I respect DS for being DS instead of putting on a PR mask. We need more of that in the gaming industry.
I actaully think DS has done some great things with Alganon and I dont think it deserves the hate it gets.
Playing: PO, EVE Waiting for: WoD Favourite MMOs: VG, EVE, FE and DDO Any person who expresses rage and loathing for an MMO is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae.
1. I had nothing to do with "Tork" leaving QOL. That was before my time.
2. We haven't hired a replacement community manager because the guys are doing just fine and it is a waste of money. You don't need to have a CM just because someone says that you do.
3. The forums were an unruly place before I came in. Then I asked the guys to enforce the TOS and without any exceptions. So guess what? Those who couldn't abide by them either left or were banned. No exceptions. I believe in quality, not quantity. And if the signal to noise ratio is low, then people will find information that much quicker without having to wade through a pile of crap. It is a gaming forum, not someone's backyard or living room where they can do as they please. Our house. Our rules.
The business of game development is not about a popularity contest. It is about principles and goals. I'm neither a diplomat nor a politician; so I don't need to impress anyone or be "one of the guys because it's kewl" so that I don't rub people the wrong way.
As long as myself and the team are achieving our goals - which we we're doing just fine - I don't particularly care about anything else - or what anyone says for that matter.
If you like the game, play it. If you don't like it, don't play it.
Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living. If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead ...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.
3. The forums were an unruly place before I came in. Then I asked the guys to enforce the TOS and without any exceptions. So guess what? Those who couldn't abide by them either left of were banned. No exceptions. I believe in quantity, not quality. And if the signal to noise ratio is low, then people will find information that much quicker without having to wade through a pile of crap. It is a gaming forum, not someone's backyard or living room where they can do as they please. Our house. Our rules.
I guess this was a typo, or a Freudian slip up If not, then it's not entirely clear what you mean.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
haha yah, typo on my part. I've said the same thing over and over already, so those who've seen already may recognize it as a typo. Thanks for pointing it out.
Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living. If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead ...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
Can't really say that I blame Derek Smart for sometimes blasting people for some of the stupid things they say. It is amazing just how ignorant some players can be toward developers. If you don't like a game just move on.
I for one am impressed that Mr. Smart takes the time to engage the community on various forums. Plus no one can doubt his passion for Alganon. I have seen many companies throw in the towel on countless games way too early. So a big thumbs up to you Mr. Smart for all your hard work and effort. And thanks for not giving up on the game.
I look forward to exploring all that Alganon has to offer.
Originally posted by kakasaki Originally posted by MadDemon64
Originally posted by kakasaki
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by vesavius
So I am going to have a look. It's free, why not.
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out. But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic... His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space. Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
He dislikes or hates Alganon and/or Derek Smart. Every person who doesn't share this same opinion is evidence that his opinion could be wrong. Or her opinion. Odds say 'him', but could be a 'her'.
You're right. There is no harm in trying a game out, even if you end up not liking it. If nothing else, you learn that you don't like it. You might learn that you do like it. Not a real big deal.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
This game isn't flashy and it doesn't have the high tech feel of some of the other fantasy MMO's out there. What it does have is a great community and most of all potential. I'm pretty old school, I remember when pong first came out, I played all the AD&D Gold Box games on a Commadore 64 and it erks me a tad when people quit playing without giving a title a chance. Slow down and play this game, read the quests and get into the RP of RPG.
I'm not a fanboy, I have P2P accounts on 3 MMO's but I still love this game because it isn't easy, there are no questhelpers, addons, but most of all it has people helping one another, not talking trash about each other.
Anyway, like the poster above me said he was going to do, give it a chance, a real chance.
Exactly.
There is so much more to the game and community than most are even willing to consider - and simply because everyone likes a good train wreck; even if it is imagined and has no basis in reality.
Derek, you spent this entire thread discussing why you feel you are within your rights to speak your mind on internet forums (against common wisdom and business practices that most firms of any type would practice)
I'm not going to debate that with you, its clear you would never yield on this topic based on your long history of doing it your way.
But I would point out, this thread was an excellent opportunity for you, the PR person to lay out to those reading why we would want to consider playing Alganon. That's why I originally stopped by, to see why the OP thought it was worth another look, because generally speaking, once a game goes DOA like this one did, there is no reason to.
So how about, since you've taken over, what sorts of improvements have occurred since those dark, early Pre-DS day when we all read so much (bad) about the game?
I'd be very interested in learning why you think Alganon is worth a look today, in case I'm missing something.
And no, don't say, "its free to try, come see for yourself" My time is extremely limited, I definitely need some decent reasons to even consider the download or I won't bother.
Oh, if its not worth your trouble to try and earn my business, that's OK too, I'll simply spend my money elsewhere.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
This game isn't flashy and it doesn't have the high tech feel of some of the other fantasy MMO's out there. What it does have is a great community and most of all potential. I'm pretty old school, I remember when pong first came out, I played all the AD&D Gold Box games on a Commadore 64 and it erks me a tad when people quit playing without giving a title a chance. Slow down and play this game, read the quests and get into the RP of RPG.
I'm not a fanboy, I have P2P accounts on 3 MMO's but I still love this game because it isn't easy, there are no questhelpers, addons, but most of all it has people helping one another, not talking trash about each other.
Anyway, like the poster above me said he was going to do, give it a chance, a real chance.
Exactly.
There is so much more to the game and community than most are even willing to consider - and simply because everyone likes a good train wreck; even if it is imagined and has no basis in reality.
Derek, you spent this entire thread discussing why you feel you are within your rights to speak your mind on internet forums (against common wisdom and business practices that most firms of any type would practice)
I'm not going to debate that with you, its clear you would never yield on this topic based on your long history of doing it your way.
But I would point out, this thread was an excellent opportunity for you, the PR person to lay out to those reading why we would want to consider playing Alganon. That's why I originally stopped by, to see why the OP thought it was worth another look, because generally speaking, once a game goes DOA like this one did, there is no reason to.
So how about, since you've taken over, what sorts of improvements have occurred since those dark, early Pre-DS day when we all read so much (bad) about the game?
I'd be very interested in learning why you think Alganon is worth a look today, in case I'm missing something.
And no, don't say, "its free to try, come see for yourself" My time is extremely limited, I definitely need some decent reasons to even consider the download or I won't bother.
Oh, if its not worth your trouble to try and earn my business, that's OK too, I'll simply spend my money elsewhere.
I'm still waiting on those pictures of the new updated models he promised us months ago. Seriously, how long does it take someone who is in charge of a game to take some pictures? It took me 5 minutes to take a picture in a game I play, and 5 more minutes to turn it into a demotivational poster.
I am honestly starting to think that he will never post those model pictures.
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
You definition is wrong. Here, free means free in terms of MONEY, not time. Wasting 30 min on a game that has this much bad press? NOT worth the time.
I would much rather play HellGate London, or what not ... it is not like i have an abundance of TIME for free (in terms of money) games.
Balance that against movies, books, tv shows, and it is even more silly to try something like Alganon. Would you watch all the bad movies in the world, if they are ALL FREE?
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
You definition is wrong. Here, free means free in terms of MONEY, not time. Wasting 30 min on a game that has this much bad press? NOT worth the time.
I would much rather play HellGate London, or what not ... it is not like i have an abundance of TIME for free (in terms of money) games.
Balance that against movies, books, tv shows, and it is even more silly to try something like Alganon. Would you watch all the bad movies in the world, if they are ALL FREE?
Fair enough, that is your opinion. But, your intro there should be changed to "NOT worth my time."
After all, you and I might consider it a waste of time but other people would not...
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
It looked great, very nice scenery. I enjoyed the quest layout, no tedious back and forth. Interesting skill system, which binds wow with an eve style time progression system.
In fact the game is basically a better looking wow, quest spam type game.
However, there was some pretty serious...turn offs with the game.
First is the "oh you can just buy the best gear and skills in the cash shop"...really? Alright i guess this ties into my next issue with the game, which makes this issue make all the more sense.
No other players. Yeah you got that right. I played on both factions, at various times of the day, over the weekend ect. One faction had zero, not one single player, none in chat, nothing, just me. Other faction at least had a few afk people in the main city, and i saw one other guy running around, we both had a good laugh with "holy crap another player" being said by both. This faction had some responses in chat with a fair amount of prodding and doubting their existance. In all my years of gaming ive never see so few people online, especially for a game with no financial barriers to entry.
