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To those that want something new - WHAT excactly do you want?
kevin_123
Member Posts: 52
80% of threads/posts on here are about how all new games are copying WOW, they're the same, they're boring etc. etc.
My question is, what excactly do you want? You keep saying "Don't they get it? We want something new!" Well, WHAT? What else is there to do? You want a game that is as good as WOW, but not WOW? Do you want a completely different genre? FPS MMO? Driving MMO? FPS MMO? Sci-Fi MMO? What new 'features' do you want?
To me, it seems a bit like what you really want is a time machine to go back in time and be amazed by this new cool type of game called 'MMO'. Where thousands of people all join together in a virtual world.
I do agree with you though, they do suck, but what is it you want? Who knows, maybe some Dev will read this and listen to your ideas/thoughts..
Comments
Personaly what I want is the ability to make an impact on more then just my gear.
We need worlds again, where you just like in a boardgame go up against other players.
We need harsh death penelties again, drop gear, lose levels. We need it to make the games exiting again! All those people that came into the market after WoW havent felt the adrenaline rush running from your enmies knowing that if they catch you you will lose your gear, and level down, while you at the same time are screaming on Vent for your buddies to come and save you. I have experinced this in Linage2 and it brought the imersion just one step closer to home, and made the game feel mush more meaningful and fun.
Countless of times I have hidden in safespots or camped out a system to avoid or catch my enemies in EvE. I have lost money and ships and implants and I have punished people in return blowing up thier shit and sending them packing. That to me is what makes an MMO. Not an endelss treadmill for gear that you can never drop or lose once it is yours.
In the words of marv from sin city, "This is blood for Blood and by the gallon. These are the old days, the bad days, the old or nothing days, They'er back! There's no choise left. And im ready for war!" I think that sums it up nicly RISK VS REWARD needs to come back to MMOs so the new generation get a chans to experince it. Yes some will cry and run to mommy but more will stay and fight it out. All we need is a game with less complex mechanics then EvE and a little more themepark ellements and we will have a success on our hands. People say they want something new why not give them something OLD, in a repackaged format. Hey you know what wasent that what Blizzard did with World of Warcraft? And look how that turned out....
Something new? No, that is how we got into this mess. Something old, but on the path of innovation that fits that, not changing it to something else entirely, a different path. The technology/features path at this point leads to CRPG, not MMO.
M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demos & indie alpha's.
it would be nice to be able to play a game, get stuck on a quest, and have to figure it out instead of just being able to google the info.
I do it now, sure, but its kinda hard to get into a game when everything in the game is in some online database. Kinda takes away from the feeling that your in a persistant world.
My Thoughts on Content Locust
Most people don't have any idea what they want, they just complain.
If its not lke WoW they complain, if its like WoW they complain...MMoRPG makers need to think smaller and forget trying to beat WoW and make games that they think are fun and be happy with a couple hundred K players.
Me personally, I want the PvE of WoW with the RvR of DAoC, mix up sandbox and themepark style with the Risk vs Reward of old school Everquest that has the character development depth of Anarchy Online...put that all together in either fantasy or Sci Fi and that would be the game for me.
Godz of War I call Thee
Massive wars and I mean really massive with thousands of players in a battlefield alla total war. Yeah I know it will take a decade or more for the hardware to allow it though.
But seriously we need castle wars or territory wars. You know those contested territories in wow? Why didn't blizzard made these zones available for conquest? Like a big scale rts fighting for resources. Guilds holding fortresses. It would give a whole new meaning to end game, a world that constantly changes.
This was allready done...DAoC
with excepton of the amount of players that is...only a couple hundred
Godz of War I call Thee
Exactly, thotbot, wowhead and the likes destroyed a part of that game. The adventuring one. I remember in the beginning peoples used to stop you and ask where was this mob or that town. Peoples getting lost ect. It was so different. Now the most pushed keys are alt + tab and see where to turn the quest.
Yes it was donne by an old game though. Warhammer tried this but it's problem was that it focused only on that part. Consider it more like an added feature not the only and main one. In wow it would had worked great.
