This site does classified it as a MMORPG. What do you mean by "to me" that is a fact.
Show me the evidence that it is not so?
Can you read the game list here?
Facts from the game developers themselves https://www.planetside2.com/what-is-ps2 I rather have THEIR facts on their OWN game than this gaming site general classification.
Both are facts. You "rather have their facts" is an opinion. Now are you learning some logic yet?
Given you no longer argue whether the game list here classifies PS2 as a MMORPG, i guess you are learning a bit. Bravo!
I'm still playing MMOs, for I love the scale of it all, both in players and world. But purely distilled, fun gameplay? I think they have been beat by the genres mentioned above and when Survival games grow in scope and depth I'm afraid I'll be moving over.
I think you have something here. Good games is really about distilled, focused fun gameplay. There is little reason why you need a persistent world to house pvp, pve, and a bunch of stuff.
Just make a pvp game, and make it well (MOBA). Or an action game (WoT). Or a card game (TCG). Or a shooter (Overwatch). Or even action RPG (D3).
It is more efficient to develop (don't have to spend resources balancing pve and pvp, don't have to spend resources to build cities that are used as a 3D lobby), let the players sort themselves into what they like better, and make more money.
Classic type MMORPG is no longer needed in the gaming world, and western devs have already figured it out.
This site does classified it as a MMORPG. What do you mean by "to me" that is a fact.
Show me the evidence that it is not so?
Can you read the game list here?
Facts from the game developers themselves https://www.planetside2.com/what-is-ps2 I rather have THEIR facts on their OWN game than this gaming site general classification.
Both are facts. You "rather have their facts" is an opinion. Now are you learning some logic yet?
Given you no longer argue whether the game list here classifies PS2 as a MMORPG, i guess you are learning a bit. Bravo!
The MMO Market is dying, and that is the opinion of game developers. The economy has been in a decline for the past 17 years. Gamers can not spend enough money to restore confidence in Developer that the economy has turned around and that MMOs are no longer dying.
The greatest game in the MMO market has lost over half of it's paying customers. Many around here will laugh, cheer, and pat them selves on the back for a job of sabotage done well. But here is the thing as WoW declines so does the MMO industry as an entirety. Why is the success of every MMO tied to the success of WoW? Because the first thing an MMO's Boss will say, when they don't have the numbers they expected, is "steal me WoW's customers."
That's because every MMO Boss thinks he has tapped into some yet undiscovered pool of gamers, just waiting to be sucked dry. So those of us who get around, may ask someone to check our list of customer with their list of customer to see if any over lap. Of course they over lap. Because the supply of customers willing and able to spend money is limited and finite. So you return to your boss and tell him that the vast majority if not all of your customers are WoW customers as well.
But you have also checked the number of streams your game is seen on and found that the numbers are down. And when streams are down, so are profits. So they send out feels to find some streams that they can buy. And once the streams are up, so are profits. So you check the customer list again, and tell your boss that they stole another double handfuls of WoW customers. So he gets to sleep for another three months, before it all starts again.
Y'all call them Whales. But true "Whale hunters" call them, "WoW's remaining player base."
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
The MMO Market is dying, and that is the opinion of game developers. The economy has been in a decline for the past 17 years. Gamers can not spend enough money to restore confidence in Developer that the economy has turned around and that MMOs are no longer dying.
The greatest game in the MMO market has lost over half of it's paying customers. Many around here will laugh, cheer, and pat them selves on the back for a job of sabotage done well. But here is the thing as WoW declines so does the MMO industry as an entirety. Why is the success of every MMO tied to the success of WoW? Because the first thing an MMO's Boss will say, when they don't have the numbers they expected, is "steal me WoW's customers."
That's because every MMO Boss thinks he has tapped into some yet undiscovered pool of gamers, just waiting to be sucked dry. So those of us who get around, may ask someone to check our list of customer with their list of customer to see if any over lap. Of course they over lap. Because the supply of customers willing and able to spend money is limited and finite. So you return to your boss and tell him that the vast majority if not all of your customers are WoW customers as well.
