Just seen this video based on an interview that Chris Roberts gave at
Gamescom. It centres around the ship pricing structure after launch and
how the disparity between ship pricing is looking to increase anywhere from 100% to 300%. This gives a huge boost to anyone who buys a ship before release.
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
Its always funny when the 'most open development ever' discussions in EVERY SINGLE TOPIC about this project always have the supporters claiming 'its all opinion because no one knows anything yet'. Thats EVERY topic. Go look at the first page and look at the topics. Eventually someone says that its speculation (when a critic makes a valid point). So how is it 4 plus years into the most openly developed game ever can there still be so many questions and so many things no one knows about? Or they post links from before kickstarter ended.
These guys do weekly podcats and monthly updates yet they never really answer anything apparently. At least not on the 'important' stuff.
Just seen this video based on an interview that Chris Roberts gave at
Gamescom. It centres around the ship pricing structure after launch and
how the disparity between ship pricing is looking to increase anywhere from 100% to 300%. This gives a huge boost to anyone who buys a ship before release.
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
For arena commander you can purchase (or rather take a loan of) a lot of ships yes. For the PU, not yet. This is probably a good thing at this stage.
"Trump is a blunt force, all-American, laser-guided middle finger to everything and everyone in Washington, D.C." - Wayne Allyn Root
Just seen this video based on an interview that Chris Roberts gave at
Gamescom. It centres around the ship pricing structure after launch and
how the disparity between ship pricing is looking to increase anywhere from 100% to 300%. This gives a huge boost to anyone who buys a ship before release.
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
Now its time to have the real discussion. From looking around I discovered that the ingame credits system isn't active yet. They are doing some other temporary credit thing for the instanced dogfighting module where you rent ships in order to use them to dogfight. You may use the rented ships in the PU as well.
SO that entire system that is in place right now will be removed. The real question is why did Chris threaten to raise the prices of ships when they don't even have prices yet? Is this another marketing ploy to make players feel like they must purchase ships now before the price goes up? Not even realizing there is no price to increase because it isn't even in the game yet. Man unless I get a good answer this really looks bad on CIG right now.
SO that entire system that is in place right now will be removed. The real question is why did Chris threaten to raise the prices of ships when they don't even have prices yet? Is this another marketing ploy to make players feel like they must purchase ships now before the price goes up? Not even realizing there is no price to increase because it isn't even in the game yet. Man unless I get a good answer this really looks bad on CIG right now.
What?! The REC renting system will remain on the game, is part of Arena Commander. You are set to earn ships by playing AC to use on AC only, that's its own "mini-game" inside SC. So they aren't removing that.
They do have prices, the price of the direct Money Value > UEC conversion, that was already said before the UEC value would obviously change once they got to it. They once shown one WIP Ship Shop UI on witch some ships UEC prices were visible.
The UEC value that is currently 10K = 10$. 100$ Ship on direct conversion would be worth 100K UEC.
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
You can rent ships in the Arena Commander module using a currency called REC. This can be earned in AC and Vanduul Swarm. REC or any items purchased via REC cannot be use in the "persistent universe".
SO that entire system that is in place right now will be removed. The real question is why did Chris threaten to raise the prices of ships when they don't even have prices yet? Is this another marketing ploy to make players feel like they must purchase ships now before the price goes up? Not even realizing there is no price to increase because it isn't even in the game yet. Man unless I get a good answer this really looks bad on CIG right now.
He might not have meant it to be construed that way but if you were to follow the comment to its logical conclusion it is certainly the unspoken implication behind it. One should note that they have systems in place to earn and buy items, on one side you can rent ships (weekly) and on the other side you can buy clothing and guns but you cannot buy clothing guns and ships in the same place. Personally I think there is only one reason for that.
He might not have meant it to be construed that way but if you were to follow the comment to its logical conclusion it is certainly the unspoken implication behind it.
Man, don't you remember the ship pledge value vs UEC in-game value? If a ship pledge is 100$ people would assume the ship would cost 100$ worth of UEC Credits (100K).
Didn't you knew the credit value vs pledge value wouldn't be how they would price ships in-game? When that wip of ship shop UI leaked some prices that were conversion of direct pledge price to UEC but then those were not the real prices.
Personally I think there is only one reason for that.
I would imagine there are many and various reasons for that. Seriously, this inference that a company shouldn't have some focus on raising money as a business and if they do they are 'bad bad con men only interested in one thing!' is all a bit kindergarten stuff no?
