DAOC best PVP / RVR i ever play to bad the LAG made me quite..... i was told the game was build on a to heavy platform to start with even with a new PC / Video card / Ram add etc...
It was an absolutely amazing game when it came out. For people getting into it way after release, or even post-WoW, it is hard to convey the excitement of logging into DAoC when it was brand new. When it came out, EQ1 and UO were the big boys on the block. There were no Asian F2Ps readily available, there was basically only one other new MMORPG out there and that was the highly buggy AO that was having major issues at the time.
When I first got the game, I had already played massively multiplayer games for a while, namely text-based MUDs, but also EQ1. However, DAoC just wowed my socks off! Everyone comments on how clunky it feels and how bad the interface is today, but compared to the original EQ1, it was very smooth and easy to use. It was far more intuitive.
The community was awesome, helpful and tight-knit. If the Albs came attacking the realm keep, people flooded the frontier to defend it, even if they were not level 50. But then, RvR was not at all about RRs or gear. It was about coordination, cooperation, and good leaders and scouts.
Classic DAoC and even SI were the funnest period of that game. ToA sort of began to make it sour, not just because of more forced PvE but also because the housing expansion came in soon after and caused people to sit in their houses rather than in the capitol city. The decline also really came when certain class changes caused much of Midgard to quit or change realm, and then cross realming and instanced dungeons.
I wish something like it would come out again, but fact is that I don't think a DAoC2 fits for this day and age of cash shops, soloers, and instant gratification crowd. Part of old DAoC was getting attached to a single character because it took time, planning and friends to get to 50 and some basic gear.
I've been really impressed with the new content in this latest patch - the new user journey and the quests available in the battlgrounds.
My experience over the past week as a returning/intermittent player has been that all of the battlegrounds have been populated, I've found groups when I've wanted them with no problem and that there is definitely bg fun to be had.
I'm not denying that end game RvR is elitist, it always has been and for a game this age that isn't going to change yet there are still ways around it and there are still guilds recruiting new players.
I've always enjoyed playing DAoC, whether others do or not and what they think 'killed' it or didn't doesn't matter to me - it was my first MMO love and the only true love
DAoC was my first MMORPG too. Fond memories all around, and it shaped my attitude toward MMO (And not to mention affected my life otherwise I wouldn't be here working for MMORPG.com ) Nice look back, Lori.
To give feedback on moderation, contact mikeb@mmorpg.com
Games will continue to get worse because they cater to Generation Y (ie: Anyone born after 1981) Or as I like to call them the "Sup" generation. Laziest most self entitled generation ever. Period. Ya noes wat ize be sayin yo?
Best MMO to date , no community at all now , even with this boasted aniversery, they needed to make daoc 2 and we all thought warhammer was that. Seen how that nightmare of a mess MMO turn out, but alas that's the past. Now they need to do it right for the future. DAOC 2 ftw.
Till then, DAOC was a great game in it's day, now ? eh only the elitest stay, I was one of those RR top players, would I go back? Nope, sorry, need new candy for this baby!
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
I still pop in every 3 months or so to play around, mainly since there's STILL nothing that comes even close to the fun RvRvR brings. I still don't understand why noone has copied this game... It's the best MMO ever...EVER.
TOA didn't kill DAOC. It's a copout for the "IWantItNow" crowd to flame DAOC's death for. DAOC died because they started drastically moving away from a COMPLEX game with equal PVE & PVP that dictated each other's involvement within the game, towards a game more close to WoW's linear questing crowed with a pure PVP mindset.
The only problem with TOA was how difficult it was to obtain Artifacts for people who were spending 20+hours trying to get just ONE of them, and THEN you had to level them to 10 from 0 for a couple weeks before they were even useful. This meant that not ONLY once you got an artifact, which was hard, but you ALSO had to GRIND for almost a month just to get the XP the artifacts needed to be useful. The XP part should have been a MAXIMUM of 3days of hard grinding, NOT 2-3 weeks of hard grinding
This is spot on. And the sub numbers support this.
What i think was odd is the attack on doac pve at the time.... even now. TOA raids for the 1st year were good they beat anythign other mmos would have for 2+ years easy. What daoc didn't do well is have boars.
Yep if doac had 20% more boar they would have been far better off; oh and by boars i mean linear quests to level to max.
People like that.
Honestly i feel if you wanted to make a daoc 2 i am 100% EVERY dev would provide these (because most mmorpgs want them).
However, for the sake of discussion you could allow these and also provide greater exp/rewards for grouping as was the case in older mmos. Thus allowing for both system to exist with-in a game.
Also the faults of TOA were real, arti were implemented too epic (hard, freak just gettign the scrolls for a few was harder than getting all that artis you needed) Leveling them was slow. TOA largest failure was the oover powered nature of the artis requiring PVP players to pve (A LOT).
The system previous to this encouraged dabbling , but didn't require participation.
I also felt that moves to nomrally the classes between the three sides was a bad move. The classes were already so diverse that alts were plentiful, then after a year or so ona side you might switch and do it all over agian (with a smile on your face, i can remember moving from a druid to many other hibs, then over to a healer, etc ,etc.).
I like Old froentiers but honestly the castles in NF were far better than the old ones. New frontieers was too large and open however. After one change to pvp i never resubbed, i cannot for pvp is bad now. The removal of ladders.
Ladders were a poorly developed part of DAOC, they were not easy to use, and in pvp they allowed scatered defenders to reproch people coming up to a high level of a castle wall,etc. Ramps are bad, no caster and even attack a person on a ramp its 100% los time, etc. Awful change, that was kept which really shows that mythic in no way has the ability to produce a good game anymore. Becuase they don't understand what makes games good. Remember ramps are easy, they take less time to learn to use.
Its kinda like skyrim it might seem good, tons of money went into it, but everyoen who played marriorwind knows they only degressed. But hey its simpler and "more fun" now.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Best game ever made, and hope it stays around for a long time, as I like to still dabble in it.
Sadly, it was bought out so no one could update or improve upon it. All of this in an effort to try to hold on to the Titanic of games (Warhammer). What a shame they sacrificed such a unique gem for such a craptastic repeat 2 faction instanced pvp mmorpg.
I think DAoC is impossible to recreate, I'm sorry to say. The three-way (hehe) RvR was great, sure. The keep siege aspects were brilliant. The realms, epic quests, dragons, raids... (Caer Sidi anyone??) but what really made it great was the people playing. This is not a jab at the WoW community or whatever. It's just an observation that MMORPG players naturally went about things differently and it's not something that can be maunfactured.
Someone touched on it above, PUGs were just what people did PVE and RVR. They weren't even called PUGs for the first few years the game came out. They were just called groups Once you got into a group, chances were that you'd be in it for quite some time. It wasn't uncommon to get in one or two groups total over the span of a 4+ hour gaming session. What you would see were guild group but even these groups weren't usually pre-made. They just happened to be the guildmates that were online. If they had an open space and you were a compatible class chances were they'd invite you and chat in group chat out of courtesy.
This PUG attitude, meshed with the pre-wow leveling process, made for a very different atmosphere. For one thing, people knew their classes. I'm not saying everyone was a l33t g4mer but if you were a tank you knew you were supposed to be keeping aggro and pealing mobs ff of the more squishy groupmebrs. If you were a caster or a rogue you knew you had to take it easy at first and be sure not to steal that aggro from the tanks... etc. If you didn't know someone would just tell you. It may sound crazy now but the whole group would often stop, explain the tactics, and help bring the person up to speed. Why not? They were gonna be there for a while anyway and it would help the Realm in the long run.
As for the leveling process, or 'the grind', there was a method behind the madness. I mentioned above that groups would stay together for a long time. That has a lot to do with the fact that leveling was not running from quest-to-quest. It was dungeon crawling and camping. Don't get me wrong, I understand that there are drawbacks to this and maybe more drawbacks than the quests-on-rails method has, but what it DID do was make it natural to really get to know random people. It's kinda hard not to when you grindin with them for an hour. Plus there was downtime while healers got their mana back etc... People didn't just sit there silently twiddling their thumbs. They got to now each oher. I'm not saying you became BFFs with everyone but you knew who they were. The more groups you got in the more people you knew and by the time you got to your mid-levels you knew your Realmmates. Conversely, you had no idea who those other people in that other realm were but they looked funny, you couldn't understand what they were sayin, they casted weird looking spells and were taking your keeps! F^*% THAT! Not on my watch!
I still hope that some developers really put their heads together one day and recreate some of this magic in a modern MMO with a focus on 'natural' community builders.
Build it and they will come. Did you ever think that because of the quality of Dark Age of Camelot, we had an equally quality community? Three realms, medieval warfare, unique classes on all sides, NO mirrors of anything. Meaningful pvp. Damn, we need this.
Comments
DAOC best PVP / RVR i ever play to bad the LAG made me quite..... i was told the game was build on a to heavy platform to start with even with a new PC / Video card / Ram add etc...
Happy 10th birthday to DAoC.
It was an absolutely amazing game when it came out. For people getting into it way after release, or even post-WoW, it is hard to convey the excitement of logging into DAoC when it was brand new. When it came out, EQ1 and UO were the big boys on the block. There were no Asian F2Ps readily available, there was basically only one other new MMORPG out there and that was the highly buggy AO that was having major issues at the time.
When I first got the game, I had already played massively multiplayer games for a while, namely text-based MUDs, but also EQ1. However, DAoC just wowed my socks off! Everyone comments on how clunky it feels and how bad the interface is today, but compared to the original EQ1, it was very smooth and easy to use. It was far more intuitive.
The community was awesome, helpful and tight-knit. If the Albs came attacking the realm keep, people flooded the frontier to defend it, even if they were not level 50. But then, RvR was not at all about RRs or gear. It was about coordination, cooperation, and good leaders and scouts.
