I mean, to me it seems they threw him right under the bus. Yeah, no experience, but why in hell would you put someone like that tip top. It's amazon, with piles of money to throw around, you couldn't find a bum with some experience? While I don't know the backend and whether there were 'wtf am I doing' conversations, amazon proper dropped the ball completely, and decided I'mma follow the ball into that pig shit it fell in. 'I guess I have no common sense, and I'm going to just cut the connection to a proper thinking brain and roll with it.'
I mean, to me it seems they threw him right under the bus. Yeah, no experience, but why in hell would you put someone like that tip top. It's amazon, with piles of money to throw around, you couldn't find a bum with some experience? While I don't know the backend and whether there were 'wtf am I doing' conversations, amazon proper dropped the ball completely, and decided I'mma follow the ball into that pig shit it fell in. 'I guess I have no common sense, and I'm going to just cut the connection to a proper thinking brain and roll with it.'
That is pretty much it yes.
To me, so far, it looks like it's one big $hit show in there!
After years of failures with canceled games under development and the crash&burn of New World. They have literally nothing to show for it.
Like others already mentioned. Typical example that money can't buy everything. No matter how much money you throw at it, if you don't have the right people working there, you're destined to fail.
It's the same with John Smedley. He is the CEO of AGS San Diego for the last 5+ years and so far, they just seem to burn away money with nothing to show for it.
I seriously wonder what the point so far is with Amazon's venture into gaming, with like 4-5 different studios producing nothing! Other than a failure called New World and publishing Lost Ark.
FF14(24,762)(29,062)(95,150)Steam charts shows it is doing just as bad on this platform alone meaning that other platforms could be even worse. Valheim is doing worse than NW starting with over half a million concurrent and completely crashed now despite being Steam only.
I see your point but the example here is a bad one since FFXIV doesn't have most of it's accounts on steam.
A big portion of the playerbase bought the game from the FFXIV store.
This guy is a convenient excuse. Its just as likely that coming in with no experience he was actually deferring to the Devs decisions. I am not saying he isn't to blame because obviously he is responsible and has to pay the piper. He was hired to make good decisions not just blindly accept game devs that have a history of mistakes. At his level he was likely barely involved in this project. I would need to see what actual decisions he was making that were in disagreement with the lead developer, in order to make an informed decision either way.
I doubt anything will magically change for the good for New World. Unfortunately is seems in game development good management is very hard to come by. This idea that you need to be a game dev to manage is a ridiculous. How many of these game devs have made absolutely horrible games. It really has no relevance really. Most game devs totally disagree with their customers.
I will give Amazon credit for one thing, at least they are holding someone accountable and recognizing that New World development was a problem. More heads need to roll. They should figure out who was actually making these huge failure decisions and fire all the people associated that were not speaking up.
Sorry, but you people look back with way too rose tinted glasses. Just because these games are still online, doesn't mean they are succesful in any way. The games are just kept alive by a bunch of wales spending lots of money and keep the lights on at SSG and CCP. That's about it. Since both companies have nothing else to keep them alive or afloat!
Yikes. Sorry, I guess.
I was just trying to share opinions on the subject and get different views. Of course, I should have known it's a settled subject beyond hearing different sides. My mistake.
In my mind, I considered EvE and DDO a turnaround because people were touting it a financial success in gaming rags. I guess I was wrong. Again, sorry.
Please correct my bad thinking by telling me the correct definition of a turnaround. Again, I beg forgiveness for being so woefully ill-informed. Must be those damn rose-tinted glasses.
If it was such a success and turnaround, then Turbine wouldn't have gone through several major lay off rounds and went nearly bankrupt, until bought up by WB. WB's first act was to ditch both DDO and LOTRO as not worth the effort and it not being profitable enough. If some former devs didn't form SSG and begged WB for them to take over these games, then both games would have been shutdown before end 2016.
EVE Online is just a sad story and most of it is CCP's own fault. Not sticking to their guns and vision and let themselves being blackmailed and threatened by a bunch of adult bullies (Goons & Co).
I fairness you have to look at the whole picture. DDO was a huge turnaround. So much so that they implemented their pay model to LOTRO.
However, Turbine had a number of stalled or incomplete projects. I remember reading an article about the studio seemingly spinning its wheels. So yeah, stuff like that is going to put a huge strain on a business.
Then, over time, the owners sold to Warner Brothers. Now, for a huge studio, what Turbine was making wasn't enough. Remember, for a large publicly traded company, it's not being profitable that's important but being profitable enough.
Did they really beg WB to take over? I'd have to see that article. My thought is that WB wasn't interested in those games so they said "hey, we'll buy those properties and separate." That's not begging, that's people who have been working at a business for a long time, they are invested in their properties and their people and they'd rather separate.