I think people just want their MMO-innocence back, back when everything was new and interesting. Once you've lost that, even a diamond is just a chunk of carbon. And I'm pretty sure most developers know that, and know better than even bother trying to accomodate them.
Me, I just want some refinement and polish in the upcoming offerings and some PVE that's too variable for a strategy guide/FAQ/Add-on to be much help.
A Modest Proposal for MMORPGs:
That the means of progression would not be mutually exclusive from the means of enjoyment.
Every person has a different idea of what constitutes the utopian mmo. And therefore, this argument will never be put to rest, because no game will ever match every person's vision and thus fall short of the mark inspiring forum nerd rage for perpetuity.
Now I do have faith in the ever elusive 'WoW Killer' so often spoken of in forum lore. I do not know if it a game I enjoy, but I predict it will have these features:
Sandbox
Non-instanced to virtually non-instanced
All previous negative unintended results of non-instanced situations will be mitigated effectively
Innovative combat system
Skill based or semi-skill based or an innovative progression never before seen
Stellar graphics
Flawless performance
Ability to effectively play on a multitude of computers and perhaps cross-platform
Innovative grouping mechanisms
Eliminated 'kill x number of..." and fed ex quests - or done in such an innovative way you don't notice
A structure which minimizes the 'top heavy' syndrom mmo's have suffered after a few years live
But almost the most important of all:
A launch and continued maintenance schedule which surpasses Blizzard's polish and performance
But THE most important of all:
It will be fun.
Perhaps one or more of the features above could be missing, but I believe all of them create a no brainer win.
I think they want 3D UO, or DAOC2.
Me personally, I want a RvR game with at least 3 faction. Preferrably more.
Because all the carrots lead to solo and small group activities. It saves a lot on bandwidth... which makes for more money to bank.
Anyway, has been done, even on a larger scale than DAoC. Old PlanetSide (pre-crap changes). SWG had some large battles like that too, 100's of players, back before NGE.
If you get many players into the same area and doing something, it's a hard hit on bandwidth. So games are not designed to do that any longer, that's the oooold out-dated yesterday way, while cutting edge solo instancing is all the rage.
M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demos & indie alpha's.
you just described EvE here, if this is what you want you should give it a try...
Yeah, everyone wants to rekindle that first blush feeling when they started their first MMO.
.
It's gone forever.
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
How about one that isnt a shallow uninspired piece of money grabbing crap?
Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
Playing: Skyrim
Following: The Repopulation
I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)
But wouldn't that go against innovation? That's what people want now, innovation to shallow uninspired pieces of money grabbing crap. I mean if it's new, it must be good, right? And people that liked mmo's before they changed to the new deal, well they should just go play other games...? Seems to be *cough* the prevailing consensus anyway. But then for the rest of us, the fantasy world usually ends when we hit disconnect.
M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demos & indie alpha's.
I'm not looking for something new, I'm looking for something old with a new shiny graphics engine and 'done right' type deal.
Never played UO but I've heard I would have loved it back in its prime. I loved DAoC pre-catacombs. I loved the concepts behind Shadowbane, however bugs, exploits, rampant hacking and corrupt GM's throughout its existance made it a terrible game, even at that, I still have many fond memories of building cities and burning others down. Eve is amazing in concept and scope and I love hearing about it, but the spreadsheet type gameplay is far to boring to keep my interest. DF would have been a great game if they did what they said instead of Tasos lying about the state of the game and the features in the game the entire way up to and during launch. It might have even been playable now if Aventurine weren't fruadalent criminals with the worst CS I've seen to date in any MMO. MO has huge potential but unprofesional inexperienced developers delivered what feels like a foreign game that lacks any of the standards set by recent MMO's (DF excluded as lieing criminals are always the bottom of the barrel). I'm missing many games that would have been perfect and fun for me except for some critical flaws. Obviously these are the big issues with me and I left out the smaller nit picking issues because like many gamers those, I dont mind living with, but the others are deal breakers.
