Windmills genuinely do generate power. The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.
Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.
Err, aren't they the folks whose power grid is often offline due to weather related issues?
Offline in winter because they never weatherproofed it for freezing conditions.
But it is the state with the largest amount of renewable energy for generation last I checked.
But better battery technology would make renewables way more possible. Right now when home battery storage is way too expensive. We've looked into it several times. Prices aren't going down.
Windmills genuinely do generate power. The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.
Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.
Err, aren't they the folks whose power grid is often offline due to weather related issues?
Offline in winter because they never weatherproofed it for freezing conditions.
But it is the state with the largest amount of renewable energy for generation last I checked.
But better battery technology would make renewables way more possible. Right now when home battery storage is way too expensive. We've looked into it several times. Prices aren't going down.
As I've been reading the lithium battery industry has its own set of social and environmental challenges as well.
Really need to come up with a more novel battery technology as I think as the current isn't sustainable
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Windmills genuinely do generate power. The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.
Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.
Err, aren't they the folks whose power grid is often offline due to weather related issues?
Texas is unique, they are on their own power grid, and it has been privatized, so it's not like a regular utility. They don't plan well for blizzards
Texas does lead in wind power though. Lots of wind out there on the caprock.
Windmills genuinely do generate power. The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.
Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.
Err, aren't they the folks whose power grid is often offline due to weather related issues?
Texas is unique, they are on their own power grid, and it has been privatized, so it's not like a regular utility. They don't plan well for blizzards
Texas does lead in wind power though. Lots of wind out there on the caprock.
If you think the reliability of the power grid is a problem when only a small fraction of the power comes from intermittent sources, then just wait until you see what happens if all of it comes from intermittent sources. That's the world that Loftia is advocating.
Windmills genuinely do generate power. The ones that exist in real-life are something closer to disposable toys for politicians so that they can feel good about chasing the latest trendy thing than a serious way to back the power grid.
Wind does generate real energy. Texas, known for being an oil state, gets 25% of its power from wind.
Err, aren't they the folks whose power grid is often offline due to weather related issues?
Offline in winter because they never weatherproofed it for freezing conditions.
But it is the state with the largest amount of renewable energy for generation last I checked.
But better battery technology would make renewables way more possible. Right now when home battery storage is way too expensive. We've looked into it several times. Prices aren't going down.
As I've been reading the lithium battery industry has its own set of social and environmental challenges as well.
Really need to come up with a more novel battery technology as I think as the current isn't sustainable
The problem is that it just isn't that easy to say, we'd like to have better batteries, so here they are. Well, except when designing a video game that allows you to ignore the laws of physics and generate energy via flying windmills. We'd like to have flying cars that consume only trivial amounts of fuel, but sometimes physics gets in the way of having what we'd like.
Both lithium ion and lead-acid batteries would be tremendously expensive if you want to store a few days worth of power. They also wear out quickly, so even if you did build enough batteries to smooth out the problems from intermittent power sources, you'll have to do it all over again in a few years. Nearly all of the lead from lead-acid batteries is already recycled.
Very few lithium ion batteries are recycled, however. It is possible to recycle them, as batteries store energy via chemical processes that don't change the atoms involved. Recycling the batteries would avoid having to go dig up new lithium, cobalt, and so forth every time you want to replace them. But that doesn't mean that it's cheap or easy to do.
I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.
All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.
I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
No?
"Qloud believes that Loftia is more than just a game but that it's also a platform where players can learn and advocate for a more sustainable future.
The developers believe that games have the power to make a positive change in our environment and our world, and this belief is reflected in the game's design and themes"
One side of the political spectrum favors this sort of approach while the other is in violent opposition.
Attempts have been made recently to ban natural gas appliances, wood burning stoves etc with an army of supporters lining up to strike down the other side.
As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."
When advocating something that is politically controversial is much of the point of your game, that very much is pushing a political ideology. The developers of Loftia own that, and it's good that they do. But I think it's ridiculous to deny what even the game's developers have directly stated.
Good 'ole alt-right doublespeak. Calling the cozy games happy thoughts the developers have said about environmental sustainability in their goofy little game "pushing a political agenda" is the only political agenda pushing I see.
You're the one pushing one by characterizing it that way, not them.
Aren't clean energy and environmental sustainability politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts, realistic or not though the fantasy game solutions might be?
But no that's some serious attempt to brainwash our young pushing a political agenda.
It's much easier to spot a bias that you disagree with than a bias that you agree with. So let's flip the situation around and suppose that they were advocating the opposite.
Suppose that the game's developers made advocating for reliable power sources into a focus of the game and openly admitted as much. You could drill for oil or gas, mine coal, or build nuclear power plants, but definitely no windmills or solar panels, as those aren't reliable enough. The problems with the favored energy sources could be waved off simply by not implementing them in the game, while the problems with disfavored energy sources would be emphasized as reasons why they weren't available.
Would you recognize the obvious political agenda behind such a game? Or would you say that reliable energy is just "politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts"? I mean really, who could ever be against reliable energy for its own sake?
I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.
All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.
I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
No?
"Qloud believes that Loftia is more than just a game but that it's also a platform where players can learn and advocate for a more sustainable future.
The developers believe that games have the power to make a positive change in our environment and our world, and this belief is reflected in the game's design and themes"
One side of the political spectrum favors this sort of approach while the other is in violent opposition.
Attempts have been made recently to ban natural gas appliances, wood burning stoves etc with an army of supporters lining up to strike down the other side.
As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."
When advocating something that is politically controversial is much of the point of your game, that very much is pushing a political ideology. The developers of Loftia own that, and it's good that they do. But I think it's ridiculous to deny what even the game's developers have directly stated.
Good 'ole alt-right doublespeak. Calling the cozy games happy thoughts the developers have said about environmental sustainability in their goofy little game "pushing a political agenda" is the only political agenda pushing I see.
You're the one pushing one by characterizing it that way, not them.
Aren't clean energy and environmental sustainability politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts, realistic or not though the fantasy game solutions might be?
But no that's some serious attempt to brainwash our young pushing a political agenda.
It's much easier to spot a bias that you disagree with than a bias that you agree with. So let's flip the situation around and suppose that they were advocating the opposite.
Suppose that the game's developers made advocating for reliable power sources into a focus of the game and openly admitted as much. You could drill for oil or gas, mine coal, or build nuclear power plants, but definitely no windmills or solar panels, as those aren't reliable enough. The problems with the favored energy sources could be waved off simply by not implementing them in the game, while the problems with disfavored energy sources would be emphasized as reasons why they weren't available.
Would you recognize the obvious political agenda behind such a game? Or would you say that reliable energy is just "politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts"? I mean really, who could ever be against reliable energy for its own sake?
Either way, it would still be just a goofy little game, and saying that they're "pushing a political agenda" would be just as silly if it were all about oil and gas and coal.
They're not "pushing" a damn thing.
And BTW, I'm not even a very green person myself. I drive a gas-powered truck, heat my place with natural gas, use air conditioning in the summer, etc.
My original post in this thread was about the silliness of saying that these devs are "pushing a political agenda' just because they're doing a cozy game with a scifi alternative energy focus and say some platitudes in their site about wanting to advocate for that kind of future.
I'm not even politically aligned with the local Greens since I view them as an annoying, one-issue bunch that tends to siphon votes from our local labour party, the NDP, which is the party I support.
So wrong again for thinking my posts are because my politics align with environmentalism lol.
It's purely about you politicizing this silliness by describing them as "pushing a political agenda."
Post edited by Iselin on
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Folks, you do find politics where it does not exist. Calm down, we are ok with lightsabers (cannot exist), we are ok with pants that gives +58 to strenght or earring that adds +851 to vitality. We are ok to run unlimited miles with minigun in hand (normally no person can carry) that never jams or just fails to work. And now windmils/solar panels are politics? really? I do not care that in real world this energy is expensive etc. It's cozy game that has solar panels. So, stop looking for politics where there is no politics.
@Lithuanian - I can see your point of view, but I wouldn’t be entirely dismissive.
::: starts shaking uncontrollably :::
POLITICS!
Shoo, thought I was going to burst open.
I think the debate is not just about politics for politics sake, it’s about the wording of their intentions for the product directly from their website. Their intention is to do more than provide a hug-and-love nature game; they intend/hope to influence players.
Games that are used to influence us to change our ideology and tone towards real-world concepts are…what? Still just games? I’m not sure I’ll grant them the innocence in concept just because there appears to be some in the delivery.
I don’t necessarily think the issue is just political in nature, either, but it’s another hand in the sustainable arena we’re all attempting to enter; that’s certainly some sort of agenda - even if it’s masked by a cutesy game with flying windmills. What people are afraid of is that even if we dress a snake up as a harmless house-cat, it’s still a snake…it’s just dressed funny (the game may or not be a “snake”, it’s an example).
I’ll agree that all games walk an influential line here and there, but not all advertise their intent to do so, openly. When they do, they open themselves up to a different angle of criticism (which many of us absolutely love). Why not discuss it?
Most importantly: don’t you DARE say that Lightsabers can’t be real. Don’t take that away from anyone - damn the science.
I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.
All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.
I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
I hardly see how this cozy fantasy game is "pushing a political ideology" except in the minds of old farts who have a kneejerk compulsion to think of everything as pushing a political agenda.
All I see is yet another cozy game where everyone loves everyone and has big Teletubby hugs for all.
I'm not a cozy games fan but "pushing a political agenda?"... pathetic spin.
No?
"Qloud believes that Loftia is more than just a game but that it's also a platform where players can learn and advocate for a more sustainable future.
The developers believe that games have the power to make a positive change in our environment and our world, and this belief is reflected in the game's design and themes"
One side of the political spectrum favors this sort of approach while the other is in violent opposition.
