You can still get Depleted Infinity Shards in-game, right? If so, I fail to see how this is P2W. It just sounds like your regular, run of the mill time-sink mechanism. Sure, they're trying to squeeze you, so does your cable and phone company. Fact is, you can do the exact same thing as someone buying these boxes. Just not on the same schedule.
Originally posted by Dauzqul It's a free game. It's free to play. You're upset on having to spend 3 dollars to update your armor once?
These boxes contain 6-10 depleted infinity shards it would cost over a hundred dollars to upgrade one piece of armor to legendary so I don't know where you get 3 dollars from . Also this has happened even though Trion pledged top armor and weapons would not be available in the cash shop for real money .
You are aware that you can also buy them with Warlords Marks?
Yes for 1800 legendary warlords marks . That would probably take you about 20+ warfronts so you would probably be able to do that once a day at best . It would probably take you about 2 months to upgrade 1 piece of gear to legendary in such a method where as someone willing to pay a hundred + dollars can do it in minuets . You wouldn't be able to afford many lock boxes on your subscription credits either . Its not so much a of problem in a game like Rift which is mostly pve centric but in a game like Archeage it could be a major issue for many potential optional subscribers .
The amount of money it would take to get a full set is ridiculous, and you know what if they find some people willing to drop that kind of money? GOOD FOR THEM! Your cheap FTP ass isn't helping to pay the bills. These people are professionals, they have families, and the company has expenses to pay as well as making a profit for its investors. In your FTP fairy tale world everyone being equal ultimately means no FTP gaming as SOMEONE has to support your ass. Just like welfare man.
Originally posted by CrazKanuk You can still get Depleted Infinity Shards in-game, right? If so, I fail to see how this is P2W. It just sounds like your regular, run of the mill time-sink mechanism. Sure, they're trying to squeeze you, so does your cable and phone company. Fact is, you can do the exact same thing as someone buying these boxes. Just not on the same schedule.
1 per daily , 15 weekly for warfront quests ,45 more for quests involving conquests . You would also be able to top them up with buying depleted lock boxes . Given it takes 550 using this method doing a lot of pvp you would be hard pushed to get one piece of gear ungraded in a month . Each character has 14 pieces of upgradable gear so it would take you a year or more to aquire the kind of gear that someone who is willing to spend the money can aquire in minuets .
o really answer this find out h ow many people are rolling around fully gears and fully upgraded. I would say ZERO. While it is POSSIBLE it is highly unlikely. If it were truly 'pay to win' then there would be a lot of people running around maxed out.
Now in a game like AA who knows. GW2 sort of has a mechenism like this, how much did people spend just o get a 'commander' title? I really didnt see a lot of 'pay to win' talk there. Now you might not get armor but you get buffs and a fancy dot.
In the end, especially in PvP it has a lot less to do with the gear and th knowledge of your toon. Does it help? Sure. Wil it make someone who bought all their gear better than someone who is a better player beat that better player? Unlikely. Might make them a little more competitive, but a better player is still going to be better.
Slow down people, this happened in rift and alpha players made it pretty clear they wouldn't be happy with the same thing in ArcheAge.
It is still nothing but rumours and speculation. Don't say its p2w when there is nothing set in stone.
Wait for the official word from Trion, it will happen in the next few weeks. The cash shop will be up by beta so people will know soon enough.
Very true . Trion have not said they will do the same thing in Archeage but they also said they wouldn't do it in Rift . My concern is if they can do it once in one game they can do it again in another .
Aslong as it can all be obtained through playing the game (even if grindy) I don't have a problem with this and don't see it as pay2win (unless u can only buy the legendary gear). I don't think it's really required to keep a f2p game profitable fluff items xp/ pvp mark boosts etc seem to be enough for other games. Nearly every f2p game i have played has a system similar in place such as buying enchant reagents in tera.
