Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Oh so that makes it okay? wtf is wrong with some of you guys
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
Yeah but they could give you pretend credits to spend in the store.... Oh wait if we make them pay to test our RMT with real money... we can refuse refunds under the digital sales act.
Nope both GW2 and Landmark used real money with real credit cards. The gems in GW2 you bough and spent in beta, you got the gems back again when the game went live. They needed to test their transaction system. This is common with beta, you test things.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
How is that their problem, though? If you've spent money in a game without knowing whether or not you'll actually like the game, that's just dumb. If you've spent money in the game and grow tired of it, what sort of time have you sunk into the game already? If significant, then is it not money well-spent? You got enjoyment out of it, so who cares? Additionally, even if you DIDN'T want to come back and play that particular game, I'm sure that there would be some way of converting that credit over to Stadium cash so you can spend it in another game, so it would really be like getting double your money. If not, then I'm sure there will be some way to do a trade for cash shop items in order to get your money out.
All-in-all, I don't really see it as a problem unless you sink in that money and it's gone for good.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
Yeah but they could give you pretend credits to spend in the store.... Oh wait if we make them pay to test our RMT with real money... we can refuse refunds under the digital sales act.
Nope both GW2 and Landmark used real money with real credit cards. The gems in GW2 you bough and spent in beta, you got the gems back again when the game went live. They needed to test their transaction system. This is common with beta, you test things.
Umm how many F2P games do S.O.E have... they really need the system testing..pfft fanboy much?
I like the look of the game but some things are questionable.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Oh so that makes it okay? wtf is wrong with some of you guys
In fact, I HOPE this happens. I hope players get fed up with Early Access to the point they stop tolerating it. It is NOT ok. It's a bad business model (great for them tomake money, bad for the health of the industry). It's taking advantage of us, and we are letting them do it. Having RMT during an EA is hardly a big issue. It's optional, it needs to be tested, and if players want to spend the money let them. They know exactly what they're paying for when they buy something in a RMT Shop. And they can only do so much in RMT without a blast of negative reaction from the player base. (most RMT shops today are nothing but services and cosmetics, I couldn't care less if they sold those during EA)
Having an EA at all is the bigger issue. They manipulate us, and misguide us and players are spending money for something they don't really understand and it's having a negative impact on the community and the industry as a whole.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Fast cash grabs does not work with MMOs, the companies that have tried that move, the Cryptic have failed hard. SoE is smarter then that, they want you to stay. Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
This thread is way out of wack. Read up 5 min on SoE F2P policy and its not hard to see they really are fair with how they do things. This type of knee jerk reaction thread is just a lazy post with no backing of facts.
Should you not take responsibility for the decisions that lead you to spend money. Having paid for things you seek to blame another for your decision. Getting quite sick of this constant shirking and whining that goes on.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
Nope, that is why they put this on steam and not sell it direct, You can not get a refund past steam.
Originally posted by kitarad Should you not take responsibility for the decisions that lead you to spend money. Having paid for things you seek to blame another for your decision. Getting quite sick of this constant shirking and whining that goes on.
It is not even out yet, But i love your sig I loved that game... so many fun times.
Access to betas or alphas when you preorder is not buying access to the beta/alpha, it's getting as a bonus to preordering access to them, whatever they call it "collector's edition" or "early access edition" or whatever
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
Nope, that is why they put this on steam and not sell it direct, You can not get a refund past steam.
I said SoE will refund you, buy the game HERE and its risk free, refund you at any time up till launch. (How is SoE to refund money you spent else where?) You are nit picking the point stands, this is a lazy OP post that didnt take time to read the facts. SoE is very fair with their F2P model. I know I have been using it for years. I have been a customer since 1999 and their customer service has never failed to make things right.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
Nope, that is why they put this on steam and not sell it direct, You can not get a refund past steam.
I said SoE will refund you, buy the game HERE and its risk free, refund you at any time up till launch. You are nit picking the point stands, this is a lazy OP post that didnt take time to read the facts. SoE is very fair with their F2P model. I know I have been using it for years. I have been a customer since 1999 and their customer service has never failed to make things right.
This is not landmark, but if you feel it is good to pay RMT in EA all the power to you.
Did landmark offer boxs and keys? Oh no they did not..
Did they say come and pay us to come to pvp events... NO
as you say you have been a "customer since 1999" So what is so fair?
They let all you people who have played EQ come back and see the old chars?
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
Nope, that is why they put this on steam and not sell it direct, You can not get a refund past steam.
