Why are people angry? I bet you would feel differently had they stolen your work.
This is more like their stealing work you did, at least part of which you actually sold to the person, over a decade ago and have since discarded and hadn't worked with or on for around 7 years. One you still have zero plans to work on again.
Why are people angry? I bet you would feel differently had they stolen your work.
This is more like their stealing work you did, at least part of which you actually sold to the person, over a decade ago and have since discarded and hadn't worked with or on for around 7 years. One you still have zero plans to work on again.
Yeah, NCsoft didn't even make City of Heroes. They were just the publisher. But they actually rather stole the IP than other way around.
You're right; revise my previous post to say "work someone else did, that you then bought rights to, then abandoned."
NCSoft is like the bratty spoiled child that shows everyone their toys but then whines and complains if someone touches them.
Seriously I don't understand why they care if a private server is up as long as it's not making a profit. If they are that up their own ass about COH, re-release the damn thing and make money off of it again. People *liked* it, I *liked* it, and I'm not one to like superhero games!
Oh NCSoft. Unwilling to do a goddamn thing with any of its western properties, but also unwilling to let anyone else touch or purchase them either. Scumbags. NCSoft are nothing but scumbags.
How are the scumbags ? It's their property ? Are you saying that I can come to your house, eat all your food then crap on the living floor for the lewls ? Cause you aren't using it at the current tiime ? Get real man, the real scumbags are the ones who steal intellectual property and pretend they are some kind of robin hood ?!?
#Ridiculous
This isn't at all like that, though.
This isn't real property, nor was it ever private property used to live in. The two items are fundamentally very different, and the laws should reflect that.
NCSoft is like the bratty spoiled child that shows everyone their toys but then whines and complains if someone touches them.
Seriously I don't understand why they care if a private server is up as long as it's not making a profit. If they are that up their own ass about COH, re-release the damn thing and make money off of it again. People *liked* it, I *liked* it, and I'm not one to like superhero games!
do you even understandf how ignorant your statement is ? Think gamers have a delusion that things they have no rights to, are theirs for the taking, now I wont get political, but this is trend that is building and it will destroy everything in its wake...
Entitled to playing a game they purchased, while also providing the server support services required to actually play the game they purchased after the original seller decides they don't want to be bothered with providing it anymore?
Yes, I could see how that attitude sets up society to completely and utterly destroy itself....
I wonder, if Ford announced that you'll no longer actually own the car you purchase from them because its design contains intellectual property... Instead, you're merely leasing the car until they decide they just really don't wanna manufacture any more parts for it, at which point they then force you to return the car or permanently park it and never use it again in favor of purchasing a new car... Would you guys still be espousing this same "WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?" nonsense?
NCSoft is like the bratty spoiled child that shows everyone their toys but then whines and complains if someone touches them.
Seriously I don't understand why they care if a private server is up as long as it's not making a profit. If they are that up their own ass about COH, re-release the damn thing and make money off of it again. People *liked* it, I *liked* it, and I'm not one to like superhero games!
do you even understandf how ignorant your statement is ? Think gamers have a delusion that things they have no rights to, are theirs for the taking, now I wont get political, but this is trend that is building and it will destroy everything in its wake...
I can understand Foxgirl's point, that if no one is using it and there is a market for it, then why not have NCsoft restart the thing. I agree with your point that it is IP and thus they can do whatever they want with it. I can also see why they won't restart it too.
Also, without getting political, were you going to say millennials? and/or liberals? PM your answer.
Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
at least i got to play for a couple of hours, something i thought would never have been possible.
and it still holds up to the mmo that are played these days.
i'd be content with a coh remaster not even a coh 2.
just a layer of polish and a new updated engine and i would happily dive back into the CoX world without hesitation.
it still has to this day some things that are sorely missed in most of nowadays mmorpgs. (mentor/mentee system, cooperation and synergies almost required to progress and level up and not just mindless solo questing and ofc the mastermind class, which is imo one of the best pet class ever).
what i don't understand though is that there are and there have been legion of lineage 2 private servers for as long as i can remember and they have mostly been left alone (with one notable exception that i can remember of : l2extreme because it was so big and admins were greedy and shady as fuck). those private server are and were actively vampirizing revenue from ncsoft whereas this coh server was not. sometimes i just don't get it with ncsoft.
NCsoft actually really hates City of Heroes. They hate most of their western MMOs actually. Wildstar for some reason was a CEO's pet project so lived a long time, even though it was doing a ton worse than CoH.
They hated Tabula Rasa enough to commit a crime against Richard Garriot, which NCsoft lost in court which makes them guilty no matter what one thinks of Richard or NCsoft, lose in court means loser is guilty in a court of law. They (NCsoft) also very quickly abandoned Auto Assault as well.
NCsoft doesn't tend to treat their western games very well. Though why they let Lineage private servers remain who knows, probably cause Lineage isn't a western game. If Lineage was created by the developers of CoH, they'd hate it as much as they did CoH.
Though Arenanet survives NCsoft, probably just cause they make a TON of money. If they were making money, but only a little like CoH made, they'd get closed down too.
I'd sooner pick EA as a publisher than NCsoft.
Let's be clear on a few things with Tabula Rasa though. Richard Garriot was a joke of a developer with it. He continuously went back to the drawing board and rebooted the project 3 - 4 times costing NCsoft tons of money in development costs in the process. The game didn't do well after launch either. It had little if anything to do with "hating" the game. The dev team didn't bug fix and it had a lot of problems and was lacking content sorely in places. It didn't have the sub count or box purchases to make up for the money garriot wasted with the numerous "reboots". While I don't think to kindly of NCsoft I think it was the right move to shut tabula rasa down given the overall situation. How they did it was shitty, but it was still the right move ultimately.
Why are people angry? I bet you would feel differently had they stolen your work.
This is more like their stealing work you did, at least part of which you actually sold to the person, over a decade ago and have since discarded and hadn't worked with or on for around 7 years. One you still have zero plans to work on again.
Yeah, NCsoft didn't even make City of Heroes. They were just the publisher. But they actually rather stole the IP than other way around.
You're right; revise my previous post to say "work someone else did, that you then bought rights to, then abandoned."
Happens all the time, the "5 year" car battery, 10 year incandescent light bulb, all were marketed at one point then pulled when those who owned their patents realized they were losing money.
Doesn't mean anyone can produce them today if the patents are still in place.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Oh NCSoft. Unwilling to do a goddamn thing with any of its western properties, but also unwilling to let anyone else touch or purchase them either. Scumbags. NCSoft are nothing but scumbags.
+1000...why would they let anyone else touch it...so they can show them up and make it profitable? Finally, all these @ss wipes trying to get clicks by promoting this story should be shot! This game is nothing without the original developers...
As someone who has a degree in interactive media, property is property , virual or physical.
OK since most of your bank accounts are virtual, I will take 500k from each of them, virtually. I mean , since you aren't using the money and it is not of the physical realm, no harm no foul.
That's a bad analogy because copying a discontinued game is pretty different than stealing money, which has to be accounted for. You're stealing money, not making a copy of it.
Yeah, not quite sure why they have such a vendetta against COH.
IMHO they think every person who's playing CoH (or wants to play CoH but can't ) should be playing one of their games instead and buying microtransactions daily.
Someone give me a Tl;dr on the last couple of pages in this thread since I stopped reading after someone posted the massivelyop link saying the guys could still go forward, just not with old character data.
Oh NCSoft. Unwilling to do a goddamn thing with any of its western properties, but also unwilling to let anyone else touch or purchase them either. Scumbags. NCSoft are nothing but scumbags.
Speak with your wallets...Refuse to buy or support any of their products.
Wouldn't make much of a difference to them. The Western market is basically gravy to them. Has been for a long time.
If you own intellectual property, and you want to keep owning it, you can't stand back and do nothing when other people use it without authorization. They pretty much have to take some action.
True enough, though I find it weird that they went after CoH, meanwhile there's dozens of L2 private servers out there, running without incident. At least two I know of have been up for a couple years now.
If anything, I'd think they would go after the game that's still live and making them money, not the one that's dead and buried by their own hand.
Oh NCSoft. Unwilling to do a goddamn thing with any of its western properties, but also unwilling to let anyone else touch or purchase them either. Scumbags. NCSoft are nothing but scumbags.
Speak with your wallets...Refuse to buy or support any of their products.
Doesn't work. It's a silent fall in profits or interest that's attributed to nothing more than market shift.
And that's only if you can get enough people to make a big enough dent for it to even exceed the expected fluxation rates.
Besides, if you aren't a customer, or at least they think you could be, you are of NO VALUE to them.
So don't do this "vote with your wallet" thing since that's the same as somebody in another house saying the "if you don't know I won't tell you" thing. It won't be heard, it doesn't influence anything, and they likely will never even know.
If you want to influence them, here's what you do...
CONTACT THEM DIRECTLY
Snail mail in dead tree format is at least ten fold more effective than anything email.
Be polite.
Do NOT make ANY kind of threat, direct or implied.
Do NOT make ANY mention of legal issues or threats.
That is flat out your best chance to get any result.
For some reason, humans respond better to actual physical mail than anything electronic.
If you aren't polite, they are going to round file you.
If you make any threat, real or otherwise, the cops will be involved and you will fail.
If you bring up lawsuits or threats of legal actions, you get tossed to the lawyers, who'll probably ignore you if they don't file a lawsuit, restraining order, or something else in the legal vein at you.
