So many comments from people who have no idea whatsoever how the law works in this case...
Blizzard can't do nothing, so the server getting shut down is not going to happen anytime soon.
In fact the only way the server might get shut down is if Blizzard pay off these guys behind the scene to shut it down. There is nothing else they can do. Sadly some(often) times the law just can't help even if you are in the right.
I personally won't probably play on this(or any other private)server. I don't really support this type of behaviour, BUT in this particular cause I don't completely disapprove either, because there's more than enough proof that there are plenty of people who would gladly play on Vanilla servers, yet Blizzard just ignore it, no even worse. They pretended to care, but in fact ignored... Would have been better if they said outright that they won't do a Vanilla server and be done with it.
At the moment I have only 2 rl friends who still play WoW(from about 30 or so back in Vanilla). I've asked around and about 20 have confirmed that if there are Vanilla servers they would be more than happy to start playing again(even if just casual).
Legion is great, but it's a grindfest... I don't know what other people think, but for me this is probably the first expansion where I geniunely feel like I'm not playing anymore for fun, but I'm playing as if it's an actual work... You miss 1-2 days and you feel like you are way behind everyone else.
What's more playing more than 2 characters without being a streamer(aka playing being your job) is close to impossible. At least impossible to keep them at the same level of progress. Even 2 chars is a bit of a strain.
Blizzard needs to make some appropriate adjustments and I don't mean just the possibility to get high AK on your alts like what they are adding in the upcoming patch.
Why am I mentioning Legion? Well today my sub expired and I actually debated whether I should pay it or not... If Vanilla servers existed I wouldn't be even thinking about this.
If there is nothing they can do then why did Nos even shut down the server the first time? Why would they even stop and not just start the server back up? There is way more here to it then you saying "They Can't do anything.. lol"
The fact is Blizzard can do something about it because the names that are used are IP Copyrighted by Blizzard and anything that uses the names, characters, art, ect. is all Blizzards for them to control.
So I will not be suprised at all to see this server shut down within months of it opening up. And if any of the original Nos team is working on this new server then I wish them the best of luck as they have already been told once to cease and desist.
I explained that in another post of mine down the road. Basically the Nost team had to shut down because their servers were in France and Blizz EU HQ is in France. They are under the same law and that's why it was easy for them to force Nost out of commission. I don't know for other countries in EU, but I believe France and UK have the DMCA law and comply with it to the fullest, so it's easier to have lawsuits against residents of those countries, however if the servers were for example in the Netherlands where as far as I'm aware don't have the DMCA law it would have been a different thing. Still if the servers were in the Netherlands and Blizzard filed a lawsuit I believe the result would be positive for them since the Netherlands is a law-based country(meaning it's not corrupt, or at least not as much as Russia is for example). However the servers(from the info we have been given) are located in Russia this time. And DMCA doesn't matter much there and what's more as I've said Blizzard is a NA company and this will be cosidered even somewhat political on Russian part, so even if they try to use different laws I doubt Russia would be helpful.
Another example is Snowden... He is currently is Russia and even though America demands for him, Russia refuses to extradite him. Blizzard's lawsuit would be something along the lines of the Snowden fiasco except on a lesser scale. At the end Russian law will turn a blind eye to the issue.
I'll give you another example. My country have the DMCA law. We have few major torrent sites that are filled with illegal music,movies, games etc... Few years ago they tried to bust the guys behind the sites, but since the servers weren't in our country, but in a country where DMCA doesn't exist they couldn't do anything. For like about 1 year they were constantly in court, but at the end nothing happened.
As I've said quite often even if you are in the right the law doesn't necessary lean in your favor.
Do you want to hear an even more commical situation that's happening to me right now... My family owns lands which we haven't used for like 25-30 years. Few monthes ago we decided that we want to build a house there and use it as a vacation house, but do you know what I found out... That some random dude has built his house on our land and because it's been so long the law isn't in my favorite. I can't demand from him to just demolish it. What I have to do is basically pay the guy for the house(since it's considered improvement /faceplam) OR let him buy the land... Tell me... Does that even sound like a law written by people with anything in their heads :P
So ...I don't get it. They got shut down once, now starting up again and telling everyone, and expect things not to repeat?
Thieves generally aren't the brightest people around. If they were, they wouldn't have to resort to stealing other people's work. I hope that Blizz makes an example out of them.
Hehe because it's that easy, just stealing the game and setup a priv server. I'm sure you never downloaded any movies or music in your life. Or any of you hypocrites clicking agree on his posts.
And to all the uninformed people who feel they can comment on something that they did not bother researching. Only one server has ever been closed by blizzard, and that was many many years ago. All private servers basically gets a letter telling them to shut down, but nobody bothers because there are never any more actions. The amount of opinions from people have no clue in here should be surprising but alas it's not. You should be ashamed of yourselves.
I am going to watch and see what Blizzard does about this. If they are not interested in protecting their IP then it is going to be a free for all, more servers will be boldly popping up.
You didn't quite buy "a game". You bought access to the Blizzard servers that at that moment hosted that particular version (1.x) of the game and that now host Legion, a 7.1 version of same game - that you still can access from your old 2005 account after linking it to Battle.net service.
Have you read the legal documentation provided on official World of Warcraft site? Just in case, I will leave a link here. In particular, it describes the terms of accessing World of Warcraft.
On the somewhat related issue of Diablo: comparing buying Diablo 2 and being able to play that game with Vanilla and Legion WoW is not quite correct as Diablo 2 is a finished product and WoW continues to be worked on and evolve.
More correct example would be Diablo 3, which is also current Blizzard product. However, in this scenario we can see that it is much closer to WoW than to Diablo 2. When I bought a copy of Diablo 3, a Vanilla version of it if you will, way before Reaper of Souls came out, it had Auction House; yellow items that with right stats were much more powerful than Legendaries; if you were leveling all professions before the drastic cost nerf your gold was very scarce as well. Some Demon Hunters out there can even remember 2-socketed Manticores that costed a small fortune on aforementioned AH.
Interestingly enough, I can no longer play that game. At the very least, no matter which version you own, Auction House is gone.
If you cannot prove injury I'm wondering how they can shut them down. If no money changes hands and it is in no way in competition with current WoW (they are different games for most purposes at this point).
That looks an awful lot like a car I used to have in your driveway
I built it and will never sell it, but I let my friends drive it sometimes
Fuck you I'm getting money for that car because you copied my old car.
MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
Do you have to prove damages to enforce your IP or does mere infringement prove your case ? I do not know about the law in the US but in some countries mere infringement is enough proof.
Don't you have statutory damages for infringement ?
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
That is not the same thing as stealing another companies IP and using everything in it and you know it. Stop injecting these retarded scenarios to make yourself feel better about partaking in the theft of another companies IP.
Edit: The people here spouting off that they bought Vanilla WoW and can no longer play that WoW need to stop. You can still play WoW, just because it is not the WoW YOU want, doesn't mean it is not WoW. It is still WoW and it is still going.
The box even says online gameplay may change.
Nowhere on a light does it say you can't light whatever the hell you want after purchasing it.
Again the idea of proving damages arises. What does it mean that I stole your IP if I have not profited from it nor damaged your product? They can always deny they meant to steal anything and had the idea to create a game like Warhammer.
MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
That is not the same thing as stealing another companies IP and using everything in it and you know it. Stop injecting these retarded scenarios to make yourself feel better about partaking in the theft of another companies IP.
Edit: The people here spouting off that they bought Vanilla WoW and can no longer play that WoW need to stop. You can still play WoW, just because it is not the WoW YOU want, doesn't mean it is not WoW. It is still WoW and it is still going.
The box even says online gameplay may change.
Nowhere on a light does it say you can't light whatever the hell you want after purchasing it.
Again the idea of proving damages arises. What does it mean that I stole your IP if I have not profited from it nor damaged your product? They can always deny they meant to steal anything and had the idea to create a game like Warhammer.
really ............. you do realize , im ceratin, that Blizz will create more than one acct and put some time on there server capturing all the IP theft .. If they need to provide any sort of proof in the future , Pretty hard to say you were making Something else with hours of footage proving otherwise...
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
Point Lazerit makes is, clicking a EULA agreement means just about nothing if you try to take someone to court against it.
I'll just say "HYPE! HYPE! HYPE!"
I don't feel a single level of guilt and those of you trying to force it on others, well I'm ashamed I used to consider you one of my gamer brothers.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
Everyone is shouting IP THEFT left and right around here, yet not once have I seen mention of the semi-new provisions in the US' DMCA in regards to online games or online services that are no longer available.
If Nost went to court they would have to prove that the original owner no longer provides the game in question. What is interesting is that one can logically argue that while WoW 7.0 is still WoW, WoW 1.12 is ALSO WoW but is no longer available by the owners choice. Also much of the art assets used in 1.12 has also been abandoned for newer models as WoW has trudged on over the years.
it would be an interesting case, as it would be the first use of the new provisions to prove legality on behalf of non-profit entity for a game that is still in service yet does not provide access to an older version of said service.
so it is not a clear case of IP theft, nor is it a certainty that the Emulated server is legal. Mainly because such an occurrence has not gone to trial under the new DMCA provisions to give legal precedent.
P.S.
Copyright and Trademarks don't disappear, the original work is still protected. Obviously this can change but we'll be dead before any Blizzard product becomes public with current laws.
please google and read about the changes I mentioned to the US' DMCA passed into law in 2015 because the law did change in regards to abandonware services and the legality of their emulation.
you are making an argument based on a false premise, that the current law makes this an open and shut case of IP theft, before 2015 you would have been right. . .right before it changed.
There was a time where gamers just wanted to play games. They didn't give a damn about the tribulations of big corporations. They also didn't care about how much money these companies could swindle with questionable business practices, but that's because companies weren't pulling the shit they are today.
Most of you are more than willing to not only bend over and take it, but defend the actions as well. Everywhere I look someone is defending gambling boxes, micro transactions, cash shops, 4 month expansion releases and day one DLC, all while claiming that as long as the company is making money they will make a better game. Well, I guess that's why they keep shoveling the same shit down your throat; because just like Coke isn't going to change their recipe with an extra billion dollars - neither are these games going to get any better. You don't go out of your way to improve something when millions of dumbfounded dip-shits are throwing money at you.
So now, not only do people defend the cash grabbing they are condemning the people that are trying to stick it to the companies that are sticking it to the players.
If Blizzard is smug enough to ignore the thousands of gamers that want this experience, then f! them and f! everyone responsible for ruining my favorite pass time event by turning games into nothing more than a 'product'.
I feel much better - thank you for the opportunity to allow me a tantrum.
XOXO
This was beautiful sir. I not only smiled, I wept.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
There was a time where gamers just wanted to play games. They didn't give a damn about the tribulations of big corporations. They also didn't care about how much money these companies could swindle with questionable business practices, but that's because companies weren't pulling the shit they are today.
Most of you are more than willing to not only bend over and take it, but defend the actions as well. Everywhere I look someone is defending gambling boxes, micro transactions, cash shops, 4 month expansion releases and day one DLC, all while claiming that as long as the company is making money they will make a better game. Well, I guess that's why they keep shoveling the same shit down your throat; because just like Coke isn't going to change their recipe with an extra billion dollars - neither are these games going to get any better. You don't go out of your way to improve something when millions of dumbfounded dip-shits are throwing money at you.
So now, not only do people defend the cash grabbing they are condemning the people that are trying to stick it to the companies that are sticking it to the players.
If Blizzard is smug enough to ignore the thousands of gamers that want this experience, then f! them and f! everyone responsible for ruining my favorite pass time event by turning games into nothing more than a 'product'.
I feel much better - thank you for the opportunity to allow me a tantrum.
XOXO
That's because some "gamers" treat video games as a right and not a product.
Also some of us actually have jobs, work for a living, and know that if our companies don't make money we will be in trouble. I would love to see the response from players if they found out their companies were not making the bottom line because potential customers decided to bypass paying and still obtained services/goods. I bet they would throw a fit.
Believe me, theoretically no one wants to pay for a thing, including me. I want everything to be free. I truly do. But that's not how the world works and I go to my job every day just like the developers do.
They don't owe you a thing except to make a product that you may or may not want to purchase. If their product is not to your liking then it's not your thing and you should most assuredly not spend a dime on it.
But some players think that these games are theirs by birthright and try to get away with everything that they can. It's just one more line on my long list why I'm embarrassed to tell people I play video games as video game culture has a P.R. problem of demanding man boys/woman girls who come across as spoiled children with screwed up priorities.
Stick it to the companies? How about not patronize them and move on? That I can support.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Enjoy your 400ms of free gameplay, dirty leechers.
Enjoy being a run of the mill minion that can't come up with a better insult. FYI, I have great internet.
So, if I choose to play I won't have any problems. Bye.
It's really pathetic that you don't even understand what you just said....
He understands that a 400ms connection is what someone thinks a private server runs on average. I'm a new recruit to private servers and I can tell you regardless of where I've played I've not had anything over 100ms.
Happily playing Vanilla and BC WoW, again, since September 2016.
They can still force them to prevent the end user from using any IP owned by blizivison... It will be ugly and in the end not worth it.. but they could.
They can also simply force them to block any US/EU IP.
But to be fair.... I can´t even be care any more.
Let the entitled little twits have their inflatable pool... Just as long as they agree to stay there and leave the rest of the internet alone.
Server providers, in this case the Elysium team, try to convey a 'love of the game' message in their videos. I take this as a love of the game overall sort of message, in that, we're a part of the global WoW community, not just a shard or splinter of it. If you subscribe to this philosophy, then it shouldn't matter where you play WoW.
While players are not directly supporting Blizzard financially by playing on a private server, a large part of this community would, if they could. I play on private servers myself and I would pay to play on legacy servers. No question.
Private servers were developed (primarily) because of people's love for earlier versions of the game. The dream would be having this in a retail setting, supporting Blizzard. I like to think of Private Servers as a message to Blizzard, and it's one I think they're hearing loud and clear at this point. We just have to hope they take action, and if they don't, the private server community isn't going anywhere.
Regardless of opinion, we're playing World of Warcraft. We're playing a game that we love.
With regard to the legality of things..
I'm not a lawyer, I'm only explaining things the way I see them with regard to this issue.
The private server software was developed from scratch and no Blizzard assets are used. The server software doesn't contain images, or anything else like that. In fact, I don't believe it uses any actual Blizzard assets. You're essentially connecting to a piece of software that is connected to a database that has all of the items/quests/etc. in it (quests/items are not trademarked/copyrighted things).
The Software that you're using to connect, the WoW client is not illegal, you've simply chosen not to update it to the latest version. The EULA (for the vanilla version) doesn't mention anything about not updating, etc. (as far as I'm aware) so there isn't anything illegal going on.
The EULA probably mentions something about reverse engineering the client, but it doesn't mention anything about server software. Regardless however, the servers/cores that private servers run aren't "Reverse Engineered" servers, the software was built from the ground up, as I understand it.
While there is a LOT of "Grey Area" stuff here, there is a lot that isn't defined/categorized/etc.
If something like this actual went to court and the technical details were laid out well, I can't see Blizzard winning anything on this.
What blows me away is that people say they can't wait to get back into the 'Vanilla community.' The Vanilla community is why I quit this game. The Vanilla community was still there when BC released, and their 'wonderfulness' is why I will NEVER play any version of WoW ever, ever again.
That said, I really think that Blizzard needs to do what they can to appease their fan base. There is a strong community that wants Vanilla servers, and Blizz should give them to the players. Problem solved. Won't need pirate servers if there is an official one. I have always thought that game publishers should give players what they want; within reason of course! An item that takes up one inv slot and and slays everything within 50 meters, including players, with one shot is not reasonable. Making early version servers that require virtually no support (and that players are willing to pay a reduced rate sub for) is reasonable.
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
That is not the same thing as stealing another companies IP and using everything in it and you know it. Stop injecting these retarded scenarios to make yourself feel better about partaking in the theft of another companies IP.
Edit: The people here spouting off that they bought Vanilla WoW and can no longer play that WoW need to stop. You can still play WoW, just because it is not the WoW YOU want, doesn't mean it is not WoW. It is still WoW and it is still going.
The box even says online gameplay may change.
Nowhere on a light does it say you can't light whatever the hell you want after purchasing it.
