OP is correct: matchmaking is completely broken. Your Tier-5 tank will end up in just as many Tier-8 matches as it will 5 and 6, which of course is ridiculous. I wouldn't mind so much if it was a matter of necessity, meaning if there simply weren't enough tanks of your own, reasonable tier-range to form a match. But that's not the case. You can plainly see that there are plenty of tanks to make a correctly matched game; it just doesn't do it.
I don't think this is something they will ever fix, because a) The developer seems to think it's supposed to work that way, and b) Too many players drank that particular kool-aid; you'll hear them describe the situation as if it were a matter of tactics rather than a matter of poor game design. But it is poor design, plain and simple.
Bottom line, if you enjoy grinding XP so that you can be the trash mob in someone else's fight, this game is for you. Otherwise skip it, or just don't progress past the early tiers.
This is by design
Yes. As I said, the problem begins with poor design, and ends with not enough people recognizing it for what it is.
Between tanks of different weight classes, TDs and SPGs, there is plenty of variety in a given tier. So a separation of one or two tiers in a random match would provide all the variety the game needs to be interesting *without* relegating anyone to the role of one-shot-killed "trash mob". But when the separation is three (common) or even four tiers (not all that uncommon), the situation is absurd and not fun.
I find no fun in a scenario where I can only scratch the paint on the bulk of the opposing team. I have no function in such a match other than to serve as a speedbump, and I do not grind XP to be a speedbump in someone else's fight.
I wouldn't bother posting at all except that the game comes so close to being good, but fails; mostly because of this problem with matchmaking. It's a shame. And of course you're not allowed to have critical opinions on the game's own forums without risking deletion and possibly even banning, which is another serious problem. So instead I post my experience here in the hopes that someone might find it useful.
Yes. As I said, the problem begins with poor design, and ends with not enough people recognizing it for what it is.
It means most of people are ok with what they have now, doesn't it? Sounds like a good design to me.
Originally posted by StealthBomb
Between tanks of different weight classes, TDs and SPGs, there is plenty of variety in a given tier. So a separation of one or two tiers in a random match would provide all the variety the game needs to be interesting *without* relegating anyone to the role of one-shot-killed "trash mob". But when the separation is three (common) or even four tiers (not all that uncommon), the situation is absurd and not fun.
I find no fun in a scenario where I can only scratch the paint on the bulk of the opposing team. I have no function in such a match other than to serve as a speedbump, and I do not grind XP to be a speedbump in someone else's fight.
I wouldn't bother posting at all except that the game comes so close to being good, but fails; mostly because of this problem with matchmaking. It's a shame. And of course you're not allowed to have critical opinions on the game's own forums without risking deletion and possibly even banning, which is another serious problem. So instead I post my experience here in the hopes that someone might find it useful.
Perhaps we are playing different games. I have no problem finding how to being useful in any level match. As I said multiple times, almost all lvl 5 meds can penetrate side and back armor of all American and German heavies and TDs up to and including level 9. Shooting front armor and "scratching paint" is not the most brilliant idea at any level. In many matches a skilled spotter (extremely rare beast) can be crucial for the win.
The topic is about the team vs team matchmaking, not about within the team distribution. There are some complaints about the latter, but definitely not even a majority, as you are trying to present it. Needless to say the players visiting the topic are not the majority of the community in the first place.
"tier 5/6 is kind of the sweet spot"
"Ive made good money in tier 6-7. In tier 9 I lose money often...even with premium"
How exactly does it contradict what I said about developers forcing you to play lower level tanks?
And no proof of "seen it stated that the devs have said it's due to not enough higher tier tanks and lower tiers are needed to fill the teams". This does not make much sense actually, people level up very fast and in a very short time span the game would be filled with high level tanks only, which would hurt the game in the long run.
1. I present it as the majority based on the posts I've read pure and simple. That thread is by far not the only thread that contains complaints about team distribution. I linked that one since it is the largest. I have seen the team distribution complaint many many times throughout various threads. It's up individuals to interpret the complaints however they want.
2. You stated "The game designed the way that you are forced to play lower level tanks to financially support your higher levels". Unless you consider tiers 5-7 as lower level tiers then it speaks for itself. I wasn't necessarily trying to contradict you but trying to show that the lower tiers are not where people are suggesting the better credits are earned (as I interpret it). If we are supposedly being foced to play lower tiers to make money then why are players recommending middle tiers to do just that?
3. I did say "IF" I had seen it, I did not say for a fact it was stated by a dev. I could try a search on the WoT forums for all of Overlord's posts to find out if we really want to know. I never said it made sense, just that I thought I might have seen it. But as you said, if players (and I've no clue of the numbers) leveled up fast it could be that there just isn't enough of them to consistently form teams of 15 tanks without a long queue wait. I'm just guessing here. I've seen it suggested by others that this might be the case. I personally do not know.
Anyway, I think I'm done with this thread. I've said all I have to say on the matchmaking system. Folks just have to make of it what they will, good or bad.
1. I present it as the majority based on the posts I've read pure and simple. That thread is by far not the only thread that contains complaints about team distribution. I linked that one since it is the largest. I have seen the team distribution complaint many many times throughout various threads. It's up individuals to interpret the complaints however they want.
2. You stated "The game designed the way that you are forced to play lower level tanks to financially support your higher levels". Unless you consider tiers 5-7 as lower level tiers then it speaks for itself. I wasn't necessarily trying to contradict you but trying to show that the lower tiers are not where people are suggesting the better credits are earned (as I interpret it). If we are supposedly being foced to play lower tiers to make money then why are players recommending middle tiers to do just that?
3. I did say "IF" I had seen it, I did not say for a fact it was stated by a dev. I could try a search on the WoT forums for all of Overlord's posts to find out if we really want to know. I never said it made sense, just that I thought I might have seen it. But as you said, if players (and I've no clue of the numbers) leveled up fast it could be that there just isn't enough of them to consistently form teams of 15 tanks without a long queue wait. I'm just guessing here. I've seen it suggested by others that this might be the case. I personally do not know.
Anyway, I think I'm done with this thread. I've said all I have to say on the matchmaking system. Folks just have to make of it what they will, good or bad.
Cheers
1. Personal perception only. I don't see any of the problems you are describing or I don't see them as a problem.
2. Yes, I consider levels 5/6 "lower levels". PzIV/3601 are regularly getting into noob team matches. DB and T20 are rarely so.
Actually, I re-read you original post and realized that I argued quite different points
Originally posted by Vitalis55
It seems though that they want the tier 4 tanks to be so mismatched that people will want to pay money to buy gold to exchange for experience.
<...>
Polls on both U.S and EU forums show tier 4 to be the least enjoyable tier by a huge margin.
And strangely I agree with you about the level 4. The problems here:
1. There are no level 4 heavies.
2. Level 4 lights are placed in matches up to level 10 (9?). All levels need scouts and A-20 and Leo excel in this role.
3. There is only 1 decent level 4 med - PzIII, which essentially a scout tank competing wih Leo. Lee and T28 are basically garbage or at least very challanging to play.
4. Can't say much about Hetzer and SU-85B but heard they are horrible.
So you are right that level 4 may be the most disappointing level in the game.
