Please please please let this be nothing like EVE....
I'm sure it will be very similar to EvE (except with avatars). Every developing company has a certain "style" - Cryptic, Bioware, Anet, Blizzard, etc. If you want to get an idea of what a future game may be like, odds are you can look to a company's past developments for a clue on how their new project may turn out.
So I am fairly certain that WoD will have alot of aspects of EvE - which I think will be awesome.
I agree with alot of what people have been saying throughout this. This game CANNOT be a WoW clone or anything close to it... it CANNOT be quest based in terms of "go here and kill and collect this". THIS game, if done correctly, will be the Sandbox game I will play, all the other Sandbox games are, in one word, horrific, in my opinion. That said though, I'll say again that it can't be anywhere near what WoW is.
One of the most intriguing aspects of this is the fact that you can pretty much count on CCP bringing expansions with AT LEAST Werewolf: The Apocalypse, and possibly Mage: The Ascension. Werewolf is a no-brainer. After they get their player base with The Masquerade set in stone to the people who adore this game, they'll hit us with at least one of these expansions.
Again, a Sandbox game that is social based to the extent that the PnP games are will be quite an awsome experience. I have a feeling CCP will bring their genre breaking features over from Eve, and combine them with some new ones that fit the White Wolf mold. While I never could get into EVE, I've always liked the concept and have tried it multiple times, but there was just something about it that I couldn't manage to stay in touch with. This game world, on the other hand, will be one that I'm already familiar with, so the concepts that are in EVE that I like will be that much better in this game for me.
I think it's a little to early to say whether or not the game-play will be similar to EVE. While I highly doubt CCP would leave their sandbox formula behind. I thought the same about Turbine, when they took over development for LOTRO, as that game was orginally going to be a sandbox. Yet it turned out exactly like WOW (for the most part) after they got their hands on the IP.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
My only problem with the game so far is that it continues to be labled the "World of Darkness" MMO when in actuality it is a Vampire: the Masquerade MMO. Certainly it is set in the WoD, but it is lacking many of the other "factions" that make up the world. Personally I was hoping for werewolves as playable characters far more than vampires. Either way I am still excited despite my mild disappointment.
Huh??? You have a lot of assumptions in there that has not been verified by CCP. Far as I know they have said zip about factions. Maybe before you jump the gun with whines, you should wait for more information!
"Please please please let this be nothing like EVE...." Go play your boring SWTOR or Wow. It will be very similar to Eve, there will be no easy buttons to push.
CCP also has a reputation for being somewhat "hardcore" - anyone every see their music video? So I expect WoD to be fairly unforgiving with consequences to one's actions.
If it ends up like EVE in terms of lack of content, I won't end up playing it. As much as I love the WoD setting, I couldn't stand EVE. There's a difference between giving your players freedom and being too damn lazy to develop content.
Honest question here but did you even read the article you're commenting on where it specifically mentions that the title in your linked article is highly misleading, or did you just see the topic of the post and respond without reading?
If it ends up like EVE in terms of lack of content, I won't end up playing it. As much as I love the WoD setting, I couldn't stand EVE. There's a difference between giving your players freedom and being too damn lazy to develop content.
What content is it missing exactly? Keep in mind it's not meant to be a linear, questing game.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Is this a World of Darkness game or a Vampire: the Masquerade game? I played some WoD PnP RPGs in the 90's, but I hate the Vampire game. I played Werewolf, and then when it came out, switched to Mage. I don't see anything in these links but Vampire stuff.
CCP said it would be Vampire: Masq initially (heavy stress on that "initially")
As long as it's on it's own rule set server it is fine with me.
CCP have nailed their colours to the Single Server Model mast. It's pretty much their signature theme. I would be amazed if WoD has multiple servers at launch. The nearest I could see to that happening is maybe seperate servers for future Werewolf/Mage/etc WoD "expansions".
What you you will probably see is zome-gradiated rules of engagement, like the high-sec/lo-sec/0.0 in EVE. Ranging from Elysium (hi-sec) to some kind of hybrid (no permadeath, restricted PvP) to "the wilds" (full PvP). Permadeath might well be a consequence for "antisocial" behaviour.
