The Localization Consensus

zaffa

http://darkfallce.webs.com/TLC.htm

A system designed to regionalize banking/transportation within Darkfall while still appealing to both the globalization and localization crowds. A lot of discussion has gone into it, and as always, more critqueing is welcome.



I hope that this system can finally show that it is possible to meet the needs and request of both parties, while still adding a proper system of regionalization into the game.



For those who are curious, this list list has been agreed upon by many of DF's strongest localization AND anti-localization advocates. It is also being sent off to the Dev's for their next scrub meeting. Please leave comments below for any comments on this document.

alazyguy

So... Alfar are fucked.

Annwyn

Originally posted by alazyguy

So... Alfar are fucked.

Why would they be?

alazyguy

C. Starter Cities Starter cities would remain globalized as they are now. In otherwords, an item could be withdrawn from them regardless of where it was deposited. Example: An item could be withdrawable from Heart of Eanna regardless of where it was deposited.

 

In addition, this promotes ARAC.

Omali

Originally posted by alazyguy

C. Starter Cities Starter cities would remain globalized as they are now. In otherwords, an item could be withdrawn from them regardless of where it was deposited. Example: An item could be withdrawable from Heart of Eanna regardless of where it was deposited.

 

In addition, this promotes ARAC.

Ayn Rand's Anti-Colonialism?

alazyguy

Originally posted by Omali

Originally posted by alazyguy

C. Starter Cities Starter cities would remain globalized as they are now. In otherwords, an item could be withdrawn from them regardless of where it was deposited. Example: An item could be withdrawable from Heart of Eanna regardless of where it was deposited.

 

In addition, this promotes ARAC.

Ayn Rand's Anti-Colonialism?

Hm?

Also, the suggested moon-gates are capital based.

Alfar is the only one in its racial alliance.

Gdemami

Most of the proposed changes looks alright or at least something solid to start with.

However, imo, it won't deal with root of the issue that is one of the main features of the game but also the major flaw - FFA PVP environment.

FFA PVP is hindering economy in the first place.

Dragim

Somewhat reminds me of american politics.  The most powerful/well known people believe something is good for the majority of the population and attempt to put it into effect.

Badaboom

Originally posted by Gdemami

Most of the proposed changes looks alright or at least something solid to start with.

However, imo, it won't deal with root of the issue that is one of the main features of the game but also the major flaw - FFA PVP environment.

FFA PVP is hindering economy in the first place.

How so?  Darkfall's economy is great right now.  Lots of trading &  player vendors.  Even player run events like the trade fairs.

CactusJack

I like it. I have been a proponent of localized banking from the beginning. Global banking allows you to sneak in someone's city, kill people, and quickly bank all their stuff before you die. I think that is idiotic. Regional banking should increase trade. An AH or something like that is necessary.

I think there will be some backlash from peeps that feel the spirit of a FFA PvP game will be compromised if you eliminate global banking. I think there are alot of people that like that you can go anywhere, rape/pillage and stash your stuff before the inevitable naked zerg starts. I don't necessary disagree with that, but regional banking and more importantly, LOCALIZED materials/enchants will really change the dynamic of DF.

I think it's well worth it. If they would just stop all the damn bunny hopping idiotcy, i would return.

Kien

Lots of good ideas at http://darkfallce.webs.com/

However, there is a problem. You're assuming that the Darkfall developers would be interested in making the proposed changes, but from what I've seen they are unable or unwilling to change the game. You're pissing in the wind. I am sorry to sound negative and trollish, but that is what I believe.

Gdemami

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Originally posted by Badaboom

How so?  Darkfall's economy is great right now.  Lots of trading &  player vendors.  Even player run events like the trade fairs.

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How do you measure it to say it is 'great'?

If anything, organizing trade fairs as a support for trading shows the opposite. If the trade was fine, it there would be no need for any fairs, they would be pointless.

Unrestricted FFA PVP hinders the trading. It directly affects the trade amount and volumes, being it due risk for traders and customers as well as risk for 'host' of the trade center.

Imo, it opens up great opportunity for devs to implement new mechanics that would enforce player ownership over the land and expand the game on whole new level, rising the game from the 'dust' of PVP game into a real sandbox.

But I agree with Kien that Aventurine is unable or unwilling to take that route. Not that they should or anything, just the game will not move from the dead end the game currently is, imo.

Annwyn

Originally posted by Gdemami

 

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Originally posted by Badaboom



How so?  Darkfall's economy is great right now.  Lots of trading &  player vendors.  Even player run events like the trade fairs.

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How do you measure it to say it is 'great'?

If anything, organizing trade fairs as a support for trading shows the opposite. If the trade was fine, it there would be no need for any fairs, they would be pointless.

 

Unrestricted FFA PVP hinders the trading. It directly affects the trade amount and volumes, being it due risk for traders and customers as well as risk for 'host' of the trade center.

Imo, it opens up great opportunity for devs to implement new mechanics that would enforce player ownership over the land and expand the game on whole new level, rising the game from the 'dust' of PVP game into a real sandbox.

But I agree with Kien that Aventurine is unable or unwilling to take that route. Not that they should or anything, just the game will not move from the dead end the game currently is, imo.

The FFA PvP aspect isn't what hinders Trading, otherwise players would've created some sort of trade hubs by themselves long ago. What's really killing everything is Global Banking, Instant Travel, No Localized Ressources and, to a lesser extent, lack of variety in materials.  The ability to move from one part of the map to another to grab ressources and teleport backs makes no sense. It allow players to move at no risks, farm anything they want, and move back at no risk, and not only that, it's very fast. 

 

To Badaboom: Tell that to any person who is knowledgable in economics and he will laugh at you. The current economy in DarkFall is horrible.

 

To Kien. I'd have to agree with you, but this "The Localization Consensus" is simply a list of suggestions, like any other, made by the players to the Devs. The main difference being the amount of people who vote for it. That said, it's still up to the Devs to decide and it doesn't seem like they plan to go "Local", but a man can dream :P

Gdemami

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Originally posted by MadnessRealm
What's really killing everything is Global Banking, Instant Travel, No Localized Ressources and, to a lesser extent, lack of variety in materials.  The ability to move from one part of the map to another to grab ressources and teleport backs makes no sense. It allow players to move at no risks, farm anything they want, and move back at no risk, and not only that, it's very fast. 

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On the contrary. Those 'features' and mechanics help the goods to flow smoother, they make for better market and trading.

Trade hubs are natural evolution of exchange systems. The only difference is how 'big' this market will be. Market cannot go well when traders and customers are under fire and risk of losing all their goods.

DarthRaiden

Originally posted by Gdemami

 

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Originally posted by MadnessRealm

What's really killing everything is Global Banking, Instant Travel, No Localized Ressources and, to a lesser extent, lack of variety in materials.  The ability to move from one part of the map to another to grab ressources and teleport backs makes no sense. It allow players to move at no risks, farm anything they want, and move back at no risk, and not only that, it's very fast. 

---

On the contrary. Those 'features' and mechanics help the goods to flow smoother, they make for better market and trading.

Trade hubs are natural evolution of exchange systems. The only difference is how 'big' this market will be. Market cannot go well when traders and customers are under fire and risk of losing all their goods.

FFA PvP doesn't hinder trade. There are interests and greements that drive the market. Free means there is a choice ..a trade can be disturbed but if its in the intrest of players and clans they won't disturb a trade.  Even enemy's in war have entered enemy city and traded.. How often you you read in alliance chat..."player x will enter our city for a trade please don't attack"..

Its player-driven  and trading is one of those things that has been put under full player made rules in Darkfall (for example guarding the newbie zone hasn't --and i think is because of players lacking  interest   to govern that area contrary to trades)

of course some exceptions and fail gone trades proves the rule.

 

Gdemami

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Originally posted by DarthRaiden
How often you you read in alliance chat..."player x will enter our city for a trade please don't attack"..
 

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If need to announce your arrival to 'trade hub' isn't hindering market and trade, I do not know what else is...

It is prime example why unrestricted FFA PVP is stupid concept as it represents tedious burden of routines placed on player shoulders.

It is the restrictions and rules that promotes freedom, not their lack of.

DarthRaiden

Originally posted by Gdemami

 

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Originally posted by DarthRaiden

How often you you read in alliance chat..."player x will enter our city for a trade please don't attack"..

 

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If need to announce your arrival to 'trade hub' isn't hindering market and trade, I do not know what else is...

It is prime example why unrestricted FFA PVP is stupid concept as it represents tedious burden of routines placed on player shoulders.

 

It is the restrictions and rules that promotes freedom, not their lack of.

Sure it has to be announced, players govern the world ..the trade is player driven ...Darkfall promotes freedom..

It is an exciting aspect. Traders have intrests , PvP have interest and   according to player driven situations and decisions the one or the other interest prevails..It is really a dream has come true in an MMORPG world in these regard..  

Gdemami

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Originally posted by DarthRaiden
It is really a dream has come true in an MMORPG world in these regard..  

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Agreed.

That is what makes dreams the dreams, they do not work in real world. Same as Darkfall.

The game is development is based on dreams rather than realistic perception.

thinktank001

I. Banking

A. Player Cites:   Localized only.  Logisitics should be a huge part of conquest and this is practically nullified with regional banking.  Vendors and housing would be offered here.

 

B. Chaos Cities:  Should just disappear.  If they want to add player housing, then they should offer areas that can built and protected outside player keeps.



C. Starter Cities:  Should be regional within each race's town.



D. Currency:  Localized only.



E. General Banking:  An item ledger could be added to a players journal.



F. Auction House:  4 regional AH/Trade hubs should be added that offer the ability to add a limited number of player/guild vendors that could be purchased by the highest bidder.   The AH would have a tax and player/guild vendors would be exempt. Locations would last for 2 week intervals.  

 II. Transportation & Communication

A. Runestones:  Disappear from the game.



B. Nexuses:  Implemented differently.  Portals that could be built into a wagon or large ship for sieging.  I think your limitations on the types of items that can be moved through them is appropriate, but I would also add a cool downtime to them.



C. Houses:  Implemented near player citys and hamlets. 



E. City Portals: Agree



F. System Messages:  Agree



G. Wagon Mount: Agree



H. Moon Gates:  Agree



I. Roads:  I would lower the speed bonus to 15% and reduce stamina loss by 50%



J. Ships:  Banking should be localized.  Banks should calculate a weight that reduces boat mobility and also holds ammo.  Cannons should have limited "clips" and require loading ( reload timer ).



K Removal of One Holding Siege Rule: Agree



L. Regionalized Resources: Agree

 

BuniontToes

There is no consensus on localized banking.  In fact AV has said that they tested lcoalized banking in early testing and It was tried, it was tested, and it was not fun.

Still.....

 

Av has said they will be making it so that enemies cannot bank in your city.  Not a bad change IMHO.

 

I never want to see auction houses int eh game, ever.  However, Av has hinted that they would like to add a feature to seatch player vendors which would be awesome.

xpiher

Originally posted by BuniontToes

 

I never want to see auction houses int eh game, ever.  However, Av has hinted that they would like to add a feature to seatch player vendors which would be awesome.

Which is all this system is.