But you can pass this level in a few hours. If you would spend the same time as for writing in this thread, you would already be in a nice level 5 tank.
And finally "use gold to exchange for experience"? Are you trying to say that you are forced to play your level 3 to get extra xp, pay gold to convert it into free xp and skip level 4? Yes, you can do that. But I would say it's plain stupid. I ran through German and American level 4 and don't even remember any specifics. Still if it's such a big deal for you, just suffer through one branch, then get "free" free experience playing higher level tanks, which is a way faster, and use it to skip the hated level 4 in all other branches.
The PZIII isn't to bad, but the gun isn't strong enough to really be effective. It can make a pretty good scout tank though
Perhaps this is just my perception, but the Lee got a decent enough gun that I could put some hurt on anything I faced. It was a garbage tank that I could not wait to get rid of. I don't really have much positive to say about the T28 either. Really disliked that tank.
The hezter is a good tank destroyer, but it is the follow up tank to the Marder II which is so powerful in most of the matches it draws that it makes the hetzer feel like a serious downgrade. The hezter requires a bit of adjusment in playstyle and the stock version really suffers in higher matches, but it is an effective TD once upgraded.
I have not played a A-20 or M5 Stuart, so no comment.
Tier 4 is a lot tougher than T1-3, which are more like tutorial levels than anything else. I would guess that around tier 4-5 about half of the fights you end up on top of the food chain and the other half on the bottom of the food chain.
And finally "use gold to exchange for experience"? Are you trying to say that you are forced to play your level 3 to get extra xp, pay gold to convert it into free xp and skip level 4? Yes, you can do that. But I would say it's plain stupid. I ran through German and American level 4 and don't even remember any specifics. Still if it's such a big deal for you, just suffer through one branch, then get "free" free experience playing higher level tanks, which is a way faster, and use it to skip the hated level 4 in all other branches.
Well I thought I was done with this thread but I decided to try and answer your question. I will address your comment assuming you are referring to my opening post of this thread.
No, I wasn't trying to say that myself, or anyone else, is being forced to do anything. I quote myself; "It seems though that they want the tier 4 tanks to be so mismatched that people will want to pay money to buy gold to exchange for experience. This way players can research the modules without having to actually play the tank and then buy a tier 5 tank."
I stress the part "that people will want", it doesn not say "forced". No one in this game is forced to do anything. Well, not unless you want something that can only be bought with WoT gold.
I never mentioned being forced to do anything, only that it "SEEMS" to be the reason. I never offered any proof of this thoery and presented it only as my opinion. Nothing more. I agree that it would be stupid to spend gold to get past tier 4 but there are many folks out there that apparently have money to burn and have no problem with it. What I do just research only the modules needed to get to the tier 5 tank. I've seen it suggested many times in the forums to just skip the tank using gold but it's not what I have done or ever will do.
Lastly, the big deal for me is not the time spent grinding the tier 4 to tier 5 but the tier level of tanks it is matched with I thought I made it clear in my opening post, maybe not. I quote myself once again:
"Then comes tier 4 and that's when the pain begins. I feel safe in saying that 90% of your matches will have tanks up to tier 7. It wouldn't be so bad if 10% was matched with tier 7's but that's not the way it is and it seems the game producers want it that way."
The original post never mentions anything regarding the time spent grinding a tier. I've reread my own post several times and I just don't see that anywhere so I don't know how it could even be implied. The thread title and post comments are all directly addressing the matchmaking system. Nothing else
Between tanks of different weight classes, TDs and SPGs, there is plenty of variety in a given tier. So a separation of one or two tiers in a random match would provide all the variety the game needs to be interesting *without* relegating anyone to the role of one-shot-killed "trash mob". But when the separation is three (common) or even four tiers (not all that uncommon), the situation is absurd and not fun.
I find no fun in a scenario where I can only scratch the paint on the bulk of the opposing team. I have no function in such a match other than to serve as a speedbump, and I do not grind XP to be a speedbump in someone else's fight.
I wouldn't bother posting at all except that the game comes so close to being good, but fails; mostly because of this problem with matchmaking. It's a shame. And of course you're not allowed to have critical opinions on the game's own forums without risking deletion and possibly even banning, which is another serious problem. So instead I post my experience here in the hopes that someone might find it useful.
Perhaps we are playing different games.
Yes, we are. I'm playing the "objective review" game, and you're playing the "fanboy" game. Every game has them, and it is not possible to have a rational or meaningful conversation with them. I will not bother. Instead I say GG to you, and leave you to your self-induced, delusional world where the game you've latched onto can do no wrong.
Besides, the tiny amount of activity on this forum indicates pretty clearly that no one cares about this game anyway
And finally "use gold to exchange for experience"? Are you trying to say that you are forced to play your level 3 to get extra xp, pay gold to convert it into free xp and skip level 4? Yes, you can do that. But I would say it's plain stupid. I ran through German and American level 4 and don't even remember any specifics. Still if it's such a big deal for you, just suffer through one branch, then get "free" free experience playing higher level tanks, which is a way faster, and use it to skip the hated level 4 in all other branches.
Well I thought I was done with this thread but I decided to try and answer your question. I will address your comment assuming you are referring to my opening post of this thread.
No, I wasn't trying to say that myself, or anyone else, is being forced to do anything. I quote myself; "It seems though that they want the tier 4 tanks to be so mismatched that people will want to pay money to buy gold to exchange for experience. This way players can research the modules without having to actually play the tank and then buy a tier 5 tank."
I stress the part "that people will want", it doesn not say "forced". No one in this game is forced to do anything. Well, not unless you want something that can only be bought with WoT gold.
I never mentioned being forced to do anything, only that it "SEEMS" to be the reason. I never offered any proof of this thoery and presented it only as my opinion. Nothing more. I agree that it would be stupid to spend gold to get past tier 4 but there are many folks out there that apparently have money to burn and have no problem with it. What I do just research only the modules needed to get to the tier 5 tank. I've seen it suggested many times in the forums to just skip the tank using gold but it's not what I have done or ever will do.
Lastly, the big deal for me is not the time spent grinding the tier 4 to tier 5 but the tier level of tanks it is matched with I thought I made it clear in my opening post, maybe not. I quote myself once again:
"Then comes tier 4 and that's when the pain begins. I feel safe in saying that 90% of your matches will have tanks up to tier 7. It wouldn't be so bad if 10% was matched with tier 7's but that's not the way it is and it seems the game producers want it that way."
The original post never mentions anything regarding the time spent grinding a tier. I've reread my own post several times and I just don't see that anywhere so I don't know how it could even be implied. The thread title and post comments are all directly addressing the matchmaking system. Nothing else
I hope this clears it up.
I my opinion "make you want" = "force". But I don't insist. However, I still don't see how gold can help to skip level 3, unless you immensely enjoy level 3. Basically you have to grind level 3 and then pay gold to pass level 4.
I agree with Then comes tier 4 and that's when the pain begins with addition "and the pain ends". Level 5 is very playable with levels 7-8 in the team. Before you start arguing let me point you to the fact, as an example, that PzIV (lvl 5) top gun is the same as Panther (lvl8) stock and you are stuck with it at level 8 for, at very least, 40k XP. Both tanks have basically the same front armor and same speed, Panther has more HP, but Pz is much easier to hide.
