Lets not forget the amount of veterans working on this title. One of them is arguably the father of the modern MMO in the form of Brad McQuaid. These guys know what they are doing and their tracks records prove it.
I'd sooner sacrifice bleeding edge graphics for a quality game play experience. Further, the engines full capability has not be tapped yet. They still can change the animations and go back over the textures to improve the quality a bit.
Those things are usually done later in the development process. For example, as Camelot: Unchained is nearing beta they are just now working on the animations and sounds for abilities.
Don't judge the graphics yet this game has the potential to be huge. World of Warcraft still looks dated and attracts huge numbers of people.
Yeah, there are some very good members of that team, but McQuaid is not one of them. He has a track record of making big promises and not following through,
One bad game does not constitute a "track record".
the issue is more of the what happened around the development on VG. from the souring of relationships with both microsoft and his own sigil employees, disappearing from the office during development and making poor decisions when he was around, to the decision to release the game(knowing it was 6 months from ready) at the same time as WoWs burning crusade expansion.
lets not forget his questionable spending of patheons funds and loss of his first development team earlier in patheon's development.
Lets not forget the amount of veterans working on this title. One of them is arguably the father of the modern MMO in the form of Brad McQuaid. These guys know what they are doing and their tracks records prove it.
What about the other "father of MMOs", Richard Garriot and SoTA? Or how about Smedly and his recent games?
Your hero worship is cute and all but there is zero evidence that the old guard has any more in them that the new blood.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Lets not forget the amount of veterans working on this title. One of them is arguably the father of the modern MMO in the form of Brad McQuaid. These guys know what they are doing and their tracks records prove it.
I'd sooner sacrifice bleeding edge graphics for a quality game play experience. Further, the engines full capability has not be tapped yet. They still can change the animations and go back over the textures to improve the quality a bit.
Those things are usually done later in the development process. For example, as Camelot: Unchained is nearing beta they are just now working on the animations and sounds for abilities.
Don't judge the graphics yet this game has the potential to be huge. World of Warcraft still looks dated and attracts huge numbers of people.
Huh..... interesting...... Are you Brad? Just wondering because after all the back and forth about how horrible Ashes of Creation is and it'll never work, you are singing the praises of someone who has tanked more than one project, snorted another up his nose, was responsible for one of the most legendary mass-firings in game industry HISTORY, and started off this project on a VERY sketchy note. I'm not saying Pantheon won't be fantastic, but fuck me! You certainly seem to have a distorted perspective of greatness.
Oh! Also, we should also note that the track record for "MMORPG Forefathers" with new MMORPGs isn't great at this point being that CU is on a delay of weeks (from over a year ago) and Lord British has enough cash to survive a whopping 3 months.
I am waiting with bated breath for this game, though, and I hope it's as fantastic as you think it will be.
Everyone makes mistakes and once it was fixed Vanguard: Saga of Heroes was one of the better MMORPGs I have played. A lot of people would agree and it's a shame Sony shut it down.
Do I think he made some life mistakes? Certainly. Do I think you've likely made mistakes in your life too? Absolutely.
Do I think EverQuest I was and still remains one of the better MMOs and was a great success with a great mind behind it(McQuaid)? You're damn right I do.
Cool man, thanks for the perspective. You love Brad. 10-4. I suppose that explains a lot about your lack of objectivity.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Gameplay is not the most important
thing, a game needs a balance, a total package. It needs to have all the different
aspects of the right gameplay as well as Music Score, Story, UI and be visually
appealing, in both environments, effects and animations. There is also a hard
to quantify general enjoyment factor. Each of those and probably a few I missed
will mean more or less to each person.
The Secret World, EQ and FFXIV are
great examples of how games will hit or misses on different points. Some players will forgive a less than stellar
visually appealing game if it matches enough of the other points. Some are just the opposite of that. Pantheon
is going to be what it is, and its successes or failure will largely be determined
by that hard to quantify enjoyment factor. Players will overlook glaring game
faults as long as they are having fun. I
play EQ and EQ2 mostly, On EQ I find that the worst UI, and total craptastic
over all visuals fade for me, but having every mob camped by high levels is
just not fun, that aspect of gameplay lowers my wanting to play in that toxic environment.
