The game wo'n't fail in a business sense and unfortunately or not that is the only sense that matters. EA will make money on this of that I have no doubt. Will some be disappoined? Will some complain? Will it be very simiar to many MMOs of the past? The most likely answer to all of these questions is yes. Regardless of player opinion, most will buy the game and play it for a while at least. This will be enough to make EA money which will only enforce the current MMO model as a success in the business community. Therefore, the next MMOs will be similar as well.
“It's unwise to pay too much, but it's worse to pay too little. When you pay too much, you lose a little money - that's all. When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing it was bought to do. The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot - it can't be done. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run, and if you do that you will have enough to pay for something better.”
I haven't really looked up a whole lot of info on ToR, but I'd like to know one thing: how will end-game items work out? As in, will all Jedi's be using the same lightsaber? I mean, there can't be much customization with lightsabers(different shapes, added jewels like in WoW, etc). Just wanna know, anyone have any idea?
especially since that other topic about how ToR will be able to have so many more worlds by 2025... I wouldn't be too thrilled to just replace 1 saber with another, after another, for a different color or something lol.
Bioware's being really tight-lipped about "end game" content.
I don't know why... we're paying for the game, we should know what we are getting.... If it isn't because of story reasons, than it is because of nefarious reasons.
Actually, even those of us who HAVE sucessfully pre-ordered havn't paid for anything yet.
And this is Bioware we're talking about...it almost certainly IS for "story reasons".
For story reasons is no reason not to tell us what kind of content it is. If I had know rift was going to pull the plug on 10 man raids 2 weeks before release, or that leveling in rifts was going to be nerfed into the ground in the transition from beta to release I wouldn't have pre-ordered (and im no not likely to ever pre-order again). On the flip side, for some people, less that 25 man raids is not acceptable. All they want is good endgame content. Why would they pre-order?
I don't blame them for allowing us to pre-order early .. but I do blame myself for buying into it (Rift).
Really though I would have played Rift anyway. It was fun for 2-3 months and worth the box price .. just arguing a point because more information would be appreciated. I probably wont ever pre-order again though.
That is a perfectly understand approach. Best if your not sure of a games quality or if it will have what your looking for to just wait it out and get more info. No reason to burn any money on a product your not sure if you'll like or not.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
He cared enough to feel he needed to pay 150 for a CE, look at his SWTOR post history (before the CE/Pre-order announcment), I can't help but LOL.
I'm not attacking the guy, I just want to bring his history to light, as it is highly ironic and gives reason to just ignore him from now on.
Greedy over inflated ego company says fuck you to their fans by charging Halo 3 like prices to their CE? Hey, i been stressed out all week long wandering how I am gonna come up with the money to get this thing... and I have no idea how well this game is even gonna do... It could possibly be a failure is all I'm saying... Certain to fail? No probably not, could fail.. yes it is very possible.
This company allowed all the praise and awards to go to it's head and then decided to drop the bombshell, you better be rich if you want it , CE box on us all.. That is what caught me by surprised and it has sent me into a rage ever since.
Then a freakin cool/rich kids club "Vip lounge" to rub it in.
What I'm referring to is your highly polarized transition from one extreme to another. Otherwise I'd agree with your stand, most corps have over-inflated egos, and price things unrealistically. Which is why I don't buy CE's or even pre-order games. In the end you usually only end up with a few gimmicks to use in-game; not to mention you're 5-10 dollars poorer than you would have been if you would have just waited. That's just me though, I don't expect others to feel that way.
Of course TOR could fail, I'd never say otherwise, far too many failures in this genre to overlook that possibility.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Okay, I'll play along with the "what if" scenario.
What if Bioware is full of fake promises too.Are u ever going to trust them on an mmo or for singleplayer games?
Answer to that would be no. Bioware would go on my list alongside SOE and Cryptic as companies whose products I would never buy again. It's one thing to make a bad game. It's a whole other thing to lie to your customers about what will be in the game. I have zero tolerance for that sort of thing.
And if Swtor fails then what games are u going to look forward to.
No big deal. Life will go on. Arkahm City will becoming out this year and I look forward to spending time in that.
Having said all this, I don't foresee either scenario happening. Almost every feature that they have touted in game has been available for all to see. Bioware has been very upfront about what this game is and what will be in it. Their decisions have upset the old school MMO traditionalists but at least fans of that genre have had two years to get over it and move on. Quite different from what SOE and Cryptic have pulled on their fanbase in the past.Often at the last minute..
No such thing as fail in SWTOR. Unless the world exploded.
funny you should mention that.
see whats really going to happen is the game is going to get pushed back till nov 2012, and shortly after release on nov 13 2012 all of the servers are going to fail and the collective conscious of 5 generations of star wars fan nerd rage is going to implode the world.
troo storie
LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity. I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already
This game will not fail. It has everything WoW had, and a tiny bit more, and it is in Star Wars Space. Many people will quit WoW and play SWTOR instead.
Okay, I'll play along with the "what if" scenario.
What if Bioware is full of fake promises too.Are u ever going to trust them on an mmo or for singleplayer games?
Answer to that would be no. Bioware would go on my list alongside SOE and Cryptic as companies whose products I would never buy again. It's one thing to make a bad game. It's a whole other thing to lie to your customers about what will be in the game. I have zero tolerance for that sort of thing.
And if Swtor fails then what games are u going to look forward to.
No big deal. Life will go on. Arkahm City will becoming out this year and I look forward to spending time in that.
Having said all this, I don't foresee either scenario happening. Almost every feature that they have touted in game has been available for all to see. Bioware has been very upfront about what this game is and what will be in it. Their decisions have upset the old school MMO traditionalists but at least fans of that genre have had two years to get over it and move on. Quite different from what SOE and Cryptic have pulled on their fanbase in the past.Often at the last minute..
But only for now, really. I mean, Bioware has really tried hard to accomodate multiple play styles, even going so far as to add in entire game systems that they had not originally intended to include.
And in interviews, while discussing plans for expansion content, they have mentioned quite a few more.
It really seems to ME that they are bending over backwards to please as many as possible...and while they obviously don't have time to implement everything before launch, they at least have plans to add some things that many of us have been asking for.
It seems to me that Bioware is trying to make a game for gamers, and to make their community happy. It's great to see, and it just re-affirms my faith in the company in general.
if swtor fials then they need companys need to stop tryign to copys wows formula and try to come out with a sandparks with polish or themeboxs something like what archage is doing
I actually would like to see it flop. I feel that until these companies figure out that the typical WoW clones do not sustain long term subscriptions that we will continue to see the same old crap. SWTOR looks like a promising game and they have done an amazing job with the PR and advertising, but in the end it is the same old stuff that actually has a logical end in a genre that I feel was intended to never have an end.
Time will tell. I find it interesting that Ulitma Online is still making a profit and it was released in 1997 and is extremely disadvantaged in most every category except for the one that really matters, it's a true sandbox, skill-based MMO. That should mean something to these gaming companies. I feel like SWTOR will do well initially, but will quickly loose subscriptions as the gaming industry rapidly evolves. Only speculation.
This game will not fail. It has everything WoW had, and a tiny bit more, and it is in Star Wars Space. Many people will quit WoW and play SWTOR instead.
i got my pre order code entered too so i should be good im hoping swtor will be better than wow
Coming back after 2 weeks of closed beta anyone that says "SW:TOR will have unfullfilled promises just like every other MMO" is just an uninformed troll wishing doom and gloom on everyone else because their game failed.
Aside from a few companion/terrain glitches and missing audio, this game is feature complete and would be ready for launch in a month. Go choke on that one.
THE BETA is a more finished product than any MMO I've seen AT LAUNCH in the last 5 years.
Speaking of uninformed... i dont think anyone has ever really claimed that it wont be a well polished product (hell with that budget it better be). People arent expecting a ton of bugs and missing content and all that. What people are concerned about is the fact that it doesnt really bring anything new to the table, and will quickly become boring and unfulfilling because we have already played pretty much the exact same game without the Star Wars skin many times in the past 5+ years. Pretty much everything that they claim makes the game special has already been done in various forms. Even the shooter (space combat) has been done, though not quite as well, but there are MMOs out there already with the shooter aspect.
Basically it really is just another WoW. Not so much in the fact that it is copying what WoW IS, but what WoW DID.... took a buncbh of already existing things from other games and added some polish and meshed them together well. But that was several years ago, and WoW cam ein a time where there werent many other options out there, especially if you want polish and a game that attracts casual players, not just the hardcore. But SWTOR is going to have a lot of tough competition coming out in the very near future. It may do well at the start, but by the time games like GW2, TERA, TSW, and Archage come around many will have already grown tired of SWTOR and will be eager to move onto those games sinc etheyre shaping up to offer quite different experiences in gameplay/features along with great developers and some polish.
Coming back after 2 weeks of closed beta anyone that says "SW:TOR will have unfullfilled promises just like every other MMO" is just an uninformed troll wishing doom and gloom on everyone else because their game failed.
Aside from a few companion/terrain glitches and missing audio, this game is feature complete and would be ready for launch in a month. Go choke on that one.
THE BETA is a more finished product than any MMO I've seen AT LAUNCH in the last 5 years.
Speaking of uninformed... i dont think anyone has ever really claimed that it wont be a well polished product (hell with that budget it better be). People arent expecting a ton of bugs and missing content and all that. What people are concerned about is the fact that it doesnt really bring anything new to the table, and will quickly become boring and unfulfilling because we have already played pretty much the exact same game without the Star Wars skin many times in the past 5+ years. Pretty much everything that they claim makes the game special has already been done in various forms. Even the shooter (space combat) has been done, though not quite as well, but there are MMOs out there already with the shooter aspect.
Basically it really is just another WoW. Not so much in the fact that it is copying what WoW IS, but what WoW DID.... took a buncbh of already existing things from other games and added some polish and meshed them together well. But that was several years ago, and WoW cam ein a time where there werent many other options out there, especially if you want polish and a game that attracts casual players, not just the hardcore. But SWTOR is going to have a lot of tough competition coming out in the very near future. It may do well at the start, but by the time games like GW2, TERA, TSW, and Archage come around many will have already grown tired of SWTOR and will be eager to move onto those games sinc etheyre shaping up to offer quite different experiences in gameplay/features along with great developers and some polish.
Just because a person is hoping for innovation in the gaming industry has no bearing on if those other games will be a success or not, looking at the mmorpg industry atleast two of the five games mentioned including TOR has a good chance to fail spectacularly and I sure wouldn't be using a game made by Funcom to put up against anyone else until they actually launch the game.
I don't think you are wrong heck I know you are right I've seen too many posts from people angry that they aren't getting to "learn how to play again" but are there really that many of those people or is it that they tend to speak the loudest (especially here).
And if it isn't because of 'nefarious reasons'... it's because of leprechaun reasons. Wow, making assuming statements is totally easy if you don't have to back it up with an argument or evidence!
So here's the deal: You haven't paid for anything yet. At most you've pre-ordered a game. The NDA will lift before you're ever charged the full price of the game, and if the end game content doesn't thrill you, feel free to cancel the order. In fact, go ahead and cancel now. I've seen your posts, and there's nothing but hate and anger and suspicion. If you do ever end up playing I know you're going to hate the game no matter what's delivered. So why bother?
Actually , I doubt very much that I will hate the game. I will probably be happy and excited, and probably play it for years to come, hopefully. I don't know where you get this idea that I am going to hate it. Maybe I hate the fact that they decided to come out with a 150 dollar CE that has a limit on it and are being sold out like hot cakes before I even get the chance to put my money down.. I may hate it if I can't retain my copy of the CE before they are all gone forever, then if I play the game I will always feel like I am missing out on something. That is the only thing I may hate about this game.
150 dollars may not be much to some, or others. It's not really much to me either, but the fact that it is limited offer only , and now I have to scramble around to find it and put my 20 dollars down, is kinda depressing.
Other than that , I think I will enjoy this game and what it has to offer I hope. The graphics could be a lil better imo, tho. Just got done playing AoC and the graphics are beautiful. Aion the graphics were astounding. Kinda hard to go from games like those with epic graphics to a game like TOR... hopefully the graphics and animations look good enough for 2012.
If it fails, watch the investors flee the genre. Maybe moving more money into CoD and 3rd person cover based shooters and sports games?
Agreed. NO ONE who likes MMOs should want this game to fail. Good news is that it is not likely too. It was reported today that SWTOR pre-order broke the records for highest selling pre-order at EA. Just think. Pre-orders are still going though most places are out of the CE.
Was that a response to my post? I will agree that AoC is terrible, but I loved AION... Nothing more awesome than flying around the abyss hunting for asmos to kill.
The grinding does suck in that game, I agree, but you do have to work your butt off if you want to be geared.
I just don't see this game failing like AoC, Warhammer and LOTRO did. Granted those games aren't complete failures, but they failed to hold a respectable percentage of those people that bought the game on release.
I just don't see myself buying SW:TOR as I was really bored with KOTOR and gave up before finbishing it. I also am not impressed with the space combat, which looks very disappointing.
Honestly - I think the only major events that could cause a epic fail is if:
Major hack attack - Something like a Sony event. I am sure EA has security systems in place to keep our accounts secure, but what if the untested game engine has weakeneses? Doubtful , but i am just saying if accounts or the game is easily hacked, it will put a big crimp in subscriptions.
WoW announces free to play and launches an expansion and Guild Wars 2 launches at the same time- maybe won' t cause an epic fail, but may weaken interest in the game. What would you all do? again, foolish move for NC soft to launch with Bioware, but Blizzard.....
Bioware announces subscription fee of $35 or more a month - you can still price yourself out of market - no matter what IP you got.
Again, I don't think EA/ Bioware are this foolish with any of the above - This game will be solid MMO at worst, the new WOW at best.
Comments
The game wo'n't fail in a business sense and unfortunately or not that is the only sense that matters. EA will make money on this of that I have no doubt. Will some be disappoined? Will some complain? Will it be very simiar to many MMOs of the past? The most likely answer to all of these questions is yes. Regardless of player opinion, most will buy the game and play it for a while at least. This will be enough to make EA money which will only enforce the current MMO model as a success in the business community. Therefore, the next MMOs will be similar as well.
We will know soon enough.
--John Ruskin
<insert doom and gloom prediction here>
<insert "I don't like ______ so _____ will be a failure" remark here>
That is a perfectly understand approach. Best if your not sure of a games quality or if it will have what your looking for to just wait it out and get more info. No reason to burn any money on a product your not sure if you'll like or not.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
What I'm referring to is your highly polarized transition from one extreme to another. Otherwise I'd agree with your stand, most corps have over-inflated egos, and price things unrealistically. Which is why I don't buy CE's or even pre-order games. In the end you usually only end up with a few gimmicks to use in-game; not to mention you're 5-10 dollars poorer than you would have been if you would have just waited. That's just me though, I don't expect others to feel that way.
Of course TOR could fail, I'd never say otherwise, far too many failures in this genre to overlook that possibility.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Having said all this, I don't foresee either scenario happening. Almost every feature that they have touted in game has been available for all to see. Bioware has been very upfront about what this game is and what will be in it. Their decisions have upset the old school MMO traditionalists but at least fans of that genre have had two years to get over it and move on. Quite different from what SOE and Cryptic have pulled on their fanbase in the past.Often at the last minute..
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
but..... what if they win?
No such thing as fail in SWTOR. Unless the world exploded.
funny you should mention that.
see whats really going to happen is the game is going to get pushed back till nov 2012, and shortly after release on nov 13 2012 all of the servers are going to fail and the collective conscious of 5 generations of star wars fan nerd rage is going to implode the world.
troo storie
LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already
This game will not fail. It has everything WoW had, and a tiny bit more, and it is in Star Wars Space. Many people will quit WoW and play SWTOR instead.
But only for now, really. I mean, Bioware has really tried hard to accomodate multiple play styles, even going so far as to add in entire game systems that they had not originally intended to include.
And in interviews, while discussing plans for expansion content, they have mentioned quite a few more.
It really seems to ME that they are bending over backwards to please as many as possible...and while they obviously don't have time to implement everything before launch, they at least have plans to add some things that many of us have been asking for.
It seems to me that Bioware is trying to make a game for gamers, and to make their community happy. It's great to see, and it just re-affirms my faith in the company in general.
Haters will still call it a fail of an MMO just like they do with WoW.
if swtor fials then they need companys need to stop tryign to copys wows formula and try to come out with a sandparks with polish or themeboxs something like what archage is doing
I actually would like to see it flop. I feel that until these companies figure out that the typical WoW clones do not sustain long term subscriptions that we will continue to see the same old crap. SWTOR looks like a promising game and they have done an amazing job with the PR and advertising, but in the end it is the same old stuff that actually has a logical end in a genre that I feel was intended to never have an end.
Time will tell. I find it interesting that Ulitma Online is still making a profit and it was released in 1997 and is extremely disadvantaged in most every category except for the one that really matters, it's a true sandbox, skill-based MMO. That should mean something to these gaming companies. I feel like SWTOR will do well initially, but will quickly loose subscriptions as the gaming industry rapidly evolves. Only speculation.
i got my pre order code entered too so i should be good im hoping swtor will be better than wow
Speaking of uninformed... i dont think anyone has ever really claimed that it wont be a well polished product (hell with that budget it better be). People arent expecting a ton of bugs and missing content and all that. What people are concerned about is the fact that it doesnt really bring anything new to the table, and will quickly become boring and unfulfilling because we have already played pretty much the exact same game without the Star Wars skin many times in the past 5+ years. Pretty much everything that they claim makes the game special has already been done in various forms. Even the shooter (space combat) has been done, though not quite as well, but there are MMOs out there already with the shooter aspect.
Basically it really is just another WoW. Not so much in the fact that it is copying what WoW IS, but what WoW DID.... took a buncbh of already existing things from other games and added some polish and meshed them together well. But that was several years ago, and WoW cam ein a time where there werent many other options out there, especially if you want polish and a game that attracts casual players, not just the hardcore. But SWTOR is going to have a lot of tough competition coming out in the very near future. It may do well at the start, but by the time games like GW2, TERA, TSW, and Archage come around many will have already grown tired of SWTOR and will be eager to move onto those games sinc etheyre shaping up to offer quite different experiences in gameplay/features along with great developers and some polish.
Just because a person is hoping for innovation in the gaming industry has no bearing on if those other games will be a success or not, looking at the mmorpg industry atleast two of the five games mentioned including TOR has a good chance to fail spectacularly and I sure wouldn't be using a game made by Funcom to put up against anyone else until they actually launch the game.
I don't think you are wrong heck I know you are right I've seen too many posts from people angry that they aren't getting to "learn how to play again" but are there really that many of those people or is it that they tend to speak the loudest (especially here).
Actually , I doubt very much that I will hate the game. I will probably be happy and excited, and probably play it for years to come, hopefully. I don't know where you get this idea that I am going to hate it. Maybe I hate the fact that they decided to come out with a 150 dollar CE that has a limit on it and are being sold out like hot cakes before I even get the chance to put my money down.. I may hate it if I can't retain my copy of the CE before they are all gone forever, then if I play the game I will always feel like I am missing out on something. That is the only thing I may hate about this game.
150 dollars may not be much to some, or others. It's not really much to me either, but the fact that it is limited offer only , and now I have to scramble around to find it and put my 20 dollars down, is kinda depressing.
Other than that , I think I will enjoy this game and what it has to offer I hope. The graphics could be a lil better imo, tho. Just got done playing AoC and the graphics are beautiful. Aion the graphics were astounding. Kinda hard to go from games like those with epic graphics to a game like TOR... hopefully the graphics and animations look good enough for 2012.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
If it fails, watch the investors flee the genre. Maybe moving more money into CoD and 3rd person cover based shooters and sports games?
Agreed. NO ONE who likes MMOs should want this game to fail. Good news is that it is not likely too. It was reported today that SWTOR pre-order broke the records for highest selling pre-order at EA. Just think. Pre-orders are still going though most places are out of the CE.
I really do hope this game succeeds , because , imo, if it does anything other than, it will or could effect the whole genre.
Everyone that is worth anything or has big money to put down on a game will think twice if this turns out to be a big dud.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
both are terrible games at the core tho : /
Was that a response to my post? I will agree that AoC is terrible, but I loved AION... Nothing more awesome than flying around the abyss hunting for asmos to kill.
The grinding does suck in that game, I agree, but you do have to work your butt off if you want to be geared.
"When it comes to GW2 any game is fair game"
I just don't see this game failing like AoC, Warhammer and LOTRO did. Granted those games aren't complete failures, but they failed to hold a respectable percentage of those people that bought the game on release.
I just don't see myself buying SW:TOR as I was really bored with KOTOR and gave up before finbishing it. I also am not impressed with the space combat, which looks very disappointing.
Honestly - I think the only major events that could cause a epic fail is if:
Major hack attack - Something like a Sony event. I am sure EA has security systems in place to keep our accounts secure, but what if the untested game engine has weakeneses? Doubtful , but i am just saying if accounts or the game is easily hacked, it will put a big crimp in subscriptions.
WoW announces free to play and launches an expansion and Guild Wars 2 launches at the same time- maybe won' t cause an epic fail, but may weaken interest in the game. What would you all do? again, foolish move for NC soft to launch with Bioware, but Blizzard.....
Bioware announces subscription fee of $35 or more a month - you can still price yourself out of market - no matter what IP you got.
Again, I don't think EA/ Bioware are this foolish with any of the above - This game will be solid MMO at worst, the new WOW at best.