Should scamming be legal in EVE?

filmoret

We have all heard the horror stories about people scamming other players in Eve and basically getting away with it because they don't offer any real way to counter or deal with it once it has been done.  What do you think about the situation of legal scamming?

Sovrath

Why is there not a real way to counter it? Can't you just find the person/people who scammed you and destroy their ships? 

filmoret

Sovrath said:

Why is there not a real way to counter it? Can't you just find the person/people who scammed you and destroy their ships? 

Sort of but not really.  You cannot touch their bank account and yes you might be able to destroy a ship or two but the ammount of credits they stole makes them able to build millions of ships.

Vrika

We should also start punishing all those horrible players who kills others in PvP.

Gdemami

Vrika said:

We should also start punishing all those horrible players who kills others in PvP.

...making silly polls hurts as much.

laxie

Players getting killed is fair game. I've seen posters protest against people killing new pilots. I got killed several times in "medium safe" areas - comes with an open world PvP game.

At the same time, I've seen people outright scamming players. Some players are 100% dedicated to scamming operations, doing literally nothing else to make income. The game is very complex, leaving players at the mercy of others. As cautious as you are, you'll need to ask for advice/help at some point. I'd argue that if developers have the ability to prevent direct scamming, they should.

I'm a strong believer of bringing out the best in people. People are only as nice as the frame work you put them in. Why nurture cheating and scamming, if we can encourage people to be fair.

Octagon7711

Eve and Archeage would double their populations in a month or two if they went full PvE.  Both good games with good system and bad zoning.

FlyByKnight

Octagon7711 said:

Eve and Archeage would double their populations in a month or two if they went full PvE.  Both good games with good system and bad zoning.

How Sway?

Kyleran

Scamming is just part of the many things that give EVE its charm, though it would be nice if they devised some form of retribution for it. 

With the new alpha clones I expect to see a huge spike in station scamming alts in the big trade hubs.

H0urg1ass

Octagon7711 said:

Eve and Archeage would double their populations in a month or two if they went full PvE.  Both good games with good system and bad zoning.

EVE and Archeage would be dead in 90 days if they went full PVE.  The entire economy depends on PVP. Not only that, but a large segment of the population logs on for one activity and that's blowing up each other's ships.

filmoret

H0urg1ass said:

Octagon7711 said:

Eve and Archeage would double their populations in a month or two if they went full PvE.  Both good games with good system and bad zoning.

EVE and Archeage would be dead in 90 days if they went full PVE.  The entire economy depends on PVP. Not only that, but a large segment of the population logs on for one activity and that's blowing up each other's ships.

Archeage would thrive but Eve wouldn't.  Eve really doesn't have anything when PVE is concerned.  Then again I guess if players could just build stations perhaps pve players would love it.

I think the scamming has major flaws that they should have fixed or at least considered.  We know the horror stories about gaming with the same dude for 3 years and suddenly he's cleaned out the entire faction account and ran off with over 10k$ real money worth of ISKS.  There is absolutely nothing that faction can do to retaliate and the person with the isks just sells it and gets real life money.  Then that person can just transfer the isks to an alternate account and boom all that money and the trail is dead cold and gone.

Octagon7711

FlyByKnight said:

Octagon7711 said:

Eve and Archeage would double their populations in a month or two if they went full PvE.  Both good games with good system and bad zoning.

How Sway?

People hate WoW buts it's successful because of the way it zones it's PvP and PvE.  People realize there are many flavors of PvP, battlegrounds, raids, tournaments, ganking, and more.  Most games with large populations cater to everyone but don't let any one element overpower the others.

Erillion

A way to counter scams ?

Use your brain !  Trust no one fully !


Have fun

rpmcmurphy

Not a scammer myself but I really enjoy that the potential is there. The majority of scams are so easily spotted that the only way someone could fall for them is if they let greed lead them by the nose.

cheyane

It involves real money not just in game currency. Am I wrong about that ? If it is just in game currency then you should leave the game alone but if it is real money I think some controls may be appropriate.

