I Think we should find some common ground

austriacus

In the last few months  i have seen all this hate between community members and the swtor players and i have to say its a bit saddening.  The fanboy side says that the game is great, its the best thing in the world the devs are great and listen to all our requests and fix everything right up,  we have fun who cares about the problems of the game?. The hater side says that the game sucks it has no retention appart from the story, the devs suck and should fix problems the moment they appear, we have fun who cares about the problems of the game?.

Both sides goes to the extremes in their critiques and supports of the game. The new topic that has appeared its players ressubing to the game and i think i understand what both sides are trying to get at.  One says that the subs are dropping and that the game is doomed to something of a 200k-300k sub base the other says that the game is only gona grow from now and that they are gona have 1-1.5m subs. Both are clear exagerations. The game is good but WoW until proven otherwise is the only fluke. No game is gona grow like it did,  MMORPGS only go DOWN and become stable at some point and its mainly because of the oversaturated market full of choices, most of which are FTP. Neither is it gona go down to 200-300k subs. Thats just insane, I mean this game has people that i know that THE ONLY REASON that they are playing the game is to prove haters wrong. With a follow like that bioware is definetely keeping more players.

I think the reason for much of the other fights its mainly also because ppl yet again resort to the extreme. For example the fanboys were saying that the game was gona have 4 million sales and sub numbers of over 3 million people and the haters were saying that the game was gona turn FTP soon. I mean come on seriously? retention rate of 75%  with 4m sales and a game going FTP were the god dam STO went FTP after a year???

Seriously people, find some common ground, both sides have become exceedingly pathetic over time and it kinda has to stop.

For the sake of us who are caught in the middle of it

 

ktanner3

You have to admit that this site is pure comedy at times. We have one poster here who has been railing against the game for months talking about what a step back for MMOs it is and yet admits to not only buying the game, but subbing after the first month. You can't make this stuff up.

austriacus

Its fun when its that one guy, but when everyone assumes anyone that isnt enjoying the game is like him, thats when it gets problematic

Afterlife

These forums are a game in themselves

Gylfi

Originally posted by austriacus

In the last few months  i have seen all this hate between community members and the swtor players and i have to say its a bit saddening.  The fanboy side says that the game is great, its the best thing in the world the devs are great and listen to all our requests and fix everything right up,  we have fun who cares about the problems of the game?. The hater side says that the game sucks it has no retention appart from the story, the devs suck and should fix problems the moment they appear, we have fun who cares about the problems of the game?.

Both sides goes to the extremes in their critiques and supports of the game. The new topic that has appeared its players ressubing to the game and i think i understand what both sides are trying to get at.  One says that the subs are dropping and that the game is doomed to something of a 200k-300k sub base the other says that the game is only gona grow from now and that they are gona have 1-1.5m subs. Both are clear exagerations. The game is good but WoW until proven otherwise is the only fluke. No game is gona grow like it did,  MMORPGS only go DOWN and become stable at some point and its mainly because of the oversaturated market full of choices, most of which are FTP. Neither is it gona go down to 200-300k subs. Thats just insane, I mean this game has people that i know that THE ONLY REASON that they are playing the game is to prove haters wrong. With a follow like that bioware is definetely keeping more players.

I think the reason for much of the other fights its mainly also because ppl yet again resort to the extreme. For example the fanboys were saying that the game was gona have 4 million sales and sub numbers of over 3 million people and the haters were saying that the game was gona turn FTP soon. I mean come on seriously? retention rate of 75%  with 4m sales and a game going FTP were the god dam STO went FTP after a year???

Seriously people, find some common ground, both sides have become exceedingly pathetic over time and it kinda has to stop.

For the sake of us who are caught in the middle of it

 

you lost your "diplomatic" status right there.

how can a MMO be good for the parts that come from offline games?

then coffee is good because it reminds of tea.

Bossalinie

MMORPG.COM: Creating [Mod Edit] since 2001

austriacus

as long as someone considers it good i dont see why it cant be good.

I love FFXIII and think its a good game, yet some people trash it like no tomorrow.

By the way i never said anything about MMOs, in the end of the day before MMORPGS they are games.

DecoyTrooper

if you like the game fine, but some of us think the game sux; creating a pointless thread like this one doesn't help either...so.. ./thread?

syntax42

Why does it matter what someone else predicts will happen to the game?  Their prediction is worth a grain of salt, unless they are a market-leading expert in the field and have tons of insider information on the company's subscription numbers and metrics.

 

Play it if you like it.  If you don't, then cancel your subscription.

jacklo

I don't know who exagerates more, but the fanboys who claim this game is perfect, when there is factual evidence proving that there are some serious problems with this game, need a check-up - neck up.

sgel

Year of the Dragon.

Master10K

This here reminds me so much of FFXIV, after launch.

Master10K

Originally posted by sgel

Year of the Dragon.