EQ2 where having poor visuals and gameplay is still generally fun with my guild.
Despite the poor gameplay.
The problem is how many people can
you get in the door if the visuals are sub-par? Or the server performance is
crappy? Or people who associate the game to EQ or Vanguard and only remember the
bad aspects? The game is going to need more than the few 100 supporters (on
this site) it has now if it is going to make it. It need to draw players in and
then give them an experience that enjoyable enough to want to keep playing.
I never tried the Elder Scrolls
simply because I was completely unimpressed by the games appearance. I played FFXIV before the reboot because it
was different from every game out there and played different (even though I
understood the gameplay was sub-par) so.. no gameplay is not the most important
factor, it may mean more to one person or another. The most important factor is
the Fun Factor of the game derived from all its aspects. What makes a game enjoyable for each person is
a moving target.
EQ is the forerunner of the modern themepark design, which was firmly put in place by WOW.
While the most popular, there are in fact other game designs still in play and in progress.
Be care of phrases such as "entire genre" because it just isn't the case.
Yes, WoW firmly put in place ... games like EQ.
Other designs have been pretty much non-factors in the grand scheme of things. The only one of note that had a decent playerbase was DAOC, and itself a derivative of EQ with open world battlegrounds tacked on.
Let's get real here and not understate the importance or accomplishment that was EQ. Without it there would be no WoW, and even this very forum would likely not exist.
Gameplay is not the most important
thing, a game needs a balance, a total package. It needs to have all the different
aspects of the right gameplay as well as Music Score, Story, UI and be visually
appealing, in both environments, effects and animations. There is also a hard
to quantify general enjoyment factor. Each of those and probably a few I missed
will mean more or less to each person.
The Secret World, EQ and FFXIV are
great examples of how games will hit or misses on different points. Some players will forgive a less than stellar
visually appealing game if it matches enough of the other points. Some are just the opposite of that. Pantheon
is going to be what it is, and its successes or failure will largely be determined
by that hard to quantify enjoyment factor. Players will overlook glaring game
faults as long as they are having fun. I
play EQ and EQ2 mostly, On EQ I find that the worst UI, and total craptastic
over all visuals fade for me, but having every mob camped by high levels is
just not fun, that aspect of gameplay lowers my wanting to play in that toxic environment.
EQ2 where having poor visuals and gameplay is still generally fun with my guild.
Despite the poor gameplay.
The problem is how many people can
you get in the door if the visuals are sub-par? Or the server performance is
crappy? Or people who associate the game to EQ or Vanguard and only remember the
bad aspects? The game is going to need more than the few 100 supporters (on
this site) it has now if it is going to make it. It need to draw players in and
then give them an experience that enjoyable enough to want to keep playing.
I never tried the Elder Scrolls
simply because I was completely unimpressed by the games appearance. I played FFXIV before the reboot because it
was different from every game out there and played different (even though I
understood the gameplay was sub-par) so.. no gameplay is not the most important
factor, it may mean more to one person or another. The most important factor is
the Fun Factor of the game derived from all its aspects. What makes a game enjoyable for each person is
a moving target.
I agree on the importance of visuals. While many fans of Pantheon were busy talking about how graphics don't matter, some of us were pushing for early improvements. Especially in a game that is partly crowdfunded, you need visual appeal to turn heads. Even people looking for something different like Pantheon are unlikely to give it a second look if it looks like ass.
VR heard us. They've made major improvements in the last year.
I have never bought more than a month of sub time for any game, ever.
The gameplay in blade and soul convinced me to buy a 1 year sub, so yeah I would say it's pretty damn important. Despite a bunch of obvious flaws (hilarious VO, jank story, etc) the gameplay (especially the combat) is just so much better than than anything else out there that I just don't care about the warts.
EQ is the forerunner of the modern themepark design, which was firmly put in place by WOW.
While the most popular, there are in fact other game designs still in play and in progress.
Be care of phrases such as "entire genre" because it just isn't the case.