Even if someone has the kind of $$ to upgrade all their gear and not think anything of it most likely works alot and could take them months to farm a piece due to amount they can play. To me it can be a good thing if done well as some of the ppl buying gear may not have pvped at all as the time required or them to be be on par with ppl that play alot which could help reduce bg q times and get more ppl pvping.
o really answer this find out h ow many people are rolling around fully gears and fully upgraded. I would say ZERO. While it is POSSIBLE it is highly unlikely. If it were truly 'pay to win' then there would be a lot of people running around maxed out.
Now in a game like AA who knows. GW2 sort of has a mechenism like this, how much did people spend just o get a 'commander' title? I really didnt see a lot of 'pay to win' talk there. Now you might not get armor but you get buffs and a fancy dot.
In the end, especially in PvP it has a lot less to do with the gear and th knowledge of your toon. Does it help? Sure. Wil it make someone who bought all their gear better than someone who is a better player beat that better player? Unlikely. Might make them a little more competitive, but a better player is still going to be better.
I've already seen players maxed out in Rift . Some people will just pay whatever it takes to do that . I agree though knowing how to play a class is important but maybe you take a look and see how big a difference legendary items make in Rift . Believe me its quite significant and unless the person with full legendary is a very bad player he would almost always beat a player in full epics .
Originally posted by bcbully AA (aswell as others) has already done it to itself. Anytime you have $$ to gold conversion, the entire Auction house becomes a cash shop.
This is something that bothers me, special in a game claim "Player driven economy", i never thought found that in AA, doesnt make sense imo and im sure it hurts alot the economy in-game.
Im still adicted to game and will be around in Trion release, but been possible to sell stuff from cs in ah its wrong, really wrong.
Originally posted by bcbully AA (aswell as others) has already done it to itself. Anytime you have $$ to gold conversion, the entire Auction house becomes a cash shop.
And the effect this has is amplified if there is anything that is "player driven"
Originally posted by greatskys Recently Trion offered depleted lock boxes available through the in game store for 650 credits . These lockboxes drop deleted infinity shards 550 of which can upgrade the top level Myrmidon armor from epic to legendary . Essentially for the first time top level armor an weapons are available in the cash shop for real money . Even though it is costly I'm sure there are people willing to do so . My concern is now that they have crossed this line what would stop them doing the same in ArcheAge which is a far more PVP centric game than Rift .
Trion worlds are the publishersof AA, not the developers. XL Games are the developers. Apparently Trion will have a say in things that will be kept & removed in patch 1.0. Beyond that, I don't know.
Originally posted by greatskys Recently Trion offered depleted lock boxes available through the in game store for 650 credits . These lockboxes drop deleted infinity shards 550 of which can upgrade the top level Myrmidon armor from epic to legendary . Essentially for the first time top level armor an weapons are available in the cash shop for real money . Even though it is costly I'm sure there are people willing to do so . My concern is now that they have crossed this line what would stop them doing the same in ArcheAge which is a far more PVP centric game than Rift .
Trion worlds are the publishersof AA, not the developers. XL Games are the developers. Apparently Trion will have a say in things that will be kept & removed in patch 1.0. Beyond that, I don't know.
Hopefully XL games will have final say over whats available in the cash shop . I don't trust Trion anymore .
Aslong as it can all be obtained through playing the game (even if grindy) I don't have a problem with this and don't see it as pay2win (unless u can only buy the legendary gear). I don't think it's really required to keep a f2p game profitable fluff items xp/ pvp mark boosts etc seem to be enough for other games. Nearly every f2p game i have played has a system similar in place such as buying enchant reagents in tera.
Even if someone has the kind of $$ to upgrade all their gear and not think anything of it most likely works alot and could take them months to farm a piece due to amount they can play. To me it can be a good thing if done well as some of the ppl buying gear may not have pvped at all as the time required or them to be be on par with ppl that play alot which could help reduce bg q times and get more ppl pvping.
I agree with you there but the way its been applied in Rift would probably take over a year to upgrade epic pvp gear to legendary but the time you do that it will probably be updated so you will never be able to catch up by grinding with those willing to pay .
