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DDO vets make Exodus to Vanguard
zipit
Member Posts: 487
If you check this thread out over at the DDO forum notice how many of the posters including the OP are founders a.k.a. vets. I know many of us here in this forum are waiting for Vanguard to come out and some ( myself included) even venture to say that it will be the new home ( hope? ) of SWG Refugees.
It seems Vanguard will be cashing in on this recent wave of " lets make crappy games based on well known IPs and see what happens" that has plagued us for some time.
Comments
"There's no star system Slave I can't reach, and there's no planet I can't find. There's nowhere in the Galaxy for you to run. Might as well give up now."
Boba Fett
Not so, if you read the FAQ on silkyvenom.com on crafting for instance, you'll see that alot of effort has been put into it, very far from being just another MMO where crafting is put in as an afterthought. I dare you to find a MMO where you can build a ship! for example
I've read some of your other posts and you don't reinforce your arguments with examples so the question is.... are you just trolling for fun here?
I don't get the hype for Vanguard. It looks like a pretty standard fantasy MMO with a few improvements and a few steps backwards.
Class level system again.
Crafting with more thought into it but it is a loot based game which instantly reduces crafters usefullness and you can be a max level combat and a max level crafter (except you have to go switch between them forgeting your other skills while you in combat or crafter mode!) which again means crafting is just an add on to the combat style, not an equaly valid playstyle.
Completely team focued content. Great, now I'm getting flashbacks of the times in EQ where after 2 hours I could still be looking for a team.
I'm sure it will do well enough but its the same old standard fantasy mmo all over again except not casual player friendly.
Well vanguard has a cult following but i think they realise thats not enough.
They want to hit it big and need to produce a good mmorpg for that.Why?they got no brand name to fall back to as warcraft,D&D,star wars etc.
But until game goes live hard to comment.
I remember seeing a quote from the lead designer on Vanguard that basicaly said they would be happy being a niche game instead of making changes they don't like to try and appeal to more players .... which is an attitude I like but unfortunitly I don't have much in common with him on what I like in a MMO.
The no brand name is an advantage as well though, just have to look at SWG to see that.
I don't get the hype for Vanguard. It looks like a pretty standard fantasy MMO with a few improvements and a few steps backwards.
Class level system again.
Crafting with more thought into it but it is a loot based game which instantly reduces crafters usefullness and you can be a max level combat and a max level crafter (except you have to go switch between them forgeting your other skills while you in combat or crafter mode!) which again means crafting is just an add on to the combat style, not an equaly valid playstyle.
Completely team focued content. Great, now I'm getting flashbacks of the times in EQ where after 2 hours I could still be looking for a team.
I'm sure it will do well enough but its the same old standard fantasy mmo all over again except not casual player friendly.
a big QFE.
For the Horde!
Let me preface this by saying: "Why the heck are you posting this in an SWG forum? This forum has nothing to do with either DDO or Vanguard"
While I agree that Vanguard is a bit overblown by the fan base you are WAY off base. The dev team making vanguard is very experienced and has a solid rep. Matter of fact the vast majority of them are the devs who created the original EQ which was so successful back in the 90's and early 2000's and is STILL one of the top MMO's today... 7 years later.
No, I think Vanguard will be a solid release. What I think is accurate, however, is all these people that are soooooooo hyped about it and expecting the world from it will be dissilusioned because they've hyped it to the point where they're expecting more from it than is actually the case.
It's going to be a very solid MMORPG but it's not going to be a sandbox... it's not going to be skills based and it's NOT going to have PvP. So all those folks who are saying "Vanguard will be king because blah blah blah" need to remember that while it will be a very good MMORPG they need to not add to what is listed as the planned features and they need to remember that Vanguard is going to be a pretty 'hard core' MMORPG with stiff death penalties and the time sinks that made EQ1 famous.