I said SoE will refund you, buy the game HERE and its risk free, refund you at any time up till launch. You are nit picking the point stands, this is a lazy OP post that didnt take time to read the facts. SoE is very fair with their F2P model. I know I have been using it for years. I have been a customer since 1999 and their customer service has never failed to make things right.
This is not landmark, but if you feel it is good to pay RMT in EA all the power to you.
Did landmark offer boxs and keys? Oh no they did not..
Did they say come and pay us to come to pvp events... NO
as you say you have been a "customer since 1999" So what is so fair?
They let all you people who have played EQ come back and see the old chars?
Oh yes they are being fair to you.
They don't want money...
So now game companies that want to make money are being unfair? IF they didnt make money there would be no MMOs to play. If you have 1/2 a brain you know F2P is not really F2P. Just means they make money a different way. HERE IS THE FACT. You dont have to pay a red cent. Everything you are upset about is optional. Just wait and hold onto your money and when the game release you can play for free with some limited restrictions. When you are ready to join the big boys and support games you want to keep going, you can start chipping in. Till then, dont get upset with the fact people want to support their games and companies that gives us ways to do so are not unfair or evil.
The biggest point here is that you are not paying to "test" anything. You are buying "Early Access".
There is a difference between a Beta/Alpha Tester and Early Access player who just happens to have access to the game during Alpha and Beta. Throwing the terms "alpha" "beta" and "testing" around is a marketing strategy, nothing more.
You are correct because they won't ask you anything about the game,so they don't care about your input.Also the game WILL as always release with bugs,so what is all the TESTING talk we hear from developers?
Also what if nobody paid to enter these unfinished games,no testing?After all that is what they have been calling them.
You know and i know,they already have a release date set,it releases on that date no matter what condition the game is in.The REAL truth is early paid access is just funding the game BEFORE it is a finished product and imo BEFORE it is deserved because you are by law not allowed to SELL unsatisfactory contents,hence why they call it ..early access testing.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
Nope, that is why they put this on steam and not sell it direct, You can not get a refund past steam.
I said SoE will refund you, buy the game HERE and its risk free, refund you at any time up till launch. You are nit picking the point stands, this is a lazy OP post that didnt take time to read the facts. SoE is very fair with their F2P model. I know I have been using it for years. I have been a customer since 1999 and their customer service has never failed to make things right.
This is not landmark, but if you feel it is good to pay RMT in EA all the power to you.
Did landmark offer boxs and keys? Oh no they did not..
Did they say come and pay us to come to pvp events... NO
as you say you have been a "customer since 1999" So what is so fair?
They let all you people who have played EQ come back and see the old chars?
Oh yes they are being fair to you.
They don't want money...
So now game companies that want to make money are being unfair? IF they didnt make money there would be no MMOs to play. If you have 1/2 a brain you know F2P is not really F2P. Just means they make money a different way. HERE IS THE FACT. You dont have to pay a red cent. Everything you are upset about is optional. Just wait and hold onto your money and when the game release you can play for free with some limited restrictions. When you are ready to join the big boys and support games you want to keep going, you can start chipping in. Till then, dont get upset with the fact people want to support their games and companies that gives us ways to do so are not unfair or evil.
I think the game companies have run the numbers and discovered that most folks who got into Betas didn't doing much real testing, but were just there 'racing for the fresh meat'. Since the companies are run by business geeks, they'll try monetizing any and every thing. Turns out this is something that works, so they continue to do it.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Originally posted by Arglebargle I think the game companies have run the numbers and discovered that most folks who got into Betas didn't doing much real testing, but were just there 'racing for the fresh meat'. Since the companies are run by business geeks, they'll try monetizing any and every thing. Turns out this is something that works, so they continue to do it.
The only real vote gamers has is their money. We have made paid beta testing a thing, we have made cash shops be a thing. I dont care what payment model a game uses, as long as its fair. Like WoW's cash shop, I never need spend a dime there if I dont want to. GW2 cash shop, again very fair system. FF 14 sub that lets you play 1 char for 12 bucks a month, again being fair. SoE's all access for 15 bucks a month, great deal. More companies need to do this.
Oh my S.O.E how you have lost it... Just go back to subs we all get fair deals that way.
They have a subscription, for $15 you get all access to every game in their library. H1Z1 will have some sort of subscription that'll be part of all access, and you still get 500 station cash each month.
That is a fair deal to all the game they have, but do we get the 500 in h1z1 as it is EA?
