Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
Why is it that whenever the subject of predatory monetization in games that target children are brought up some of you always want to talk about parenting?
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
If someone gives their credit card to a casino it doesn't matter how bad their parenting is the casino isn't going to let four year old's run around in it gambling. Let alone have the casino specifically target these unsuspecting kids with predatory monetization.
Yet that's exactly what these gaming companies are doing they make it easy enough for a four year old to gamble online.
Four year old children can't make any purchase without the indulgence or lacking supervision of their parents.
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
Why is it that whenever the subject of predatory monetization in games that target children are brought up some of you always want to talk about parenting?
It is relevant.
It may be relevant to the eventual outcome but it's totally irrelevant to the discussion of the predatory marketing practice.
It comes across as a disingenuous attempt to give the predator a pass likely for some political reason related to endorsing laissez-faire capitalism.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
If someone gives their credit card to a casino it doesn't matter how bad their parenting is the casino isn't going to let four year old's run around in it gambling. Let alone have the casino specifically target these unsuspecting kids with predatory monetization.
Yet that's exactly what these gaming companies are doing they make it easy enough for a four year old to gamble online.
Four year old children can't make any purchase without the indulgence or lacking supervision of their parents.
Right and if I wanted to open a casino where parents could give me their credit card and let their four years old's come in and gamble how do you think that would go down?
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
Runescape also upped their subscription prices not too long ago. I'd expect the major games to go up to $19.99/mo in the next year or two. New customers aren't being attracted, best way to get more money is to squeeze the ones you already have.
Many of the people subscribed are there regardless of a price hike, look at Netflix that costs something like 5x now than when it originally launched. Also tends to have significantly worse programming overall now that many networks pulled out and their original content is 99% crap that gets canceled in a season.
This is what I think may have been the deciding factor, back in the day the old school MMOs must have thought new players were as important as current ones so they dropped the sub only model. But if you are reasonably sure you will only get a trickle of new players, scaring them of is not an issue, especially if you have a loyal player base who will stick with you.
Both RuneSape and Old School RuneScape are separately among the most
populated MMORPGs at this time. They have no difficulty attracting
players.
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
"The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company."
Exactly. This is the point I was trying to make with my last couple posts only summed up much better.
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
They would have called it gambling and brought it under the gambling rules but the damn gaming industry has been paying and greasing pockets to make sure it won't be. All the mock hearings and supposed committees are all just for show.
Until that happens there will never be accountability for this slimy shit.
They would have called it gambling and brought it under the gambling rules but the damn gaming industry has been paying and greasing pockets to make sure it won't be. All the mock hearings and supposed committees are all just for show.
Until that happens there will never be accountability for this slimy shit.
I think until politicians saw this sort of thing on their mobiles or their children gambling in games they had no idea of what was going on. There was a clear divide between casino games which were regulated and other video games which did not need any regulation. Since that realisation the lobbying has been intense to slow the changes to the law down, meanwhile every studio using the like of loot boxes is looking at what they can replace them with if they have to drop them.
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
I also think that I'm not wrong about the disgusting predatory tactics, unregulated gambling with loot boxes, taking advantage of people, and every other dirty underhanded trick these greedy companies are using to make money.
So you opine and many feel accordingly.
I disagree in that I think that interpretation improperly embellishes the role of the provider in such things while diminishing that of the consumer.
Such makes it far too easy for consumers to be seen as victims rather than the accomplices they are in this.
This isn't an opinion or feeling. The predatory monetization in video games is a fact.
Are you really going to call kids as young as four years old accomplices rather than victims?
No, clearly from the posted link the parents were the accomplices.
I did agree that game companies should have to send notifications of excessive spending which the buyer can set the limit for, much as my bank cards do.
Right which means these companies targeted kids who were victims.
They were targeting customers, they had no idea the age of the purchaser near as I could tell.
I don't view players who spend money on games, even large amounts as victims, but YMMV.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I also think that I'm not wrong about the disgusting predatory tactics, unregulated gambling with loot boxes, taking advantage of people, and every other dirty underhanded trick these greedy companies are using to make money.
So you opine and many feel accordingly.
I disagree in that I think that interpretation improperly embellishes the role of the provider in such things while diminishing that of the consumer.
Such makes it far too easy for consumers to be seen as victims rather than the accomplices they are in this.
This isn't an opinion or feeling. The predatory monetization in video games is a fact.
Are you really going to call kids as young as four years old accomplices rather than victims?
No, clearly from the posted link the parents were the accomplices.
I did agree that game companies should have to send notifications of excessive spending which the buyer can set the limit for, much as my bank cards do.
Right which means these companies targeted kids who were victims.
They were targeting customers, they had no idea the age of the purchaser near as I could tell.
I don't view players who spend money on games, even large amounts as victims, but YMMV.
How about Bernie Madoff's investors? Also not victims?
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
If someone gives their credit card to a casino it doesn't matter how bad their parenting is the casino isn't going to let four year old's run around in it gambling. Let alone have the casino specifically target these unsuspecting kids with predatory monetization.
Yet that's exactly what these gaming companies are doing they make it easy enough for a four year old to gamble online.
