ArtCraft Entertainment Closes $12m in Funding, Details Beta - MMORPG.com

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ArtCraft Entertainment Closes $12m in Funding, Details Beta - MMORPG.com

Crowfall's J. Todd Coleman shared a Founder's Update announcing the close of another round of financing for the upcoming MMO.

Read the full story here

Utinni

Good to hear for this team. Hoping the game can eventually become as robust as SB was.

ultimateduck

Hoping for the best on this game.

F2Plague

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..

I don't back these games because I feel like they just hand out assets on a mass scale to players before the game is even released. And every couple of months they have their hands out again asking for more and giving "future players" even more of an advantage.

I perfectly understand they need to raise funds, but I would be more inclined to give to a company that wasn't using pay to win or pay to advance incentives to reward donors. I don't see this working out in the long term.

This is just my opinion. I know the people investing a lot of money into this game are probably gonna be up in arms over it. But I would be extremely surprised to see this kind of business model create a long term gaming experience. Realistically, anyone who buys the standard edition of the game, is just paying for the opportunity to be a donors peasant.

Alomar

F2Plague said:

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..



I don't back these games because I feel like they just hand out assets on a mass scale to players before the game is even released. And every couple of months they have their hands out again asking for more and giving "future players" even more of an advantage.



I perfectly understand they need to raise funds, but I would be more inclined to give to a company that wasn't using pay to win or pay to advance incentives to reward donors. I don't see this working out in the long term.



This is just my opinion. I know the people investing a lot of money into this game are probably gonna be up in arms over it. But I would be extremely surprised to see this kind of business model create a long term gaming experience. Realistically, anyone who buys the standard edition of the game, is just paying for the opportunity to be a donors peasant.

Your not alone, even amongst us looking forward to the game. It's why even though I'm looking forward to Crowfall, I much prefer the development and the backer store of Camelot Unchained significantly more. Yet, I think not creating their own engine and struggling to host battles 1/100 the size of CU will be Crowfall's downfall rather than it's store.

F2Plague

Alomar said:

F2Plague said:

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..



I don't back these games because I feel like they just hand out assets on a mass scale to players before the game is even released. And every couple of months they have their hands out again asking for more and giving "future players" even more of an advantage.



I perfectly understand they need to raise funds, but I would be more inclined to give to a company that wasn't using pay to win or pay to advance incentives to reward donors. I don't see this working out in the long term.



This is just my opinion. I know the people investing a lot of money into this game are probably gonna be up in arms over it. But I would be extremely surprised to see this kind of business model create a long term gaming experience. Realistically, anyone who buys the standard edition of the game, is just paying for the opportunity to be a donors peasant.

Your not alone, even amongst us looking forward to the game. It's why even though I'm looking forward to Crowfall, I much prefer the development and the backer store of Camelot Unchained significantly more. Yet, I think not creating their own engine and struggling to host battles 1/100 the size of CU will be Crowfall's downfall rather than it's store.

Glad I am not the only one who see's the pitfall they are digging themselves. I was unaware of any game play issues as I don't really follow any kick starter games. Good to hear CU is doing it right, I never played DAOC. Would be nice to have something to look forward to in the MMO genre.

Truvidienn

Not gonna lie.. Hope I get a beta invite.

Utinni

F2Plague said:

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..

I don't back these games because I feel like they just hand out assets on a mass scale to players before the game is even released. And every couple of months they have their hands out again asking for more and giving "future players" even more of an advantage.

I perfectly understand they need to raise funds, but I would be more inclined to give to a company that wasn't using pay to win or pay to advance incentives to reward donors. I don't see this working out in the long term.

This is just my opinion. I know the people investing a lot of money into this game are probably gonna be up in arms over it. But I would be extremely surprised to see this kind of business model create a long term gaming experience. Realistically, anyone who buys the standard edition of the game, is just paying for the opportunity to be a donors peasant.