Perma death, lol. Think of every single time you've randomly died because of someone else's actions. Is it more than once? You just lost everything. Dumbest idea ever.
Perma death, lol. Think of every single time you've randomly died because of someone else's actions. Is it more than once? You just lost everything. Dumbest idea ever.
It's totally dependant upon mechanics. If it was a standard mmo, with standard gameplay and grind then yes, perma death wouldn't work.
If however the mechanics are right, or there is a relative risk/reward ratio for it then it certainly can work.
PS - oh and not very often as I don't tend to run in scrub PUG's.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
They finally announced it! good stuff. I have a cousin that worked on EVE he told me to keep my eyes open for this. i never played the PnP but a guy i worked with almost shit his pants when i told him they're making a game.
I would love me some permadeath, hardcore diablo 2 anyone? makes ganking way more fun. I agree if you work it in right i think it'd be awesome, you know someone says to you 'go to X zone and i wont have your back this time' and there you go permadeath is setup
Please please please let this be nothing like EVE....
I'm sure it will be very similar to EvE (except with avatars). Every developing company has a certain "style" - Cryptic, Bioware, Anet, Blizzard, etc. If you want to get an idea of what a future game may be like, odds are you can look to a company's past developments for a clue on how their new project may turn out.
So I am fairly certain that WoD will have alot of aspects of EvE - which I think will be awesome.
A system with perma death could be cool. I like the idea of perma death bounties for distruptive players.
Also like to idea of perma death for players who take on leadership roles. I am thinking guild members trying to protect their leader and others trying to assinate leaders at the same time.
Another option would be to have the choice when you create your character to have perma death but in return for accepting risk you have special bonuses and are able to learn much faster. Something like your character is 1.75 a normal character and caps out with 2 days grinding. This way it is not a total loss when you die but you still have to plan out how and when you PVP.
* I read most of what Jon Wood writes * He needs more bullet points though
I think perma-death could be a possible mechanic, a difficult one to flesh out, granted, but if I could choose any company to design the process then CCP would be at the top of my list.
My view:
As a previous poster noted it would be advantageous to allow for some of the time and effort you had invested in the now dead character to pass on to your next incarnation. Perhaps some sort of system to sire a npc fledgling and the ability to tutor it before you assume its identity.
If it was implemented, I'm sure that killing another player permanently would be a seperate action to defeating them in PvP similar to the way that Darkfall has a 'Gank' action so that technical issues wouldn't cause any heartaches or, at least, would keep them to a minimum. However, it might also be wise to incorporate a seriously high penalty or punishment for killing another permanently so as to deter rampant and chaotic slaughter by throw-away griefing characters.
As a tribute for keeping the peace between the bloodlines the Camarilla could demand a blood sacrifice as punishment for permanently killing another vampire requiring a group of players to offer up one of their own members to foot the bill (a character of similar prestige of course and, naturally, one that is freely choosing to make the sacrifice). Maybe to 'unlock' use of the action the organisation of players would have to arrange with a Camarilla npc and have it approved beforehand who would be exchanged for the target.
An eye for an eye type of system - you kill one of theirs permanently and one of yours of equal or greater value dies permanently.
It would be a risky decision to implement such a system and it would need to be as close to air-tight as possible to avoid exploitation and the backlash that would follow but I wait to be amazed if CCP decide to tackle the problem of bringing perma-death to the mainstream of MMORPGs.
Perma death, lol. Think of every single time you've randomly died because of someone else's actions. Is it more than once? You just lost everything. Dumbest idea ever.
Guess some people have never played VTM:B. I would like a perma death system that had structure....i.e. break the masquerade 5 times and you are punished by final death. This makes characters think and not act like zombies. Perma death doesn't mean you have to die in PvP combat. Perhaps they use a LOTRO esque system and call it retreat. So if you are defeated in most PvP battles you just retreat and heal up. However, break the core rules of the masquerade and your character is fried. Seems fair to me. Maybe the Prince let's you create a childe before final death....this becomes your new character with all the money from the old one.
For those not aware breaking the masquerade meant feeding in public or any show of vampiric powers...increase speed, strength, or blood magic. Anything that would let a human know you were supernatural. I would very much welcome that part. That way you need see city zones with vampires running around sucking the blood of every available human to boost their power.
I really don't know much about the IP but the thought of permadeath really has me intrigued, so I wanted to share a couple thoughts I had on how it might work. Please flame me openly if you want, it's a whole lot better then keeping your hate inside.
General PvE - toon loses enough life to become incapacitated, returns to faction house or spawnpoint
Boss PvE - Boss may perform killing blow to incapacitated player, deathblow takes 5-10 seconds, player can respawn to avoid deathblow but can't rejoin fight.
PvP - a player of higher rank may perform a deathblow on an opposing faction lower rank player, if a player permakills a player, the dead players faction has a contract for vengence on the offending player and any rank player within the faction may perform a deathblow on said player. Higher rank player may have the ability to take vengence on the offending players superiors.
Players may be kicked from a faction to avert retribution from another faction, the player never loses the contract until it's fulfilled or payed out via cash or service.
Banhammer - GM takes the offending players head and puts it on a spike, anytime the player logs in, they can only pick that toon, and the only ability they have is to talk to people that come within 10' . All the other players are able to pick up rotten garbage from the street and throw it at the banned player for points.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I think perma-death could be a possible mechanic, a difficult one to flesh out, granted, but if I could choose any company to design the process then CCP would be at the top of my list.
My view:
As a previous poster noted it would be advantageous to allow for some of the time and effort you had invested in the now dead character to pass on to your next incarnation. Perhaps some sort of system to sire a npc fledgling and the ability to tutor it before you assume its identity.
If it was implemented, I'm sure that killing another player permanently would be a seperate action to defeating them in PvP similar to the way that Darkfall has a 'Gank' action so that technical issues wouldn't cause any heartaches or, at least, would keep them to a minimum. However, it might also be wise to incorporate a seriously high penalty or punishment for killing another permanently so as to deter rampant and chaotic slaughter by throw-away griefing characters.
As a tribute for keeping the peace between the bloodlines the Camarilla could demand a blood sacrifice as punishment for permanently killing another vampire requiring a group of players to offer up one of their own members to foot the bill (a character of similar prestige of course and, naturally, one that is freely choosing to make the sacrifice). Maybe to 'unlock' use of the action the organisation of players would have to arrange with a Camarilla npc and have it approved beforehand who would be exchanged for the target.
An eye for an eye type of system - you kill one of theirs permanently and one of yours of equal or greater value dies permanently.
It would be a risky decision to implement such a system and it would need to be as close to air-tight as possible to avoid exploitation and the backlash that would follow but I wait to be amazed if CCP decide to tackle the problem of bringing perma-death to the mainstream of MMORPGs.
Wow, killer idea on how to possibly take care of that.
If it ends up like EVE in terms of lack of content, I won't end up playing it. As much as I love the WoD setting, I couldn't stand EVE. There's a difference between giving your players freedom and being too damn lazy to develop content.
If by content you mean, "Please tell me what to do because otherwise I'll just sit here and spin in circles", I hope not. I'm tired of games made for people too lazy to actually play. Go watch a movie if you don't want to have to do anything.
Did they mention anything about monster play? It would be kinda cool if your faction controled an area if you were given an optional monster character to play only in that area. If the area switched control the control of the monsters would switch too.
* I read most of what Jon Wood writes * He needs more bullet points though
Comments
I'm sure it will be very similar to EvE (except with avatars). Every developing company has a certain "style" - Cryptic, Bioware, Anet, Blizzard, etc. If you want to get an idea of what a future game may be like, odds are you can look to a company's past developments for a clue on how their new project may turn out.
So I am fairly certain that WoD will have alot of aspects of EvE - which I think will be awesome.
I agree with alot of what people have been saying throughout this. This game CANNOT be a WoW clone or anything close to it... it CANNOT be quest based in terms of "go here and kill and collect this". THIS game, if done correctly, will be the Sandbox game I will play, all the other Sandbox games are, in one word, horrific, in my opinion. That said though, I'll say again that it can't be anywhere near what WoW is.