Then there was the sloppy combat. It wasnt lag, no one was on, everything ran smooth, it was something along the lines of the game not knowing where i was, where the mob was and what attacks i was attempting to execute. For instance, my melee guy would whack on the mob several times before anything registerd, and then several times after the mob had died, however the mob was still there killing me. My mage, well i knew how many fireball killed a mob, but sometimes it would take 3 times as many, as non were registering. Both characters had many deaths because the low level mobs i was testing this on would get a whole lot of attacks in while the game seemed to be figuring out what was going on. I cant imagine this game offering any type of satisfactory pvp or end game pve with this sort of sloppy combat. Mobs seemed to rubberband all over the place, as melee mobs landed hit after hit before i was in melee range, and as they ran right through me out of melee range again, then popped up behind me ect, landing hits the whole time (this is why i made a mage btw)
My conclusion, is that someone put their heart and soul into the world, its beautifull and laid out well, however its paired to one of the worst combay systems ive seen in a game, even games with alpha state combat placeholders. As for long time play, well at some point your gonna meet someone who basically bought their character in the cash shop, granted there are other people playing since there seemed to be zero to 5 new players in the weeks i casually played. Its a nice game to wander around for a bit and look at stuff, a nice game to check out the skills, but other than that, its a very loney, buggy, unenjoyable game, granted i hold a games combat as one of the most importat features.
Merge this game with a real combat system, get rid of focusing this game toward wow players (who wouldnt leave their game for a crappier version that just looked nicer), get rid of the cash shop that is more buy to win than any other ive ever seen, and mabey focus more on the skills and the time progression system *( make the game unique i guess) rename it and it might grow a niche crowd to it.
Right now, i dont see who is funding this game, because its certainly not player(s)...
I agree poeple should not judge gaems on what other poeple say
Playing: Single player games |
Awaiting: Wild Star |Blade & Soul | The Repopulation | The Elder Scrolls online | ArcheAge | Firefall | Survarium | Bless | Black Desert |
Played: Guild Wars | Diablo 3 |The War Z | Runescape |World of Warcraft |Combat Arms |Perfect World | Rift | Fiesta | DC universe online | Aion | Age of Conan |Allods | Vindictus | The Secret World | Forge | Battle of the Immortals | Global Agenda| Cabal Online | Tera |
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
You definition is wrong. Here, free means free in terms of MONEY, not time. Wasting 30 min on a game that has this much bad press? NOT worth the time.
I would much rather play HellGate London, or what not ... it is not like i have an abundance of TIME for free (in terms of money) games.
Balance that against movies, books, tv shows, and it is even more silly to try something like Alganon. Would you watch all the bad movies in the world, if they are ALL FREE?
I can see where someones time is limited when they have waisted 3000 plus replies on this forum. Download the ame and try it. Can do that while you work towards another useless 3000 posts. How do you even get that many. There arent enough interesting things to post about on here.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
There is so much more to the game and community than most are even willing to consider - and simply because everyone likes a good train wreck; even if it is imagined and has no basis in reality.
Derek Smart, Derek Smart, Derek Smart. I have to say, Derek, I'm from Liverpool and you really let the side down.
Ultimately, this game is pretty much down the drain. Bad marketting, a lack of decent game design and I think I'll just stop there because the list goes on and on. There's been no real recovery, the game is pretty much still at the state it was at launch and it's got so much competition from better games in the same area (which is why we make NICHE games, guys, not try to compete with the bloody elephant in the room) that it is royally buggered.
This game isn't flashy and it doesn't have the high tech feel of some of the other fantasy MMO's out there. What it does have is a great community and most of all potential. I'm pretty old school, I remember when pong first came out, I played all the AD&D Gold Box games on a Commadore 64 and it erks me a tad when people quit playing without giving a title a chance. Slow down and play this game, read the quests and get into the RP of RPG.
I wanted to comment on the bit in blue because, in my several times trying the game, I've had exactly the opposite experience. The community has been very unresponsive and rather unfriendly. I'll get a few token "hellos" when I say hello in my faction's channel (on either side), but beyond that, nothing. And I've played at different times of day/night.
Not only that, I barely see anyone talking to anyone in that channel. Once in a while you'll see someone ask a question. Sometimes they get an answer. Sometimes they don't.
The last time I played, I tried on several occasions to interact and talk with the community - or at least whom ever was online. I commented on how quiet it was and how it seemed that people hardly ever responded when a question was asked, etc. It was suggested I should join a guild, as that would change things for me.