Attempts have been made recently to ban natural gas appliances, wood burning stoves etc with an army of supporters lining up to strike down the other side.
As first said in 1969, "The personal is political."
When advocating something that is politically controversial is much of the point of your game, that very much is pushing a political ideology. The developers of Loftia own that, and it's good that they do. But I think it's ridiculous to deny what even the game's developers have directly stated.
Good 'ole alt-right doublespeak. Calling the cozy games happy thoughts the developers have said about environmental sustainability in their goofy little game "pushing a political agenda" is the only political agenda pushing I see.
You're the one pushing one by characterizing it that way, not them.
Aren't clean energy and environmental sustainability politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts, realistic or not though the fantasy game solutions might be?
But no that's some serious attempt to brainwash our young pushing a political agenda.
So what if a game was promoting pro-life over abortion? Would you consider that not to be a political agenda as well? Pro-life is all happy thoughts as well.
Comments
But it is the state with the largest amount of renewable energy for generation last I checked.
But better battery technology would make renewables way more possible. Right now when home battery storage is way too expensive. We've looked into it several times. Prices aren't going down.
Really need to come up with a more novel battery technology as I think as the current isn't sustainable
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
------------
2024: 47 years on the Net.
Both lithium ion and lead-acid batteries would be tremendously expensive if you want to store a few days worth of power. They also wear out quickly, so even if you did build enough batteries to smooth out the problems from intermittent power sources, you'll have to do it all over again in a few years. Nearly all of the lead from lead-acid batteries is already recycled.
Very few lithium ion batteries are recycled, however. It is possible to recycle them, as batteries store energy via chemical processes that don't change the atoms involved. Recycling the batteries would avoid having to go dig up new lithium, cobalt, and so forth every time you want to replace them. But that doesn't mean that it's cheap or easy to do.
Suppose that the game's developers made advocating for reliable power sources into a focus of the game and openly admitted as much. You could drill for oil or gas, mine coal, or build nuclear power plants, but definitely no windmills or solar panels, as those aren't reliable enough. The problems with the favored energy sources could be waved off simply by not implementing them in the game, while the problems with disfavored energy sources would be emphasized as reasons why they weren't available.
Would you recognize the obvious political agenda behind such a game? Or would you say that reliable energy is just "politically agnostic, optimistic happy thoughts"? I mean really, who could ever be against reliable energy for its own sake?
They're not "pushing" a damn thing.
And BTW, I'm not even a very green person myself. I drive a gas-powered truck, heat my place with natural gas, use air conditioning in the summer, etc.
My original post in this thread was about the silliness of saying that these devs are "pushing a political agenda' just because they're doing a cozy game with a scifi alternative energy focus and say some platitudes in their site about wanting to advocate for that kind of future.
I'm not even politically aligned with the local Greens since I view them as an annoying, one-issue bunch that tends to siphon votes from our local labour party, the NDP, which is the party I support.
So wrong again for thinking my posts are because my politics align with environmentalism lol.
It's purely about you politicizing this silliness by describing them as "pushing a political agenda."
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Also, Palia just seems like the title most folk actually wants to play in that genre of cozy life sim mmo-lite games.
Fishing on Gilgamesh since 2013
Fishing on Bronzebeard since 2005
Fishing in RL since 1992
Born with a fishing rod in my hand in 1979
Calm down, we are ok with lightsabers (cannot exist), we are ok with pants that gives +58 to strenght or earring that adds +851 to vitality. We are ok to run unlimited miles with minigun in hand (normally no person can carry) that never jams or just fails to work.
And now windmils/solar panels are politics? really?
I do not care that in real world this energy is expensive etc. It's cozy game that has solar panels.
So, stop looking for politics where there is no politics.
http://www.mmoblogg.wordpress.com
I think the debate is not just about politics for politics sake, it’s about the wording of their intentions for the product directly from their website. Their intention is to do more than provide a hug-and-love nature game; they intend/hope to influence players.
Games that are used to influence us to change our ideology and tone towards real-world concepts are…what? Still just games? I’m not sure I’ll grant them the innocence in concept just because there appears to be some in the delivery.
I don’t necessarily think the issue is just political in nature, either, but it’s another hand in the sustainable arena we’re all attempting to enter; that’s certainly some sort of agenda - even if it’s masked by a cutesy game with flying windmills. What people are afraid of is that even if we dress a snake up as a harmless house-cat, it’s still a snake…it’s just dressed funny (the game may or not be a “snake”, it’s an example).
I’ll agree that all games walk an influential line here and there, but not all advertise their intent to do so, openly. When they do, they open themselves up to a different angle of criticism (which many of us absolutely love). Why not discuss it?
Most importantly: don’t you DARE say that Lightsabers can’t be real. Don’t take that away from anyone - damn the science.
If it looks like duck and walks like a duck....
So what if a game was promoting pro-life over abortion? Would you consider that not to be a political agenda as well? Pro-life is all happy thoughts as well.