H1Z1 is SOE not EA.
Wake up - In this thread EA is Early Access, ya know, what this whole thread is about, not Electronic Arts DUH!
Anyway on topic... For $20 I'll certainly give this a look.. Been watching some of the streams over the last few days and find it interesting... And OP please get rid of your computer and give up gaming... Do we needs idiots starting posts about this subject every time a company sells EA??
Buy it or don't buy it... Your choice..... Just stop it with these brain dead posts !!!!
Originally posted by Arglebargle I think the game companies have run the numbers and discovered that most folks who got into Betas didn't doing much real testing, but were just there 'racing for the fresh meat'. Since the companies are run by business geeks, they'll try monetizing any and every thing. Turns out this is something that works, so they continue to do it.
The only real vote gamers has is their money. We have made paid beta testing a thing, we have made cash shops be a thing. I dont care what payment model a game uses, as long as its fair. Like WoW's cash shop, I never need spend a dime there if I dont want to. GW2 cash shop, again very fair system. FF 14 sub that lets you play 1 char for 12 bucks a month, again being fair. SoE's all access for 15 bucks a month, great deal. More companies need to do this.
I agree with your view on models.
As far as paid betas go, it's unfortunate that you're right, we have made it a thing. However, there's actually very little testing going on at all. Betas and, even more so, Alphas used to rely on exclusivity alone in order to get testing out of the participants. You actually felt like you were special because they could have chosen anyone, but they picked you! There were also expectations that came along with it. You were expected to log bugs, you were expected to be knowledgeable about the product and process. It really was work! Now, you pay your $20, download it, play it for 15 minutes, call it a buggy mess and move along because you have no reason to give them your time and effort, why would you? They "took" your $20 from you and gave you a piece of crap, so you owe them nothing. That's about the delta in thought process between the "good ole days" and today. So, if we want to blame anyone for the current state of quality in games, gamers could be just as responsible as the developers themselves.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Oh so that makes it okay? wtf is wrong with some of you guys
Of course it's okay, it's called targeting consumers. In the above threads it's targeting short term impulse gamers. I am guessing you never ran a business or took a business course?
SOE is a corporation. It stays afloat on profits. If you think any game company makes games for charity, you are fooling yourself. Nothing is Free, not even Free to Play.
Originally posted by Arglebargle I think the game companies have run the numbers and discovered that most folks who got into Betas didn't doing much real testing, but were just there 'racing for the fresh meat'. Since the companies are run by business geeks, they'll try monetizing any and every thing. Turns out this is something that works, so they continue to do it.
The only real vote gamers has is their money. We have made paid beta testing a thing, we have made cash shops be a thing. I dont care what payment model a game uses, as long as its fair. Like WoW's cash shop, I never need spend a dime there if I dont want to. GW2 cash shop, again very fair system. FF 14 sub that lets you play 1 char for 12 bucks a month, again being fair. SoE's all access for 15 bucks a month, great deal. More companies need to do this.
I agree with your view on models.
As far as paid betas go, it's unfortunate that you're right, we have made it a thing. However, there's actually very little testing going on at all. Betas and, even more so, Alphas used to rely on exclusivity alone in order to get testing out of the participants. You actually felt like you were special because they could have chosen anyone, but they picked you! There were also expectations that came along with it. You were expected to log bugs, you were expected to be knowledgeable about the product and process. It really was work! Now, you pay your $20, download it, play it for 15 minutes, call it a buggy mess and move along because you have no reason to give them your time and effort, why would you? They "took" your $20 from you and gave you a piece of crap, so you owe them nothing. That's about the delta in thought process between the "good ole days" and today. So, if we want to blame anyone for the current state of quality in games, gamers could be just as responsible as the developers themselves.
Originally posted by Ontblod Oh noes, 20 dollars, where and how can I dig up that huge amount of money....
It is not about the base fee, more about the RMT in EA.
GW2 did it and Landmark. They need to test their RMT as well. When beta ended everyone that tested got their gems again to spend or in the case of Landmark, you get the items back again in live. Testing requires all systems tested.
EA = Early Access (gotchya the lack of a preposition confused me)
GW2 gave you free gems to spend during Alpha and Beta. And any gems you bought with real money during Alpha/Beta were given back to you at release.
Landmark is doing the same thing. Since Landmark is SOE, then it's probably going to be the case here as well.
Yes, it's fair to assume that you will have all your credits/items restored once the game launches.
Selling the items during EA has less to do with testing than it has with taking advantage of impulse spending. People WILL spend real money on items during Early Access if given the chance. Promising them a full re-set of store credits at launch makes that spending even more likely.
Many people may grow tired of the game during EA/alpha/beta. They won't be around after launch to spend money in the Cash Shop, so you have to catch them as early as possible. Once they've spent the money, it doesn't matter what happens after that.
Oh so that makes it okay? wtf is wrong with some of you guys
Of course it's okay, it's called targeting consumers. In the above threads it's targeting short term impulse gamers. I am guessing you never ran a business or took a business course?
SOE is a corporation. It stays afloat on profits. If you think any game company makes games for charity, you are fooling yourself. Nothing is Free, not even Free to Play.
Marketing and Advertising essentially hinge on exploiting and manipulating human psychology. It is part of everyday life.
In the case of SOE, they generally offer one of the best F2P experiences around. They are also unusually good with refund policies (in Landmark anyways). However, that doesn't mean they won't use the "standard tricks" when it comes to persuading players to part with their cash.
SOE are a business, therefore they need to show healthy and growing) profits. The shareholders will accept nothing less.
The biggest point here is that you are not paying to "test" anything. You are buying "Early Access".
There is a difference between a Beta/Alpha Tester and Early Access player who just happens to have access to the game during Alpha and Beta. Throwing the terms "alpha" "beta" and "testing" around is a marketing strategy, nothing more.
Honestly we are splitting hairs here and it is all a matter of perspective. Game companies have realized that the MMO market has been so poor lately, that people are grasping at anything and willing to pay for something that traditionally they received payment for (that payment being free early access if they agreed to beta test a developers game).
So yeah, depending on your perspective, it is PAY to ALPHA or BETA test because that is exactly what you are doing. Buying early access as you put it is just another one of those marking terms and strategies that covers up what it really is.
Now here is the thing. You really can't complain about this marketing strategy because lets face it, it wouldn't exist if people weren't willing to pay for it.
And I can complain about marking strategy. But I'm not complaining about the industry cornering a vulnerable market, that's business. I'm complaining that the players are in the dark of what's going on. "Ignorant" has a negative connotation and I don't want to insult my fellow players but most of them buy into it so willingly. they're sheep. you're right. People are willing to pay for it. But it's shady and makes me dissapointed in developers. Why manipulate the market like that? It's like Photoshop in Fashion. They're taking an ignorant mass, flipping a few coin phrases "alpha" "beta" "test" "early" all marketing Hot words and making money off of it. Which, I'd be fine with if that money was being used to deliver something worth while. But no, they're making millions off the backs of ignorant and desperate players and they aren't delivering. MMO after MMO of generic template trash.
^^ Exactly this. Unfortunately, this is what Dave Georgeson, under the guidance of Smed, has devolved SOE into over these last 5 years. It's like a carney show over there, with the compelling, over-glitzy gleeman trying oh so hard to hook the ignorant and desperate to buy their snake oil. Under scrutiny (and really, it doesn't take much) their intent and goals are clear, allowing you to see the cheaply made and mediocre product beneath a glossy veneer.
I used to be a SOE fan. I shook that company off like a clod under my shoe after seeing what they've become. No wonder they report yearly losses in the millions and have had massive layoffs. Now they're just getting desperate, and have fully embraced the cheese that is their new marketing and pricing strategy.
The biggest point here is that you are not paying to "test" anything. You are buying "Early Access".
There is a difference between a Beta/Alpha Tester and Early Access player who just happens to have access to the game during Alpha and Beta. Throwing the terms "alpha" "beta" and "testing" around is a marketing strategy, nothing more.
Honestly we are splitting hairs here and it is all a matter of perspective. Game companies have realized that the MMO market has been so poor lately, that people are grasping at anything and willing to pay for something that traditionally they received payment for (that payment being free early access if they agreed to beta test a developers game).
So yeah, depending on your perspective, it is PAY to ALPHA or BETA test because that is exactly what you are doing. Buying early access as you put it is just another one of those marking terms and strategies that covers up what it really is.
Now here is the thing. You really can't complain about this marketing strategy because lets face it, it wouldn't exist if people weren't willing to pay for it.
And I can complain about marking strategy. But I'm not complaining about the industry cornering a vulnerable market, that's business. I'm complaining that the players are in the dark of what's going on. "Ignorant" has a negative connotation and I don't want to insult my fellow players but most of them buy into it so willingly. they're sheep. you're right. People are willing to pay for it. But it's shady and makes me dissapointed in developers. Why manipulate the market like that? It's like Photoshop in Fashion. They're taking an ignorant mass, flipping a few coin phrases "alpha" "beta" "test" "early" all marketing Hot words and making money off of it. Which, I'd be fine with if that money was being used to deliver something worth while. But no, they're making millions off the backs of ignorant and desperate players and they aren't delivering. MMO after MMO of generic template trash.
^^ Exactly this. Unfortunately, this is what Dave Georgeson, under the guidance of Smed, has devolved SOE into over these last 5 years. It's like a carney show over there, with the compelling, over-glitzy gleeman trying oh so hard to hook the ignorant and desperate to buy their snake oil. Under scrutiny (and really, it doesn't take much) their intent and goals are clear, allowing you to see the cheaply made and mediocre product beneath a glossy veneer.
I used to be a SOE fan. I shook that company off like a clod under my shoe after seeing what they've become. No wonder they report yearly losses in the millions and have had massive layoffs. Now they're just getting desperate, and have fully embraced the cheese that is their new marketing and pricing strategy.
Again people make these declarative statements, 52 million in development costs for EqNext AND H1Z1
Comments
Oh so that makes it okay? wtf is wrong with some of you guys
Nope both GW2 and Landmark used real money with real credit cards. The gems in GW2 you bough and spent in beta, you got the gems back again when the game went live. They needed to test their transaction system. This is common with beta, you test things.
How is that their problem, though? If you've spent money in a game without knowing whether or not you'll actually like the game, that's just dumb. If you've spent money in the game and grow tired of it, what sort of time have you sunk into the game already? If significant, then is it not money well-spent? You got enjoyment out of it, so who cares? Additionally, even if you DIDN'T want to come back and play that particular game, I'm sure that there would be some way of converting that credit over to Stadium cash so you can spend it in another game, so it would really be like getting double your money. If not, then I'm sure there will be some way to do a trade for cash shop items in order to get your money out.
All-in-all, I don't really see it as a problem unless you sink in that money and it's gone for good.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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Umm how many F2P games do S.O.E have... they really need the system testing..pfft fanboy much?
I like the look of the game but some things are questionable.
In fact, I HOPE this happens. I hope players get fed up with Early Access to the point they stop tolerating it. It is NOT ok. It's a bad business model (great for them tomake money, bad for the health of the industry). It's taking advantage of us, and we are letting them do it. Having RMT during an EA is hardly a big issue. It's optional, it needs to be tested, and if players want to spend the money let them. They know exactly what they're paying for when they buy something in a RMT Shop. And they can only do so much in RMT without a blast of negative reaction from the player base. (most RMT shops today are nothing but services and cosmetics, I couldn't care less if they sold those during EA)
Having an EA at all is the bigger issue. They manipulate us, and misguide us and players are spending money for something they don't really understand and it's having a negative impact on the community and the industry as a whole.
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Live a life less ordinary.
Fast cash grabs does not work with MMOs, the companies that have tried that move, the Cryptic have failed hard. SoE is smarter then that, they want you to stay. Matter of fact with Landmark, early access fee you pay can be refunded right up till launch. The fee is just to get people who want to test but just stick their heads in and take off. Seeing this is SoE's game I am sure they will make the same stand.
This thread is way out of wack. Read up 5 min on SoE F2P policy and its not hard to see they really are fair with how they do things. This type of knee jerk reaction thread is just a lazy post with no backing of facts.
Nope, that is why they put this on steam and not sell it direct, You can not get a refund past steam.
It is not even out yet, But i love your sig I loved that game... so many fun times.
Access to betas or alphas when you preorder is not buying access to the beta/alpha, it's getting as a bonus to preordering access to them, whatever they call it "collector's edition" or "early access edition" or whatever
I said SoE will refund you, buy the game HERE and its risk free, refund you at any time up till launch. (How is SoE to refund money you spent else where?) You are nit picking the point stands, this is a lazy OP post that didnt take time to read the facts. SoE is very fair with their F2P model. I know I have been using it for years. I have been a customer since 1999 and their customer service has never failed to make things right.
This is not landmark, but if you feel it is good to pay RMT in EA all the power to you.
Did landmark offer boxs and keys? Oh no they did not..
Did they say come and pay us to come to pvp events... NO
as you say you have been a "customer since 1999" So what is so fair?
They let all you people who have played EQ come back and see the old chars?
Oh yes they are being fair to you.
They don't want money...