"Trump is a blunt force, all-American, laser-guided middle finger to everything and everyone in Washington, D.C." - Wayne Allyn Root
Man, don't you remember the ship pledge value vs UEC in-game value? If a ship pledge is 100$ people would assume the ship would cost 100$ worth of UEC Credits (100K).
Didn't you knew the credit value vs pledge value wouldn't be how they would price ships in-game? When that wip of ship shop UI leaked some prices that were conversion of direct pledge price to UEC but then those were not the real prices.
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in a week. Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in 60 hours.
There was a comment made a long time ago about how UEC equivalant pricing might indeed be higher in the game but there has been quite a few statements since then which would appear to contradict that comment.
Connie price / 60 hours = 5000 UEC per hour.
Didn't you notice that when they did the Gamescom demo the players earned about 3000 UEC in half an hour. Not very far from the "earn a connie in 60 hours" comment that had been given out before.
I wonder how renting is going to work. If you have a bad habit of getting rented ships blown up will they continue to rent ships to you.
Rented ships are rented with the REC currency. And its an IN SIM-POD system .... as Arena Commander is simulated space combat only. So you can blow up rented ships to your hearts content as many as you like. Its only bits and bytes ... or should I saw SIMULATED simpod bits and bytes existing as bits and bytes in a computer game on your computer.
There are currently no known plans for the Persistent Universe that one can rent ships from NPCs. I am sure many PLAYERS will rent out ships ... what they will do to you if you blow up the rented ships is up to them and you. In and out of the game.
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in a week. Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in 60 hours.
There was a comment made a long time ago about how UEC equivalant pricing might indeed be higher in the game but there has been quite a few statements since then which would appear to contradict that comment.
Connie price / 60 hours = 5000 UEC per hour.
Didn't you notice that when they did the Gamescom demo the players earned about 3000 UEC in half an hour. Not very far from the "earn a connie in 60 hours" comment that had been given out before.
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in a week / 60 hours the backers that protested about how easy it would get ships that were set in hundreds during their pledges?
I'm not sure the statement would remain today as the plan, theew certainly should be a progression but if a connie could be earned in a week, we would all be flying our own Idris Capital Ships in a few months, what is insanely fast comparing to "gear progression" on other MMO's.
For me when he says about the price increase when replying a question about earning them in-game, so their value on UEC what brings me back to that moment i mentioned, the UEC prices would be more expensive than the pledge value.
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
As ships currently are free in the Alpha version of the game - NO. You can request as many ships from the Port Olisar terminals as you want for free. And then blow them up. Ad infinitum ad nauseam. So there is no need to buy ships in game with in game credits. And therefore also no known price.
In the future you will be able to buy ships and ship parts in the "Astro Armada" ship retailer shop on ArcCorp.
The in-game economy is nearly nonexistent right now, so it's a bit early to holler one way or another. Too many elects of the game aren't in place. Said elements will be a huge driver in the overall economy, like player-based ship repair (not cry-astro), mining, fuel harvesting, and the refining of resources into usable components to facilitate repairs and NPC crafting of new products. How much will those operations cost the player to run, how much revenue will it earn them?
For now, they have small arms for sale, hand guns and various rifles. The prices on these feel fairly comparable to the real world. Following Chris' comments along this thread, ship prices will fall into line with the prices of airplanes and ships in the real world...maybe slightly less.
Right now, the earnings for missions seems ridiculous when compared to the cost of fuel, ammo, and repairs likely to be incurred for carrying out said mission This is the kind of thing that needs to be refined over time. Right now, risking a multi-million dollar ship on a mission that doesn't even pay enough to by me a new rifle, much less rearm and repair said ship.
TL;DR
Cost on anything is relative to the cost of everything. We do not have pricing of everything yet. I don't think we can start to balance out the economy until more elements that contribute to it are in-place. Therefore, asking what one element of said economy will cost is basically asking an individual to just make shit up on the spot. I am no economist, but that is how the situation appears to me.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone www.spankybus.com -3d Artist & Compositor -Writer -Professional Amature
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in a week / 60 hours the backers that protested about how easy it would get ships that were set in hundreds during their pledges?
I'm not sure the statement would remain today as the plan, theew certainly should be a progression but if a connie could be earned in a week, we would all be flying our own Idris Capital Ships in a few months, what is insanely fast comparing to "gear progression" on other MMO's.
For me when he says about the price increase when replying a question about earning them in-game, so their value on UEC what brings me back to that moment i mentioned, the UEC prices would be more expensive than the pledge value.
Yes, earning in a week would be silly. But 60 hours seemed quite reasonable, that's 20 days for a pretty hardore gamer and far more for someone with a lot of family/social responsibilites.
Besides, should CIG be catering to people that choose to pay for these things (the very same people who also extol that their purchases are to fund development, not seek an advantage) or should CIG be catering to getting and keeping the non-ship buying customer.
I've always said that this balancing of pleasing the wallet warriors and the normal people would be a task I don't wish on anyone but it appears that Roberts has decided to cast his lot with the whales....
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
As ships currently are free in the Alpha version of the game - NO. You can request as many ships from the Port Olisar terminals as you want for free. And then blow them up. Ad infinitum ad nauseam. So there is no need to buy ships in game with in game credits. And therefore also no known price.
In the future you will be able to buy ships and ship parts in the "Astro Armada" ship retailer shop on ArcCorp.
Have fun
Their free? I thought after they were blown up once they went into a cool down timer where you either wait or spend UEC to unlock them right away?
Wonder if that mechanic will transfer into the finished game? Don't want to wait for insurance to replace your ship? A fee can be paid to make you a priority!
Yes, earning in a week would be silly. But 60 hours seemed quite reasonable, that's 20 days for a pretty hardore gamer and far more for someone with a lot of family/social responsibilites.
Well they can balance this out several ways. Imagine they want ships to be fairly fast to get, yet they will counter it to make it fairly easy to loose them as well. It's one possibility for sure.
The hardcore gamer vs casual gamer on MMO's it's a flaw on the genre itself. Because some people have +10 per day to dedicate to the MMO, the game itself will keep increasing the grind bar to fit those people (otherwise they will catch-up to the top too fast and have nothing else to grind for)... in consequence the casual players are put in front of the Great Wall of Grind.
The only real balance one MMO could do when there is this type of progression is limit how much time a player play per day, and maintain a casual level of grind for everyone. However that will never happen!
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
As ships currently are free in the Alpha version of the game - NO. You can request as many ships from the Port Olisar terminals as you want for free. And then blow them up. Ad infinitum ad nauseam. So there is no need to buy ships in game with in game credits. And therefore also no known price.
In the future you will be able to buy ships and ship parts in the "Astro Armada" ship retailer shop on ArcCorp.
Have fun
Their free? I thought after they were blown up once they went into a cool down timer where you either wait or spend UEC to unlock them right away?
Wonder if that mechanic will transfer into the finished game? Don't want to wait for insurance to replace your ship? A fee can be paid to make you a priority!
With a 15% discount if you use UEC purchased from the cash shop, or perhaps it'll be token based but the tokens can only be bought from the cash shop and converting in-game UEC to a token has a large brokers fee....
I'm pretty sure that the "spend UEC to reduce the timer" was written into lore, will have to see if I can find that article.
Wonder if that mechanic will transfer into the finished game? Don't want to wait for insurance to replace your ship? A fee can be paid to make you a priority!
That mechanic will transfer though the final game yes. It's part of the insurance mechanic.
Not sure about fees but they wouldn't be a bad idea. Otherwise it opens quite the loopholes on the insurance mechanic that would allow ways to trick or abuse it. Things like let a player steal your ship on purpose, insurance pays back and repeat the process.
Just wondering. Can you purchase a ship right now ingame with ingame credits?
As ships currently are free in the Alpha version of the game - NO. You can request as many ships from the Port Olisar terminals as you want for free. And then blow them up. Ad infinitum ad nauseam. So there is no need to buy ships in game with in game credits. And therefore also no known price.
In the future you will be able to buy ships and ship parts in the "Astro Armada" ship retailer shop on ArcCorp.
Have fun
Their free? I thought after they were blown up once they went into a cool down timer where you either wait or spend UEC to unlock them right away?
Wonder if that mechanic will transfer into the finished game? Don't want to wait for insurance to replace your ship? A fee can be paid to make you a priority!
We already know that there will be wait time before the insurance replaces your ship.
I think the final game will have either a) Instant replacement for ship if you pay extra, or b) Everyone buying 3 copies of their favorite ship so that you can skip the waiting
There is still insufficient information to calculate a final UEC to hour conversion rate at the moment. There is no official announcement about that. And I doubt there will be, as people play very differently and earn money at very different rates.
The ONLY thing that we have been able to calculate from Chris old statement was that ROUGHLY one hour of game time (non-hard core gaming, non-100 % cash earning missions) corresponds to about 4,17 $ worth of pledge ship. The 4.17 comes from price Constellation (250 $) divided by 60 (hours). And no, you cannot use the 1 $ to 1000 UEC conversion rate, because this specifically is NOT applicable for the UEC wallet with which you buy ships. There is a separate wallet linked to UEC bought via real-world-money-conversion.
So a single seater starter ship is some 13 hours of game time (non-hard core non-100 % cash earning missions). 54 $ divided by 4.17..
A single seater regular fighter is around 30 hours of game time.
A Connie is approx. 60 hours of game time - the example given by Chris Roberts.
And a Javelin with a crew of 24 that pools their resources would require around 25 hours of game time from EACH crew member.
So again ... at this time we have insufficient knowledge to know if owners of big ships have advantages over other pilots.
I'm 100% sure that the Constellation you purchased for over $200 with 10 weapon hardpoints and its own fighter will have a huge advantage over any other ship costing less.
Huge advantage at what?
Fighting?
The Constellation is slower than the smaller dedicated fighters and its main offense is missiles which are a pain to target at smaller fast ships, can be avoided rather easily and cost a lot of $$$ to replenish. Macross Missiles Massacre is cool to look at though.
Cargo hauling?
It has an awful cargo/ship size ratio compared to the other cargo haulers unless you get the Taurus variant which doesn't have the snub-fighter.
Operation cost?
It requires 5 players/NPCs to fully operate without automated hardware...
I just got done watching Macross Do You Remember Love and then i saw your missile massacre comment LOL!
Comments
These guys do weekly podcats and monthly updates yet they never really answer anything apparently. At least not on the 'important' stuff.
"Trump is a blunt force, all-American, laser-guided middle finger to everything and everyone in Washington, D.C." - Wayne Allyn Root
SO that entire system that is in place right now will be removed. The real question is why did Chris threaten to raise the prices of ships when they don't even have prices yet? Is this another marketing ploy to make players feel like they must purchase ships now before the price goes up? Not even realizing there is no price to increase because it isn't even in the game yet. Man unless I get a good answer this really looks bad on CIG right now.
I think it's not yet there because there needs to exist the differentiation between what you actually bought and what you bought with Alpha UEC.
What?! The REC renting system will remain on the game, is part of Arena Commander. You are set to earn ships by playing AC to use on AC only, that's its own "mini-game" inside SC. So they aren't removing that.
They do have prices, the price of the direct Money Value > UEC conversion, that was already said before the UEC value would obviously change once they got to it. They once shown one WIP Ship Shop UI on witch some ships UEC prices were visible.
The UEC value that is currently 10K = 10$.
100$ Ship on direct conversion would be worth 100K UEC.
This was already known... --'
You can rent ships in the Arena Commander module using a currency called REC. This can be earned in AC and Vanduul Swarm. REC or any items purchased via REC cannot be use in the "persistent universe".
He might not have meant it to be construed that way but if you were to follow the comment to its logical conclusion it is certainly the unspoken implication behind it.
One should note that they have systems in place to earn and buy items, on one side you can rent ships (weekly) and on the other side you can buy clothing and guns but you cannot buy clothing guns and ships in the same place.
Personally I think there is only one reason for that.
"Trump is a blunt force, all-American, laser-guided middle finger to everything and everyone in Washington, D.C." - Wayne Allyn Root
Didn't you knew the credit value vs pledge value wouldn't be how they would price ships in-game? When that wip of ship shop UI leaked some prices that were conversion of direct pledge price to UEC but then those were not the real prices.
"Trump is a blunt force, all-American, laser-guided middle finger to everything and everyone in Washington, D.C." - Wayne Allyn Root
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in a week.
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in 60 hours.
There was a comment made a long time ago about how UEC equivalant pricing might indeed be higher in the game but there has been quite a few statements since then which would appear to contradict that comment.
Connie price / 60 hours = 5000 UEC per hour.
Didn't you notice that when they did the Gamescom demo the players earned about 3000 UEC in half an hour. Not very far from the "earn a connie in 60 hours" comment that had been given out before.
There are currently no known plans for the Persistent Universe that one can rent ships from NPCs. I am sure many PLAYERS will rent out ships ... what they will do to you if you blow up the rented ships is up to them and you. In and out of the game.
If you still wonder, read this:
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/faq/rec-faq
Have fun
Don't you remember when he said a connie could be earned in a week / 60 hours the backers that protested about how easy it would get ships that were set in hundreds during their pledges?
