Actually i am on guard regardless of beng in a bg (not going to comment on arena sincec to me it s more sport then pvp.)or open world pvp (such as in darkfall) mostly because if you are pvping in a true pvp game you will have a pvper coming sooner or later (this is true of any pvper i know of). I actually enjoy both styles of pvp from going from a ffa pvp style like darkfall to a more objective stye group based pvp in otther games, and in truth i find ffa open world pvp to become far more boring much faster then the objective style. Sad to hear you do not find the pvp style desirable, for me pvp is about fighting as well as defeating another player as such i will embrace it in whatever form i can. NOw i would love to see hwo big and spread out the zone as well as objecttives are in the zones before i say anythign like pssibility of 1 on 1 pvp combat happening, mostly since in these people will be moving in groups mostly. I guess you have a arge distaste for group/zerg pvp which i understand and i dislike it as well, since it wittles down to who has what numbers wins. I will not compare in anyway rift pvp to tsw pvp for the sheer fact that the abbility systems are cmpletely different with rift being a class/talent system and tsw being completely a abbility/passive system; For the most part tsw will have a much easier time of balancing the pvp in tsw compared to rift since your passives as well as abbilities are easier to adjust/nerf or buff into balance (you will still have a fotm specc of abilities). Well i do hope you and the rest of the solo pvper find a good pvp based mmo to enjoy, since without a large reason as well as change in their mindset tsw wil be zone/bg style with some synergy between pvp as well as pve (i hope).
Does anyone know what battleground actually means in this context?
Will battlegrounds be seperated pvp regions like in DAoC or just stupid 5on5 capture the holy artifact scenario games?
The first is fine for me, the latter is just boring
It is zone pvp like wintergrasp from what we can see, with objectives and large areas, although they may have qued/instanced pvp i am not sure it looks to be large scale zone based pvp for the most part.
Even without open world pvp (i think it is open zone pvp) it will be just as fun since you can still hunt, jump and do all that good stuff on the other two factions. IT is not like the pvp is per say instanced that i have heard, it ust sounds like it is certain places in zones/is a zone that you fight over with each other. Somethign like wintergrasp in wow though think it would be several of those kinds of zone wars going on together at time, with the factions having to corridante their fighting to control more then one or two of them at a time. Honestly if this is the case i would be for that over open world pvp.
No...thats not fun, most of your players that prefer pvp to pve will tell you those pvp zones are nothing more than battle grounds. They are fun for a bit, but get boring. The fun of pvp is having no clue someone is coming...in BG's or zones, you are always looking for it...so you loe that excitement. Thats why it would be great to see pvp and pve servers.
You mean more like : "that those other players dont know someone is comming" ... Most lovers of open world pvp actively seek fight and dont just wait if some will come after them, yes I know it doesnt look as innocent as you would like to, but thats how it is :P and pretending otherwise just makes argumentation look silly.
It looks like that Funcom thinks that this kind of pvp would more hurt their game - from my firends who played AoC i heard definitly way more stories about player griefing in open world than stories about great open world PvP ... So imo AoC experience played part in decision against open world pvp.
There's really no reason to PvP on PvP servers except for the sake of killing. Themepark-like games aren't the type of games you should be looking into for the PvP population. I bring it up all of the time, but L2 there were rarely any gankers because the cost of ganking was high. Now if you were in a war with a different guild... THEN you probably got camped until the war ended.
Good PvP mmos limit griefing by using an alignment system or consequence system. It doesn't work 100% correctly (you usually get those few strays who ruin the vision of the game type for basically everyone who says they are dumb). AoC there wasn't really a consequence when I played it. When there's no consequence....you kind of ruin the realism.
But when I say PvP mmo, I'm really just saying an mmo that's 50/50.
ANYWAYS... TSW has pvp done well for the type of game it is. I would play WoW if it had a classless system. Why? Because the last AAA mmo that's had a good system like this..well. Hmm... It's been a while. ANet and Funcom both understand this to some extent.
Sorry you're heartbroken but I'm thrilled. I hate open world PvP. I might still be playing Aion except for the annoyance of getting ganked by a toon 20 levels above me while questing. No fun imo.
I never undertood that either.
Couple weeks ago I was being camped by 4 very high level players who repeatedly kept killing.