If you don't like a slow paced game I suspect Vanguard will wind up turning you off. It's NOT going to be 'get from point A to point B lightning fast. It's going to involve long travel times. It's going to involve stiff death penalties and it's going to involve gated areas of the game as well. Not to mention a crafting system that will NOT be independant of your level because many of the components can only be obtained in very dangerous areas, some only in raid content areas. All of those statements are straight off the Vanguard FAQ's and other information available.
So if you're hoping for Vanguard to be a sandbox you *will* be dissapointed. It'll be a good game in the vein of EQ1... but it won't be a sandbox like SWG or EVE are.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
I don't get the hype for Vanguard. It looks like a pretty standard fantasy MMO with a few improvements and a few steps backwards.
Class level system again.
Crafting with more thought into it but it is a loot based game which instantly reduces crafters usefullness and you can be a max level combat and a max level crafter (except you have to go switch between them forgeting your other skills while you in combat or crafter mode!) which again means crafting is just an add on to the combat style, not an equaly valid playstyle.
Completely team focued content. Great, now I'm getting flashbacks of the times in EQ where after 2 hours I could still be looking for a team.
I'm sure it will do well enough but its the same old standard fantasy mmo all over again except not casual player friendly.
a big QFE.
Exactly. hype the game by all means, but as a replacement for SWG? Im finding it very hard to see any worthy comparison between the two titles.
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Currently Following: Roma Victor, Fallen Earth, Warhammer Online.
I find the extreme hype on Vanguard pretty funny too, I'm sure the game will do OK, but it's not going to get more subscriptions than WOW like some fans have predicted. Some aspects of the game look neat, but overall it's mainly going to involve the 'difficulty' of sitting through huge time sinks (they were bragging about making travel take longer for a while). And despite what fans with blinders on say, it's going to be a raiding game - something like 1/4 of the content will require raiding, as will gearing up a character, so you're going to have to either be in a raid guild or ignore 1/4 of the game and spend most of your time farming stuff to get loot whores to part with raid loot.
Also, this is on the general discussion board, not the SWG board, I think someome's confused. Or maybe there's something odd with the thread.
If you want a raid centric game with forced interdependence then Vanguard will be for you.
I prefer a game which is solo friendly yet challenging.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it."
Brad McQuaid
Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc.
Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
www.vanguardsoh
This is what has me interested in Vanguard, actually. Looking for a team will be part of the game, but not necessary a negative part of it. Those who like to socialize and get to know people might look at this as a good thing. Those who want a fast group so that they can quickly complete the games content will complain.
A step backward is what I have been waiting for, to be honest. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the new wave of quick-n-easy, casual friendly mmorpgs, but I miss Everquest and the old features that may be comsidered outdated, but that I still consider an important part of a mmorpg (for example, a death penalty).
Although I won't have the time I used to when I played Everquest, I am still looking forward to Vanguard: Saga of Heroes. I can give it a try and see how it works out for me, and keep a mmo like Auto Assault as an alternate so I can have some good, quick fun when I want.
Vanguard and mmorpgs like it require a lot more attention and to me, come a lot closer to being a massive multiplayer virtual gameworld. It won't be all fun and games all the time, yes there will be some times that players may get frustrated and angry, but when I think back to my days playing EQ and UO, this is part of what made those games so great, in my opinion.
Common sense ? it burns, it burns, it burnnnnnssssss...
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I don't think Vanguard will come close to the number wow has but then its doesn't need to
Vanguard will likely however substain its numbers over many years while wows number are already dropping
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
Common sense ? it burns, it burns, it burnnnnnssssss...
*chuckles*... I know... I know... what WAS I thinking... common sense on this board is like looking for a grain of rice in ethiopia.
