Total War: Warhammer - SEGA Went Full EA

H0urg1ass

I was considering purchasing Total War: Warhammer today at full price just because of all of the good things I have heard about it. However, when I got to the steam page to make my purchase, I noticed something very weird. The overall reviews were positive, but the recent reviews were in the red mixed category. My brain said "Whoaaaa there! Hold up, why is everyone suddenly so angry?" So I started reading the reviews.

It turns out that the DLC pricing and timing has a lot of people ticked off, and after doing some quick mind-math, consider me one of the ticked.



They are charging $8 for day one DLC of one of the races that's included in the download files, but you have pay to unlock them.  Then another $19 for the first true race expansion.  $19 for a single race?  That's goddamn absurd, especially considering there are a dozen races in Warhammer. Are they planning on charging 1/3 of the box price for each new expansion?  Unreal.

The one that really got me, however, was the $3 to unlock blood and gore in a Warhammer game.  Warhammer... one of the bloodiest of games in existence.  The battle cry of one of the factions is "Blood for the Blood God!" for flying fracks sake, and they're charging $3 to unlock it?  It should be a check mark on the settings page, not a freaking individual DLC.  

I mean seriously have you seen this video?  



It opens and closes with thousands of dead bodies falling into a mountain of dead bodies. Paying for blood and gore in a Warhammer game is like buying a family meal at KFC and paying extra for the goddamn chicken.  "No sir, it only comes with mashed potatoes and cole slaw, if you want the chicken in your bucket of chicken, then you need to shell out some extra dough."

If I were to purchase the full experience today, then it would cost me $90.  Well, I'm no longer interested.  TW:W, I'll see you at Steam Winter Sale 2017.

Cleffy

Think that is expensive. Try playing Warhammer on the Table Top.

Scorchien

They can and will , people pay it , good move by them.........TW WAr has done very well

Borluc

What really pisses me off about crap like this is that they actively take ideas created by the modding community and then charge for them.  What some people created with passion and no desire for personal gain for years on end turns into milking the community for features already coded into the program.  The LOTR mod for medieval 2 far exceeded any expansion CA ever made.  

H0urg1ass

Cleffy said:

Think that is expensive. Try playing Warhammer on the Table Top.

Oh I've played the tabletop since the early 90's.  I've spent thousands and they just keep getting more expensive.

MisterZebub said:

Yeah I was chuffed to buy this game until I saw how cutthroat they were with their DLC. I'll be waiting until they put out an edition with all the DLC included, at least I will if they don't put a ridiculous price tag on it as they're doing now.

"CASH FOR THE CASH GOD!!!!" Yeah .... fuck you Sega.

Yep, this will be a wait for the "game of the year edition" game for me.  No damn way I'm paying those prices.

Wizardry

I could easily blame the developer/publisher but it is the gamer's who are to blame.

If people keep accepting dlc's we will never see a change for the better.

What MOST don't even realize that most every game i have seen do this,are actually selling "unfinished" games then selling he unfinished content as "added content" lmao.
Adding in cash shops/unlocks is just adding yet more cost to what SHOULD be one single sold game for around 50-70 depending how solid the game is and of course anything worth less is imo worthless.

Lokero

This isn't new by any means for Total War games.  They've been milking people with the dumbest DLC for ages.  For example, in Empire:TW, they sold uniforms for different units basically.

TW games have a mix of some of the worst DLC you can imagine and also some decent DLC that add a fair amount to gameplay(usually new regions/campaigns/factions and such).

Someone probably should have warned the Warhammer fans in advance, but anyone who has played a TW game just expects the horrid DLC system.

As a long time TW series fan, and one who really wants Total Warhammer, I am waiting for the "GOTY" edition purchase.  This is not just a result of the DLC but also the horrid bugs for which TW is known.

Summary:  With any TW game, it's always best advised to wait 6+ months before purchasing.

waynejr2

DMKano said:

Someone blame Trion already.

I blame Trion. 

Horusra

waynejr2 said:

DMKano said:

Someone blame Trion already.

I blame Trion. 

