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PVE with a challenge
Greymantle4
Member UncommonPosts: 809
in LFGame
It seems every mmo I play anymore the PVE in the outdoor environment is way to easy. The only challenge I can find is end game raids and dungeons anymore. Does anyone know a MMO that has a challenge (I'm not talking time sinks) in gameplay in the outdoor pve environment? The last game I remember having this challenge was the original EQ.
Comments
yeah they don't really make those
well maybe anarchy online
Eve Online or Team WoW PVP.
Eve online gives you a genuine rush because you could lose ALOT of money and work.
WoW PVP gives you a rush because you can make a 15 y/o get extremely emo.
Pretty sad when I get two suggestions for pvp and one for a old game. What happen to putting a challenge in PVE games these days? sigh
Make a protection spec tank in WoW and go solo, challenge enough.
Wow's only challenge to me is if I can stay the whole 30 days I paid for anymore. :P There hasn't been a challenge in Wow outdoor environment in a very long time. They nerfed the hell out of the old world while increasing the power of the classes and the gear. This combo made my brothers 10 year old daughter have no problems leveling.
try darkfall, the mobs are actually a challenge.
from the very first goblin camps to ever increasing challenging mob options. with mini-bosses / dungeons / all kinds of differen't mechanics, there really is some great pve to be had....
the problem is the players, everyone has a grind / skilling up mentality, so they just stick to what's easy and efficient. The next thing you know the tedium sets in.
if you can overcome that mindset, darkfall's pve is pretty darn good.
"In life we are all turds, some sink and some float but in the end we all get flushed."
Darkfall has the most challenging open world PvE I have experienced. Not saying it's perfect, but you actually are able to use some tactics and strategy while farming pve mobs.
Steam: Neph
I have to tell you the last game I would have thought anyone would have suggested would be Darkfall. I'm not sure if I could get by the open world pvp though. Is it a lot like old school UO if you know what I mean?
Vanguard may be another option. Especially if you pick a class that's traditionally not seen as solo friendly (such as rogue).
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You? - Build A Character - D&D Compendium
I personally missed out on good old UO. I assume you are talking like pre-Trammel though? It's FFA pvp any time anywhere as soon as you 24 hrs of noob protection wears off. That's 24 hrs of play time not 24 hrs from the first time you log in. However, the game is not so crowded that you are running into pkers all the time, especially once you get out of the starting areas. At the same time, many of the people I have run into have been quite helpful rather than just pking me on site. Yes, there are those that have done that, but I really thought it would be way worse. I am still new to the game so I am not sure of all the ins and outs, but it's kept me more interested than any other game I have recently tried. There are also a bunch of threads on this site describing how DFO is PvE not PvP. I'm don't think I agree with that, but there is plenty of pve in the game and more on the way. At least give the free trial a shot so you can see what it's like to have mobs see you from far away, start shooting you, lure you into their buddies, call more of their friends, flee from you etc. It's a fun experience. Although I am sure others will probably soon follow this post tell you how it is the worst experience ever. To each his own though.
Steam: Neph
I heard there is a lot of problems with lag now that they have gone to one server. I did try this game with the free trial and played a monk. I was surprised on the challenge the game offered. I just couldn't wade in to a bunch of mobs and slay them all.
I decided not to sub due to never seeing anyone.
That is almost impossible to balance and also difficult not to become road blocks for players who want to get around. There is a reason why all the challenging content resides in dungeons.
Even in raid content the PvE is piss easy. Why? Because the NPC's will NEVER surprise you, they always do the same over and over . You might whipe a few times just to know what the boss can/will do and after that it's just a drill. What PvE needs is some random skills/abilities used by the mobs. Something that doesn't always happen and happens at random moments during the encounter, so you will never expect it and it will require you to improvise and adapt, thus using your brains.
Fere libenter homines id quod volunt credunt.
Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress.
You're suggesting some level of A.I. Aion had this with the balaur, they chose to either attack you or leave you alone.... if we could get a company that could expand upon that, and they uncertainty of "Monsters" in MMO's i think it would really bring the worlds to life..... Will this wolf aggro me?? he's looking at me... growling, do i step forward and aggro, or do i back up and he leaves me alone...... I really think if a developer did this it would raise the bar for PVE content and really breath some life into the MMO indurstry.
I was not suggesting that raiding was hard only challenging in learning a script for a boss with 24 others.
seriously just try out darkfall, it is the most challenging pve gameplay that you will find in any MMO out there at the moment, it's leaps and bounds above the rest.
even if you don't like the game, you might as well try it out just to check out the mechanics...
mobs detect you if you are in a view and crouching allows you to get closer, they go in and out of ranged / cast spells etc. you get the loot that they are actually using / carrying (for the most part).
like I said though, don't go into it with the idea of being the best at pvp or grinding the most efficient way and you'll have tons of fun.
you can explore for days (not just hours or minutes or, like most newer games along a path) you will stumble upon differen't mobs and scenery all around.
don't use a map or anything and it could be even more entertaining.
you can really make the game into an exploration / pve game if you choose to... you might get ganked (not often, relatively), but that just makes the pve even more exciting with an extra challenge.
anyways, go for it and let us know.... just don't get sucked into killing 200 of the same mob if you want to have fun.
edit: oh and theres always the kraken you fight from a giant ship
"In life we are all turds, some sink and some float but in the end we all get flushed."
"you can explore for days (not just hours or minutes or, like most newer games along a path) you will stumble upon differen't mobs and scenery all around...don't use a map or anything and it could be even more entertaining...you can really make the game into an exploration / pve game if you choose to... you might get ganked (not often, relatively), but that just makes the pve even more exciting with an extra challenge."
This is part of the problem with PvE in a lot of games. It's all railroaded and convenient. Maps and little hillocks for mountains. A fantasy MMO with a real Map full of difficult terrain, dangerous creatures and no map would certainly up the challenge of PvEnvironment.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
I totally agree and i'm a huge proponent of immersive environments.
I don't really want to go into a rant on how game worlds are nothing like worlds anymore. I feel like the whole draw towards MMO's is entering another dimension and the art of exploration has been lost, sadly.
Anyways, if you haven't tried Darkfall, I'd give it a go just for the seem-less world and pve for the low price of a free trial.
you can get a decent amount of satisfaction out of that without ever being bothered by the "need to compete in pvp" mindset that has plagued the game.
edit: we as gamers have been forced through a little whole for the past 7 years or so. I just think about when the last time was that the majority of (mmo) gamers have loaded into a new world and just picked a direction and started running.
the problem is that 2 situations exist:
1.) the on rails experience - you log on and are forced down a path.
2.) the open world experience - you log on and force yourself down a path (the path of "efficiency")
the solution is:
when you actually get presented with a game that allows you to step more than 3 pixels in 4 directions, we need to break out of our own boxes and let go of the search for manufactured rewards.
Edit 2:
I don't know about you guys, but I would rather spend my time finding a challenging monster in a cave that I found while running towards a distant mountain hours from the nearest populated town, than gain a 'bubble' of xp killing a rat with the same skill rotation that was sitting in a spawn of 4 other rats, 2 feet away from the last spawn of 4 rats one level bellow them. (<---- poorly worded run on sentence for the purpose of highlighting the tedium written about)
"In life we are all turds, some sink and some float but in the end we all get flushed."
Perhaps he's trying to tell us he hasn't played WOW in over 5 years. Nowadays tank specs are perfectly capable of leveling solo; they're just slow.
I mean, you're a tank. You don't take damage quickly. This gives you tons of time to react to anything that's happening to you, which makes things rather easy.
The only hard part is knowing how many mobs to pull at once. That, or being ganked while pulling a large group.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
slow =/= hard
"In life we are all turds, some sink and some float but in the end we all get flushed."
That would be interesting and I sure would give it a go. As for Darkfall I might give it a try after this weekend. This weekend we get to play Aion for free so going to do that. The PVE is pretty good and can have a good challenge. It's to bad they short changed on the content because if the last 30 levels was like the first 20 levels my wife and I would still be playing.
I heard some bosses were really hard/impossible to beat in FFIX. But the thing is, this is pretty much endgame. I don't know how the rest of the game is, and FFIV is almost here too....
At this point might as well wait for FF14. It is one of the future games I have a little hope that I might get what I want in a PVE game.
FFIX = Final fantasy 9 which was on the PS1 and not and MMO
FFIV = Final Fantasy 4 which was on the SNES i don't even thnk there where mmo's back then.
what you MEANT to say is FFXI and FFXIV..
There's the sense of exploration of a world, as well as the exchange of information between players concerning that world that makes it interesting and valuable. Otherwise as you say it's kill ten rats in a nondescript area and move on to the next "ride".
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem