Oh please. Now Rift's hype is a nonsense because we don't know about its end game? Is end game that important to you that you allow yourself to call out names for those who disagree or think Rift is a good game? I'm sorry, but you are trolling.
Nope I'm not, and you should refrain calling people "trolls" just because they don't share your idyllic view of a video game.
I'm simply neither blindly fanatic of this game, nor blindly bashing this game. I'm somewhere inbetween, and that's always the hardest role, since you get flamed by both sides.
Ah you are neither praising nor bashing. Where does a sentence such as 'We are still waiting to see that famous "endgame content". Until then, any hype is nonsensical fanboy talk.' stands in there? I explained why I think you are trolling, and it doesn't have to do with not sharing an idyllic view of a video game.
And perhaps you are 'getting flamed by both sides' because of your tone.
Oh please. Now Rift's hype is a nonsense because we don't know about its end game? Is end game that important to you that you allow yourself to call out names for those who disagree or think Rift is a good game? I'm sorry, but you are trolling.
Nope I'm not, and you should refrain calling people "trolls" just because they don't share your idyllic view of a video game.
I'm simply neither blindly fanatic of this game, nor blindly bashing this game. I'm somewhere inbetween, and that's always the hardest role, since you get flamed by both sides.
Ah you are neither praising nor bashing. Where does a sentence such as 'We are still waiting to see that famous "endgame content". Until then, any hype is nonsensical fanboy talk.' stands in there? I explained why I think you are trolling, and it doesn't have to do with not sharing an idyllic view of a video game.
And perhaps you are 'getting flamed by both sides' because of your tone.
I invite you to read how the diehard fans treat other people who dare say anything remotely negative about their new toy here before you judge whatever I say. And yes, praising content nobody has seen IS nonsensical - that's common sense.
But whatever - welcome to my ignore list, since you're doing exactly what you accuse me of - and that is "stirring the pot in hope to get negative reactions". And a friendly advice - be careful of the "pot calling the kettle black" syndrome.
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
You can't change someones opinion. The fans of this game will fight you to the end because your opinion is wrong (to them). This is why I hate these types of threads. If you dislike Rift, leave the forum or be constructive and bring up what they could do better. If you like rift, discuss ge mechanics and topics relevant to the actual gameplay. I'm starting to get tired of all this defending and attacking.
This was a good review. When I seen the "veteran" point of view in the topic, I sighed "Oh lord"... I myself am a Veteran to MMO's... But the OP has stated pretty much everything I feel about this game.
Good graphics, Good animations, Polished, Soul Tree is awesome, Rifts are fun and excciting.
PVP.. well I have done warfronts so far.. Was it fun? Yea it was mainly because I got to put to test my soul set up and see how it worked in a pvp setting.
I am hoping in this next beta to try my hand at some REAL open world pvp. I am on a pvp server so I hope it is heavily focused on PVP in the world.
Oh please. Now Rift's hype is a nonsense because we don't know about its end game? Is end game that important to you that you allow yourself to call out names for those who disagree or think Rift is a good game? I'm sorry, but you are trolling.
Nope I'm not, and you should refrain calling people "trolls" just because they don't share your idyllic view of a video game.
I'm simply neither blindly fanatic of this game, nor blindly bashing this game. I'm somewhere inbetween, and that's always the hardest role, since you get flamed by both sides.
You should refrain from calling everyone a fan boy. I didn't even think about rift until one day i get a beta key from a friend and say what the fuck it's worth a try.
I thought rift would be a fail EQ wannabe.. , but boy was i proven wrong when I actually got a chance to play this game.
Now I am very excited and cannot wait for release.
You can't change someones opinion. The fans of this game will fight you to the end because your opinion is wrong (to them). This is why I hate these types of threads. If you dislike Rift, leave the forum or be constructive and bring up what they could do better. If you like rift, discuss ge mechanics and topics relevant to the actual gameplay. I'm starting to get tired of all this defending and attacking.
Actually the OP made a good positive review about rift, then a few bad apples came in here to tell him that he should not be enjoying the game and it sucks.
I like rift, I think it is a great game and I will be playing it for a long time I am sure. Everyone does have their own tastes though.. What one person may consider fun, another person may consider a snooze fest. (You know what games I am talking about...***Hint**** It has manned space ships)
I invite you to read how the diehard fans treat other people who dare say anything remotely negative about their new toy here before you judge whatever I say. And yes, praising content nobody has seen IS nonsensical - that's common sense.