Who's stealing?
If you use my cigarette lighter to light a cigar you are breaking my EULA, your not stealing. I can try to take you to court and claim damages but I don't believe it would go very far. I believe the a judge would probably rule that my EULA violates any kind of fair use.
Clicking a check box on the internet does not a contract make.
The "The box even says online game play may change" is written to absolve the vendor of any kind of financial responsibility should you be dissatisfied with any changes made to the product. It's not a statement of IP protection.
The question of "fair use" to the best of my knowledge, is one that has not been legally tested in regards to this type of circumstance. When monies are not being exchanged, it makes the waters pretty murky. If a company like Blizzard does end up taking a private, fan run, *free* server to court, they are rolling the dice big time. I don't believe companies are too eager to test the waters here, it could easily bite them in the ass.
My comments are purely conjecture, with a dash of real world experience.
I once developed a product, produced and sold it for over four years in my native country of Canada. Then one day out of the blue came a cease and desist letter from a big American corporation. I believe that they were full of crap and I had a case but I had to make a big decision. Do I fight them? They have pretty deep pockets, I had made quite a decent amount of coin from the product over the four + years. I decided that instead of risking loosing that money in escalating legal fees, I just decided to call it a day with the product and sold the production line to a company in Poland.
By the way, a cigarette lighter or any product for that matter, is an intellectual property.
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
What if someone lights a cigarette with your lighter then uses their cigarette to light another cigarette?
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Making early version servers that require virtually no support (and that players are willing to pay a reduced rate sub for) is reasonable.
I wonder how true this part is though.
It costs money to run servers and for players to connect to them.
Blizzard will want things to run well as it's their company name on the line.
To that end, company's budget everything as well as forecast costs, profits, etc.
Just because the "product" the public servers put out don't cost much doesn't mean that's how Blizzard wants their product to be represented. My guess is that this costs more than players realize because they are thinking of it only in the context of "all you need is the server software and we're good".
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
What if someone lights a cigarette with your lighter then uses their cigarette to light another cigarette?
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
What if someone lights a cigarette with your lighter then uses their cigarette to light another cigarette?
FUCK !!!
I hadn't thought about that !
I'd better update my Eula
or if they light a candle with said cigarette, and then use that to have a "enternal flame" and never buy another lighter from you. Sharing said flame with their community. Making sure you do not sell any more lighters period.
Silly i know..
Anyway.. This whole thing i would guess have killed any chance a vanilla project ever had with Blizzard. (not that it was that much of a chance to begin with... Now it is mulch.)
Honestly I think you are making a drastic mistake by thinking that everyone who plays on these emulated servers don't still support or play current Wow.
Never made any such claim. But the thing is... Most of these "tweeners" will not care one way or antoher.. they will not take to the streets or do the legwork... They will play on Nost if they can, and remenis over beer when they can´t.
The ones i have a problem with are the zealots and their misguided crusade
Comments
I don't know for other countries in EU, but I believe France and UK have the DMCA law and comply with it to the fullest, so it's easier to have lawsuits against residents of those countries, however if the servers were for example in the Netherlands where as far as I'm aware don't have the DMCA law it would have been a different thing. Still if the servers were in the Netherlands and Blizzard filed a lawsuit I believe the result would be positive for them since the Netherlands is a law-based country(meaning it's not corrupt, or at least not as much as Russia is for example).
However the servers(from the info we have been given) are located in Russia this time. And DMCA doesn't matter much there and what's more as I've said Blizzard is a NA company and this will be cosidered even somewhat political on Russian part, so even if they try to use different laws I doubt Russia would be helpful.
Another example is Snowden... He is currently is Russia and even though America demands for him, Russia refuses to extradite him.
Blizzard's lawsuit would be something along the lines of the Snowden fiasco except on a lesser scale. At the end Russian law will turn a blind eye to the issue.
I'll give you another example. My country have the DMCA law. We have few major torrent sites that are filled with illegal music,movies, games etc... Few years ago they tried to bust the guys behind the sites, but since the servers weren't in our country, but in a country where DMCA doesn't exist they couldn't do anything. For like about 1 year they were constantly in court, but at the end nothing happened.