Yes, WoW firmly put in place ... games like EQ.
Other designs have been pretty much non-factors in the grand scheme of things. The only one of note that had a decent playerbase was DAOC, and itself a derivative of EQ with open world battlegrounds tacked on.
Let's get real here and not understate the importance or accomplishment that was EQ. Without it there would be no WoW, and even this very forum would likely not exist.
You can't place everything against an anomaly just to say they therefor have no significance. All kinds of factors as well as features have been used in this genre, they don't all come from WOW or EQ.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
EQ is the forerunner of the modern themepark design, which was firmly put in place by WOW.
While the most popular, there are in fact other game designs still in play and in progress.
Be care of phrases such as "entire genre" because it just isn't the case.
Yes, WoW firmly put in place ... games like EQ.
Other designs have been pretty much non-factors in the grand scheme of things. The only one of note that had a decent playerbase was DAOC, and itself a derivative of EQ with open world battlegrounds tacked on.
Let's get real here and not understate the importance or accomplishment that was EQ. Without it there would be no WoW, and even this very forum would likely not exist.
Thank you for confirming who we should blame for the terrible state of the "popular" MMO's, always wondered about that.
No WOW, think of the possibilities lost due to that one terrible accident.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The problem is that people think photo fidelity means good art. Yet you don't see people handing around ultra realism sections on museums and art forums, weird, huh?
um, well while I agree that photo fidelity doesn't mean good art, there is a reason that Piedro Campos and Diego Fazio are considered amazing.
I agree on the importance of visuals. While many fans of Pantheon were busy talking about how graphics don't matter, some of us were pushing for early improvements. E
Graphics are the biggest and most important seller of a game these days.
You can have the best gameplay of the world, but without eye candy it doesn't sell well, and this is all business end of the day so it's a must; you can't just go in the mall with a gray cookie box with no visual appeal to it.
Pantheon should invest more into the areas that look more subpar because those will discount on how enjoyable the game experience will be.
The problem is that people think photo fidelity means good art. Yet you don't see people handing around ultra realism sections on museums and art forums, weird, huh?
um, well while I agree that photo fidelity doesn't mean good art, there is a reason that Piedro Campos and Diego Fazio are considered amazing.
I agree on the importance of visuals. While many fans of Pantheon were busy talking about how graphics don't matter, some of us were pushing for early improvements. E
Graphics are the biggest and most important seller of a game these days.
You can have the best gameplay of the world, but without eye candy it doesn't sell well, and this is all business end of the day so it's a must; you can't just go in the mall with a gray cookie box with no visual appeal to it.
Pantheon should invest more into the areas that look more subpar because those will discount on how enjoyable the game experience will be.
World of Warcraft disagrees with you. An engine that originally ran on DirectX 7 and JUST received SOME animation updates in Legion is going strong.
If you want a graphics simulator just download the Unreal Engine editor. Why even play a game if game play doesn't matter?
I haven't really been in the habit of posting on this forum recently (other than the Old EQ1 friends thread), but this subject intrigued me so I thought I would weigh in. I agree with the underlying topic that gameplay is the most important. I can't speak for others, but who is going to keep coming back to a game that plays the same over and over again? You certainly want graphics to be as sharp as possible and since the goal is to make it as realistic as possible, graphics contributes to that. But if I were trying a game that had incredible graphics but was boring to play, I'd likely log into it just to see a beautiful landscape and essentially use it as a glorified screensaver.
On the other hand, if someone succeeded at created a super-dynamic MMO (I'm still hoping), I would be willing to sacrifice graphics (to an extent) and might not notice the inferior quality if I felt immersed in the world. Obviously, the ideal situation is for both to be fantastic. Someone mentioned that high-end graphics requires a more powerful system which is why the devs might not be as focused on that right now in order to broaden the before launch.
On that note, there's also been a lot of discussion about the driving force behind Pantheon, Brad McQuaid. Here's my take on Mr. McQuaid. Everquest was my introduction to MMOs and for me is still the standard for the genre. I can't say if it was the fact that it was EQ or the fact that it was my first MMO. It's become a cliché by now, but people generally remember their first MMO as their fondest. People who started with Ultima Online generally view EQ negatively and vice-versa for EQ players who tried UO. The same goes for Dark Age of Camelot. There was so much hype for that game that I had to give it a try. And while others were praising it, I was thoroughly disappointed.
And WoW, the biggest MMO of all-time, didn't really offer me anything new so I barely even played it. As a result, I viewed Brad McQuaid as some kind of visionary in the gaming industry and just assumed that Vanguard would take MMOs to the next level. I don't have to go into detail about that game because we all know it didn't. At that point I had pretty much given up on MMOs and came to the conclusion that your first MMO experience was a once in a lifetime never to be repeated phenomenon.
However, I never completely checked out of the genre for good because I guess I'm a hopeless romantic who is still hoping for a game that captures that magic once again. When I first heard about Pantheon, it peaked my curiosity and I started reading bits and pieces about it. The biggest thing that convinced me to give this game a chance is a thread that Brad himself began on Reddit a couple months ago. Here it is for anyone who is interested:
The thing that caught my attention is where he says you learn from your mistakes as well as your successes. And it's no secret that the biggest mistake of Vanguard is probably that it was launched before it was ready. And visionary doesn't seem to be repeating that mistake. I would rather wait and play a game that is done than become impatient and urge them to get it out and hope that they fill in the holes later. As a result, I am willing to give this MMO a chance. Since my expectation of the industry as a whole is pretty low, it's not much of a gamble. I'm not putting my life on hold waiting for it to be released, and when it is, if it disappoints, I'll simply go back to doing what I was doing before...not playing MMOs.
I haven't really been in the habit of posting on this forum recently (other than the Old EQ1 friends thread), but this subject intrigued me so I thought I would weigh in. I agree with the underlying topic that gameplay is the most important. I can't speak for others, but who is going to keep coming back to a game that plays the same over and over again? You certainly want graphics to be as sharp as possible and since the goal is to make it as realistic as possible, graphics contributes to that. But if I were trying a game that had incredible graphics but was boring to play, I'd likely log into it just to see a beautiful landscape and essentially use it as a glorified screensaver.
On the other hand, if someone succeeded at created a super-dynamic MMO (I'm still hoping), I would be willing to sacrifice graphics (to an extent) and might not notice the inferior quality if I felt immersed in the world. Obviously, the ideal situation is for both to be fantastic. Someone mentioned that high-end graphics requires a more powerful system which is why the devs might not be as focused on that right now in order to broaden the before launch.
On that note, there's also been a lot of discussion about the driving force behind Pantheon, Brad McQuaid. Here's my take on Mr. McQuaid. Everquest was my introduction to MMOs and for me is still the standard for the genre. I can't say if it was the fact that it was EQ or the fact that it was my first MMO. It's become a cliché by now, but people generally remember their first MMO as their fondest. People who started with Ultima Online generally view EQ negatively and vice-versa for EQ players who tried UO. The same goes for Dark Age of Camelot. There was so much hype for that game that I had to give it a try. And while others were praising it, I was thoroughly disappointed.
And WoW, the biggest MMO of all-time, didn't really offer me anything new so I barely even played it. As a result, I viewed Brad McQuaid as some kind of visionary in the gaming industry and just assumed that Vanguard would take MMOs to the next level. I don't have to go into detail about that game because we all know it didn't. At that point I had pretty much given up on MMOs and came to the conclusion that your first MMO experience was a once in a lifetime never to be repeated phenomenon.
However, I never completely checked out of the genre for good because I guess I'm a hopeless romantic who is still hoping for a game that captures that magic once again. When I first heard about Pantheon, it peaked my curiosity and I started reading bits and pieces about it. The biggest thing that convinced me to give this game a chance is a thread that Brad himself began on Reddit a couple months ago. Here it is for anyone who is interested:
The thing that caught my attention is where he says you learn from your mistakes as well as your successes. And it's no secret that the biggest mistake of Vanguard is probably that it was launched before it was ready. And visionary doesn't seem to be repeating that mistake. I would rather wait and play a game that is done than become impatient and urge them to get it out and hope that they fill in the holes later. As a result, I am willing to give this MMO a chance. Since my expectation of the industry as a whole is pretty low, it's not much of a gamble. I'm not putting my life on hold waiting for it to be released, and when it is, if it disappoints, I'll simply go back to doing what I was doing before...not playing MMOs.
