I understand what you mean OP, but Archeage is really seamless, except for dungeons and mirage isle, and maybe some other spots.
Others have said you need a glider, but that still doesn't make up for the restrictive leveling system. You will still be restricted as to what you can do, whether it's killing mobs or doing quests. This is due to the leveling system though.
Seamless - no loading screens but still sends you from zone to zone dictating the level of mobs in each zone giving you a rails leveling experience.
Open World - Go and do what you want... like other open world games where mobs dont really have levels but are on templates... a rat is always gonna be a rat no matter what zone you're in it's always going to be the same difficulty.. a bear is going to be a bear no matter what zone you're in always the same difficulty... it's up to you to find the mobs that present the best challenge / reward for yourself... not know if you go to said zone there will be mobs the same level as you.
If we are all going to use our own definitions and not stick to some standard than any meaningful discussion is moot.
You are talking about leveless design - open world games don't have to have mobs without levels, this is your own definition.
So by your own definition - if ArcheAge simply shuffled all the mobs and had many different levels of mobs in every region - would you say its an open world game?
There isn't any standard though. There are many MMOs and Virtual Worlds, that are seamless, open-world, instanced, phased, etc. And they aren't just using only one of these types, but a mixture of some, or all, which could define what "open-world" might mean. Open-world could mean various concepts.
The real issue here, is that a leveling system, restricts combat, exploration, and access to other content, without any chance of success, because of the artificial leveling progression system.
By that description, it's not really an open-world if you are restricted because of levels, because you're not "open" to access all the content, due to the leveling restriction.
I understand what mbrodie means. A level 50 rat shouldn't be harder to kill than a lvl 1 rat, or whatever NPC you want to use. It should be consistent throughout the game. The only exceptions i would have, is if there was a story explaining why it's harder to kill, if for example, it was infused with magic and became a demon-rat, or whatever. lol.
As it is now, most MMOs, including AA, have these ridiculous restrictions, due to levels.
This game is not open world/sandbox. Maybe compared to wow it is but nothing compared to games like Ultima Online. I would have still play it if the graphics and movement was smooth like it is in wow but everything just looks outdated and sloppy. Not going to play it
Originally posted by SamuraiXIV I just tried the beta and can say that AA is 100% open world I actually even hit the sea and no fatigue to stop me from going anywhere like in wow, rift and the such.
So you are telling me that you can run straight in a direction across several zones without having to reroute to get through narrow passages that allow you into or out of zones?
Wtf are you talking about ?
Where's this "narrow entrance" to the sea zones then ?
How come I can get from zone to zone on land without crossing anywhere near the "roads" ? The paths are there if you're prepared to look for them, but obviously some mountains will be too steep to climb. However, even though you cannot climb mountain X from within Zone A, you may be able to run up the back of it from Zone B, then jump off and glide straight into Zone A.
Yes, it really is an open world even by strict standards. You can go anywhere, and you do not have to cross into other lands via disquised zone boundaries. There are no actual boundaries. You can even swim from continent to continent-in fact this is an integral part of the the game design.
The noobie lands are in valleys that seem like zones because each valley has different level mobs. But this does not make it not open world, it just corrals noobies into an area so they don't get lost.
Seamless - no loading screens but still sends you from zone to zone dictating the level of mobs in each zone giving you a rails leveling experience.
Open World - Go and do what you want... like other open world games where mobs dont really have levels but are on templates... a rat is always gonna be a rat no matter what zone you're in it's always going to be the same difficulty.. a bear is going to be a bear no matter what zone you're in always the same difficulty... it's up to you to find the mobs that present the best challenge / reward for yourself... not know if you go to said zone there will be mobs the same level as you.
If we are all going to use our own definitions and not stick to some standard than any meaningful discussion is moot.
You are talking about leveless design - open world games don't have to have mobs without levels, this is your own definition.
So by your own definition - if ArcheAge simply shuffled all the mobs and had many different levels of mobs in every region - would you say its an open world game?
you trying to compare AA to open world is like trying to compare EVE online's game world to WoW.... WoW is seamless, EVE is open world.
Edit - and no, because AA still has zones based off levels.. putting higher level mobs into the mix changes nothing
starter zone - level 1 - 5, next zone level 5 - 11, next zone level 11 - 18 etc... it's completely on the rails.. i cant just go looking for adventure
Edit 2 - and off the wiki "An open world is a type of video gamelevel design where a player can roam freely through a virtual world and is given considerable freedom in choosing how or when to approach objectives."