Trion just wishes they had a game people would contemplate buying a dlc for.

rodingo

H0urg1ass said:

I was considering purchasing Total War: Warhammer today at full price just because of all of the good things I have heard about it. However, when I got to the steam page to make my purchase, I noticed something very weird. The overall reviews were positive, but the recent reviews were in the red mixed category. My brain said "Whoaaaa there! Hold up, why is everyone suddenly so angry?" So I started reading the reviews.

It turns out that the DLC pricing and timing has a lot of people ticked off, and after doing some quick mind-math, consider me one of the ticked.

They are charging $8 for day one DLC of one of the races that's included in the download files, but you have pay to unlock them.  Then another $19 for the first true race expansion.  $19 for a single race?  That's goddamn absurd, especially considering there are a dozen races in Warhammer. Are they planning on charging 1/3 of the box price for each new expansion?  Unreal.

The one that really got me, however, was the $3 to unlock blood and gore in a Warhammer game.  Warhammer... one of the bloodiest of games in existence.  The battle cry of one of the factions is "Blood for the Blood God!" for flying fracks sake, and they're charging $3 to unlock it?  It should be a check mark on the settings page, not a freaking individual DLC.  

If I were to purchase the full experience today, then it would cost me $90.  Well, I'm no longer interested.  TW:W, I'll see you at Steam Winter Sale 2017.

This might come off as a TW fanboy post, but I will try my best for it not to be.  Part of this might be how familiar you are, or are not with the whole Total War series.

Sega basically started selling blood and gore pack DLCs since Shogun 2.  Their reasoning for selling it separately as a DLC instead of with the core game is mainly due to keeping the ESRB rating at a level that will garner more sales in more countries.  Some may argue against it, but that is just how it is.  Those DLCs  have always been around $2-$3 to include in Shogun 2, Rome 2, Attila, and now Warhammer.

The day one DLC is something that started with Rome 2 I think and ever since Sega/CA has been releasing faction DLC's in piecemeal. However in Rome 2 and Attila you usually got 3-4 factions in a culture pack.  Plus in Rome 2 and Attila they sold slightly more expensive DLCs that were actually mini-campaigns.  These usually sold for around $15 and included some different factions sometimes or at least slightly tweaked existing factions and played on new campaign map that was specific to the DLC.  This was actually done as far back with Medieval 2 and the Kingdoms expansion/DLC.

This new DLC for Warhammer, "Call of the Beastmen" is both a new faction along with a new mini-campaign which means a new campaign map and also new battlemaps that go with the beastmen theme. So the new DLC is more than just a new faction.  However, I'm  not saying that the price is worth it because only you can decide that.  I'm not too convinced myself plus I have not bought the Chaos day one DLC because Chaos doesn't interest me at all.  Not to mention I don't agree with $8 for one faction. Plus I don't pre-order games anymore so I didn't get it the faction for free. But like I said, I could care less about Chaos. With Call of the Beastmen I'm going to take a wait and see approach and see what the other fans think first.

Here is an example of a battle with the new DLC and the new battlemap

This new Total War game is both good and bad in my opinion.  It's good because the way battles are played in Total War games are perfect for the Warhammer universe.  However the campaign part of the game is extremely  slimmed down.  I think in Attila they were really going in the right direction with their campaign mechanics such as dealing with population happiness, religion, food, squalor, disease, and inter-faction politics.  Managing an empire is more of balancing act in Attila than any other Total War game I can think of.

Total War: Warhammer isn't  a bad game.  In fact the battles are just as fun as ever and managing an empire, though somewhat easier from its predecessors, is still enjoyable.  However, that said Sega/CA is still not  showing any sign of slowing down with releasing DLC's in piecemeal unfortunately.  Though they do occasionally throw us fans a bone with "freeLC" which sometimes can be a faction or even culture pack.  Their latest freeLC was a new cavalry unit added to the undead roster.

Gruug

Rarely do I purchase DLC for games. It has become too easy for these publishers (don't always blame the developers) to take things out of the finished game to sell as DLC later. So, you rarely get a full game but rather about 1/2 to 3/4. They think they can make more money selling you the rest of the game later. Not me.

ianicus

Here is a novel idea, if you don't want the dlc, don't buy it. I'll never understand people purposefully reviewing a game negatively PURELY based of its dlc monetization. As it stands total Warhammer is a very VERY well made game, and should be reviewed on those attributes. At the end of the day that's what really counts, all of the dlc made so.far is not required to play. I don't support milking gamers with dlc like this, but I wouldn't punish the designers and the people that put alot of hard work into that game because of some suits bad dlc decisions.

YashaX

The base game is a lot of fun, get the dlc on sale. 

H0urg1ass

rodingo said:

H0urg1ass said:

Stuff

This might come off as a TW fanboy post, but I will try my best for it not to be.  Part of this might be how familiar you are, or are not with the whole Total War series.

I'm not familiar with it at all.  In fact, this would have been my first RTS in years.  I was interested in this purely on the basis of being a Warhammer fanboy.

Sega basically started selling blood and gore pack DLCs since Shogun 2.  Their reasoning for selling it separately as a DLC instead of with the core game is mainly due to keeping the ESRB rating at a level that will garner more sales in more countries.  Some may argue against it, but that is just how it is.  Those DLCs  have always been around $2-$3 to include in Shogun 2, Rome 2, Attila, and now Warhammer.

I just don't agree with this on principle.  If they want to save their ESRB rating to increase sales, then have blood and gore as a completely free optional DLC.  But honestly, if they're worried about ESRB rating in a Warhammer game, then they don't understand the lore at all.  It's a sick, bloody, and violent world full of constant war and death.  Now I'm wondering if they captured that feeling since blood and gore is optional in the first place.

The day one DLC is something that started with Rome 2 I think and ever since Sega/CA has been releasing faction DLC's in piecemeal. However in Rome 2 and Attila you usually got 3-4 factions in a culture pack.  Plus in Rome 2 and Attila they sold slightly more expensive DLCs that were actually mini-campaigns.  These usually sold for around $15 and included some different factions sometimes or at least slightly tweaked existing factions and played on new campaign map that was specific to the DLC.  This was actually done as far back with Medieval 2 and the Kingdoms expansion/DLC.

Day one DLC being standard is just another reason that validates my "wait until it's on a mega sale" gaming policy of the last few years.  I will not, not pay for day one DLC.  Ever.

This new DLC for Warhammer, "Call of the Beastmen" is both a new faction along with a new mini-campaign which means a new campaign map and also new battlemaps that go with the beastmen theme. So the new DLC is more than just a new faction.  However, I'm  not saying that the price is worth it because only you can decide that.  I'm not too convinced myself plus I have not bought the Chaos day one DLC because Chaos doesn't interest me at all.  Not to mention I don't agree with $8 for one faction. Plus I don't pre-order games anymore so I didn't get it the faction for free. But like I said, I could care less about Chaos. With Call of the Beastmen I'm going to take a wait and see approach and see what the other fans think first.

I just can't see paying $20 per race, even with a mini campaign.  Especially when there are a dozen races in the world of Warhammer. I don't know how many they plan on adding to the game, but at $20 a pop the game could cost upwards of $300 by the time you have everything.

Here is an example of a battle with the new DLC and the new battlemap

This new Total War game is both good and bad in my opinion.  It's good because the way battles are played in Total War games are perfect for the Warhammer universe.  However the campaign part of the game is extremely  slimmed down.  I think in Attila they were really going in the right direction with their campaign mechanics such as dealing with population happiness, religion, food, squalor, disease, and inter-faction politics.  Managing an empire is more of balancing act in Attila than any other Total War game I can think of.

Several of the complaints in the Steam reviews mention that the game mechanics are regressing. They're saying that previous games were much better and now they're moving backwards with this one.

Total War: Warhammer isn't  a bad game.  In fact the battles are just as fun as ever and managing an empire, though somewhat easier from its predecessors, is still enjoyable.  However, that said Sega/CA is still not  showing any sign of slowing down with releasing DLC's in piecemeal unfortunately.  Though they do occasionally throw us fans a bone with "freeLC" which sometimes can be a faction or even culture pack.  Their latest freeLC was a new cavalry unit added to the undead roster.

That's cool I guess.  I mean at least they're throwing bones every once in a while for their $90 game.

Azaron_Nightblade

Cleffy said:

Think that is expensive. Try playing Warhammer on the Table Top.

That's probably what they're banking on. =P
"These guys are crazy enough to spend thousands of dollars on little tin soldiers, there's very little doubt they'll fork over tons of money for the digital versions of those tin soldiers too!" :pleased:

Solar_Prophet

Yeah, it's ridiculous. I deeply regret buying the game. Truth be told, it's not even all that good. 

I will be avoiding purchasing Sega products within the first month or two of release, that's for sure. 

Xarko

Its not only new race, its tons of new battle maps and approximately 15 hours long new campaign. Ive seen 60$ AAA games that have less content than this DLC and I bet you own some of them OP.

FrodoFragins

The base game is amazing - although I got the chaos warriors free since I bought the game in the first week.

I've put in 330 hours (on a $60 purchase) into the game since launch and it is my first total war game.  It's amazingly immersive and I knew nothing of the lore going in.  Admittadly, I used to be a big strategy game fan and had forgotten how much i liked non RTS strategy games until I played this.

While I think the DLC is overpriced, I'm OK with it since I love it so much and want them to keep pushing out more content.  I got the beastmen DLC on sale at GMG for $15 and it includes a steam code.  I've passed on the blood pack for now.  There aren't really any other games that are this immersive to me.  the hours go by so fast it's absurd.

I also bought most of the past TW games during the steam summer sale as a thank you.  I spend money on games based on how many hours it gives me.  i like at least two hours per dollar and if I hit that I spend more if they offer new content or a cash shop.

People giving the base game low scores due to DLC prices is a bit unfair.  You can always buy the base game and wait for sales on DLC.

I knew skyrim wasn't my type of game, I'm not a fan of side quests, so I waited for everything to go on sale big time.  That doesn't make the game bad in any way.  It's just called being an informed consumer. 

FrodoFragins

MisterZebub said:

Yeah I was chuffed to buy this game until I saw how cutthroat they were with their DLC. I'll be waiting until they put out an edition with all the DLC included, at least I will if they don't put a ridiculous price tag on it as they're doing now.

"CASH FOR THE CASH GOD!!!!" Yeah .... fuck you Sega.

LOL.

They are ramping up the amount of DLC's they are making for the game due to the large sales numbers.   you will likely be waiting years and by then the second game of their TW:WH trilogy will be out.  There's nothing wrong with the base games content. Especially compared with 99% of console games that last a week or two.

The beastmen will be added as an  NPC faction for free and the amount of free modded content is amazing.

LupusVai

In my opinion the reason people are getting fleeced so hard on this game is because of Denuvo copy protection. They can charge what they want because the game is so hard to crack that it will be months if ever that its able to be pirated. (i suspect never as its not a big title) Therefore captive audience with only two options pay through the teeth or don't play.

Really goes to show that all of the claims from the software industry (and movie music for that matter) that the reason games are so expensive is because of piracy and if there wasn't piracy they'd be much cheaper are bs.
Same goes for the new xbox and playstation games I don't think they're pirateable yet? They're all expensive regardless of there being no piracy with their titles.

I'm not advocating piracy by the way, just making an observational comment.

YashaX

H0urg1ass said:

Several of the complaints in the Steam reviews mention that the game mechanics are regressing. They're saying that previous games were much better and now they're moving backwards with this one.

It has lots of new features that aren't in the older titles, in some ways it is much deeper and the changes fit the War universe. The first Rome TW is still my favorite (in a nostalgic kind of way), but pretty sure that is partly because every game since is basically a mod of that so I never really feel that "new game" buzz from subsequent TW games.

Most of the complaints are either people who are fans of the old games and can't accept any change and people who don't like the DLC charges. Imo its well worth the price for the base game. 9/10.

Heretique

Can't wait to see things such as "Controller Support" DLC in future games, if people are willing to pay, why stop!

Maurgrim

Don't blame CA for these payed  DLC, blame the fanatic fanboys who buys everything CA throws at them, they are the ones who made this mess in the first place.

hfztt

This on a forum where people BEG for sub MMO's? You get your nuts in a twist about paying 1½ month worth of sub for ACTUAL content?

The irony is strong with this one...

tawess

Meh... Their reason for the blood pack was sound and the cost was fucking peanuts. Blame the ratings board more than SEGA on that one because they are seven shades of fucked up. 

As for 19 per race. That is a bit steep. But sad to say i am getting fairly hardened to these sort of things. 

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