It certainly is *wink* *wink*

austriacus

@ DecoyTrooper

I dont like the game but that doesnt make it bad, Just because you think it sucks doenst mean the people that enjoy it are gona think its a bad game i personally think that as long as someone gets enjoiment out of the game its a good one refardless if its succesfull or not

Antarious

I can have a middle ground with people who present their perspective.   I don't have to agree with it... I'll read it and often not even comment.   I enjoy the ability to have someone elses perspective even if it doesn't match my own.

 

So I don't mind that type of debate even if heated.

 

What I have seen increasingly on forums is...

 

People who think their opinion invalidates someone elses.   I don't care what you think or who you think you are... when Person A says they don't like something..  and your only contribution is to tell them how wrong they are.   You are likely going to end up blocked because you are not adding anything and have no ability to understand subjective material.   Along with the fact a persons opinion is 100% correct for them no matter what anyone else says.

 

We also have posters now who simply post some type of insult in every reply.  

 

If you want a common ground.. or a middle ground you have to have people who can appreciate other points of view.   Even ones they don't agree with... you could simply call it a form of respect.

 

People who cannot do that.. have no common ground.   So you can either let them drown out discussions or you can shut them off...

 

I never used block on this site until the last few months and I've been using it .. more and more often as time goes by.

 

On the TOR forums during beta and the first month of release.. I ignored more people on those forums.. that people I ignored in EVERY single MMO I ever played COMBINED.

 

That's pretty much what MMO's and forums have now turned into for me.  

austriacus

Originally posted by jacklo

I don't know who exagerates more, but the fanboys who claim this game is perfect, when there is factual evidence proving that there are some serious problems with this game, need a check-up - neck up.

The sames goes to the haters that think the game is gona turn FTP in a month both are a bad extreme

Gylfi

Originally posted by syntax42

Why does it matter what someone else predicts will happen to the game?  Their prediction is worth a grain of salt, unless they are a market-leading expert in the field and have tons of insider information on the company's subscription numbers and metrics.

 

Play it if you like it.  If you don't, then cancel your subscription.

 

What i hate the most is this kind of self-centredness. 

-I have fun so i support the game and its genre, i don't care about anyone else and i don't care if my game is harmful to a more serious concept of virtuality that's been forgotten since 2nd life, the fact that MMO's are more than anything simulations.

-Even though i now support the game because i have fun, since i also care only about myself i will just as soon quit the game when i wake up and decide i'm not having fun nemore efficiently screwing those that i supported and those that i ignored, i only leave destruction in my passage.

those that go "don't post, don't think, don't judge, don't discuss, don't say no or yes, just have fun or not, and do it silently". These are not even human beings, imo.

WE ARE ONE on the planet, we don't live isolated!

ryman

I'll take the haters of a game over fanbois anyday of the week. The fanbois mostly consist of (A) people who are completely new to MMORPGs or (B) have a warped reality to the point of sexual attractiveness to the game. At least the haters mostly consist of the veterans that critque the game into hardcore oblivion. They both have warped unrealistic expectations of the game, it's just that I prefer hardcore critquing over hardcore hard-on for the game.

Cavod

Originally posted by Gylfi

Originally posted by syntax42

Why does it matter what someone else predicts will happen to the game?  Their prediction is worth a grain of salt, unless they are a market-leading expert in the field and have tons of insider information on the company's subscription numbers and metrics.

 

Play it if you like it.  If you don't, then cancel your subscription.

 

What i hate the most is this kind of self-centredness. 

-I have fun so i support the game and its genre, i don't care about anyone else and i don't care if my game is harmful to a more serious concept of virtuality that's been forgotten since 2nd life, the fact that MMO's are more than anything simulations.

-Even though i now support the game because i have fun, since i also care only about myself i will just as soon quit the game when i wake up and decide i'm not having fun nemore efficiently screwing those that i supported and those that i ignored, i only leave destruction in my passage.

those that go "don't post, don't think, don't judge, don't discuss, don't say no or yes, just have fun or not, and do it silently". These are not even human beings, imo.

WE ARE ONE on the planet, we don't live isolated!

This link may help you understand something you seem to be missing.  I suppose this could help aswell.

 

Just because you can't stand 'spin the bottle' because it's sleazy or pervy or you're prudy or not invited or w/e doesn't mean you have to ruin it for the kids busting over it.  Maybe little Jimmy 'insecurity issues' and Tammy 'daddy doesn't love me' are gaining some valuable life lessons from it.

 

"Oh, but it's harming my chances of hooking up with [insert person participating] and tainting em."  Both under the assumption said person has any remote interest in you(devs making a game catered to your opinion) and/or isn't already completely 'tainted'(genre even caring that your opinion exists).  See, one of the great things about life is you're allowed to have fun doing whatever you want as long as it doesn't actively hurt another person.

 

I don't see people saying "don't post, don't think, don't judge, don't discuss, don't say no or yes, just have fun or not, and do it silently", heck, we have a forum for that! linky  It's a matter of people coming to a SWTOR GENERAL DISCUSSION FORUM and getting anything but 'general discussion' about SWTOR as everything boils down into a "THIS IS WHY SWTOR IS HORRIBLE WOE TO YOU WHO PLAY!!!!1111elventyone" by a few choice names, over and over...  and over... and over again and again and again.

 

How would we like it if a group of hardcore twitch gamers came over to MMORPG.com and devolved every thread down to 'why MMOs suck and why you suck for liking them because they take no skill'?  At some point it gets old and hinders useful and appropriate discussion..

 

Either that or you just "WHOOOOOSHED" me like a pro.

DLangley

Let's avoid personal attacks guys, thanks.

sanosukex

Originally posted by ryman

I'll take the haters of a game over fanbois anyday of the week. The fanbois mostly consist of (A) people who are completely new to MMORPGs or (B) have a warped reality to the point of sexual attractiveness to the game. At least the haters mostly consist of the veterans that critque the game into hardcore oblivion. They both have warped unrealistic expectations of the game, it's just that I prefer hardcore critquing over hardcore hard-on for the game.

LOL so true.. and to Ktanner3 sounds like me heh.. I have said many times I feel this game is a step back for MMOs in several areas yet I still play.. but mostly cause it's star wars and I'm bored.. and well yea I'm a star wars nut...

Arkinia

Originally posted by sgel

Year of the Dragon.

sorry...

 

Year of the Tiger? Woods ready for 2012 unveiling

Vesavius

Originally posted by bossalinie

MMORPG.COM: Creating [Mod Edit] since 2001

 

made me chuckle

BilboDoggins

SWTOR isnt going to die, in fact over the long term it will probably be quite successful and Bioware will make a nice (not huge) profit.

 

That being said the game right now is NOT good. As someone who has played the game all the way to nightmare mode raids I can honestly say that the problems I experienced with SWTOR were way worse than any other MMO I have played since 1996 when I began with Darksun Online.

 

SWTOR has monstrous potential and had it of launched with less bugs, better performance, more interesting endgame, and QoL features like Pazaak, and pod racing then it would have been a home run. Of course these thinsg will eventually come and when they do SWTOR will be the game I was hoping it could be.

 

Its just not that game yet..................

sanosukex

Originally posted by BilboDoggins

 

 

SWTOR has monstrous potential and had it of launched with less bugs, better performance, more interesting endgame, and QoL features like Pazaak, pod racing, And was released in 2003 then it would have been a home run. Of course these thinsg will eventually come and when they do SWTOR will be the game I was hoping it could be.

 

fixed for you

Gylfi

Originally posted by Cavod

Originally posted by Gylfi

Originally posted by syntax42

Why does it matter what someone else predicts will happen to the game?  Their prediction is worth a grain of salt, unless they are a market-leading expert in the field and have tons of insider information on the company's subscription numbers and metrics.

 

Play it if you like it.  If you don't, then cancel your subscription.

 

What i hate the most is this kind of self-centredness. 

-I have fun so i support the game and its genre, i don't care about anyone else and i don't care if my game is harmful to a more serious concept of virtuality that's been forgotten since 2nd life, the fact that MMO's are more than anything simulations.

-Even though i now support the game because i have fun, since i also care only about myself i will just as soon quit the game when i wake up and decide i'm not having fun nemore efficiently screwing those that i supported and those that i ignored, i only leave destruction in my passage.

those that go "don't post, don't think, don't judge, don't discuss, don't say no or yes, just have fun or not, and do it silently". These are not even human beings, imo.

WE ARE ONE on the planet, we don't live isolated!

This link may help you understand something you seem to be missing.  I suppose this could help aswell.

 

Just because you can't stand 'spin the bottle' because it's sleazy or pervy or you're prudy or not invited or w/e doesn't mean you have to ruin it for the kids busting over it.  Maybe little Jimmy 'insecurity issues' and Tammy 'daddy doesn't love me' are gaining some valuable life lessons from it.

 

"Oh, but it's harming my chances of hooking up with [insert person participating] and tainting em."  Both under the assumption said person has any remote interest in you(devs making a game catered to your opinion) and/or isn't already completely 'tainted'(genre even caring that your opinion exists).  See, one of the great things about life is you're allowed to have fun doing whatever you want as long as it doesn't actively hurt another person.

 

I don't see people saying "don't post, don't think, don't judge, don't discuss, don't say no or yes, just have fun or not, and do it silently", heck, we have a forum for that! linky  It's a matter of people coming to a SWTOR GENERAL DISCUSSION FORUM and getting anything but 'general discussion' about SWTOR as everything boils down into a "THIS IS WHY SWTOR IS HORRIBLE WOE TO YOU WHO PLAY!!!!1111elventyone" by a few choice names, over and over...  and over... and over again and again and again.

 

How would we like it if a group of hardcore twitch gamers came over to MMORPG.com and devolved every thread down to 'why MMOs suck and why you suck for liking them because they take no skill'?  At some point it gets old and hinders useful and appropriate discussion..

 

Either that or you just "WHOOOOOSHED" me like a pro.

oh fuck me jesus.

Freedom sucks because you could say all this bullshit.