Classic DAoC and even SI were the funnest period of that game. ToA sort of began to make it sour, not just because of more forced PvE but also because the housing expansion came in soon after and caused people to sit in their houses rather than in the capitol city. The decline also really came when certain class changes caused much of Midgard to quit or change realm, and then cross realming and instanced dungeons.
I wish something like it would come out again, but fact is that I don't think a DAoC2 fits for this day and age of cash shops, soloers, and instant gratification crowd. Part of old DAoC was getting attached to a single character because it took time, planning and friends to get to 50 and some basic gear.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
I've been really impressed with the new content in this latest patch - the new user journey and the quests available in the battlgrounds.
My experience over the past week as a returning/intermittent player has been that all of the battlegrounds have been populated, I've found groups when I've wanted them with no problem and that there is definitely bg fun to be had.
I'm not denying that end game RvR is elitist, it always has been and for a game this age that isn't going to change yet there are still ways around it and there are still guilds recruiting new players.
I've always enjoyed playing DAoC, whether others do or not and what they think 'killed' it or didn't doesn't matter to me - it was my first MMO love and the only true love
DAoC was my first MMORPG too. Fond memories all around, and it shaped my attitude toward MMO (And not to mention affected my life otherwise I wouldn't be here working for MMORPG.com
) Nice look back, Lori.
To give feedback on moderation, contact mikeb@mmorpg.com
Games will continue to get worse because they cater to Generation Y (ie: Anyone born after 1981) Or as I like to call them the "Sup" generation. Laziest most self entitled generation ever. Period. Ya noes wat ize be sayin yo?
Best MMO to date , no community at all now , even with this boasted aniversery, they needed to make daoc 2 and we all thought warhammer was that. Seen how that nightmare of a mess MMO turn out, but alas that's the past. Now they need to do it right for the future. DAOC 2 ftw.
Till then, DAOC was a great game in it's day, now ? eh only the elitest stay, I was one of those RR top players, would I go back? Nope, sorry, need new candy for this baby!
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
everyone get back now !
They solved the Buffbot problem, there are npc who sell buff tockens for some silver to full buff you. No need for second acc now !!
I still pop in every 3 months or so to play around, mainly since there's STILL nothing that comes even close to the fun RvRvR brings. I still don't understand why noone has copied this game... It's the best MMO ever...EVER.
I measure all other games to this game. And I always come back to camelot. Enough said.
This is spot on. And the sub numbers support this.
What i think was odd is the attack on doac pve at the time.... even now. TOA raids for the 1st year were good they beat anythign other mmos would have for 2+ years easy. What daoc didn't do well is have boars.
Yep if doac had 20% more boar they would have been far better off; oh and by boars i mean linear quests to level to max.
People like that.
Honestly i feel if you wanted to make a daoc 2 i am 100% EVERY dev would provide these (because most mmorpgs want them).
However, for the sake of discussion you could allow these and also provide greater exp/rewards for grouping as was the case in older mmos. Thus allowing for both system to exist with-in a game.
Also the faults of TOA were real, arti were implemented too epic (hard, freak just gettign the scrolls for a few was harder than getting all that artis you needed) Leveling them was slow. TOA largest failure was the oover powered nature of the artis requiring PVP players to pve (A LOT).
The system previous to this encouraged dabbling , but didn't require participation.
I also felt that moves to nomrally the classes between the three sides was a bad move. The classes were already so diverse that alts were plentiful, then after a year or so ona side you might switch and do it all over agian (with a smile on your face, i can remember moving from a druid to many other hibs, then over to a healer, etc ,etc.).
I like Old froentiers but honestly the castles in NF were far better than the old ones. New frontieers was too large and open however. After one change to pvp i never resubbed, i cannot for pvp is bad now. The removal of ladders.
Ladders were a poorly developed part of DAOC, they were not easy to use, and in pvp they allowed scatered defenders to reproch people coming up to a high level of a castle wall,etc. Ramps are bad, no caster and even attack a person on a ramp its 100% los time, etc. Awful change, that was kept which really shows that mythic in no way has the ability to produce a good game anymore. Becuase they don't understand what makes games good. Remember ramps are easy, they take less time to learn to use.
Easy easy easy = simple simple simple = boring boring boring.
Its kinda like skyrim it might seem good, tons of money went into it, but everyoen who played marriorwind knows they only degressed. But hey its simpler and "more fun" now.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Sadly, it was bought out so no one could update or improve upon it. All of this in an effort to try to hold on to the Titanic of games (Warhammer). What a shame they sacrificed such a unique gem for such a craptastic repeat 2 faction instanced pvp mmorpg.
Damn it. I wish I were a millionaire.
Build it and they will come. Did you ever think that because of the quality of Dark Age of Camelot, we had an equally quality community? Three realms, medieval warfare, unique classes on all sides, NO mirrors of anything. Meaningful pvp. Damn, we need this.