Is AoC larger in player numbers than LOTRO

Deewe

Originally posted by Electriceye

@OP: I doubt AoC is even close to LOTRO subs numbers as it has considerably less amount of server activity and overall servers than LOTRo. It just doesn't make sense.

I have to agree, one week later there are still  +1k over (15k) crocodile pet giveaway available here.

Would you have done the same with LotRo they would have been depleted in lets say 2 -3 days max.

 

We can all agree the game is doing better, still it does not compare to LotRo

 

 

Originally posted by Wharg0ul

LOTRO is a good game...but:

It's too happy for me. AoC feels dirty, barbaric, and perverse. LOTRO seems clean, happy, and.....dare I say "cute"?

I keep trying to go back to LOTRO, but can't get more than a month into it before I feel like I'm going to puke. 

Guess you're going to stay away from TOR then

InsideBevel

Originally posted by Electriceye

@OP: I doubt AoC is even close to LOTRO subs numbers as it has considerably less amount of server activity and overall servers than LOTRo. It just doesn't make sense.

 

So, what you are saying is that you are playing both games?

Drakynn

I almost broke down and got Rise of the Godslayer  and try Age of Conan again.But I looked a tthe site and the acount upgrade costs $24.95 for the basic version and would thne have to pay for at least a motnh of subscription,whilst new comers can ge tit and the original game for $19.95 and get 30 days free.Whilst I'm sure peopel wil consider that fair,it really gave me no incentive to come bakc and try the game,so I've resubbed to LotRO instead.

jblah

Originally posted by Electriceye

Originally posted by jblah

I keep wanting to come back and try the game but the official forums are not very attractive to new players from the PVP exploits and the new AA system exploits where people are maxed out already.

This is a joke.. right? These forums got to a whole new level of "rosiness" if the only significant new mechanic not working as intended isn't even mentioned.

@OP: I doubt AoC is even close to LOTRO subs numbers as it has considerably less amount of server activity and overall servers than LOTRo. It just doesn't make sense.

Like I said I have not tried the game since launch but I was about to when I checked the official forums and found that the new AA system is being exploted. Here is the link I found http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=220071

Then I found this link about the same lag spike problem they have had since launch as well. http://forums.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=220197 . I am also noticing a lot of threads about how bad the UI is as well which I remember being a problem when I first played and since I realized I had to look at it all the time it is kind of a game breaker for me anyway. Well I guess I will just play console RPG's till Cata and ToR come out. I just feel I would be foolish to fall for the AoC hype twice. Those that do enjoy the game I wish you the best.

Electriceye

Originally posted by InsideBevel

Originally posted by Electriceye

@OP: I doubt AoC is even close to LOTRO subs numbers as it has considerably less amount of server activity and overall servers than LOTRo. It just doesn't make sense.

 

So, what you are saying is that you are playing both games?

Common sense dude. A game with 22 active servers (some more than others admittedly) vs a game that has some.. 15? servers, most of which are ridiculously low pop as all players are flocking to the few good populated servers.

The simple truth from a neutral point of view is that RotGS didn't do any miracles unlike what people in these forums would make you believe. It has simply gone through the usual increase of player activity after an expansion, few returning players trying it out, a few brand new players. player activity =/= new subs (what people are seeing on Xfire) after a newly released expansion, again nothing surprising there either.

Who cares about that though? AoC is enjoyable for a lot of the people playing it and that's the only thing that matters right?

DaSpack

Originally posted by Electriceye

Originally posted by InsideBevel

Originally posted by Electriceye

@OP: I doubt AoC is even close to LOTRO subs numbers as it has considerably less amount of server activity and overall servers than LOTRo. It just doesn't make sense.

 

So, what you are saying is that you are playing both games?

Common sense dude. A game with 22 active servers (some more than others admittedly) vs a game that has some.. 15? servers, most of which are ridiculously low pop as all players are flocking to the few good populated servers.

The simple truth from a neutral point of view is that RotGS didn't do any miracles unlike what people in these forums would make you believe. It has simply gone through the usual increase of player activity after an expansion, few returning players trying it out, a few brand new players. player activity =/= new subs (what people are seeing on Xfire) after a newly released expansion, again nothing surprising there either.

Who cares about that though? AoC is enjoyable for a lot of the people playing it and that's the only thing that matters right?

