MMO's don't have unique IP's i just googled Star trek games do you know how many games have been brought out?
Not recently. I also don't play ancient old games.
Tell me, what is the latest Star Trek RPG, based on the TNG universe, that has both ship combat and ground combat? There is no other than STO. If you can name another one, i will go play that instead.
Il give you that there is no game with both ground and ship combat. But like i said if it truely is about IP then why did Star trek online do so rubbishly? while it has millions of fans around the world.? IP = IP your now talking about features has nothing to do with IP.
I said TNG universe. That is the JJ abram reboot. You can't drive a galaxy class star ship in that game. Don't you think i would already have check that out?
"rubbish"? Now you are forcing your opinion on others. If it is rubbish to me, why would i be having free fun with it?
And again u just halfly read or not read at all the things i put down. Yes its rubbish. if it wasnt rubbish there would be millions of star trek fans paying a sub and playing it. Thats not opinion. but fact because acording to you people flock towards IP's
now that i am unbanned let me refresh and destroy.
You premises are flat out wrong. Do you really thing a dev with millions of dollars and a huge team of people behind him, does not think of all. They do, but the problem is that they..how do be nice about this(I have worked for a lot of gvt grants for historic restorations, and how you actually spend money and the way people really think you spend money is lets just say different)
SWTOR is the proof of that, minimal gameplay huge everything else.
what I am saying is everyone is wrong about how the gameplay should go, and the devs who are my age and according to mensa 90% of the people are dumber than me. So devs are just geeks who program my games, and they better stop fucking it up or you won't get my money.
What are you on about?
Look, games get a finite number of dev hours. If you spend more on world/social elements, that's less for gameplay elements. If you know you don't have enough time to fully bake fresh gameplay, you usually opt to create tried-and-true gameplay.
Thus, projects where world/social elements are emphasized (more hours spent) are less likely to have fresh gameplay.
That's just how it works. Time isn't magically created out of thin air by the Dev Hours Fairy.
As for your final paragraph, I think "WTF?!" is the only reasonable response.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
now that i am unbanned let me refresh and destroy.
You premises are flat out wrong. Do you really thing a dev with millions of dollars and a huge team of people behind him, does not think of all. They do, but the problem is that they..how do be nice about this(I have worked for a lot of gvt grants for historic restorations, and how you actually spend money and the way people really think you spend money is lets just say different)
SWTOR is the proof of that, minimal gameplay huge everything else.
what I am saying is everyone is wrong about how the gameplay should go, and the devs who are my age and according to mensa 90% of the people are dumber than me. So devs are just geeks who program my games, and they better stop fucking it up or you won't get my money.
What are you on about?
Look, games get a finite number of dev hours. If you spend more on world/social elements, that's less for gameplay elements. If you know you don't have enough time to fully bake fresh gameplay, you usually opt to create tried-and-true gameplay.
Thus, projects where world/social elements are emphasized (more hours spent) are less likely to have fresh gameplay.
That's just how it works. Time isn't magically created out of thin air by the Dev Hours Fairy.
As for your final paragraph, I think "WTF?!" is the only reasonable response.
When was the last time an MMO had fresh gameplay for u? i can think of a couple games wich did stuff diffrently but was it fresh? Not for me. It was fresh for 2 weeks. then i started to feel that those games where the same boring questhub to questhub race to level cap. So now my fresh gameplay is gone. and there is not a world to replace it. That is why world is so important in MMORPG's. (and social being complimented trough gameplay will make you stick around)
Firefall has amazing gameplay. The most fun i've had in an mmo in awhile. It is a MMOFPS, incase you haven't heard about it. Great controls. Reminds me of Unreal tournament.
Anyways, the World sucks. I mean its there, it looks good, but its filled with redundant quest (both dynamic and standard). It feels like a game where you are continuously doing daily quest. Its really a grind game. There is no real payoff to the grind except crafting better gear. But once you have the better gear, then.....nothing.
As a result of not much to do in the World but the same old stuff over and over again, the Social aspect is pretty bad. Players group for higher level stuff like BWA runs and quick XP grinding, but that's it. These two aspects can be completely ignored if you want because the rewards from BWA runs is the same as what you get from your every day missions.
Finally, the Story is pretty bad as well. Not much is explained. I'm almost positive not much has even been created yet. Plus you get these random little items you find on the ground which have voice recordings on them, that are suppose to add to the plot. They are a really good idea and fun to find, but then you discover that they themselves don't even make much sense.
But goddamn, that gameplay sure is fun. I just wish I wasn't bored to tears when logging in.
When was the last time an MMO had fresh gameplay for u? i can think of a couple games wich did stuff diffrently but was it fresh? Not for me. It was fresh for 2 weeks.
3-4 weeks ago?
I played Marvel Heroes .. the story campagin is fresh enough. And i finished it (30 hours of free fun!) and moved on. I *may* get back to play another hero, but probably not soon.
When was the last time an MMO had fresh gameplay for u? i can think of a couple games wich did stuff diffrently but was it fresh? Not for me. It was fresh for 2 weeks.
3-4 weeks ago?
I played Marvel Heroes .. the story campagin is fresh enough. And i finished it (30 hours of free fun!) and moved on. I *may* get back to play another hero, but probably not soon.
So you played an MMO for 30 hours? ive played SP games for far far longer then that. Content locusts.. yuck.
When was the last time an MMO had fresh gameplay for u? i can think of a couple games wich did stuff diffrently but was it fresh? Not for me. It was fresh for 2 weeks.
3-4 weeks ago?
I played Marvel Heroes .. the story campagin is fresh enough. And i finished it (30 hours of free fun!) and moved on. I *may* get back to play another hero, but probably not soon.
So you played an MMO for 30 hours? ive played SP games for far far longer then that. Content locusts.. yuck.
Yes. Is there any reason not to? I have 30 hours of free fun.
And yes, some SP games lasted longer (for me). Not all of them though. I just finished the main campaign of Splinter Cell black list. It was less than 30 hours (took me a week) but i had a lot of fun. Very nice mechanics, good story and polish.
OTOH, STO took a lot longer than 30 hours to finish. I probably will play that on and off for a while. The content is enjoyable too, and there is quite a bit more than Marvel Heroes.
When was the last time an MMO had fresh gameplay for u? i can think of a couple games wich did stuff diffrently but was it fresh? Not for me. It was fresh for 2 weeks. then i started to feel that those games where the same boring questhub to questhub race to level cap. So now my fresh gameplay is gone. and there is not a world to replace it. That is why world is so important in MMORPG's. (and social being complimented trough gameplay will make you stick around)
Well the bigger factor there is that MMORPGs are giant projects, and thus risk-averse projects.
Apart from that, to a degree it proves my point. MMORPGs have sprawling feature sets, so they're exactly the sort of spread-focus game I'm describing, which limits their ability to innovate and iterate on fresh gameplay.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
MMORPGs have sprawling feature sets, so they're exactly the sort of spread-focus game I'm describing, which limits their ability to innovate and iterate on fresh gameplay.
If you foresee that you will have trouble innovating and iterating individual components, it might be time to go back and consider a better foundation for the project?
MMORPGs have sprawling feature sets, so they're exactly the sort of spread-focus game I'm describing, which limits their ability to innovate and iterate on fresh gameplay.
If you foresee that you will have trouble innovating and iterating individual components, it might be time to go back and consider a better foundation for the project?
Why? Not all projects need innovation in every individual component.
Look, games get a finite number of dev hours. If you spend more on world/social elements, that's less for gameplay elements. If you know you don't have enough time to fully bake fresh gameplay, you usually opt to create tried-and-true gameplay.
Thus, projects where world/social elements are emphasized (more hours spent) are less likely to have fresh gameplay.
That's just how it works. Time isn't magically created out of thin air by the Dev Hours Fairy.
That's why I went with gameplay and world as being the most important from a development standpoint. Social and story can, and should be, player driven with minimal dev attention, provided that the gameplay and world give the players the tools they need to create their own content/experiences. That is the big difference between MMOs and other games; a good MMO engages the player and turns them into psuedo devs as they shape their own stories and the game around them in ways that the official devs could never manage with a population of thousands of players. By having the devs focus on one or two of the elements with the idea that if done right, the players can handle the others on their own, you end up with a much better game overall. The players are more willing to make a commitment to the game because they feel like they are actually an important piece of it rather than a casual observer, and the devs can make the parts they focus on better because they don't have to spread their resources as thin.
Originally posted by maplestone If you foresee that you will have trouble innovating and iterating individual components, it might be time to go back and consider a better foundation for the project?
Why? Did WOW require tremendous amounts of innovation to be successful?
No, it was successful simply by greatly refining pre-existing features.
But yeah, if innovation is the goal of the project then (a) you don't make an MMORPG because you want a smaller project where innovation is more feasible, and (b) you focus on innovating gameplay and ignore the rest of the elements.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
I said gameplay, but gameplay and world go together. For me, gameplay is how things interact in the world, by killing monsters to traveling over the land to finding hidden treasures. The gameplay is in the world, so kind of need both together. If the gameplay is structured well, with cooperative aspects, the social will grow from that.
Story is useless (for mmorpgs that are worlds) . A good lore is needed, to build the world and people make their own stories. Sure there are a lot of little stories throughout, but always following a set story detracts from it being a world, making it merely a game.
If you just want to play a game and go through a good story, then that is fine, but there is no longevity in that. Then you end up being called a content locust. I personally think that is a little unfair because most mmo's today are built as games to just consume the story and move on. Not their fault it is designed that way. Just need worlds developed instead of games where people build their own story. Not necessarily a sandbox either. It can have a structure to follow, but allows leeway and customization, variety. A sandpark I guess.
I said gameplay, but gameplay and world go together. For me, gameplay is how things interact in the world, by killing monsters to traveling over the land to finding hidden treasures. The gameplay is in the world, so kind of need both together. If the gameplay is structured well, with cooperative aspects, the social will grow from that.
And that is your preference.
To me, gameplay and world do not have to go together. Case in point, LFD and instances are fun to me. They are all gameplay and no world.
