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Gaming Sites Enforcement of NDA's in Forums
damond5031
Member UncommonPosts: 445
So why do popular gaming forums enforce the rules of contracts made between players and gaming companys? Surely they want players to know what they are getting into when they buy a new game. I keep hearing about how NDA's should'nt be broken because they represent a game that is not fully developed, and will be completely different when it is released. Well good, then by all means lets hear about how the game is improving from the people in Beta!! By the time a title is about to hit the market we should hear the beta players singing its praises as we are about to purchase it!! Is it ethical to hide the real nature of the products that are endorsed on your web page for financial reasons?
Comments
It is more ethical than permitting someone to violate their legal/civil responsibility for not disclosing confidential information like those people who have accepted non-disclosure agreements.
I know things about a companys manufacturing processes that would be worth money to that companys competitors yet I still abide by the NDA I agreed to almost 20 years ago even though I am no longer employed by them.
It's completely ethical. MMORPG development companies have a significant interest in having NDA's. We wouldn't even have these games to play without the companies. MMORPG.com recognizes this and respects the companies contract with the players to not disclose certain information.
If you want to find out about leaked information, there are sites for that. Go to those sites.
You know...sites like MMORPG would have a rough time if they allowed people to break NDA willy nilly - these sites depend at least partially on having a good relationship with developers - and that would be gone. All those contests sites have? Not anymore. ALl information would come third hand. Interviews? Forget it.
Even our private guild forums don't allow NDA breaches. Not only are they unethical, but our guild is big enough that just maybe someone reading IS a developer.
There was a lawyer post on here awhile ago outlining why such things are the way they are...
Apparenlty, by accepting a NDA "you" obtain the RIGHT to view and use infomation associated with the aggreement..
For everyone that doesnt have the right to possess that infomation, you dont have a foot to stand on legally.. (aka you have stolen information in your possesson)
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I can't believe it. There are no MMO sites that are properly 'investigative'
IRL, Newspapers leak stuff, get info from 'sources' and report on scandals. For games they just rephrase press releases and show 'opinion' pieces. Just because the Daily Star reports on some football club scandal, doesn't mean that the footbal club will never give them an interview again! Same with games.
No site has the guts to report on leaks, show beta reviews etc.... They could just say 'we heard from a source' or 'we were anonymously emailed' so they don't get sued. But nooooo, they have to stay on 'the right side' of the devs. And then in 3 months everyone gets burned if the game is different than they expected.
While I personally think NDAs are idiotic, people tend to get bullied quite a lot for having leaks in their posession. It's usually just easier to cave in and go along w/ them than to try and battle it.
Believe it or not, the laws on NDAs aren't always as cut and dry as people may think. For the most part in games they are fairly standard, but there are definitely situations where companies abuse such agreements. They also aren't always the most solid contracts. Just because there is a contract doesn't automatically make it legal. In the case of this site, there really isn't any advantage MMORPG.com would get from letting leaks slide, so that is probably the main reason they don't do it. That and avoiding the pressure that studios / publishers put on them if they have NDA breaking material on their site.
because the relationship between the sites and companies that make the games is at the heart of everything. These sites run on advertising revenue and the devs pay their bills, not us. Our traffic is just the commodity thats used to sell advertising.
They need to toe the line and do what they are told, thankyouverymuch.
They are not on our side and they are not our friends. It has nothing to do with ethics.
When was the last time you saw a paper publishing a piece of news like "Anonymous Apple worker reveals the secrets of still unannounced IPhone"?
What the newspapers do is different. They don't openly try to get people who are under NDA to reveal business secrets about upcoming products.
Engagdet is a popular gadgets blog, getting thousands and thousands of comments per day and going to all tech events etc.. Yet they still post pictures of 'leaked cellphones' or rumors or product leaks etc etc.. And yet Massively, which is the same company, doesn't do that about MMOs.
I'm not asking that Massively or MMORPG's writers post about their experience in beta, what I'm asking is that they go 'Website XXXXX leaked some beta footage for XXXXXXX MMO.' and then link to it. I really don't think there is a legal barrier to reading/writing about stuff that has been put on a public website for all to see. In fact, it's ridiculous.
And FYI, the only MMO sites that really leak or even discuss leaks are obscure website that only pop up for one game run by a single individual doing it as a hobby. There are no 'major' MMO website that discuss leaks, which is honestly ridiculous. Just because you annoy one company, doesn't mean you lose ALL advertising revenue. That's like saying Engadget loses all it's revenue because it leaks IPhone 5 stuff or that a newspaper that talks about a factory worker commiting suicide will never have advertising from that company again.
Man you really just don't get it.
Websites like this get funding from advertisements. In order to make enough money from advertisements, this website has to have a certain amount of visitor traffic, meaning people who come to this site and use the site and see the ads. Without the requisite amount of traffic, the site won't make enough money to survive.
There are 2 ways of generating such traffic relevant to this discussion. One way is by mmorpg.com having good relationships with developers, allowing for mmorpg.com to publish interviews, insider articles, upcoming previews, and other such publications that are only made possible by having friendly relations and a positive reputation with gaming companies.
The second way (relevant to this discussion) to generate traffic is by publishing beta leaks. The downside to this is that you lose all of the benefits of the first way...meaning you lose all the insider articles, upcoming previews, interviews, good reputation, etc. The folks who run this site have to pick one or the other. They can't pick the second way and then still expect to have all the developers still dealing with them. There is no middle road. It's one or the other.
There are other websites that have chosen method two. This website has choosen method one. What don't you get about that?
Also, there are major mmorpg websites that publish beta leaks about multiple games. Just because you can't find them doesn't mean they don't exist. I just checked and they are still up. And no I will not share the info in a post or through PM. '
The decision to publish beta leaks probably has almost nothing to do with the legality of it. Forget about the legal aspect. It has to do with money and ads and traffic and integrity.
You're being ridiculous. Devs give features/news/interviews to WEBSITES WITH THE MOST READERS, regardless of whether they have leaks or not, because they want sales.
Most Industries have Trade Magazines that are all about the next big thing with writers that are encouraged to leak as much information as they can. However, these trade magazines aren't Free. You have to pay to read them. The thing about MMO's is that those that care about insider MMO information don't care enough to pay for that info. The point is MMO industry needs to grow up.
Many times, when it is possible, then yes that is the case. But it is not as clear cut as that. Not even close. The amount of information gaming companies have to hand out is limited. They do have to make choices. Reputations and respect can come into play.
Also, if it's all about the bottom line for them (ie money, as you said), then why would they support a beta leak site which could do much more harm to them than good? If a website is publishing a bunch of beta leaks which are just trashing your game left and right, do you think a gaming company would be dumb enough to give that site even more traffic by giving the site exclusive interviews and such? Do you really think "most readers" automatically equals more sales? The NDA is in place for a reason. The don't want bad publicity from reviews of an unfinished game to hinder sales.
Shiny, leak sites are often sites that have no problem with gold seller ads, bot ads and other content that is often detrimental to the games they are reporting on. Catering to sites like that doesn't help get sales of anything, so devs rarely do interviews with them or send assets to them. Sit aside what you want to believe and re-read the responses here. Most of them are completely spot on.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I don't understand what is so hard about this. A website might not want to encourage illegal activities. Just like most McDonalds probably doesn't encourage people doing drugs in their parking lot, even if it does bring more people into McDonalnds.
Sent me an email if you want me to mail you some pizza rolls.
Actually many times leak sites say good stuff about games in development. Or so it seems. And if not, won't it help burst the hype bubble so there isn't negative press at launch of a game?
I personally think we could do a lot better and help support an MMORPG press that doesn't just say good things about games and devs before launch, building hype, and then after when the advertising money stops coming goes '6/10 buggy, laggy mess of a game'. That frustrates me.
You're talking about two things. Fair/honest reviewing is a completely different fopic from leaking beta info. That you would expect fairness and honesty from the group actively working against the developer is amusing.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I support democracy, but if I support wikileaks for showing whats really going on in our democracies does that make me 'actively working against democracy'? Um no I don't think so.
Yes it's not the same, but I still think I should know what a game actually plays like and that leaks should be published by big game news sites.
I at no point said you were doing anything, let alone that you were actively working against the developers. Between your wild interpretations of what you are being told and that you equate - at ANY level - gamplay reviews of a video game to the release of sensitive top level government documents indicates to me that you've got too skewed a perspective of this to actually have a rational discussion on the topic.
Cheers, m8.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Well, 'mate',
all I'm trying to say is that I think MMORPG.COM could publish leaks without suffering financial damage.
How so?
Leaks
=
More Readers
=
Higher value of advertising space
=
Companies wanting to advertise
Also, to those saying that no-one would pay people who leak, what better place to advertise your game than the exact place in which your competitor's has been trashed. What if certain companies secretly leaked gameplay videos in order to make competitors look bad. THEN the industry would have grown up/matured.
Then they do actually get sued and disappear like beta leaks did and all that money goes up some lawyer's ass. You keep using these awkward rare scenarios that never happen in real life, like companies leaking bad videos of some other companies game so they can then go on a leak site to advertise.
Oh and how do you even know leaks equals more readers? If that was true, where are all the leak sites? You said yourself there were none. If they are such money makers, then go make one.