 First of all I just want to say that these forum questions on which game is bigger or better than the other one is inflamatory and normally leads to nothing else but flaming. Reading your post however I could not stop myself from replying for two reasons.

1. Applying your logic about number of servers as an indicator of amount of players can most definitely not be used as a gauge for population. If it were so I guess EVE would be the MMO with lowest population having only 1 server. Servers can service everything from 1000 people to several 100 000 based on setup. Your comment on no. of servers is just plain wrong. You comment on Lotro being in higher population is also wrong just for the simple reason that just the open Beta signup in Korea on AoC had over 200 000 signups (a good indicator of how many is playing the game over there). Over 30 000 people played the same server and they had 7 servers through beta. Actually looking on these numbers alone makes AoC much bigger than LotRO not even counting in EU and US. I must ask you, have you played the game lately? If you think nobody plays AoC, you have to rethink.

2. For your comments about AoC that have not undergone major changes in gameplay mechanics, I think they pretty much speak for themselves. If you did not log in for nothing else than to verify that Conan still was holding a sword, yes I guess you would not see any change. I you just completed one dungeon, tried to sell one crafted sword or any of the other things you can do you, you are bound to see a difference... That depending on of course if you remember how the game was in the first place.

TheNinjaboy

Remember when looking at a Quarterly report you have to take into consideration all the PREPAID 6month and 12month subs they got prior to that Quarter.

I don't think they count those numbers in the following quarters as that quarter's revenues.

A lot of players took advantage of the 12month free EXPANSION offer.

dhayes68

Originally posted by Aceundor

The thing is that AoC is presently experiencing a "re-awakening" in the MMO community. How long this will last and how deep it will go remain to bee seen. However there is definately a positivie vibe around it. Right now AoC is "the place to be"

Lotro is experiencing that players are in a "been there done that" faze. It is a great game and has been a great game for a long time. That is part of its, call it , "problem". 

So I would say that the number of players in AoC is increasing while playernumbers in Lotro is decreasing. However I dont beleive that AoC has more players than Lotro at the moment. AoC was so far behind Lotro that it would take some more time to catch up.

If I should guess I would say Lotro as about 200 - 250K players while AoC has about 150K players. (up from 80 k)

Lets see if AoC keeps up its momentum. It is certanly on the right track. Playing last night I was happy to see lots of people around. Thats whats counts for me, that the world is alive. 

No, its not experiencing a "re-awakening". Its experiencing an uptic in activity within the mmo community because they launched an expansion.  The two are very different. Though I stipulate the first could lead to the second, hypothetically.

Gomodded

How do people here know how many players or subscribers LOTRO has, or AOC?? How can they be so sure?! Some are not playing, some are guessing, maybe there's some secret crystal balls people have? Or they have good contacts that are in the  MMORPG companies and that are 'deep throating' information to the outside.

It's a mystery. How can you tell if more people are playing or not. Only by headcount on servers! Oh, but stupid. Headcount would have to be done many months back to compare...

... but what if people did? Some did, and they say, 'more players online, growing from Jan to Apr, again little bit in May with ROTGS', maybe 20-30% added to people's number in April? 'Now some more than double player numbers online from January'. We thank him and say 'good job, keep it up' (and when he's gone, I say 'that guy is WEIRD', but not meant badly).

Is this check for all servers? I dunno, I dont think so, he named two servers. So, its still a mystery, but I see a lot, a lot more people running around, many of them from back from launch or even fully new. So who to believe? I dunno too, I think Ill just keep playing, theres beliefs for everyone what they want to.

 

PS: I also dont think AOC has more players than LOTRO, because everyone loves elves and hobbits, and Tolkien wrote great books. Plus, many people dont like Funcom or non-fluffy graphics, or have bad computers or hate too much zoning! Too bad. For them.

DaSpack

IOriginally posted by Gomodded

How do people here know how many players or subscribers LOTRO has, or AOC?? How can they be so sure?! Some are not playing, some are guessing, maybe there's some secret crystal balls people have? Or they have good contacts that are in the  MMORPG companies and that are 'deep throating' information to the outside.

It's a mystery. How can you tell if more people are playing or not. Only by headcount on servers! Oh, but stupid. Headcount would have to be done many months back to compare...

... but what if people did? Some did, and they say, 'more players online, growing from Jan to Apr, again little bit in May with ROTGS', maybe 20-30% added to people's number in April? 'Now some more than double player numbers online from January'. We thank him and say 'good job, keep it up' (and when he's gone, I say 'that guy is WEIRD', but not meant badly).