There's the rub, a casino can pretty easily tell if a minor is roaming about the casino, and when they see one they normally address the parents who aren't in compliance with the law.
To date there are no good ways to verify the identity or age of a customer online and there are no laws here in the States which require companies to do so.
There also are no laws which prevent companies from marketing to children, predatory or otherwise so again, up to the parents to own the responsibility of protecting them from harm which is entirely within their control.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
"The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company."
Exactly. This is the point I was trying to make with my last couple posts only summed up much better.
Is what the company doing legal? If so, no harm no foul until laws are put in place then drop the hammer on them say I.
There are many activities children are legally permitted to do that I personally do not let my grandchildren do.
Like letting children drive by themselves at 16, that's just plain crazy talk....even my parents managed to delay me until I was nearly 17.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
Nope.
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
Nope.
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
Please provide the scientific proof that companies are directly targeting children (rather than gamers in general) in a predatory manner..and not just one or two odd outliers...or old articles from years ago.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Well , the entire discussion to this point was about CC purchases , now the goalposts move to cash and gamecards ( which are purchased with cash) unless of course we have a stupid parent giving a CC to there teenagerto run around with. And the phone does not matter here , because again the parent needs to buy and set up the phone and permissions on it.
But cash purchase is different if the teenager spends his own lawn cutting money on a gamecard to get lootboxes and that is different spending money earned is one thing and a lesson in of itself , or unless you want to say the kid is stealing cash to buy gamecards .. But in the end all these scenarios and how kid gets into them..
Comes down to parenting. And how the kid was raised and taught ..
That is because the law is a laggard. What these companies are doing should be legislated and controlled but we are not there yet.
" Well, the way I see it, there's what's legal and there's what's right."
--Perry Mason
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
Nope.
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
Please provide the scientific proof that companies are directly targeting children (rather than gamers in general) in a predatory manner..and not just one or two odd outliers...or old articles from years ago.
Video game loot boxes linked to problem gambling, study shows
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
Nope.
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
Please provide the scientific proof that companies are directly targeting children (rather than gamers in general) in a predatory manner..and not just one or two odd outliers...or old articles from years ago.
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
I'm not making excuses for the company. I'm also not making excuses for inadequate parenting which is part of the problem when children are involved, no matter how much some want to downplay or ignore that element of it. The parental element is never irrelevant in anything involving their children below the age of majority.
Monetization has and is being addressed to varying degree by differing government bodies, generally and in terms of the effectiveness of parental control. To date this has led mostly to action outside North America, but any trend in that direction has a chance of becoming more widespread which time will tell.
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
Nope.
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
Please provide the scientific proof that companies are directly targeting children (rather than gamers in general) in a predatory manner..and not just one or two odd outliers...or old articles from years ago.
Heck do you even need a study or all the links I posted could have just picked any game box image with loot boxes and an "E" for everyone rating on it.
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Drug use in kids under 18 is a parenting issue. So we should just ignore the dealers and focus on the parents. That’s the equivalent argument some are making.
In reality, whether a parent is doing a poor job is quite a separate issue from whether these companies are intentionally targeting and exploiting kids. Both can be true but that doesn’t mean we ignore the company’s role.
I am not making the false equivalence you contend.
In reality poor parental control is what allows children to have access to and spend large amounts of money on anything, and can contribute to their delinquency otherwise.
In reality poor parenting is what allows children to have access to environments where drug use is rampant and can contribute to their delinquency.
Again- Meaningless.
That doesn't mean that you do not address drug dealers/company
Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
I don’t think you are following the conversation. Either purposefully or honestly.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
Well the difference is , the parent has full control of the use/exposure and access to The PC and CC and inputting the info approving open use. .
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
Nope.
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
Please provide the scientific proof that companies are directly targeting children (rather than gamers in general) in a predatory manner..and not just one or two odd outliers...or old articles from years ago.
Have you watched advertising directed toward children? I don't think scientific proof is needed for that blatantly and frequently demonstrated. Determining the effectiveness of it would require so, but that it exists does not.
Comments
It is relevant.
Four year old children can't make any purchase without the indulgence or lacking supervision of their parents.
It comes across as a disingenuous attempt to give the predator a pass likely for some political reason related to endorsing laissez-faire capitalism.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Adequate parenting or lack thereof are never meaningless.
Illegal drugs and their sale are targeted at multiple levels. The illegal sale of legal drugs is also so targeted. Neither have any relevance to in game purchases.
Both RuneSape and Old School RuneScape are separately among the most populated MMORPGs at this time. They have no difficulty attracting players.
The parent argument is meaningless in that it doesn’t excuse the company. And as for the drugs yes that is my point. They are addressed on multiple levels. We don’t just say “parents “ and excuse the source.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
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Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Exactly. This is the point I was trying to make with my last couple posts only summed up much better.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Until that happens there will never be accountability for this slimy shit.
For the drug comparison to be compatable , you would assume the parent is putting a dealer in the kids room and saying don't use drugs there bad and walking away.