But you have also checked the number of streams your game is seen on and found that the numbers are down. And when streams are down, so are profits. So they send out feels to find some streams that they can buy. And once the streams are up, so are profits. So you check the customer list again, and tell your boss that they stole another double handfuls of WoW customers. So he gets to sleep for another three months, before it all starts again.
Y'all call them Whales. But true "Whale hunters" call them, "WoW's remaining player base."
What economy have been in decline for 17 years? Certainly not MMOs who were far smaller in 2000 then today (2009 in another matter). The world economy is actually doing pretty well too.
Or do you mean US economy? While Us have more then a few MMO devs far from all companies are American. We have 'Norweigan, Japanese, Soth Korean, Russian and many other companies as well and EU generally have as many MMOers as US.
You are right that Wows playerbase are shared with similar games but that is just something expected, just like CIVs playerbase often play games like HoM&M and AoW. If you make a similar game to something else people who enjoyed the first game will be the most likely source of platers.
Now, a game like Eve or PS2 that are far more different probably have far less players in common with Wow.
New games do of course gain some new players or attract them from other genres as well. Eso did gain some people who played the TeS games but never a MMO before. The easiest way to do this is of course to use the setting of a popular none MMO or fictional IP to attract the fans.
Anyways: if the genre want more players you either need to get back people who moved away from the genre or attract new people. Doing the exact same thing as the other games are doing right now wont do that.
Either you need to figure out what made them play in the first place and why they quit and use that information to make a game that will get them back into the genre or you will need to figure out a new concept that will attract a new type of player. Easier said then done either of them but not impossible.
Recycling the same players for each new game is not a good tactic, you loose a few every time.
In another thread there was a mention about what people liked from wow vanilla that they miss now. It was mentioned that there were lots of reasons. This is to me an indication that I've been right all along, that people overall miss "an experience". You can't replace the experience of "meeting someone in the field and teaming up" by group finders. It'll lose the feeling of realism or what you call it. I believe that the boundaries of a free online world have been misunderstood/ignored and the needs to experience an online world as well.
Now you see this vanilla experience thing back a little in survival MMO's and games like Minecraft. So I'm wondering why EQ Landmark failed because it was filling up the gap of the need of having this experience with way better quality graphics. People seem to keep complaining over little things and forgetting why they're in an online mmo the first place? Okay, I've seen the review by Yogscast and it's not appreciative of experiencing an online world besides humor, which by the way degraded the whole game imo.
In terms of experiencing apparently people want to go back to the very basics and have full control: Minecraft. For me, after experiencing WoW graphics, Minecraft is kind of a joke. I think it's great with optional violence and all, but in the end you're just playing with cubes. You might as well go sit in a cubicle in order to earn money. Sorry, it won't cut it for me.
I think GW2 is too violent though I like the system. I think that about all MMO's that they're too violent. They should take Minecraft as an example... Probably can take a few mill. players away with the right approach.
I have gotten bored of MMO's. Every time I try one, I feel like i've played it before but just another skin. Then again, I don't know why i'm so addicted to ARPG's like Path of Exile.
Cryomatrix
Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
MMOs are stale because technology hasn't advanced enough to add new features. Gaming has evolved in this manner: 2d -> 3d -> 3d arpg (and 3d arpg still isn't up to par). so the next big thing will be VR -- but it's going to take a long time before VR is cheap enough and fun.
They are dying because developers focus too much on the cash shop and getting the most money as they possibly can. In older MMOs the developers had passion and wanted to make an MMO they love.
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
The MMO Market is dying, and that is the opinion of game developers. The economy has been in a decline for the past 17 years. Gamers can not spend enough money to restore confidence in Developer that the economy has turned around and that MMOs are no longer dying.
