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[Poll]I didn't poop my pants ( a more in-depth impression than the average forumite)
nate1980
Member UncommonPosts: 2,072
I haven't taken part in the hype-fest that's been going on since they announced the reveal date earlier this summer. However, I did await the reveal date with some excitement. The way two websites said "you'll poop your pants" and things along that line had me expecting a really cool game. Yet I was underwhelmed as I watched the reveal live stream. Below are my opinions. Feel free to share you own opinions of the reveal below. Try to keep it civil and constructive.
So the first impression was the art style/graphics. People lump this into the same thing, but it's not really. The graphics definitely looked modern, but the art style was a turn off. IMHO, WoW was as cartoony as it gets without going kiddy mode or cell-shaded. It had the cartoony colors and the unrealistic proportions of body parts. Then you have SWTOR, which was a nod more towards realism while still being somewhat cartoony. It did away with the unrealistic proportions for the most part. I feel that EQN is a cross between these two games. Overall, the "look" of the game sort of set the tone for the rest of the reveal for me. I was disappointed. I didn't expect photo-realistic graphics and art-style, but I WAS expecting a continuation of the style the two previous EQ games had.
Next we have the classes and combat system. I'm a huge fan of player choice in the ability to customize your character. The more choice the better. Being able to multi-class is definitely a huge step in the right direction and an improvement of the majority of MMORPG's out there. Also, being tasked with finding these elusive classes sounds like a mini-game in and of itself. It will be the main motivator for me to go out and explore the world. However, without the traditional method of progression (ie. getting more powerful through levels or skilling up) what will motivate a person to keep playing. This was one of the drawbacks of GW2 for me and one of the major reasons I quit playing. I never felt more powerful as I leveled up in GW2, because everything scaled with me. I also felt no sense of progression as far as abilities went, since there was a limited amount of space for skills, and I have a very good idea of the character I like to play. So in EQN, once I create my sword wielding, magic slinging, self buffing/healing character what's to keep me playing since there's no real progression?
The combat system being a mix between tab targeting and action-based doesn't bother me a whole lot. I can jive with either as long as it's fun and well polished. The problem comes down to the limited amount of abilities you're able to use at any given time. I feel like GW2 was a horrible influence on the genre concerning this and was probably the largest reason I had for leaving GW2 after a few weeks after release. I don't like the several hotbars needed in games like WoW, but only having a handful of abilities is severely limiting and definitely not any better.
Next we have destructible environments. This is both a good and a bad thing. In a perfect world, this feature would be awesome, because in a perfect world the community playing it would be mature and wouldn't unneccessarily destroy pieces of the world. However, this isn't a perfect world and MMORPGs are full of trolls, griefers, and kiddies. Like someone else said before, what's stopping someone from turning the world into swiss cheese? For those who will actually muster any motivation to explore Norath, what will keep them exploring once all the beautiful scenery is destroying by its community. He said something about the environment healing, but didn't say anything about how long that would take. If it takes too long, then we encounter what I just described. If it's too short, then what's the point of the feature anyways? Then of course there's the question of how will all of this affect performance?
Next we have the next iterration of public questing. I've been on board with public quests since WAR brought them into the genre years ago. It was a novel idea for a genre stuck with either no questing or static quest hub questing. RIFT and then GW2 took this concept to the next level. EQN seems to be taking the idea a couple notches further. Definitely something to be happy about and probably the only thing I got from this reveal that had me raise an eyebrow in interest.
Yet here we are to the final problem and the one I feel is the biggest one for me. He mentioned that we've been playing DnD for 35 years. Yet he forgets that many of us have been exploring vast, beautiful worlds (either online or offline) for over a decade. So what's going to motivate us to explore yet another one? GW2 kept my interest after its failure to capture me in the progression department by having a gorgeous world to explore with lots of nice scenery easter eggs. But that didn't hold my interest more than a few weeks. Just like in real life, I want to see the world, and see all of its wonders. However, unlike the real world, EQN doesn't seem to motivate you to explore in any particular direction. Since we don't know where these class trainers are, we'll just be wondering around aimlessly for hours, days, weeks, or months trying to find them. Usually, a game has something progression-based to drive you on. It could be gaining more levels or even a good story, but there are no levels in EQN, and there was no mention of an over-arcing story.
So in short, if EQN fails to capture me, it won't be because the art-style isn't to my liking or a myriad of other valid reasons, but because once I create my character and look around the bold new world, where will I go, why, and why should I care considering I've already done the explore just for the sake to explore over a dozen times before in much more photo-realistic games.
To spark some discussion and give my thread some traction, I'll throw in a poll.
Comments
I feel completely and utterly the same way about GW2. I think the game is gorgeous, and a triumph in polish and lore from a very talented company.
But after a few weeks, I was mostly bored out of my mind. It was so disheartening leveling, and playing, and never getting anything special. I would go days sometimes without acquiring a single new ability. I hated it.
I hate the restrictive hotbar. HATE it. And I agree, it doesn't need to be the current 40 hotbar set. There has to be a happy medium where less is more, and yet we have more options than 8.