Is this check for all servers? I dunno, I dont think so, he named two servers. So, its still a mystery, but I see a lot, a lot more people running around, many of them from back from launch or even fully new. So who to believe? I dunno too, I think Ill just keep playing, theres beliefs for everyone what they want to.

 

PS: I also dont think AOC has more players than LOTRO, because everyone loves elves and hobbits, and Tolkien wrote great books. Plus, many people dont like Funcom or non-fluffy graphics, or have bad computers or hate too much zoning! Too bad. For them.

 As I said 3 posts further up. the question of this thread is very easy to answer since Neowiz just published today that at least 200 000 have started playing AoC in Korea through open Beta. http://www.dn.no/finans/portal/newsPage?newt__source=feed.news.tdn.ALL_NEWS&newt__newsId=FUNCOM-fs113ct0

You have to google translate it, but thats what this pressrelease basically is saying. Now, 200 000 in Korea pluss another 200 000 in EU and US, leaves AoC at double of what even the most optimistic estimates for Lotro would be. End of discussion I think.

Loke666

Originally posted by DaSpack

 As I said 3 posts further up. the question of this thread is very easy to answer since Neowiz just published today that at least 200 000 have started playing AoC in Korea through open Beta. http://www.dn.no/finans/portal/newsPage?newt__source=feed.news.tdn.ALL_NEWS&newt__newsId=FUNCOM-fs113ct0

You have to google translate it, but thats what this pressrelease basically is saying. Now, 200 000 in Korea pluss another 200 000 in EU and US, leaves AoC at double of what even the most optimistic estimates for Lotro would be. End of discussion I think.

Well, it depends if you count paying customers or not. But it is a good guess that AoC will jump past LOTRO when the game launches in Korea.

I really don't see what this matter however, as long as both companies have enough money to continue to fund the games.

eyeswideopen

Unlike LotRO, Funcom hasn't had to make AoC  free to play with a cash shop to stay afloat. If that doesn't tell you which has more subs, nothing will. Bye-bye LotRO.

Jackdog

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Unlike LotRO, Funcom hasn't had to make AoC  free to play with a cash shop to stay afloat. If that doesn't tell you which has more subs, nothing will. Bye-bye LotRO.

I would say it is just the opposite, I expect the AOC population to drop off rapidly in the next few months once they shiny wears off the new expansion.

If I were Funcom and SOE Iwould be holding meetings with my financial people this week to see how we could emulate Turbines decisions. It worked great for DDO and I expect it will work even better for LoTRO.The game is three years old and still consistently beats AoC in ratings, that says it all right there.

Loke666

Originally posted by Jackdog

I would say it is just the opposite, I expect the AOC population to drop off rapidly in the next few months once they shiny wears off the new expansion.

If I were Funcom and SOE Iwould be holding meetings with my financial people this week to see how we could emulate Turbines decisions. It worked great for DDO and I expect it will work even better for LoTRO.The game is three years old and still consistently beats AoC in ratings, that says it all right there.

That would be stupid. First they wait and see how this actually works.

Making a game like DDO F2P is one thing, it is very instanced and a lot like Guildwars. It is easy to sell instances to players there.

LOTRO is an open game and it is impossible to be sure that the F2P business model is better until you actually tried it.

We wont know if this was a good move or not. They probably spent a lot of thinking on this (unless they have financial problems and are desperate) but that doesn't really mean that they will earn a lot more money.

So if I had a MMO company I would look on this with interest but not consider anything until I seen that this is a proven idea. Can you get more money by converting your game from F2P to P2P? It is not unlikely but it also might totally bomb.

MMO.Maverick

Originally posted by Loke666

That would be stupid. First they wait and see how this actually works.

  We wont know if this was a good move or not. They probably spent a lot of thinking on this (unless they have financial problems and are desperate) but that doesn't really mean that they will earn a lot more money.

So if I had a MMO company I would look on this with interest but not consider anything until I seen that this is a proven idea. Can you get more money by converting your game from F2P to P2P? It is not unlikely but it also might totally bomb.

Yep. Wait and see is the best response I think, seeing how LotrO will do it and what could be learnt from it or possibly copied.