Well, when I inquired of any possible guilds that are recruiting or what would be a good way to get in touch with members of one, the only answer I got, was a rather snarky "Talk to people and get to know them". Which was, in the context of when it was said, obviously a sarcastic jibe based on my having noted how quiet it was and how unresponsive people are.
For me to get to know people, or vice-versa, there has to be actual conversation. There can't be actual conversation when I'm talking to a wall 90% of the time.
Outside of the specific sarcastic jibe I noted above, I've had exactly the same experience every time I play. The community has consistently been the single weakest part of the experience in my time.
I see it claimed how Alganon has an active and helpful community... and I've yet to see it for myself. Perhaps it's only active and friendly if you're already part of a guild or something. But as a new player, it's a few voices shy of being a ghost town in my experience. I personally don't consider guilds as "community" by themselves. Community is everyone on the server. Guilds are a subset of that.
I would love to get to know people, join a guild and experience this wonderful community I see/read so much about. After several wholehearted tries, though, I'm just not seeing it.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
This game isn't flashy and it doesn't have the high tech feel of some of the other fantasy MMO's out there. What it does have is a great community and most of all potential. I'm pretty old school, I remember when pong first came out, I played all the AD&D Gold Box games on a Commadore 64 and it erks me a tad when people quit playing without giving a title a chance. Slow down and play this game, read the quests and get into the RP of RPG.
I wanted to comment on the bit in blue because, in my several times trying the game, I've had exactly the opposite experience. The community has been very unresponsive and rather unfriendly. I'll get a few token "hellos" when I say hello in my faction's channel (on either side), but beyond that, nothing. And I've played at different times of day/night.
Not only that, I barely see anyone talking to anyone in that channel. Once in a while you'll see someone ask a question. Sometimes they get an answer. Sometimes they don't.
The last time I played, I tried on several occasions to interact and talk with the community - or at least whom ever was online. I commented on how quiet it was and how it seemed that people hardly ever responded when a question was asked, etc. It was suggested I should join a guild, as that would change things for me.
Well, when I inquired of any possible guilds that are recruiting or what would be a good way to get in touch with members of one, the only answer I got, was a rather snarky "Talk to people and get to know them". Which was, in the context of when it was said, obviously a sarcastic jibe based on my having noted how quiet it was and how unresponsive people are.
For me to get to know people, or vice-versa, there has to be actual conversation. There can't be actual conversation when I'm talking to a wall 90% of the time.
Outside of the specific sarcastic jibe I noted above, I've had exactly the same experience every time I play. The community has consistently been the single weakest part of the experience in my time.
I see it claimed how Alganon has an active and helpful community... and I've yet to see it for myself. Perhaps it's only active and friendly if you're already part of a guild or something. But as a new player, it's a few voices shy of being a ghost town in my experience. I personally don't consider guilds as "community" by themselves. Community is everyone on the server. Guilds are a subset of that.
I would love to get to know people, join a guild and experience this wonderful community I see/read so much about. After several wholehearted tries, though, I'm just not seeing it.
That pretty much sums up my experience on the forums, but I had a less enjoyable experience. There the community is only active and helpful to those who are fully accepting of the game and do not give criticism of any kind. Alganon, in my eyes, went from a game that was ruined by game crippling bugs and content that bordered on plagiarism, to a game that is ruined by a tiny community populated with unfriendly people.
Speaking of content, any word on the upcoming expansion? I have only heard about it when it was announced, and there has been no word about it since, not even a notice that the expansion was being delayed (it was promised to be released in winter 2011, but its 2012 now, and the fact that it was delayed and that there was no word that it would be delayed is a grim sign, probably that the game is on its last legs, but nobody wants to admit it).
I was going to try it back at launch anyway. Seems like they had a pretty reasonable buy to play option then.
Other games came along and I lost general interest. So why not try it now that it's more free to try than it seemed like it was at the last moment in time I cared to look at it. ( A bit better than a year or two ago right? )
Thanks for pointing it out again.
I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.
Well I had this download over night and spent the morning playing for more hours than I intended. This isn't exactly the same thing as getting lost in a SimCity game or AOE2 skirmish..
-Likes The skill system seems excellent. A step in the right direction. There's the timed training to gain different stats, specializations, and even access to more quests. I don't get the system over all. But yeah I've played for 4 hours and can only compare it to strat games and other MMOs I've played that has tried to use it.