And I don't believe that "level 4 pain" deserves a dedicated thread
Ok, I'm not gonna try and say that no one will have fun after tier 3 but this is what you can expect.
At tier 1 you will be in matches against tier 1 & tier 2 tanks.
At tier 2 you will be in matches against tanks up to tier 4, this is especially true for arty & TDs.
At tier 3 you will be in matches against tanks up to tier 5. Not a big deal if you play arty or TD.
Then comes tier 4 and that's when the pain begins. I feel safe in saying that 90% of your matches will have tanks up to tier 7. It wouldn't be so bad if 10% was matched with tier 7's but that's not the way it is and it seems the game producers want it that way.
Now why would they want it that way you may ask. It is a F2P game and they have to make money, that's obvious. It seems though that they want the tier 4 tanks to be so mismatched that people will want to pay money to buy gold to exchange for experience. This way players can research the modules without having to actually play the tank and then buy a tier 5 tank. Researching the module upgrades is similar to skill trees in many fantasy mmos. There are certain tank upgrade modules you have to use exp to research (learn) in order to research the next available tank in that tree.
Tier 5, btw, is only slightly bettter in matches than tier 4 so don't expect things to suddenly get much better. Polls on both U.S and EU forums show tier 4 to be the least enjoyable tier by a huge margin. Check the gameplay discussion/official V6.4 matchmaking discussion thread on the oficial forums if you doubt this. It is THE number 1 complaint about the game.
Personally I just stopped playing my tier 4 & tier 5 tanks until they change the matchmaking system and won't be supporting them with real money. If you can somehow have fun with this horrible system then by all means go for it.
I really didnt read much after the OP so i appologize in advance if this has been said (in a similar fashion). I can't remember any MMO I have played that didnt have a section of advancement that was less enjoyable then the rest..
I am in teir 5 in USA tanks and USSR TD's, and yeah I get put in alot of matches against teir 7. You know what I do? Follow the big guys on my team Or just find a really good ambush spot and wait for tanks you can take out. What you are saying is a claim that your personal dislike for the "grind" is some conspiracy by the devs to make you spend more money.
I mean, if your one of those guys on the team that EVERYONE completely hates that goes off solo, driving in the middle of the open landscape and you get taken out and start spamming (hackers, i hate this matchmaking system, X tank is so OP, blah blah blah) then I would completely understand..
But for me and the majority of people I play with teir 3/4/5 just plain suck. Matchmaking system is not THAT broken (I AM NOT saying its perfect by any means... but you name a game that is PERFECT for every single person that plays PLEASE tell me so I can play it.)
My advice is STFU and go grind so you can join the big boys that keep 1 shotting you... wont it be fun when your teir 7 and can just roll around murdering all the lowbies? Sometimes the grass is greener lol
My advice is STFU and go grind so you can join the big boys that keep 1 shotting you... wont it be fun when your teir 7 and can just roll around murdering all the lowbies? Sometimes the grass is greener lol
This is why I prefer games where your K/D ratio is governed by skill, not by "kool epix" and "1337 gear", too bad WoT isnt one of these games. Reminds me of rest of f2p MMOs where one pays to win. WoT isnt like this (still grindy though) yet bigger e-peen is the biggest gameplay factor.
I really didnt read much after the OP so i appologize in advance if this has been said (in a similar fashion). I can't remember any MMO I have played that didnt have a section of advancement that was less enjoyable then the rest..
I am in teir 5 in USA tanks and USSR TD's, and yeah I get put in alot of matches against teir 7. You know what I do? Follow the big guys on my team Or just find a really good ambush spot and wait for tanks you can take out. What you are saying is a claim that your personal dislike for the "grind" is some conspiracy by the devs to make you spend more money.
I mean, if your one of those guys on the team that EVERYONE completely hates that goes off solo, driving in the middle of the open landscape and you get taken out and start spamming (hackers, i hate this matchmaking system, X tank is so OP, blah blah blah) then I would completely understand..
But for me and the majority of people I play with teir 3/4/5 just plain suck. Matchmaking system is not THAT broken (I AM NOT saying its perfect by any means... but you name a game that is PERFECT for every single person that plays PLEASE tell me so I can play it.)
My advice is STFU and go grind so you can join the big boys that keep 1 shotting you... wont it be fun when your teir 7 and can just roll around murdering all the lowbies? Sometimes the grass is greener lol
First off Comicazi. No argument from me, it's just as I said as my first comment in the OP. I'm not gonna try to tell anyone they won't have fun after tier 3, just letting them know what's ahead. Any displeasure I have is my own opinion.
I completely agree that a tier 5 in same match with tier 7-8 is playable. I just would like to have more matches of say 5-7 or 4-6, in those ranges. It just gets old for me to play 90% of my matches against up to tier 8's. Typical matches for my StuG are like this (that's my StuG at the bottom left):
I've been trying out my Stug again last week and here is how it goes almost every day: First 3 matches are with tiers up to 5 with occasional 6. After that almost all matches are like the above pic. Not same tank models but the tier spread. I'm ok with it once in a while but really don't want it almost all the time. But that's just me.
Now for Quentin405. I'm tempted to just dismiss your comments as plain simple trash talk and not repsond at all. However I don't like someone pissing down my back and tell me it's raining. If you had read the whole thread you would have seen where I stated that it wouldn't be a "grind" if it were fun. But matchmaker makes it a grind.
Your 2nd comment is just ignorant. All I'll say is that if I get any comment in-game on my game play it's usually a compliment or an attaboy. The rare negative comments are from ignorant players that don't understand a thing about logical moves or tactics, and which are usually pointed out to them by other players on the team that know better.
Your 3rd comment is a jewel. You lost any hope of credibility with the "STFU". Only someone with limited capacity to communicate would resort to that. I've been going back & forth with Comicaze on things we disagree with but he never lowered himself to insults. That shows class, something you are obviously lacking.
Apparently your idea of fun is to play a higher tier tank just so you can wipe up on the lowbies. I'll go out on a limb here and bet that most players idea of fun is a competitive match. There's a new word for you to chew on. Say it slowly, competitive.
Come back and spew some more trash but I've said all I have to say to you. Anything more is a waste of effort.
First off Comicazi. No argument from me, it's just as I said as my first comment in the OP. I'm not gonna try to tell anyone they won't have fun after tier 3, just letting them know what's ahead. Any displeasure I have is my own opinion.
I completely agree that a tier 5 in same match with tier 7-8 is playable. I just would like to have more matches of say 5-7 or 4-6, in those ranges. It just gets old for me to play 90% of my matches against up to tier 8's. Typical matches for my StuG are like this (that's my StuG at the bottom left):
I've been trying out my Stug again last week and here is how it goes almost every day: First 3 matches are with tiers up to 5 with occasional 6. After that almost all matches are like the above pic. Not same tank models but the tier spread. I'm ok with it once in a while but really don't want it almost all the time. But that's just me.
Look, I simply don't see myself or any of my friends being 90% in high-level matches. It's 50/50 in my experience. And when I am at the bottom and don't want to bother "scratching paint" for 15 mins, I just "rush across the field in Malinovka", spot few tanks, got shot, exit battle, and jump into another tank - I have 8 of them, 5 elited/100% crew with perks. But again I don't know much about TDs (waiting to try American). Maybe there is a problem indeed or you are just so freaking unlucky.