But whatever - welcome to my ignore list, since you're doing exactly what you accuse me of - and that is "stirring the pot in hope to get negative reactions". And a friendly advice - be careful of the "pot calling the kettle black" syndrome.
I would reply to any bad comments from a diehard the same way. It is not because you feel like diehard fans are treating people bad that it makes it right for you to do the same; it only make things worst. And since our exchange started, all you did was posting a 'NO U', without really explaining what you meant by that. Ah well.
You can't change someones opinion. The fans of this game will fight you to the end because your opinion is wrong (to them). This is why I hate these types of threads. If you dislike Rift, leave the forum or be constructive and bring up what they could do better. If you like rift, discuss ge mechanics and topics relevant to the actual gameplay. I'm starting to get tired of all this defending and attacking.
Actually the OP made a good positive review about rift, then a few bad apples came in here to tell him that he should not be enjoying the game and it sucks.
I like rift, I think it is a great game and I will be playing it for a long time I am sure. Everyone does have their own tastes though.. What one person may consider fun, another person may consider a snooze fest. (You know what games I am talking about...***Hint**** It has manned space ships)
It's come to the point of me not caring. If all were going to get is "is rift good or not" threads I might as well go back to the eve forum and get that thing up and started again (god knows it's been dead since I left).
Yep because jumping around from feralas to tanaris to hinterlands with half a quest log or quests that I had to grind XP to even do was my imagination. As an alliance player swamp of sorrows, thousand needles, feralas and (fuck I forget the name of the zone that had the mara instance in it) hard had any quests at all. Remember tryin to do hillsbrad as an alliance? Of course not because we had no quests... Remember Wpl? Don't accuse menof lying dude I played wow three straight years after release it's a fact that blizzard had a major quest flow problem in the game for both factions.
You mean that some areas were more faction specific? STOP THE PRESS!
Just like Rift then, actually... only Rift has way less variety. In Rift, each faction has only one leveling path through its specific areas. In WoW, each faction always has a choice of different areas while leveling.
I will pass on the other lies, like e.g. WPL lacking quests, which is a blatant lie. Thousand needles has a load of quests for level 30-35ish alliance chars too, even if it was a horde oriented area. Hillsbrad in Southshore had a ton of quests for alliance. Feralas was an area for both factions, alliance even had a side specific pet to gain there (fairy dragon) the horde couldn't get. Maybe you were just... bad at finding quests in that game? Then of course, I understand why you enjoy being "on rails" in Rift. If you played WoW three years and post such nonsense, you are either lieing to make Rift, your new toy, look better, or you were just play bad at playing WoW.
PS: I'm not a "Rift hater", I actually bought the Digital Collector edition for 60 Euros. The game will definitely be fun for a couple of months, but I don't see it keeping my attention for 6+ years like WoW has and still does, or even 2 or 3 years. It just lacks variety of content for that, even compared to other games at release like WoW of course, but also e.g. LOTRO. Grinding "random encounters" (aka pseudo-dynamic content) in the same old regions on my 3rd alt will get old very, very quickly.
The Korrigan, can you be honest and straight forward with me on this, did ever use quest helper in your play time in wow?
sorry if this more then a little off topic from the OP, but i need to ask it.
It's come to the point of me not caring. If all were going to get is "is rift good or not" threads I might as well go back to the eve forum and get that thing up and started again (god knows it's been dead since I left).
It's best just to ignore the threads altogether, because you are always going to have people saying that they think a game is good or bad for whatever reason.
You could start that eve thread and have like 10 different people telling you why they think it is boring.
It's come to the point of me not caring. If all were going to get is "is rift good or not" threads I might as well go back to the eve forum and get that thing up and started again (god knows it's been dead since I left).
It's best just to ignore the threads altogether, because you are always going to have people saying that they think a game is good or bad for whatever reason.
You could start that eve thread and have like 10 different people telling you why they think it is boring.
Once feb 24th comes im basically done with this place.
At one time i was a pretty good hater of games on this site. But I just dont understand why a game like rift that promotes group play through dynamic content is getting so much shit by this community.
With all the horrible games in this genre that basically push players into some lame instance or solo questing experience, this one thats finally doing what a lot of us asked for (group focused play) is getting shit on.
I mean so what if the game barrows mechanics for other games? Its a fucking group based mmo!!!
