Bomb: Throne and Liberty chose Tab Targetting gameplay

Interesting

I just had to bring back my ancient MMORPG.com account from the nether or wherever it is that it was resting to communicate this to the community here:

Just saw the most recent videos from internal beta testers gameplay.
I saw it in this video 

This game did so many right things, I think they are developing it its been 10-12 years now, and whenever they got close to decide on releasing, they perceived it would flop and get beat up by the current competition at the time (Diablo 3, Path of Exiles, Lost Ark, Black Desert Online, etc), so they went back to the drawing board. Which was a wise decision.

But it looks like this time it will finally fail, if they dont rewrite the entire thing into proper gameplay standards: Unreal Tournament, Hellgate London, Firefall, Overwatch 2 (for people with atleast two hands, atleast one eye and a functioning brain "fight or flight" decision capable).

The korean game Air, looked awesome and promising, until people spotted it was tab targetting, and they half-baked it into action combat to no avail. So its looking even worse for NcSoft Throne and Liberty.

There is a reason Dwarf Fortress and Runescape did not do the Rockstar Games leap from GTA 2 to GTA 3. Throne and Liberty will go nowhere.

In another news, Ashes of Creation seems to have been backtracking on the gameplay choice as well, to a more hybrid version, which is still not Unreal Tournament/Overwatch 2/Firefall enough... or Elite/Freelancer enough (from, you know, the guy who got hundreds of million of monies in investment to make Star Citizen).

[Deleted User]

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Iselin

Define what you mean by "tab target gameplay."

I could give less of a shit if you also optionally can pick out an individual from a crowd by using the tab key. Actually, I lie. I do like that use of the tab key even In otherwise action combat games.

All I really care about for a game to be in my action combat wheelhouse preference is whether or not I can also aim just by my facing, whether or not I can actively avoid damage with blocks, dodges, etc. and whether or not the combat is fast-paced and not subject to long cooldowns for skills.

[Deleted User]

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Slapshot1188

Also... Ashes of creation was ALWAYS supposed to have hybrid Tab target combat... 

• Combat targeting is a hybrid between action oriented and tab targeting.

Source: Lazy Peon Livestream Q&A

• The player will be able to dictate their own experience by selecting skills that are tab targeting or action oriented.

Source: Ashes of Creation Livestream Sept 3 2017


Did this change and now they have removed action combat?

As far as Throne and Liberty... I'm not a huge fan of these Korean games as the settings usually just end up in some mash of fantasy, historical and futuristic.  Just not my thing, but if they do go Tab Target I'll take a deeper look.

Mensur

What a useless post. 

Dattelis

coretex666 said:

A complaint that an MMO does not play like Unreal Tournament is pretty wild for me.

I came to this forum to discuss if its ok for a wolf to drop coins (its not)

Guess there are many types of MMO players. 

Someone has to complain about something. Its like an unwritten rule in humanity.

KnightFalz

coretex666 said:

A complaint that an MMO does not play like Unreal Tournament is pretty wild for me.

I came to this forum to discuss if its ok for a wolf to drop coins (its not)

Guess there are many types of MMO players. 

There are many types, including those that enjoy PlanetSide 2. There are even those that still enjoy tab-target, We are a diverse bunch.

Heh, at least a wolf could have coins in it's mouth. It's the ones that somehow store full suits of plate armour that must be in a world of hurt. It's no wonder they and other animals are so hostile in many MMORPGs.

Kyleran

Dattelis said:

coretex666 said:

A complaint that an MMO does not play like Unreal Tournament is pretty wild for me.

I came to this forum to discuss if its ok for a wolf to drop coins (its not)

Guess there are many types of MMO players. 

Someone has to complain about something. Its like an unwritten rule in humanity.

We all take our turns, right?

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Ralphie2449

The biggest active mmoRPG, FF14 is a tab target mmo, what makes you think everyone has some weird short of hater boner for tab targeting?

Tab targetting works great, non tab target design can also work great if it is done in a similar way to wildstar, but I wouldnt confuse "Literally FPS with a handful of abilities" as somekind of epitomy of "mmorpg", they fit "mmofps" category far better.

Interesting

Since my account is still logged on and I got the morbid desire to check on the Throne and Liberty hopers potential bone breaking...