I definitely agree. As I've stated before, experience is experience whether it's negative or positive. A crude example is a kid putting his finger in the electrical socket. Once he does it he won't ever do it again.
How many developers can say they've been through a hugely successful game, also made mistakes on a second one, and learned from both? There's very few.
People seem to critique him for his mistakes in life but at least he owns up to them and fixed the problems he was having. That takes a lot to do and shows good character.
I'd like to make another point here. When EverQuest I was being created there wasn't any sort of development "recipe" that they could follow. That made the development of a title like that, that much harder.
Consider he(Brad McQuaid) managed the entire development team from the projects inception and created a successful title that is still running I'd say that is a big deal.
World of Warcraft disagrees with you. An engine that originally ran on DirectX 7 and JUST received SOME animation updates in Legion is going strong.
If you want a graphics simulator just download the Unreal Engine editor. Why even play a game if game play doesn't matter?
Put a new game MMO out with the World of Warcraft graphics and animation and see how well it sells.
You can't use that comparative, it's one old extremely popular game that keeps a large player base, one new MMO has new standards to play by to meet the expectations of gamers that are obviously higher.
Graphics are the master race, they drive gaming altogether, the so-called "next-gen" or "current-gen" games, the industry of hardware and console gaming itself, it's simply where the money is.
World of Warcraft disagrees with you. An engine that originally ran on DirectX 7 and JUST received SOME animation updates in Legion is going strong.
If you want a graphics simulator just download the Unreal Engine editor. Why even play a game if game play doesn't matter?
Put a new game MMO out with the World of Warcraft graphics and animation and see how well it sells.
You can't use that comparative, it's one old extremely popular game that keeps a large player base, one new MMO has new standards to play by to meet the expectations of gamers that are obviously higher.
Graphics are the master race, they drive gaming altogether, the so-called "next-gen" or "current-gen" games, the industry of hardware and console gaming itself, it's simply where the money is.
Pantheon looks at least five times better than World of Warcraft already. Nonetheless, I think people are expecting "Black Desert Online" equivalent visuals which is a bit much given the engine choice.
IMO Pantheon doesn't look bad at all. I do think the UI makes it seem worse than it is which will likely be improved.
Pantheon looks at least five times better than World of Warcraft already. Nonetheless, I think people are expecting "Black Desert Online" equivalent visuals which is a bit much given the engine choice.
But that is exactly the thing, Black Desert Online is setting the standard for people's expectations, everything that comes after starts being compared to BDO and other higher fidelity MMO's especially on the Graphics and Animations front.
Obviously, when WWO appears claiming one MMO with one graphical appearance that is on the AAA quality tier, those games will be the getting the attention and the big bucks, even if they underperform on the gameplay front.
Pantheon looks at least five times better than World of Warcraft already. Nonetheless, I think people are expecting "Black Desert Online" equivalent visuals which is a bit much given the engine choice.
But that is exactly the thing, Black Desert Online is setting the standard for people's expectations, everything that comes after starts being compared to BDO and other higher fidelity MMO's especially on the Graphics and Animations front.
Obviously, when WWO appears claiming one MMO with one graphical appearance that is on the AAA quality tier, those games will be the getting the attention and the big bucks.
I disagree with BDO setting a standard. People are still crowdfunding games that don't even look as half as good as BDO. Crowfall is one of them. Further, Pantheon is still getting pledges all the time and the forums are rampant with excited fans that pay to post.
I disagree with BDO setting a standard. People are still crowdfunding games that don't even look as half as good as BDO. Crowfall is one of them. Further, Pantheon is still getting pledges all the time and the forums are rampant with excited fans that pay to post.
Well if you decide to go "cartoon'ish" you can pull it off without much effort on the graphical front, so is Crowfall and other games following similar styles.
