it hard for us to draw pictures that would easily show the parallel argument we are trying to get across.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
It looks like we're both talking about the extremists on both sides of the argument. Most of us are rational ppl with common sense, but we get caught up in these flame threads that are carefully choreographed by trolls and fanbois alike.
Also, the fourth best selling artist of all time is ABBA... Take that for what it's worth....
You mean Mc. Trolls or Mc. Fanbois in carefully choreographed Mc. Threads.
Well still using the Macky D's Analogy. The big mac is a quality sandwich but yet its still not good for you. Or a Salad lets get rid of macky d's. You get a quality salad but when you drinch it in dressing its tastes like quality but its not good for you.
So Yeah WoW is a polished MMO but its not good for you!!! So therefor WE HATE IT!!!
It's interesting to note that everyone who's voiced their opinion on why they "hate" wow was once a WoW player.
Which means, when people make the argument "11 million people choose Wow" over any other game is factually incorrect. Many people play multiple mmo's at once. If you were to ask the 11 million WoW playes, you will not get 11 million people saying WoW is the best.
Case in point,... i played Wow and many other MMOS....
Wow is not the best mmo I've played.
It's the same as Avatar the movie. Just because I paid to watch it and contributed to it being the highest grossing film of all time... it doesn't mean that my paid ticket = me believing it's the best movie i've ever seen.
Well, maybe for some, but for me its more that nearly every MMO maker out there has taken WoWs success and turned it into this ridiculous mindset of "We should all make games exaqtly like WoW, but with a different name/skin". All they see is the $$$$ attached to WoW and they try to copy that success and are too stupid to see that youre not going to bring down the most succesful brand of anything by copying it, especially when anything you do, they already do better. There are just too few companies out there willing to actually try anything new and innovative. Just think if WoW had never existed, would some other company have come up with something even better, rather than trying to copy it? Would there have never been a game as succesful as WoW in it's absence? Would we still have ended up with dozens and dozens of games just like WoW even without it's presence, or would we have seen a completely different genre of MMOs taking over?
I personally don't like WoW. I dont absolutely hate it, and i can certainly see its appeal to the masses but on the several times that ive tried getting into playing it over the years, i just get bored within a few weeks and cant wait to find something else to play. Unfortunately, that something new to play usually ends up being 90% identical to WoW after you get over the "newness" of it. That's why i hate it, not for the game itself, but for the stagnant state of MMOs that it's success has caused.
I'm not going to read 26 pages just to stay current with my answer, so i will just reply to the thread topic.
Personally, I think that WoW is a very solid, stable game... I'm just bored of playing it.
/facepalm
Look up Analogy and you will see where your thinking makes no sense what-so-ever...
a·nal·o·gy
1.a similarity between like features of two things, on which a comparison may be based: the analogy between the heart and a pump.
2.similarity or comparability: I see no analogy between your problem and mine.
5.Logic. a form of reasoning in which one thing is inferred to be similar to another thing in a certain respect, on the basis of the known similarity between the things in other respects.
Now above is the definition of 'Analogy', and #5 is highlighted because that is how the McD/WoW analogy is being used in disscussion. The known similarities being that they are both businesses selling a product/service to its customers and that they are both popular and their quality is highly subjective.
Note #3 and #4 of the definition have been removed because they reffered to Biology and Linguistics.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Aye, there are a lot of people who are bored of the game. There are a lot of people who are also put off by the direction the game is going.
Think is that when someone even bothers to state a reason such as the one above, they get attacked with "You haven't done everything" or "Show me your 'I killed Arthas 25 hard mode' achievement, cause if you dont have that you havent done everything and therefore cannot be bored" style comments.
I myself lost interest in the game after Uld (a lil after TOC). Before that I would sign in now and then just to help the guild run a raid, but once you've done a raid once, it gets boring real quick (and I'm weird cause to me fun > loot chasing...).
I don't need to have to kill Arthas in 25 man on hard mode or get my Gear Score to XXX in order to know that the game is boring to me. Because to me, the location might change but the game is still the same. And that game got old to me a long time ago...
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
And why cant the two companies be compaired based on quality of their products and services?
To me it just looks like you are just looking for a way fr the analogy to fail, even though no matter how hard you try, the analogy still works as it still fits within the parameters of its definition.
And you can have sustained success over the long term if your quality is subjective. Look at companies such as MS and Apple. They remain successful even though a lot of thier products tend to be low on the quality scale (specially when you look back at the launch of Vista). Still today they remain successful even though the quality of thier products can be debated.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Well for one I responded to this thread back when it was in the Pub, not when it was moved to the WoW forums. The title is also a question asking why people hate WoW, which pretty much asks people why they dont like the game. If you like the game, why are you in this thread?
And two, how am I here terrorizing anyone? Is my use of logic and reasoning scaring anyone? Because to terrorize means to scare, which means my points are somehow scaring someone.
But yeah, I mostly post because its a forum and I have full right to post my opinion just as you do yours. Sadly the theme with anything related to WoW is that if your opinion isnt sunshine and rainbows about the game, you are hence forth a troll.
But even though I no longer play WoW, I still hold a lidetime account that expires in 2030 (odd for a lifetime account to have an expiration date....) That Vivendi Universal awarded to employees of EB games back at the launch of WoW (store in a region who sold the most pre orders won, giving each employee of that store a lifetime account). So this means I hold an active subscription and have full right to talk about the game in any public forum.
But oddly enough the point you are trying to make can be used against yourself as well.
Because I AM a fan of the game and love it with all my heart, I can jump into threads and attack peoples reasons/arguments on not liking the game because they are nothing more than Trolls.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Don't wait?
Am I missing something?
