I have come to the realization that it isn't mmos that have changed, its me. Mmos play the same way they have always played, its just now im older, have less time, and the market is so over saturated with them that the feeling of wonderment and curiosity just isnt there anymore.
Yeah, MMOs are pretty much dead, as evidenced by the rise of MOBAs. People would rather play a fun short game and accomplish something than grind for an hour and achieve nothing. There are still good MMOs out that I plan to play but not as frequently or as reverently.
Something new and good is bound to come around by then, don't you think?
Dunno, ask the people fleeing WoW. Or the ones that fled EQ, ten years earlier.
A lot of them sound like they've grown pretty tired of waiting.
What about the ones fleeing Eve?
Just recently broke the 40K accounts concurrently online barrier for the first time since 2013, there's a "fact" for you and a figure most modern MMORPGs won't share.
Deadwood projects unrelated to EVE shut down, increased focus on the core moneymaker, increased focus on VR titles which may (or may not) be the next big thing.
Meanwhile in EVE we just received a significant content update with the new Citadels already triggering epic battles everywhere.
My alliance lost the fight to stand up a large fortrizar by 1 minute and 30 seconds.
10 Titans and 9 Super carriers showed up including PL who just wanted to get in on the kill mail.
Things couldn't be any busier and the future is bright indeed.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Something new and good is bound to come around by then, don't you think?
Dunno, ask the people fleeing WoW. Or the ones that fled EQ, ten years earlier.
A lot of them sound like they've grown pretty tired of waiting.
What about the ones fleeing Eve?
Just recently broke the 40K accounts concurrently online barrier for the first time since 2013, there's a "fact" for you and a figure most modern MMORPGs won't share.
Deadwood projects unrelated to EVE shut down, increased focus on the core moneymaker, increased focus on VR titles which may (or may not) be the next big thing.
Meanwhile in EVE we just received a significant content update with the new Citadels already triggering epic battles everywhere.
My alliance lost the fight to stand up a large fortrizar by 1 minute and 30 seconds.
10 Titans and 9 Super carriers showed up including PL who just wanted to get in on the kill mail.
Things couldn't be any busier and the future is bright indeed.
But I guess you had to be there. :pleased:
My comment wasnt about having a battle in a game where the point is to have battles. You must be a little desperate if you need to resort to bragging about doing things in a game that you should be doing..
Well you keep bragging about playing a game the facts will still be on the internet for you to look up if need be.
How about a link for your fact? I am looking and the last time something was posted about concurrent users in EVE was from 2010. Or did you guys just say in chat ok everyone ill start but lets see how high we can count get and bam you have a fact?
Don't think the situation is quite as dire as the OP suggests, but its definitely a sad spot we find ourselves in.
Not that dire because all it will take is 1 or 2 of these indie games spending a few million and making back 100x that will bring the triples A studios right back on board. Not that they really matter though, because they will simply emulate the shit out of whatever is succeeding until everyone gets sick of it and the entire process repeats itself.
To be fair. You could kinda say this about every market.
I agree with the OP. And all these kickstarter games are pretty niche. Non of them will have large playerbases in them. The small indie companies are the ones keeping the genre alive. If it wasn't for them the genre would have almost died out for sure.
Games that don't exist yet are not keeping the genre from dying lol. You would be more on the money if you said Asian developed mmos are keeping the genre alive. The former is only true in your mind.
MMOs are doing fine. Considering the low failure rate of MMOs (actual failure) compared to other video games, investing in developing MMOs is probably the safest investment you could make. MMOs considered failures by us are actually still making money. Very few developed MMOs ever lose money overall.
A successful product doesn't just reimburse the cost during development, but also makes enough to fund the next project, and very few MMORPGs actually fall into this category.
MMORPG's will not disappear. Any game genre keeps coming back. Platformers, point and click adventures, pixel art, this is all the rage now. I don't know why the OP thinks that point and click adventures are dead. Just the AAA companies don't bother with those. Fortunately there are a ridiculous amount of indie developers that release gems of games in all kinds of genres.
Look beyond this website. This website only follows mainstream gaming.
I think MMORPG lost focus on what makes the genre unique. The potential to make virtual societies has taken a back seat to largely unsatisfying grind mechanics with a reward of progression. There is a certain novelty to doing things that aren't fun on its own like grinding monsters and quests or even pvp. But all these later MMORPG have been trimmed down to this with the hooks and advantage of other players being downplayed.
The audience doesn't want MMORPG. Selling to and catering the games based around them has lead the genre down this road of emulating gameplay done better in othe genres. It's alienated a large portion of its old base and not good enough quality to truly win over new base that took hold with WoW's expansion in players into the genre.
Well you can choose to live alone and be the king in every game due to all the time you have not having kids or wife or freinds Just like me hahaha. I do have a job but a part timer to increase game time
It's dead to me ( Since SWtOR launched) but it seems the industry doesn't miss my money. It's not just MMORPGs that have drifted away from me but strategy games as well and don't even get me started about country music.
The markets full. So many MMO's out there that people are spread thin. Most are playing 2 or 3 at a time some more then that.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I don't even know what to say... these threads have been popping up for nearly a decade now. It is tiresome. I disagree, and will continue to disagree.
I don't even know what to say... these threads have been popping up for nearly a decade now. It is tiresome. I disagree, and will continue to disagree.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I used to love video games, but it all changed when I played a game called MUD. Simply a text game it had no finesse other games of that era had. But playing in a world populated by real people - it was clear to me even than : this is the future of video games, a higher state altogether. It is pointless for video games to go anywhere else.
And for long time they did. EQ , DAOC, UO ... than came WoW blew the lid off these games and opened it to the world. And everyone knew this is the way to go.
Games were made by top companies, books were written like "ready player one" - the sky was the limit.
But it failed. No need to go into details why. We all know it did.
What interest me is now.
What was once a pinnacle of gaming perfection and future of gaming. Today no professional game company want to touch. Heck even the company that made trillions on their MMO (Blizzard) stepped out of the game and started making casual products.
Instead of AAA company like Naughty Dog or CD Project Red pushing the technological envelope to MMO, we are left with handfull of "Indie" companies making MMOs
With low budgets , none of the resources or manpower of big companies - best they can make is mini-mmo , rehash of old formula ... or fail
Bottom line, even if those indie kickstarter funded games get released, which not all of them will. It will be far cry from what a healthy genre growth should have been.
They will most likely be the last to attempt it too.
And MMO will simply disappear as Point and Click adventures , RTS strategies etc did. Maybe to be unburied years after as nostalgia novelty for another round of kickstarters.
The Genre isn't dead. It's nowhere near dead. The thing is there are so many games these days thanks to the market being flooded by Asian made MMO's that the community is spread thin. The community isn't shrinking but growing but the amount of games out there are growing faster so it looks like the community is dying but we are not. It isn't like it was 20 years ago where there were only a handful of games in the genre.
I agree that it is a dying genre, but personally I think it's because the first M disappeared out of MMO in favour of solo-centric, easy-mode gameplay and cash shop items. In fact I'd replace the Massively with Moribund.
MMO's are not dead. We just have a ton of elitists who abandon ship when one little thing doesn't fit with their image of what an MMO should be.
MOGs are not dead and indeed are thriving.
MMORPGs, however are on life support and fading fast. Insisting that the health of MOGs (multiplayer online games) somehow shows that MMORPGs are healthy too is simply ridiculous.
MMORPGs have too many limitations they have to work within for them to be the future of all gaming. It's just impossible to deliver high quality non repetitive content on the scale of MMORPGs.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Yes, a dead genre always has a couple hundred titles to choose from, and new ones being released on a constant basis. /facepalm
Just because your standards are too high (ridiculously so) for any current game to meet, doesn't mean the genre is dying. In fact, it's flourishing, with a ton of promising titles on the horizon. Some are theme parks, some are sand parks, and some are sandboxes.
You people remind me of those global warming idiots in the 60's who screamed that we would all die by the seventies if we didn't do something. When that didn't happen, they moved our 'impending doom' up into the 90's. When that didn't happen (and the ozone hole proved to be inconsequential), they moved it to the 2020's and 2030's. Guess what's going to happen next?
The genre is fine. Oh, and so are point and click adventures. There's a ton of really good ones that were released recently, and a lot more on the horizon. Steam likely has 50 or more which were released in the last few years, even a few that were kickstarted.
TL;DR Typical gloom and doom claptrap from one of the resident 'old school' MMO players.
The genre is kind of shit though. MMORPGs are the laughing stock of gaming. Repetitive and grindy. Also they are not that successful. COmpared to the big blockbusters in other genres, MMORPGs look like an extremely niche genre which has the potential to sell very few copies. It just pales in comparison to shooters, RPGs and adventure games. It seems even strategy games are becoming more popular lol.
It seems even BLizzard have given up on this genre and they have been the most successful company in it. They just realised that other genres sell more, make more money and have more potential for sequels. Their new overwatch game is massive (10m played the beta) and no doubt will make a lot of money.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
fivoroth said:
The genre is kind of shit though. MMORPGs are the laughing stock of gaming. Repetitive and grindy. Also they are not that successful. COmpared to the big blockbusters in other genres, MMORPGs look like an extremely niche genre which has the potential to sell very few copies. It just pales in comparison to shooters, RPGs and adventure games. It seems even strategy games are becoming more popular lol.
