Bethesda Cancels PS4 Mod Support Sony to Blame

[Deleted User]

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laserit

Shitty

heocat

Typical $ony B.S.

bartoni33

I feel bad for those that bought both those games on console in the hopes of being able to mod them.

[Deleted User]

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laserit

Being so closed ended is a lot more negative than positive.

Konfess

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

It's Bethesda that is saying they won't pay for every mod to get checked out, like you would a rescue dog at the pound.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same users come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying because Bethesda Bitch Slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

laserit

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same user come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying to Bethesda Bitch slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Android and Apple don't seem to have a problem.

SEANMCAD

blueturtle13 said:

 will not approve user mods the way they should work: where users can do anything they want...

https://bethesda.net/#en/events/game/ps4-mod-update/2016/09/09/199

kind of an abstract answer on their part which one could ride several mack trucks thru

'how it should work'? and 'how should it work'? exactly
'do anything they want'? like inject a virus? or with the exact same parameters as a PC? or does 'anything they want' include things that only a PC could use and thus its not 'anything the user wants'

hmmm...not that I dont trust what a company owned by Zenimax says but I dont trust anything a company owned by Zenimax says

[Deleted User]

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Vrika

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

It's Bethesda that is saying they won't pay for every mod to get checked out, like you would a rescue dog at the pound.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same users come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying because Bethesda Bitch Slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Bethesda does not have the option to get all mods checked though PS4's normal approval process: There are more than 49 thousand mods, enchantments and resouces available for Skyrim on Skyrim Nexus. That's more than 50 times the number of Playstation 4 games available. Fallout 4 is newer so it has less mods: Only 15 times the number of all Playstation 4 games.

Running all those mods through same approval process that Sony uses for full games is no option.


Also Sony doesn't prevent mods because of possible hacking. Mods for Skyrim and Fallout 4 are not programs, they are instructions for game client what to do. A bit like a webpage is instructions for web browser on what to do. That's not to say they couldn't be used for hacking, but it's not much easier than to use a webpage to hack Playstation 4.

gervaise1

Torval said:

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

It's Bethesda that is saying they won't pay for every mod to get checked out, like you would a rescue dog at the pound.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same users come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying because Bethesda Bitch Slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Unless a mod executes a third party executable there is rarely a way for it to exploit anything beyond the game, unless the modding API provides for it. It's possible for Lua scripting to do that, but not likely or often implemented in that way. It would be interesting to know how the mod framework could be expected to present a vulnerability in the PlayStation platform.

@Konfess has the right of it imo.

And I am sure that is what Bethseda will have said. And so they will have suggested that they just allow them all unchecked.

And Sony will - we can assume - probably said not unless they are checked. Or maybe they invited Bethseda to do the checking - since Sony won't have the resources o do so. And - key point - to underwrite any and all fallout resulting from any exploits, hacks or service denials that result. Bethseda - who I think we can assume - won't have the resources anyway will not have wanted to do this.

As you say "rarely a way for it to exploit". Would you bank on a "rarely" though? Which could cost you mega-millions?

Konfess

laserit said:

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same user come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying to Bethesda Bitch slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Android and Apple don't seem to have a problem.

Apple not only has this problem, they created the system that Sony is using.  Android and MS also have this problem and a system I am not at liberty to talk about.

[Deleted User]

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Octagon7711

So Sony says it's a big potential problem and everyone else seems to think it's not, ok.

[Deleted User]

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gervaise1

Torval said:

gervaise1 said:

Torval said:

<snip>

<snip>

What specifically is Sony worried about? Is this really about security or more about losing control of the developers and software in their ecosystem. <snip>.

Sony could very well be "reluctant" to let developers into their ecosystem from a business point of view.

What they are worried about though is anything remotely like the breach they suffered previously. Senior managers - possibly scarred and untrusting of security statements (the like of which they will have heard before) - will now be "paranoid". Jobs probably on the line as well etc. And they will want an absolute guarantee. And without such a guarantee its an easy business decision to take: no reward, increased risk with possible large impact.

Now, as I suggested, they may have been OK if Zenimax had took charge of checking all mods and then underwriting any harm that might result from accepting them. Maybe - not sure though. Even if they did go that far however Zenimax - again from a business prespective - wouldn't give such an underwriting. No reward, possible large downside. 

From a software side I agree there should almost certainly be no issue. That is not an absolute though. So from a business perspective - that looks at things like risk mitigation - this is a very easy decision to take.

[Deleted User]

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cagan

test

Konfess

Vrika said:

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

It's Bethesda that is saying they won't pay for every mod to get checked out, like you would a rescue dog at the pound.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same users come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying because Bethesda Bitch Slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Bethesda does not have the option to get all mods checked though PS4's normal approval process: There are more than 49 thousand mods, enchantments and resouces available for Skyrim on Skyrim Nexus. That's more than 50 times the number of Playstation 4 games available. Fallout 4 is newer so it has less mods: Only 15 times the number of all Playstation 4 games.

Running all those mods through same approval process that Sony uses for full games is no option.


Also Sony doesn't prevent mods because of possible hacking. Mods for Skyrim and Fallout 4 are not programs, they are instructions for game client what to do. A bit like a webpage is instructions for web browser on what to do. That's not to say they couldn't be used for hacking, but it's not much easier than to use a webpage to hack Playstation 4.

The first person to walk up to me and shake my hand and say, "I'm a hacker" was from Finland.  I just sent her your post, and she thanks you for the laugh it gave her.

What follows are her corrections, the opinion of a hacker, of your post.

