B2P is a better option IMO, as long as the game's good enough to justify the initial investment. It also means less goldfarmer vermin spamming the chats and harassing honest players through mails and tells.
The Blade & Soul goldseller/bot problem really killed f2p for me.
game has multiple safe zones no longer a hardcore sandbox, thank you backers for ruining the game.
The hardcore sandbox game is ruined from the start. They don't work, the only one that was arguably successful was UO and it had a captive audience, unless you want to argue EVE in which 90% of players never leave the safest areas.
Hardcore PvP games need 'food' to survive just like a poker table needs fish. Gamers have enough choices now that the only people who are going to play a hardcore PvP MMO are the very small amount of hardcore PKer types. That isn't enough to sustain even a small MMO, and if it was why would you develop a game with the goal of selling 30k copies when you could develop a crappy pve MMO and make significantly more.
Stop bringing up the 'hardcore PvP' fantasy, it's not real. It doesn't work and won't ever, the game design is innately anti-MMO, prohibitive to new players (or anybody but no-lifers honestly), riddled with 'quit points', and the market is one of the smallest around.
I am a PvPer. I have played PvP in MMOs since UO. I have played MOBAs since the original dota on WC3. I have played FPS games since DOOM. I love to compete and competition against other players and I am saying that 'hardcore PvP' is the moronic pipe-dream of no-life griefers.
It. Does. Not. Work.
i'm not talking about briefing people , if they are gonna call it hardcore sandbox, that many safezone should not exist maybe for 1 max, no a billion fken place all over the world, and if people grief me i dont care , most of the time if you aren't bad you can escape or kill them and take all their loot, Salem online will still better than Albion, they have a safezone and only one, where you can't build into forcing you to venture out you can hide in the safe zone if you want but you won't get to build anything or experience all the game has to offer, the fact that there are multiple safe zone and people can build in safezone and hide ruins the game and i too played UO, i too played doom, i too played dota,
game has multiple safe zones no longer a hardcore sandbox, thank you backers for ruining the game.
The hardcore sandbox game is ruined from the start. They don't work, the only one that was arguably successful was UO and it had a captive audience, unless you want to argue EVE in which 90% of players never leave the safest areas.
Hardcore PvP games need 'food' to survive just like a poker table needs fish. Gamers have enough choices now that the only people who are going to play a hardcore PvP MMO are the very small amount of hardcore PKer types. That isn't enough to sustain even a small MMO, and if it was why would you develop a game with the goal of selling 30k copies when you could develop a crappy pve MMO and make significantly more.
Stop bringing up the 'hardcore PvP' fantasy, it's not real. It doesn't work and won't ever, the game design is innately anti-MMO, prohibitive to new players (or anybody but no-lifers honestly), riddled with 'quit points', and the market is one of the smallest around.
I am a PvPer. I have played PvP in MMOs since UO. I have played MOBAs since the original dota on WC3. I have played FPS games since DOOM. I love to compete and competition against other players and I am saying that 'hardcore PvP' is the moronic pipe-dream of no-life griefers.
It. Does. Not. Work.
i'm not talking about briefing people , if they are gonna call it hardcore sandbox, that many safezone should not exist maybe for 1 max, no a billion fken place all over the world, and if people grief me i dont care , most of the time if you aren't bad you can escape or kill them and take all their loot, Salem online will still better than Albion, they have a safezone and only one, where you can't build into forcing you to venture out you can hide in the safe zone if you want but you won't get to build anything or experience all the game has to offer, the fact that there are multiple safe zone and people can build in safezone and hide ruins the game and i too played UO, i too played doom, i too played dota,
Psssst. Eve has no safe zones ( other than being docked). You can shoot other people in hi sec, dangerous tho it is.
Or you can join rvb or factional warfare.
Of you can stay in low sec or null sec which is over half the game's real estate and have all the pvp you can eat.
And for the millionth time, ffa.pvp and.sandbox are NOT interchangeable terms.
Eve player since 2007
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Are they going with the ESO selling content patches practice too? Cause that's a pretty shitty b2p model.
I'd like to see other MMOs adding so much content with patches, that ESO adds to the game with the DLCs. Let alone such a high quality content. That's simply unheard of.
i play eve . and there have plenty of bots , spammers and huge toxic community ,and it`s p2p , so tell me more about how b2p albion will have not such things? I can tell u , they will be there , but you are just a bunch of greedy b****rds and want to cash the game asap. and as some1 mentioned b4, if this ... "premium" gives u ability to progress faster this bcome p2w automaticaly!