I'm not sure the statement would remain today as the plan, theew certainly should be a progression but if a connie could be earned in a week, we would all be flying our own Idris Capital Ships in a few months, what is insanely fast comparing to "gear progression" on other MMO's.
For me when he says about the price increase when replying a question about earning them in-game, so their value on UEC what brings me back to that moment i mentioned, the UEC prices would be more expensive than the pledge value.
In the future you will be able to buy ships and ship parts in the "Astro Armada" ship retailer shop on ArcCorp.
Have fun
For now, they have small arms for sale, hand guns and various rifles. The prices on these feel fairly comparable to the real world. Following Chris' comments along this thread, ship prices will fall into line with the prices of airplanes and ships in the real world...maybe slightly less.
Right now, the earnings for missions seems ridiculous when compared to the cost of fuel, ammo, and repairs likely to be incurred for carrying out said mission This is the kind of thing that needs to be refined over time. Right now, risking a multi-million dollar ship on a mission that doesn't even pay enough to by me a new rifle, much less rearm and repair said ship.
TL;DR
Cost on anything is relative to the cost of everything. We do not have pricing of everything yet. I don't think we can start to balance out the economy until more elements that contribute to it are in-place. Therefore, asking what one element of said economy will cost is basically asking an individual to just make shit up on the spot. I am no economist, but that is how the situation appears to me.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone
www.spankybus.com
-3d Artist & Compositor
-Writer
-Professional Amature
Yes, earning in a week would be silly. But 60 hours seemed quite reasonable, that's 20 days for a pretty hardore gamer and far more for someone with a lot of family/social responsibilites.
Besides, should CIG be catering to people that choose to pay for these things (the very same people who also extol that their purchases are to fund development, not seek an advantage) or should CIG be catering to getting and keeping the non-ship buying customer.
I've always said that this balancing of pleasing the wallet warriors and the normal people would be a task I don't wish on anyone but it appears that Roberts has decided to cast his lot with the whales....
Wonder if that mechanic will transfer into the finished game? Don't want to wait for insurance to replace your ship? A fee can be paid to make you a priority!
Imagine they want ships to be fairly fast to get, yet they will counter it to make it fairly easy to loose them as well. It's one possibility for sure.
The hardcore gamer vs casual gamer on MMO's it's a flaw on the genre itself. Because some people have +10 per day to dedicate to the MMO, the game itself will keep increasing the grind bar to fit those people (otherwise they will catch-up to the top too fast and have nothing else to grind for)... in consequence the casual players are put in front of the Great Wall of Grind.
The only real balance one MMO could do when there is this type of progression is limit how much time a player play per day, and maintain a casual level of grind for everyone. However that will never happen!
With a 15% discount if you use UEC purchased from the cash shop, or perhaps it'll be token based but the tokens can only be bought from the cash shop and converting in-game UEC to a token has a large brokers fee....
I'm pretty sure that the "spend UEC to reduce the timer" was written into lore, will have to see if I can find that article.
Not sure about fees but they wouldn't be a bad idea. Otherwise it opens quite the loopholes on the insurance mechanic that would allow ways to trick or abuse it. Things like let a player steal your ship on purpose, insurance pays back and repeat the process.
I think the final game will have either
a) Instant replacement for ship if you pay extra, or
b) Everyone buying 3 copies of their favorite ship so that you can skip the waiting
Incorrect assumption.
There is still insufficient information to calculate a final UEC to hour conversion rate at the moment. There is no official announcement about that. And I doubt there will be, as people play very differently and earn money at very different rates.
The ONLY thing that we have been able to calculate from Chris old statement was that ROUGHLY one hour of game time (non-hard core gaming, non-100 % cash earning missions) corresponds to about 4,17 $ worth of pledge ship. The 4.17 comes from price Constellation (250 $) divided by 60 (hours). And no, you cannot use the 1 $ to 1000 UEC conversion rate, because this specifically is NOT applicable for the UEC wallet with which you buy ships. There is a separate wallet linked to UEC bought via real-world-money-conversion.
So a single seater starter ship is some 13 hours of game time (non-hard core non-100 % cash earning missions). 54 $ divided by 4.17..
A single seater regular fighter is around 30 hours of game time.
A Connie is approx. 60 hours of game time - the example given by Chris Roberts.
And a Javelin with a crew of 24 that pools their resources would require around 25 hours of game time from EACH crew member.
Have fun