Exactly. I'm fine with a turn-based tactical strategy game where you're using your brain to win encounters and not twitch-based combat. But fast paced is fine as long as we have enough time to make tactically impactful decisions with a nice selection of abilities.
I'm in my 30's, so maybe I'm getting a bit old and cynical, but I saw through that PR smile and heard, "we want to save development costs by having YOU, our player base create the game for us!"
Problem with games like GW2 and WoW is that if you've already been somewhere in the world, and the developers haven't released a new content patch yet, you've already explored the area... nothing is different.
From what I saw today EQN isn't going to be like that. Mob population will change. Environments will change. New players you encounter may use abilities and combos you've never seen until that moment. Basically it is all about every login being a new adventure.
Like this example. Say I logged in everyday and went down the same road I always go down. But today that road was torn up like a battleground. Orcs were setting up camps further down the road and it looked bad. Like they were converging from many different regions because they found this spot to be their sweet spot.
As I got closer I saw what appeared to be other players fighting furiously with an orc boss and the players were doing things I've never seen before. A chronomancer/ranger type character? I can't be sure. I just stopped an watched the drama unfold from a safe distance. I can't believe that this was the same road I've always gone down everyday.
The EQN system isn't remotely like GW2. In Guild Wars 2, within a day you have every weapon and all their skills unlocked and within a week you are level 80 and have all your utility skills unlocked.
The EQN system is far closer to Guild Wars 1 skill collection system, only a lot more in depth. There are a lot of weapons and each weapon provides its own skills. Each of the 40 classes has access to two weapons and 4 of their own class specific skills. Also each different piece of armor adds specific abilities. All of this must be discovered out in the open world and it is unknown how long it would take to find it all.
Guild Wars 2 wasn't the first to have a limited hot bar. Everquest 1 had one with their spell gems, and Guild Wars 1 followed it with a limited 8 skill hot bar.
There are actually two types of destruction: temporary and permanent. A lot of the world destruction is regenerated or restored over time or through events. They said how fast it regenerates is dependent on how much destruction there is and how many people are in the world at the time. They also said they can modify who and when something can be destroyed as well as the rate of regeneration. What if's aren't my definition of an in-depth impression.
Aren't you tired of being led by the nose in games? They describe it as a world where you just explore, talk to NPCs, see what is going on in finding out what you can do to help or hinder. You don't need a symbol over an NPC's head or a sparkly trail to guide you where you need to go.
the shoddy art style and action combat made me poop my pants.
Good response though I disagree with portions, which I will go into detail:
Thank god Im too old to believe in what you kids call hype. I find it silly and childish. They are promoting the game and it takes a small amount of intelligence to take it with a grain of salt. Playing the actual game should be the goal.
Art style is subjective. You either like it or your don't. I happen to like it so it works for me. While style is very important, its never enough to stop me from playing a game especially if the content or mechanics are fun and/or good.
I can foresee *countless* comparisons to GW2, some valid some not. In terms of progression I interpreted EQN as being the progression itself. For the first time I wont log onto a game to complete some form of content or gear but merely to progress in a changing world. The problem I had with other level-less games is its still based on a level-like mechanic. In those models I will get bored because the construct of the game screams level to progress but they don't exist. This game looks to be non linear but I have no idea because I haven't played it.
I agree with you that gamers will abuse the freedom. But to me thats part of the fun. You ask who will stop these gamers from doing this? Hopefully other gamers. I think its more of a balance question. If there are more people who want to BUILD the game versus those who want to Destroy it the game can potentially grow. The uncertainty of that is what will have me logging on every day. Its unpredictable. The minute it becomes certain/deterministic... my view changes.
GW2 is a great game but its flawed to me. Its world is beautiful but like every single other game its static. You run around a static map (not a world) and interact with timed events. Over time that will get boring for most people, myself included. But obviously the game has its audience. The difference I see with EQN starts with foundation. The game is built from 'blocks' that can change size and characteristics. Name me one MMO that does that today. That changes everything simply because it introduces a new experience no one has ever had before. When was the last time you had that? It provides flexibility an opportunity on a huge scale. Can they deliver the experience with the technology? Thats the million dollar question that only play will answer.
I see this game failing to capture a lot of people. And you know what that's ok. This game like every other one that is out there is not for everyone. GW2 failed to capture me. I can name countless others.
Let the market splinter into niche genres so each get to play the game we would love. I've been waiting for something like this for decades. Crossing fingers they can deliver. What they have shown so far looks promising.
Yes, and I definitely see some good possibilities. Once you were maxxed out in SWG, you encountered the same problem I described. However, SWG had player ran cities. So from a RPers perspective, if this game has player ran cities, then patrolling that cities peremeter and surrounding country would be a good cause for me to log in. It gives me a base of operations to begin my adventures. From there, I can explore further with friends. Could go on a week long adventure through a nearby mountain range, underground caverns, or even visit far off lands as ambassadors from our player ran city.