Speaking about grind, you will praise your lvl 4 experience when you come across stock Porsche and Panther
My advice is STFU and go grind so you can join the big boys that keep 1 shotting you... wont it be fun when your teir 7 and can just roll around murdering all the lowbies? Sometimes the grass is greener lol
This is why I prefer games where your K/D ratio is governed by skill, not by "kool epix" and "1337 gear", too bad WoT isnt one of these games. Reminds me of rest of f2p MMOs where one pays to win. WoT isnt like this (still grindy though) yet bigger e-peen is the biggest gameplay factor.
That was sarcasm. quentin proposed the same as I did, if OP is 90% at the bottom of the list, then just get a higher level tank and be 90% of the time at the top, right?
WoT is personal skills based. There is no such thing as "kool epix" and "1337 gear" in the game. All equipment is readily available to everyone.
Look, I simply don't see myself or any of my friends being 90% in high-level matches. It's 50/50 in my experience. And when I am at the bottom and don't want to bother "scratching paint" for 15 mins, I just "rush across the field in Malinovka", spot few tanks, got shot, exit battle, and jump into another tank - I have 8 of them, 5 elited/100% crew with perks. But again I don't know much about TDs (waiting to try American). Maybe there is a problem indeed or you are just so freaking unlucky.
Speaking about grind, you will praise your lvl 4 experience when you come across stock Porsche and Panther
Lol, you may be right and I AM that unlucky, and it wouldn't surprise me one bit. Maybe I should platoon with you so my matches will get better. But then yours might get worse. I decided to pull my SU-85 out of the closet and same thing happened as with the StuG. First few matches were with tier 5-6 as top tank then the next 10 or so looking like trhe image I posted. Oh well, that's life.
I have considered that same thing at the beginning of a bad matchup but I wouldn't get very far in my TDs to lite up enemies, even with the StuG.
Yeah, I've heard people lament about the grind at higher levels. Due to how much the research costs if I remember right. Is that right?
My most amount of fun comes when I play my KV in tier 5. Sometimes I'm on top of the list, and sometimes I'm stuck in tier 9 battles. It does not matter. In fact, I earn more xp when I go up against the tier 9's.
Why?
One number and two words:
152mm DERP GUN (Loaded with all HE, never use AP in these types of guns)
Even the big guys fear that thing. Sure, it won't (usually) insta-pop a 4502, but it will take 20% of his HP away. Even the mighty maus is about 19% or so per shot. And just hitting ONCE is a giant amount of xp and cash. Hit them up close for even more xp (the closer you are, the more xp you get per damage). And before you say it, I'll say it:
"But it fires so slow! You're a one shot cannon!"
And that one shot kills tier 5's and below, and makes tier 6's and 7's wish they hadn't shown their face, and eats away at tier 8, 9, 10 faster than their own guns do (barring the 152's on the russian td's, etc).
The trick to firing more shots is NOT playing like a heavy tank in the KV, as it is fragile. Sure, it can bounce little tank guns fairly well, but the big guys can 1-2 shot you if you show them your face too long.
I've had a mission where I had 10 kills (10 shots, 10 kills, won sniper and top gun lol) in the thing. I won some medal I can't remember the name of for being the last guy alive on my team and killing the last 6 on their side solo (some were damaged, to be sure). My "losing" missions typically still net me 600-800, sometimes more (and sometimes less, sure I die in one shot to arty like everyone else).
1) Use your teammates as meat shields if they are higher level than you. If you're top dog in a match, then you should be able to charge forth, but it still helps to keep friends around to make your enemy "pay" if they want to shoot at you while you reload.
2) Keep near buildings or rocks that let you take cover after you take your shot. That's where the friends come in. You want that enemy to think twice about chasing you just because he knows you're reloading and can't fire back.
3) Don't take low percentage shots. Sure, you'll miss, but if you do, make sure you can hide while you reload. Taking a 300m shot at a moving tank is fine, he won't get to you before you reload. Taking a shot at a tiny portion of a moving tank 30 meters away is suicide.
Its the tank I play when I get frustrated with sniper arty or getting into too many tier 10 battles with idiots as teammates. It always makes money. It almost always brings a smile to my face. I win over 61% of my battles in the thing, I have nearly a 3:1 K/D ratio in it.
For added enjoyment, play with 2 friends in KV's as well. Even in the tier 9 battles, we're a force to be reckoned with. Turning a corner and getting derped by 3 152's is a painful experience for ANY tank .
WOT is a great game up to tier 3 after that the game really goes down hill because of the stupid matchmaking.
Level 4 is somewhat troublesome, but you can pass it in a few hours. If you can't compete at levels 5 and beyond, then you are personally not skilled enough, nothing wrong with the matchmaker.
Ok, I went back and played a few of my tier 5 tanks to log the matches and my previous number of tier 8 matches was a tad high. Not 90% as I stated but more like 80%. Still way too high for me. I played at least 50 matches each in the M10, PZ4, and T-34. So maybe it is that I just have some bizarre Twighlight Zone kind of bad luck. These matches were during various times of the day & night. The T-34 had a slightly better ratio, meaning less tier 8 matches.
I certainly feel that I have the skills to play at any tier but the skills come down to mainly just trying to survive long enough to maybe get a chance to hit one of the tanks that are not tier 7 & 8 in these matches. Let's face it, there are not a lot of options regarding tactics in these matches. Since I mainly play TDs I have to stay back and usually end up waiting to try and defend the flag.
Now when I play the T-34 it's just trying to stay alive. Trying to use the higher tiers as shields really doesn't work, at least not in MY experience. Nine times out of ten the moment the enemy spots you it is assured that you will be the next target on their crosshairs since you are a easy kill and therefore XP and credits. This includes enemy arty. And even if you do manage to get off a few shots without getting mauled the shots will either bounce or do hardly any damage at all. And yes, I know how and where to shoot tanks.
Generally speaking, I want to be able to play a match in pretty much the same way as the tier 7 & 8 tanks do. Competitvely and more than just being a tad more than useless. And I want this in all the tiers, not just the higher tiers. This does not mean I want to be top dog in every match as some will claim. Someone always does.
WoT has acknowledged it is a problem even though it's working as intended. At least as intended on the EU servers where there is enough players to make the matchmaker work. They also stated that they were concerned that trying to change it might do more harm than good but that won't be known unless they try.
A represntative of WoT stated in a interview they were working on a solution and that one idea they were considering was to make lower tier spread matches a "pay for" option. Now this really got my dander up. What that says to me is that it's ok if changing the MM does more harm than good as long as they can make money from it. If they go this route it will be the end of my WoT playing as will also with friends that play.
For now I only play my tier 2 & 3 tanks and it's fun. The tactical options are far more than in the tier 4-6 matches and there are no tanks that you can't do some team-helpful damage to. The only drawback is the totally clueless noobs you get teamed with. Hey, I was a noob once but was never clueless.