The greatest game in the MMO market has lost over half of it's paying customers. Many around here will laugh, cheer, and pat them selves on the back for a job of sabotage done well. But here is the thing as WoW declines so does the MMO industry as an entirety. Why is the success of every MMO tied to the success of WoW? Because the first thing an MMO's Boss will say, when they don't have the numbers they expected, is "steal me WoW's customers."
That's because every MMO Boss thinks he has tapped into some yet undiscovered pool of gamers, just waiting to be sucked dry. So those of us who get around, may ask someone to check our list of customer with their list of customer to see if any over lap. Of course they over lap. Because the supply of customers willing and able to spend money is limited and finite. So you return to your boss and tell him that the vast majority if not all of your customers are WoW customers as well.
But you have also checked the number of streams your game is seen on and found that the numbers are down. And when streams are down, so are profits. So they send out feels to find some streams that they can buy. And once the streams are up, so are profits. So you check the customer list again, and tell your boss that they stole another double handfuls of WoW customers. So he gets to sleep for another three months, before it all starts again.
Y'all call them Whales. But true "Whale hunters" call them, "WoW's remaining player base."
What economy have been in decline for 17 years? Certainly not MMOs who were far smaller in 2000 then today (2009 in another matter). The world economy is actually doing pretty well too.
Or do you mean US economy? While Us have more then a few MMO devs far from all companies are American. We have 'Norweigan, Japanese, Soth Korean, Russian and many other companies as well and EU generally have as many MMOers as US.
You are right that Wows playerbase are shared with similar games but that is just something expected, just like CIVs playerbase often play games like HoM&M and AoW. If you make a similar game to something else people who enjoyed the first game will be the most likely source of platers.
Now, a game like Eve or PS2 that are far more different probably have far less players in common with Wow.
New games do of course gain some new players or attract them from other genres as well. Eso did gain some people who played the TeS games but never a MMO before. The easiest way to do this is of course to use the setting of a popular none MMO or fictional IP to attract the fans.
Anyways: if the genre want more players you either need to get back people who moved away from the genre or attract new people. Doing the exact same thing as the other games are doing right now wont do that.
Either you need to figure out what made them play in the first place and why they quit and use that information to make a game that will get them back into the genre or you will need to figure out a new concept that will attract a new type of player. Easier said then done either of them but not impossible.
Recycling the same players for each new game is not a good tactic, you loose a few every time.
In the online & multiplayer game market there is one given, in every games customer base (those who spend money) WoW customers exceed (greater than) Non-WoW customers. If a game flipped that greater than symbol, then that would be news. Maybe they made an effort to hide the fact that they had more Non-WoW customers. But once an employee left, then word would spread. And it hasn't.
Let me state this again. No online multiplayer game can stand up and say, "The majority of our customers don't subscribe to WoW." Again I'm only talking about people who spend money when I say customers. Numbers inflated by those who don't spend money, is not what I am talking about.
As for that MMO that has pushed the 400k±50k subscriber limit. It only has 2k±500 unique subscribers. Many paying for hundreds of subscriptions, for clans played by a single user and many bots.
Yes, "recycling the same pool of customers for each new game is not a good tactic." But it's how the game is played.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Going back to how it used to be where there was only a playerbase of 200 and you knew everyone of them and new people were greeted and helped and bad people were still bad but not as obviously bad as if you ninja'd or greifed you have to enjoy playing solo. (Astonia 2, RPGWorld, EUO, Terraworld online etc) Still chat to people who used to play those games and they still exist even though some of them are open sourced or only have 1 person log in per day etc.
Comments
Given you no longer argue whether the game list here classifies PS2 as a MMORPG, i guess you are learning a bit. Bravo!
Just make a pvp game, and make it well (MOBA). Or an action game (WoT). Or a card game (TCG). Or a shooter (Overwatch). Or even action RPG (D3).
It is more efficient to develop (don't have to spend resources balancing pve and pvp, don't have to spend resources to build cities that are used as a 3D lobby), let the players sort themselves into what they like better, and make more money.