It seems even BLizzard have given up on this genre and they have been the most successful company in it. They just realised that other genres sell more, make more money and have more potential for sequels. Their new overwatch game is massive (10m played the beta) and no doubt will make a lot of money.
mmorpg doesnt need to be grinding. grinding is not the main theme. dev create game to make money. grinding player doesnt give money to dev. we need huge battle arena with less grindy leveling system
mmorpg doesnt need to be grinding. grinding is not the main theme. dev create game to make money. grinding player doesnt give money to dev. we need huge battle arena with less grindy leveling system
And you started off so good.....
Actually the grind is there just so that you will pay more money. The longer it takes for you to reach the cap (what ever that is in-game) the more likely you are to spend money. Ofc there is a breaking point (and it differs from person to person) but up to that the desire to progress is what keeps one a customer.
Now with that said you cold have the most grand and epic arena system and still bork it with grind. And as i said.. one persons grind is another persons challenge. So how do you build a good system that please both... Simple answer.. you don´t. You pick one and hope for the best.
mmorpg doesnt need to be grinding. grinding is not the main theme. dev create game to make money. grinding player doesnt give money to dev. we need huge battle arena with less grindy leveling system
Just give me a grindy MMO with good grapics and interesting combat + progression and you got me.
The grindier the better, i've yet to play an MMO with too much grind. If it takes a hundred years to reach max level, even better. Chances are, tho, that my life time is too short for reaching the end game, but that's ok. At least i got something to do for every day i paid for.
If i wanted a battle arena with no grind, i'd be posting on moba.com, but this is mmorpg.com. They are supposed to take a long time to get anywhere. If they don't they are bad mmorpgs, it's that simple.
Comments
Big diff between dead and saturation.
Meanwhile in EVE we just received a significant content update with the new Citadels already triggering epic battles everywhere.
My alliance lost the fight to stand up a large fortrizar by 1 minute and 30 seconds.
10 Titans and 9 Super carriers showed up including PL who just wanted to get in on the kill mail.
Things couldn't be any busier and the future is bright indeed.
But I guess you had to be there. :pleased:
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Well you keep bragging about playing a game the facts will still be on the internet for you to look up if need be.
http://www.technobuffalo.com/2015/06/29/eve-online-seeing-lowest-player-count-since-2008/
How about a link for your fact? I am looking and the last time something was posted about concurrent users in EVE was from 2010. Or did you guys just say in chat ok everyone ill start but lets see how high we can count get and bam you have a fact?
A successful product doesn't just reimburse the cost during development, but also makes enough to fund the next project, and very few MMORPGs actually fall into this category.
Look beyond this website. This website only follows mainstream gaming.
The audience doesn't want MMORPG. Selling to and catering the games based around them has lead the genre down this road of emulating gameplay done better in othe genres. It's alienated a large portion of its old base and not good enough quality to truly win over new base that took hold with WoW's expansion in players into the genre.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
MMORPGs, however are on life support and fading fast. Insisting that the health of MOGs (multiplayer online games) somehow shows that MMORPGs are healthy too is simply ridiculous.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
The genre is kind of shit though. MMORPGs are the laughing stock of gaming. Repetitive and grindy. Also they are not that successful. COmpared to the big blockbusters in other genres, MMORPGs look like an extremely niche genre which has the potential to sell very few copies. It just pales in comparison to shooters, RPGs and adventure games. It seems even strategy games are becoming more popular lol.
It seems even BLizzard have given up on this genre and they have been the most successful company in it. They just realised that other genres sell more, make more money and have more potential for sequels. Their new overwatch game is massive (10m played the beta) and no doubt will make a lot of money.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Actually the grind is there just so that you will pay more money. The longer it takes for you to reach the cap (what ever that is in-game) the more likely you are to spend money. Ofc there is a breaking point (and it differs from person to person) but up to that the desire to progress is what keeps one a customer.
Now with that said you cold have the most grand and epic arena system and still bork it with grind. And as i said.. one persons grind is another persons challenge. So how do you build a good system that please both... Simple answer.. you don´t. You pick one and hope for the best.
This have been a good conversation
The grindier the better, i've yet to play an MMO with too much grind. If it takes a hundred years to reach max level, even better. Chances are, tho, that my life time is too short for reaching the end game, but that's ok. At least i got something to do for every day i paid for.
If i wanted a battle arena with no grind, i'd be posting on moba.com, but this is mmorpg.com. They are supposed to take a long time to get anywhere. If they don't they are bad mmorpgs, it's that simple.