For me it was Vanguard. It had everything on my list that I liked but for each item it was only ok, not great, or good, just ok, like they reached a point of good enough and just left it.
Graphics - great environment, but bad characters and animations, running looked so weird.
Housing - it had it but only a few styles.
Interesting classes - mostly but no real way to customize your classes, or make yourself unique.
Flight - this was ok.
Then of course falling through the world and lag and minute long loads every time you cross a chunk line... I kept going back hoping it would be better and while there were definitely less bugs, the game just felt meh.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Ironically it was also the worst MMO I've ever played. Funny how that works.
This. A lot of the other games listed in this thread had a fully funded chance to release and stand on its own. Vanguard on the other hand barely got out of the gate from an SoE defibrillator jolt. All of the money that would have gone to expanding the game after launch was spent just getting it playable, taking out a lot in the process. Sad indeed.
I'm really surprised that no one has mentioned Middle Earth Online yet. A Middle Earth themed fantasy game that was closer to Ultima Online than the WoW-style themepark it turned into? That could have been amazing.
I would have to say Mortal Online most likely. I feel like the crafting system is insanely well thought out, and would work so well in a bug free environment. Also the combat and skill caps were really nice, just the horrible development team will probably never be able to fix it unless they start hiring competent people.
Title should be pretty self-explanatory, but this thread is essentially a thread of ideas. Which MMOs - in their marketing phase - had the most appeal to you?
Vanguard - So many promises of all the right things, all the stuff that eq2 didn't deliver on. The "real eq2" was a popular phrase to use.
Aion - So hyped, or atleast I was.
Teso - Looked real good on paper and dev talks up to the actual product.
Originally posted by Aeander
Which ones brought some cool concepts to the table?
Vanguard - Combat, moving while casting, defensive and offensive targets, blood magic, battler clerics.
Eq2 - Coop combos/finishers, a cool concept although the way eq2 did it was not quite there. Pro-active healing and wards was nice too. Best crafting in any mmorpg.. that is the first year before they messed it up, where it was challenging to create things of high quality, where you needed other players to craft subcomponents, and rares were actually rare, and crafting was a viable play style instead of adventuring.
GW2 - Ten years with no new cool concepts, then GW2 makes dynamic events. A fantastic concept, unfortunately they failed to make it interesting. So much potential in the concept of dynamic events, and I would like to see other games pick it up.to make it interesting. So much potential in the concept of dynamic events, and I would like to see other games pick it up.
Originally posted by Aeander
Which ones would you still use as a good example if you were to design an MMO yourself? Which MMOs, with more talented developers, would push the genre in ways that you'd like to see.
The living breathing world feel from Everquest. That is only all the good things, the faction system, the open world with open dungeons, truly versatile gameplay options, deep lore incorporated into every bit of the world and game, the hidden opportunities and mysteries of unknown drops, keys and access quests to enter zones/areas/doors, coop mechanics with actual roles but making it much less forced and possibility to chose several roles depending on need.
Then I would take eq2's crafting system, or crafting should be meaningful and needed, be challenging. To that I would add coop mechanics, having to rely on others creating components you can't, working together as a crafting group to craft somehing difficult (for example a formula that needs to be done within a time limit and everyone needs to deliver their part).
As an open world I would make it seamless and truly open (no more boxing people in with mountain barriers to keep them on rails). Into that I would put GW2's dynamic events model, but a much improved version that supports the living breathing world aspect better. Events should be something exciting and rare(ish) and have a real effect on the world for a substantial amount of time, perhaps more like EqNext say they will do it.
With all that .... BEGONE STORY DRIVEN THEMEPARK, the game shall put the tools into the players hands and make the players create their stories. And I mean that not only in the sandbox way of thinking, but also that players should actually be able to create adventure for other players, crafters who needs protection to get to places, adventurers needing crafters services, guilds/organizations putting up public requests (quests) for other players, and even player made adventures og some sort maybe like Neverwinters Foundry.