But Pantheon is not really falling on that style, it's approaching more the realistic graphics, and that is where you notice the quality if it had the visual approach of WoW or Crowfall it would be a different story.
Comments
lets not forget his questionable spending of patheons funds and loss of his first development team earlier in patheon's development.
Good gameplay and a bad UI/animation/sound front is still a bad game to me. The elements combined that create the gameplay experience.
Your hero worship is cute and all but there is zero evidence that the old guard has any more in them that the new blood.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Cool man, thanks for the perspective. You love Brad. 10-4. I suppose that explains a lot about your lack of objectivity.
Crazkanuk
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Azarelos - 90 Hunter - Emerald
Durnzig - 90 Paladin - Emerald
Demonicron - 90 Death Knight - Emerald Dream - US
Tankinpain - 90 Monk - Azjol-Nerub - US
Brindell - 90 Warrior - Emerald Dream - US
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EQ is the forerunner of the modern themepark design, which was firmly put in place by WOW.
While the most popular, there are in fact other game designs still in play and in progress.
Be care of phrases such as "entire genre" because it just isn't the case.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Gameplay is not the most important thing, a game needs a balance, a total package. It needs to have all the different aspects of the right gameplay as well as Music Score, Story, UI and be visually appealing, in both environments, effects and animations. There is also a hard to quantify general enjoyment factor. Each of those and probably a few I missed will mean more or less to each person.
The Secret World, EQ and FFXIV are great examples of how games will hit or misses on different points. Some players will forgive a less than stellar visually appealing game if it matches enough of the other points. Some are just the opposite of that. Pantheon is going to be what it is, and its successes or failure will largely be determined by that hard to quantify enjoyment factor. Players will overlook glaring game faults as long as they are having fun. I play EQ and EQ2 mostly, On EQ I find that the worst UI, and total craptastic over all visuals fade for me, but having every mob camped by high levels is just not fun, that aspect of gameplay lowers my wanting to play in that toxic environment. EQ2 where having poor visuals and gameplay is still generally fun with my guild. Despite the poor gameplay.
The problem is how many people can you get in the door if the visuals are sub-par? Or the server performance is crappy? Or people who associate the game to EQ or Vanguard and only remember the bad aspects? The game is going to need more than the few 100 supporters (on this site) it has now if it is going to make it. It need to draw players in and then give them an experience that enjoyable enough to want to keep playing.
I never tried the Elder Scrolls simply because I was completely unimpressed by the games appearance. I played FFXIV before the reboot because it was different from every game out there and played different (even though I understood the gameplay was sub-par) so.. no gameplay is not the most important factor, it may mean more to one person or another. The most important factor is the Fun Factor of the game derived from all its aspects. What makes a game enjoyable for each person is a moving target.
Other designs have been pretty much non-factors in the grand scheme of things. The only one of note that had a decent playerbase was DAOC, and itself a derivative of EQ with open world battlegrounds tacked on.
Let's get real here and not understate the importance or accomplishment that was EQ. Without it there would be no WoW, and even this very forum would likely not exist.
VR heard us. They've made major improvements in the last year.
I have never bought more than a month of sub time for any game, ever.
The gameplay in blade and soul convinced me to buy a 1 year sub, so yeah I would say it's pretty damn important. Despite a bunch of obvious flaws (hilarious VO, jank story, etc) the gameplay (especially the combat) is just so much better than than anything else out there that I just don't care about the warts.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
No WOW, think of the possibilities lost due to that one terrible accident.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
And then there's "hyper-realism" ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmmR4F7Np2g
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
You can have the best gameplay of the world, but without eye candy it doesn't sell well, and this is all business end of the day so it's a must; you can't just go in the mall with a gray cookie box with no visual appeal to it.
Pantheon should invest more into the areas that look more subpar because those will discount on how enjoyable the game experience will be.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
If you want a graphics simulator just download the Unreal Engine editor. Why even play a game if game play doesn't matter?