It's akin to buying mines, trees, and shrines in Shadowbane except with real money. Pretty insane.

Arkade99

F2Plague said:

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..

You can't purchase resource nodes. I'm not sure where you got that from. The guild halls can only be placed in EKs. EKs are glorified housing. The actual PvP competition will be in the campaigns, where those buildings and parcels that people purchased can't be used.

The only thing that may impact campaigns are the statues, but they haven't been implemented yet, so we don't know exactly what the impact will be. We do know that players will be able to obtain the statues in game and that crafting specific buildings will be required to house the statues in order to get the buffs.

Arterius said:

No your not wrong I have been saying that for a while. There is also an optional sub that I feel is very P2W.



I still argue to this day that if you choose to just buy in and not get a sub you have no chance at competing against people who do

How is the optional sub P2W? Please elaborate, because they removed the extra training from VIP. In fact, we don't even know exactly what's going to be in the VIP sub at this point, so to say it is P2W is ridiculous.

Lukzfresh

You can just buy into beta of course . Because that is the thing now in days. I bought in 2 yearsish ago... I don’t buy into games anymore. It’s just a terrible idea and normally they fail.

Kajidourden

F2Plague said:

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..

I don't back these games because I feel like they just hand out assets on a mass scale to players before the game is even released. And every couple of months they have their hands out again asking for more and giving "future players" even more of an advantage.

I perfectly understand they need to raise funds, but I would be more inclined to give to a company that wasn't using pay to win or pay to advance incentives to reward donors. I don't see this working out in the long term.

This is just my opinion. I know the people investing a lot of money into this game are probably gonna be up in arms over it. But I would be extremely surprised to see this kind of business model create a long term gaming experience. Realistically, anyone who buys the standard edition of the game, is just paying for the opportunity to be a donors peasant.

You have no idea what you're talking about, and it shows.  

Arkade99

Lukzfresh said:

You can just buy into beta of course . Because that is the thing now in days. I bought in 2 yearsish ago... I don’t buy into games anymore. It’s just a terrible idea and normally they fail.

The upcoming beta is completely free as long as you have created an account on Crowfall.com, so there's that.

tweedledumb99

I've seen a few people say that Crowfall is Pay2Win and I've never seen a sign that's for sure true, just ambiguity in the descriptions that makes it possible to use to get an advantage.

Quizzical

F2Plague said:

No one finds any of the stuff on their shop pay to win? Kickstarter bundles either? I mean.. if you ask me being able to buy resource nodes for your kingdom, guild halls for your guild, buff providing statues all for real money seems a bit off side in a PVP focused game.. And those are just cash shop, the Kickstarter bundles are even more questionable..

I don't back these games because I feel like they just hand out assets on a mass scale to players before the game is even released. And every couple of months they have their hands out again asking for more and giving "future players" even more of an advantage.

I perfectly understand they need to raise funds, but I would be more inclined to give to a company that wasn't using pay to win or pay to advance incentives to reward donors. I don't see this working out in the long term.

This is just my opinion. I know the people investing a lot of money into this game are probably gonna be up in arms over it. But I would be extremely surprised to see this kind of business model create a long term gaming experience. Realistically, anyone who buys the standard edition of the game, is just paying for the opportunity to be a donors peasant.

It all depends on the details.  If you can buy something useful, but can easily get the same thing just by playing the game, is that pay to win?  What if the version you can buy looks different but functions equivalently?  What if what you can buy genuinely does give you a huge advantage, but only in some special circumstances that few people care about and doesn't any other players?

So yes, it depends on the details--and the details aren't yet known.  Sure, it could turn into heavy pay to win.  Or it might be completely fine.  I'm inclined to wait and see before passing judgment.

Scot

tweedledumb99 said:

I've seen a few people say that Crowfall is Pay2Win and I've never seen a sign that's for sure true, just ambiguity in the descriptions that makes it possible to use to get an advantage.