Did you drop out of Grade school? Or is the education system THAT bad these days?
How's your Slavic?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
LOL it is already pay to win,EVERY single one of these games is a RACE and giving players the chance to race faster is p2w. Almsost everything we see in most games is p2w,even bag space,mounts,xp potions all p2w,the ONLY things that should ever be in a CS are visual items but even that is a problem because then to make those sales you likely get horrid gear in game and better looking gear in CS. Bottom line is CS's are a terrible way to run a game,there will always be the idea somewhere in the back of their head that they just need to step up the CS a bit a little each time,until it is full blown trying to basically sell everything that should be earned in game in the CS.
I completely agree with this. And for Robin to say "Unfortunately, the pay to play / subscription model has been dead for a long time" they no nothing about the MMO industry and the Subscription Model. The ONLY reason why its not working is we have MMOs costing $200+ Million and a $15 a month sub from 500K players is not enough to keep the game alive. Look at FFXIV, its a sub and going strong BECAUSE they didnt sink millions into making the game or remaking the game. Albion is ONLY designed to make money like every other MMO that does a cash shop as their main source of revenue and no the Box cost is just to help pay off the initial investment.
P2P MMOs are far and better the best model. You just get F2P B2P crap when you have a floored market with crappy games that need these models just to have the game.
B2P is a better option IMO, as long as the game's good enough to justify the initial investment. It also means less goldfarmer vermin spamming the chats and harassing honest players through mails and tells.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Watch the hype drop significantly to this game. F2P games always gather massive audience due to being simply FREE TO PLAY. Albion sadly didn't understand this to appreciate it...and if they can flip flop like this, it shows they are unreliable. Expect a lot of mixed reviews from a huge portion of their potential customers.
Free => B2P always, and Blade & Soul is best latest example of how 5 year old games with terrible endgame, with asian/korean background can still do great in the west, again thanks to being F2P.
Pay to win exist in 100% of multiplayer games, so that argument holds no merit at monetizing options. Albion had lost its opportunity to do what many F2P models could with me over the years and that's at least to be installed and tried, something now I know I'll never do. But hey, this is good news, one less game to keep an eye on in 2016.
the game is not even finished and they are thinking of money already. unless the current state of the game is actually the final release. eewww. Guild Wars 2 is B2P. is this game even close to comparison with the quality. your graphics and gameplay sucks. why would someone buy to play Albion when there are way better games to play like Archeage and TERA or even Rift. These game developers just wants to cash on their effort when the product is not even close to a "good game"
Making games is a business. It's fun for the end-user, but the company behind it is in it, from start to finish, for the money. Just like any other business. The development and publishing companies are not non-profit charities.
B2P is a better option IMO, as long as the game's good enough to justify the initial investment. It also means less goldfarmer vermin spamming the chats and harassing honest players through mails and tells.
The real driver behind gold spammers is - earning potential - aka populat games that have lots of people buying gold.
If the game is popular - B2P is a zero deterrent. Case in point Archeage Alpha $150 entry fee had tens of thousands gold spammer accounts banned.
What ultimately kills gold spam is the lack of buying customers.
The price of entry makes no difference whatsoever.
Not true F2P makes it way easier, easier a developer for games myself, we can set stuff based on account and keep track alot easier.. With F2P, they can delete and remake and keep doing it... So will B2P get rid of them NO.. But makes it easier to deal with period.... Make a game, then you can see for your self...How it works..
I don't get to try it for free, I'm not interested better have a trial.
This decision - and ensuing discussion is about - price.
Whether they have a trial or not is a decision they will have to make about promotion. And that is something they will have to do prior to launch. Advertsing; pre-launch trials; trials a year after launch; legendary editions; price cuts; invite-a-friend etc.
Of course with free-to-download games the price and promotion issues ostensibly merge.
Let me translate: "We don't think our game will be good enough to enough people because it is a niche game, so we need to have some guaranteed revenue up front. In the end, we felt using the excuse that B2P helps prevent botters and gold spammers sounded pretty good. As a side note, going B2P also allows us to extend the inevitable P2W cash shop items from being introduced within 60 days of release to within 120 days of release - so it's win, win short term for everyone involved, both stakeholders and players alike!
the buy to play option makes sense, considering the ridiculous amount of bots in the first few days of a ftp mmo like say B&S the buying to play will at the very least cut down on those numbers, plus it will provided funding for features.
Here is what sounds like the dumbest idea implemented by Albion Online.
Let's sell Founder's Packs with items that reward players for being a founder which can be looted and break.