I haven't really been in the habit of posting on this forum recently (other than the Old EQ1 friends thread), but this subject intrigued me so I thought I would weigh in. I agree with the underlying topic that gameplay is the most important. I can't speak for others, but who is going to keep coming back to a game that plays the same over and over again? You certainly want graphics to be as sharp as possible and since the goal is to make it as realistic as possible, graphics contributes to that. But if I were trying a game that had incredible graphics but was boring to play, I'd likely log into it just to see a beautiful landscape and essentially use it as a glorified screensaver.
On the other hand, if someone succeeded at created a super-dynamic MMO (I'm still hoping), I would be willing to sacrifice graphics (to an extent) and might not notice the inferior quality if I felt immersed in the world. Obviously, the ideal situation is for both to be fantastic. Someone mentioned that high-end graphics requires a more powerful system which is why the devs might not be as focused on that right now in order to broaden the before launch.
On that note, there's also been a lot of discussion about the driving force behind Pantheon, Brad McQuaid. Here's my take on Mr. McQuaid. Everquest was my introduction to MMOs and for me is still the standard for the genre. I can't say if it was the fact that it was EQ or the fact that it was my first MMO. It's become a cliché by now, but people generally remember their first MMO as their fondest. People who started with Ultima Online generally view EQ negatively and vice-versa for EQ players who tried UO. The same goes for Dark Age of Camelot. There was so much hype for that game that I had to give it a try. And while others were praising it, I was thoroughly disappointed.
And WoW, the biggest MMO of all-time, didn't really offer me anything new so I barely even played it. As a result, I viewed Brad McQuaid as some kind of visionary in the gaming industry and just assumed that Vanguard would take MMOs to the next level. I don't have to go into detail about that game because we all know it didn't. At that point I had pretty much given up on MMOs and came to the conclusion that your first MMO experience was a once in a lifetime never to be repeated phenomenon.
However, I never completely checked out of the genre for good because I guess I'm a hopeless romantic who is still hoping for a game that captures that magic once again. When I first heard about Pantheon, it peaked my curiosity and I started reading bits and pieces about it. The biggest thing that convinced me to give this game a chance is a thread that Brad himself began on Reddit a couple months ago. Here it is for anyone who is interested:
https://www.reddit.com/r/MMORPG/comments/4y7sd0/i_am_brad_aradune_mcquaid_cco_for_pantheon_rise/
The thing that caught my attention is where he says you learn from your mistakes as well as your successes. And it's no secret that the biggest mistake of Vanguard is probably that it was launched before it was ready. And visionary doesn't seem to be repeating that mistake. I would rather wait and play a game that is done than become impatient and urge them to get it out and hope that they fill in the holes later. As a result, I am willing to give this MMO a chance. Since my expectation of the industry as a whole is pretty low, it's not much of a gamble. I'm not putting my life on hold waiting for it to be released, and when it is, if it disappoints, I'll simply go back to doing what I was doing before...not playing MMOs.
How many developers can say they've been through a hugely successful game, also made mistakes on a second one, and learned from both? There's very few.
People seem to critique him for his mistakes in life but at least he owns up to them and fixed the problems he was having. That takes a lot to do and shows good character.
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Consider he(Brad McQuaid) managed the entire development team from the projects inception and created a successful title that is still running I'd say that is a big deal.
You can't use that comparative, it's one old extremely popular game that keeps a large player base, one new MMO has new standards to play by to meet the expectations of gamers that are obviously higher.
Graphics are the master race, they drive gaming altogether, the so-called "next-gen" or "current-gen" games, the industry of hardware and console gaming itself, it's simply where the money is.
IMO Pantheon doesn't look bad at all. I do think the UI makes it seem worse than it is which will likely be improved.
World of Warcraft:
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen:
Then you have other announced MMO's like Wild West Online showing off render graphics like this: https://www.facebook.com/WildWestOnline/videos/1857472187802904/
Obviously, when WWO appears claiming one MMO with one graphical appearance that is on the AAA quality tier, those games will be the getting the attention and the big bucks, even if they underperform on the gameplay front.
But Pantheon is not really falling on that style, it's approaching more the realistic graphics, and that is where you notice the quality if it had the visual approach of WoW or Crowfall it would be a different story.