Erillion

cheyane said:

It involves real money not just in game currency. Am I wrong about that ? If it is just in game currency then you should leave the game alone but if it is real money I think some controls may be appropriate.

Real money is not involved.

But you CAN calculate a real money equivalent value from the PLEX- ISK conversion rate.


Have fun

Phry

Erillion said:

cheyane said:

It involves real money not just in game currency. Am I wrong about that ? If it is just in game currency then you should leave the game alone but if it is real money I think some controls may be appropriate.

Real money is not involved.

But you CAN calculate a real money equivalent value from the PLEX- ISK conversion rate.


Have fun

The Real Money to Isk comparisons are mostly just that, its a useful tool for estimating the value of ships killed etc. that are on your Corps Kill Board real money isn't actually involved other than as a yardstick.
Its worth noting that while Scams are quite common, the best defence against them, is common sense, as most Scams rely on either greed, or naivity on the part of the victim.
Eve has a fairly steep learning curve, this is just one of them, and honestly, its not CCP's job to protect players from their own stupidity, and if they learn a lesson from it in game, where the consequences are 'virtual' then it may better prepare them for the scams that exist IRL, and i don't mean other MMO's etc. but the day to day scams that exist on the net, television, etc. Because sometimes, when you listen the the various complaints people have, i wonder if they are prepared to venture out onto the street without parental supervision.

DijonCyanide

That is one of the reasons why I do not play PvP nor invest any real-world money into PvPing.  I might dabble & invest some time into PvP, but when I get killed I was expecting it.  EVE Online being a only PvP, I would had considered subscribing back in the day if they offered a PvE version, is why I never subscribed & invested into the game.  I also remember a LONG time ago reading the story, pretty sure from this web site too, about how someone that worked for EVE Online was helping a player or players.  To me that would be similar to "insider-trading".  I am sure after that safeguards were implemented.  Losing in-game virtual assets is one thing, but if that carries over into losing real-world money based off of gameplay HELL NO.  In a PvP game though one should expect to be ganked eventually.

Elsabolts

Eve should have a PVE server only.

Loke666

Scamming could be used in some MMOs but Eves PLEX system is not a great thing for that. It would be interesting though to make a MMO where scams are part of the base mechanics.

Onigod

I think when it happens ingame it should not be banable or anything punishable, I remember in Darkfall I scammed the shit out of 1 guild and made a full group of people hand me over most of their stash and their hard work,  would I steal irl? never.  

Being scammed (if you know what scammed actually means) is the person being scammed his own fault, when real money and passwords get involved it is a different story and the scammer should be banned but people have to realise that a game company is not the internet police.

DeVoDeVo

It already is legal right?  I mean, I read so much about scamming in this game.  The scammers and player base laugh about it while the developers do little.  Seems legal to me.

filmoret

Erillion said:

A way to counter scams ?

Use your brain !  Trust no one fully !


Have fun

Easy thing to say but once a faction gives money to a carrier for the purpose of getting some military supplies or making any kind of supply run.  He can just walk away and nothing you can really do about it.  I thought you played this game?

Erillion said:

cheyane said:

It involves real money not just in game currency. Am I wrong about that ? If it is just in game currency then you should leave the game alone but if it is real money I think some controls may be appropriate.

Real money is not involved.

But you CAN calculate a real money equivalent value from the PLEX- ISK conversion rate.


Have fun

Last I checked you can sell the isk for real money.  Or did they change that feature?

AreWeLive

filmoret said:

We have all heard the horror stories about people scamming other players in Eve and basically getting away with it because they don't offer any real way to counter or deal with it once it has been done.  What do you think about the situation of legal scamming?

really if you need to ask this question then this game is not for you and maybe you should just move on.....

Erillion

filmoret said:

Last I checked you can sell the isk for real money.  Or did they change that feature?

When did you last check ?

2023 ?

Such a feature was never in the game. Unless you mean e-bay ;-)



Have fun

Slapshot1188

If the "scamming" occurs within the context of the game and does not consist of exploiting some bug then why in the world would we want a rule against it?

If the "scamming" includes out of game components or exploiting bugs then that's a different story.