Comments
And again u just halfly read or not read at all the things i put down. Yes its rubbish. if it wasnt rubbish there would be millions of star trek fans paying a sub and playing it. Thats not opinion. but fact because acording to you people flock towards IP's
What are you on about?
Look, games get a finite number of dev hours. If you spend more on world/social elements, that's less for gameplay elements. If you know you don't have enough time to fully bake fresh gameplay, you usually opt to create tried-and-true gameplay.
Thus, projects where world/social elements are emphasized (more hours spent) are less likely to have fresh gameplay.
That's just how it works. Time isn't magically created out of thin air by the Dev Hours Fairy.
As for your final paragraph, I think "WTF?!" is the only reasonable response.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
When was the last time an MMO had fresh gameplay for u? i can think of a couple games wich did stuff diffrently but was it fresh? Not for me. It was fresh for 2 weeks. then i started to feel that those games where the same boring questhub to questhub race to level cap. So now my fresh gameplay is gone. and there is not a world to replace it. That is why world is so important in MMORPG's. (and social being complimented trough gameplay will make you stick around)
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
I'll give you another example: Firefall
Firefall has amazing gameplay. The most fun i've had in an mmo in awhile. It is a MMOFPS, incase you haven't heard about it. Great controls. Reminds me of Unreal tournament.
Anyways, the World sucks. I mean its there, it looks good, but its filled with redundant quest (both dynamic and standard). It feels like a game where you are continuously doing daily quest. Its really a grind game. There is no real payoff to the grind except crafting better gear. But once you have the better gear, then.....nothing.
As a result of not much to do in the World but the same old stuff over and over again, the Social aspect is pretty bad. Players group for higher level stuff like BWA runs and quick XP grinding, but that's it. These two aspects can be completely ignored if you want because the rewards from BWA runs is the same as what you get from your every day missions.
Finally, the Story is pretty bad as well. Not much is explained. I'm almost positive not much has even been created yet. Plus you get these random little items you find on the ground which have voice recordings on them, that are suppose to add to the plot. They are a really good idea and fun to find, but then you discover that they themselves don't even make much sense.
But goddamn, that gameplay sure is fun. I just wish I wasn't bored to tears when logging in.
3-4 weeks ago?
I played Marvel Heroes .. the story campagin is fresh enough. And i finished it (30 hours of free fun!) and moved on. I *may* get back to play another hero, but probably not soon.
So you played an MMO for 30 hours? ive played SP games for far far longer then that. Content locusts.. yuck.
Yes. Is there any reason not to? I have 30 hours of free fun.
And yes, some SP games lasted longer (for me). Not all of them though. I just finished the main campaign of Splinter Cell black list. It was less than 30 hours (took me a week) but i had a lot of fun. Very nice mechanics, good story and polish.
OTOH, STO took a lot longer than 30 hours to finish. I probably will play that on and off for a while. The content is enjoyable too, and there is quite a bit more than Marvel Heroes.
Well the bigger factor there is that MMORPGs are giant projects, and thus risk-averse projects.
Apart from that, to a degree it proves my point. MMORPGs have sprawling feature sets, so they're exactly the sort of spread-focus game I'm describing, which limits their ability to innovate and iterate on fresh gameplay.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Why? Not all projects need innovation in every individual component.
That's why I went with gameplay and world as being the most important from a development standpoint. Social and story can, and should be, player driven with minimal dev attention, provided that the gameplay and world give the players the tools they need to create their own content/experiences. That is the big difference between MMOs and other games; a good MMO engages the player and turns them into psuedo devs as they shape their own stories and the game around them in ways that the official devs could never manage with a population of thousands of players. By having the devs focus on one or two of the elements with the idea that if done right, the players can handle the others on their own, you end up with a much better game overall. The players are more willing to make a commitment to the game because they feel like they are actually an important piece of it rather than a casual observer, and the devs can make the parts they focus on better because they don't have to spread their resources as thin.
Why? Did WOW require tremendous amounts of innovation to be successful?
No, it was successful simply by greatly refining pre-existing features.
But yeah, if innovation is the goal of the project then (a) you don't make an MMORPG because you want a smaller project where innovation is more feasible, and (b) you focus on innovating gameplay and ignore the rest of the elements.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
I said gameplay, but gameplay and world go together. For me, gameplay is how things interact in the world, by killing monsters to traveling over the land to finding hidden treasures. The gameplay is in the world, so kind of need both together. If the gameplay is structured well, with cooperative aspects, the social will grow from that.
Story is useless (for mmorpgs that are worlds) . A good lore is needed, to build the world and people make their own stories. Sure there are a lot of little stories throughout, but always following a set story detracts from it being a world, making it merely a game.
If you just want to play a game and go through a good story, then that is fine, but there is no longevity in that. Then you end up being called a content locust. I personally think that is a little unfair because most mmo's today are built as games to just consume the story and move on. Not their fault it is designed that way. Just need worlds developed instead of games where people build their own story. Not necessarily a sandbox either. It can have a structure to follow, but allows leeway and customization, variety. A sandpark I guess.
And that is your preference.
To me, gameplay and world do not have to go together. Case in point, LFD and instances are fun to me. They are all gameplay and no world.