Return of RNGesus, BEGONE LOOT VENDER SYSTEMS. Loot shall be much randomized from drop chances to randomized stats (Diablo 2 style), to hidden opportunities (quest drops). Every players should sit with the feeling that today might be the day I find a really awesome piece of loot. MinMaxers should be given their fix and hunt for those last 1-2 extra percent. Players should be able to look upon another serious player and think, nice gear.. One day I shall have that as well.
I am not fond of trinity in its simple form, but I want roles - Players should support each other and be nudged to play together.. bonuses to working together, still with the option to play solo to some degree. So a skill based system would be a good choice here, and instead of choosing your "class", you choose your role .. or actually, you work on your skills for a certain role, but you can work on several roles at the same time and switch between them dynamically. There shall still be healers, buffers, debuffers, tanks, crowd controlling, pulling, melee, mages, pets and so on, but people can choose which of these roles to pick up depending on the situation (aka who you coop with).
With this kind of skill based mechanic comes a very important thing. There should "never" be endgame, character progression should continue on all levels the game offers, gear and "levels" (in this case skill levels). Like Eq has it's AA system, progression should be virtually endless, and never be only about gear.. skills shall not have a cap, but instead diminishing returns as needed.
Fast travel, yes that is a must (sorry old schoolers, running for 3 hours to get to a group is ruining immersion just as much as gating). There should be some kind of limit, GW2's mechanic for example is horrible, WoW griffon and boat riding is better but not optimal. Also some kind of unlocking system, so you can earn by questing or faction work new gate points.
Combat - I don't have too much preference, but it has to have coop elements with roles, be tactical and therefore reasonably paced (3 bears, not too fast, not too slow, but just right). Like Eq you will not be able to fight nonstop, pauses will be needed to allow GASP actual player communication, although not the ridiculous 2-3 minutes medding-time with nothing to do. Point target, tab target, doesn't really matter to me, as long as it works smoothly.
Hirelings - Yes please, not combat active. But say like sending your hireling to pick up another player, sell goods for you, send orders to your businesses. Yes businesses, players should be able to have various businesses, run shops, taverns, warehouses, crafting stations with special stuff for rent, and much more.
And I could go on, but it's your lucky day .. it's all over now.
Basically, there's was only 2 multiplayer games which I personally had some hope for to have potential. First it was SW:TOR, I had some hopes for it (but not by a huge amount, not after the original SWG) but it isn't easy explaining what those hopes were back then. Something sublime, and yet still profound, a hope to just bring back the feeling like when I was 4 and for the first time watching Star Wars: A New Hope..... Well it didn't, so enough about that.
Biggest hope was Destiny. I watched and read as many trailers, dev talks/interviews and pieces of news I could get my hands on. I loved Halo, so was hoping that Bungie magic coupled with a multiplayer PVE setting could bring a new Sci-Fi themed big open world multiplayer to call home. No barriers, just pure unhindered instantaneous PVE multiplayer action with lots of different activities on the side (including solo play) and good overall and reasonably fast character progression. I didn't mind the PVP aspect of it, back then i had read that it was intended to be completely optional with very few rewards attached.
The light of hope dimmed significantly when I first saw the news that raids was to be only done in organised groups. Then beta hit and the videos came out, and the impressions I had about the zones made it abundantly clear that it was somewhat smaller than expected. And now, after it has been out for a while, it seems to be a bit grindy from all reviews.
Think I still will get around to play it when the PS4 gets cheaper, and then play it occasionally from then on. Seems to be decent for occasional play, but for anything more it doesn't seem to fit the bill.
Only hope now is something I read on a forum chat only a couple of days ago. It might not even be true, haven't been able to find a single thing about it online. Don't know the name even.
Its basically a concept for a multiplayer semi-openworld "dungeon crawler" FPS game, with no loot and NO PVP (just thinking about no PVP makes me bit giddy). That's all the details I know about it at the moment. Considering the no-PVP concept while being a FPS, it will most likely receive a massive amount of flak. So more likely to be a hoax.
Other than SW:TOR because I mean the makers of KOTOR making an online game all of the fan boys should have gone crazy but they did a poor job and basically made it WoW with a Star Wars costume I'm going to take a different approach.
Shadowbane.