Classic type MMORPG is no longer needed in the gaming world, and western devs have already figured it out.
The greatest game in the MMO market has lost over half of it's paying customers. Many around here will laugh, cheer, and pat them selves on the back for a job of sabotage done well. But here is the thing as WoW declines so does the MMO industry as an entirety. Why is the success of every MMO tied to the success of WoW? Because the first thing an MMO's Boss will say, when they don't have the numbers they expected, is "steal me WoW's customers."
That's because every MMO Boss thinks he has tapped into some yet undiscovered pool of gamers, just waiting to be sucked dry. So those of us who get around, may ask someone to check our list of customer with their list of customer to see if any over lap. Of course they over lap. Because the supply of customers willing and able to spend money is limited and finite. So you return to your boss and tell him that the vast majority if not all of your customers are WoW customers as well.
But you have also checked the number of streams your game is seen on and found that the numbers are down. And when streams are down, so are profits. So they send out feels to find some streams that they can buy. And once the streams are up, so are profits. So you check the customer list again, and tell your boss that they stole another double handfuls of WoW customers. So he gets to sleep for another three months, before it all starts again.
Y'all call them Whales. But true "Whale hunters" call them, "WoW's remaining player base."
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Or do you mean US economy? While Us have more then a few MMO devs far from all companies are American. We have 'Norweigan, Japanese, Soth Korean, Russian and many other companies as well and EU generally have as many MMOers as US.
You are right that Wows playerbase are shared with similar games but that is just something expected, just like CIVs playerbase often play games like HoM&M and AoW. If you make a similar game to something else people who enjoyed the first game will be the most likely source of platers.
Now, a game like Eve or PS2 that are far more different probably have far less players in common with Wow.
New games do of course gain some new players or attract them from other genres as well. Eso did gain some people who played the TeS games but never a MMO before. The easiest way to do this is of course to use the setting of a popular none MMO or fictional IP to attract the fans.
Anyways: if the genre want more players you either need to get back people who moved away from the genre or attract new people. Doing the exact same thing as the other games are doing right now wont do that.
Either you need to figure out what made them play in the first place and why they quit and use that information to make a game that will get them back into the genre or you will need to figure out a new concept that will attract a new type of player. Easier said then done either of them but not impossible.
Recycling the same players for each new game is not a good tactic, you loose a few every time.
Now you see this vanilla experience thing back a little in survival MMO's and games like Minecraft. So I'm wondering why EQ Landmark failed because it was filling up the gap of the need of having this experience with way better quality graphics. People seem to keep complaining over little things and forgetting why they're in an online mmo the first place? Okay, I've seen the review by Yogscast and it's not appreciative of experiencing an online world besides humor, which by the way degraded the whole game imo.
In terms of experiencing apparently people want to go back to the very basics and have full control: Minecraft. For me, after experiencing WoW graphics, Minecraft is kind of a joke. I think it's great with optional violence and all, but in the end you're just playing with cubes. You might as well go sit in a cubicle in order to earn money. Sorry, it won't cut it for me.
I think GW2 is too violent though I like the system. I think that about all MMO's that they're too violent. They should take Minecraft as an example... Probably can take a few mill. players away with the right approach.
I have gotten bored of MMO's. Every time I try one, I feel like i've played it before but just another skin. Then again, I don't know why i'm so addicted to ARPG's like Path of Exile.
Cryomatrix
You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
http://twitch.tv/woetothevanquished
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
Let me state this again. No online multiplayer game can stand up and say, "The majority of our customers don't subscribe to WoW." Again I'm only talking about people who spend money when I say customers. Numbers inflated by those who don't spend money, is not what I am talking about.
As for that MMO that has pushed the 400k±50k subscriber limit. It only has 2k±500 unique subscribers. Many paying for hundreds of subscriptions, for clans played by a single user and many bots.
Yes, "recycling the same pool of customers for each new game is not a good tactic." But it's how the game is played.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Long story short, genres still alive.
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.