"After only a couple weeks online, the news for The Old Republic has gone from good to bad. Following some drama over the weekend, news has come out that after one week on the UK charts the game dropped from #10 to #38. Now the analysts are stepping in and while they see a healthy MMO market, they don’t think that TOR is hurting WoW at all:
Baird Equity estimates that the game has peak concurrent users of roughly 350,000 players.
According to analysts at Cowen and Company the uptake of The Old Republic has had “minimal apparent impact” on Blizzard and Activision’s market-leading World of Warcraft.
Hopefully things pick up and the concurrent player base grows, otherwise the game will become like Warhammer Online in a few months."
You think that's bad? ... How many people does one pro football stadium seat? I think it's average of like 60k. 350K, every day...that's really good.
Consider, WoW didn't start at 1 million or 11 million, it slowly over 4 months and upwards increased to exponential numbers. Stop finding negativity where there is none, thanks.
Totally different era of gaming.
I wouldn't expect any big budget game to ever show a pattern of growth like WoW, again... unless you somehow think the game is going to bring non-gamers to the table.
350k concurrent users is probably pretty nice... if they maintained that for a year or two or three... but I think there are a lot more pressures that would push people to drop subscriptions than keep them... and TOR has plenty of work that needs to be done to patch up the problems and keep content matching demand.... we'll just have to see how things look in a few months/year.
It is negative news but its not really worth noting...
How is it negative though? Having 350k online concurrently during peak hours seems rather impressive to me. Not to mention there's nothing to say that number won't grow. It isn't like WoW or other popular mmos garnered their impressive player numbers over night.
This number really says nothing positive or negative about the game. The one thing I will say though is the NO western market MMORPG since WoW has managed to exceed the subs it had during its first month. So the odds are really stacked against SWTOR in this regard. If it does manage to exceed the subs it has during month 1, that will be an impressive feat.
LOTRO did.
Nothing since then though. I think its about 50/50 if this is SWTOR peak, it will depend on the first few months of patches. if they actually get in all the PvP changes theyve said will be in for January people will be impressed.
This is getting sad. Let just all agreed right now that it is a complete fail and in fact no longer is being played at all and that they are about to shut the doors. Maybe people will then be happy. Following SWTOR on this site is worse than the CNN News cycle.
I can't wait until about April of this year. That will be the time when we should either see game numbers go up...or game numbers go down, but it wouldn't surprise me to see a drop after the games first month. From all the negative post about the game on the main forums(which from my memory I have never seen a new game get slammed so badly in such short time) this game could see one of the most massive drops in player base we've ever seen.
Never seen a game get bashed this bad on mmorpg.com? You're not new so you either have short term memory loss or are just selectively remembering past launches. EVERY game gets slammed just like this with haters declaring the game a failure and the fanboys singing the games praises.
We all get you wanted a sandbox and didn't get it, I myself would like a good sandbox after playing swg for at least 3 years but the reality is even if this isn't what you wanted it is what many others wanted. After playing for the last few weeks I"m still hooked and outside of swg and coh nothing has done the trick for me over the years.
I believe she was speaking of the official forums and I agree I have rarely seen so much hate out of the gate on the official boards.
Then you weren't on the official forums when swg launched. :P
Oh I was there, and it was nothing like this games forums. People were not cancelling before the game even went officailly live! LOL! People were posting they cancelled during the EGA!
1. Yes, its getting slammed, but its also a rather low percentage of people. No game had higher expectations so its getting slammed because it didnt meet unrealistic expectations. SWTOR also has an unusually large number of people that want the game to fail and will spread negativity at any chance they get. these forums hear are overflowing with such posts.
The game has issues, but its not even close to WAR or AoC issues
2. I think Rift patch 1.1 was the most hate Ive ever seen on a forum. That place was a complete shitshow then. Granted it was mostly upset Rftblades, but boy did they whine up a storm.
3. SWG was awful at launch in many key aspects. It was released at least 6 mnths to early and had tons of articles written about how much it sucked. Vanguard released in better shape than SWG. People were more forgiving then and stuck with it.
According to vgcharts it had 1.7m after the 1st week (box sales only).
Add to this the digital orders and the sales since then, and it may easily have passed the 2m mark.
According to vgcharts it had 900.000 boxes preordered in the US, which meant 900.000 digital copies in the US, which meant 500.000 boxes in EU, which meant 500.000 digital copies in EU, with meant 200.000 boxes in the rest of the world, which meant 200.000 copies in the rest of the world, which meant 3.200.000 preorders, and God knows how many millions at launch, and gazillions after christmas.
But the fact is that EA announced "more than one milion subs" and hasn't announded yet the 2 milion.
This is getting sad. Let just all agreed right now that it is a complete fail and in fact no longer is being played at all and that they are about to shut the doors. Maybe people will then be happy. Following SWTOR on this site is worse than the CNN News cycle.
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
TOR may not be 100% at launch, but is still better at launch then 99% of other MMOs at launch.
Patches, content updates, major patches + expansions etc. this is going to be a game I play for many, many years.
I don't care if it ever "beats WoW" it is a better game, through and through.
So much better than WAR at launch, so much better than Rift, other MMOs aren't even worth mentioning.
GW2 is going to be the only MMO I will split my TOR time with. But I won't feel wrong or dirty about it because of GW2 being B2P.
And that is based off 100% GW2 hype. Could turn out much different.
I just love how on THIS site and others, if TOR doesn't "beat WoW" it's a failure.
Another week and a half and I'll have been playing TOR for a month. Definitely sticking around, as is my entire guild and everyone I know in another friend guild on my server.
The thought of going back to a non-VO MMO or a fantasy MMO after experiencing true Sci-Fi Star Wars MMO Bioware bliss, no thanks a billion.
They have isolated a lot of players who would play but they would have to totally upgrade computers to do so. I don't play rift or star wars right now because I would have to totally upgrade my computer.
Why do so many people waste their time bean counting and comparing numbers to other games when it's not even their job to give a crap? (yes you forum posters) Just play the games you like and stop this wacky BS. Hey guess what? I play TOR, and WoW, and I'm also gonna play GW2......woo0000
Im not sure it will ever be like Warhammer. Or be any kind of failed project.
But the novelty is going to subside. This game isnt bad. I just wouldnt call it necessarily good. Once people get over it being "STAR WARS! OMG! BIOWARE! WEEEE! " its going to move to the background. Give it three months and see where it is.
If it werent for it being Star Wars, and if Bioware didnt have its massive popularity this game would be barely a blimp in the genre because its not particularly well made in comparison to other mmorpgs. It may improve in time and Im sure it will.
But again, give it a few months. This will never kill WoW, and it will never even begin to compare to its success. Its going to fade into teh background soon enough. Just wait.
eve's Peak concurrent record is about 59,000 and it's considered very successful.
i remember being on EQ1 and getting a GM announcement to have everyone you kow logon because they were coming close to PCU of 50k for the first time. I called all my RL friends who played eq and we all logged on to help the effort.
if you approximate that a game's PCU is about 20% of it's subscriber base then that'd put SWTOR players about halfway between 1 million and 2 million.
that's plenty of people and i have to imagine that most games would kill to be having this many PCU.
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
For most MMOs the actual subscriber base is 10x the concurrent users, however we are still talking about launch here where a higher percentge than normal will be online. As much as I'd like POS lazily developed games like this go down the pan, those numbers are still pretty impressive. These numbers have limited value though until the ACTUAL subscription phase kicks in, I'd guess that AoC and WAR had half to as much concurrent players at launch.
Got to love how a game fails if it doesn't have WOW numbers. Who the frig cares? If it has a healthy population that subscribes to it every month then it is a successful MMORPG. Period. I could care less about WOW.
Im not sure it will ever be like Warhammer. Or be any kind of failed project.
But the novelty is going to subside. This game isnt bad. I just wouldnt call it necessarily good. Once people get over it being "STAR WARS! OMG! BIOWARE! WEEEE! " its going to move to the background. Give it three months and see where it is.
If it werent for it being Star Wars, and if Bioware didnt have its massive popularity this game would be barely a blimp in the genre because its not particularly well made in comparison to other mmorpgs. It may improve in time and Im sure it will.
But again, give it a few months. This will never kill WoW, and it will never even begin to compare to its success. Its going to fade into teh background soon enough. Just wait.
Yeah...you may be waiting for a LONG time.
Yeah...you may be waiting till march.
Exactamondo! This ^
People will enjoy this off and on for years. But massively so? Nah. Like the good man said. March is a good estimate.
Game is not BAD. Its not. Is it good? Not so much. It resides somewhere in the middle. A great effort in adding voice overs to mmorpgs. Really. A solid effort. And not much of a solid effort was made in regards to just about every other aspect of the game. Minimal effort across the board in every other regard.
Most fans are freaking over novelty. Its new. Its something to play. Its Star Wars. But with the minimal effort they've made here? This hype wont last.
Now you die hard fans might stick with it awhile longer before you burn out and you will. But you'll always have new players to play with. The game world isnt going to die away. Not anytime soon. But this over reaction to this game isnt going to last.
If it werent Star Wars and didnt have the brand name Bioware slapped on it, most of you wouldnt be playing it past the first month. Bioware has made a competent mmo compared to those that release 5 or even 7 years ago. But this isnt going to change the industry. Most "good" mmos are more polished than this. More alive.
Its not a bad effort. Just a mediocre one in design and execution.
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
The following statement is false The previous statement is true
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
.....except Bioware devs have stated that they used WoW as a basis for most of their design decisions.
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
.....except Bioware devs have stated that they used WoW as a basis for most of their design decisions.
Yes they did. And it shows. Although Im not a WoW fan. Wow did it better. It does, did and will continue to do so.
Just saying.
One thing Tor has that WoW doesnt? Nifty voice overs. Now lets see how long that lasts you.
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
.....except Bioware devs have stated that they used WoW as a basis for most of their design decisions.
....except too many people misunderstood the fact that Bioware was talking about the WoW themepark model, not cloning the game and all its systems.
1. Make a game that a appeals to casuals.
2. Make a game that's easy to learn, but hard to master.
3. Make a game that can be played on most computers.
4. Make a game with the standard themepark elements including questing, crafting, dungeons, raids, instanced pvp, etc.
5. In short, make a game that has the best chance of making the most money, and pulling in the most subscriptions.
And yet people continue to spread the BS that Bioware said they were going to "clone" their game after WoW. They never said that. They said they would make a themepark game modeled after the WoW business model, which is quite different than making it a "clone."
Anyone with half a brain and an ounce of objectivity who has played this game would say that yes, it's the same TYPE of game as WoW, but no...it doesn't FEEL like WoW, aside from the fact that it's fun as hell, which is what Vanilla WoW was.
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
.....except Bioware devs have stated that they used WoW as a basis for most of their design decisions.
that may well be as regards the UI... although by the sound of it, unlike wow the UI isnt that moddable, though when you take into account the complaints about a number of other games that released last year, that had very user unfriendly UI's then its understandable that they would have a really good look at one that works.. but UI's are not the whole game.. otherwise we would be getting complaints that MW3 etc are just Counterstrike clones (their not.. counterstrike is better for one thing ) on the other hand, is SW;TOR even having a good launch, the servers are down for maintenance every day pretty much.. which .. is a sign that there are a few issues that their struggling to resolve, perhaps it was too much to expect the launch of SW;TOR to be as good as the launch of Rift..
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
.....except Bioware devs have stated that they used WoW as a basis for most of their design decisions.
Yes they did. And it shows. Although Im not a WoW fan. Wow did it better. It does, did and will continue to do so.
Just saying.
One thing Tor has that WoW doesnt? Nifty voice overs. Now lets see how long that lasts you.
Might wana ask around and see how cata is liked.
Just saying
The following statement is false The previous statement is true
Comments
Totally different era of gaming.
I wouldn't expect any big budget game to ever show a pattern of growth like WoW, again... unless you somehow think the game is going to bring non-gamers to the table.
350k concurrent users is probably pretty nice... if they maintained that for a year or two or three... but I think there are a lot more pressures that would push people to drop subscriptions than keep them... and TOR has plenty of work that needs to be done to patch up the problems and keep content matching demand.... we'll just have to see how things look in a few months/year.
We'll know.
If this article is correct, then 350k concurrent players is an amazing amount. Obviously, the author doesn't know what "concurrent" means.
Well it doesn't have 2 million players yet, when seemed it would have 2-6 million at launch
An honest review of SW:TOR 6/10 (Danny Wojcicki)
LOTRO did.
Nothing since then though. I think its about 50/50 if this is SWTOR peak, it will depend on the first few months of patches. if they actually get in all the PvP changes theyve said will be in for January people will be impressed.
According to vgcharts it had 1.7m after the 1st week (box sales only).
Add to this the digital orders and the sales since then, and it may easily have passed the 2m mark.
This is getting sad. Let just all agreed right now that it is a complete fail and in fact no longer is being played at all and that they are about to shut the doors. Maybe people will then be happy. Following SWTOR on this site is worse than the CNN News cycle.
I self identify as a monkey.
1. Yes, its getting slammed, but its also a rather low percentage of people. No game had higher expectations so its getting slammed because it didnt meet unrealistic expectations. SWTOR also has an unusually large number of people that want the game to fail and will spread negativity at any chance they get. these forums hear are overflowing with such posts.
The game has issues, but its not even close to WAR or AoC issues
2. I think Rift patch 1.1 was the most hate Ive ever seen on a forum. That place was a complete shitshow then. Granted it was mostly upset Rftblades, but boy did they whine up a storm.
3. SWG was awful at launch in many key aspects. It was released at least 6 mnths to early and had tons of articles written about how much it sucked. Vanguard released in better shape than SWG. People were more forgiving then and stuck with it.
According to vgcharts it had 900.000 boxes preordered in the US, which meant 900.000 digital copies in the US, which meant 500.000 boxes in EU, which meant 500.000 digital copies in EU, with meant 200.000 boxes in the rest of the world, which meant 200.000 copies in the rest of the world, which meant 3.200.000 preorders, and God knows how many millions at launch, and gazillions after christmas.
But the fact is that EA announced "more than one milion subs" and hasn't announded yet the 2 milion.
An honest review of SW:TOR 6/10 (Danny Wojcicki)
Dont' go to the official forum then xD
An honest review of SW:TOR 6/10 (Danny Wojcicki)
You know, it gets old seeing comments from kiddies who arent old enough to know that WoW is a clone of several other mmos before it. And to call SWTOR a WoW clone is obviously done by those who arent playing SWTOR! I have played nearly all of the mmos since 2000 and can say that SWTOR is NOT a WoW clone. It is nicely done and has gaming aspects that WoW clearly doesnt. I am enjoying SWTOR and know it is a great mmo. If you don't then simply don't play it!!! Lol. Very simple.
BTW, the terms Fanboy and Troll are just names the kiddies give to those who disagree with them....is a kid thing. Lmao.
I've said it before, I'll say it again.
TOR may not be 100% at launch, but is still better at launch then 99% of other MMOs at launch.
Patches, content updates, major patches + expansions etc. this is going to be a game I play for many, many years.
I don't care if it ever "beats WoW" it is a better game, through and through.
So much better than WAR at launch, so much better than Rift, other MMOs aren't even worth mentioning.
GW2 is going to be the only MMO I will split my TOR time with. But I won't feel wrong or dirty about it because of GW2 being B2P.
And that is based off 100% GW2 hype. Could turn out much different.
I just love how on THIS site and others, if TOR doesn't "beat WoW" it's a failure.
Another week and a half and I'll have been playing TOR for a month. Definitely sticking around, as is my entire guild and everyone I know in another friend guild on my server.
The thought of going back to a non-VO MMO or a fantasy MMO after experiencing true Sci-Fi Star Wars MMO Bioware bliss, no thanks a billion.
They have isolated a lot of players who would play but they would have to totally upgrade computers to do so. I don't play rift or star wars right now because I would have to totally upgrade my computer.
Why do so many people waste their time bean counting and comparing numbers to other games when it's not even their job to give a crap? (yes you forum posters) Just play the games you like and stop this wacky BS. Hey guess what? I play TOR, and WoW, and I'm also gonna play GW2......woo0000
Yeah...you may be waiting till march.
eve's Peak concurrent record is about 59,000 and it's considered very successful.
i remember being on EQ1 and getting a GM announcement to have everyone you kow logon because they were coming close to PCU of 50k for the first time. I called all my RL friends who played eq and we all logged on to help the effort.
if you approximate that a game's PCU is about 20% of it's subscriber base then that'd put SWTOR players about halfway between 1 million and 2 million.
that's plenty of people and i have to imagine that most games would kill to be having this many PCU.
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Dwight D Eisenhower
My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.
Henry Rollins
For most MMOs the actual subscriber base is 10x the concurrent users, however we are still talking about launch here where a higher percentge than normal will be online. As much as I'd like POS lazily developed games like this go down the pan, those numbers are still pretty impressive. These numbers have limited value though until the ACTUAL subscription phase kicks in, I'd guess that AoC and WAR had half to as much concurrent players at launch.
Couldn't they had said how many Concurrent players Wow had as well at the same time?
Without comparisions any number is just useless info.
^^this^^
Exactamondo! This ^
People will enjoy this off and on for years. But massively so? Nah. Like the good man said. March is a good estimate.
Game is not BAD. Its not. Is it good? Not so much. It resides somewhere in the middle. A great effort in adding voice overs to mmorpgs. Really. A solid effort. And not much of a solid effort was made in regards to just about every other aspect of the game. Minimal effort across the board in every other regard.
Most fans are freaking over novelty. Its new. Its something to play. Its Star Wars. But with the minimal effort they've made here? This hype wont last.
Now you die hard fans might stick with it awhile longer before you burn out and you will. But you'll always have new players to play with. The game world isnt going to die away. Not anytime soon. But this over reaction to this game isnt going to last.
If it werent Star Wars and didnt have the brand name Bioware slapped on it, most of you wouldnt be playing it past the first month. Bioware has made a competent mmo compared to those that release 5 or even 7 years ago. But this isnt going to change the industry. Most "good" mmos are more polished than this. More alive.
Its not a bad effort. Just a mediocre one in design and execution.
I think people confuse wow clone and themepark. Yes swtor is a themepark, wow clone not so much.
The following statement is false
The previous statement is true
.....except Bioware devs have stated that they used WoW as a basis for most of their design decisions.
Yes they did. And it shows. Although Im not a WoW fan. Wow did it better. It does, did and will continue to do so.
Just saying.
One thing Tor has that WoW doesnt? Nifty voice overs. Now lets see how long that lasts you.
....except too many people misunderstood the fact that Bioware was talking about the WoW themepark model, not cloning the game and all its systems.
1. Make a game that a appeals to casuals.
2. Make a game that's easy to learn, but hard to master.
3. Make a game that can be played on most computers.
4. Make a game with the standard themepark elements including questing, crafting, dungeons, raids, instanced pvp, etc.
5. In short, make a game that has the best chance of making the most money, and pulling in the most subscriptions.
And yet people continue to spread the BS that Bioware said they were going to "clone" their game after WoW. They never said that. They said they would make a themepark game modeled after the WoW business model, which is quite different than making it a "clone."
Anyone with half a brain and an ounce of objectivity who has played this game would say that yes, it's the same TYPE of game as WoW, but no...it doesn't FEEL like WoW, aside from the fact that it's fun as hell, which is what Vanilla WoW was.
that may well be as regards the UI... although by the sound of it, unlike wow the UI isnt that moddable, though when you take into account the complaints about a number of other games that released last year, that had very user unfriendly UI's then its understandable that they would have a really good look at one that works.. but UI's are not the whole game.. otherwise we would be getting complaints that MW3 etc are just Counterstrike clones (their not.. counterstrike is better for one thing
) on the other hand, is SW;TOR even having a good launch, the servers are down for maintenance every day pretty much.. which .. is a sign that there are a few issues that their struggling to resolve, perhaps it was too much to expect the launch of SW;TOR to be as good as the launch of Rift..
Might wana ask around and see how cata is liked.
Just saying
The following statement is false
The previous statement is true