WTF kind of bullshit is this?! If I want a Founder's Pack for the items you get, I definitely don't want them ever being looted or breaking! I want to use that shit forever and not just while I sit at a bank with guards.
Sounds as good as Blade and Soul's idea of loot bidding for item drops you should earn from running dungeons at no cost.
I am convinced that developers do not play their games nor think things through before making decisions.
the game is not even finished and they are thinking of money already. unless the current state of the game is actually the final release. eewww. Guild Wars 2 is B2P. is this game even close to comparison with the quality. your graphics and gameplay sucks. why would someone buy to play Albion when there are way better games to play like Archeage and TERA or even Rift. These game developers just wants to cash on their effort when the product is not even close to a "good game"
GW2 WAS b2p, now its f2p with only the las expansion costing extra cash
It's easy... If you can't afford to play it or don't like the direction it's going then don't play it. I understand it's a business and they have to make money but it seems like these days people want games for free and complain way too much. Go to MMORPG game list and find a new one to play and please stop with all the reasons why it should be f2p...... It's getting as old as the casual vs hardcore argument. Simple... Work a couple hours and you're set for the month.
Are they going with the ESO selling content patches practice too? Cause that's a pretty shitty b2p model.
I'd like to see other MMOs adding so much content with patches, that ESO adds to the game with the DLCs. Let alone such a high quality content. That's simply unheard of.
That'd be EVE online for one. GW2 did alright from what I hear. Secret World does it. I could keep listing them, but there's really only one MMO that has the gall to sell their content patches as DLC so ESO makes a much shorter list.
Hmm, just wondering but couldn't game companies sell gold? That certainly would put away some gold spammers, if the price is low enough that it become unprofitable for this groups.
OK, people probably wold claim the game to be Pay to win based, but the truth is that for most games you can find an external source ready to make your life easier, for the correct price tag.
Other way to end with gold farming would be to reduce the importance of gold itself, for example maximizing the used non trade-able resources like tokens, faction/rep/fame points, even introducing item direct exchange by comparing item values...perhaps going even so far as to create a small quest for acquiring a special coin for trade between players, say you can only directly trade with other players if you acquire a merchant permit...
found it interesting, lets see where this leads, glad I bought the Pack when I did too, plan to play it a lot when it releases.
Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning.
And the more you know Insanity, is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
But I can tell you that only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.
Are they going with the ESO selling content patches practice too? Cause that's a pretty shitty b2p model.
I'd like to see other MMOs adding so much content with patches, that ESO adds to the game with the DLCs. Let alone such a high quality content. That's simply unheard of.
That'd be EVE online for one. GW2 did alright from what I hear. Secret World does it. I could keep listing them, but there's really only one MMO that has the gall to sell their content patches as DLC so ESO makes a much shorter list.
Dunno, Secret World is also selling DLC's, and to my knowledge they're not free for subscribers. Ofc you could argue that the DLC's in ESO aren't free to subscribers either, but at least while you subscribe you get to play the DLC's for free. I guess you could say beeing a subscriber in ESO lets you rent the DLC's.
Imo it's not a bad idea. Better than p2p games where you subscribe every month but content patches only come every other month, or every further apart if there's an expansion on the way.
This way when there's new content you pay for the new content. When there's no new content you play the content you allready payed for free of charge. This means if the developer wants my money they need to create new content. I can even choose to not get a certain DLC if it's not something i'm interested in, ex. a pvp fokused DLC.
B2P is a better option IMO, as long as the game's good enough to justify the initial investment. It also means less goldfarmer vermin spamming the chats and harassing honest players through mails and tells.
The Blade & Soul goldseller/bot problem really killed f2p for me.
It also killed ArcheAge to a large degree. Since all those bots mean legitimate players lose out on important things, ranging from having to sit in the queue, because several hundred bots are farming instead of honest players, to crap like losing the housing spots and other things to these pariahs.
No matter what some try to claim, having the game as NOT F2P would cut down on the number of these jerks running around, since they'd either have to shell out money themselves to get in, or hack player accounts. Either way, there's a very limited supply of those, and getting banned will hurt them a lot more than it would on a game where they just have to enter some more text to get back into game on a brand new account.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
Comments
The Blade & Soul goldseller/bot problem really killed f2p for me.
i'm not talking about briefing people , if they are gonna call it hardcore sandbox, that many safezone should not exist maybe for 1 max, no a billion fken place all over the world, and if people grief me i dont care , most of the time if you aren't bad you can escape or kill them and take all their loot, Salem online will still better than Albion, they have a safezone and only one, where you can't build into forcing you to venture out you can hide in the safe zone if you want but you won't get to build anything or experience all the game has to offer, the fact that there are multiple safe zone and people can build in safezone and hide ruins the game and i too played UO, i too played doom, i too played dota,
Psssst. Eve has no safe zones ( other than being docked). You can shoot other people in hi sec, dangerous tho it is.