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
ROFL
Yah I got a kick out of that too. DDO has no vets. Nobody has stayed in it long enough to become one. Matter of fact most of the beta testers have quit and many of the *few* that are left have posted that they probably won't be playing much longer. A "Vet" is someone who's played a game for a significant ammount of time. DDO hasn't been around long enough for anyone, including beta testers, to have played that long
Currently Playing: Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Sig image Pending
Still in: A couple Betas
I like teams but not forced teaming. I dislike needing a team to be able to do anything fun combat wise except fight things lots of levels lower then yoursekf, I dislike watching the whole time I can be on been spent 'level whatever looking for team', I dislike it that when you do get a team it then become a case of not wanting to leave and wanting to get the most out of a team.
And in my experiance its not people who 'want to finish the game quickly will complain' about teams. The really fast power levels always operate as members of teams and won't be any different in Vanguard.
Oh and this was originaly posted in the SWG forum, the mods must have moved it over here.
Like every single game that has ever come to market, I'll believe the hype when it's released. Until then, it's all vaporware, rumor, and opinion.
On a more realistic note, saying I dont "reinforce" my arguments with examples is a bold statement when your post contains just a simple link from the DDO forums, nothing but peoples opinions, which is exactly what my post here was. A
And I did "reinforce" my argument, I gave the offical forums as a prime example. It offers me nothing but the same crap I see everywhere else, I just fail to see whats so great about this game, and why basically everybody is praising it so much when its still in closed beta. Your claims of Vanguard being almighty would hold alot more water if it was in open beta, or live.
"There's no star system Slave I can't reach, and there's no planet I can't find. There's nowhere in the Galaxy for you to run. Might as well give up now."
Boba Fett
Let me preface this by saying: "Why the heck are you posting this in an SWG forum? This forum has nothing to do with either DDO or Vanguard"
While I agree that Vanguard is a bit overblown by the fan base you are WAY off base. The dev team making vanguard is very experienced and has a solid rep. Matter of fact the vast majority of them are the devs who created the original EQ which was so successful back in the 90's and early 2000's and is STILL one of the top MMO's today... 7 years later.
No, I think Vanguard will be a solid release. What I think is accurate, however, is all these people that are soooooooo hyped about it and expecting the world from it will be dissilusioned because they've hyped it to the point where they're expecting more from it than is actually the case.
It's going to be a very solid MMORPG but it's not going to be a sandbox... it's not going to be skills based and it's NOT going to have PvP. So all those folks who are saying "Vanguard will be king because blah blah blah" need to remember that while it will be a very good MMORPG they need to not add to what is listed as the planned features and they need to remember that Vanguard is going to be a pretty 'hard core' MMORPG with stiff death penalties and the time sinks that made EQ1 famous.
If you don't like a slow paced game I suspect Vanguard will wind up turning you off. It's NOT going to be 'get from point A to point B lightning fast. It's going to involve long travel times. It's going to involve stiff death penalties and it's going to involve gated areas of the game as well. Not to mention a crafting system that will NOT be independant of your level because many of the components can only be obtained in very dangerous areas, some only in raid content areas. All of those statements are straight off the Vanguard FAQ's and other information available.
So if you're hoping for Vanguard to be a sandbox you *will* be dissapointed. It'll be a good game in the vein of EQ1... but it won't be a sandbox like SWG or EVE are.
Thats what im trying to get at here. This thread was origionally in the SWG forums, thats where it was when I made my 1st post on it. People keep refering to this game as the replacement for SWG, but as you can see the areas in your post ive highlighted red, just like youve said it wont be a replacement. The only way it will be a replacement is if you are currently playing swg, and quit it to play Vanguard.
This game nowhere near resembles pre-cu swg, and once again Ill bring up the fact that the game is still in BETA! Nobody knows if all the "good" things on the site will be in live, or even if they are in beta, due to an NDA. Anything can happen during beta and the transition to live, and unfortunately nobody but the testers know about it. Dark and Light sounded and looked good, until that big fiasco. Face of Mankind didnt have as much hype, but it was a neat little game, look how that turned out.
The point im attempting to make is that in the gaming world today, MMO's specificly, is that you cannot trust anything you see, read or hear from the devs until the game is fully released and in live. By now I would have thought the majority of MMO'ers would realize this after whats happened to swg.