Having read about buying resource nodes and guild halls it is going to start out very P2W.

Copperfield

i bought this game... and refunded it 3 hours later.. the direction they going with combat and the world is just not my thing..

its more of a hub multiplayer pvp game.. and gets boring very fast.. 

same maps over over.. capture that point attack that castle.. no feeling of presistance world or any progress..

i see this game becoming a success for 4/5 months because people are hungry for a good mmorpg.. but this aint gonna be it

Kyleran

Copperfield said:

i bought this game... and refunded it 3 hours later.. the direction they going with combat and the world is just not my thing..

its more of a hub multiplayer pvp game.. and gets boring very fast.. 

same maps over over.. capture that point attack that castle.. no feeling of presistance world or any progress..

i see this game becoming a success for 4/5 months because people are hungry for a good mmorpg.. but this aint gonna be it

This is why I've held off from really following this game, the lack of persistance which one element I really enjoy in MMORPGs.

Three years after leaving EVE I sometimes still pull up the sovereignty map and see how it has changed. I also mull over the regions I helped take and lose,  with many of the same organizations still battling for control of null sec.

It's one of the things that kept me coming back which I'm just not seeing in CFs model, which seems almost like an oversized and extended BR in many ways 

IsilithTehroth

Game needs drastic improvements. As a backer so many things about the game are off(granted it is alpha) from combat being zerg v zerg with CC spamming and over the top bloom effects to nothing at all to do in game. The mobs as least seem more responsive then past versions though. I decided to retry it last night it there is some improvement,but not enough for the time its been in alpha. Also there needs to be some persistence to the game world as others have stated. I don't want to do 3 months sessions and then have to restart everytime. That will lead to tons of player attrition. A huge sprawling main map that is affected by campaigns win/loses so we are actually contributing to something is needed. Specific items/gear both cosemetic and stats should be unlocked via campaigns ect.

Scot

Scot said:

tweedledumb99 said:

I've seen a few people say that Crowfall is Pay2Win and I've never seen a sign that's for sure true, just ambiguity in the descriptions that makes it possible to use to get an advantage.

Having read about buying resource nodes and guild halls it is going to start out very P2W.

If I have that wrong do expand, you know I just skim threads on games not out yet. The "you can always grind it" argument will depend very much on how long it takes to grind.

Arkade99

Scot said:

Scot said:

tweedledumb99 said:

I've seen a few people say that Crowfall is Pay2Win and I've never seen a sign that's for sure true, just ambiguity in the descriptions that makes it possible to use to get an advantage.

Having read about buying resource nodes and guild halls it is going to start out very P2W.

If I have that wrong do expand, you know I just skim threads on games not out yet. The "you can always grind it" argument will depend very much on how long it takes to grind.

Yes, you do have that wrong. You can't buy resource nodes. I have no idea where people are getting that from. In your EK, you can't get any resources besides basic, which aren't useful for much. The best resources will be available in the campaigns with the most risk. 

Guild halls can be purchased, but they do nothing but sit in your EK. EKs are not the primary focus of the game. The competition is in the campaigns, where if you want a guild hall, you will actually have to build it.

muthax

This kind of threads remind me of when TESO was in BETA and people said it was a wow clone... luckily I got into beta myself and could see it was all FUD, like with Crowfall

muthax

IsilithTehroth said:

 I don't want to do 3 months sessions and then have to restart everytime. That will lead to tons of player attrition. A huge sprawling main map that is affected by campaigns win/loses so we are actually contributing to something is needed. Specific items/gear both cosemetic and stats should be unlocked via campaigns ect.

You don't have to restart, your character progression is maintained, only the campaign worlds reset. If I misunderstood your comment, apologies

Arkade99

muthax said:

IsilithTehroth said:

 I don't want to do 3 months sessions and then have to restart everytime. That will lead to tons of player attrition. A huge sprawling main map that is affected by campaigns win/loses so we are actually contributing to something is needed. Specific items/gear both cosemetic and stats should be unlocked via campaigns ect.