AA doesnt give me that freedom.. it gives me quests which tell me what mobs to kill and where to kill them, trade route quests, quests to get my first farm, quests to get my first ship... sure i can go kill mobs, but then you miss out on your first farm not doing the quest etc...
I'm sorry if AA is the second coming for you, but after playing a substancial amount of hours over the course of like 2 and a half months or something, the game is heavily flawed, with potential but not enough... hacks and bots are out of control, combat being handled client side instead of server side was a terrible design choice, considering it's on the crytek engine the graphics are super average even maxed out.... it just doesnt do it for me, it's not a real open world game, it's more themepark then sandbox and it doesnt live up to the hype at all.
Just out of interest, would you describe SWG (lets say Pre CU) as an open world mmorpg?
To expand on my first post. I don't want to want to have each little area of the map (read: zones) separated by impassable mountains or walls that require exit or entrance to the zone through narrow pathways. This leads to silly zoned mentality where each zone is drastically different from the next as far as mobs/culture/eco-system/etc. My example of this is the WOW map.
This is not how things are in the real world, things flow together and lines get blurred, each state isn't surrounded by impassable mountains. I can go west until I hit the ocean, hop on a boat to asia, then continue west again. (I know...vidya games....but i play mmo's to immerse in a virtual world, and it's important to me.) To go back to my original example: in Asherons Call there wasn't areas, mob levels went up and down gradually but you could run for hours in a single direction only needing to change course for the occasional mountain that was too steep, or tree, or building or whatever.
Maybe I'm wrong, maybe the mountains aren't impassable, but I pulled up the world map and all I saw was a bunch of zones that appear to be separated by impassable terrain.
In other words,
The OP didn't play the game, he looked at the map and decided for himself how the game works.
Even when people have told him that it doesn't work know he's decided it works he still insists that it works how he decided.
Another poster has decided upon his own definition of open world. Apparently even Darkfall isn't an open world because the mobs get stronger as you move away from the starting areas. Just like they do in UO. Just like they do in saga of ryzom, just like they do in damn near every MMO ever made.
Basically this is where we come to bash the game by imposing our own definition of open world.
I must have been living in a fools paradise my whole live thinking that i myself lived in a "open world" But i just looked at a map and saw that we do in fact live in "zones" My mind is officially blown.
OMG and look! A mountain that i can climb to the top of!!!!!
To expand on my first post. I don't want to want to have each little area of the map (read: zones) separated by impassable mountains or walls that require exit or entrance to the zone through narrow pathways. This leads to silly zoned mentality where each zone is drastically different from the next as far as mobs/culture/eco-system/etc. My example of this is the WOW map.
This is not how things are in the real world, things flow together and lines get blurred, each state isn't surrounded by impassable mountains. I can go west until I hit the ocean, hop on a boat to asia, then continue west again. (I know...vidya games....but i play mmo's to immerse in a virtual world, and it's important to me.) To go back to my original example: in Asherons Call there wasn't areas, mob levels went up and down gradually but you could run for hours in a single direction only needing to change course for the occasional mountain that was too steep, or tree, or building or whatever.
Maybe I'm wrong, maybe the mountains aren't impassable, but I pulled up the world map and all I saw was a bunch of zones that appear to be separated by impassable terrain.
In other words,
The OP didn't play the game, he looked at the map and decided for himself how the game works.
Even when people have told him that it doesn't work know he's decided it works he still insists that it works how he decided.
Another poster has decided upon his own definition of open world. Apparently even Darkfall isn't an open world because the mobs get stronger as you move away from the starting areas. Just like they do in UO. Just like they do in saga of ryzom, just like they do in damn near every MMO ever made.
Basically this is where we come to bash the game by imposing our own definition of open world.
This is why I asked the question about whether mbrodie considers SWG Pre CU an open world mmorpg.
In my experience SWG was the very definition of open world sandpark....and yet....try rolling a toon stright out of ME and heading to Dath for a Nightsister or Rancor hunt and see how that goes....
Does this mean that SWG was also not an open world mmorpg?
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
It's funny to suggest a game isn't open world if it does have the possibility of you getting around without following the bread crumbs. The game is over a year old already and if you can do it more often than not odds are it is intentional not a glitch (ergo it is a open world game which rewards actually thinking).
