And apparently not knowing how to use forums either that you had to make three separate posts.
And apparently you have never visited this website on a mobile device. The interface is disgusting on mobile and even made a topic about how mobile unfriendly this website is which is completely unacceptable nowadays but it got ignored of course! I personally visit this website mostly on the go when travelling so 99% of the time I am using a mobile device to read it or write posts.
@OP, well there are a few games I personally like. Now I have long got over the desire to have 1 game to rule them all and play it like crazy. I just hop around. At the moment I play about 5-7 hours a week and if you can believe it I play FFXIV and ESO with the odd mobile game. I am now even trying Skyforge. Due to my limited playtime I never ever run out of content.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
The market is extremely sad right now unless you enjoy gw2/eso/other casualfests because theres a ton of them out there. If you want to raid you have two games to choose from. If you want a sandbox you have no real options outside of EVE (which nobody is going to start playing now because no one wants to wait for real time skills). This genre needs saving.
Let's get this straight the genre of MMORPG's is not dead. The genre is just not what you and many others want it to be. Which honestly the only thing alot of you guys seem to want is like EQ 1 HD edition, or a remake of whatever 15-20 year old game that you played when you first learned what an MMORPG is. I get it we all have our favorite games and nostalgia is really strong.
However where you guys lose me is that NOTHING will make you happy with MMORPG's at this point. Every single game for ever will be 'meh' or you'll nit pick and tear apart any game that isn't EXACTLY what you want it to be. Then on top of that you go the condescending old man on any one who enjoys anything newer than like 2005. It's like nothing makes you happy so therefore anyone else who is happy is just some stupid kid.
I haven't consistantly played any one mmo in a long time, I can agree that the genre doesn't grab me like it did when I was younger. Just at some point if nothing makes you excited w/ MMORPG's any more, and the genre is dead to you then just go play something else. It's easier for your sanity and everyone else's.
Ok, really getting tired of this insane accusation.
We do NOT NOT NOT want it to be like EQ1. We want what was promised to us when the genre came out. Real fleshed out worlds. In depth Crafting. Great Housing. We don't want zoning into every area because it's extremely immersion breaking. And we want to be everything under the sun including a proper musician, or a house builder, or a real carpenter. EQ1 didn't offer those things. Mind you, what it did offer was a reason to group together and talk to other players and a seriously gigantic world to explore, something that modern MMO's DON'T. Of course, modern MMO's also don't offer anything else of what I listed either.
We want the next step in games, not to take two steps back. We want Next Gen, like we were promised. But not a single game released in the last ten years offers us Next Gen and hasn't.
So stop accusing us all of wanting to go back in time. We want things to get better, not to be so easy anyone can do them completely alone, and not to be so hard that they can only be done by grouping, and so that they ONLY offer theme park MMO's until you hit the end where you raid for endless hours and pvp where you do nothing but beat on each other for endless hours (which is usually like just beating on npc's with some occasional chatter that you can respond to unless they become harassing).
I blame WoW and LOTRO for all this. Before LOTRO the them park game was never heard of just like before WoW, we didn't have baby friendly MMO's.
Previous games that were much loved by the community did things right. And we repeatedly mention them over and over and over again. They didn't have everything but they were better than they are now. For gods sakes, SWG had entertainer classes so varied that it allowed you to created whole cantina bands with other players, and whole classes devoted to building and maintaining housing and the items in it. Have you ever seen another game offer alternative classes than the ones that beat the crap out of others? Why would they remove these from the GENRE completely when they were so loved by the players? The answer is that the devs and publishers are just looking for a quick buck. We have less offered to us now than we did during EQ1, EQ2, and SWG and we are told that we should just shut up and be happy. Well I'm not going to shut up and I'm not happy. The genre is slowly being destroyed due to greed for money.
What the devs and publishers don't get is that the genre is already suffering for their greed and it will only get worse.
So how about YOU stop making excuses and blaming us for wanting to make the genre better instead of us asking for more and YOU start doing the same thing? Facebook is only to pass the time when you are bored, it is NOT the way the whole game industry should go. In every other industry, they try to advance things and make things better. In THIS industry, we are told to live with what we have and be happy be have it.
I had a really long, mostly mean post written here. I deleted it because I don't want to come off as a completely jerk. I've got a few thoughts.
I think you're confusing promised and dreamed. I remember the early days of MMORPG's and MUDS and how exciting it was to dream of those things. I don't ever remember a DEV promising they could do all those things.
Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. Can you really blame big developers for not taking up multi-million, multi-year projects that are almost certain to lose money.
The MMORPG has advanced a lot in the past 20 years. It's turned into something the older generation doesn't quite like, but my main point was it really seems to me that all we do is hate on everything, and most of us don't seem to really enjoy anything. I don't blame devs for abandoning us at all, we aren't putting our money where our keyboards are. The younger generation, or the ones who have adapted to the new stuff well apparently they are because there are a lot of games right now that this site hates on constantly that seem to be making money.
To me the MMORPG genre has always been about getting into a world and committing to it, and living in it making relationships with others who have. Unfortunately both by game design and just where our culture is at in terms of the internet trolls, it's gotten harder. However there really are a ton of games, both themepark and sandbox that we could choose to do that in, we just don't because 'insert' flaw.
Originally posted by Hariken I went back to my old favorites. Cleaned out my PC of all the hyped up junk mmo's. Probably should stop coming to sites like this too. Getting hyped up for what turns out to be just bad games Skyforge being the last one. That game really opened my eyes that being sucked by hype for bad games is all sites like this do sometimes. The MMO players that love what they play don't come to sites like this.
Originally posted by Daikuru Blade and Soul and Black Desert, also Lineage Eternal and Lost Ark are not far away.
No thanks. B&S is dull, Black Desert will go the same route as ArcheAge, Lineage Eternal is just an L1 sequel Diablo-like wannabe and Lost Ark is another Diablo online wannabe.
As the OS has stated, there are no good MMO's in the near or distant future. Only thing current MMO's offer is P2W cast shops.
Any decent MMO's coming up that are not Farmville or top-down isometric based?
What is dull about Blade and Soul? Please tell me exactly. Oh you must be a prophet, please tell me more, seriously...maybe, maybe not, you cant say that yet. LE and LA are both open world MMOs, so they are NOT Diablo clones.
B&S is fun for a while but uses the same system Swtor use for story telling (instanced and personal) , and the zones arent "open" , more like little zones with corridors to connect .... the combat is cool , but outside that ......"meh".
and no prophet u can play it ...on rus servers
I played BD on KR for weeks, and the game was "cool" but is the same as AA , no content for groups ( no dungeons) , combat is awesome , but gets repetitive realllly fast ....imho it wont do well on west market , but who knows :P
Let's get this straight the genre of MMORPG's is not dead. The genre is just not what you and many others want it to be. Which honestly the only thing alot of you guys seem to want is like EQ 1 HD edition, or a remake of whatever 15-20 year old game that you played when you first learned what an MMORPG is. I get it we all have our favorite games and nostalgia is really strong.
However where you guys lose me is that NOTHING will make you happy with MMORPG's at this point. Every single game for ever will be 'meh' or you'll nit pick and tear apart any game that isn't EXACTLY what you want it to be. Then on top of that you go the condescending old man on any one who enjoys anything newer than like 2005. It's like nothing makes you happy so therefore anyone else who is happy is just some stupid kid.
I haven't consistantly played any one mmo in a long time, I can agree that the genre doesn't grab me like it did when I was younger. Just at some point if nothing makes you excited w/ MMORPG's any more, and the genre is dead to you then just go play something else. It's easier for your sanity and everyone else's.
Ok, really getting tired of this insane accusation.
We do NOT NOT NOT want it to be like EQ1. We want what was promised to us when the genre came out. Real fleshed out worlds. In depth Crafting. Great Housing. We don't want zoning into every area because it's extremely immersion breaking. And we want to be everything under the sun including a proper musician, or a house builder, or a real carpenter. EQ1 didn't offer those things. Mind you, what it did offer was a reason to group together and talk to other players and a seriously gigantic world to explore, something that modern MMO's DON'T. Of course, modern MMO's also don't offer anything else of what I listed either.
We want the next step in games, not to take two steps back. We want Next Gen, like we were promised. But not a single game released in the last ten years offers us Next Gen and hasn't.
So stop accusing us all of wanting to go back in time. We want things to get better, not to be so easy anyone can do them completely alone, and not to be so hard that they can only be done by grouping, and so that they ONLY offer theme park MMO's until you hit the end where you raid for endless hours and pvp where you do nothing but beat on each other for endless hours (which is usually like just beating on npc's with some occasional chatter that you can respond to unless they become harassing).
I blame WoW and LOTRO for all this. Before LOTRO the them park game was never heard of just like before WoW, we didn't have baby friendly MMO's.
Previous games that were much loved by the community did things right. And we repeatedly mention them over and over and over again. They didn't have everything but they were better than they are now. For gods sakes, SWG had entertainer classes so varied that it allowed you to created whole cantina bands with other players, and whole classes devoted to building and maintaining housing and the items in it. Have you ever seen another game offer alternative classes than the ones that beat the crap out of others? Why would they remove these from the GENRE completely when they were so loved by the players? The answer is that the devs and publishers are just looking for a quick buck. We have less offered to us now than we did during EQ1, EQ2, and SWG and we are told that we should just shut up and be happy. Well I'm not going to shut up and I'm not happy. The genre is slowly being destroyed due to greed for money.
What the devs and publishers don't get is that the genre is already suffering for their greed and it will only get worse.
So how about YOU stop making excuses and blaming us for wanting to make the genre better instead of us asking for more and YOU start doing the same thing? Facebook is only to pass the time when you are bored, it is NOT the way the whole game industry should go. In every other industry, they try to advance things and make things better. In THIS industry, we are told to live with what we have and be happy be have it.
I had a really long, mostly mean post written here. I deleted it because I don't want to come off as a completely jerk. I've got a few thoughts.
I think you're confusing promised and dreamed. I remember the early days of MMORPG's and MUDS and how exciting it was to dream of those things. I don't ever remember a DEV promising they could do all those things.
Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. Can you really blame big developers for not taking up multi-million, multi-year projects that are almost certain to lose money.
The MMORPG has advanced a lot in the past 20 years. It's turned into something the older generation doesn't quite like, but my main point was it really seems to me that all we do is hate on everything, and most of us don't seem to really enjoy anything. I don't blame devs for abandoning us at all, we aren't putting our money where our keyboards are. The younger generation, or the ones who have adapted to the new stuff well apparently they are because there are a lot of games right now that this site hates on constantly that seem to be making money.
To me the MMORPG genre has always been about getting into a world and committing to it, and living in it making relationships with others who have. Unfortunately both by game design and just where our culture is at in terms of the internet trolls, it's gotten harder. However there really are a ton of games, both themepark and sandbox that we could choose to do that in, we just don't because 'insert' flaw.
Your reply is ridiculous.
What you are saying is: 'We should be grateful for what we are given, even if it's not what we have been asking for. We should make the best of what others choose to sell us, however bad it is".
Pfft... what are you not looking forward to Project Gorgon??!!?? I hear if you donate $100 to the kick starter they will send you a time machine so you can go back in time to when this game would be awesome.
I get it though, I don't agree with running around being pissed off that I'm not getting exactly what I want all the time so I must definititely be a brainwashed communist, with no education, or friends.
Hey you know what I'm not even trying to stop you from running around all pissy your whole life because you think thats the cool thing to do. You should definitely not be grateful for anything, good or bad thats obviously the best way to be.
Right? Apparently if you're not pissed off and are enjoying the newer mmorpgs, you're not a true mmorpg gamer and is brainwashed(like you said) on these forums. Seems like it's the other way around to me. These sole called true mmorpg gamers seem so brainwashed by the past they can't let go.
Originally posted by Daikuru Blade and Soul and Black Desert, also Lineage Eternal and Lost Ark are not far away.
Looking forward to them all. People who already dismiss games that have not even released don't deserve anything to play.
There is this brand new invention that allows gamers to read information released by the developers, watch officially release videos (some not so official), and provide details about these games and other products for consumers to decide if they like/want something BEFORE we waste money on it. Perhaps you've heard of it, it's only been around in one form or another since 01 JAN 1983 and the name we now know it by was coined in 1990 by Tim Berners-Lee. In case that isn't enough to figure it out, its the World Wide Web, the Web, or just plane ole "the internet". I would hope you have because you used it to make this post.
I agree with the OP because I have researched these games on my own utilizing the above brand new shiny invention. I also am very much aware of what my likes and dislikes are and I can say that I won't play any of them. Why? Because I don't have to try everything out to know if I will like it or not. I try not to prove the Thomas Tusser quote as a truism in my life. If you are not aware of him or which quote I am referring to, it goes like this: A fool and his money are soon parted.
Maybe I'll miss the next great thing and maybe not. It won't bother me in the least bit because I don't have to buy every game coming out because I've researched them and they aren't my cup of tea.
There are a couple things going on here. The so-called newer MMO's are basically all the same, and those who want something different in gameplay recognize that. They are playing the game itself and are bored with the old gameplay that the current gen of MMO's deliver.
Those who like the current crop of MMO's are playing a somewhat different game. They are competing in the metagame (competition ladders, etc.) and are not as concerned with the repetitive nature of these database-driven MMO's.
The clash between the two groups is partially due to people approaching and playing games for completely different reasons. Many people are not interested in the kind of social milieu gaming that these current MMO's depend on to draw in players. This kind of jostling aspect where people are rather adversarial at all times is a big difference from the older MMO's, which did not have the competition as a main selling point. This also coincides more or less with the age group of the players, where the 20 somethings are more interested in creating pecking orders within their groups and then butting up against other people.
Current MMO's represent a failure to advance the genre. People who have played a variety of games through the years tend to be able to see that there are more ways to make games than what is commonly accepted as THE way to make MMO's. The definition of MMO is completely different between the two groups.
For people to desire a different sort of gameplay is not a slight against the people who enjoy the current crop of MMO's. There can be more than one kind of game called MMO, we don't all have to jam into some narrow paradigm. Those who attack people who desire a broader range of game style in the market are misguided. Nobody should be threatened by variety or worried that more choices are going to be available in the future.
The 'failure to advance the genre' is a hilarious point to make. LFG / decent story / phasing / dynamic events / choices in story etc are all things that are new.
Whether someone personally likes the new things or not is irrelevant.
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
I'm on my phone. You can't edit posts from the phone.
I didn't say what is being offered is a good thing. I didn't say it wad a bad thing. I said many people didn't like old ones and many people fo like new ones. Therefore asking for what you advocate for would not make everyone happy, only the people who like what you are advocating for.
And no you weren't promised anything. Not even in any particular game ad the eula clearly shows.
They offered you a game. That's it. They started the game may change. They expressed their hopes and desires for what the future might hold.
But no you were not promised anything. That is just your assumption.
Yes many are angry. Yes many are happy. Welcome to the world.edit - now I'm on my pc. And I didn't blame you for anything, or tell you to shut up or anything like that.edit - and I'm pretty sure almost everything I stated is true:I am 39 (turn 40 in December) - at least according to my birth certificate. I was around way back in 1997. Many do like the games you advocate for, many people don't. Therefore the genre heading in that direction would not make everyone happy. You did discuss the direction you would like to see - admittedly this part may not be true and just what I perceive from your posts.edit - sheesh a lot of edit. I will say that I generally agree with the thread title. I'm not really excited about anything in the mmo genre right now. That however doesn't mean they are bad, it just means they don't appeal to my particular tastes, at least not anymore.
Actually Venge you can edit from your phone. Scroll to the bottom of the page and two the go to full website. I'm on a cross country move and use it myself.
"Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. "
I don't think it's greedy devs or fickle players. If you parse the posts of players there are clearly *multiple* player segments who prioritize different things. It's not one person wanting two different things it's two people wanting two different things.
If you make a list of those segments some are mutually contradictory but most aren't and most could be accommodated within the same game if was designed in that way to begin with.
I think it's mainly a problem of dev perception i.e. aiming for a *single* average player type (and then picking the type that makes the most noise) rather than looking at it like a jigsaw puzzle where they try and slot many different player types into the same game.
"Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. "
I don't think it's greedy devs or fickle players. If you parse the posts of players there are clearly *multiple* player segments who prioritize different things. It's not one person wanting two different things it's two people wanting two different things.
If you make a list of those segments some are mutually contradictory but most aren't and most could be accommodated within the same game if was designed in that way to begin with.
I think it's mainly a problem of dev perception i.e. aiming for a *single* average player type (and then picking the type that makes the most noise) rather than looking at it like a jigsaw puzzle where they try and slot many different player types into the same game.
you very well could be right sir. To clarify what I meant about fickle is just that it seems like most mmorpg players including myself jump from game to game to game at a crazy pace. Maybe I'm wrong. I think you have a good point though.
Ok, really getting tired of this insane accusation.
We do NOT NOT NOT want it to be like EQ1. We want what was promised to us when the genre came out. Real fleshed out worlds. In depth Crafting. Great Housing. We don't want zoning into every area because it's extremely immersion breaking. And we want to be everything under the sun including a proper musician, or a house builder, or a real carpenter. EQ1 didn't offer those things. Mind you, what it did offer was a reason to group together and talk to other players and a seriously gigantic world to explore, something that modern MMO's DON'T. Of course, modern MMO's also don't offer anything else of what I listed either.
We want the next step in games, not to take two steps back. We want Next Gen, like we were promised. But not a single game released in the last ten years offers us Next Gen and hasn't.
So stop accusing us all of wanting to go back in time. We want things to get better, not to be so easy anyone can do them completely alone, and not to be so hard that they can only be done by grouping, and so that they ONLY offer theme park MMO's until you hit the end where you raid for endless hours and pvp where you do nothing but beat on each other for endless hours (which is usually like just beating on npc's with some occasional chatter that you can respond to unless they become harassing).
I blame WoW and LOTRO for all this. Before LOTRO the them park game was never heard of just like before WoW, we didn't have baby friendly MMO's.
Previous games that were much loved by the community did things right. And we repeatedly mention them over and over and over again. They didn't have everything but they were better than they are now. For gods sakes, SWG had entertainer classes so varied that it allowed you to created whole cantina bands with other players, and whole classes devoted to building and maintaining housing and the items in it. Have you ever seen another game offer alternative classes than the ones that beat the crap out of others? Why would they remove these from the GENRE completely when they were so loved by the players? The answer is that the devs and publishers are just looking for a quick buck. We have less offered to us now than we did during EQ1, EQ2, and SWG and we are told that we should just shut up and be happy. Well I'm not going to shut up and I'm not happy. The genre is slowly being destroyed due to greed for money.
What the devs and publishers don't get is that the genre is already suffering for their greed and it will only get worse.
So how about YOU stop making excuses and blaming us for wanting to make the genre better instead of us asking for more and YOU start doing the same thing? Facebook is only to pass the time when you are bored, it is NOT the way the whole game industry should go. In every other industry, they try to advance things and make things better. In THIS industry, we are told to live with what we have and be happy be have it.
As an Ex SWG player myself, I can't really get behind the attitude you're presenting, nor most of what you're saying... I mean facebook group? You've said that over and over, proving exactly what the other poster said..
" Then on top of that you go the condescending old man on any one who enjoys anything newer than like 2005. It's like nothing makes you happy so therefore anyone else who is happy is just some stupid kid."....
If you want to be taken seriously you can't behave this way, it doesn't look like a concerned gamer, it looks like nothing more than a typical asshat on the internet. It just makes all of us look bad because it's so widely done around here and elsewhere. It's been that way since like 2005..so don't give me the "it's just bitterness from prolonged waiting BS". Yet we wonder why no one listens... Who wants to build a game that thrives on community interaction when those who hold the future of that game in their hands, look like a bunch of toxic, bitter, blowhards ready to jump on the first person who says something to them?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
"Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. "
I don't think it's greedy devs or fickle players. If you parse the posts of players there are clearly *multiple* player segments who prioritize different things. It's not one person wanting two different things it's two people wanting two different things.
If you make a list of those segments some are mutually contradictory but most aren't and most could be accommodated within the same game if was designed in that way to begin with.
I think it's mainly a problem of dev perception i.e. aiming for a *single* average player type (and then picking the type that makes the most noise) rather than looking at it like a jigsaw puzzle where they try and slot many different player types into the same game.
you very well could be right sir. To clarify what I meant about fickle is just that it seems like most mmorpg players including myself jump from game to game to game at a crazy pace. Maybe I'm wrong. I think you have a good point though.
Yes I see what you mean, I think this issue is partly what causes the game hopping.
For the sake of argument If you divided the player base into
1) fast level and leave
2) fast level and raid
3) fast level and pvp
4) slow level, RPG types
5) emotionally invested long-term players - players who treat the game like their favorite bar/pub/chat room because they became emotionally attached
then a fast level game will do well at first but won't keep groups 1 and 4 (and won't have time to create lots of group 5) so needs to keep enough of groups 2 or 3 to make the game work long-term.
Hence why I think these games need to somehow find a progression compromise that works for both groups 2, 3 and 4.
The second point is what causes players to get attached to the game. I'd say either
- they get attached to the world itself (easier with a popular pre-existing IP)
- they get attached to their characters (which takes time played)
- social connections (which requires some level of interaction)
#
So the design aims, to my mind should be
- deep world (to get people attached to the world)
- slow progression (to get people attached to their character) but with specific compromises for raider, pvp players
- a solo design but actively removing all the things that prevent grouping (for social interaction)
I am looking forward to this: Playing a MMO I decided not to play until two years after launch.
It will not have launch issues, it has lots of content updates, it is going to be a good experience. Rather than jump in at beta, been there done that by launch, launch issues, then waiting for the new content.
If two years is too much for you locusts, how about not preordering, not playing the beta and waiting for the reviews. Just that will give you a better experience.
The Repopulation, Shard Online, Albion Online, Tree of Saviour, and I think a few others should be releasing this year. I've played all but ToS, and I am pretty excited for them to go full release. My only issue would be that I may not have the time to devote to them as I still currently play Eve Online frequently, as well as a few others from time to time.
There are a ton of MMO's to play for the "modern" gamer. But your right there is nothing new to play for someone that prefers early style MMO's, that's actually finished anyway.
People made fun of games like Vangaurd because of the funky models and bugs, but you are hard pressed to find a game with better combat skills, class diversity, and shear game world size. Played the game for years and there were still places, quests and things to experience. That game was massive. There were dungeons you never really finished you just got as far as you could.
People that didn't like it never played it long enough to understand how complex and big the world and systems were, for the majority of people it performed poorly looked odd, and was full of frustrating bugs, so they quit almost immediately, preventing most gamers from even playing arguably the largest and most complex MMO ever made.
The amount of content was staggering, all in one persistent none instanced seemless world. I think only APW was instanced.
We will never see a game as large and diverse as say Vangaurd, We can just hope for smaller more modern versions of those types of games. But I have yet to see one.
I agree about Vanguard it was immense and after seven years of playing I still hadn't seen all the world.
I am looking forward to this: Playing a MMO I decided not to play until two years after launch.
It will not have launch issues, it has lots of content updates, it is going to be a good experience. Rather than jump in at beta, been there done that by launch, launch issues, then waiting for the new content.
If two years is too much for you locusts, how about not preordering, not playing the beta and waiting for the reviews. Just that will give you a better experience.
What are playing Scot this game you mention here ?
I was also enjoying the part about voting with your wallets when the poster saying it has made a habit of not spending anything on the games he plays. Well vote with your wallet indeed !
If you want to make an impact you have to play and give feedback on the games and so many games are F2P now that your mere presence is all they need as others are more than willing to fund your presence. However that quote from The Wire, Cedric's wife says "you cannot lose if you do not play" so decide if you want to make a difference by playing and contributing to this genre or leave it until it becomes what you want.
The more I play this new kind of crap mmo, the more I miss the old mmo's, Actually I miss the old Tab target and old fashion questing, having to read the quest to find out where to go.
I miss complex crafting and pvp that is not about stun, stun, fear, stun, fear, stun stun stun.....
A new mmo, bringing back the old things with a new touch, I would pay a sub for that ! now nothing is worth it. I play Archeage because I like the setting and I can do my own thing a bit. But is it a game that could keep me hooked for years to come? No
Comments
And apparently you have never visited this website on a mobile device. The interface is disgusting on mobile and even made a topic about how mobile unfriendly this website is which is completely unacceptable nowadays but it got ignored of course! I personally visit this website mostly on the go when travelling so 99% of the time I am using a mobile device to read it or write posts.
@OP, well there are a few games I personally like. Now I have long got over the desire to have 1 game to rule them all and play it like crazy. I just hop around. At the moment I play about 5-7 hours a week and if you can believe it I play FFXIV and ESO with the odd mobile game. I am now even trying Skyforge. Due to my limited playtime I never ever run out of content.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
I had a really long, mostly mean post written here. I deleted it because I don't want to come off as a completely jerk. I've got a few thoughts.
I think you're confusing promised and dreamed. I remember the early days of MMORPG's and MUDS and how exciting it was to dream of those things. I don't ever remember a DEV promising they could do all those things.
Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. Can you really blame big developers for not taking up multi-million, multi-year projects that are almost certain to lose money.