I mean would you really rather play WoW with its bullshit solo centric phasing that makes it impossible to see anyone else in the area if they arent on the same quest over a game that lets hundreds of players raid content together outside an instance???
Uggh... I give. Its true people really dont know what they want.
... You spent 6 years doing endgame. In rift you can do the same thing and you won't have to waist your time like you did with wow releveling becaus in rift a new class is only a respec away.
You do make a good point from a player's perspective. I, as a Rift player, can try any Cleric soul that I want just by respecing, I can change my play experience (as far as my character's abilities are concerned) around completely and try what may just as well be a new class and not lose any time investment at all
What I would like to get some thoughts on is whether or not the system that was just described is going to hurt the longevity of the game or not? In other mmos (including that big one that I won't mention) I have to invest so much more time if I want to try a new class and more time = more money = rich devs. Are people going to get burned out on RIft faster if they can try all the shiny toys easier or will this make people less frustrated?
I think that really depends on what Trion has in store for endgame. If they go more of a hybrid PvP/PvE route like Warhammer then perhaps not as much, but if it all comes down to gear grind for advancement (be it in warfronts or raids) then I absolutely see it hurting longevity. Making alts in WoW was something Blizz had in mind to keep people playing during content gaps I'd say as far back as TBC (think that was when it was a suggestion on the loading screens) and of course later on in WotLK when they added the account bound leveling gear.
In WoW I know of people who have leveled every class to cap, that amount of time in Rift would give a player a max level of every class on both factions. Alting won't be nearly the diversion in Rift that it has been in other games. Longevity will all come down to Rift's endgame- if it winds up copying the raid or die mentality of WoW and EQ1 I don't see it maintaining a great many subs.
I have to say Pierth, I like your post. This is the kind of conversation that forums are meant for.
I suppose what it really does come down to is the end game content, this is more important in Rift then in many other games because of the calss system. So, anybody have any comments on what the best way to implement end game content would be for a game like this?
It's come to the point of me not caring. If all were going to get is "is rift good or not" threads I might as well go back to the eve forum and get that thing up and started again (god knows it's been dead since I left).
It's best just to ignore the threads altogether, because you are always going to have people saying that they think a game is good or bad for whatever reason.
You could start that eve thread and have like 10 different people telling you why they think it is boring.
Once feb 24th comes im basically done with this place.
At one time i was a pretty good hater of games on this site. But I just dont understand why a game like rift that promotes group play through dynamic content is getting so much shit by this community.
...
Uggh... I give. Its true people really dont know what they want.
This will be the same mantra sung in every game forum that is close to release. Being around long enough you should know this by know. Heck the most positive forum I've seen here is the GW2 one and that one will become a pit of negativity as well once we get closer to its release.
It's difficult to say what kind of end game content should be added to a game like Rift. I do want a lot of content at the end, but they have to be careful with how they implement some of it. Instances and raids are probably going to be a basic cookie cutter type except changed a bit as normal. How was SWG's end game content? It was one of my favorite games, but I wasn't able to make it to the end game content before they changed it up. I heard it was a blast like the rest of the game was.
You can't change someones opinion. The fans of this game will fight you to the end because your opinion is wrong (to them). This is why I hate these types of threads. If you dislike Rift, leave the forum or be constructive and bring up what they could do better. If you like rift, discuss ge mechanics and topics relevant to the actual gameplay. I'm starting to get tired of all this defending and attacking.
I did just that with my blog and all you did was attack me, even though my blog did point out all the good in the game --- as well as the bad and the areas the developers need to work on. BTW I do like Rift. I do not hate it as you may imply. I might have my issues with the game, but I do not hate it...in fact I go so far as to say I think it will be one of the best games released this year. You know what your problem is Rock...you cannot stand anything remotely negative to be spoken about the game...doesn't matter if it is true or not. I made some valid points about the games sound, graphics(and not just squirrels) and gme play and all you focused on was attacking my appeal to the games designers to polish their game the way Blizzard's designers did...because of this you belittle my article and attack me.
You, despite your attempt, cannot defend the un-defendable. There are issues with the game Rift. You just can't seem to allow anyone to voice their concerns about those issues that they feel need addressed. That is the sign of an over zealous fan...the term most use is "fanboy".
Just as constructive critism and my own personal want, what do you see as negative for Rift? Trying to gather as much knowledge on the game as possible.
Once feb 24th comes im basically done with this place.