Sounds like a great deal to me as long as they can stay in the black.
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In a previous post (by me) I mentioned City of Heroes and its axe to the face even though profits were being made. I see some of that for these other games and I am STILL left to wonder, why, if a game makes money would it be culled. A dollar is a dollar. Only when your company is on the sinking end of a canoe and profit ISN'T PROFIT would I see money rolling in as an excuse to axe a game. Even if you expect 10 mil a quarter and get 150k if it's over the margin, I feel if it's your only investment, pure profit even if small, go bigger keep the moneymaker (I'm not gambler). I guess thats still an aside though lol. I want New World to get better, and I still feel its 'out of the gate' momentum was good. Problem is, a small world with grinding to no... real end, in the end, didn't hold me. I always wanna go back playing but I know if I do I'll either b A) chopping down trees or Getting killed by respawns before I can kill the adds.
Frankly I would'nt use DDO as a measurement for anything, least of all LOTRO. While I might be vastly uninformed here, DDO has no real relationship with LOTRO, especially in terms of profit. It was a solid /puzzle game but adhered to much to its pen and paper origins. Beyond that, I've seen no relation between its (success?) and LOTROS (...success????). I quite like lotro in the past, but its, newfound /glory is VASTLY intertwined with ftp offers and gameplay bonuses. I'm currently waiting for the new .......... Build??()() to be released and then I may go back to it. DDO on the other hand was amazing, but soooo, limited considering it Held far to much to its PnP origins. Gimme real people I can actually shake my fist at, it's the far better game, but purely online.
In a previous post (by me) I mentioned City of Heroes and its axe to the face even though profits were being made. I see some of that for these other games and I am STILL left to wonder, why, if a game makes money would it be culled. A dollar is a dollar. Only when your company is on the sinking end of a canoe and profit ISN'T PROFIT would I see money rolling in as an excuse to axe a game. Even if you expect 10 mil a quarter and get 150k if it's over the margin, I feel if it's your only investment, pure profit even if small, go bigger keep the moneymaker (I'm not gambler). I guess thats still an aside though lol. I want New World to get better, and I still feel its 'out of the gate' momentum was good. Problem is, a small world with grinding to no... real end, in the end, didn't hold me. I always wanna go back playing but I know if I do I'll either b A) chopping down trees or Getting killed by respawns before I can kill the adds.
You are overlooking something very important to people responsible for making money, the opportunity cost of an investment.
Using your numbers, $40M per year spent for $600K profit, a 1.5% return which is terrible from a business perspective.
Rather they took that $40M, invested it in some new mobile cash shop game which made them mega millions, probably at even obscene margins like 30 or 40 percent.
Hindsight is 20 / 20, no one can really predict the future, but in general older games continue to die, while the "potential" to hit it big lies in future investments even though the risk is greater of course.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Comments
To me, so far, it looks like it's one big $hit show in there!
After years of failures with canceled games under development and the crash&burn of New World. They have literally nothing to show for it.
Like others already mentioned. Typical example that money can't buy everything. No matter how much money you throw at it, if you don't have the right people working there, you're destined to fail.
It's the same with John Smedley. He is the CEO of AGS San Diego for the last 5+ years and so far, they just seem to burn away money with nothing to show for it.
I seriously wonder what the point so far is with Amazon's venture into gaming, with like 4-5 different studios producing nothing! Other than a failure called New World and publishing Lost Ark.
I see your point but the example here is a bad one since FFXIV doesn't have most of it's accounts on steam.
A big portion of the playerbase bought the game from the FFXIV store.
I doubt anything will magically change for the good for New World. Unfortunately is seems in game development good management is very hard to come by. This idea that you need to be a game dev to manage is a ridiculous. How many of these game devs have made absolutely horrible games. It really has no relevance really. Most game devs totally disagree with their customers.
I will give Amazon credit for one thing, at least they are holding someone accountable and recognizing that New World development was a problem. More heads need to roll. They should figure out who was actually making these huge failure decisions and fire all the people associated that were not speaking up.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Game has more life than NW however simply because it has lots more content and is better made even if AGS is trying hard to fudge this on up too.
Good riddence to Mike Frazzini I say.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Using your numbers, $40M per year spent for $600K profit, a 1.5% return which is terrible from a business perspective.
Rather they took that $40M, invested it in some new mobile cash shop game which made them mega millions, probably at even obscene margins like 30 or 40 percent.
Hindsight is 20 / 20, no one can really predict the future, but in general older games continue to die, while the "potential" to hit it big lies in future investments even though the risk is greater of course.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon