Does Anyone Out There Like PVE & PVP?

FlyByKnight

Hey folks, I was looking over at the forums for some up and coming MMORPGS (Crowfall, Blade & Soul, Black Desert). Am I the only person who likes PVP AND PVE? Does it really have to be either or?

I always feel like when a PVP based MMORPG (with PVE elements) is on the horizon there is a segment of people who absolutely want some barren world world devoid of things that can make a game interesting beyond just logging on and shooting or hacking up player controlled opponents.

I love PVP, but I love when a game has a great lore than can be explored in game. I like large and vast beastiaries. I like interesting dungeons and boss fights to do with friends. I still like looting.

I don't subscribe to the notion that Open World PVP games should be devoid of NPCs and other challenges. Without those elements all you have is Planetside 2.

My longtime dream is to play a good PVP heavy game that properly integrates a great community driven lore/narrative (not a sole hero) and has group PVE activities to participate in during times inbetween engagements.

Does anybody else feel this way? Are there any grey area people out there?

sunandshadow

Sorry to say, in my opinion it really does have to be one of the other, because PvP fans want open-world PvP and PvE fans (like me) will only tolerate arena/battleground PvP.

Similarly, MMOs really do need to pick whether they are aiming at players who like to group or players who like to solo.

H0urg1ass

I love good PVE and good PVP.  Unfortunately, the two never seem to be in the same game.

If I want fantastic PVE, then I play Age of Conan.  If I want fantastic PVP, then I play EVE Online.  AoC has shitty PVP and EVE has the most boring PVE ever invented.

I can't wait to find a game that manages to blend the two well in a setting that I enjoy.

Treadworthy

I love both as well.  I tend to PVE when new to a game, then PVP with alts, or end game.  Of course, that depends on nature of the game.

Loktofeit

Most people do. However, most people also aren't looking for it in the same game, nor are they looking for the type of PVP that most MMOs offer. 

Axehilt

Plenty of people enjoy both.

Myself I get my PVP from PVP genres (not MMORPGs), and my PVE mostly from MMORPGs.

RPGs are about vertical progression, and vertical progression makes for awful PVP (instead of being a contest purely of skill, it also measures how progressed you are -- and that reduces PVP quality.)

Daikuru

I like PvPvE.

Slapshot1188

I greatly enjoy both.  The problems I see are that most games are designed as PvE OR  PvP and then have the other tacked on.  This is a recipe to fail.  Not every game has to appeal to every player.

FomaldehydeJim

I love both, but I rarely love both in the same game. 

Joseph_Kerr

I like both, I tend to level using both methods equal parts if possible. If not I generally get bored of the game because they tend to feel half baked in one way or another.

FomaldehydeJim

Slapshot1188 said:

I greatly enjoy both.  The problems I see are that most games are designed as PvE OR  PvP and then have the other tacked on.  This is a recipe to fail.  Not every game has to appeal to every player.

I agree.

I only enjoy PVP where there is a level playing field and preferably FPS/TPS combat... I dislike PVP that promotes ganking or griefing or with stat and gear advantages.  

I only really enjoy PVE that involves character advancement (not necessarily traditional levels but there needs to be a carrot). 

For me, PVP and PVE are rarely compatible in the same game.   

Beatnik59

I like to do PvP.

I like PvE.

I also like raiding.

I like to roleplay too; I like to GM things like murder mysteries and play cameos for plots.  I like to create interesting, memorable characters that are complex and nuanced in their personalities.

I like to craft and buy or sell things on the market.

I like to build and decorate structures: guild halls, bars, houses and the like.

And I like to be by myself too, fishing or getting into the mindset of the character, perhaps building something interesting out in the sticks, just so someone might come by and say..."wow...that was cool!"

I like all these things because I like MMORPGs.  I like the diversity of the experience here which challenges the whole person, not just one aspect of him or her.

To me, the best MMORPGer is the one who strives to learn and perform in every aspect of play, from combat (PvP and PvE) to crafting (economics and design) to roleplay (character development and interpersonal storytelling) to content creation (GMing, structure design, combat scenario design).  Those are the kind of players I like playing with.  Those are the kinds of players I try to emulate.

FlyByKnight

I don't mind the blend. I understand there has to be balance though and 50/50 definitely isn't it. When it comes to MMORPGs I can never really get into 100% either way. 

Should a PVP weighted MMORPG be completely devoid of engageable enemy NPCs in the environment? Should it have NO story and NO lore and NO non PVP challenges? Should it be just a map where there are only players? My personal preference says no.

treyu86

Darkfall online, and more after the last patch, has open pvp, guild pvp, sieges, territory control, and the character levelling and gearing (for pvp) based in PvE with group activities, zerg activites and soloing activities. It is the best games that combines both and with an fps fantasy combat

Iselin

Yeah, I like them both. Also crafting, exploring, socializing... I guess I just like MMORPGs. I probably shouldn't hang out here

Kopogero

PvE is suppose to be the environment, the world and it's creatures, unless the game allows players to be creatures/monsters as well. PvP is everything else that's happening between players, from opposing factions to competition with crafters/gatherers...Anyone who doesn't understand these basic concepts doesn't understand what MMORPG's are.

Reklaw

Like em both aswell...though not in the way it's presented current day. More like a niche way with a flag system, so that anyone who wants to PVP could/should be able to do so in the games open world.

The only problem with a flag system is that the wanna-be pvp player will complain cause he/she can not pray on the weak as most who will flag themself will want that PVP challenge, so unfortunaly I don't think a flagging system will work today. 

Star Wars galaxies is the only game I spend allot of time in PVP compared to any other MMO after. Fallen Earth might come into second. But overall I get my PVP fix from other genre of games and choose them because it's forced PVP, but in a MMORPG my experiance should be about freedom and not forced playstyle's.

Loktofeit

FlyByKnight said:

I don't mind the blend. I understand there has to be balance though and 50/50 definitely isn't it. When it comes to MMORPGs I can never really get into 100% either way. 

Should a PVP weighted MMORPG be completely devoid of engageable enemy NPCs in the environment? Should it have NO story and NO lore and NO non PVP challenges? Should it be just a map where there are only players? My personal preference says no.

There's no right answer to that. It all depends on the design of the game and the target audience.

VengeSunsoar

FomaldehydeJim said:

Slapshot1188 said:

I greatly enjoy both.  The problems I see are that most games are designed as PvE OR  PvP and then have the other tacked on.  This is a recipe to fail.  Not every game has to appeal to every player.

I agree.

I only enjoy PVP where there is a level playing field and preferably FPS/TPS combat... I dislike PVP that promotes ganking or griefing or with stat and gear advantages.  

I only really enjoy PVE that involves character advancement (not necessarily traditional levels but there needs to be a carrot). 

For me, PVP and PVE are rarely compatible in the same game.   

FomaldehydeJim said:

Slapshot1188 said:

I greatly enjoy both.  The problems I see are that most games are designed as PvE OR  PvP and then have the other tacked on.  This is a recipe to fail.  Not every game has to appeal to every player.

I agree.

I only enjoy PVP where there is a level playing field and preferably FPS/TPS combat... I dislike PVP that promotes ganking or griefing or with stat and gear advantages.  

I only really enjoy PVE that involves character advancement (not necessarily traditional levels but there needs to be a carrot). 

For me, PVP and PVE are rarely compatible in the same game.   

'---
Odd quote thingi the phone.  This pretty much describes me as well. 

laserit

I've experienced a great blend of pvp and pve in a role playing atmosphere. IMHO it's the playerbase themselves that make the two things so difficult to marry.

ZoeMcCloskey

Yes and yes!  I'll admit though I tend to show up for the PvE but stay for the PvP.  

The games I have stayed in the longest are for PvP, apart from SWG or Atlantica whose pve kept me long term.

Wizardry

This topic is so beaten to death .../sigh

If you don't really care about your game and just enter to gain levels or whatever i guess it doesn't really matter.I care a lot about the game i choose to play,i want it to have longevity,i can't stand game hopping and just wasting money on games i play for 1 hour or 1 week.

It takes way too long to explain so i will make it simple,PVP and PVE cannot coexist they do not compliment each other,they contradict each other.

Also this topic cannot be lumped under one roof,some if not many or most games that ONLY offer pvp is because they are a low budget operation cutting corners and cost on a large scale pve game.I just have to ask myself WHY would i want to play a budget game,answer is i do not.

All these little fishing boats looking to fish up some suckers,some fish to bite their bait can just get out of my pond.I only want to jump on the big fishing vessels,there is luxury,comfort,everything i need,small boats make me sea sick.

phantomghost

I personally like both PvP and PvE.  I always get more hyped to play a PvP game but when it actually comes down to it I prefer playing a PvE game.  

I would prefer PvE be the major focus, but I am for open world PvP and territorial control etc... but I tend to dislike a complete FFA- would prefer factions etc.  Also, I usually get pretty annoyed with games where you have to aim because it becomes too tiring and I suck at it.

Phoebes

I like a lot of different aspects of MMORPG's like PvE, PvP, crafting, trading, etc. But if one of those aspects can completely interfere with and disrupt another, I don't like that. That's how I see PvP in a PvE game. PvP can disrupt any aspect of the game at any time depending on some other player's mood.

Loke666

Good PvE and PvP at the same time is really hard to pull off. You need good solid mechanics that works just as well in both with unbalancing one or the other.

My guess is that it would be easiest to make with a good AI so the npcs and mobs act somewhat human, it doesn't have to really hard to tell who is a human and not but you can' use tanking against mobs without being able to tank players as well. Let the mob often attack the target that is actually best for them and let them at time syncronize attacks.

Yeah, some people might think that this will take out parts of the fun of PvE but having an open world where people need to specc for one or the other thing just suck. Not to mention nerfs for one or the other playstyles.

phantomghost

Loke666 said:

Good PvE and PvP at the same time is really hard to pull off. You need good solid mechanics that works just as well in both with unbalancing one or the other.

My guess is that it would be easiest to make with a good AI so the npcs and mobs act somewhat human, it doesn't have to really hard to tell who is a human and not but you can' use tanking against mobs without being able to tank players as well. Let the mob often attack the target that is actually best for them and let them at time syncronize attacks.

Yeah, some people might think that this will take out parts of the fun of PvE but having an open world where people need to specc for one or the other thing just suck. Not to mention nerfs for one or the other playstyles.

 Good point.  When there seems to be a decent mix of PvE and PvP, even in a game primarily focusing on PvE, there tends to be a lot of balancing issues and complaints that come up based on the classes PvP aspects.