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
It's funny to suggest a game isn't open world if it does have the possibility of you getting around without following the bread crumbs. The game is over a year old already and if you can do it more often than not odds are it is intentional not a glitch (ergo it is a open world game which rewards actually thinking).
you obfuscate a LOT.
You equate the skill system of Eve to Darkfall because players have to spend 'time' playing in Darkfall in order to progress in the skill system.
You equate an open world with having to follow a road to get to meaningful content when that is the anthesis of open world.
its really pretty amazing the lengths you will go, not such much to defend the game, but to just disassemble.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
It's funny to suggest a game isn't open world if it does have the possibility of you getting around without following the bread crumbs. The game is over a year old already and if you can do it more often than not odds are it is intentional not a glitch (ergo it is a open world game which rewards actually thinking).
you obfuscate a LOT.
You equate the skill system of Eve to Darkfall because players have to spend 'time' playing in Darkfall in order to progress in the skill system.
You equate an open world with having to follow a road to get to meaningful content when that is the anthesis of open world.
its really pretty amazing the lengths you will go, not such much to defend the game, but to just disassemble.
It's amazing the lengths you go to to justify your point of view.
In EVE you spend time to progress, in DF you spend time grinding to progress, difference? Oh you have to do a specific think in DF whereas in EVE you don't... I guess that just makes DF inferior.
You equate to having a road you can follow as not open world when your own words contradict you.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
It's amazing the lengths you go to to justify your point of view.
In EVE you spend time to progress, in DF you spend time grinding to progress, difference? Oh you have to do a specific think in DF whereas in EVE you don't... I guess that just makes DF inferior.
You equate to having a road you can follow as not open world when your own words contradict you.
you are describing ALL games.
How is Eve not like AA using your exact logic?
I think you would be better served to just drop that logic
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
being able to do it with great diffiuclty and cleverness and just being able to walk into a forest to do it ARE NOT THE SAME THING!
AA options are either follow the path or put in a lot of work and cleverness, its silly to equate that with an open world but hey if that is your idea of an open world then have fun bro
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
being able to do it with great diffiuclty and cleverness and just being able to walk into a forest to do it ARE NOT THE SAME THING!
AA options are either follow the path or put in a lot of work and cleverness, its silly to equate that with an open world but hey if that is your idea of an open world then have fun bro
Have fun grinding levels in DF and then saying "Hey at least I am not wasting time like in EVE" brah ( grinding levels isn't natural progression just like how EVE's time based system isn't a natural progression but unlike EVE DF forces you to do something ad nauseum until you get to where you want, EVE makes you wait, both are vastly inferior to a system where you do what you want and levels come from that... oh look Archeage).
Also difficulty does not determine open world factor, if you believe otherwise I will drop your butt in Antarctica so you can argue with a penguin that Earth isn't open world because you are freezing your privates to a glacier.
It was always funny reading these debates on this site. since im now registered i can tell you my opinion. pls understand, im not a mmo gamer. i am a gamer. i play many different games, but prefer rpgs the most.
so is AA a open world? technicaly speaking it is. it has only minor loading screens and you can indeed jump from a mountain and with a glider fly to different zones. but here is the whole problem of the whole mmo genre, cursed by themepark design. the leveling experience in AA is a themepark. it has zones, you do questst ond move on. although the world is open, it is fragmented. it puts you into level constrictions and you are indeed not free to explore a open world.
in extremly good singleplayer rpgs like gothic 1 etc. you are truly free to go anywhere. sure, you will meet stuff that can kill you in 1 hit, but you can sneak your way past them and on another parts you encounter weaker enemies. imagine youii just sneak behind a dinosaur lv 99, you approach a pond where you can kill lv 15 struff, cause hey, theyx have to drink too. but if you swim into that lake (pond), then strong predators are waiting for you.
i crushes my soul, how shitty the mmo genre is. not only you have zones, which progress linear. means you have really no business as lv 5 in a lv 30 zone. but also modern mmos dont even have day/night cycles. in another rpgs the enemies get stronger at night etc. nope, not here.
AA leveling is just bad, its a stupid themepark. and i swear i could write 10 pages why i hate mmos of now (themepark).
to the OP:
The difference in AA is, that at max level or say lv 30 the game opens up. AA uses the world meaningful. means you go to older zones to gather stuff, you pass (travel) them by trading etc. wouldnt AA not having this, hell i would never bother.
i really want to like mmo genre. it has the most potential. but it crushes my soul how bad it is.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
being able to do it with great diffiuclty and cleverness and just being able to walk into a forest to do it ARE NOT THE SAME THING!