I don't view players who spend money on games, even large amounts as victims, but YMMV.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
To date there are no good ways to verify the identity or age of a customer online and there are no laws here in the States which require companies to do so.
There also are no laws which prevent companies from marketing to children, predatory or otherwise so again, up to the parents to own the responsibility of protecting them from harm which is entirely within their control.
Is what the company doing legal? If so, no harm no foul until laws are put in place then drop the hammer on them say I.
There are many activities children are legally permitted to do that I personally do not let my grandchildren do.
Like letting children drive by themselves at 16, that's just plain crazy talk....even my parents managed to delay me until I was nearly 17.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
There are countless ways around that. Maybe on their phones. Maybe at their friends house. And you don't always need a credit card. You can use the ever popular gamecards which can be bought for cash.
Then there is the FACT that teenagers can actually, you know, have jobs. And earn money.
The length that some of you will go to excuse companies is kind of crazy. Nobody I know is saying that parents have no responsibility for their kids but the ultimate root cause is the companies who are targeting those kids.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
But cash purchase is different if the teenager spends his own lawn cutting money on a gamecard to get lootboxes and that is different spending money earned is one thing and a lesson in of itself , or unless you want to say the kid is stealing cash to buy gamecards .. But in the end all these scenarios and how kid gets into them..
Comes down to parenting. And how the kid was raised and taught ..
--Perry Mason
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Video game loot boxes linked to problem gambling, study shows
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/apr/02/video-game-loot-boxes-problem-gambling-betting-childrenLoot boxes linked to problem gambling in new research
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56614281Are in-game ‘loot boxes’ a gambling gateway for children?
https://www.deseret.com/entertainment/2022/12/6/23467178/are-in-game-loot-boxes-a-gambling-gateway-for-childrenAdolescents and loot boxes: links with problem gambling and motivations for purchase
https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsos.190049Loot boxes use, video gaming, and gambling in adolescents: Results from a path analysis before and during COVID-19-pandemic-related lockdown in Italy
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2022.1009129/fullStudy: Video game 'loot boxes' linked to gambling addiction in young people
https://www.wtsp.com/article/tech/study-video-game-loot-boxes-linked-to-gambling-addiction-in-young-people/67-97ae4e3d-bcac-43d6-af01-6adbb5a247e4ASA tech trial exposes how gambling brands are targeting kids
https://www.thedrum.com/news/2019/04/04/asa-tech-trial-exposes-how-gambling-brands-are-targeting-kidsVideo game loot boxes are linked to problem gambling: Results of a large-scale survey
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0206767The impact of gambling marketing and advertising on children, young people and vulnerable adults
https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/publication/documents/2020-03/gambling-marketing-advertising-effect-young-people-final-report.pdf
“Don't Gamble With Children's Rights”—How Behavioral Design Impacts the Right of Children to a Playful and Healthy Game Environment
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9108192/Impact of Gambling Advertisements and Marketing on Children and Adolescents: Policy Recommendations to Minimise Harm
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/46302105_Impact_of_Gambling_Advertisements_and_Marketing_on_Children_and_Adolescents_Policy_Recommendations_to_Minimise_HarmKids as Young as 11 Are Becoming Addicted to Online Gambling
https://www.parents.com/kids/safety/kids-as-young-as-11-are-becoming-addicted-to-online-gambling/Youth harmed by addictive mechanics in video games
https://thecampanile.org/2019/09/15/youth-harmed-by-addictive-mechanics-in-video-games/3 Ways Video Game Companies Are Getting Your Kids Hooked
https://time.com/124498/handheld-video-games-kids-hooked/Recent UK action to protect children from online gambling and gaming-related privacy issues
https://www.taylorwessing.com/en/insights-and-events/insights/2023/02/gambling-and-gaming-advertising-and-measures-to-tackle-children-gamblingOnline gaming and gambling in children and adolescents – Normalising gambling in cyber places
https://responsiblegambling.vic.gov.au/documents/479/Online-gaming-and-gambling-in-children-and-adolescents_.pdf
LAWMAKERS WANT TO REGULATE VIDEO GAMES TARGETED AT CHILDREN
https://futurism.com/the-byte/law-ban-loot-boxes-video-gamesHow a 16-year-old gamer turned into a compulsive gambler
https://www.espn.com/espn/feature/story/_/id/18510975/how-counter-strike-turned-teenager-compulsive-gambler
Apps for preschoolers are flooded with manipulative ads, according to a new study
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/10/30/18044678/kids-apps-gaming-manipulative-ads-ftcSurprise! Kids’ apps are full of manipulative, unregulated advertising
https://www.popsci.com/ads-kids-apps-games/I mean come on really?
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I'm not making excuses for the company. I'm also not making excuses for inadequate parenting which is part of the problem when children are involved, no matter how much some want to downplay or ignore that element of it. The parental element is never irrelevant in anything involving their children below the age of majority.
Monetization has and is being addressed to varying degree by differing government bodies, generally and in terms of the effectiveness of parental control. To date this has led mostly to action outside North America, but any trend in that direction has a chance of becoming more widespread which time will tell.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Is that quote from the original black and white TV series?
It sounds like something that would be so.