Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Very solid game.Trying to understand the negativity compared to a game like Final Fantasy
Belgaraath
Member UncommonPosts: 3,204
On metacritic, forum goers here and elsewhere, this game is getting a love it or hate it reception. Very little in between. I love the game and will continue playing it for at least a few months, maybe more depending on the future content releases and bug fixes. I'm having trouble understanding why a game like Final Fantasy which has much smaller zones even splitting cities into pieces, a less active old school combat system, no voiceovers with walls of text, less options with regard to the PVP/PVE experience this game offers, more grindy quests than this game has, much more grinding of Fates compared to Anchors just to get XP, an even more static world, worse crafting, lack of a Mod community like ESO has, etc etc etc got such high scores when in my mind ESO offers so much more. I mean I thought Final Fantasy was a solid game for an MMO, but I stopped playing because I have just done enough of the explanation point hub stuff with very little pure exploration which ESO does much better.
WHY I ASK YOU!!!! lol If ESO re-releases a 2nd time showing an improvement, do they all of a sudden get 10 scores just for showing improvement? lol The world of ratings makes no sense to me and every game seems to be held to a completely different standard. It's exactly why I think all reviews are worthless except my own opinion of the game when I play it.
There Is Always Hope!
Comments
This^^^^^^^^^^^
+1
I 100% agree with you. I love FF XIV ARR but ESO does offer better gameplay and exploration.
Why? It could just be that ESO isn't as good as you think it is.
Honestly, I don't know since I have yet to play ESO, so you could be right. But FFXIV is a well rounded game with a lot to offer. And from what i hear (notice I sad "hear" so don't down me for it), has more things to do besides questing, better grouping mechanics, and less bugs.
Trying to figure out the thought processes of others will only lead to your own insanity.
If you enjoy a game, play it. Don't worry what others think, especially on these forums.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Played them both, still prefer WoW for PvE and GW2 for PvP.
The game play in both games is Almost the exact same....ESO has way better PVP final fantasy online has crappy pvp
Run from quest to quest to quest to quest..and keep on questing
Both are good games in my opinion, I enjoyed the Cutscenes in Final fantasy alot
~edit~ one thing that confused me....Ending credit in final fantasy online when you finish the end quests haha
that was a bit weird when ending credit pop up Confused me
My review: It's OK.... mediocre enough for you?
I havn't played ESO to make a comparison but I have been playing FFXIV for 8 months.
You don't need to bring another game down just to prop up your own game. IT appears that a majority of PLAYERS, as opposed to critics, disagree with you. The average player rating for FFXIV is much higher than your player rating for ESO. Using critics is a strawman argument when it is clear that majority of players seem to agree with the critics.
As for FFXIV, when it was released, it was POLISHED with very few bugs. I keep reading about the bugs in ESO. I keep reading about the phasing of quests where you can't even group up with friends unless you're on the EXACT same part of the quest. I keep hearing that the quests arn't particularly well written or feel anticlimactic. Lastly, it seems that ESO has an identity crisis going on. It's a mediocre mmo and a mediocre Elder Scrolls game. It tries to be both at the same time and fails miserably at it.
When FFXIV released, it offered 16 dungeons, an 8 man raid, and three primal fights with story mode and hard version. It offers traditional quests and open world real time quests (FATES). It offers a very "final fantasy" experience. It knows what it is and waht it offers. It doesn't have an identity crisis.
There is 0% chance that FFXIV will go free to play in the next few years based on its huge financial success. Let's see if ESO can say the same.
TLDR: No need to show ESO love by trying to tear down another game (FFXIV). Let's see if ESO can be half as successful as FFXIV before you start making baseless comparisons.
That does not make sense..A game is always without exception as good as you think it is. Enjoyment is a feeling. Your either enjoying what you are doing or your not.
When your scapegoating your game by using another game as your 'defense' to it, I'm sorry but its speaking volumes of having not a sound argument why your game isn't any good. Your comparing apples to orangles to make your spoiled oranges sound as if they were better.
Final Fantasy 14 isn't a perfect game, but what it does it does well and and in an extremely polished format. Its graphics style is much cleaner and polished (putting black and dirt on stuff doesn't make it suddenly 'better', stop trying to pretend it does), its combat system is old school but its well done and functions smoothly. Its story isn't bad by any means (if but cheesy).What makes it really shine (and I feel is what pushes it to be so well regarded)is its mechanics that are designed so well for the game they created.
Elder Scrolls Online... falls flat in many areas. To be fair, it sets itself up for such hurdles being an MMO version of a SINGLE PLAYER GAME. Bugs and issues PLAGUE the game (something FF14 had far fewer of), which to be fair its somewhat acceptable to have some (though its a bit outrageous how many it has). The graphics are rather lackluster, using 'dark and gritty' to disguise over-all 'mediocre' graphics and textures that plenty of other games do better on. Its combat system works to be faithful on the series and I feel it does... though the series really the combat systems were always rather lack luster to me and it carries on this issue. Its 'progression' with levels I feel are relatively well done which all in all I think makes a good (not great but good) combat system when all components are put together.
Where it falls flat on its face is its immersion. The game just lacks that immersive feel people expect from an TES game, due to it being an MMo. That feeling of exploration is just gone with dozens of people being around you. The 'boss farming' only destroys the feeling of epicness you SHOULD be feeling in a game that is suppose to be about adventure. Its attempting to be a Singleplayer game in an MMo and that greatly hurts its immersion. Combined with the number of bugs, it makes the experience of the game worst off. It doesnt allow it to hide its flaws at all when your constantly reminded 'oh this is a cheap TES game with swarms of people'. Voice acting telling you how dire the situation is with the city being attacked doesn't create a tense atmosphere when that attack is pathetic at best and doesn't have any atmosphere at all to back it up.
In Short: Using another game as scape goat is a desperate attempt to point a finger another way to hide the problems with your game. If you are going to defend your game, you need to give valid points AND you need to do so without a bias opinion hiding its flaws by 'using another game' to try and dust them under the rug.
ESO as a single player game can be alot of fun. ESO as a pvp / seige only game can be alot of fun.
But just try doing standard pve with a friend.. or worse put yourself to a real test and do it with a full group. Then you will see where ESO starts to dramaticly fall apart. You have a quest to go rescuse XX number of people. Guess what. One person rescuse a person, it runs off and only counts for the one person. So now you have to play the waiting game as everyone runs around solo trying to find enough people. Angry Joe pointed it out best. The game is great when you play it solo pve wise. But when you want to play it with your partner or with some friends doing pve. The game falls apart really fast as you spent alot of time just waiting around trying to find enough guys to complete a quest or enough items to finish off a quest.
I enjoy ESO, as a single player game that is.
Dont bother trying to understand it, unless the symptoms of MMO burnout are a real driving interest for you.
ESO has tremendous potential once it irons out the bugs and technical issues, which will come along in time. If I played MMO's for years and years while desperately waiting for the next one to come out like a crackhead needing a fix, I'd probably behave like a donkey too, would there be any other way? As it stands I have tempered expectations and have taken extended breaks from the genre, I find ESO to be an awesome game. Dont bother reading reviews and forums except for the lols, they're filled with nothing but irate little anger monkeys, nothing more to say about it really. Game on.
I like how you crap all over Final Fantasy to validate your ESO argument. The truth of the matter is that they are two MMO's and two different games. If you like ESO that's fine, but I wouldn't say it's better and Its not for me to tell you what to like.
ESO has a PR problem right now, sure there are people that like it. But, many people aren't going to waste a box price and a sub to feed a curiousity about the game. It's too much of an expense, I certainly won't do it.
Now, although I have not 'bought' ESO, I did get relatively far in the Beta to of formed an opinion about the game. You may count my opinion for all a lick of salt, but it is valid, because that impression from Beta made me not buy the game, whereas in the FF14: ARR Beta I did buy that game.
So, for me I played both betas, one I bought the other I did not. Why is that? Well i'll tell you.