The MMORPG has advanced a lot in the past 20 years. It's turned into something the older generation doesn't quite like, but my main point was it really seems to me that all we do is hate on everything, and most of us don't seem to really enjoy anything. I don't blame devs for abandoning us at all, we aren't putting our money where our keyboards are. The younger generation, or the ones who have adapted to the new stuff well apparently they are because there are a lot of games right now that this site hates on constantly that seem to be making money.
To me the MMORPG genre has always been about getting into a world and committing to it, and living in it making relationships with others who have. Unfortunately both by game design and just where our culture is at in terms of the internet trolls, it's gotten harder. However there really are a ton of games, both themepark and sandbox that we could choose to do that in, we just don't because 'insert' flaw.
Heh, I'm actually playing Baldur's Gate again.
B&S is fun for a while but uses the same system Swtor use for story telling (instanced and personal) , and the zones arent "open" , more like little zones with corridors to connect .... the combat is cool , but outside that ......"meh".
and no prophet u can play it ...on rus servers
I played BD on KR for weeks, and the game was "cool" but is the same as AA , no content for groups ( no dungeons) , combat is awesome , but gets repetitive realllly fast ....imho it wont do well on west market , but who knows :P
Your reply is ridiculous.
What you are saying is: 'We should be grateful for what we are given, even if it's not what we have been asking for. We should make the best of what others choose to sell us, however bad it is".
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Help support an artist and gamer who has lost his tools to create and play: http://www.gofundme.com/u63nzcgk
Right? Apparently if you're not pissed off and are enjoying the newer mmorpgs, you're not a true mmorpg gamer and is brainwashed(like you said) on these forums. Seems like it's the other way around to me. These sole called true mmorpg gamers seem so brainwashed by the past they can't let go.
There is this brand new invention that allows gamers to read information released by the developers, watch officially release videos (some not so official), and provide details about these games and other products for consumers to decide if they like/want something BEFORE we waste money on it. Perhaps you've heard of it, it's only been around in one form or another since 01 JAN 1983 and the name we now know it by was coined in 1990 by Tim Berners-Lee. In case that isn't enough to figure it out, its the World Wide Web, the Web, or just plane ole "the internet". I would hope you have because you used it to make this post.
I agree with the OP because I have researched these games on my own utilizing the above brand new shiny invention. I also am very much aware of what my likes and dislikes are and I can say that I won't play any of them. Why? Because I don't have to try everything out to know if I will like it or not. I try not to prove the Thomas Tusser quote as a truism in my life. If you are not aware of him or which quote I am referring to, it goes like this: A fool and his money are soon parted.
Maybe I'll miss the next great thing and maybe not. It won't bother me in the least bit because I don't have to buy every game coming out because I've researched them and they aren't my cup of tea.
There are a couple things going on here. The so-called newer MMO's are basically all the same, and those who want something different in gameplay recognize that. They are playing the game itself and are bored with the old gameplay that the current gen of MMO's deliver.
Those who like the current crop of MMO's are playing a somewhat different game. They are competing in the metagame (competition ladders, etc.) and are not as concerned with the repetitive nature of these database-driven MMO's.
The clash between the two groups is partially due to people approaching and playing games for completely different reasons. Many people are not interested in the kind of social milieu gaming that these current MMO's depend on to draw in players. This kind of jostling aspect where people are rather adversarial at all times is a big difference from the older MMO's, which did not have the competition as a main selling point. This also coincides more or less with the age group of the players, where the 20 somethings are more interested in creating pecking orders within their groups and then butting up against other people.
Current MMO's represent a failure to advance the genre. People who have played a variety of games through the years tend to be able to see that there are more ways to make games than what is commonly accepted as THE way to make MMO's. The definition of MMO is completely different between the two groups.
For people to desire a different sort of gameplay is not a slight against the people who enjoy the current crop of MMO's. There can be more than one kind of game called MMO, we don't all have to jam into some narrow paradigm. Those who attack people who desire a broader range of game style in the market are misguided. Nobody should be threatened by variety or worried that more choices are going to be available in the future.
Whether someone personally likes the new things or not is irrelevant.
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
Actually Venge you can edit from your phone. Scroll to the bottom of the page and two the go to full website. I'm on a cross country move and use it myself."Secondly, I get so tired of acting like it's the dev's / publishers greed thats the problem. the MMORPG community has been incredibly fickle for a long time. "
I don't think it's greedy devs or fickle players. If you parse the posts of players there are clearly *multiple* player segments who prioritize different things. It's not one person wanting two different things it's two people wanting two different things.