AA options are either follow the path or put in a lot of work and cleverness, its silly to equate that with an open world but hey if that is your idea of an open world then have fun bro
Have fun grinding levels in DF and then saying "Hey at least I am not wasting time like in EVE" brah ( grinding levels isn't natural progression just like how EVE's time based system isn't a natural progression but unlike EVE DF forces you to do something ad nauseum until you get to where you want, EVE makes you wait, both are vastly inferior to a system where you do what you want and levels come from that... oh look Archeage).
Also difficulty does not determine open world factor, if you believe otherwise I will drop your butt in Antarctica so you can argue with a penguin that Earth isn't open world because you are freezing your privates to a glacier.
despite the bizzare logic that Darkfall is like Eve because you have to spend time gaining skill, the reality is it doesnt even matter to this conversation.
So what if Darkfall is cheap carbon copy of Eve. Its still more of an open world than AA is. Oh and the housing is better too. At least you are not so close to your neighboor you are dry humping them just to get to your farm
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
being able to do it with great diffiuclty and cleverness and just being able to walk into a forest to do it ARE NOT THE SAME THING!
AA options are either follow the path or put in a lot of work and cleverness, its silly to equate that with an open world but hey if that is your idea of an open world then have fun bro
Have fun grinding levels in DF and then saying "Hey at least I am not wasting time like in EVE" brah ( grinding levels isn't natural progression just like how EVE's time based system isn't a natural progression but unlike EVE DF forces you to do something ad nauseum until you get to where you want, EVE makes you wait, both are vastly inferior to a system where you do what you want and levels come from that... oh look Archeage).
Also difficulty does not determine open world factor, if you believe otherwise I will drop your butt in Antarctica so you can argue with a penguin that Earth isn't open world because you are freezing your privates to a glacier.
despite the bizzare logic that Darkfall is like Eve because you have to spend time gaining skill, the reality is it doesnt even matter to this conversation.
So what if Darkfall is cheap carbon copy of Eve. Its still more of an open world than AA is. Oh and the housing is better too. At least you are not so close to your neighboor you are dry humping them just to get to your farm
I don't even have to play Darkfall to know your definition of "better" is flawed. I think most would define better based on functionality and features and looks/aesthetics would have NOTHING to do with it. Can you tell me how Darkfall housing is better based on function or purpose when compared to AA housing/farming? Better yet, tell me ANY game that has more functional/useful housing than AA?
IMHO AA has the most complex/fuctional/and rewarding housing system over ANY MMO.
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
being able to do it with great diffiuclty and cleverness and just being able to walk into a forest to do it ARE NOT THE SAME THING!
AA options are either follow the path or put in a lot of work and cleverness, its silly to equate that with an open world but hey if that is your idea of an open world then have fun bro
Have fun grinding levels in DF and then saying "Hey at least I am not wasting time like in EVE" brah ( grinding levels isn't natural progression just like how EVE's time based system isn't a natural progression but unlike EVE DF forces you to do something ad nauseum until you get to where you want, EVE makes you wait, both are vastly inferior to a system where you do what you want and levels come from that... oh look Archeage).
Also difficulty does not determine open world factor, if you believe otherwise I will drop your butt in Antarctica so you can argue with a penguin that Earth isn't open world because you are freezing your privates to a glacier.
despite the bizzare logic that Darkfall is like Eve because you have to spend time gaining skill, the reality is it doesnt even matter to this conversation.
So what if Darkfall is cheap carbon copy of Eve. Its still more of an open world than AA is. Oh and the housing is better too. At least you are not so close to your neighboor you are dry humping them just to get to your farm
I don't even have to play Darkfall to know your definition of "better" is flawed. I think most would define better based on functionality and features and looks/aesthetics would have NOTHING to do with it. Can you tell me how Darkfall housing is better based on function or purpose when compared to AA housing/farming? Better yet, tell me ANY game that has more functional/useful housing than AA?
IMHO AA has the most complex/fuctional/and rewarding housing system over ANY MMO.
to begin with 'good' is subjective but we have been throwing it around as a factual word.
second, aesthetics is extreemly importnat to me. This is my virtual world, if it wasnt important I would just play a MUD. For me the housing and farms in AA is extreemly tacky and distracting, I feel like I am playing a kids game
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Comments
I understand what you mean OP, but Archeage is really seamless, except for dungeons and mirage isle, and maybe some other spots.