"Mods are programs, they are instructions that tell a game client what to do. A bit like a web pages are instructions that tell web browsers what to do. That is to say they could be used for hacking, and it's just as easy to use a web page to hack the Playstation 4."

For the other posters who think that mods are antiseptic, I am not writing a tutorial on mod virus writing.  Bethesda could have chosen a small number of mods to release.  The community (hackers) would have protested, that their mods or favorites didn't get released.  So Bethesda chose the cheaper alternative and saved themselves some money, and let Sony take the blame.

[Deleted User]

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SlyLoK

I figured Sony would end up doing this. I tried to let people know that it wasnt likely to happen on a Sony platform. I am a bit surprised that MS is going to allow it but then again they have been really gamer friendly lately.

Thomas2006

bblueturtle13 said:

Konfess said:

Vrika said:

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

It's Bethesda that is saying they won't pay for every mod to get checked out, like you would a rescue dog at the pound.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same users come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying because Bethesda Bitch Slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Bethesda does not have the option to get all mods checked though PS4's normal approval process: There are more than 49 thousand mods, enchantments and resouces available for Skyrim on Skyrim Nexus. That's more than 50 times the number of Playstation 4 games available. Fallout 4 is newer so it has less mods: Only 15 times the number of all Playstation 4 games.

Running all those mods through same approval process that Sony uses for full games is no option.


Also Sony doesn't prevent mods because of possible hacking. Mods for Skyrim and Fallout 4 are not programs, they are instructions for game client what to do. A bit like a webpage is instructions for web browser on what to do. That's not to say they couldn't be used for hacking, but it's not much easier than to use a webpage to hack Playstation 4.

  Bethesda could have chosen a small number of mods to release.  The community (hackers) would have protested, that their mods or favorites didn't get released.  So Bethesda chose the cheaper alternative and saved themselves some money, and let Sony take the blame.

That is exactly what Bethesda did for the Xbox One release of Mods for Fallout 4. They restricted the number of mods allowed as they quality check those submitted to Microsoft for consideration. Just as they would have done for Sony. This has nothing to do with 'hacking threats' and everything to do with Sony not getting a financial kickback on allowing them. This is not a new struggle with the Mod scene and Sony. It has always come down to money.

What many do not understand, apparently, is that the Mods on consoles run through a loader from Bethesda. All Mods for consoles (ok just the Xbox) are housed on Bethesda's servers and are quality checked by Bethesda from their end and again my Microsoft on their end. It is not like the PC where you can just open a browser and download any Mod you want which can open you or your machine to risk.
On the console it does not work that way. The Bethesda Mod Manager houses all Mods available for that platform. You have to sign into Bethesda.net to be able to download the Mods straight from Bethesda.

 

So you know for a fact that it is all about money and not another possible issue that you have not taken into account?  

Think you all mighty knowing person of Sony.

[Deleted User]

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FrodoFragins

It's hard to believe it's reached the point where I prefer Microsoft over Sony.

Konfess

blueturtle13 said:

Konfess said:

Vrika said:

Konfess said:

There is a reason for closed systems, first is safety from hackers.  Second is quality of coding.  Sony simply wants the mods to pass a screening and vetting process like every game content does on a console, and have Bethesda pay for it.  Like they did with Skyrim and Fallout 4.

It's Bethesda that is saying they won't pay for every mod to get checked out, like you would a rescue dog at the pound.

Sony is say, they don't want a playstation store hack downloaded by everyone as a Fallout mod.  Then those same users come crying how their credit cards are maxed out and sony did nothing to protect them.  Not crying because Bethesda Bitch Slapped them with their open mod system.

Downloading a mod, is like taking candy from that creepy guy (Handsome Football Player / Rapist) in the rape van.

Bethesda does not have the option to get all mods checked though PS4's normal approval process: There are more than 49 thousand mods, enchantments and resouces available for Skyrim on Skyrim Nexus. That's more than 50 times the number of Playstation 4 games available. Fallout 4 is newer so it has less mods: Only 15 times the number of all Playstation 4 games.

Running all those mods through same approval process that Sony uses for full games is no option.


Also Sony doesn't prevent mods because of possible hacking. Mods for Skyrim and Fallout 4 are not programs, they are instructions for game client what to do. A bit like a webpage is instructions for web browser on what to do. That's not to say they couldn't be used for hacking, but it's not much easier than to use a webpage to hack Playstation 4.

  Bethesda could have chosen a small number of mods to release.  The community (hackers) would have protested, that their mods or favorites didn't get released.  So Bethesda chose the cheaper alternative and saved themselves some money, and let Sony take the blame.

That is exactly what Bethesda did for the Xbox One release of Mods for Fallout 4. They restricted the number of mods allowed as they quality check those submitted to Microsoft for consideration. Just as they would have done for Sony. This has nothing to do with 'hacking threats' and everything to do with Sony not getting a financial kickback on allowing them. This is not a new struggle with the Mod scene and Sony. It has always come down to money.

What many do not understand, apparently, is that the Mods on consoles run through a loader from Bethesda. All Mods for consoles (ok just the Xbox) are housed on Bethesda's servers and are quality checked by Bethesda from their end and again my Microsoft on their end. It is not like the PC where you can just open a browser and download any Mod you want which can open you or your machine to risk.
On the console it does not work that way. The Bethesda Mod Manager houses all Mods available for that platform. You have to sign into Bethesda.net to be able to download the Mods straight from Bethesda.

 

Just my point, Bethesda went through the process for Xbox.  But Bethesda refused to do it for Playstation.  Why?  Bethesda chose not to allow mods on the Playstation, not Sony.