The art is big, the models are big. It's big and it feels big.
The class system seems pretty standard with some room to customize. I have a reaver who looks like he can gain access to some spells as well as tanking skills.
-Dislikes Why put so much effort into creating a product to start skimping at the most seen part of your game? The animation feels too sluggish. I've been told it will speed up as I level, well your first impression is: WHY THE HELL AM I MOVING SO FUCKING SLOW?! Sorry, it's the part of a MMO that people should work on most in my opinion.
Usual dumb AI, and what quests you get at the hubs are rather un-inspired. Sure I'm low level, but why not introduce me to the world? Instead I'm told to go out into a field absolutely filled with mindless mobs just tracking back and forth over top of one another. That I had to run through a mostly empty field to get to. Mind you, as slowly as friggin' possible.
-Other Thoughts I don't mind the art work. The "Inn" being so empty was laughable. If I had a ton of time to really "work" to get into the game I feel that I could, but really I think the developers should spend more time trying to convince me it's a good idea. Rather than thinking (Well they've done it in every other themepark, so we'll just put them into the drill.) Fix the animation. The textures and stuff are easy things for people to pick up on and gripe about, knock their socks off with some new animation. Give us two or three skills at the beginning so we can feel useful. I know 2 hours invested in a tank class to get the usual special strike, buff shout, and bleed / taunt stuff has worked for others in the past. But a unique class ability sooner rather than later could help the game stand out some.
I dunno. I'll keep it installed and see if I care to give it another go by the weekend.
I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.
I did the same thing over a year ago. With all the hype, the f2p re-release, negative word-of-mouth, etc..., I figured the only way to really find out about the game was to play it ,so I did. What I found was a game I enjoyed, but also felt was flawed in a number of significant and obvious ways. I also had serious questions regaring the pay-to-win factor, but Mr. Smart and other staff members were good enough to listen to and respond to my questions. I honestly felt they took my issues seriously and I felt their response alleviated my concern.
Ultimately, irrespective of the various technical issues that bothered me about the game, what bothered me most was the lack of other players. There just never seemed to be enough other players online for me to play with, ever... I soloed to 30 and barely saw other players or heard them in chat. A huge part of playing a MMO is the social interaction; grouping and playing through content can be a great experience, much less simply being able to chat and socialize. During my play time, that factor was pretty much non-existent.
Would I play Alganon again? Sure. Is there anything really pulling me back into it, especially over any other game that may interest me right now? Not at all. I could take it or leave it.
I did the same thing over a year ago. With all the hype, the f2p re-release, negative word-of-mouth, etc..., I figured the only way to really find out about the game was to play it ,so I did. What I found was a game I enjoyed, but also felt was flawed in a number of significant and obvious ways. I also had serious questions regaring the pay-to-win factor, but Mr. Smart and other staff members were good enough to listen to and respond to my questions. I honestly felt they took my issues seriously and I felt their response alleviated my concern.
Ultimately, irrespective of the various technical issues that bothered me about the game, what bothered me most was the lack of other players. There just never seemed to be enough other players online for me to play with, ever... I soloed to 30 and barely saw other players or heard them in chat. A huge part of playing a MMO is the social interaction; grouping and playing through content can be a great experience, much less simply being able to chat and socialize. During my play time, that factor was pretty much non-existent.
Would I play Alganon again? Sure. Is there anything really pulling me back into it, especially over any other game that may interest me right now? Not at all. I could take it or leave it.
Indeed - but the CATCH-22 situation is that some people jump in (usually at odd times depending), don't see many others - or don't actually know how to find/contact them - then leave. I've seen that flow for almost two years (next month) now since I took over the company and development.
Anyway, there are a number of things in the works so I remain optimistic that it will continue to grow - albeit slowly.
Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living. If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead ...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.
Comments
I just wanted to say 2 things
I respect DS for being DS instead of putting on a PR mask. We need more of that in the gaming industry.
I actaully think DS has done some great things with Alganon and I dont think it deserves the hate it gets.
Playing: PO, EVE
Waiting for: WoD
Favourite MMOs: VG, EVE, FE and DDO
Any person who expresses rage and loathing for an MMO is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae.
Mr. Smart, is it really clever to hire a whole dev team if you ended up building your game "from the ground up single handedly"?