Others have said you need a glider, but that still doesn't make up for the restrictive leveling system. You will still be restricted as to what you can do, whether it's killing mobs or doing quests. This is due to the leveling system though.
There isn't any standard though. There are many MMOs and Virtual Worlds, that are seamless, open-world, instanced, phased, etc. And they aren't just using only one of these types, but a mixture of some, or all, which could define what "open-world" might mean. Open-world could mean various concepts.
The real issue here, is that a leveling system, restricts combat, exploration, and access to other content, without any chance of success, because of the artificial leveling progression system.
By that description, it's not really an open-world if you are restricted because of levels, because you're not "open" to access all the content, due to the leveling restriction.
I understand what mbrodie means. A level 50 rat shouldn't be harder to kill than a lvl 1 rat, or whatever NPC you want to use. It should be consistent throughout the game. The only exceptions i would have, is if there was a story explaining why it's harder to kill, if for example, it was infused with magic and became a demon-rat, or whatever. lol.
As it is now, most MMOs, including AA, have these ridiculous restrictions, due to levels.
Wtf are you talking about ?
Where's this "narrow entrance" to the sea zones then ?
How come I can get from zone to zone on land without crossing anywhere near the "roads" ? The paths are there if you're prepared to look for them, but obviously some mountains will be too steep to climb. However, even though you cannot climb mountain X from within Zone A, you may be able to run up the back of it from Zone B, then jump off and glide straight into Zone A.
Yes, it really is an open world even by strict standards. You can go anywhere, and you do not have to cross into other lands via disquised zone boundaries. There are no actual boundaries. You can even swim from continent to continent-in fact this is an integral part of the the game design.
The noobie lands are in valleys that seem like zones because each valley has different level mobs. But this does not make it not open world, it just corrals noobies into an area so they don't get lost.
Just out of interest, would you describe SWG (lets say Pre CU) as an open world mmorpg?
In other words,
The OP didn't play the game, he looked at the map and decided for himself how the game works.
Even when people have told him that it doesn't work know he's decided it works he still insists that it works how he decided.
Another poster has decided upon his own definition of open world. Apparently even Darkfall isn't an open world because the mobs get stronger as you move away from the starting areas. Just like they do in UO. Just like they do in saga of ryzom, just like they do in damn near every MMO ever made.
Basically this is where we come to bash the game by imposing our own definition of open world.
The open world is there the moment you log into the game for the 1st time.
Climbing mountains and crossing oceans and walking to each and every zone without a single delay in loading screens.
Even more open world as Skyrim as Skyrim does have loading screens when entering a house or "open" world dungeon.
I must have been living in a fools paradise my whole live thinking that i myself lived in a "open world" But i just looked at a map and saw that we do in fact live in "zones" My mind is officially blown.
OMG and look! A mountain that i can climb to the top of!!!!!
This is why I asked the question about whether mbrodie considers SWG Pre CU an open world mmorpg.
In my experience SWG was the very definition of open world sandpark....and yet....try rolling a toon stright out of ME and heading to Dath for a Nightsister or Rancor hunt and see how that goes....
Does this mean that SWG was also not an open world mmorpg?
You can't go wherever you want in the real world. I can't go everywhere I want in AA either however I can go more places and in more ways than I can in real life. That's open enough for me...and far more open world than most of the MMOs I('ve) play(ed).
I feel it is very open in other words. WOW used to feel that way to me too until Cataclysm. Now it's this and LOTRO for open worlds imo.
R.I.P Vanguard
wrong.
lets take the starter zone for starters.
if it was as many 'open world' games are you could go north, south, west, or east and be able to travel a good distance.
As someone who commonly plays 'open world games' I can tell you this game is restrictive in this regard.
I was able to get from one zone to another zone without following the road but it took a shit ton of clever climbing.
its silly
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Actually not... even Skyrim has the climbing bit... especially when trolls start cropping up and you do not have a good fire weapon. Tastes =/= facts.
what is funny about AA is that unless you are clever and willing to do some work you cant get to the next area without following the road. It is really funny to suggest that game is open world.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
It's funny to suggest a game isn't open world if it does have the possibility of you getting around without following the bread crumbs. The game is over a year old already and if you can do it more often than not odds are it is intentional not a glitch (ergo it is a open world game which rewards actually thinking).
you obfuscate a LOT.