At one time i was a pretty good hater of games on this site. But I just dont understand why a game like rift that promotes group play through dynamic content is getting so much shit by this community.
...
Uggh... I give. Its true people really dont know what they want.
This will be the same mantra sung in every game forum that is close to release. Being around long enough you should know this by know. Heck the most positive forum I've seen here is the GW2 one and that one will become a pit of negativity as well once we get closer to its release.
I can garuntee you that when gw2 hits it will be a shitstorm of negative coming from that end aswell. This is one of those forums where people are never completely satisfied with anything. They claim to be looking for something new, but when a ne revolutionary game comes out it is also labeled as garbage for some reason or another. Honestly I think a few people on here are living in the past and hoping for a revamp of one of the games from the 90's early 2000's. When that comes out people will be complaining about how it is unoriginal or boring aswell.
Just as constructive critism and my own personal want, what do you see as negative for Rift? Trying to gather as much knowledge on the game as possible.
Just as constructive critism and my own personal want, what do you see as negative for Rift? Trying to gather as much knowledge on the game as possible.
Very nice writeup, fair and presenting goods and bads, I agree with most. I also understand why it's not popular among those who can't stand any critic about their new favorite game. You, like me, don't live in a black and white world, but a world full of shades of grey
Respect, walk, what did you say? Respect, walk Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me? - PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
I'll be preordering the game, with several of my former WoW and Conan guild mates. I cannot tell you if the game will last for any of us, but as of now its surpassed everything else we've tried in the past year and is finally allowing us to lay the world of Azeroth to rest, and that for us is great because we were pretty sick of that world. If your looking for revolutionary, your looking in the wrong place. If you just want a fun game in a new setting that does what you already know very well.. Rift is your game, as it stands in beta.
Very good review. I agree that Rift is a fun game. I have much more to learn about it, but this comment by William Murray rang true to me also:
Originally posted by William Murphy
Initially back on the Alpha server I was a bit saddened to find that Rift played largely like so many games before it. For some reason, though no one in the company had ever promised otherwise, I was expecting perhaps something a bit more unique in terms of how it played. That said, coming into the Beta 5, knowing that Rift is essentially a highly polished traditional fantasy MMORPG, I found myself enjoying the content much more.
I had mentioned before that am looking forward to Rift, SWTOR, and GW2 this year, and I would not have thought that I would have been excited for the familiar or what I’ve been accustom to. However, what Trion has done is delivered on what we are familiar with, polished it better, added a little more breadth and depth, and in addition to that new-car smell, that fun "I" remember having, or at least initially having, when I was trudging through the beginnings of WAR, that faded quickly, with this game Rift, that feeling of “fun” hasn’t ended.
On my PvE and PvP servers, I've tried them both, and they both appeal to myPvEvP mindset. Of course much more PvE oriented on the PvE server, but regardless of which one, the player-base interactivity has been refreshing. And while at level 30, I am still going through an identity crisis about what I want to mix and match in terms of the vast depth and breadth of character skill customization.
So in the short-bursts I've had, I still do find the game-play enticing and a dash of old-school, particularly on the PvP server. Though my expectation might be to just roll on a PvE server, because it seems that I can do everything, even PvP on a PvE server, but completely turn my switch off when my old and tired self succumbs to, well, being older. But I can still venture into the opposing factions town and try to take it over, and sure, they can sit back and watch me and friends, or they can take-up arms and drive me out. Same goes the other way. It’s a very flexible way of game-play.
Trion does everything very well, which is more than I can say about any other mmo in the last 6-years. Trion borrows very well from other games before it, and implements the content and mechanics very well, which lends value to the game-play. Heck, every mmo has borrowed from it's predecessors since MUD's. And with Rift, even by making PvE more engaging than any other mmo on the market, and contributing to the importance of community cooperation, PvE scale-ability based on population, the dynamic and story-interlaced aspects of it, vast breadth and depth of character development, all's good.
Sure I wish crafting was more robust, sure I wish Character Creation was more robust, sure I wish there was more emphasis on player-made goods as opposed to "Quest" items, but to name a few, those are some trade-offs.
Rift will do well, is my thought, and has earned a pre-order and will be about the only subscribed-to mmo, while I await to try their competition this year.
... I suppose what it really does come down to is the end game content, this is more important in Rift then in many other games because of the calss system. So, anybody have any comments on what the best way to implement end game content would be for a game like this?