Again, actual mail that is polite, explains the issue, and makes no threats or mentions of law stuff has the greatest amount of influence on companies. Everything else basically fails, sometimes epically.
at least i got to play for a couple of hours, something i thought would never have been possible.
and it still holds up to the mmo that are played these days.
i'd be content with a coh remaster not even a coh 2.
just a layer of polish and a new updated engine and i would happily dive back into the CoX world without hesitation.
it still has to this day some things that are sorely missed in most of nowadays mmorpgs. (mentor/mentee system, cooperation and synergies almost required to progress and level up and not just mindless solo questing and ofc the mastermind class, which is imo one of the best pet class ever).
what i don't understand though is that there are and there have been legion of lineage 2 private servers for as long as i can remember and they have mostly been left alone (with one notable exception that i can remember of : l2extreme because it was so big and admins were greedy and shady as fuck). those private server are and were actively vampirizing revenue from ncsoft whereas this coh server was not. sometimes i just don't get it with ncsoft.
NCsoft actually really hates City of Heroes. They hate most of their western MMOs actually. Wildstar for some reason was a CEO's pet project so lived a long time, even though it was doing a ton worse than CoH.
They hated Tabula Rasa enough to commit a crime against Richard Garriot, which NCsoft lost in court which makes them guilty no matter what one thinks of Richard or NCsoft, lose in court means loser is guilty in a court of law. They (NCsoft) also very quickly abandoned Auto Assault as well.
NCsoft doesn't tend to treat their western games very well. Though why they let Lineage private servers remain who knows, probably cause Lineage isn't a western game. If Lineage was created by the developers of CoH, they'd hate it as much as they did CoH.
Though Arenanet survives NCsoft, probably just cause they make a TON of money. If they were making money, but only a little like CoH made, they'd get closed down too.
I'd sooner pick EA as a publisher than NCsoft.
Let's be clear on a few things with Tabula Rasa though. Richard Garriot was a joke of a developer with it. He continuously went back to the drawing board and rebooted the project 3 - 4 times costing NCsoft tons of money in development costs in the process. The game didn't do well after launch either. It had little if anything to do with "hating" the game. The dev team didn't bug fix and it had a lot of problems and was lacking content sorely in places. It didn't have the sub count or box purchases to make up for the money garriot wasted with the numerous "reboots". While I don't think to kindly of NCsoft I think it was the right move to shut tabula rasa down given the overall situation. How they did it was shitty, but it was still the right move ultimately.
He still won in court, so doesn't matter what someone thinks otherwise. No matter what else was involved, for in a court of law that is what they decided that Richard Garriot was the victim.
He won in court because of how they handled FIRING him. Not because of anything to do with TR directly, but with how they handled firing him. He'd of not been fired had he handled TR in a better fashion in the first place as the games he produced had actually done fairly well for the company to that point. He wasted 7 years of development time, numerous reboots, and the like and still made a lackluster game (sorry fans of it it was). He was also the CEO of NC Interactive (NC Austin) so ncsoft did what they did to force him out as it would of basically been impossible to do so otherwise. While they could of talked to the board and seen to a vote simply to oust him (which is what they should of done) them firing him in some fashion after the amount of money and time he spent was inevitable at the same time as was the shut down of TR at that point.
Garriot again won in court because of how they handled ousting him from the company. He was bad for business and owned a lot of stock which complicated matters ultimately. He won because they forced him to sell his stock and leave the company which was wrong of them to do (don't get me wrong I think they handled it like dicks), but again I was talking about why TR was ultimately shut down. It had little to do with garriot and everything to do with it costing the company way to much money and time to develop and they didn't even break even or have the numbers subscriber wise to support ongoing server costs...
I never said Garriot should of lost the lawsuit. Just that he was a joke at that point (still remains a joke with how shroud of the avatar is) developer/producer wise.... I simply said given the overall screw up on his end wasting a ton of time and money that it wasn't surprising that TR shut down when it couldn't even break even and was bleeding money after launch and that him being ousted was no surprise even though NCsoft handled it terribly from a legal perspective. Garriot had a magic touch at one time, but that touch has long been gone from him and he has his head so far up his own ass at times I just don't even. I still respect what he's done, but he just doesn't have it anymore.
Why are people angry? I bet you would feel differently had they stolen your work.
This is more like their stealing work you did, at least part of which you actually sold to the person, over a decade ago and have since discarded and hadn't worked with or on for around 7 years. One you still have zero plans to work on again.
Yeah, NCsoft didn't even make City of Heroes. They were just the publisher. But they actually rather stole the IP than other way around.
You're right; revise my previous post to say "work someone else did, that you then bought rights to, then abandoned."