I don't really have an issue with the matchmaker. I'm running a T29 (fully upgraded) and I'm having fun. Sure, it was a little tough when I had the 2 tanks before this one (the M6 and the introductory heavy) but I got my kills on equivalent tier or lower tanks and just fired HE rounds into the butt end of those of higher tier.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
The Panzer IV is one of the best tanks in the game. If you are dying the second you get spotted, especially by artillery, you are doing something terribly terribly wrong. The panzerIV is not a brawling tank and isn't mean to run into the middle of combat. The long 88 has amazing accuracy, penetration and rate of fire. When you are low on the tiers, sit back and support your team with long range shots (if possible).
As a tank destroyer, you don't have to sit back and guard the flag and you might just be doing your team a disservice if you do. Some maps it is a good tactic, but other maps it is a good tactic to follow behind a pack of tanks or pick a nice sniper position and wait.
The more guns firing on a target, the quicker they die, the better your chance for victory.
If you have not played an artillery vehicle you could really benefit from trying it. Just seeing how the artillery system works, how to aim, how to lead and especially how line of fire works will help you when you player your tanks. Seeing how other vehicles use cover and go back into hiding will help all aspects of playing.
The Panzer IV is one of the best tanks in the game. If you are dying the second you get spotted, especially by artillery, you are doing something terribly terribly wrong. The panzerIV is not a brawling tank and isn't mean to run into the middle of combat. The long 88 has amazing accuracy, penetration and rate of fire. When you are low on the tiers, sit back and support your team with long range shots (if possible).
As a tank destroyer, you don't have to sit back and guard the flag and you might just be doing your team a disservice if you do. Some maps it is a good tactic, but other maps it is a good tactic to follow behind a pack of tanks or pick a nice sniper position and wait.
The more guns firing on a target, the quicker they die, the better your chance for victory.
If you have not played an artillery vehicle you could really benefit from trying it. Just seeing how the artillery system works, how to aim, how to lead and especially how line of fire works will help you when you player your tanks. Seeing how other vehicles use cover and go back into hiding will help all aspects of playing.
My comments regarding tactics have to do with matches that are 60% - 70% tier 7 & 8 tanks. Several of those will be arty that stay in the rear and the few tanks that are tier 5 & 6 are doing the same thing the tier 5 & 6 tanks on your team are doing, and that is also staying behind the front fighting trying to support the best they can. Don't take it too literally when I say I stay in the back defending the flag. It all depends on the tank types on both teams, how the battle unfolds, and the map.
I never said I die the second I get spotted but that a tier 5 tank will be targeted quickly the moment it's spotted by the higher tiers. If you notice I was talking about the tactic of using higher tier tanks as shields which is what most people will advise doing in these matches.
Yes, the PZ4 is one of the best tanks in the game, for it's tier. In a match as I described it's just another easy kill if it isn't careful. I play the PZ4 as a sniper as most players do simply due to it's high acurracy gun and relatively weak armor (for a tier 5 medium). Also, don't forget, those higher tier enemy tanks know how to shoot at long range also.
As a long range sniper you have to stop to get a good shot and arty many times can shoot almost all the way across the map so just because you are sniping from long range doesn't necessarily mean you are safe from them. I have not played arty but I have watched many player videos using arty so I know exactly how they play from their perspective.
I've played 6100 matches thus far combining all my tanks played and I feel confident that I know how to play and at the least am better than average. There isn't a tactic or strategy I haven'y tried.
All of this really has nothing to do with the thread topic. It's about the matches a player will face when they are in tier 4-6 tanks. As I've already said before, it's up to to the individual player to determine if they like it or not.
I've played 6100 matches thus far combining all my tanks played and I feel confident that I know how to play and at the least am better than average. There isn't a tactic or strategy I haven'y tried.
You got 6100 matches under your belt, but still playing PzIV, T-34 and complaining on mmorpg.com about the matchmaker? Let me put me this politely - I don't believe a single word you are saying here.
I have just over 6000, which puts me within top 1000 players on the NA server, and I am playing Maus, E-50 and have Patton open - top German heavy, medium and American medium tank respectively, clarifying for someone not familiar with the game. And at this stage I have a very meager theoretical interest in the MM discussion.
Now when I play the T-34 it's just trying to stay alive. Trying to use the higher tiers as shields really doesn't work, at least not in MY experience. Nine times out of ten the moment the enemy spots you it is assured that you will be the next target on their crosshairs since you are a easy kill and therefore XP and credits.
I routinely teamkill meds trying to hide behind my heavy's back or just exit the match, if there are many such idiots in the team.
Originally posted by comicaze I routinely teamkill meds trying to hide behind my heavy's back or just exit the match, if there are many such idiots in the team.
Originally posted by comicaze Let me put me this politely - I don't believe a single word you are saying here.
I routinely teamkill meds trying to hide behind my heavy's back or just exit the match, if there are many such idiots in the team.
I never said I hide behind a heavy's back, you assumed that and are wrong. I said using them as shields. You yourself have stated that you do the same . I quote you: " I followed the "big guys" and just shot cowardly from behind". And, you stated that you fit in betwen them to see where they point their turrets. You didn't say you hid behind their backs so I didn't assume you said so. You sir are the idiot for twisting the truth of what people say. The truth hurts sometimes doesn't it.
Originally posted by comicaze
You got 6100 matches under your belt, but still playing PzIV, T-34 and complaining on mmorpg.com about the matchmaker? Let me put me this politely - I don't believe a single word you are saying here.
I don't even play my tier 4,5,6 tanks anymore due to the MM. When they change it I will play them again. When I can have fun again in those tanks in competive matches then I will eventually move up to the higher tiers. Seems you have appointed yourself the judge of what tiers are fun and which are not. Sorry bud but any tier can fun and doesn't require a high tier tank. Tier 2 & 3 is what's fun for me these days and if that doesn't meet your approval then tough chit. Just the fact that you say you will TK a player says it all about you as a player. It's never good to TK someone even if they do something you don't like. It only hurts yourself and your teammates, but I guess it's all about you isn't it.
I care not if you believe me since apparently you think only people that play high tier tanks are worthy of your belief. Your attitude reeks of elitist superiorty syndrome. The type that think anyone that doesn't play high tiers are not even worthy of logging into the game. I hate to pop your balloon but the game is meant for everyone to have fun regardless of the tiers they play. I could easily post screenshots of my stats to confirm my matches played and general accomplishments but as I said, I don't give a rats a$$ if you believe me or not.
If you don't believe me then I suppose you also don't believe the vast magority of the people that complain about the MM and base their complaints on tiers 4-6. Yeah, they are all full of manure and your opinion means more than all of theirs.
I try to be respectful of people in the forums but you have shown your true colors so get over yourself and stop trying to be the almighty judge and jury of all that is WoT. Flame all you want but I shall reply no more to you. It's not worth any more of my time.
Comments
Yes. As I said, the problem begins with poor design, and ends with not enough people recognizing it for what it is.
Between tanks of different weight classes, TDs and SPGs, there is plenty of variety in a given tier. So a separation of one or two tiers in a random match would provide all the variety the game needs to be interesting *without* relegating anyone to the role of one-shot-killed "trash mob". But when the separation is three (common) or even four tiers (not all that uncommon), the situation is absurd and not fun.