In any case, I have respect for people who dare to be who they are and hold on to what they belive in. Even though it's not always very smart
For the record
1. I had nothing to do with "Tork" leaving QOL. That was before my time.
2. We haven't hired a replacement community manager because the guys are doing just fine and it is a waste of money. You don't need to have a CM just because someone says that you do.
3. The forums were an unruly place before I came in. Then I asked the guys to enforce the TOS and without any exceptions. So guess what? Those who couldn't abide by them either left or were banned. No exceptions. I believe in quality, not quantity. And if the signal to noise ratio is low, then people will find information that much quicker without having to wade through a pile of crap. It is a gaming forum, not someone's backyard or living room where they can do as they please. Our house. Our rules.
The business of game development is not about a popularity contest. It is about principles and goals. I'm neither a diplomat nor a politician; so I don't need to impress anyone or be "one of the guys because it's kewl" so that I don't rub people the wrong way.
As long as myself and the team are achieving our goals - which we we're doing just fine - I don't particularly care about anything else - or what anyone says for that matter.
If you like the game, play it. If you don't like it, don't play it.
Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.
I guess this was a typo, or a Freudian slip up
If not, then it's not entirely clear what you mean.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
haha yah, typo on my part. I've said the same thing over and over already, so those who've seen already may recognize it as a typo. Thanks for pointing it out.
Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Since when is Tuesday a direction?
Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
Can't really say that I blame Derek Smart for sometimes blasting people for some of the stupid things they say. It is amazing just how ignorant some players can be toward developers. If you don't like a game just move on.
I for one am impressed that Mr. Smart takes the time to engage the community on various forums. Plus no one can doubt his passion for Alganon. I have seen many companies throw in the towel on countless games way too early. So a big thumbs up to you Mr. Smart for all your hard work and effort. And thanks for not giving up on the game.
I look forward to exploring all that Alganon has to offer.
Waste of time. There are hundreds better F2P games out there. Being free is no longer a reason to try out.
But if it is free, why not try it out? Sorry, I just don't get your logic...
His logic is that a long time ago, few games were free. Mosts games required subscriptions. Nowadays, more and more games are becoming free, and for every good free to play game, there are ten bad free to play games. He is saying that you should be a smart consumer and think not about paying for games with money, but with time and disk space.
Ok, I see his point now. But, like I said, if it is free... by the very definition of free, it cost nothing to try. Hell, anyone with 30 min to burn can give a free game a whirl. What's the harm?
He dislikes or hates Alganon and/or Derek Smart. Every person who doesn't share this same opinion is evidence that his opinion could be wrong. Or her opinion. Odds say 'him', but could be a 'her'.
You're right. There is no harm in trying a game out, even if you end up not liking it. If nothing else, you learn that you don't like it. You might learn that you do like it. Not a real big deal.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Derek, you spent this entire thread discussing why you feel you are within your rights to speak your mind on internet forums (against common wisdom and business practices that most firms of any type would practice)
I'm not going to debate that with you, its clear you would never yield on this topic based on your long history of doing it your way.
But I would point out, this thread was an excellent opportunity for you, the PR person to lay out to those reading why we would want to consider playing Alganon. That's why I originally stopped by, to see why the OP thought it was worth another look, because generally speaking, once a game goes DOA like this one did, there is no reason to.
So how about, since you've taken over, what sorts of improvements have occurred since those dark, early Pre-DS day when we all read so much (bad) about the game?
I'd be very interested in learning why you think Alganon is worth a look today, in case I'm missing something.
And no, don't say, "its free to try, come see for yourself" My time is extremely limited, I definitely need some decent reasons to even consider the download or I won't bother.
Oh, if its not worth your trouble to try and earn my business, that's OK too, I'll simply spend my money elsewhere.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I'm still waiting on those pictures of the new updated models he promised us months ago. Seriously, how long does it take someone who is in charge of a game to take some pictures? It took me 5 minutes to take a picture in a game I play, and 5 more minutes to turn it into a demotivational poster.
I am honestly starting to think that he will never post those model pictures.
Since when is Tuesday a direction?
You definition is wrong. Here, free means free in terms of MONEY, not time. Wasting 30 min on a game that has this much bad press? NOT worth the time.
I would much rather play HellGate London, or what not ... it is not like i have an abundance of TIME for free (in terms of money) games.