Happens all the time, the "5 year" car battery, 10 year incandescent light bulb, all were marketed at one point then pulled when those who owned their patents realized they were losing money.
Doesn't mean anyone can produce them today if the patents are still in place.
No one is trying to produce new batteries. They're merely seeking to make existing ones function, and since it's software we're talking, the analogy has to exist in a world where the battery doesn't deteriorate over time or with use.
If you own intellectual property, and you want to keep owning it, you can't stand back and do nothing when other people use it without authorization. They pretty much have to take some action.
True enough, though I find it weird that they went after CoH, meanwhile there's dozens of L2 private servers out there, running without incident. At least two I know of have been up for a couple years now.
If anything, I'd think they would go after the game that's still live and making them money, not the one that's dead and buried by their own hand.
Are any of these L2 private servers using stolen L2 server code? Or are they an EMU ? If someone wants an CoH server then they should work on an EMU and not steal the actually server code. I don't see this ending well for the people involved.
Comments
Seriously I don't understand why they care if a private server is up as long as it's not making a profit. If they are that up their own ass about COH, re-release the damn thing and make money off of it again. People *liked* it, I *liked* it, and I'm not one to like superhero games!
This isn't real property, nor was it ever private property used to live in. The two items are fundamentally very different, and the laws should reflect that.
Yes, I could see how that attitude sets up society to completely and utterly destroy itself....
I wonder, if Ford announced that you'll no longer actually own the car you purchase from them because its design contains intellectual property... Instead, you're merely leasing the car until they decide they just really don't wanna manufacture any more parts for it, at which point they then force you to return the car or permanently park it and never use it again in favor of purchasing a new car... Would you guys still be espousing this same "WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?" nonsense?
Also, without getting political, were you going to say millennials? and/or liberals? PM your answer.
You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Doesn't mean anyone can produce them today if the patents are still in place.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Now we have long forgotten IPs left to languish, unused by owners who couldn't give a fuck less.
+1000...why would they let anyone else touch it...so they can show them up and make it profitable? Finally, all these @ss wipes trying to get clicks by promoting this story should be shot! This game is nothing without the original developers...
(is all I have to say)
If anything, I'd think they would go after the game that's still live and making them money, not the one that's dead and buried by their own hand.
Unless, maybe they're considering re-opening CoH themselves and don't want private servers undermining it? Hmmm.
Doesn't work. It's a silent fall in profits or interest that's attributed to nothing more than market shift.
And that's only if you can get enough people to make a big enough dent for it to even exceed the expected fluxation rates.
Besides, if you aren't a customer, or at least they think you could be, you are of NO VALUE to them.
So don't do this "vote with your wallet" thing since that's the same as somebody in another house saying the "if you don't know I won't tell you" thing. It won't be heard, it doesn't influence anything, and they likely will never even know.
If you want to influence them, here's what you do...
CONTACT THEM DIRECTLY
Snail mail in dead tree format is at least ten fold more effective than anything email.
Be polite.
Do NOT make ANY kind of threat, direct or implied.
Do NOT make ANY mention of legal issues or threats.
That is flat out your best chance to get any result.
For some reason, humans respond better to actual physical mail than anything electronic.
If you aren't polite, they are going to round file you.
If you make any threat, real or otherwise, the cops will be involved and you will fail.
If you bring up lawsuits or threats of legal actions, you get tossed to the lawyers, who'll probably ignore you if they don't file a lawsuit, restraining order, or something else in the legal vein at you.
Again, actual mail that is polite, explains the issue, and makes no threats or mentions of law stuff has the greatest amount of influence on companies. Everything else basically fails, sometimes epically.
Lost my mind, now trying to lose yours...
Garriot again won in court because of how they handled ousting him from the company. He was bad for business and owned a lot of stock which complicated matters ultimately. He won because they forced him to sell his stock and leave the company which was wrong of them to do (don't get me wrong I think they handled it like dicks), but again I was talking about why TR was ultimately shut down. It had little to do with garriot and everything to do with it costing the company way to much money and time to develop and they didn't even break even or have the numbers subscriber wise to support ongoing server costs...
I never said Garriot should of lost the lawsuit. Just that he was a joke at that point (still remains a joke with how shroud of the avatar is) developer/producer wise.... I simply said given the overall screw up on his end wasting a ton of time and money that it wasn't surprising that TR shut down when it couldn't even break even and was bleeding money after launch and that him being ousted was no surprise even though NCsoft handled it terribly from a legal perspective. Garriot had a magic touch at one time, but that touch has long been gone from him and he has his head so far up his own ass at times I just don't even. I still respect what he's done, but he just doesn't have it anymore.
If someone wants an CoH server then they should work on an EMU and not steal the actually server code. I don't see this ending well for the people involved.