As I've said quite often even if you are in the right the law doesn't necessary lean in your favor.
Do you want to hear an even more commical situation that's happening to me right now...
My family owns lands which we haven't used for like 25-30 years. Few monthes ago we decided that we want to build a house there and use it as a vacation house, but do you know what I found out... That some random dude has built his house on our land and because it's been so long the law isn't in my favorite.
I can't demand from him to just demolish it. What I have to do is basically pay the guy for the house(since it's considered improvement /faceplam) OR let him buy the land... Tell me... Does that even sound like a law written by people with anything in their heads :P
Hehe because it's that easy, just stealing the game and setup a priv server. I'm sure you never downloaded any movies or music in your life. Or any of you hypocrites clicking agree on his posts.
And to all the uninformed people who feel they can comment on something that they did not bother researching. Only one server has ever been closed by blizzard, and that was many many years ago. All private servers basically gets a letter telling them to shut down, but nobody bothers because there are never any more actions. The amount of opinions from people have no clue in here should be surprising but alas it's not. You should be ashamed of yourselves.
Enjoy being a run of the mill minion that can't come up with a better insult. FYI, I have great internet.
So, if I choose to play I won't have any problems. Bye.
Have you read the legal documentation provided on official World of Warcraft site? Just in case, I will leave a link here. In particular, it describes the terms of accessing World of Warcraft.
On the somewhat related issue of Diablo: comparing buying Diablo 2 and being able to play that game with Vanilla and Legion WoW is not quite correct as Diablo 2 is a finished product and WoW continues to be worked on and evolve.
More correct example would be Diablo 3, which is also current Blizzard product. However, in this scenario we can see that it is much closer to WoW than to Diablo 2. When I bought a copy of Diablo 3, a Vanilla version of it if you will, way before Reaper of Souls came out, it had Auction House; yellow items that with right stats were much more powerful than Legendaries; if you were leveling all professions before the drastic cost nerf your gold was very scarce as well. Some Demon Hunters out there can even remember 2-socketed Manticores that costed a small fortune on aforementioned AH.
Interestingly enough, I can no longer play that game. At the very least, no matter which version you own, Auction House is gone.
That looks an awful lot like a car I used to have in your driveway
I built it and will never sell it, but I let my friends drive it sometimes
Fuck you I'm getting money for that car because you copied my old car.
Don't you have statutory damages for infringement ?
I make cigarette lighters and by opening the package you are agreeing to my EULA which can also be found on the internet so you can read before you buy.
If you use the cigarette lighter to light a cigar, you are a thief and a scoundrel.
You must buy my cigar lighter for that.
Also.... have a look at my nice campfire lighters, they come packaged in a nice piece of recycled newspaper.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
I'll just say "HYPE! HYPE! HYPE!"
I don't feel a single level of guilt and those of you trying to force it on others, well I'm ashamed I used to consider you one of my gamer brothers.
you are making an argument based on a false premise, that the current law makes this an open and shut case of IP theft, before 2015 you would have been right. . .right before it changed.
Also some of us actually have jobs, work for a living, and know that if our companies don't make money we will be in trouble. I would love to see the response from players if they found out their companies were not making the bottom line because potential customers decided to bypass paying and still obtained services/goods. I bet they would throw a fit.
Believe me, theoretically no one wants to pay for a thing, including me. I want everything to be free. I truly do. But that's not how the world works and I go to my job every day just like the developers do.
They don't owe you a thing except to make a product that you may or may not want to purchase. If their product is not to your liking then it's not your thing and you should most assuredly not spend a dime on it.
But some players think that these games are theirs by birthright and try to get away with everything that they can. It's just one more line on my long list why I'm embarrassed to tell people I play video games as video game culture has a P.R. problem of demanding man boys/woman girls who come across as spoiled children with screwed up priorities.
Stick it to the companies? How about not patronize them and move on? That I can support.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
He understands that a 400ms connection is what someone thinks a private server runs on average. I'm a new recruit to private servers and I can tell you regardless of where I've played I've not had anything over 100ms.
They can also simply force them to block any US/EU IP.
But to be fair.... I can´t even be care any more.