I respect everybodys opinion on Vanguard and any game for that matter, and my OP wasnt a "shot it down" attempt, was just a mildly vulgar way of what I think about the matter, aka my opinion.
"There's no star system Slave I can't reach, and there's no planet I can't find. There's nowhere in the Galaxy for you to run. Might as well give up now."
Boba Fett
No, if I read the FAQ, I'll see that they *talk about* how a lot of effort has been put into it. Lots of MMORPGs have talked a good game (Mourning, anyone?) The proof will only be in the game itself. I'm not saying that it'll be awful, mind--just that the FAQ don't necessarily mean much.
Chris Mattern
Ok a quick overview on Vanguard.
-The Market
Sigil is right to say that this game is aimed for a niche market.
60-70% of the MMORPG player base won't like this game.
On a positive note the 30% of people who is looking for something more challenging with a slow leveling, knows that Vanguard can deliver what they are looking for.
Who knows about Vanguard will know already that this game is not meant to kick WoW or other similar MMORPG out of the top spot.
It will do extremely well though, because there is not another game that can satisfy that 30% of the player base which I was talking about above.
And the only company that can develope such a game is Sigil (DnL, Darkfall, Morning and the likes were doomed from the beginning because the developers did not have enough experience to pull off a game so complex)
-The Hype.
People like me is hyping this game, because I know what it will be like, and I know that all the features promised by Brad & Co will be in it.
Other people don't know the game as much as I do and most of them will be indeed disappointed.
Just to make it cristal clear, EQ will be the main inspiration for Vanguard.
Basically Vanguard should be the real EQ2, at least what the old EQ player base thought EQ2 would be.
The idea was to strip all the boring bits from EQ and inject few original features and some good ideas from other games.
So if you hated EQ, you most probably hate Vanguard.
-The Competition
Vanguard better than WOW or EQ2?
Personally I don't give a shit, as long as I like it, the other games are irrelevant to me, and I think that's the same state of mind of the majority of Vanguard Fans.
Vanguard comunity is not interested in hyping the game in this way, we usually hype the features that Vanguard will include, and we are really passionate about it.
If that come across as over hyping the game, we do apologise for it.
I am sure there are better games than Vanguard out there for the vast majority of MMORPG players.
Vanguard "core" comunity is not interested in attracting people from other games nor we are interested in saying that Vanguard is better than X game.
Vanguard is just Vanguard.
PS: Personally I am a bit irritated by people that hype Vanguard and doesn't know what is all about.
This kind of people also are the ones that will complain in the future about the game being disappointing.
Vanguard is one of the few games you know in advance what it will be like, it is plain black and white, no room for misinterpretations, just read all the informations.
If you really want to know more about this game, you should visit Silkyvenom.com, and read all the guides (vanguides and faqs), before over hyping a game you know nothing about, so you won't be disappointed later on.
Omg... I never anticipated such a response to my initial post. People yelling fanboi/hypemonger... If you look at what I wrote there's nothing omgwtf! Vanguard FTW! noob!!!! about it. I just state that there has been some discussion in the SWG forum in here about Vanguard taking some people away from SOE. I then have the boldness to say that Vanguard will cash in on the wave of crappy games that have hit us lately and people start to grow horns??
I'm just excited about this game, but I'll keep it down from now on
ROFL
Yah I got a kick out of that too. DDO has no vets. Nobody has stayed in it long enough to become one. Matter of fact most of the beta testers have quit and many of the *few* that are left have posted that they probably won't be playing much longer. A "Vet" is someone who's played a game for a significant ammount of time. DDO hasn't been around long enough for anyone, including beta testers, to have played that long
Indeed they have vets. You need to un derstand that DDO is not going to survive into 2007. So, in relation to the game's lifespan and in correlation to low influx of new players and high expatriation of seasoned players then yes DDO has vets. I'm not talking EQ or even SWG timelines here.