One of the most intriguing aspects of this is the fact that you can pretty much count on CCP bringing expansions with AT LEAST Werewolf: The Apocalypse, and possibly Mage: The Ascension. Werewolf is a no-brainer. After they get their player base with The Masquerade set in stone to the people who adore this game, they'll hit us with at least one of these expansions.
Again, a Sandbox game that is social based to the extent that the PnP games are will be quite an awsome experience. I have a feeling CCP will bring their genre breaking features over from Eve, and combine them with some new ones that fit the White Wolf mold. While I never could get into EVE, I've always liked the concept and have tried it multiple times, but there was just something about it that I couldn't manage to stay in touch with. This game world, on the other hand, will be one that I'm already familiar with, so the concepts that are in EVE that I like will be that much better in this game for me.
I think it's a little to early to say whether or not the game-play will be similar to EVE. While I highly doubt CCP would leave their sandbox formula behind. I thought the same about Turbine, when they took over development for LOTRO, as that game was orginally going to be a sandbox. Yet it turned out exactly like WOW (for the most part) after they got their hands on the IP.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Huh??? You have a lot of assumptions in there that has not been verified by CCP. Far as I know they have said zip about factions. Maybe before you jump the gun with whines, you should wait for more information!
"Please please please let this be nothing like EVE...." Go play your boring SWTOR or Wow. It will be very similar to Eve, there will be no easy buttons to push.
CCP also has a reputation for being somewhat "hardcore" - anyone every see their music video? So I expect WoD to be fairly unforgiving with consequences to one's actions.
Yes let's hope it's nothing like the deepest, most involved, community driven mmo on the market. God I hope it's another WoW clone....
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
As long as it's on it's own rule set server it is fine with me.Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
Got damn it Twilight!!!! See what you done?!?!!!!!
Its the High School Musical plague, all over again!!!!
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
If it ends up like EVE in terms of lack of content, I won't end up playing it. As much as I love the WoD setting, I couldn't stand EVE. There's a difference between giving your players freedom and being too damn lazy to develop content.
http://kalex.org
Cheers,
Jon Wood
Managing Editor
MMORPG.com
What content is it missing exactly? Keep in mind it's not meant to be a linear, questing game.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
CCP said it would be Vampire: Masq initially (heavy stress on that "initially")
Give me liberty or give me lasers
CCP have nailed their colours to the Single Server Model mast. It's pretty much their signature theme. I would be amazed if WoD has multiple servers at launch. The nearest I could see to that happening is maybe seperate servers for future Werewolf/Mage/etc WoD "expansions".
What you you will probably see is zome-gradiated rules of engagement, like the high-sec/lo-sec/0.0 in EVE. Ranging from Elysium (hi-sec) to some kind of hybrid (no permadeath, restricted PvP) to "the wilds" (full PvP). Permadeath might well be a consequence for "antisocial" behaviour.
We'll see.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Perma death, lol. Think of every single time you've randomly died because of someone else's actions. Is it more than once? You just lost everything. Dumbest idea ever.
It's totally dependant upon mechanics. If it was a standard mmo, with standard gameplay and grind then yes, perma death wouldn't work.
If however the mechanics are right, or there is a relative risk/reward ratio for it then it certainly can work.
PS - oh and not very often as I don't tend to run in scrub PUG's.
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
They finally announced it! good stuff. I have a cousin that worked on EVE he told me to keep my eyes open for this. i never played the PnP but a guy i worked with almost shit his pants when i told him they're making a game.
I would love me some permadeath, hardcore diablo 2 anyone? makes ganking way more fun. I agree if you work it in right i think it'd be awesome, you know someone says to you 'go to X zone and i wont have your back this time' and there you go permadeath is setup
Yes
A system with perma death could be cool. I like the idea of perma death bounties for distruptive players.
Also like to idea of perma death for players who take on leadership roles. I am thinking guild members trying to protect their leader and others trying to assinate leaders at the same time.