Balance that against movies, books, tv shows, and it is even more silly to try something like Alganon. Would you watch all the bad movies in the world, if they are ALL FREE?
Fair enough, that is your opinion. But, your intro there should be changed to "NOT worth my time."
After all, you and I might consider it a waste of time but other people would not...
A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true...
I played this game for a little a few months ago.
It looked great, very nice scenery. I enjoyed the quest layout, no tedious back and forth. Interesting skill system, which binds wow with an eve style time progression system.
In fact the game is basically a better looking wow, quest spam type game.
However, there was some pretty serious...turn offs with the game.
First is the "oh you can just buy the best gear and skills in the cash shop"...really? Alright i guess this ties into my next issue with the game, which makes this issue make all the more sense.
No other players. Yeah you got that right. I played on both factions, at various times of the day, over the weekend ect. One faction had zero, not one single player, none in chat, nothing, just me. Other faction at least had a few afk people in the main city, and i saw one other guy running around, we both had a good laugh with "holy crap another player" being said by both. This faction had some responses in chat with a fair amount of prodding and doubting their existance. In all my years of gaming ive never see so few people online, especially for a game with no financial barriers to entry.
Then there was the sloppy combat. It wasnt lag, no one was on, everything ran smooth, it was something along the lines of the game not knowing where i was, where the mob was and what attacks i was attempting to execute. For instance, my melee guy would whack on the mob several times before anything registerd, and then several times after the mob had died, however the mob was still there killing me. My mage, well i knew how many fireball killed a mob, but sometimes it would take 3 times as many, as non were registering. Both characters had many deaths because the low level mobs i was testing this on would get a whole lot of attacks in while the game seemed to be figuring out what was going on. I cant imagine this game offering any type of satisfactory pvp or end game pve with this sort of sloppy combat. Mobs seemed to rubberband all over the place, as melee mobs landed hit after hit before i was in melee range, and as they ran right through me out of melee range again, then popped up behind me ect, landing hits the whole time (this is why i made a mage btw)
My conclusion, is that someone put their heart and soul into the world, its beautifull and laid out well, however its paired to one of the worst combay systems ive seen in a game, even games with alpha state combat placeholders. As for long time play, well at some point your gonna meet someone who basically bought their character in the cash shop, granted there are other people playing since there seemed to be zero to 5 new players in the weeks i casually played. Its a nice game to wander around for a bit and look at stuff, a nice game to check out the skills, but other than that, its a very loney, buggy, unenjoyable game, granted i hold a games combat as one of the most importat features.
Merge this game with a real combat system, get rid of focusing this game toward wow players (who wouldnt leave their game for a crappier version that just looked nicer), get rid of the cash shop that is more buy to win than any other ive ever seen, and mabey focus more on the skills and the time progression system *( make the game unique i guess) rename it and it might grow a niche crowd to it.
Right now, i dont see who is funding this game, because its certainly not player(s)...
I agree poeple should not judge gaems on what other poeple say
Playing: Single player games |
Awaiting: Wild Star |Blade & Soul | The Repopulation | The Elder Scrolls online | ArcheAge | Firefall | Survarium | Bless | Black Desert |
Played: Guild Wars | Diablo 3 |The War Z | Runescape |World of Warcraft |Combat Arms |Perfect World | Rift | Fiesta | DC universe online | Aion | Age of Conan |Allods | Vindictus | The Secret World | Forge | Battle of the Immortals | Global Agenda| Cabal Online | Tera |
I can see where someones time is limited when they have waisted 3000 plus replies on this forum. Download the ame and try it. Can do that while you work towards another useless 3000 posts. How do you even get that many. There arent enough interesting things to post about on here.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
Derek Smart, Derek Smart, Derek Smart. I have to say, Derek, I'm from Liverpool and you really let the side down.
Ultimately, this game is pretty much down the drain. Bad marketting, a lack of decent game design and I think I'll just stop there because the list goes on and on. There's been no real recovery, the game is pretty much still at the state it was at launch and it's got so much competition from better games in the same area (which is why we make NICHE games, guys, not try to compete with the bloody elephant in the room) that it is royally buggered.
Add me on Steam!
Me and a Friend are Bad At Games
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
That pretty much sums up my experience on the forums, but I had a less enjoyable experience. There the community is only active and helpful to those who are fully accepting of the game and do not give criticism of any kind. Alganon, in my eyes, went from a game that was ruined by game crippling bugs and content that bordered on plagiarism, to a game that is ruined by a tiny community populated with unfriendly people.
Speaking of content, any word on the upcoming expansion? I have only heard about it when it was announced, and there has been no word about it since, not even a notice that the expansion was being delayed (it was promised to be released in winter 2011, but its 2012 now, and the fact that it was delayed and that there was no word that it would be delayed is a grim sign, probably that the game is on its last legs, but nobody wants to admit it).
Since when is Tuesday a direction?
Eh I'll download it.
I was going to try it back at launch anyway. Seems like they had a pretty reasonable buy to play option then.
Other games came along and I lost general interest.
So why not try it now that it's more free to try than it seemed like it was at the last moment in time I cared to look at it. ( A bit better than a year or two ago right? )
Thanks for pointing it out again.
I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.
Well I had this download over night and spent the morning playing for more hours than I intended. This isn't exactly the same thing as getting lost in a SimCity game or AOE2 skirmish..
-Likes
The skill system seems excellent. A step in the right direction. There's the timed training to gain different stats, specializations, and even access to more quests. I don't get the system over all. But yeah I've played for 4 hours and can only compare it to strat games and other MMOs I've played that has tried to use it.
The art is big, the models are big. It's big and it feels big.
The class system seems pretty standard with some room to customize. I have a reaver who looks like he can gain access to some spells as well as tanking skills.
-Dislikes
Why put so much effort into creating a product to start skimping at the most seen part of your game? The animation feels too sluggish. I've been told it will speed up as I level, well your first impression is: WHY THE HELL AM I MOVING SO FUCKING SLOW?! Sorry, it's the part of a MMO that people should work on most in my opinion.
Usual dumb AI, and what quests you get at the hubs are rather un-inspired. Sure I'm low level, but why not introduce me to the world? Instead I'm told to go out into a field absolutely filled with mindless mobs just tracking back and forth over top of one another. That I had to run through a mostly empty field to get to. Mind you, as slowly as friggin' possible.
-Other Thoughts
I don't mind the art work. The "Inn" being so empty was laughable.
If I had a ton of time to really "work" to get into the game I feel that I could, but really I think the developers should spend more time trying to convince me it's a good idea. Rather than thinking (Well they've done it in every other themepark, so we'll just put them into the drill.)
Fix the animation. The textures and stuff are easy things for people to pick up on and gripe about, knock their socks off with some new animation.
Give us two or three skills at the beginning so we can feel useful. I know 2 hours invested in a tank class to get the usual special strike, buff shout, and bleed / taunt stuff has worked for others in the past.
But a unique class ability sooner rather than later could help the game stand out some.
I dunno.
I'll keep it installed and see if I care to give it another go by the weekend.
I used to play MMOs like you, but then I took an arrow to the knee.
I did the same thing over a year ago. With all the hype, the f2p re-release, negative word-of-mouth, etc..., I figured the only way to really find out about the game was to play it ,so I did. What I found was a game I enjoyed, but also felt was flawed in a number of significant and obvious ways. I also had serious questions regaring the pay-to-win factor, but Mr. Smart and other staff members were good enough to listen to and respond to my questions. I honestly felt they took my issues seriously and I felt their response alleviated my concern.
Ultimately, irrespective of the various technical issues that bothered me about the game, what bothered me most was the lack of other players. There just never seemed to be enough other players online for me to play with, ever... I soloed to 30 and barely saw other players or heard them in chat. A huge part of playing a MMO is the social interaction; grouping and playing through content can be a great experience, much less simply being able to chat and socialize. During my play time, that factor was pretty much non-existent.
Would I play Alganon again? Sure. Is there anything really pulling me back into it, especially over any other game that may interest me right now? Not at all. I could take it or leave it.
Indeed - but the CATCH-22 situation is that some people jump in (usually at odd times depending), don't see many others - or don't actually know how to find/contact them - then leave. I've seen that flow for almost two years (next month) now since I took over the company and development.
Anyway, there are a number of things in the works so I remain optimistic that it will continue to grow - albeit slowly.
Game developers are just human beings who happen to make games for a living.
If you want to hold us up to higher standards of conduct, then go ahead
...but don't be surprised if we don't uphold them.