A repply to Zorvan. Hi, Zorvan. I remember you from old, something might have happened to your account, but I am still unchanged from my original state. Ive long left these boards upon ataining the "light". I saw you disdained and scorned Hellgate as one of my set examples of gameplay. I must now bring you to remembrance that Hellgate London, from Bill Roper was the inheritor of the expected hope at the time, Diablo in 3D with guns. It fulfilled its meta purpose, to showcase a working prototype of the concept. Its historical value renders its place in my mentions. I am the one that justify its mention along Unreal Tournament, etc. 
I could have went new blood, like the current generation, and mentioned Borderlands, Destiny, The Division, all unchosen to inherit the title of spiritual successor to our angelical gamer generation expectations and high standards. They have chosen money and popularity, rather than the actual essence of what we, amongst ourselves dont need to express with words, neither to defend or explain.

If I was to criticize, no games would stand, so when I mention, I aknowledge, implicitly, the aspect of light that the game had, the aspect in it that is an example.

A generic repply to the common static prejudiced brain sealed unvisionaries that cannot conceive the perfect coupling of action gameplay with rpgs systems, mmorpg systems, and e-sports field designs to watch, etc: 
-its not time yet, but the 80+ years in me, will even provide everything with virtual reality in it, just a matter of time and the vision of which I speak ("The Game of games") will be refined, polished, funded, manifested, and played...

The Temple of Edfu some hundreds of years ago was the concept of a microship, silly when people get stuck in the past.

Scot

Interesting said:

Since my account is still logged on and I got the morbid desire to check on the Throne and Liberty hopers potential bone breaking...

A repply to Zorvan. Hi, Zorvan. I remember you from old, something might have happened to your account, but I am still unchanged from my original state. Ive long left these boards upon ataining the "light". I saw you disdained and scorned Hellgate as one of my set examples of gameplay. I must now bring you to remembrance that Hellgate London, from Bill Roper was the inheritor of the expected hope at the time, Diablo in 3D with guns. It fulfilled its meta purpose, to showcase a working prototype of the concept. Its historical value renders its place in my mentions. I am the one that justify its mention along Unreal Tournament, etc. 
I could have went new blood, like the current generation, and mentioned Borderlands, Destiny, The Division, all unchosen to inherit the title of spiritual successor to our angelical gamer generation expectations and high standards. They have chosen money and popularity, rather than the actual essence of what we, amongst ourselves dont need to express with words, neither to defend or explain.

If I was to criticize, no games would stand, so when I mention, I aknowledge, implicitly, the aspect of light that the game had, the aspect in it that is an example.

A generic repply to the common static prejudiced brain sealed unvisionaries that cannot conceive the perfect coupling of action gameplay with rpgs systems, mmorpg systems, and e-sports field designs to watch, etc: 
-its not time yet, but the 80+ years in me, will even provide everything with virtual reality in it, just a matter of time and the vision of which I speak ("The Game of games") will be refined, polished, funded, manifested, and played...

The Temple of Edfu some hundreds of years ago was the concept of a microship, silly when people get stuck in the past.

I think we are just having some problems working out what you are getting at here. I have long had a dream of a MMORPG with the perfect use of action combat but have yet to see it done properly. For me there are a lot of "nearly there's" like PS2 or AoC or "too zerg fest" like BDO. But from your examples you are thinking more of FPS-MMOs, which is a far easier fit for the action combat model.

Pesonnaly, I think tab works better the more melee a MMO has, games I have never played like Blade and Soul have been pointed out to me, but I just don't see them as proper MMORPG's.

One thing though I think your disappointment here is misplaced, action combat is now de rigueur, if they don't have it in T&L just move onto the next one that will. Meanwhile the tab combat (however much there really is) just means it stays on my radar.

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Quizzical

DarkZorvanReturns said:

Interesting said:

Since my account is still logged on and I got the morbid desire to check on the Throne and Liberty hopers potential bone breaking...

A repply to Zorvan. Hi, Zorvan. I remember you from old, something might have happened to your account, but I am still unchanged from my original state. Ive long left these boards upon ataining the "light". I saw you disdained and scorned Hellgate as one of my set examples of gameplay. I must now bring you to remembrance that Hellgate London, from Bill Roper was the inheritor of the expected hope at the time, Diablo in 3D with guns. It fulfilled its meta purpose, to showcase a working prototype of the concept. Its historical value renders its place in my mentions. I am the one that justify its mention along Unreal Tournament, etc. 
I could have went new blood, like the current generation, and mentioned Borderlands, Destiny, The Division, all unchosen to inherit the title of spiritual successor to our angelical gamer generation expectations and high standards. They have chosen money and popularity, rather than the actual essence of what we, amongst ourselves dont need to express with words, neither to defend or explain.

If I was to criticize, no games would stand, so when I mention, I aknowledge, implicitly, the aspect of light that the game had, the aspect in it that is an example.

A generic repply to the common static prejudiced brain sealed unvisionaries that cannot conceive the perfect coupling of action gameplay with rpgs systems, mmorpg systems, and e-sports field designs to watch, etc: 
-its not time yet, but the 80+ years in me, will even provide everything with virtual reality in it, just a matter of time and the vision of which I speak ("The Game of games") will be refined, polished, funded, manifested, and played...

The Temple of Edfu some hundreds of years ago was the concept of a microship, silly when people get stuck in the past.

Did you just randomly spit a thesaurus at me?

He didn't, but I will.  Have a thesaurus, reference book, glossary, lexicon, onomasticon, terminology, vocabulary, language reference book, sourcebook, storehouse of words, treasury of words, or word list.

https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/thesaurus

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Interesting

The wise decision ( 200 IQ play ) now for them is to announce they will be changing the engine, reprograming everything from scratch. Why? To get the action gameplay combat up to 2024-2034 standards, or even new korean gamers will drown from the western criticism. Announcing they will remove the pay 2 win (battle passes, collections, etc) aspects in its integrality, and delay the thing until like april 2024. Bow down the neck / head or be broken to pieces ncsoft. They pay programmers / enginneers salaries for that. They are rich and have hundreds of employees, etc. So no mercy. Only Skull and Bones from Ubisoft got a worse pre-release reputation / criticism than Throne and Liberty from NcSoft.

Interesting

freebie for clicking on this thread: Dune Awakening, thats all

Quizzical

Interesting said:

The wise decision ( 200 IQ play ) now for them is to announce they will be changing the engine, reprograming everything from scratch. Why? To get the action gameplay combat up to 2024-2034 standards, or even new korean gamers will drown from the western criticism. Announcing they will remove the pay 2 win (battle passes, collections, etc) aspects in its integrality, and delay the thing until like april 2024. Bow down the neck / head or be broken to pieces ncsoft. They pay programmers / enginneers salaries for that. They are rich and have hundreds of employees, etc. So no mercy. Only Skull and Bones from Ubisoft got a worse pre-release reputation / criticism than Throne and Liberty from NcSoft.

Have you considered that different players have different preferences?  If most games catered to your personal preferences, then that would be a massively oversaturated niche, and there would be a lot of money to be made by ignoring your preferences and doing something else instead.

Also, please don't bump threads that deservedly died seven months ago.  If you have something new to say, you can make a new thread.

Tiller

In a round about way op clowned on Zorvan getting his original account banned and how he still has his original account.  Not sure it maters around here much these days, but hilarious take I guess.

MMOExposed

well this went left

Nanfoodle

Iselin said:

Define what you mean by "tab target gameplay."

I could give less of a shit if you also optionally can pick out an individual from a crowd by using the tab key. Actually, I lie. I do like that use of the tab key even In otherwise action combat games.

All I really care about for a game to be in my action combat wheelhouse preference is whether or not I can also aim just by my facing, whether or not I can actively avoid damage with blocks, dodges, etc. and whether or not the combat is fast-paced and not subject to long cooldowns for skills.

Close inspections of videos shows always a straight line between the play char and the NPC target, even when another NPC is in the way or when the play char is not square to the NPC. Looks like standard EQ1 Tab Targeting. IMO thats not a bad thing but as of yet we have had no info if their is cone skills and AoE that dont require a target lock. With Auto play being a big part of this game, I am not sure if that type of skill would works. 

Grymmoire

And here I thought Necros were mostly in the ESO domain.

Ralphie2449

After watching some videos it doesnt look bad, gonna be very curious how builds are going to work and how many types of spell we have, we need movement, weaken, aoe, gap closers etc for it to be interesting since what we ve seen is very limited rn.

Standing still to attack aint a dealbreaker for me, not everyone has adhd and needs to non stop move like a headless chicken, one of the most fan aspect of casters in any game is when you get a few seconds to safely cast with great spell effects.

Sovrath

Not sure what the issue is. Souls games are tab targeting and still "action oriented."

I personally love souls combat.

Nanfoodle

Sovrath said:

Not sure what the issue is. Souls games are tab targeting and still "action oriented."

I personally love souls combat.

I personally love tab targeting, Im a little tried of action combat myself. My hope is the auto combat is not something that happens in the West copy of the game. That will be a deal breaker for me. I just have no desire to try and compete with players that auto play 24/7 to advance their chars. I just dont want me hand forced to use the same tactic and then wonder how to play my char at cap.