You equate the skill system of Eve to Darkfall because players have to spend 'time' playing in Darkfall in order to progress in the skill system.
You equate an open world with having to follow a road to get to meaningful content when that is the anthesis of open world.
its really pretty amazing the lengths you will go, not such much to defend the game, but to just disassemble.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
It's amazing the lengths you go to to justify your point of view.
In EVE you spend time to progress, in DF you spend time grinding to progress, difference? Oh you have to do a specific think in DF whereas in EVE you don't... I guess that just makes DF inferior.
You equate to having a road you can follow as not open world when your own words contradict you.
Can you only access the next part of the map by following the road to a specific entry/exit point....or can you climb or glide over mountains and other natural obstacles and appear in the next part of the map at any point you choose with no loading screen in between?
If the latter which is how i interpret even your own description then its open world.
you are describing ALL games.
How is Eve not like AA using your exact logic?
I think you would be better served to just drop that logic
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
being able to do it with great diffiuclty and cleverness and just being able to walk into a forest to do it ARE NOT THE SAME THING!
AA options are either follow the path or put in a lot of work and cleverness, its silly to equate that with an open world but hey if that is your idea of an open world then have fun bro
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Have fun grinding levels in DF and then saying "Hey at least I am not wasting time like in EVE" brah ( grinding levels isn't natural progression just like how EVE's time based system isn't a natural progression but unlike EVE DF forces you to do something ad nauseum until you get to where you want, EVE makes you wait, both are vastly inferior to a system where you do what you want and levels come from that... oh look Archeage).
Also difficulty does not determine open world factor, if you believe otherwise I will drop your butt in Antarctica so you can argue with a penguin that Earth isn't open world because you are freezing your privates to a glacier.
It was always funny reading these debates on this site. since im now registered i can tell you my opinion. pls understand, im not a mmo gamer. i am a gamer. i play many different games, but prefer rpgs the most.
so is AA a open world? technicaly speaking it is. it has only minor loading screens and you can indeed jump from a mountain and with a glider fly to different zones. but here is the whole problem of the whole mmo genre, cursed by themepark design. the leveling experience in AA is a themepark. it has zones, you do questst ond move on. although the world is open, it is fragmented. it puts you into level constrictions and you are indeed not free to explore a open world.
in extremly good singleplayer rpgs like gothic 1 etc. you are truly free to go anywhere. sure, you will meet stuff that can kill you in 1 hit, but you can sneak your way past them and on another parts you encounter weaker enemies. imagine youii just sneak behind a dinosaur lv 99, you approach a pond where you can kill lv 15 struff, cause hey, theyx have to drink too. but if you swim into that lake (pond), then strong predators are waiting for you.
i crushes my soul, how shitty the mmo genre is. not only you have zones, which progress linear. means you have really no business as lv 5 in a lv 30 zone. but also modern mmos dont even have day/night cycles. in another rpgs the enemies get stronger at night etc. nope, not here.
AA leveling is just bad, its a stupid themepark. and i swear i could write 10 pages why i hate mmos of now (themepark).
to the OP:
The difference in AA is, that at max level or say lv 30 the game opens up. AA uses the world meaningful. means you go to older zones to gather stuff, you pass (travel) them by trading etc. wouldnt AA not having this, hell i would never bother.
i really want to like mmo genre. it has the most potential. but it crushes my soul how bad it is.
despite the bizzare logic that Darkfall is like Eve because you have to spend time gaining skill, the reality is it doesnt even matter to this conversation.
So what if Darkfall is cheap carbon copy of Eve. Its still more of an open world than AA is. Oh and the housing is better too. At least you are not so close to your neighboor you are dry humping them just to get to your farm
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
I don't even have to play Darkfall to know your definition of "better" is flawed. I think most would define better based on functionality and features and looks/aesthetics would have NOTHING to do with it. Can you tell me how Darkfall housing is better based on function or purpose when compared to AA housing/farming? Better yet, tell me ANY game that has more functional/useful housing than AA?
IMHO AA has the most complex/fuctional/and rewarding housing system over ANY MMO.
to begin with 'good' is subjective but we have been throwing it around as a factual word.
second, aesthetics is extreemly importnat to me. This is my virtual world, if it wasnt important I would just play a MUD. For me the housing and farms in AA is extreemly tacky and distracting, I feel like I am playing a kids game
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me