AoC is doing good right now, twice to triple the player population that it used to have. Of course, that will diminish in the months to come, but how much remains to be seen. I'm guessing that the successful RotGS launch - especially successful compared to the launch two years ago -  will have given them a boost in confidence that they're on the right path certainly in some aspects, and it generated a boost in approval among the player community as well. If I was them, I'd sit together and see how they can continue on the right path and keep learning from the mistakes, instead of devoting the resources to switching the sub model.

Personally, I would like them to devote their attention and resources to making the Towers work, next to tweaking and smoothing over any Khitai issues.

 

DaSpack

Originally posted by Jackdog

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Unlike LotRO, Funcom hasn't had to make AoC  free to play with a cash shop to stay afloat. If that doesn't tell you which has more subs, nothing will. Bye-bye LotRO.

I would say it is just the opposite, I expect the AOC population to drop off rapidly in the next few months once they shiny wears off the new expansion.

If I were Funcom and SOE Iwould be holding meetings with my financial people this week to see how we could emulate Turbines decisions. It worked great for DDO and I expect it will work even better for LoTRO.The game is three years old and still consistently beats AoC in ratings, that says it all right there.

 Dude, wake up. LotRO just went F2P. I think it's quite obvious which game that is doing better.

And by the way, AoC besides getting the Xpack population in just got another 200 000 (at least) from Korea launch. All in all starting to approach 1/2 Mill subs.

finaticd

Originally posted by DaSpack

Originally posted by Jackdog

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Unlike LotRO, Funcom hasn't had to make AoC  free to play with a cash shop to stay afloat. If that doesn't tell you which has more subs, nothing will. Bye-bye LotRO.

I would say it is just the opposite, I expect the AOC population to drop off rapidly in the next few months once they shiny wears off the new expansion.

If I were Funcom and SOE Iwould be holding meetings with my financial people this week to see how we could emulate Turbines decisions. It worked great for DDO and I expect it will work even better for LoTRO.The game is three years old and still consistently beats AoC in ratings, that says it all right there.

 Dude, wake up. LotRO just went F2P. I think it's quite obvious which game that is doing better.

And by the way, AoC besides getting the Xpack population in just got another 200 000 (at least) from Korea launch. All in all starting to approach 1/2 Mill subs.

Jakedog is correct as the population per xfire already fell by 1/3 and it hasn't been a full month yet.

Daspook is incorrect...Xfire shows LOTRO much higher even before the FTP announcment so LOTRO is dominating AoC even after a recent AoC expansion.  The numbers show that people are not interested in AoC very long http://www.xfire.com/games/aoc/Age_of_Conan_Hyborian_Adventures/

Koreans wont stay very long...the game was free but most likely they where stuck in Tortage and don't know how little this game has yet.  Not to mention Funcom pretty much sold the rights so they will get very little at all.

1/2 million subs is pretty laughable, the game doesn't have the quality or content to sustain that......maybe if it grows again it can sustain a 100,000 subscriber base but with so low numbers future development will be low. Call me when you fill up the 4 USA servers. or the many empty french/poland-russia servers.

Darkheart00

Originally posted by finaticd

Originally posted by DaSpack

Originally posted by Jackdog

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Unlike LotRO, Funcom hasn't had to make AoC  free to play with a cash shop to stay afloat. If that doesn't tell you which has more subs, nothing will. Bye-bye LotRO.

I would say it is just the opposite, I expect the AOC population to drop off rapidly in the next few months once they shiny wears off the new expansion.

If I were Funcom and SOE Iwould be holding meetings with my financial people this week to see how we could emulate Turbines decisions. It worked great for DDO and I expect it will work even better for LoTRO.The game is three years old and still consistently beats AoC in ratings, that says it all right there.

 Dude, wake up. LotRO just went F2P. I think it's quite obvious which game that is doing better.

And by the way, AoC besides getting the Xpack population in just got another 200 000 (at least) from Korea launch. All in all starting to approach 1/2 Mill subs.

Jakedog is correct as the population per xfire already fell by 1/3 and it hasn't been a full month yet.

Daspook is incorrect...Xfire shows LOTRO much higher even before the FTP announcment so LOTRO is dominating AoC even after a recent AoC expansion.  The numbers show that people are not interested in AoC very long http://www.xfire.com/games/aoc/Age_of_Conan_Hyborian_Adventures/

Koreans wont stay very long...the game was free but most likely they where stuck in Tortage and don't know how little this game has yet.  Not to mention Funcom pretty much sold the rights so they will get very little at all.