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I will never try World of Warcraft because I think that the graphics are too cartoony and the game has instances with millions of subscribers. I enjoy MMORPG games that are competetive and challenging but I will not give anything a chance that does not have FFA PVP server.
Also, since I have been enjoying Darkfall as my primary game for over a year now, I think that it will be very hard returning to an ALT+1+2+3 (auto-attack/auto-aim) type of game. I cannot see this type of game giving me a rush of adrenaline or anything like that. If I were to try it, I would probably quit because it is probably too laid back for my taste.
I like to put on headphones and pretend that I am in the game. It is easy to do this with Darkfall because the UI is much like Oblivion (one of my all time favorite solo games). If I were to try doing this with WOW than there would be fluffy/flashy things all over reminding me that it is just a game (floating exclamation points? arrows showing you where to go? most annoying is circles around the mobs! watching floating numbers rise above enemies telling you how much damage you are dealing . ..).
I loved Vanguard and that totally died . .. and there are many games out there that in my opinion are probably a lot funner than WOW but die because the population is just too low. This makes a lot of people angry toward WOW for taking so many subscribers away from other games . ..
NEWS FLASH! "A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore gamer and knew just what to do!" Download my music for free! I release several albums per month as part of project "Thee Untitled" . .. some video game music remixes and cover songs done with instruments in there as well! http://theeuntitled.bandcamp.com/ Check out my roleplaying blog, collection of fictional short stories, and fantasy series... updated on a blog for now until I am finished! https://childrenfromtheheavensbelow.blogspot.com/ Watch me game on occasion or make music... https://www.twitch.tv/spoontheeuntitled and subscribe! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUvqULn678VrF3OasgnbsyA
Because every time you even mention another game someone brings this shit up like WOW was the first and end all MMO. Hell, this crap is even on going in my gaming guild of 13 years when I talk about single player games that are great I get some of our cement headed brethren piping up about WOW. People with low mentalities and strong links to addiciton cannot seem to get past it and need to simply disconnect from it.
Once the game is over, the king and the pawn go back in the same box. ~ Italian proverb
people hate WoW for 3 simple reasons or atleast general reasons
1) every new game put on the market is automaticalled compaired to WoW even if its a 900000AD based space sim.. its WoW..
2) most of the big name game companies are now too scared by investers to do anything but rehash WoW items to make WoW clones...
3) WoW just sucks.... its far too easy a game to play, hell even WC was pretty simple to play
personally i tried WoW back before BC on a buddys lowby mage... wasnt impressed with it, tho i did enjoy the hour i spent killing rabbits and deer in the alliance forests.. still not my kind of game.
far too used to grindy korean games and FPS/RTS games to play WoW even less now that its gone cruise control... may as well make every max level as the XP boost pretty much does that... (buddy went back got max level in a month or some jazz with a brand new toon)
while i give WoW props for making a decently stable game, i dislike it simply do to the cheesyness of it. sorry if you disagree with me BUT thats your choice
There are games that are deserted like Vanguard but there are plenty of smaller mmos that maintain pretty decent populations on their servers ( theres just not as many servers ) .
Of course Warcraft attracts all ages but you only have to play it for a short while to realise many of them are children by what they say in general chat and how they act in PUGs or if what you say is true suggests there has to be some very immature 28 year olds playing WoW . Either way they arn't the sort of people I want to know .
Any statement including yours in these forums is going to be a generalisation but broadly speaking most people with a little common sence will see that Warcraft is being made increasingly child-friendly . That not to say theres content adults wont enjoy but it is a general trend in the game . Thats also not to say there is anything wrong in it being child friendly . Kids subs are worth the same as adults .
WoW is fun . I dont hate it but I find it boring now . If I was of a school age and all my friends were playing it I would think its the best game ever . But if you like a game with friendly , mature and helpful community there are better mmos to play .
Holy Cow! Someone answered the question without mentioning MacDonalds, which I think is the basis for much of the argument of the last few pages. I completely understand what Sid said because he was articulate, to the point and obviously gifted with common sense.
Just got home from work... Picked up some McDonalds... what did I miss?
Lol, too right.
As I said earlier, analogies are nonsensical because they simply end in circular arguments (see previous pages as an example). In my opinion, it's just lazy to use anologies in a debate.
I digress though ...
I'm not sure why people would 'hate' any one game really. As to previous players getting bored, etc. I just see that as a natural occurence. At some point I'll get bored with a game and move on. That's not necessarily a reflection of the game though.
I have to agree.
Let me start by saying I don't hate WoW... I enjoyed my time in game yet I have moved on. The following is what I believe is a reason of the 'hate'.
WoW has set the template on how to make an insane amount of money in an MMO... and every other studio will attempt to stick to the format (with small variations) for their chance at the big bucks..
WoW killed diversity.
Of the flip side WoW brought a lot of attention to MMO's so now there is a lot more money being invested into the industry. A larger MMO market does mean more titles in the future.
https://www.youtube.com/user/NemsGaming
Two issues here:
1. You could argue (and it has ad nauseum) Blizzard copied existing games, and therefore didn't bring anything new to the market. With that, how can you blame Blizzard for something that it didn't do? and,
2. Don't you think blaming Blizzard for it's success is a bit misguided? Blizzard simply responded to the market.
I think WoW killing mmorpg diversity was more true in the past then the present. More and more mmorpgs are being developed and being touted as nothing like WoW. Devs in interviews are actually using those words, "We're nothing like WoW.' Whether those games are in fact the polar opposite of WoW is open for debate. I think a lot of gamers see quests, instances, etc., in an mmorpg and immediately shout, "WoW clone" and are being unfair. What devs have to do is learn to be more original and creative while keeping what works well and ignore the fringe hardcore gamers who will never be happy.