I find no fun in a scenario where I can only scratch the paint on the bulk of the opposing team. I have no function in such a match other than to serve as a speedbump, and I do not grind XP to be a speedbump in someone else's fight.
I wouldn't bother posting at all except that the game comes so close to being good, but fails; mostly because of this problem with matchmaking. It's a shame. And of course you're not allowed to have critical opinions on the game's own forums without risking deletion and possibly even banning, which is another serious problem. So instead I post my experience here in the hopes that someone might find it useful.
It means most of people are ok with what they have now, doesn't it? Sounds like a good design to me.
Perhaps we are playing different games. I have no problem finding how to being useful in any level match. As I said multiple times, almost all lvl 5 meds can penetrate side and back armor of all American and German heavies and TDs up to and including level 9. Shooting front armor and "scratching paint" is not the most brilliant idea at any level. In many matches a skilled spotter (extremely rare beast) can be crucial for the win.
1. I present it as the majority based on the posts I've read pure and simple. That thread is by far not the only thread that contains complaints about team distribution. I linked that one since it is the largest. I have seen the team distribution complaint many many times throughout various threads. It's up individuals to interpret the complaints however they want.
2. You stated "The game designed the way that you are forced to play lower level tanks to financially support your higher levels". Unless you consider tiers 5-7 as lower level tiers then it speaks for itself. I wasn't necessarily trying to contradict you but trying to show that the lower tiers are not where people are suggesting the better credits are earned (as I interpret it). If we are supposedly being foced to play lower tiers to make money then why are players recommending middle tiers to do just that?
3. I did say "IF" I had seen it, I did not say for a fact it was stated by a dev. I could try a search on the WoT forums for all of Overlord's posts to find out if we really want to know. I never said it made sense, just that I thought I might have seen it. But as you said, if players (and I've no clue of the numbers) leveled up fast it could be that there just isn't enough of them to consistently form teams of 15 tanks without a long queue wait. I'm just guessing here. I've seen it suggested by others that this might be the case. I personally do not know.
Anyway, I think I'm done with this thread. I've said all I have to say on the matchmaking system. Folks just have to make of it what they will, good or bad.
Cheers
1. Personal perception only. I don't see any of the problems you are describing or I don't see them as a problem.
2. Yes, I consider levels 5/6 "lower levels". PzIV/3601 are regularly getting into noob team matches. DB and T20 are rarely so.
Actually, I re-read you original post and realized that I argued quite different points
And strangely I agree with you about the level 4. The problems here:
1. There are no level 4 heavies.
2. Level 4 lights are placed in matches up to level 10 (9?). All levels need scouts and A-20 and Leo excel in this role.
3. There is only 1 decent level 4 med - PzIII, which essentially a scout tank competing wih Leo. Lee and T28 are basically garbage or at least very challanging to play.
4. Can't say much about Hetzer and SU-85B but heard they are horrible.
So you are right that level 4 may be the most disappointing level in the game.
But you can pass this level in a few hours. If you would spend the same time as for writing in this thread, you would already be in a nice level 5 tank.
And finally "use gold to exchange for experience"? Are you trying to say that you are forced to play your level 3 to get extra xp, pay gold to convert it into free xp and skip level 4? Yes, you can do that. But I would say it's plain stupid. I ran through German and American level 4 and don't even remember any specifics. Still if it's such a big deal for you, just suffer through one branch, then get "free" free experience playing higher level tanks, which is a way faster, and use it to skip the hated level 4 in all other branches.
The PZIII isn't to bad, but the gun isn't strong enough to really be effective. It can make a pretty good scout tank though
Perhaps this is just my perception, but the Lee got a decent enough gun that I could put some hurt on anything I faced. It was a garbage tank that I could not wait to get rid of. I don't really have much positive to say about the T28 either. Really disliked that tank.
The hezter is a good tank destroyer, but it is the follow up tank to the Marder II which is so powerful in most of the matches it draws that it makes the hetzer feel like a serious downgrade. The hezter requires a bit of adjusment in playstyle and the stock version really suffers in higher matches, but it is an effective TD once upgraded.
I have not played a A-20 or M5 Stuart, so no comment.
Tier 4 is a lot tougher than T1-3, which are more like tutorial levels than anything else. I would guess that around tier 4-5 about half of the fights you end up on top of the food chain and the other half on the bottom of the food chain.
Well I thought I was done with this thread but I decided to try and answer your question. I will address your comment assuming you are referring to my opening post of this thread.
No, I wasn't trying to say that myself, or anyone else, is being forced to do anything. I quote myself; "It seems though that they want the tier 4 tanks to be so mismatched that people will want to pay money to buy gold to exchange for experience. This way players can research the modules without having to actually play the tank and then buy a tier 5 tank."
I stress the part "that people will want" , it doesn not say "forced". No one in this game is forced to do anything. Well, not unless you want something that can only be bought with WoT gold.
I never mentioned being forced to do anything, only that it "SEEMS" to be the reason. I never offered any proof of this thoery and presented it only as my opinion. Nothing more. I agree that it would be stupid to spend gold to get past tier 4 but there are many folks out there that apparently have money to burn and have no problem with it. What I do just research only the modules needed to get to the tier 5 tank. I've seen it suggested many times in the forums to just skip the tank using gold but it's not what I have done or ever will do.
Lastly, the big deal for me is not the time spent grinding the tier 4 to tier 5 but the tier level of tanks it is matched with I thought I made it clear in my opening post, maybe not. I quote myself once again:
"Then comes tier 4 and that's when the pain begins. I feel safe in saying that 90% of your matches will have tanks up to tier 7. It wouldn't be so bad if 10% was matched with tier 7's but that's not the way it is and it seems the game producers want it that way."
The original post never mentions anything regarding the time spent grinding a tier. I've reread my own post several times and I just don't see that anywhere so I don't know how it could even be implied. The thread title and post comments are all directly addressing the matchmaking system. Nothing else
I hope this clears it up.
Yes, we are. I'm playing the "objective review" game, and you're playing the "fanboy" game. Every game has them, and it is not possible to have a rational or meaningful conversation with them. I will not bother. Instead I say GG to you, and leave you to your self-induced, delusional world where the game you've latched onto can do no wrong.
Besides, the tiny amount of activity on this forum indicates pretty clearly that no one cares about this game anyway
I my opinion "make you want" = "force". But I don't insist. However, I still don't see how gold can help to skip level 3, unless you immensely enjoy level 3. Basically you have to grind level 3 and then pay gold to pass level 4.
I agree with Then comes tier 4 and that's when the pain begins with addition "and the pain ends". Level 5 is very playable with levels 7-8 in the team. Before you start arguing let me point you to the fact, as an example, that PzIV (lvl 5) top gun is the same as Panther (lvl8) stock and you are stuck with it at level 8 for, at very least, 40k XP. Both tanks have basically the same front armor and same speed, Panther has more HP, but Pz is much easier to hide.
And I don't believe that "level 4 pain" deserves a dedicated thread
I really didnt read much after the OP so i appologize in advance if this has been said (in a similar fashion). I can't remember any MMO I have played that didnt have a section of advancement that was less enjoyable then the rest..