Originally posted by CrazKanuk You can still get Depleted Infinity Shards in-game, right? If so, I fail to see how this is P2W. It just sounds like your regular, run of the mill time-sink mechanism. Sure, they're trying to squeeze you, so does your cable and phone company. Fact is, you can do the exact same thing as someone buying these boxes. Just not on the same schedule.
1 per daily , 15 weekly for warfront quests ,45 more for quests involving conquests . You would also be able to top them up with buying depleted lock boxes . Given it takes 550 using this method doing a lot of pvp you would be hard pushed to get one piece of gear ungraded in a month . Each character has 14 pieces of upgradable gear so it would take you a year or more to aquire the kind of gear that someone who is willing to spend the money can aquire in minuets .
Thats pay to win in my books .
It has never been pay to win and never will be. you can throw as much cash as you like at the cash shop to buy pvp gear but without the rank to use it it is useless. and the people who actually use their brain will know there is no point in buying any pvp gear as you have to grind the rank to use it so not exactly pay to win as you claim.
Originally posted by CrazKanuk You can still get Depleted Infinity Shards in-game, right? If so, I fail to see how this is P2W. It just sounds like your regular, run of the mill time-sink mechanism. Sure, they're trying to squeeze you, so does your cable and phone company. Fact is, you can do the exact same thing as someone buying these boxes. Just not on the same schedule.
1 per daily , 15 weekly for warfront quests ,45 more for quests involving conquests . You would also be able to top them up with buying depleted lock boxes . Given it takes 550 using this method doing a lot of pvp you would be hard pushed to get one piece of gear ungraded in a month . Each character has 14 pieces of upgradable gear so it would take you a year or more to aquire the kind of gear that someone who is willing to spend the money can aquire in minuets .
Thats pay to win in my books .
It has never been pay to win and never will be. you can throw as much cash as you like at the cash shop to buy pvp gear but without the rank to use it it is useless. and the people who actually use their brain will know there is no point in buying any pvp gear as you have to grind the rank to use it so not exactly pay to win as you claim.
A certain rank does have to be achieved to use it but any game that make it possible to get the top legendary gear instantly once you do via a cash shop is pay to win in my view . My worry is not for Rift which is basically mostly PVE but for Archeage which is a world pvp title . If they do the same thing there and make it possible to obtain legendary gear in a similar manner it defeats leveling because by the time you obtain such gear it will most likely be upgraded and out of date . It also defeats subscribing because you will never have enough credit to obtain the gear from the cash shop without spending more money on top of it . In a PVP game thats a killer .
Rift rides the line on P2W, this is true, but you still CAN earn it in game just by playing, which techincally doesn't make it P2W, more like a P2Shortcut. If it was actually considered P2W then other games that ride the line like GW2, EQ, EQ2, etc are all P2W as well, and I just don't think that's completely true.
P2W is a pretty subjective term these days though. Winning to some people is having the best and newest outfits to show. That's their own version of "winning", so games like GW2 would fall into that category, though technically by a text book definition GW2 isn't quite P2W, it's just another game that lets you pay to achieve things faster than people who don't pay. It really is all subjective imo.
Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV Have played: You name it If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.
Well both Rift and AA are F2P....to keep these games running...they need to make money. So those willing to put money into the game to keep it running certainly do deserve to be better equipped than the freeloaders. If everything was set up for both freeloaders and paying customers to be on equal ground....what would be the point of paying any money. Everybody would just run on F2P status and that would quickly shut down the games.
If you like the game support it by dumping a few bucks into it once in a while. Don't cry cause it's not 100% free. Nothing is free in the world. Even tho this generation seems to think the previous generation owes them a living.
I agree. Games like Path of Exile are so dumb, I can not even buy the best items in the cash shop!
Little forum boys with their polished cyber toys: whine whine, boo-hoo, talk talk.