I followed the lore and story development of this game long before it was released and it had true potential. A dynamic world with a deep and rich story.
Right now I'm holding onto hope with Star Citizen it looks amazing so far, we'll see if they can pull it off.
Comments
For me it was Vanguard. It had everything on my list that I liked but for each item it was only ok, not great, or good, just ok, like they reached a point of good enough and just left it.
Graphics - great environment, but bad characters and animations, running looked so weird.
Housing - it had it but only a few styles.
Interesting classes - mostly but no real way to customize your classes, or make yourself unique.
Flight - this was ok.
Then of course falling through the world and lag and minute long loads every time you cross a chunk line... I kept going back hoping it would be better and while there were definitely less bugs, the game just felt meh.
This. A lot of the other games listed in this thread had a fully funded chance to release and stand on its own. Vanguard on the other hand barely got out of the gate from an SoE defibrillator jolt. All of the money that would have gone to expanding the game after launch was spent just getting it playable, taking out a lot in the process. Sad indeed.
Vanguard - So many promises of all the right things, all the stuff that eq2 didn't deliver on. The "real eq2" was a popular phrase to use.
Aion - So hyped, or atleast I was.
Teso - Looked real good on paper and dev talks up to the actual product.
Vanguard - Combat, moving while casting, defensive and offensive targets, blood magic, battler clerics.
Eq2 - Coop combos/finishers, a cool concept although the way eq2 did it was not quite there. Pro-active healing and wards was nice too. Best crafting in any mmorpg.. that is the first year before they messed it up, where it was challenging to create things of high quality, where you needed other players to craft subcomponents, and rares were actually rare, and crafting was a viable play style instead of adventuring.
GW2 - Ten years with no new cool concepts, then GW2 makes dynamic events. A fantastic concept, unfortunately they failed to make it interesting. So much potential in the concept of dynamic events, and I would like to see other games pick it up.to make it interesting. So much potential in the concept of dynamic events, and I would like to see other games pick it up.
The living breathing world feel from Everquest. That is only all the good things, the faction system, the open world with open dungeons, truly versatile gameplay options, deep lore incorporated into every bit of the world and game, the hidden opportunities and mysteries of unknown drops, keys and access quests to enter zones/areas/doors, coop mechanics with actual roles but making it much less forced and possibility to chose several roles depending on need.
Then I would take eq2's crafting system, or crafting should be meaningful and needed, be challenging. To that I would add coop mechanics, having to rely on others creating components you can't, working together as a crafting group to craft somehing difficult (for example a formula that needs to be done within a time limit and everyone needs to deliver their part).
As an open world I would make it seamless and truly open (no more boxing people in with mountain barriers to keep them on rails). Into that I would put GW2's dynamic events model, but a much improved version that supports the living breathing world aspect better. Events should be something exciting and rare(ish) and have a real effect on the world for a substantial amount of time, perhaps more like EqNext say they will do it.
With all that .... BEGONE STORY DRIVEN THEMEPARK, the game shall put the tools into the players hands and make the players create their stories. And I mean that not only in the sandbox way of thinking, but also that players should actually be able to create adventure for other players, crafters who needs protection to get to places, adventurers needing crafters services, guilds/organizations putting up public requests (quests) for other players, and even player made adventures og some sort maybe like Neverwinters Foundry.
Return of RNGesus, BEGONE LOOT VENDER SYSTEMS. Loot shall be much randomized from drop chances to randomized stats (Diablo 2 style), to hidden opportunities (quest drops). Every players should sit with the feeling that today might be the day I find a really awesome piece of loot. MinMaxers should be given their fix and hunt for those last 1-2 extra percent. Players should be able to look upon another serious player and think, nice gear.. One day I shall have that as well.
I am not fond of trinity in its simple form, but I want roles - Players should support each other and be nudged to play together.. bonuses to working together, still with the option to play solo to some degree. So a skill based system would be a good choice here, and instead of choosing your "class", you choose your role .. or actually, you work on your skills for a certain role, but you can work on several roles at the same time and switch between them dynamically. There shall still be healers, buffers, debuffers, tanks, crowd controlling, pulling, melee, mages, pets and so on, but people can choose which of these roles to pick up depending on the situation (aka who you coop with).
With this kind of skill based mechanic comes a very important thing. There should "never" be endgame, character progression should continue on all levels the game offers, gear and "levels" (in this case skill levels). Like Eq has it's AA system, progression should be virtually endless, and never be only about gear.. skills shall not have a cap, but instead diminishing returns as needed.
Fast travel, yes that is a must (sorry old schoolers, running for 3 hours to get to a group is ruining immersion just as much as gating). There should be some kind of limit, GW2's mechanic for example is horrible, WoW griffon and boat riding is better but not optimal. Also some kind of unlocking system, so you can earn by questing or faction work new gate points.
Combat - I don't have too much preference, but it has to have coop elements with roles, be tactical and therefore reasonably paced (3 bears, not too fast, not too slow, but just right). Like Eq you will not be able to fight nonstop, pauses will be needed to allow GASP actual player communication, although not the ridiculous 2-3 minutes medding-time with nothing to do. Point target, tab target, doesn't really matter to me, as long as it works smoothly.
Hirelings - Yes please, not combat active. But say like sending your hireling to pick up another player, sell goods for you, send orders to your businesses. Yes businesses, players should be able to have various businesses, run shops, taverns, warehouses, crafting stations with special stuff for rent, and much more.
And I could go on, but it's your lucky day .. it's all over now.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
Basically, there's was only 2 multiplayer games which I personally had some hope for to have potential. First it was SW:TOR, I had some hopes for it (but not by a huge amount, not after the original SWG) but it isn't easy explaining what those hopes were back then. Something sublime, and yet still profound, a hope to just bring back the feeling like when I was 4 and for the first time watching Star Wars: A New Hope..... Well it didn't, so enough about that.
Biggest hope was Destiny. I watched and read as many trailers, dev talks/interviews and pieces of news I could get my hands on. I loved Halo, so was hoping that Bungie magic coupled with a multiplayer PVE setting could bring a new Sci-Fi themed big open world multiplayer to call home. No barriers, just pure unhindered instantaneous PVE multiplayer action with lots of different activities on the side (including solo play) and good overall and reasonably fast character progression. I didn't mind the PVP aspect of it, back then i had read that it was intended to be completely optional with very few rewards attached.
The light of hope dimmed significantly when I first saw the news that raids was to be only done in organised groups. Then beta hit and the videos came out, and the impressions I had about the zones made it abundantly clear that it was somewhat smaller than expected. And now, after it has been out for a while, it seems to be a bit grindy from all reviews.
Think I still will get around to play it when the PS4 gets cheaper, and then play it occasionally from then on. Seems to be decent for occasional play, but for anything more it doesn't seem to fit the bill.
Only hope now is something I read on a forum chat only a couple of days ago. It might not even be true, haven't been able to find a single thing about it online. Don't know the name even.
Its basically a concept for a multiplayer semi-openworld "dungeon crawler" FPS game, with no loot and NO PVP (just thinking about no PVP makes me bit giddy). That's all the details I know about it at the moment. Considering the no-PVP concept while being a FPS, it will most likely receive a massive amount of flak. So more likely to be a hoax.
Neocron.
There is nothing out there now, and there will be nothing out there in the future.
Open PVP.
GvG PVP. (nothing out there beats it)
Crafting (nothing out there now beats it)
Sandbox.
Skills Professions Specialety's (nothing out there now beats it)
You never heard of it, well thats why it failed,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neocron
Other than SW:TOR because I mean the makers of KOTOR making an online game all of the fan boys should have gone crazy but they did a poor job and basically made it WoW with a Star Wars costume I'm going to take a different approach.
Shadowbane.
I followed the lore and story development of this game long before it was released and it had true potential. A dynamic world with a deep and rich story.
Right now I'm holding onto hope with Star Citizen it looks amazing so far, we'll see if they can pull it off.
marvel heroes, Lost Ark, Lineage Eternal, Diablo 3
combo of fun action combat, may be some MMO elements but can be played as solo games ... a good mix of gameplay types, convenience, and action.