What is the lesson in that?
cry me a river
He isn't asking for your sympathy. I agree with Slowdoves, I don't play mmos and pay a sub fee to get ganked by people with nothing better to do than torment others. If that's your idea of "fair" or "fun" perhaps you should consider some kind of profesional help. I want to have fun PvEing and PvP when I want to, not when someone else wants to. Seems like Ragnar and many others, including myself, share this vision. So you can crawl back to DF or MO and gank the few helpless people still playing those FFA PvP games. What most advocates for FFA PvP can't seem to grasp is their kind are dying because they kill their own games off, then move on and do the same to another game. So TSW and nearly every game out there isn't for you or your kind, maybe you should "go cry me a river" then, no?
I know a lot of pvpers that were really looking forward to pvp with this game, me being one. I had the chance to speak with Ragnar 1 on 1, and found that he's a great guy with a vision. The sad thing is, to those pvpers that are looking for open world pvp....your not in his vision. I asked about the fact that we have three factions, so I'm assuming that means we can fight in open world when crossing factions. The response was, "good question, while the three factions don't like one another, they understand that they need to work together to defeat the forces (npcs) and therefor there is governing body that sets rules amongst the three factions." He went on to say that there will be battlegrounds type of pvp, but absolutely no world pvp when I spoked to him after the panel. I even asked about the opportunity for a pvp server where the factions could fight one another and he said it wouldn't even be considored because it doesn't fit the game. He did say that if the communty demanded clan war deccing on the forums, then he'd considor that.
So, while a great guy...and probably a great pve game based on what I saw, if you are looking for the open world pvp, whether it be faction based on ffa, its not here. This was such a heartbreaker for me...
Makes me want to vomit. I had SO much hope for this - I saw this as the first 3 faction mmorpg of quality since Dark Age of Camelot. Finally, I thought, someone with common sense and vision as to complex pvp mechanics instead of the same old predictable PVE or half arsed meaningless free for all pvp or the overdone 2 faction pvp where one side always has the edge. This is incredibly disappointing. I'm definitely going to foward this to my DAoC guild - going to have at least 20 pissed off people.
What is it going to take for a developer to get up and smell the epic of fantasy novels, movies, etc? Three factions is demanding, I realize this. It was hard in 2001 when Mythic released Dark Age of Camelot with dozens of classes and races that were unique to each other. I get that it takes more work and more dedication to creativity, I get that variation is not easy but as Spike TV's Deadliest Warrior has taught action fans, the variation between cultures in a warfare environment is addictive, entertaining, and just plain fascinating.
Three factions at war is a fantastic step forward for an mmorpg who doesn't mind creating a product that adults with educations can support. Three factions with complex political systems is alright in a dummed down society because there are plenty of the rest of us who are starving for such levels of depth.
/RIP Secret World. Dammit. Free to Play with a cash shop in the next 12 months with some Paul Barnett level propaganda as to why it's the best business model for the few remaining players. Mark my words. With them dashing what could have been so climactic and fun, even more folks will now make the SW: TOR jump.
Originally posted by Comaf What is it going to take for a developer to get up and smell the epic of fantasy novels, movies, etc? Three factions is demanding, I realize this. It was hard in 2001 when Mythic released Dark Age of Camelot with dozens of classes and races that were unique to each other. I get that it takes more work and more dedication to creativity, I get that variation is not easy but as Spike TV's Deadliest Warrior has taught action fans, the variation between cultures in a warfare environment is addictive, entertaining, and just plain fascinating.
Im sorry some of you didnt bother to read the point of The Secret World. However, there is an upcoming MMORPG called Prime: Battle for Dominus that will have exactly what youre ranting about. Enjoy.
What is it going to take for a developer to get up and smell the epic of fantasy novels, movies, etc? Three factions is demanding, I realize this. It was hard in 2001 when Mythic released Dark Age of Camelot with dozens of classes and races that were unique to each other. I get that it takes more work and more dedication to creativity, I get that variation is not easy but as Spike TV's Deadliest Warrior has taught action fans, the variation between cultures in a warfare environment is addictive, entertaining, and just plain fascinating.
Im sorry some of you didnt bother to read the point of The Secret World. However, there is an upcoming MMORPG called Prime: Battle for Dominus that will have exactly what youre ranting about. Enjoy.
QFT
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Sad that I started this thread...it has a lot of care and a lot of bear...
Thats why these types are petrified of sandboxes.
Oh wow, look Bob they really do exist... I mean really, afraid of sandboxes? As if sandboxes have anything to do with PVP..
Fear? Really, fear? WTH is there to fear?
Look I'm a PVPer through and through had my MMO start in DAOC on Mordred all I've ever done is play on FFA servers, or in games like SWG warring guilds..But I find this attitude freaking hilarious as well as pathetic. No one fears PVP, there's nothing to fear in it, the main reason non-pvpers do not like PVP, do not like to see it, as well as bemoan it, is you.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
For the most part ffa pvp is well interesting though it gets vary boring after a awhile, because you get to where you go out into the word either looking for pvp or getting found by someone looking for pvp and you are expecting it to happen. Battle ground style pvp is the same way you get to have find and enjoyment till it loses it luster, although if you gain things from said pvp style in a synergy system with pve such as access to instances or other things, it leads to a desire to still do this type of pvp. Both styles are well lack luster for their replay ability, since you can not really do it constantly without it feeling old, as well as losing much of the edge/importance it had at the start. Though most people who tried and read the game design as well as how the lore worked would have relised the game was never ment to be a ffa open world pvp based game, since it was prettty regularly stated that only pvp would be availible in the hallow earth yet rescently they added these zone control pvp activities. three faction based mmos are nott just a great idea for pvp based games, they are also great for pve based ones as well, since the third faction brings more tention as well as a wild card or new perception on the conflict at hand. I have played since uo as both a pvper, as well as pver going from ffa pvp to open loot pvp to bg/arena style pvp, and what i found i enjoyed the most was a good mix of them all. Why do i like that? Well because each is as boring as any pve content sandbox or themepark after you have spent hours in doing that alone. Trully everytime i see open world pvp they come the griefers and gankers on either a pvp-based or pve-based game, because they enjoying killing you (some just like making your day bad, as a way to make thier day feel better.); Yet also you will see the ninja/loot stealers as well who are going to get what they want damn those around them, why because they feel entitled to have what they want. Yet both of these are unavoidable evils of both game types, because nothign short of banning them will stop them from doing it, and i am happy to be rid of one of those with the fact that ffa open world pvp is not in game. Any pvper thatt actually thinks that they were duped into believing this game was open world pvp by funcom, but i got to say you were not duped by anyone but yourself really mostly since never did they state they were implimenting open world pvp at all. The evidence that three factions is perfect for pvp based combat is pretty frail since it is just as perfect for pve intrigue in story; Also the fact that it is based as a modern or classless system being great for pvp, well that is true for character playstyle customization in pve too. We all saw what we wanted to see plain as day, but to say that because of that the game will fail is childish. The game is pretty inovative in areas with being classless, a more mission status, and non stat based game base it is pretty far from wow in alot of ways, also people many pve and pvp players have been looking for a classless mmo either pve or pvp based for awhile now.
Makes me want to vomit. I had SO much hope for this - I saw this as the first 3 faction mmorpg of quality since Dark Age of Camelot. Finally, I thought, someone with common sense and vision as to complex pvp mechanics instead of the same old predictable PVE or half arsed meaningless free for all pvp or the overdone 2 faction pvp where one side always has the edge. This is incredibly disappointing. I'm definitely going to foward this to my DAoC guild - going to have at least 20 pissed off people.
And yet another DAOC reference - TSW will have "open world" FvF PvP ala DAOC, in that there are PvP zones for it, the way DAOC had the frontiers. More or less. The OP just misused the term "open world" and seems to mean something more like PvP-anywhere. No, it is limited to PvP zones, but that's still way better than team PvP in instanced arenas and the like.
Why am I the only one pointing this out, in this ridiculously long and misleading thread? Am I wrong, or what? What do other people think?
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Originally posted by Vhaln Originally posted by Comaf Makes me want to vomit. I had SO much hope for this - I saw this as the first 3 faction mmorpg of quality since Dark Age of Camelot. Finally, I thought, someone with common sense and vision as to complex pvp mechanics instead of the same old predictable PVE or half arsed meaningless free for all pvp or the overdone 2 faction pvp where one side always has the edge. This is incredibly disappointing. I'm definitely going to foward this to my DAoC guild - going to have at least 20 pissed off people.
And yet another DAOC reference - TSW will have "open world" FvF PvP ala DAOC, in that there are PvP zones for it, the way DAOC had the frontiers. More or less. The OP just misused the term "open world" and seems to mean something more like PvP-anywhere. No, it is limited to PvP zones, but that's still way better than team PvP in instanced arenas and the like.
Why am I the only one pointing this out, in this ridiculously long and misleading thread? Am I wrong, or what? What do other people think?
Open World PvP - Any member of a faction can attack any member of another faction anywhere in the world. You may or may not get loot from the other people, depending on the rules of the game.
FFA PvP - Players can earn reputation with factions, but aren't required to be a member of factions. Any player can attack any other player more or less at any time. Players may or may not get loot from killing other players.
TSW will not have Open World PvP, nor will it have FFA PvP.
TSW will have Faction v Faction v Faction PvP in either instanced battlegrounds or in zones where everyone is flagged for PvP (like Wintergrasp in WoW).
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
There will be other PvP options in-game. Those who believe open world PvP would be appropriate in TSW, should probably read some of the lore behind it.
Lead designer: "PvP is free for all in the fight club of every hub city. What's special is that you can even make a gank. Although it's a little bit dirty and unfair to some of you, it seems that it's really what the developers want to see, "what we usually see in games like this is that these areas are being self-policed by the players. If a player plays dirty, he will be punished by the other players." Besides, fighting club can be occupied by other factions. For example, a group of Illuminati players burst into Templars' fight club and occupy it while Dragon players may suddenly come and kick Illuminati out if it."
So, why does every gankfester think that every MMO ever published needs to have OPEN world pvp? Some games have it, some games don't. Personally, my game-style doesn't support open world PVP so I don't play games or on servers that offer it and I've never complained. Many games that went the way of supporting griefers I stopped playing...cough...Aion...and yes, OPEN world PVP means gankers and griefers. I understand that the OP would NEVER participate in activities which ruin gameplay for another player...but many will, many can, and many do.
I've never logged into Darkfall or the COUNTLESS games that ONLY offer PVP as their gameplay.
Is it possible to leave ONE game on the market that doesn't cater to gamers who scream and cry the loudest?
PVP servers & PVE servers; a solution that has been working wonders in catering for both kind of players for over a decade.
Which is why Anet's and now Funcom's decision to go with a single ruleset pisses me off so much.
Don't deny those who love world pvp their fun, I am not denying you your fun (on pve servers) either.
While its great to be more intelligent than most others on the MMORPG forums, dont you feel like our explanations fall to deaf ears? I see exactly what your saying Pony, they did Open World PvP right (after some balance changes) in DaOC years ago yet they still go for the newer demographics (and fail at even that since they wont even make pve and pvp servers....). Dont get me wrong, W v W v W will be interesting but after playing games like WAR (to those who havent played recently, the RvR is 100% win) or DoAC it just feels like a huge weekly BG (wintergrasp anyone?).
As far as the pvetards that complain about being "ganked". When i refer to open world RvR as most people, i mean keeps/fortresses, battle objectives, resources, relics and server faction wide buffs = a REASON and MEANING in doing PvP on a massive scale. I like WAR for their RvR lakes, specially after the changes they made to world pvp the game is actually quite fun but like most mmos of today; it was too late. The going problem is DaOC is just too old to keep a enough players playing and WAR just is living off of life support (almost a year and all we've seen is 20 more RvR ranks and some more sets along with a host balance and RvR system changes that actaully made world pvp fun). Seems that SWTOR gets the prize, for doing it right i suppose.
TLDR: Finding out that GW2 only features PvE servers was a major downer for me, i was hope for a similar system in the open world as the mists since the game has the ability to do so (creating so much more competition much like Lineage 2 since there is no race vs race but a more massive GvG experience) but nonetheless ill be playing it. As far as SWTOR; as far as the PvE goes i enjoy the questing and its a nice change of pace from your quest grind ala wow. Im not very moved by group story since it feels.......out of place. Ill enjoy the questing and personal story while open world PVP my ass off with my lesbian evil bounty hunter >:3.
All in all other seek Open World PvP because its immersive and not scripted, and since in the last few years it seems developers cant realize that 10% of a games popualtion actually raids and still creates the cookie cutter formula. Yet SWTOR managed to sweeten the deal with personal relationships/vanity and story with the big hitter "Open World PVP".
TOR will be a ghost town in 6 months just like Star Trek. Buried under the weight of it's own IP and expectations.
So, why does every gankfester think that every MMO ever published needs to have OPEN world pvp? Some games have it, some games don't. Personally, my game-style doesn't support open world PVP so I don't play games or on servers that offer it and I've never complained. Many games that went the way of supporting griefers I stopped playing...cough...Aion...and yes, OPEN world PVP means gankers and griefers. I understand that the OP would NEVER participate in activities which ruin gameplay for another player...but many will, many can, and many do.
I've never logged into Darkfall or the COUNTLESS games that ONLY offer PVP as their gameplay.
Is it possible to leave ONE game on the market that doesn't cater to gamers who scream and cry the loudest?
PVP servers & PVE servers; a solution that has been working wonders in catering for both kind of players for over a decade.
Which is why Anet's and now Funcom's decision to go with a single ruleset pisses me off so much.
Don't deny those who love world pvp their fun, I am not denying you your fun (on pve servers) either.
While its great to be more intelligent than most others on the MMORPG forums, dont you feel like our explanations fall to deaf ears? I see exactly what your saying Pony, they did Open World PvP right (after some balance changes) in DaOC years ago yet they still go for the newer demographics (and fail at even that since they wont even make pve and pvp servers....). Dont get me wrong, W v W v W will be interesting but after playing games like WAR (to those who havent played recently, the RvR is 100% win) or DoAC it just feels like a huge weekly BG (wintergrasp anyone?).
As far as the pvetards that complain about being "ganked". When i refer to open world RvR as most people, i mean keeps/fortresses, battle objectives, resources, relics and server faction wide buffs = a REASON and MEANING in doing PvP on a massive scale. I like WAR for their RvR lakes, specially after the changes they made to world pvp the game is actually quite fun but like most mmos of today; it was too late. The going problem is DaOC is just too old to keep a enough players playing and WAR just is living off of life support (almost a year and all we've seen is 20 more RvR ranks and some more sets along with a host balance and RvR system changes that actaully made world pvp fun). Seems that SWTOR gets the prize, for doing it right i suppose.
TLDR: Finding out that GW2 only features PvE servers was a major downer for me, i was hope for a similar system in the open world as the mists since the game has the ability to do so (creating so much more competition much like Lineage 2 since there is no race vs race but a more massive GvG experience) but nonetheless ill be playing it. As far as SWTOR; as far as the PvE goes i enjoy the questing and its a nice change of pace from your quest grind ala wow. Im not very moved by group story since it feels.......out of place. Ill enjoy the questing and personal story while open world PVP my ass off with my lesbian evil bounty hunter >:3.
All in all other seek Open World PvP because its immersive and not scripted, and since in the last few years it seems developers cant realize that 10% of a games popualtion actually raids and still creates the cookie cutter formula. Yet SWTOR managed to sweeten the deal with personal relationships/vanity and story with the big hitter "Open World PVP".
TOR will be a ghost town in 6 months just like Star Trek. Buried under the weight of it's own IP and expectations.
Not sure i would say Tor will be a ghost town in 6 months, since i knwo many guilds and people that are going to make that trip t it and find it interesting as well as refreshing to see. They like that it is somwhat like the ktor games with hwo it's alignment system works and the ip of it.
More then 10% of the people in mmo will raid, though only a small percent will actually progression raid is true, but yet those same raiders will pvp as well so they seek both avennues realy. A game that can give both and entertain you is going to do beter overall then a game that focuses on one or the other.
Na, the sad fact is someone who was supposedly following the game would have known about the pvp format long ago, you know, like those that actualy followed the game did. I have nothing against a pvp rule set server, but would never play on one in this game becouse the most interesting end game content will require the cooperation of the three factions to solve. I can't see that happening on a pvpvp server. They are trying to do things a bit differently in TSW, why would people clammor for it to be the same old game they've played before? I'm preferring to try the game as intended, and see how it goes.
Open World PvP - Any member of a faction can attack any member of another faction anywhere in the world. You may or may not get loot from the other people, depending on the rules of the game.
Looks like most people define "open world" differently than you and the OP do. Mostly, I always thought it just meant open as opposed to private, i.e. instanced. That's how I've always seen it used before.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Open World PvP - Any member of a faction can attack any member of another faction anywhere in the world. You may or may not get loot from the other people, depending on the rules of the game.
Looks like most people define "open world" differently than you and the OP do. Mostly, I always thought it just meant open as opposed to private, i.e. instanced. That's how I've always seen it used before.
I can understand both sides of the view, since it can be open world pvp if you are apart of the world while your pvping inn a zone without it being instanced, but yet also some would place it as being pvp that occures all over the world instead of localized zones. I would go with it being a localized type of world pvp, or as zone-based pvp that is apart of the persist world of tsw.
Originally posted by Elricmerren Originally posted by Vhaln
Originally posted by lizardbones
Open World PvP - Any member of a faction can attack any member of another faction anywhere in the world. You may or may not get loot from the other people, depending on the rules of the game. Looks like most people define "open world" differently than you and the OP do. Mostly, I always thought it just meant open as opposed to private, i.e. instanced. That's how I've always seen it used before. I can understand both sides of the view, since it can be open world pvp if you are apart of the world while your pvping inn a zone without it being instanced, but yet also some would place it as being pvp that occures all over the world instead of localized zones. I would go with it being a localized type of world pvp, or as zone-based pvp that is apart of the persist world of tsw.
In a game like WoW or Rift, if the server is a PvP server, then you have open world PvP. If the server is a PvE server, you don't have open world PvP. You may still have PvP in PvP zones that isn't instanced...which I guess would be open PvP. It's not world PvP because the entire world (server) isn't open to PvP.
TSW doesn't have open world PvP, it's all isolated into zones or instanced into battlegrounds.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Comments
Actually i am on guard regardless of beng in a bg (not going to comment on arena sincec to me it s more sport then pvp.)or open world pvp (such as in darkfall) mostly because if you are pvping in a true pvp game you will have a pvper coming sooner or later (this is true of any pvper i know of). I actually enjoy both styles of pvp from going from a ffa pvp style like darkfall to a more objective stye group based pvp in otther games, and in truth i find ffa open world pvp to become far more boring much faster then the objective style. Sad to hear you do not find the pvp style desirable, for me pvp is about fighting as well as defeating another player as such i will embrace it in whatever form i can. NOw i would love to see hwo big and spread out the zone as well as objecttives are in the zones before i say anythign like pssibility of 1 on 1 pvp combat happening, mostly since in these people will be moving in groups mostly. I guess you have a arge distaste for group/zerg pvp which i understand and i dislike it as well, since it wittles down to who has what numbers wins. I will not compare in anyway rift pvp to tsw pvp for the sheer fact that the abbility systems are cmpletely different with rift being a class/talent system and tsw being completely a abbility/passive system; For the most part tsw will have a much easier time of balancing the pvp in tsw compared to rift since your passives as well as abbilities are easier to adjust/nerf or buff into balance (you will still have a fotm specc of abilities). Well i do hope you and the rest of the solo pvper find a good pvp based mmo to enjoy, since without a large reason as well as change in their mindset tsw wil be zone/bg style with some synergy between pvp as well as pve (i hope).
It is zone pvp like wintergrasp from what we can see, with objectives and large areas, although they may have qued/instanced pvp i am not sure it looks to be large scale zone based pvp for the most part.
Sad that I started this thread...it has a lot of care and a lot of bear...
Incognito
www.incognito-gaming.us
"You're either with us or against us"
Do you cry over every game that doesn't throw out it's lore in order to let you have open world PvP?
That's just not what this game is about.
Thats why these types are petrified of sandboxes.
Life IS Feudal
There's really no reason to PvP on PvP servers except for the sake of killing. Themepark-like games aren't the type of games you should be looking into for the PvP population. I bring it up all of the time, but L2 there were rarely any gankers because the cost of ganking was high. Now if you were in a war with a different guild... THEN you probably got camped until the war ended.
Good PvP mmos limit griefing by using an alignment system or consequence system. It doesn't work 100% correctly (you usually get those few strays who ruin the vision of the game type for basically everyone who says they are dumb). AoC there wasn't really a consequence when I played it. When there's no consequence....you kind of ruin the realism.
But when I say PvP mmo, I'm really just saying an mmo that's 50/50.
ANYWAYS... TSW has pvp done well for the type of game it is. I would play WoW if it had a classless system. Why? Because the last AAA mmo that's had a good system like this..well. Hmm... It's been a while. ANet and Funcom both understand this to some extent.
no open world pvp has pretty much sold this game for me. Woot
Considering the way Funcom handles Open PvP in Age of Conan this is a great move on their part.
He isn't asking for your sympathy. I agree with Slowdoves, I don't play mmos and pay a sub fee to get ganked by people with nothing better to do than torment others. If that's your idea of "fair" or "fun" perhaps you should consider some kind of profesional help. I want to have fun PvEing and PvP when I want to, not when someone else wants to. Seems like Ragnar and many others, including myself, share this vision. So you can crawl back to DF or MO and gank the few helpless people still playing those FFA PvP games. What most advocates for FFA PvP can't seem to grasp is their kind are dying because they kill their own games off, then move on and do the same to another game. So TSW and nearly every game out there isn't for you or your kind, maybe you should "go cry me a river" then, no?
Makes me want to vomit. I had SO much hope for this - I saw this as the first 3 faction mmorpg of quality since Dark Age of Camelot. Finally, I thought, someone with common sense and vision as to complex pvp mechanics instead of the same old predictable PVE or half arsed meaningless free for all pvp or the overdone 2 faction pvp where one side always has the edge. This is incredibly disappointing. I'm definitely going to foward this to my DAoC guild - going to have at least 20 pissed off people.
What is it going to take for a developer to get up and smell the epic of fantasy novels, movies, etc? Three factions is demanding, I realize this. It was hard in 2001 when Mythic released Dark Age of Camelot with dozens of classes and races that were unique to each other. I get that it takes more work and more dedication to creativity, I get that variation is not easy but as Spike TV's Deadliest Warrior has taught action fans, the variation between cultures in a warfare environment is addictive, entertaining, and just plain fascinating.
Three factions at war is a fantastic step forward for an mmorpg who doesn't mind creating a product that adults with educations can support. Three factions with complex political systems is alright in a dummed down society because there are plenty of the rest of us who are starving for such levels of depth.
/RIP Secret World. Dammit. Free to Play with a cash shop in the next 12 months with some Paul Barnett level propaganda as to why it's the best business model for the few remaining players. Mark my words. With them dashing what could have been so climactic and fun, even more folks will now make the SW: TOR jump.
What a ridiculous mistake.
Im sorry some of you didnt bother to read the point of The Secret World. However, there is an upcoming MMORPG called Prime: Battle for Dominus that will have exactly what youre ranting about. Enjoy.
QFT
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Oh wow, look Bob they really do exist... I mean really, afraid of sandboxes? As if sandboxes have anything to do with PVP..
Fear? Really, fear? WTH is there to fear?
Look I'm a PVPer through and through had my MMO start in DAOC on Mordred all I've ever done is play on FFA servers, or in games like SWG warring guilds..But I find this attitude freaking hilarious as well as pathetic. No one fears PVP, there's nothing to fear in it, the main reason non-pvpers do not like PVP, do not like to see it, as well as bemoan it, is you.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
For the most part ffa pvp is well interesting though it gets vary boring after a awhile, because you get to where you go out into the word either looking for pvp or getting found by someone looking for pvp and you are expecting it to happen. Battle ground style pvp is the same way you get to have find and enjoyment till it loses it luster, although if you gain things from said pvp style in a synergy system with pve such as access to instances or other things, it leads to a desire to still do this type of pvp. Both styles are well lack luster for their replay ability, since you can not really do it constantly without it feeling old, as well as losing much of the edge/importance it had at the start. Though most people who tried and read the game design as well as how the lore worked would have relised the game was never ment to be a ffa open world pvp based game, since it was prettty regularly stated that only pvp would be availible in the hallow earth yet rescently they added these zone control pvp activities. three faction based mmos are nott just a great idea for pvp based games, they are also great for pve based ones as well, since the third faction brings more tention as well as a wild card or new perception on the conflict at hand. I have played since uo as both a pvper, as well as pver going from ffa pvp to open loot pvp to bg/arena style pvp, and what i found i enjoyed the most was a good mix of them all. Why do i like that? Well because each is as boring as any pve content sandbox or themepark after you have spent hours in doing that alone. Trully everytime i see open world pvp they come the griefers and gankers on either a pvp-based or pve-based game, because they enjoying killing you (some just like making your day bad, as a way to make thier day feel better.); Yet also you will see the ninja/loot stealers as well who are going to get what they want damn those around them, why because they feel entitled to have what they want. Yet both of these are unavoidable evils of both game types, because nothign short of banning them will stop them from doing it, and i am happy to be rid of one of those with the fact that ffa open world pvp is not in game. Any pvper thatt actually thinks that they were duped into believing this game was open world pvp by funcom, but i got to say you were not duped by anyone but yourself really mostly since never did they state they were implimenting open world pvp at all. The evidence that three factions is perfect for pvp based combat is pretty frail since it is just as perfect for pve intrigue in story; Also the fact that it is based as a modern or classless system being great for pvp, well that is true for character playstyle customization in pve too. We all saw what we wanted to see plain as day, but to say that because of that the game will fail is childish. The game is pretty inovative in areas with being classless, a more mission status, and non stat based game base it is pretty far from wow in alot of ways, also people many pve and pvp players have been looking for a classless mmo either pve or pvp based for awhile now.
And yet another DAOC reference - TSW will have "open world" FvF PvP ala DAOC, in that there are PvP zones for it, the way DAOC had the frontiers. More or less. The OP just misused the term "open world" and seems to mean something more like PvP-anywhere. No, it is limited to PvP zones, but that's still way better than team PvP in instanced arenas and the like.
Why am I the only one pointing this out, in this ridiculously long and misleading thread? Am I wrong, or what? What do other people think?
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
And yet another DAOC reference - TSW will have "open world" FvF PvP ala DAOC, in that there are PvP zones for it, the way DAOC had the frontiers. More or less. The OP just misused the term "open world" and seems to mean something more like PvP-anywhere. No, it is limited to PvP zones, but that's still way better than team PvP in instanced arenas and the like.
Why am I the only one pointing this out, in this ridiculously long and misleading thread? Am I wrong, or what? What do other people think?
Open World PvP - Any member of a faction can attack any member of another faction anywhere in the world. You may or may not get loot from the other people, depending on the rules of the game.
FFA PvP - Players can earn reputation with factions, but aren't required to be a member of factions. Any player can attack any other player more or less at any time. Players may or may not get loot from killing other players.
TSW will not have Open World PvP, nor will it have FFA PvP.
TSW will have Faction v Faction v Faction PvP in either instanced battlegrounds or in zones where everyone is flagged for PvP (like Wintergrasp in WoW).
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
There will be other PvP options in-game. Those who believe open world PvP would be appropriate in TSW, should probably read some of the lore behind it.
Lead designer: "PvP is free for all in the fight club of every hub city. What's special is that you can even make a gank. Although it's a little bit dirty and unfair to some of you, it seems that it's really what the developers want to see, "what we usually see in games like this is that these areas are being self-policed by the players. If a player plays dirty, he will be punished by the other players." Besides, fighting club can be occupied by other factions. For example, a group of Illuminati players burst into Templars' fight club and occupy it while Dragon players may suddenly come and kick Illuminati out if it."
DAOC is alive and kicking still for your 3 realm thrills. Graphics are good even by today's standard.
And in DAoC the RvR is also taking place in separate zones of the world and not everywhere in it. It's praised as the best RvR MMO ever, by most.
TOR will be a ghost town in 6 months just like Star Trek. Buried under the weight of it's own IP and expectations.
Not sure i would say Tor will be a ghost town in 6 months, since i knwo many guilds and people that are going to make that trip t it and find it interesting as well as refreshing to see. They like that it is somwhat like the ktor games with hwo it's alignment system works and the ip of it.
More then 10% of the people in mmo will raid, though only a small percent will actually progression raid is true, but yet those same raiders will pvp as well so they seek both avennues realy. A game that can give both and entertain you is going to do beter overall then a game that focuses on one or the other.
Na, the sad fact is someone who was supposedly following the game would have known about the pvp format long ago, you know, like those that actualy followed the game did. I have nothing against a pvp rule set server, but would never play on one in this game becouse the most interesting end game content will require the cooperation of the three factions to solve. I can't see that happening on a pvpvp server. They are trying to do things a bit differently in TSW, why would people clammor for it to be the same old game they've played before? I'm preferring to try the game as intended, and see how it goes.
Looks like most people define "open world" differently than you and the OP do. Mostly, I always thought it just meant open as opposed to private, i.e. instanced. That's how I've always seen it used before.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
I can understand both sides of the view, since it can be open world pvp if you are apart of the world while your pvping inn a zone without it being instanced, but yet also some would place it as being pvp that occures all over the world instead of localized zones. I would go with it being a localized type of world pvp, or as zone-based pvp that is apart of the persist world of tsw.
Open World PvP - Any member of a faction can attack any member of another faction anywhere in the world. You may or may not get loot from the other people, depending on the rules of the game.
Looks like most people define "open world" differently than you and the OP do. Mostly, I always thought it just meant open as opposed to private, i.e. instanced. That's how I've always seen it used before.
I can understand both sides of the view, since it can be open world pvp if you are apart of the world while your pvping inn a zone without it being instanced, but yet also some would place it as being pvp that occures all over the world instead of localized zones. I would go with it being a localized type of world pvp, or as zone-based pvp that is apart of the persist world of tsw.
In a game like WoW or Rift, if the server is a PvP server, then you have open world PvP. If the server is a PvE server, you don't have open world PvP. You may still have PvP in PvP zones that isn't instanced...which I guess would be open PvP. It's not world PvP because the entire world (server) isn't open to PvP.
TSW doesn't have open world PvP, it's all isolated into zones or instanced into battlegrounds.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.