I am in teir 5 in USA tanks and USSR TD's, and yeah I get put in alot of matches against teir 7. You know what I do? Follow the big guys on my team
Or just find a really good ambush spot and wait for tanks you can take out. What you are saying is a claim that your personal dislike for the "grind" is some conspiracy by the devs to make you spend more money.
I mean, if your one of those guys on the team that EVERYONE completely hates that goes off solo, driving in the middle of the open landscape and you get taken out and start spamming (hackers, i hate this matchmaking system, X tank is so OP, blah blah blah) then I would completely understand..
But for me and the majority of people I play with teir 3/4/5 just plain suck. Matchmaking system is not THAT broken (I AM NOT saying its perfect by any means... but you name a game that is PERFECT for every single person that plays PLEASE tell me so I can play it.)
My advice is STFU and go grind so you can join the big boys that keep 1 shotting you... wont it be fun when your teir 7 and can just roll around murdering all the lowbies? Sometimes the grass is greener lol
IZI MODO?! Ha-ha-ha!
First off Comicazi. No argument from me, it's just as I said as my first comment in the OP. I'm not gonna try to tell anyone they won't have fun after tier 3, just letting them know what's ahead. Any displeasure I have is my own opinion.
I completely agree that a tier 5 in same match with tier 7-8 is playable. I just would like to have more matches of say 5-7 or 4-6, in those ranges. It just gets old for me to play 90% of my matches against up to tier 8's. Typical matches for my StuG are like this (that's my StuG at the bottom left):
I've been trying out my Stug again last week and here is how it goes almost every day: First 3 matches are with tiers up to 5 with occasional 6. After that almost all matches are like the above pic. Not same tank models but the tier spread. I'm ok with it once in a while but really don't want it almost all the time. But that's just me.
Now for Quentin405. I'm tempted to just dismiss your comments as plain simple trash talk and not repsond at all. However I don't like someone pissing down my back and tell me it's raining. If you had read the whole thread you would have seen where I stated that it wouldn't be a "grind" if it were fun. But matchmaker makes it a grind.
Your 2nd comment is just ignorant. All I'll say is that if I get any comment in-game on my game play it's usually a compliment or an attaboy. The rare negative comments are from ignorant players that don't understand a thing about logical moves or tactics, and which are usually pointed out to them by other players on the team that know better.
Your 3rd comment is a jewel. You lost any hope of credibility with the "STFU". Only someone with limited capacity to communicate would resort to that. I've been going back & forth with Comicaze on things we disagree with but he never lowered himself to insults. That shows class, something you are obviously lacking.
Apparently your idea of fun is to play a higher tier tank just so you can wipe up on the lowbies. I'll go out on a limb here and bet that most players idea of fun is a competitive match. There's a new word for you to chew on. Say it slowly, competitive.
Come back and spew some more trash but I've said all I have to say to you. Anything more is a waste of effort.
Look, I simply don't see myself or any of my friends being 90% in high-level matches. It's 50/50 in my experience. And when I am at the bottom and don't want to bother "scratching paint" for 15 mins, I just "rush across the field in Malinovka", spot few tanks, got shot, exit battle, and jump into another tank - I have 8 of them, 5 elited/100% crew with perks. But again I don't know much about TDs (waiting to try American). Maybe there is a problem indeed or you are just so freaking unlucky.
Speaking about grind, you will praise your lvl 4 experience when you come across stock Porsche and Panther
That was sarcasm. quentin proposed the same as I did, if OP is 90% at the bottom of the list, then just get a higher level tank and be 90% of the time at the top, right?
WoT is personal skills based. There is no such thing as "kool epix" and "1337 gear" in the game. All equipment is readily available to everyone.
Lol, you may be right and I AM that unlucky, and it wouldn't surprise me one bit. Maybe I should platoon with you so my matches will get better. But then yours might get worse. I decided to pull my SU-85 out of the closet and same thing happened as with the StuG. First few matches were with tier 5-6 as top tank then the next 10 or so looking like trhe image I posted. Oh well, that's life.
I have considered that same thing at the beginning of a bad matchup but I wouldn't get very far in my TDs to lite up enemies, even with the StuG.
Yeah, I've heard people lament about the grind at higher levels. Due to how much the research costs if I remember right. Is that right?
My most amount of fun comes when I play my KV in tier 5. Sometimes I'm on top of the list, and sometimes I'm stuck in tier 9 battles. It does not matter. In fact, I earn more xp when I go up against the tier 9's.
Why?
One number and two words:
152mm DERP GUN (Loaded with all HE, never use AP in these types of guns)
Even the big guys fear that thing. Sure, it won't (usually) insta-pop a 4502, but it will take 20% of his HP away. Even the mighty maus is about 19% or so per shot. And just hitting ONCE is a giant amount of xp and cash. Hit them up close for even more xp (the closer you are, the more xp you get per damage). And before you say it, I'll say it:
"But it fires so slow! You're a one shot cannon!"
And that one shot kills tier 5's and below, and makes tier 6's and 7's wish they hadn't shown their face, and eats away at tier 8, 9, 10 faster than their own guns do (barring the 152's on the russian td's, etc).
The trick to firing more shots is NOT playing like a heavy tank in the KV, as it is fragile. Sure, it can bounce little tank guns fairly well, but the big guys can 1-2 shot you if you show them your face too long.
I've had a mission where I had 10 kills (10 shots, 10 kills, won sniper and top gun lol) in the thing. I won some medal I can't remember the name of for being the last guy alive on my team and killing the last 6 on their side solo (some were damaged, to be sure). My "losing" missions typically still net me 600-800, sometimes more (and sometimes less, sure I die in one shot to arty like everyone else).
1) Use your teammates as meat shields if they are higher level than you. If you're top dog in a match, then you should be able to charge forth, but it still helps to keep friends around to make your enemy "pay" if they want to shoot at you while you reload.
2) Keep near buildings or rocks that let you take cover after you take your shot. That's where the friends come in. You want that enemy to think twice about chasing you just because he knows you're reloading and can't fire back.
3) Don't take low percentage shots. Sure, you'll miss, but if you do, make sure you can hide while you reload. Taking a 300m shot at a moving tank is fine, he won't get to you before you reload. Taking a shot at a tiny portion of a moving tank 30 meters away is suicide.
Its the tank I play when I get frustrated with sniper arty or getting into too many tier 10 battles with idiots as teammates. It always makes money. It almost always brings a smile to my face. I win over 61% of my battles in the thing, I have nearly a 3:1 K/D ratio in it.
For added enjoyment, play with 2 friends in KV's as well. Even in the tier 9 battles, we're a force to be reckoned with. Turning a corner and getting derped by 3 152's is a painful experience for ANY tank
.
WOT is a great game up to tier 3 after that the game really goes down hill because of the stupid matchmaking.
I have already spent money on this game, but because of thier own greed they won't be getting another penny from me.
Level 4 is somewhat troublesome, but you can pass it in a few hours. If you can't compete at levels 5 and beyond, then you are personally not skilled enough, nothing wrong with the matchmaker.
Ok, I went back and played a few of my tier 5 tanks to log the matches and my previous number of tier 8 matches was a tad high. Not 90% as I stated but more like 80%. Still way too high for me. I played at least 50 matches each in the M10, PZ4, and T-34. So maybe it is that I just have some bizarre Twighlight Zone kind of bad luck. These matches were during various times of the day & night. The T-34 had a slightly better ratio, meaning less tier 8 matches.