You don't have to restart, your character progression is maintained, only the campaign worlds reset. If I misunderstood your comment, apologies

On top of that, some campaigns will last 6 months or more. 

Scot

Arkade99 said:

Scot said:

Scot said:

tweedledumb99 said:

I've seen a few people say that Crowfall is Pay2Win and I've never seen a sign that's for sure true, just ambiguity in the descriptions that makes it possible to use to get an advantage.

Having read about buying resource nodes and guild halls it is going to start out very P2W.

If I have that wrong do expand, you know I just skim threads on games not out yet. The "you can always grind it" argument will depend very much on how long it takes to grind.

Yes, you do have that wrong. You can't buy resource nodes. I have no idea where people are getting that from. In your EK, you can't get any resources besides basic, which aren't useful for much. The best resources will be available in the campaigns with the most risk. 

Guild halls can be purchased, but they do nothing but sit in your EK. EKs are not the primary focus of the game. The competition is in the campaigns, where if you want a guild hall, you will actually have to build it.

Fair points, what's this about buff statues, I got it from the post above.

muthax

Arkade99 said:

On top of that, some campaigns will last 6 months or more. 

What people don't understand is that you don't have CHARACTERS, you have VESSELS that your soul can inhabit. You train skills passively (like in EVE but better because you just accrue Skill Points and then distribute them) and any vessel that uses a particular skill (ie heavy armour or leather armour, etc) benefits from them

Arkade99

Scot said:

Arkade99 said:

Scot said:

Scot said:

tweedledumb99 said:

I've seen a few people say that Crowfall is Pay2Win and I've never seen a sign that's for sure true, just ambiguity in the descriptions that makes it possible to use to get an advantage.

Having read about buying resource nodes and guild halls it is going to start out very P2W.

If I have that wrong do expand, you know I just skim threads on games not out yet. The "you can always grind it" argument will depend very much on how long it takes to grind.

Yes, you do have that wrong. You can't buy resource nodes. I have no idea where people are getting that from. In your EK, you can't get any resources besides basic, which aren't useful for much. The best resources will be available in the campaigns with the most risk. 

Guild halls can be purchased, but they do nothing but sit in your EK. EKs are not the primary focus of the game. The competition is in the campaigns, where if you want a guild hall, you will actually have to build it.

Fair points, what's this about buff statues, I got it from the post above.

They haven't been implemented yet, so this is all subject to change, but there are 2 types of statues: artifacts and relics. There are no artifacts for sale in the store, and only 2 relics. The relics you can buy are:

Arkon Greatsword Relic - Gives +crit chance for harvesting
Golden Dragon Altar Relic - Doesn't specify the type of benefit

Both of these items specifically say that you can obtain them in game:

*All relics can also be found and scavenged from the Campaign Worlds.

So these aren't some exclusive thing where you can only obtain them by spending money. Furthermore, there are restrictions on their use, which you can read about in the game's FAQ. You don't just buy the relic and immediately get the benefit from it. 

Relics must be placed in specific buildings in an EK. Most of those buildings don't even exist yet, but I think we'll see many of them come online in the next patch. My assumption is that we'll have to craft those buildings, but they may also be made available in the store. Players are limited to 3 artifact/relic buffs at a time and the buffs run out and need to be recharged by some in-game method. 

So the basic idea is that you place the relics in specific buildings in your EK and those buffs apply to your characters no matter which world they are in. Everyone will have the ability to obtain relics by playing the game. They are meant as a way to tie EKs and Campaigns together, but in a small way that doesn't unbalance things.

These will be small buffs. With full training and gear, I can exceed 40% harvesting crit chance. The 2 or 3% I get from a relic isn't going to mean much. It's just another way for people to play the min/max game. If people want to spend money on that, and then spend more money on the building to place it in, rather than just obtaining them in game, more power to them.