I think the difference between the EQ1 hotbar and GW1 or GW2 is that you still could decide yourself, WITHOUT multi-classing, from a wide set of spells in your spell book. Other than the actual number limit - EIGHT - you could put ANYTHING you wanted in those 8 slots from a spell book typically exploding with spells. Some spells were obviously better than others, some were essential, some were fluff.
But I don't like putting a weapon in my hand and it creating a few spells for me, ESPECIALLY if I want my darn warrior to have an axe and yet I HATE the axe abilities. I find it actually more crippling to play style and roleplay.
The word Scenario was mentioned once during the live stream and an interview since has said that ti will have PvP but wouldn't give any details on what kinds.
Good post. The only thing I have a problem with is where you say "you kids." As a man in my 30's, with a career, a veteran, and a kid of my own approaching teenage years, it just rubs me the wrong way. But hay, if you're much older than me then that's your right. I say the same thing to people in their early 20's, lol.
When he was talking about voxels and destructibility, he mentioned player keeps and them being seiged by other players. Perhaps it was just an example or maybe it was a hint of things to come.
+1
The GW1 reference is a good way to describe what it sounds like they're going for. I had to use it a few times when talking w/ a few friends earlier.
Get rid of the hand-holding quest hub 'What's my motivation?' B.S. If I don't like what some dev thinks will make a 'great story' then I should be able to go make my own - and EQN seems to be looking at things the same way.
That's when he used the word scenario whether that was word was used int he literal sense or in the sense it's come to mean in MMORPGs is unknown could be both!
Not overwhelmed (no poop), not underwhelmed.
Personally, my biggest disappointment is learning that they are basically no where close to being done and that the game we'll be playing this year will be the minecraft version. I like what I saw in EQN Landmark, even predicted that their player dev tools would exist separately from EQ Next itself, but not what I was hoping for. It seems like they can't answer most of our questions about things like combat and PvP, because they don't even know themselves. Seems like all the have are ideas, a world and the technology to create what they're designing. Thats it.
That said, I do love the ideas, just sort of bummed knowing that they aren't close to being done.
I voted other. I wasn't blown away by the reveal but I wasn't underwhelmed either. I feel the same about the game as I did before. I am not a huge fan of the characters models but it isn't too bad that I wouldn't play because of them. I will wait to see more race models before I decide how much I like/dislike the characters. My big concern watching the gameplay was the broadcast attacks by mobs. I am not a fan of it. I would rather learn the mob and be surprised by what it does than play dodge the box/circle.
I was very happy to hear that they are trying to move away from static mob spawn points. If done correctly, this could be a good step toward creating a living world. I hope they take this aspect of the game as far as their systems allow. I also like the idea of server wide quests. An old game, Istaria, did this and they were fun. Although Landmarks is a way to get things designed by the players, I believe it is a good thing. It will allow the building system to be tested an insane amount before EQ Next is released. I am sure I will mess around in it and see how it works.
The nerd-rage of the anti-stylised crowd made me poop my pants with excitement. The fallout was hilarious.
I would tell them to move on to a game with a more realistic approach, but I know they will linger around like a bad smell bemoaning the art style until long after release, much to my amusement.
I pooped my pants coz i'm hard to please and i don't like the way mmorpg's are doing in general. Everquest next will bring me back in the right track.
Sandbox: check
Hardcore server: Check.
Non target based combat: Check.
That's the 3 main feature that i want for my mmorpg. Also, hardcore server is not pvp server, it's all the way hardcore with death penalties. Something like full loot or something like the system from darksouls. You know, a meaningful pvp system no matter where you are in the open world, not only in an silly arena or battleground.
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Wait, are you talking about macro script combat system? I mean pressing one button and letting a program do the rest of the work. That's what most players that are considered pro play these old mmorpg.
Press one key. Let autohokey press 1-4-7-2-47--34-34 in that order. Press an other key: 6-2-`-72-1-7. GG next game.
These combat system are lame and games like these are doomed to be free to play nowadays.
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I'm almost 50, and I think cynics are cute and naïve... but honestly I don't get your gripe.
Don't want to do it: don't. If you want to do it because you find it fun... do.
If you really think that creating and releasing an entire game client centered around voxel modeling -- for free -- and supporting those clients with dedicated servers, bandwidth, and storage -- for free -- saved them a red cent over just using in-house modelers and less polished tools... then I gotta wonder where your brain is.
I can see how this MIGHT save them a bit of time and provide a more varied set of models... if the crowd sources are able to submit polished work. But they could do the work in-house. You don't really need 100 unique "Farm Cottage" models to build a world.
I personally think they built this mostly for fun, as a marketing tool, and to get more people personally invested in the new game world.
I think they are further along than what it may seem. The hardest parts are the systems such as the AI and procedural rendering and they seem to be finished. Now it is about finishing the content which by its very nature of the game is not a whole lot. Between Landscape and how easy the toolset makes content creation, I think the game will be progressing at a fast pace now that it has been revealed.