I certainly feel that I have the skills to play at any tier but the skills come down to mainly just trying to survive long enough to maybe get a chance to hit one of the tanks that are not tier 7 & 8 in these matches. Let's face it, there are not a lot of options regarding tactics in these matches. Since I mainly play TDs I have to stay back and usually end up waiting to try and defend the flag.
Now when I play the T-34 it's just trying to stay alive. Trying to use the higher tiers as shields really doesn't work, at least not in MY experience. Nine times out of ten the moment the enemy spots you it is assured that you will be the next target on their crosshairs since you are a easy kill and therefore XP and credits. This includes enemy arty. And even if you do manage to get off a few shots without getting mauled the shots will either bounce or do hardly any damage at all. And yes, I know how and where to shoot tanks.
Generally speaking, I want to be able to play a match in pretty much the same way as the tier 7 & 8 tanks do. Competitvely and more than just being a tad more than useless. And I want this in all the tiers, not just the higher tiers. This does not mean I want to be top dog in every match as some will claim. Someone always does.
WoT has acknowledged it is a problem even though it's working as intended. At least as intended on the EU servers where there is enough players to make the matchmaker work. They also stated that they were concerned that trying to change it might do more harm than good but that won't be known unless they try.
A represntative of WoT stated in a interview they were working on a solution and that one idea they were considering was to make lower tier spread matches a "pay for" option. Now this really got my dander up. What that says to me is that it's ok if changing the MM does more harm than good as long as they can make money from it. If they go this route it will be the end of my WoT playing as will also with friends that play.
For now I only play my tier 2 & 3 tanks and it's fun. The tactical options are far more than in the tier 4-6 matches and there are no tanks that you can't do some team-helpful damage to. The only drawback is the totally clueless noobs you get teamed with. Hey, I was a noob once but was never clueless.
It's just a game though and tier 2 & 3 still fun.
I don't really have an issue with the matchmaker. I'm running a T29 (fully upgraded) and I'm having fun. Sure, it was a little tough when I had the 2 tanks before this one (the M6 and the introductory heavy) but I got my kills on equivalent tier or lower tanks and just fired HE rounds into the butt end of those of higher tier.
"Many nights, my friend... Many nights I've put a blade to your throat while you were sleeping. Glad I never killed you, Steve. You're alright..."
Chavez y Chavez
The Panzer IV is one of the best tanks in the game. If you are dying the second you get spotted, especially by artillery, you are doing something terribly terribly wrong. The panzerIV is not a brawling tank and isn't mean to run into the middle of combat. The long 88 has amazing accuracy, penetration and rate of fire. When you are low on the tiers, sit back and support your team with long range shots (if possible).
As a tank destroyer, you don't have to sit back and guard the flag and you might just be doing your team a disservice if you do. Some maps it is a good tactic, but other maps it is a good tactic to follow behind a pack of tanks or pick a nice sniper position and wait.
The more guns firing on a target, the quicker they die, the better your chance for victory.
If you have not played an artillery vehicle you could really benefit from trying it. Just seeing how the artillery system works, how to aim, how to lead and especially how line of fire works will help you when you player your tanks. Seeing how other vehicles use cover and go back into hiding will help all aspects of playing.
My comments regarding tactics have to do with matches that are 60% - 70% tier 7 & 8 tanks. Several of those will be arty that stay in the rear and the few tanks that are tier 5 & 6 are doing the same thing the tier 5 & 6 tanks on your team are doing, and that is also staying behind the front fighting trying to support the best they can. Don't take it too literally when I say I stay in the back defending the flag. It all depends on the tank types on both teams, how the battle unfolds, and the map.
I never said I die the second I get spotted but that a tier 5 tank will be targeted quickly the moment it's spotted by the higher tiers. If you notice I was talking about the tactic of using higher tier tanks as shields which is what most people will advise doing in these matches.
Yes, the PZ4 is one of the best tanks in the game, for it's tier. In a match as I described it's just another easy kill if it isn't careful. I play the PZ4 as a sniper as most players do simply due to it's high acurracy gun and relatively weak armor (for a tier 5 medium). Also, don't forget, those higher tier enemy tanks know how to shoot at long range also.
As a long range sniper you have to stop to get a good shot and arty many times can shoot almost all the way across the map so just because you are sniping from long range doesn't necessarily mean you are safe from them. I have not played arty but I have watched many player videos using arty so I know exactly how they play from their perspective.
I've played 6100 matches thus far combining all my tanks played and I feel confident that I know how to play and at the least am better than average. There isn't a tactic or strategy I haven'y tried.
All of this really has nothing to do with the thread topic. It's about the matches a player will face when they are in tier 4-6 tanks. As I've already said before, it's up to to the individual player to determine if they like it or not.
You got 6100 matches under your belt, but still playing PzIV, T-34 and complaining on mmorpg.com about the matchmaker? Let me put me this politely - I don't believe a single word you are saying here.
I have just over 6000, which puts me within top 1000 players on the NA server, and I am playing Maus, E-50 and have Patton open - top German heavy, medium and American medium tank respectively, clarifying for someone not familiar with the game. And at this stage I have a very meager theoretical interest in the MM discussion.
I routinely teamkill meds trying to hide behind my heavy's back or just exit the match, if there are many such idiots in the team.
IZI MODO?! Ha-ha-ha!
I never said I hide behind a heavy's back, you assumed that and are wrong. I said using them as shields. You yourself have stated that you do the same . I quote you: " I followed the "big guys" and just shot cowardly from behind". And, you stated that you fit in betwen them to see where they point their turrets. You didn't say you hid behind their backs so I didn't assume you said so. You sir are the idiot for twisting the truth of what people say. The truth hurts sometimes doesn't it.
I don't even play my tier 4,5,6 tanks anymore due to the MM. When they change it I will play them again. When I can have fun again in those tanks in competive matches then I will eventually move up to the higher tiers. Seems you have appointed yourself the judge of what tiers are fun and which are not. Sorry bud but any tier can fun and doesn't require a high tier tank. Tier 2 & 3 is what's fun for me these days and if that doesn't meet your approval then tough chit. Just the fact that you say you will TK a player says it all about you as a player. It's never good to TK someone even if they do something you don't like. It only hurts yourself and your teammates, but I guess it's all about you isn't it.
I care not if you believe me since apparently you think only people that play high tier tanks are worthy of your belief. Your attitude reeks of elitist superiorty syndrome. The type that think anyone that doesn't play high tiers are not even worthy of logging into the game. I hate to pop your balloon but the game is meant for everyone to have fun regardless of the tiers they play. I could easily post screenshots of my stats to confirm my matches played and general accomplishments but as I said, I don't give a rats a$$ if you believe me or not.
If you don't believe me then I suppose you also don't believe the vast magority of the people that complain about the MM and base their complaints on tiers 4-6. Yeah, they are all full of manure and your opinion means more than all of theirs.
I try to be respectful of people in the forums but you have shown your true colors so get over yourself and stop trying to be the almighty judge and jury of all that is WoT. Flame all you want but I shall reply no more to you. It's not worth any more of my time.
Good day.