I'd like to weigh in with a couple of suggestions and opinions.
Personally, I was a big fan of WoWs outdoor raid-bosses. Rifts, well, rifts makes for an interesting and natural way of adding quite a few of these (as has been suggested before). Fighting the other faction for these sounds like a lot of fun.
On the other hand, I'm not against instance-based raiding - although, with WoW, the constant rush and need to get them all done each week was a bit tedious. One idea is to put a limit on how many raiding instances can be completed per week. That way, you pick the ones that suit your guild better, you can mix it up each week, and it'll stave off the immediate need for new content (to some extent). This of course requires a large pool of instances to choose from (they don't have to be massiv 15-boss instances, but they have to be available from the get-go, otherwise you're screwed).
Variation of difficulty between them would be a big plus. Some players prefer the biggest challenge available to them - while others like the medium ones. The problem therein lies in catering to both at the same time. WoW sort of catered to both (after a while) with their achievement-system. You know, kill boss alpha by only using x item beta. It's not a bad system really. Choosing a whole different instance instead (thereby avoiding tuning the boss for more than one tactic) is just a different way to go. The problem is, that after all, they will HAVE to cater to both. And do so right from the start.
I realize to many the limitation of instances will feel like an unwanted limitation to their playtime. I can only speak from my own experience, where my WoW-guild struggled to keep people interested, because they felt like all they were doing was the same shit over and over - which is something I'd like to see change if I join/start up a new community. It feels like you can't please everyone at the same time - so an in-between solution might be golden. I.e. a solution which is acceptable to the hardcore crowd and the more casual-gaming crowd at the same time.
I think many (not all, of course) guilds would benefit from having a varied playtime-experience. If the developers have to "force" this diversity into the game, so be it. Some will hate it - but I think many might find the game to last longer. One day focusing on PvP, another on Rifts/Outdoor bosses and the third battling through an instance. For example. Granted, not everyone enjoys every aspect of the game, so alternatives must be abduant. Don't like PvP? Mix up raiding instances with regular 5-man instances (I'm sure they can be made attractive even to well-progressed players, if designed correctly). Or ignore the instances all-together and focus on PvP (this seems much easier to accomplish). Maybe they'll put in some huge open-world group effort PvP battles (I think I read a rumor about that not long ago)?
And, well, not to sound like an elitist jackass here, but a pretty important factor to me is "Epics should be epics". I think every former/current WoW-player knows what I'm talking about here. At the start of WoW, epics were awesome - they were a reward for completing something challenging (I realize I might get flamed for putting it that way, but you're too good for that right? at least you know what I'm trying to say). Now, I haven't played Cataclysm, 'cause I burned out mid-way through Wrath, but it feels like you get 5 free purples just for logging on (*yawn*).
Dropping two thirds of the loot-table each kill, or in laymen terms "free purples", is also a sure-fire way of killing longevity of the game. Players are more likely to accept doing the same instance over and over if there's actually some reward to it - it doesn't have to be instantaneous, and shouldn't be guaranteed (the lottery is still popular in every country right? - no one's flaming that).
They need to grab this bull by the horns early on, and not let gear inflation get out of hand. Granted, there will be gear inflation - there always is. But it can be managed. One example I can think of is limiting how much better a purple piece is over a blue counterpart, etc.
With Rift's class-system only consisting of 4 classes it's going to make loot-creation more difficult. If they want to limit progression and gear inflation (and when I put it like this, I mean it as a synonym to 'longeviety'), they're going to want to differentiate the gear a lot. Having one piece, say a leg armor, which works well with all 9 mage-souls might sound good on paper - but once you have it, there's no further upgrades available to you(!). E.g. Boring! MMOs are just next-gen stamp collections (you may quote me on that). It's simply not fun if your collection is complete in a month.
Lastly, I'd like to hypothesize that a game which doesn't require 50-hours a week (but still has decent options for it), while yet rewards more active playing than 5+ hours a week is going to hit the sweet-spot of the publics tolerance-limit. Finding that spot might prove difficult though.
Lastly, and most importantly, make the content available as fun and enjoyable as possible! It may sound like a superflous comment, but it's a game, and some developers tend to forget that part from time to time. Fun for hardcores, fun for casuals. The war between those is an illusion. It's possible for both to coexist
Wow, apparently I had a lot to say (and you don't even know how many thoughts I didn't put down on 'paper').
TLDR version:
Outdoor bosses. Many instances. Limited amount of instances each week. Game-design limit to gear inflation. Fun for hardcores and casuals alike.
Comments
Ah you are neither praising nor bashing. Where does a sentence such as 'We are still waiting to see that famous "endgame content". Until then, any hype is nonsensical fanboy talk.' stands in there? I explained why I think you are trolling, and it doesn't have to do with not sharing an idyllic view of a video game.
And perhaps you are 'getting flamed by both sides' because of your tone.
I invite you to read how the diehard fans treat other people who dare say anything remotely negative about their new toy here before you judge whatever I say. And yes, praising content nobody has seen IS nonsensical - that's common sense.
But whatever - welcome to my ignore list, since you're doing exactly what you accuse me of - and that is "stirring the pot in hope to get negative reactions". And a friendly advice - be careful of the "pot calling the kettle black" syndrome.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
This was a good review. When I seen the "veteran" point of view in the topic, I sighed "Oh lord"... I myself am a Veteran to MMO's... But the OP has stated pretty much everything I feel about this game.
Good graphics, Good animations, Polished, Soul Tree is awesome, Rifts are fun and excciting.
PVP.. well I have done warfronts so far.. Was it fun? Yea it was mainly because I got to put to test my soul set up and see how it worked in a pvp setting.
I am hoping in this next beta to try my hand at some REAL open world pvp. I am on a pvp server so I hope it is heavily focused on PVP in the world.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
You should refrain from calling everyone a fan boy. I didn't even think about rift until one day i get a beta key from a friend and say what the fuck it's worth a try.
I thought rift would be a fail EQ wannabe.. , but boy was i proven wrong when I actually got a chance to play this game.
Now I am very excited and cannot wait for release.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Actually the OP made a good positive review about rift, then a few bad apples came in here to tell him that he should not be enjoying the game and it sucks.
I like rift, I think it is a great game and I will be playing it for a long time I am sure. Everyone does have their own tastes though.. What one person may consider fun, another person may consider a snooze fest. (You know what games I am talking about...***Hint**** It has manned space ships)
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
I would reply to any bad comments from a diehard the same way. It is not because you feel like diehard fans are treating people bad that it makes it right for you to do the same; it only make things worst. And since our exchange started, all you did was posting a 'NO U', without really explaining what you meant by that. Ah well.
Actually the OP made a good positive review about rift, then a few bad apples came in here to tell him that he should not be enjoying the game and it sucks.
I like rift, I think it is a great game and I will be playing it for a long time I am sure. Everyone does have their own tastes though.. What one person may consider fun, another person may consider a snooze fest. (You know what games I am talking about...***Hint**** It has manned space ships)
It's come to the point of me not caring. If all were going to get is "is rift good or not" threads I might as well go back to the eve forum and get that thing up and started again (god knows it's been dead since I left).Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
The Korrigan, can you be honest and straight forward with me on this, did ever use quest helper in your play time in wow?
sorry if this more then a little off topic from the OP, but i need to ask it.
It's best just to ignore the threads altogether, because you are always going to have people saying that they think a game is good or bad for whatever reason.
You could start that eve thread and have like 10 different people telling you why they think it is boring.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
Once feb 24th comes im basically done with this place.
At one time i was a pretty good hater of games on this site. But I just dont understand why a game like rift that promotes group play through dynamic content is getting so much shit by this community.
With all the horrible games in this genre that basically push players into some lame instance or solo questing experience, this one thats finally doing what a lot of us asked for (group focused play) is getting shit on.
I mean so what if the game barrows mechanics for other games? Its a fucking group based mmo!!!
I mean would you really rather play WoW with its bullshit solo centric phasing that makes it impossible to see anyone else in the area if they arent on the same quest over a game that lets hundreds of players raid content together outside an instance???
Uggh... I give. Its true people really dont know what they want.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
I have to say Pierth, I like your post. This is the kind of conversation that forums are meant for.
I suppose what it really does come down to is the end game content, this is more important in Rift then in many other games because of the calss system. So, anybody have any comments on what the best way to implement end game content would be for a game like this?
This will be the same mantra sung in every game forum that is close to release. Being around long enough you should know this by know. Heck the most positive forum I've seen here is the GW2 one and that one will become a pit of negativity as well once we get closer to its release.
I never ever used a single quest helping addon, if that's your question, and I play since November 2004. Never had one of those installed.
I don't see how it relates to the discussion at hand though.
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
It's difficult to say what kind of end game content should be added to a game like Rift. I do want a lot of content at the end, but they have to be careful with how they implement some of it. Instances and raids are probably going to be a basic cookie cutter type except changed a bit as normal. How was SWG's end game content? It was one of my favorite games, but I wasn't able to make it to the end game content before they changed it up. I heard it was a blast like the rest of the game was.
I did just that with my blog and all you did was attack me, even though my blog did point out all the good in the game --- as well as the bad and the areas the developers need to work on. BTW I do like Rift. I do not hate it as you may imply. I might have my issues with the game, but I do not hate it...in fact I go so far as to say I think it will be one of the best games released this year. You know what your problem is Rock...you cannot stand anything remotely negative to be spoken about the game...doesn't matter if it is true or not. I made some valid points about the games sound, graphics(and not just squirrels) and gme play and all you focused on was attacking my appeal to the games designers to polish their game the way Blizzard's designers did...because of this you belittle my article and attack me.
You, despite your attempt, cannot defend the un-defendable. There are issues with the game Rift. You just can't seem to allow anyone to voice their concerns about those issues that they feel need addressed. That is the sign of an over zealous fan...the term most use is "fanboy".
Just as constructive critism and my own personal want, what do you see as negative for Rift? Trying to gather as much knowledge on the game as possible.
- This was pointed at Teala too.
I can garuntee you that when gw2 hits it will be a shitstorm of negative coming from that end aswell. This is one of those forums where people are never completely satisfied with anything. They claim to be looking for something new, but when a ne revolutionary game comes out it is also labeled as garbage for some reason or another. Honestly I think a few people on here are living in the past and hoping for a revamp of one of the games from the 90's early 2000's. When that comes out people will be complaining about how it is unoriginal or boring aswell.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
May I sugest reading my view. Click Here <<<<
Very nice writeup, fair and presenting goods and bads, I agree with most. I also understand why it's not popular among those who can't stand any critic about their new favorite game. You, like me, don't live in a black and white world, but a world full of shades of grey
Respect, walk
Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me?
- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
Very good review. I agree that Rift is a fun game. I have much more to learn about it, but this comment by William Murray rang true to me also:
I had mentioned before that am looking forward to Rift, SWTOR, and GW2 this year, and I would not have thought that I would have been excited for the familiar or what I’ve been accustom to. However, what Trion has done is delivered on what we are familiar with, polished it better, added a little more breadth and depth, and in addition to that new-car smell, that fun "I" remember having, or at least initially having, when I was trudging through the beginnings of WAR, that faded quickly, with this game Rift, that feeling of “fun” hasn’t ended.
On my PvE and PvP servers, I've tried them both, and they both appeal to myPvEvP mindset. Of course much more PvE oriented on the PvE server, but regardless of which one, the player-base interactivity has been refreshing. And while at level 30, I am still going through an identity crisis about what I want to mix and match in terms of the vast depth and breadth of character skill customization.
So in the short-bursts I've had, I still do find the game-play enticing and a dash of old-school, particularly on the PvP server. Though my expectation might be to just roll on a PvE server, because it seems that I can do everything, even PvP on a PvE server, but completely turn my switch off when my old and tired self succumbs to, well, being older. But I can still venture into the opposing factions town and try to take it over, and sure, they can sit back and watch me and friends, or they can take-up arms and drive me out. Same goes the other way. It’s a very flexible way of game-play.
Trion does everything very well, which is more than I can say about any other mmo in the last 6-years. Trion borrows very well from other games before it, and implements the content and mechanics very well, which lends value to the game-play. Heck, every mmo has borrowed from it's predecessors since MUD's. And with Rift, even by making PvE more engaging than any other mmo on the market, and contributing to the importance of community cooperation, PvE scale-ability based on population, the dynamic and story-interlaced aspects of it, vast breadth and depth of character development, all's good.
Sure I wish crafting was more robust, sure I wish Character Creation was more robust, sure I wish there was more emphasis on player-made goods as opposed to "Quest" items, but to name a few, those are some trade-offs.
Rift will do well, is my thought, and has earned a pre-order and will be about the only subscribed-to mmo, while I await to try their competition this year.
I'd like to weigh in with a couple of suggestions and opinions.