If you make a list of those segments some are mutually contradictory but most aren't and most could be accommodated within the same game if was designed in that way to begin with.
I think it's mainly a problem of dev perception i.e. aiming for a *single* average player type (and then picking the type that makes the most noise) rather than looking at it like a jigsaw puzzle where they try and slot many different player types into the same game.
you very well could be right sir. To clarify what I meant about fickle is just that it seems like most mmorpg players including myself jump from game to game to game at a crazy pace. Maybe I'm wrong. I think you have a good point though.
As an Ex SWG player myself, I can't really get behind the attitude you're presenting, nor most of what you're saying... I mean facebook group? You've said that over and over, proving exactly what the other poster said..
" Then on top of that you go the condescending old man on any one who enjoys anything newer than like 2005. It's like nothing makes you happy so therefore anyone else who is happy is just some stupid kid."....
If you want to be taken seriously you can't behave this way, it doesn't look like a concerned gamer, it looks like nothing more than a typical asshat on the internet. It just makes all of us look bad because it's so widely done around here and elsewhere. It's been that way since like 2005..so don't give me the "it's just bitterness from prolonged waiting BS". Yet we wonder why no one listens... Who wants to build a game that thrives on community interaction when those who hold the future of that game in their hands, look like a bunch of toxic, bitter, blowhards ready to jump on the first person who says something to them?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Yes I see what you mean, I think this issue is partly what causes the game hopping.
For the sake of argument If you divided the player base into
1) fast level and leave
2) fast level and raid
3) fast level and pvp
4) slow level, RPG types
5) emotionally invested long-term players - players who treat the game like their favorite bar/pub/chat room because they became emotionally attached
then a fast level game will do well at first but won't keep groups 1 and 4 (and won't have time to create lots of group 5) so needs to keep enough of groups 2 or 3 to make the game work long-term.
Hence why I think these games need to somehow find a progression compromise that works for both groups 2, 3 and 4.
The second point is what causes players to get attached to the game. I'd say either
- they get attached to the world itself (easier with a popular pre-existing IP)
- they get attached to their characters (which takes time played)
- social connections (which requires some level of interaction)
#
So the design aims, to my mind should be
- deep world (to get people attached to the world)
- slow progression (to get people attached to their character) but with specific compromises for raider, pvp players
- a solo design but actively removing all the things that prevent grouping (for social interaction)
I am looking forward to this: Playing a MMO I decided not to play until two years after launch.
It will not have launch issues, it has lots of content updates, it is going to be a good experience. Rather than jump in at beta, been there done that by launch, launch issues, then waiting for the new content.
If two years is too much for you locusts, how about not preordering, not playing the beta and waiting for the reviews. Just that will give you a better experience.
The Repopulation, Shard Online, Albion Online, Tree of Saviour, and I think a few others should be releasing this year. I've played all but ToS, and I am pretty excited for them to go full release. My only issue would be that I may not have the time to devote to them as I still currently play Eve Online frequently, as well as a few others from time to time.
Black desert no thank you, most boring game i have played in my life, lvling is nice but that is it.
Camelot unchained I funded, and looking forward to it!
W40k I will wait and see.
Lineage eternal I will buy and play but not as a main game.
Blade and soul , tricky one I just don't know how much I will like it or not. ( will have to try )
To be honest now is the time for a developer to step up and bring something out, something fresh!
I agree about Vanguard it was immense and after seven years of playing I still hadn't seen all the world.
What are playing Scot this game you mention here ?
I was also enjoying the part about voting with your wallets when the poster saying it has made a habit of not spending anything on the games he plays. Well vote with your wallet indeed !
If you want to make an impact you have to play and give feedback on the games and so many games are F2P now that your mere presence is all they need as others are more than willing to fund your presence. However that quote from The Wire, Cedric's wife says "you cannot lose if you do not play" so decide if you want to make a difference by playing and contributing to this genre or leave it until it becomes what you want.
The more I play this new kind of crap mmo, the more I miss the old mmo's, Actually I miss the old Tab target and old fashion questing, having to read the quest to find out where to go.
I miss complex crafting and pvp that is not about stun, stun, fear, stun, fear, stun stun stun.....
A new mmo, bringing back the old things with a new touch, I would pay a sub for that ! now nothing is worth it. I play Archeage because I like the setting and I can do my own thing a bit. But is it a game that could keep me hooked for years to come? No