1/2 million subs is pretty laughable, the game doesn't have the quality or content to sustain that......maybe if it grows again it can sustain a 100,000 subscriber base but with so low numbers future development will be low. Call me when you fill up the 4 USA servers. or the many empty french/poland-russia servers.

You do realise the upsurge in xfire was due to play to win competition its know back where it should be.

Abot

I am going to point out the obvious here.  Xfire is not a sure way to gauge any games true numbers due to the fact that not everyone uses it :O.  Also you cant even say that a certain percentage of people in each game uses Xfire as there is no statistics (I am not going to explain stats if you dont know it take a class).

CyberWiz

I think it is unlikely for AoC to have equal or higher numbers than LOTRO, there is no doubt tho that AoC is getting closer.

donjuanamigo

who cares?

finaticd

Originally posted by Darkheart00

 

You do realise the upsurge in xfire was due to play to win competition its know back where it should be.

Mostly do to the release of the expansion though...there have been many Xfire competitions before with little change but when the numbers spike that high it is do to more people playing so expansion is most likely. 

However, it is very low atm...much lower than where it was just before 1.05, free trials, win-backs, and endless Tortage which is a bad sign for AoC.

Hrimnir

I don't know if its been posted before as im not gonna read through that many pages of responses. But, this is a topic that came up frequently on the AoC forums from all the doomsayers/negative nancy's there.

What we determined, through actual research, and valid statistics, is that xfire is utterly USELESS for determining MMO subscription numbers.  Why you might ask? Demographics.  If you look at xfire usage statistics, its primarily used by 13-19 year olds.  The average age range for MMO gamers is 18-35, with the "hump" of the peak at around 24-26 years old.  Thats overall, yes certain MMOs will swing in certain directions.  LOTRO online for some reason was favored by older players, their "hump" in the curve peaked at about 31.  Age of conan, being a mature game, by nature is going to have fewer sub 18 year olds, either via parenting or stores not selling them the Mature rated game, etc.  I would guess AoC to be slightly higher than the average.

The point is, using xfire for MMO sub numbers is like going to the Berkeley campus and polling for the presidential election and then trying to state that this is the overall opinion of the entire country.  Its painfully wrong.

finaticd

Originally posted by Hrimnir

I don't know if its been posted before as im not gonna read through that many pages of responses. But, this is a topic that came up frequently on the AoC forums from all the doomsayers/negative nancy's there.

What we determined, through actual research, and valid statistics, is that xfire is utterly USELESS for determining MMO subscription numbers.  Why you might ask? Demographics.  If you look at xfire usage statistics, its primarily used by 13-19 year olds.  The average age range for MMO gamers is 18-35, with the "hump" of the peak at around 24-26 years old.  Thats overall, yes certain MMOs will swing in certain directions.  LOTRO online for some reason was favored by older players, their "hump" in the curve peaked at about 31.  Age of conan, being a mature game, by nature is going to have fewer sub 18 year olds, either via parenting or stores not selling them the Mature rated game, etc.  I would guess AoC to be slightly higher than the average.

The point is, using xfire for MMO sub numbers is like going to the Berkeley campus and polling for the presidential election and then trying to state that this is the overall opinion of the entire country.  Its painfully wrong.

Your buddies at the AoC forums are off.....pretty much every MMO, WoW, AoC, LOTRO, EQ has the same age demographic like you mentioned, yeah it is strange they all hoover at around 26-28 as an AVERAGE age of a player.  Which means the opposite and Xfire is more significant do to having similar populations.  webtraffic demographics, casual serveys, studies, etc. The bad thing about xfire is it keeps track of time, when the only important number is users per day.

IDK why so few AoC players get statistics. Xfire is a sample to represent a population.

However, we don't compare AoC to other games to often but like webtraffic and xfire and company statements etc we can factor a bunch of stuff and determine AoC has fewer players than LOTRO.

What Xfire is best with is comparing to itself so in that regard AoC is doing pretty poorly compared to pre patch 1.05 and looks to be headed back down to after patch 1.05. Which is funny because isn't patch 1.05 supposed to be the miracle patch.

green13

As of six months ago, LOTRO was definitely in the lead (though keep in mind that LOTRO's subscription numbers are a guess - Turbine have always been too embarassed to release them).

http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/150k-1m.png

But that could look very different in the next update of these figures. Anectodally at least, LOTRO's numbers have been slipping.