Personally, I was a big fan of WoWs outdoor raid-bosses. Rifts, well, rifts makes for an interesting and natural way of adding quite a few of these (as has been suggested before). Fighting the other faction for these sounds like a lot of fun.
On the other hand, I'm not against instance-based raiding - although, with WoW, the constant rush and need to get them all done each week was a bit tedious. One idea is to put a limit on how many raiding instances can be completed per week. That way, you pick the ones that suit your guild better, you can mix it up each week, and it'll stave off the immediate need for new content (to some extent). This of course requires a large pool of instances to choose from (they don't have to be massiv 15-boss instances, but they have to be available from the get-go, otherwise you're screwed).
Variation of difficulty between them would be a big plus. Some players prefer the biggest challenge available to them - while others like the medium ones. The problem therein lies in catering to both at the same time. WoW sort of catered to both (after a while) with their achievement-system. You know, kill boss alpha by only using x item beta. It's not a bad system really. Choosing a whole different instance instead (thereby avoiding tuning the boss for more than one tactic) is just a different way to go. The problem is, that after all, they will HAVE to cater to both. And do so right from the start.
I realize to many the limitation of instances will feel like an unwanted limitation to their playtime. I can only speak from my own experience, where my WoW-guild struggled to keep people interested, because they felt like all they were doing was the same shit over and over - which is something I'd like to see change if I join/start up a new community. It feels like you can't please everyone at the same time - so an in-between solution might be golden. I.e. a solution which is acceptable to the hardcore crowd and the more casual-gaming crowd at the same time.
I think many (not all, of course) guilds would benefit from having a varied playtime-experience. If the developers have to "force" this diversity into the game, so be it. Some will hate it - but I think many might find the game to last longer. One day focusing on PvP, another on Rifts/Outdoor bosses and the third battling through an instance. For example. Granted, not everyone enjoys every aspect of the game, so alternatives must be abduant. Don't like PvP? Mix up raiding instances with regular 5-man instances (I'm sure they can be made attractive even to well-progressed players, if designed correctly). Or ignore the instances all-together and focus on PvP (this seems much easier to accomplish). Maybe they'll put in some huge open-world group effort PvP battles (I think I read a rumor about that not long ago)?
And, well, not to sound like an elitist jackass here, but a pretty important factor to me is "Epics should be epics". I think every former/current WoW-player knows what I'm talking about here. At the start of WoW, epics were awesome - they were a reward for completing something challenging (I realize I might get flamed for putting it that way, but you're too good for that right? at least you know what I'm trying to say). Now, I haven't played Cataclysm, 'cause I burned out mid-way through Wrath, but it feels like you get 5 free purples just for logging on (*yawn*).
Dropping two thirds of the loot-table each kill, or in laymen terms "free purples", is also a sure-fire way of killing longevity of the game. Players are more likely to accept doing the same instance over and over if there's actually some reward to it - it doesn't have to be instantaneous, and shouldn't be guaranteed (the lottery is still popular in every country right? - no one's flaming that).
They need to grab this bull by the horns early on, and not let gear inflation get out of hand. Granted, there will be gear inflation - there always is. But it can be managed. One example I can think of is limiting how much better a purple piece is over a blue counterpart, etc.
With Rift's class-system only consisting of 4 classes it's going to make loot-creation more difficult. If they want to limit progression and gear inflation (and when I put it like this, I mean it as a synonym to 'longeviety'), they're going to want to differentiate the gear a lot. Having one piece, say a leg armor, which works well with all 9 mage-souls might sound good on paper - but once you have it, there's no further upgrades available to you(!). E.g. Boring! MMOs are just next-gen stamp collections (you may quote me on that). It's simply not fun if your collection is complete in a month.
Lastly, I'd like to hypothesize that a game which doesn't require 50-hours a week (but still has decent options for it), while yet rewards more active playing than 5+ hours a week is going to hit the sweet-spot of the publics tolerance-limit. Finding that spot might prove difficult though.
Lastly, and most importantly, make the content available as fun and enjoyable as possible! It may sound like a superflous comment, but it's a game, and some developers tend to forget that part from time to time. Fun for hardcores, fun for casuals. The war between those is an illusion. It's possible for both to coexist
Wow, apparently I had a lot to say (and you don't even know how many thoughts I didn't put down on 'paper').
TLDR version:
Outdoor bosses. Many instances. Limited amount of instances each week. Game-design limit to gear inflation. Fun for hardcores and casuals alike.