Or you can join rvb or factional warfare.
Of you can stay in low sec or null sec which is over half the game's real estate and have all the pvp you can eat.
And for the millionth time, ffa.pvp and.sandbox are NOT interchangeable terms.
Eve player since 2007
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Dwight D Eisenhower
My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.
Henry Rollins
I'd like to see other MMOs adding so much content with patches, that ESO adds to the game with the DLCs. Let alone such a high quality content. That's simply unheard of.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I completely agree with this. And for Robin to say "Unfortunately, the pay to play / subscription model has been dead for a long time" they no nothing about the MMO industry and the Subscription Model. The ONLY reason why its not working is we have MMOs costing $200+ Million and a $15 a month sub from 500K players is not enough to keep the game alive. Look at FFXIV, its a sub and going strong BECAUSE they didnt sink millions into making the game or remaking the game. Albion is ONLY designed to make money like every other MMO that does a cash shop as their main source of revenue and no the Box cost is just to help pay off the initial investment.
P2P MMOs are far and better the best model. You just get F2P B2P crap when you have a floored market with crappy games that need these models just to have the game.
Better option for whom?
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Free => B2P always, and Blade & Soul is best latest example of how 5 year old games with terrible endgame, with asian/korean background can still do great in the west, again thanks to being F2P.
Pay to win exist in 100% of multiplayer games, so that argument holds no merit at monetizing options. Albion had lost its opportunity to do what many F2P models could with me over the years and that's at least to be installed and tried, something now I know I'll never do. But hey, this is good news, one less game to keep an eye on in 2016.
Making games is a business. It's fun for the end-user, but the company behind it is in it, from start to finish, for the money. Just like any other business. The development and publishing companies are not non-profit charities.
Not true F2P makes it way easier, easier a developer for games myself, we can set stuff based on account and keep track alot easier.. With F2P, they can delete and remake and keep doing it... So will B2P get rid of them NO.. But makes it easier to deal with period.... Make a game, then you can see for your self...How it works..
Not really an issue for the employed.
This decision - and ensuing discussion is about - price.
Whether they have a trial or not is a decision they will have to make about promotion. And that is something they will have to do prior to launch. Advertsing; pre-launch trials; trials a year after launch; legendary editions; price cuts; invite-a-friend etc.
Of course with free-to-download games the price and promotion issues ostensibly merge.
Let's sell Founder's Packs with items that reward players for being a founder which can be looted and break.
WTF kind of bullshit is this?! If I want a Founder's Pack for the items you get, I definitely don't want them ever being looted or breaking! I want to use that shit forever and not just while I sit at a bank with guards.
Sounds as good as Blade and Soul's idea of loot bidding for item drops you should earn from running dungeons at no cost. I am convinced that developers do not play their games nor think things through before making decisions.
GW2 WAS b2p, now its f2p with only the las expansion costing extra cash
https://ashesofcreation.com/r/Y4U3PQCASUPJ5SED
That'd be EVE online for one. GW2 did alright from what I hear. Secret World does it. I could keep listing them, but there's really only one MMO that has the gall to sell their content patches as DLC so ESO makes a much shorter list.
OK, people probably wold claim the game to be Pay to win based, but the truth is that for most games you can find an external source ready to make your life easier, for the correct price tag.
Other way to end with gold farming would be to reduce the importance of gold itself, for example maximizing the used non trade-able resources like tokens, faction/rep/fame points, even introducing item direct exchange by comparing item values...perhaps going even so far as to create a small quest for acquiring a special coin for trade between players, say you can only directly trade with other players if you acquire a merchant permit...
Imo it's not a bad idea. Better than p2p games where you subscribe every month but content patches only come every other month, or every further apart if there's an expansion on the way.
This way when there's new content you pay for the new content. When there's no new content you play the content you allready payed for free of charge. This means if the developer wants my money they need to create new content. I can even choose to not get a certain DLC if it's not something i'm interested in, ex. a pvp fokused DLC.
No matter what some try to claim, having the game as NOT F2P would cut down on the number of these jerks running around, since they'd either have to shell out money themselves to get in, or hack player accounts. Either way, there's a very limited supply of those, and getting banned will hurt them a lot more than it would on a game where they just have to enter some more text to get back into game on a brand new account.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/