Rift rides the line on P2W, this is true, but you still CAN earn it in game just by playing, which techincally doesn't make it P2W, more like a P2Shortcut. If it was actually considered P2W then other games that ride the line like GW2, EQ, EQ2, etc are all P2W as well, and I just don't think that's completely true.
P2W is a pretty subjective term these days though. Winning to some people is having the best and newest outfits to show. That's their own version of "winning", so games like GW2 would fall into that category, though technically by a text book definition GW2 isn't quite P2W, it's just another game that lets you pay to achieve things faster than people who don't pay. It really is all subjective imo.
There has always been an element of it but until now there top tier weapons and armor have never been available through spending real world money in the cash shop .
Rift rides the line on P2W, this is true, but you still CAN earn it in game just by playing, which techincally doesn't make it P2W, more like a P2Shortcut. If it was actually considered P2W then other games that ride the line like GW2, EQ, EQ2, etc are all P2W as well, and I just don't think that's completely true.
P2W is a pretty subjective term these days though. Winning to some people is having the best and newest outfits to show. That's their own version of "winning", so games like GW2 would fall into that category, though technically by a text book definition GW2 isn't quite P2W, it's just another game that lets you pay to achieve things faster than people who don't pay. It really is all subjective imo.
There has always been an element of it but until now there top tier weapons and armor have never been available through spending real world money in the cash shop .
This is true. I enjoy Rift a lot, but it does seem to be moving more towards a P2W style gameplay. It's really sad, Rift used to be THE game to play if you didn't want to play WoW for PvE/PvP themeparks, but this move may end up doing more damage than problem solving.
What I really don't get is, the servers are all medium/high pop still. I know they are making plenty of money off the outfits alone, because everyone and their dog has wardrobe outfits purchased through the Rift store these days. What gives Trion?
Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV Have played: You name it If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.
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Crazkanuk
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Yes for 1800 legendary warlords marks . That would probably take you about 20+ warfronts so you would probably be able to do that once a day at best . It would probably take you about 2 months to upgrade 1 piece of gear to legendary in such a method where as someone willing to pay a hundred + dollars can do it in minuets . You wouldn't be able to afford many lock boxes on your subscription credits either . Its not so much a of problem in a game like Rift which is mostly pve centric but in a game like Archeage it could be a major issue for many potential optional subscribers .
Slow down people, this happened in rift and alpha players made it pretty clear they wouldn't be happy with the same thing in ArcheAge.
It is still nothing but rumours and speculation. Don't say its p2w when there is nothing set in stone.
Wait for the official word from Trion, it will happen in the next few weeks. The cash shop will be up by beta so people will know soon enough.
1 per daily , 15 weekly for warfront quests ,45 more for quests involving conquests . You would also be able to top them up with buying depleted lock boxes . Given it takes 550 using this method doing a lot of pvp you would be hard pushed to get one piece of gear ungraded in a month . Each character has 14 pieces of upgradable gear so it would take you a year or more to aquire the kind of gear that someone who is willing to spend the money can aquire in minuets .
Thats pay to win in my books .
o really answer this find out h ow many people are rolling around fully gears and fully upgraded. I would say ZERO. While it is POSSIBLE it is highly unlikely. If it were truly 'pay to win' then there would be a lot of people running around maxed out.
Now in a game like AA who knows. GW2 sort of has a mechenism like this, how much did people spend just o get a 'commander' title? I really didnt see a lot of 'pay to win' talk there. Now you might not get armor but you get buffs and a fancy dot.
In the end, especially in PvP it has a lot less to do with the gear and th knowledge of your toon. Does it help? Sure. Wil it make someone who bought all their gear better than someone who is a better player beat that better player? Unlikely. Might make them a little more competitive, but a better player is still going to be better.
Very true . Trion have not said they will do the same thing in Archeage but they also said they wouldn't do it in Rift . My concern is if they can do it once in one game they can do it again in another .