Another option would be to have the choice when you create your character to have perma death but in return for accepting risk you have special bonuses and are able to learn much faster. Something like your character is 1.75 a normal character and caps out with 2 days grinding. This way it is not a total loss when you die but you still have to plan out how and when you PVP.
* I read most of what Jon Wood writes
* He needs more bullet points though
I think perma-death could be a possible mechanic, a difficult one to flesh out, granted, but if I could choose any company to design the process then CCP would be at the top of my list.
My view:
As a previous poster noted it would be advantageous to allow for some of the time and effort you had invested in the now dead character to pass on to your next incarnation. Perhaps some sort of system to sire a npc fledgling and the ability to tutor it before you assume its identity.
If it was implemented, I'm sure that killing another player permanently would be a seperate action to defeating them in PvP similar to the way that Darkfall has a 'Gank' action so that technical issues wouldn't cause any heartaches or, at least, would keep them to a minimum. However, it might also be wise to incorporate a seriously high penalty or punishment for killing another permanently so as to deter rampant and chaotic slaughter by throw-away griefing characters.
As a tribute for keeping the peace between the bloodlines the Camarilla could demand a blood sacrifice as punishment for permanently killing another vampire requiring a group of players to offer up one of their own members to foot the bill (a character of similar prestige of course and, naturally, one that is freely choosing to make the sacrifice). Maybe to 'unlock' use of the action the organisation of players would have to arrange with a Camarilla npc and have it approved beforehand who would be exchanged for the target.
An eye for an eye type of system - you kill one of theirs permanently and one of yours of equal or greater value dies permanently.
It would be a risky decision to implement such a system and it would need to be as close to air-tight as possible to avoid exploitation and the backlash that would follow but I wait to be amazed if CCP decide to tackle the problem of bringing perma-death to the mainstream of MMORPGs.
Guess some people have never played VTM:B. I would like a perma death system that had structure....i.e. break the masquerade 5 times and you are punished by final death. This makes characters think and not act like zombies. Perma death doesn't mean you have to die in PvP combat. Perhaps they use a LOTRO esque system and call it retreat. So if you are defeated in most PvP battles you just retreat and heal up. However, break the core rules of the masquerade and your character is fried. Seems fair to me. Maybe the Prince let's you create a childe before final death....this becomes your new character with all the money from the old one.
For those not aware breaking the masquerade meant feeding in public or any show of vampiric powers...increase speed, strength, or blood magic. Anything that would let a human know you were supernatural. I would very much welcome that part. That way you need see city zones with vampires running around sucking the blood of every available human to boost their power.
I really don't know much about the IP but the thought of permadeath really has me intrigued, so I wanted to share a couple thoughts I had on how it might work. Please flame me openly if you want, it's a whole lot better then keeping your hate inside.
General PvE - toon loses enough life to become incapacitated, returns to faction house or spawnpoint
Boss PvE - Boss may perform killing blow to incapacitated player, deathblow takes 5-10 seconds, player can respawn to avoid deathblow but can't rejoin fight.
PvP - a player of higher rank may perform a deathblow on an opposing faction lower rank player, if a player permakills a player, the dead players faction has a contract for vengence on the offending player and any rank player within the faction may perform a deathblow on said player. Higher rank player may have the ability to take vengence on the offending players superiors.
Players may be kicked from a faction to avert retribution from another faction, the player never loses the contract until it's fulfilled or payed out via cash or service.
Banhammer - GM takes the offending players head and puts it on a spike, anytime the player logs in, they can only pick that toon, and the only ability they have is to talk to people that come within 10' . All the other players are able to pick up rotten garbage from the street and throw it at the banned player for points.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
Wow, killer idea on how to possibly take care of that.
If by content you mean, "Please tell me what to do because otherwise I'll just sit here and spin in circles", I hope not. I'm tired of games made for people too lazy to actually play. Go watch a movie if you don't want to have to do anything.
Did they mention anything about monster play? It would be kinda cool if your faction controled an area if you were given an optional monster character to play only in that area. If the area switched control the control of the monsters would switch too.
* I read most of what Jon Wood writes
* He needs more bullet points though
monster play? there is nothing BUT monster play in World of Darkness