1) Final Fantasy 14 has a good story, epic encounters and a cast of characters that have personality, motivations and epic interactions. I did not see any of this in ESO, to be honest most of the people I encountered were pretty much forgettable. I can't remember a single one of them and although I know its been some time, they didn't leave a lasting impression nor did they succeed in immersing in the world.
2) Zones, yes Final Fantasy 14 has zones split into parts and are smaller than ESO. But, I love the landscapes in Final Fantasy 14 and the weather affects are some of the best I've seen in an MMO in addition to lovely vistas. Might not count a lot for you, but for me I personally enjoy it. Also, in Final Fantasy you come to explore and back track between zones quite often making the world feel lived in, coming back to see familuar NPC's and learning the world. In ESO, zones where consumable content, I moved from one, to the next. For the most part they were pretty uninspiring.
Also ESO zones might be bigger, but it did feel like I was walking around a hell of a lot doing nothing. I explored every nook and cranny and there wasn't really much there to warrant my dedication to the journey. In fact, I find it insulting that a horse which for travelling and exploring is a necessity is so darned expensive. The fact I have to pay EXTRA money as well to get a horse is a slap in the face. Yes, I know you can get it in game, but the price is set to a standard where you either have to spend some considerable time investing to get a horse or just spend the cash. It's quite cheeky of them.
3) Voice Overs, yes this seems to be a big thing right now. You know what, I personally don't care. Voice Overs are a nice feature, but I always considered it a lazy feature for those who don't like to read. ESO voice acting is also kinda hit and miss. Not the only one mind you, SWTOR also has hit and miss voice acting. The Best MMO for voice acting has to be TSW.
Personally I like having just the major sections in Final Fantasy voice acted, makes more impact and special and that 'wall' of text you refer to is the stuff that makes the quests and characters seem more real. In addition to the fact that its much easier and cheaper to get content out for a game with less voice acting.
4) Crafting however your flat wrong. Well, perhaps this is an opinion thing. But I play MMO's as a dedicated crafter its what I enjoy and FF14 has one of the best I seen which is very deep. Unless you are the type of person to dedicate time to crafting I guess you wouldn't see it in all its majesty and complexity. ESO has a more friendly crafting system I would say, but ultimately I was bored with it.
5) Quests are about the same to be fair, I prefer Final Fantasy because the quests seem to be more relevant to the greater scheme of things. ESO seems to be one dimensional. You get a quest chain that begins and abruptly ends, a little nugget with no relevance to anything else other than that chain. Of course not all are like that. But, I remember doing quests in ESO which made me go 'That's it?' or I would be wondering 'why?'. Motives are quite unclear and end fights anti-climatic.
6) FATES although now not a primary way of experience they were much more social than ESO. FATE trains would have several full parties for the under taking. In the Beta of ESO I found that people were looking to go lone wolf or be a bit bitchy about stuff.
7) PvP I will give you this one, for now Final Fantasy 14 is not really PvP centric and those guys could use some love. But to my understanding, ESO is a bit PvP centric towards the end game. So, the focuses are a bit different.
NOW!
Reviews are not worthless, nor is your opinion. Both have value. You are going to know 'what' you like. But reviews arm the consumer with knowledge to make a reasonable decision. I am sorry you are not liking the reviews coming out, but its just that for the moment people are not digging the game and I can understand why. This information helps people unsure or on the fence who don't want to waste money on a game they are not going to enjoy.
Let's talk about that as well.
1) ESO in BETA had several issues, dupe bugs, falling through the world, broken quests etc. In fact for the months I was involved in the BETA I have noted 206 potential problems. I have them written down in my note book because I actually take the bug reporting seriously! Now I am not going to go through the list, a lot of them are graphical in nature, but there were bugs with quests, typos, falling through the world, duping, optimization issues etc etc.
From the footage of bugs in the live game I have watched... the bugs are still there. I did think at the time that with the amount of bugs I found so close to launch that they wouldn't have time getting them sorted. Now, in order to commit to a date and to show investor confidence they have essentially rushed a release before the game was ready. Ultimately they are getting the back lash on this. Now you might be willing to muscle through this, perhaps you've not experienced it yourself BUT no one should have to 'force' themselves to play a broken game in order to succeed, especially when the game is live and no longer in beta. If this was a single player game, you would of taken it back to the shop.
2) ESO has made their motivations clear and its a big F U to the community. This might not be their intent, but it is how it looks and image is everything at the beginning of an MMO's life span.
Let me put it to you, when you buy an MMO you expect the full game. Sometimes you are rewarded with vanity stuff as a pre-purchase to show others your dedication. But, when the game hides content behind a further payment wall its insulting. I am talking about the race lock, the imperial class, the horse and the ability to get married (which as a roleplay irks me). So if the Imperial Edition is the 'full game' then why make people pay more for it?? The reason is because they can, Elder Scrolls is a strong brand and people will play it even if it was garbage, heck people have been waiting for an ESO for a long time so why not take advantage early on, right?
Further more, for people who rely on payment cards to play MMO's they HAVE to purchase one to take advantage of the free month. In addition to the fact that there is no reference to payment methods on the main page or account page until you have actually bought the game!
Let's talk about staying power.
Final Fantasy 14 will have a long staying power because of the following reasons.
[] Each and every month, sometimes more in a month there are events that entice people back into the game, these may be little events, but for completionists they will not want to pass them up and will perhaps re-sub for a month just to keep their toons up to date.
[] Every 3 months (twice now on clock work) there have been MASSIVE patches adding a wealth of content, making me understand what my subscription is actually being spent on.
[] For every month of subscription you gain loyalty, vanity pets and mounts enticing people to maintain their subs.
They in effect reward people for their loyalty.
Whereas as far as I have seen, as far as I have played with ESO all they have done is bastardised the game and its community. Let's see where the game is 6 months from now and compare Final Fantasy then to ESO.
Now, I understand that this was a wall of text, if you read it all I thank you for your time. Sorry I couldn't do it as a voice over.
Thank you for this well thoughtout and detailed response.
I think its because people expect a high quality from Elder Scrolls so people were expecting this revelation when they played it. I think they rate it average because its just another run-of-the-mill themepark MMO with Elder Scrolls IP attached to it.
Thats just my opinion from reading/watching streams about it for the last few weeks while sitting on the fence. I haven't actually played it myself yet.
free 7 day sub and unlocks for swtor new accounts and 90+ day inactive subs click here to get it!
Click here for trove referral, bonuses to both!
This might be the most astute point made about ESO to date.
This 1000 times this!
No signature, I don't have a pen
Just like some movies shouldn't have sequels or remakes, single player games shouldn't be made into MMOs. I'm sorry but the argument of, "but I want to play with my friends on line" isn't a good excuse to water down and shoehorn an IP into a format it wasn't designed for. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
There's the disconnect.
There is a large percentage of mmo players that can only love an mmo which has the potential for years, not months. A few months to those players is the evaluation period - and if they choose to move on after a few months, that game is the opposite of what they are looking for in an mmo.
If you are one who likes to jump around from game to game a few months may seem like a good solid game which has longevity - from the perspective that you will enjoy the game for a long time, i.e. a few months.
From the other perspective, there are those who hate the game because it only held their interest for 'a few months'.
For me personally, a few months doesn't make a great mmo, but it is long enough to get my money's worth.
Speak for yourself and stop generalizing. I for example don't think that ESO lacks immersion. It has it's problems but all games do.
You do realize that the single player games are still the single player games, right? I mean, my copy of Skyrim is still the same Skyrim that it was prior to the release of ESO. So, the single player games were not all magically turned into MMOs, and if you don't want to play an MMO then the option to play the single player games still exists.
Who are you to say that a commercial entity "shouldn't" make and sell a product? Are you afraid that the existence of an Elder Scrolls MMO is somehow going to... do what? I don't know, I just don't understand hipsters, you guys just don't make any sense.