Aslong as it can all be obtained through playing the game (even if grindy) I don't have a problem with this and don't see it as pay2win (unless u can only buy the legendary gear). I don't think it's really required to keep a f2p game profitable fluff items xp/ pvp mark boosts etc seem to be enough for other games. Nearly every f2p game i have played has a system similar in place such as buying enchant reagents in tera.
Even if someone has the kind of $$ to upgrade all their gear and not think anything of it most likely works alot and could take them months to farm a piece due to amount they can play. To me it can be a good thing if done well as some of the ppl buying gear may not have pvped at all as the time required or them to be be on par with ppl that play alot which could help reduce bg q times and get more ppl pvping.
I've already seen players maxed out in Rift . Some people will just pay whatever it takes to do that . I agree though knowing how to play a class is important but maybe you take a look and see how big a difference legendary items make in Rift . Believe me its quite significant and unless the person with full legendary is a very bad player he would almost always beat a player in full epics .
This is something that bothers me, special in a game claim "Player driven economy", i never thought found that in AA, doesnt make sense imo and im sure it hurts alot the economy in-game.
Im still adicted to game and will be around in Trion release, but been possible to sell stuff from cs in ah its wrong, really wrong.
And the effect this has is amplified if there is anything that is "player driven"
Trion worlds are the publishers of AA, not the developers. XL Games are the developers. Apparently Trion will have a say in things that will be kept & removed in patch 1.0. Beyond that, I don't know.
Hopefully XL games will have final say over whats available in the cash shop . I don't trust Trion anymore .
I agree with you there but the way its been applied in Rift would probably take over a year to upgrade epic pvp gear to legendary but the time you do that it will probably be updated so you will never be able to catch up by grinding with those willing to pay .
Oh right, because XL games didn't make it paytowin in korea at all?
This game should be P2P, F2P just don't work....
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It has never been pay to win and never will be. you can throw as much cash as you like at the cash shop to buy pvp gear but without the rank to use it it is useless. and the people who actually use their brain will know there is no point in buying any pvp gear as you have to grind the rank to use it so not exactly pay to win as you claim.
A certain rank does have to be achieved to use it but any game that make it possible to get the top legendary gear instantly once you do via a cash shop is pay to win in my view . My worry is not for Rift which is basically mostly PVE but for Archeage which is a world pvp title . If they do the same thing there and make it possible to obtain legendary gear in a similar manner it defeats leveling because by the time you obtain such gear it will most likely be upgraded and out of date . It also defeats subscribing because you will never have enough credit to obtain the gear from the cash shop without spending more money on top of it . In a PVP game thats a killer .
Rift rides the line on P2W, this is true, but you still CAN earn it in game just by playing, which techincally doesn't make it P2W, more like a P2Shortcut. If it was actually considered P2W then other games that ride the line like GW2, EQ, EQ2, etc are all P2W as well, and I just don't think that's completely true.
P2W is a pretty subjective term these days though. Winning to some people is having the best and newest outfits to show. That's their own version of "winning", so games like GW2 would fall into that category, though technically by a text book definition GW2 isn't quite P2W, it's just another game that lets you pay to achieve things faster than people who don't pay. It really is all subjective imo.
Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.
I agree. Games like Path of Exile are so dumb, I can not even buy the best items in the cash shop!
Little forum boys with their polished cyber toys: whine whine, boo-hoo, talk talk.
This is Trion's specialty. It dates back to "were not closing servers, were converting them to trial servers"
no tricks no traps my ass.
There has always been an element of it but until now there top tier weapons and armor have never been available through spending real world money in the cash shop .
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This is true. I enjoy Rift a lot, but it does seem to be moving more towards a P2W style gameplay. It's really sad, Rift used to be THE game to play if you didn't want to play WoW for PvE/PvP themeparks, but this move may end up doing more damage than problem solving.
What I really don't get is, the servers are all medium/high pop still. I know they are making plenty of money off the outfits alone, because everyone and their dog has wardrobe outfits purchased through the Rift store these days. What gives Trion?
Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.