Let the entitled little twits have their inflatable pool... Just as long as they agree to stay there and leave the rest of the internet alone.
This have been a good conversation
While players are not directly supporting Blizzard financially by playing on a private server, a large part of this community would, if they could. I play on private servers myself and I would pay to play on legacy servers. No question.
Private servers were developed (primarily) because of people's love for earlier versions of the game. The dream would be having this in a retail setting, supporting Blizzard. I like to think of Private Servers as a message to Blizzard, and it's one I think they're hearing loud and clear at this point. We just have to hope they take action, and if they don't, the private server community isn't going anywhere.
Regardless of opinion, we're playing World of Warcraft. We're playing a game that we love.
With regard to the legality of things..
I'm not a lawyer, I'm only explaining things the way I see them with regard to this issue.
The private server software was developed from scratch and no Blizzard assets are used. The server software doesn't contain images, or anything else like that. In fact, I don't believe it uses any actual Blizzard assets. You're essentially connecting to a piece of software that is connected to a database that has all of the items/quests/etc. in it (quests/items are not trademarked/copyrighted things).
The Software that you're using to connect, the WoW client is not illegal, you've simply chosen not to update it to the latest version. The EULA (for the vanilla version) doesn't mention anything about not updating, etc. (as far as I'm aware) so there isn't anything illegal going on.
The EULA probably mentions something about reverse engineering the client, but it doesn't mention anything about server software. Regardless however, the servers/cores that private servers run aren't "Reverse Engineered" servers, the software was built from the ground up, as I understand it.
While there is a LOT of "Grey Area" stuff here, there is a lot that isn't defined/categorized/etc.
If something like this actual went to court and the technical details were laid out well, I can't see Blizzard winning anything on this.
That said, I really think that Blizzard needs to do what they can to appease their fan base. There is a strong community that wants Vanilla servers, and Blizz should give them to the players. Problem solved. Won't need pirate servers if there is an official one. I have always thought that game publishers should give players what they want; within reason of course! An item that takes up one inv slot and and slays everything within 50 meters, including players, with one shot is not reasonable. Making early version servers that require virtually no support (and that players are willing to pay a reduced rate sub for) is reasonable.
The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!
If you use my cigarette lighter to light a cigar you are breaking my EULA, your not stealing. I can try to take you to court and claim damages but I don't believe it would go very far. I believe the a judge would probably rule that my EULA violates any kind of fair use.
Clicking a check box on the internet does not a contract make.
The "The box even says online game play may change" is written to absolve the vendor of any kind of financial responsibility should you be dissatisfied with any changes made to the product. It's not a statement of IP protection.
The question of "fair use" to the best of my knowledge, is one that has not been legally tested in regards to this type of circumstance. When monies are not being exchanged, it makes the waters pretty murky. If a company like Blizzard does end up taking a private, fan run, *free* server to court, they are rolling the dice big time. I don't believe companies are too eager to test the waters here, it could easily bite them in the ass.
My comments are purely conjecture, with a dash of real world experience.
I once developed a product, produced and sold it for over four years in my native country of Canada. Then one day out of the blue came a cease and desist letter from a big American corporation. I believe that they were full of crap and I had a case but I had to make a big decision. Do I fight them? They have pretty deep pockets, I had made quite a decent amount of coin from the product over the four + years. I decided that instead of risking loosing that money in escalating legal fees, I just decided to call it a day with the product and sold the production line to a company in Poland.
By the way, a cigarette lighter or any product for that matter, is an intellectual property.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
It costs money to run servers and for players to connect to them.
Blizzard will want things to run well as it's their company name on the line.
To that end, company's budget everything as well as forecast costs, profits, etc.
Just because the "product" the public servers put out don't cost much doesn't mean that's how Blizzard wants their product to be represented. My guess is that this costs more than players realize because they are thinking of it only in the context of "all you need is the server software and we're good".
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I hadn't thought about that !
I'd better update my Eula
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Silly i know..
Anyway.. This whole thing i would guess have killed any chance a vanilla project ever had with Blizzard. (not that it was that much of a chance to begin with... Now it is mulch.)
This have been a good conversation
The ones i have a problem with are the zealots and their misguided crusade
This have been a good conversation