So now game companies that want to make money are being unfair? IF they didnt make money there would be no MMOs to play. If you have 1/2 a brain you know F2P is not really F2P. Just means they make money a different way. HERE IS THE FACT. You dont have to pay a red cent. Everything you are upset about is optional. Just wait and hold onto your money and when the game release you can play for free with some limited restrictions. When you are ready to join the big boys and support games you want to keep going, you can start chipping in. Till then, dont get upset with the fact people want to support their games and companies that gives us ways to do so are not unfair or evil.
You are correct because they won't ask you anything about the game,so they don't care about your input.Also the game WILL as always release with bugs,so what is all the TESTING talk we hear from developers?
Also what if nobody paid to enter these unfinished games,no testing?After all that is what they have been calling them.
You know and i know,they already have a release date set,it releases on that date no matter what condition the game is in.The REAL truth is early paid access is just funding the game BEFORE it is a finished product and imo BEFORE it is deserved because you are by law not allowed to SELL unsatisfactory contents,hence why they call it ..early access testing.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
If you say so.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
The only real vote gamers has is their money. We have made paid beta testing a thing, we have made cash shops be a thing. I dont care what payment model a game uses, as long as its fair. Like WoW's cash shop, I never need spend a dime there if I dont want to. GW2 cash shop, again very fair system. FF 14 sub that lets you play 1 char for 12 bucks a month, again being fair. SoE's all access for 15 bucks a month, great deal. More companies need to do this.
Wake up - In this thread EA is Early Access, ya know, what this whole thread is about, not Electronic Arts DUH!
Anyway on topic... For $20 I'll certainly give this a look.. Been watching some of the streams over the last few days and find it interesting... And OP please get rid of your computer and give up gaming... Do we needs idiots starting posts about this subject every time a company sells EA??
Buy it or don't buy it... Your choice..... Just stop it with these brain dead posts !!!!
@Op and some other crybabies
No tears will help, just freaking stop buying early access games if you think it's wrong and stop crying.
I agree with your view on models.
As far as paid betas go, it's unfortunate that you're right, we have made it a thing. However, there's actually very little testing going on at all. Betas and, even more so, Alphas used to rely on exclusivity alone in order to get testing out of the participants. You actually felt like you were special because they could have chosen anyone, but they picked you! There were also expectations that came along with it. You were expected to log bugs, you were expected to be knowledgeable about the product and process. It really was work! Now, you pay your $20, download it, play it for 15 minutes, call it a buggy mess and move along because you have no reason to give them your time and effort, why would you? They "took" your $20 from you and gave you a piece of crap, so you owe them nothing. That's about the delta in thought process between the "good ole days" and today. So, if we want to blame anyone for the current state of quality in games, gamers could be just as responsible as the developers themselves.
Crazkanuk
----------------
Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
----------------
Of course it's okay, it's called targeting consumers. In the above threads it's targeting short term impulse gamers. I am guessing you never ran a business or took a business course?
SOE is a corporation. It stays afloat on profits. If you think any game company makes games for charity, you are fooling yourself. Nothing is Free, not even Free to Play.
+1
Marketing and Advertising essentially hinge on exploiting and manipulating human psychology. It is part of everyday life.
In the case of SOE, they generally offer one of the best F2P experiences around. They are also unusually good with refund policies (in Landmark anyways). However, that doesn't mean they won't use the "standard tricks" when it comes to persuading players to part with their cash.
SOE are a business, therefore they need to show healthy and growing) profits. The shareholders will accept nothing less.
^^ Exactly this. Unfortunately, this is what Dave Georgeson, under the guidance of Smed, has devolved SOE into over these last 5 years. It's like a carney show over there, with the compelling, over-glitzy gleeman trying oh so hard to hook the ignorant and desperate to buy their snake oil. Under scrutiny (and really, it doesn't take much) their intent and goals are clear, allowing you to see the cheaply made and mediocre product beneath a glossy veneer.
I used to be a SOE fan. I shook that company off like a clod under my shoe after seeing what they've become. No wonder they report yearly losses in the millions and have had massive layoffs. Now they're just getting desperate, and have fully embraced the cheese that is their new marketing and pricing strategy.
Again people make these declarative statements, 52 million in development costs for EqNext AND H1Z1
( per their 2014 income report. http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielnyegriffiths/2014/05/14/sony-fy-2014-earnings-winning-the-console-battle-losing-the-profits-war/ )
is not bad at all or are you going to claim its bad business to invest in a game development?