So what excactly do I want?
Open world: I despise instancing, it is the exact oposite of what I feel an MMO should be. I want to run through a zone and see all the other players doing their thing, playing with their group, ect. However I can tolerate instancing to an extent, for example certain quests that are instanced to give the player the full immersive experience that would not be possible under other circumstances. Also Aion did instancing for the first 2 zones of the game rather intelligently. Having the lower level zones instanced allowed for the servers to hold a lot more people for launch and would have left the game at a stable population for each server if it had been a better product. Still kudos on thinking ahead and planning those start zones accordingly.
PvP: This is by far the most important aspect of the game to me. It must be a centric part of the game, not an afterthought. PvP must involve risk and be rewarding as well. Games like WoW and Warhammer had pvp and reward you for it, however they had no risk involved and the majority of it took place in meaningless instances that reset 10 minutes later when you were done with your round. While DAoC pvp on the surface was pretty meaningless, the RvR system added depth to it and gave it a purpose. UO/DF/MO all accomplished this with full loot. And Shadowbane accomplished this with the best city building/city siege system I've ever seen in an MMO as well as inventory looting.
Sandbox vs linear: While the sandbox is appealing to me, many games are a combination of the two. To me a true sandbox takes into account all of your actions, the other players determine the reactions to those actions and you have the opportunity to change the face of the game forever. However I'm not totally against a themepark type system as long as it has sandbox elements too it. A linear progression starting at point A leveling up and moving to point B then C, D, E, F ect doing quests at each hub along the way is rathering boring to me. However Tolerable if it slightly challenging, not repetative and if by the time I get to point Z I am able to actually do something, interact with the world and change it (what is known as endgame). While I'd prefer the entire game be fun for me, Sometimes the destination is just better than the journey, this was most relevant to me in DAoC where I power leveled characters by grinding with capped level characters to skip the journey entirely and be ready for the end game RvR/PvP aspect of the game.
Skill based gameplay: I want a game based on player skill not gear alone. I want victories to be determined by the better player, not the guy that spent 40 hours raiding the previous week. Gear can still be important, as well as utilized with certain play styles to give you a huge advantage, but it should not be the ultimate deciding factor which seems to be the case in many if not most games today.
Honesty/quality: This is my final request in an MMO. It includes getting a good game for a fair price as well as having said game supported by a competent honest developer. Now, most games in development start off meeting this mark for me, however that can quickly change. Monthly fee + cash shop is one of the quickest ways to fail this category. Blatant lieing to the extent of calling your playbase stupid if they believe a word you say (DF/Tasos/Aventurine) fails this category. Pushing out content lacking, boring, incomplete games fails this category (cryptic, though they already failed). Charging MMO prices for a non MMO, instanced game, (RTW/APB) fails this category. Cloning WoW (to many to list) fails this category. Finally, the game must be up to todays set standards. Lack of an intuitive, easy to use interface/HUD, basic intiutive key layouts and easy to learn (possibly hard to master) gameplay will fail this category.
Maybe Im not who you are talking to but ill answer anyway. I want a new world, but can still be mideaval and magical. A good collection of classes and races. Battles that are challenging but not battles that go on for a boring 45 minutes. A smooth ui. Coding that isnt buggy. Fishing, crafting and bards. Auction/broker system that also allows the buyer to advertise what he wants and is willing to pay. Some solo content. Group content that gives better rewards than solo content. In between content that can be soloed but only by players with some skill and imagination. Raid content in from launch. Combat that does not significantly depend on ping times.
I want a tailored experience. What I mean by that is I want to log on and enjoy my stay in the game. I want to be able to play solo one day if I feel like it, duo with my wife, group with friends or pug it up. I want the option and I want all of those options to be viable.
I want freedom. Freedom to go where I want and do what I want. Freedom to choose how I play. I hate pre-designed classes they tend to be boring and simply support the generic Tank, Healer, DPS setup.
I want to have fun. If I log in for an hour or 3 hours it shouldn't matter, I should have fun while I am in game. I also don't want to have to work for months on end to get to a point in the game where I can have fun, that just promotes the dangling of the carrot to keep you paying to play. If the games fun I will play for a long time, UO I played for over a decade.
I want to customization. I don't want to look like every one else. I want to be an individual. I don't want to be just another Plate Armored wearing paladin or Warrior. I want the ability to customize my attire so that it suits my individual taste and style. I also don't want to have to wear some god awful looking mismatched gear from hell to get a decent bonus from my gear.
I want to be able to hang with new players even if I am a 5 year vet and both of us benefit from the endeavor. I don't want some large gap where they can't help me with what I want to do and I get nothing from helping them.
I want PvP, I need PvP lol but I don't want it to be another situation where new players are constantly being run out of the game stunting it's growth and eventually killing it like it generally does in FFA PvP MMO's.
I want a good crafting experience that revolves around more than repetition. I also want customization there, allow me to create custom custom armor and weapons at least to a degree. Let me name it and stamp my seal on it.
I want to feel a part of the world not like I'm just some visitor. A home is a good start, again I will point out UO. Expand upon that make me feel like I belong there.
I want a bustling economy. I want an MMO where gear and weapons are always needed. This means giving them durability and only allow so much of that durability to be restored with a repair each time gradually decreasing until it must be replaced. I want food to matter.
I want a feel of exploration. Yes the world will eventually all be explored, but that doesn't mean things must always stay the same. Going into a dungeon and clearing out the goblins that reside in it doesn't mean that goblins have to be present the next time you visit. Other mobs could have taken up residence. Maybe the goblins fearful of another adventurer comming through set traps or brought more troops. Maybe a Dragon decided to make that it's nest one day. Things don't have to stay the same constantly.
There is a lot more I want lol. This would be a good start though.
I just want good combat mechanics. I can respect a game for what it chooses to do, and also what it chooses *not* to do, but I simply cannot stand a game with that's either too cumbersome (which I have yet to see an MMO do), or too simple. Anything else is the "director's choice" and I'm fine with it, but it's always comes with critique. The gamebreaker for me is the combat.
So I am looking forward to a lot of new games that are breaking away from the EQ-set standard.
Honorable mentions;
Tabula Rasa was ok, but still far too simple for what was.
Auto Assault was tits, and no matter how meh the content got over time, the base formula was great. That game needed love.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
This is the only right answer.
People don't know what they want. What they say, what they actually like and what they actually do in-game are three completely different things.
It's up to the developers to create a game that appeals to us, not up to the players.
Half the time we want what we already have but we lost. Meaning features from old MMOs that "worked" because of the magic of nostalgia. The other half we're not quite sure; we want a feature that's "cool" or "original" that'll let us have "fun," but it's hard to think of ways to realistically implement it without disrupting other aspects of the game. That's a developer's job, right? Well, yeah. They make what they want and you get to choose whether or not you like what they're selling. If you don't, go to the next guy. A good developer will consider but not bow down to his customers' requests. Basically, what Hyanmen said above.
What do we want? Why can't we all just get along? What's the meaning of life? Are there aliens? Who ate the last slice of chocolate cake? These are just some of the bigger questions worth pondering.
Been playing Lineage 2 for 5 years and still today nothing else out there comes close. Open World, Open PVP, Sandbox style political system and a social aspect thats unmatched.
I know what I want, things from past MMOs that did work, and I want them because they were fun, not because of some magical nostalgia effect, package them in a shiny new skin with all the standard social/guild/auction mechanics we've come to expect and you would be golden. Getting along is boring, conflict is in our genes and makes life interesting. There is no meaning of life, the world, the planet, solar system, the galaxy we are part of will all be destroyed by a cosmic event that could have originated billions of years ago. There are aliens, they are mexicans and they come here looking for a better life, they dont find it though. I had the last slice of chocolate cake, it was good but kinda stale. None of those questions were worth pondering, they were all quite obvious to me, feel free to disagree though.
You don't know that.