An overview of Ac2! Is this the game for you?

Greyloop · July 2004

An overview of Ac2! Is this the game for you?

First let me remind you that AC2 is an MMORPG where you pay 12.95 a month to play on turbine's servers. This is a game where you progress your character by questing, Hunting, crafting, etc.

Second let me start by saying AC2 is not perfect and you should NEVER go into an MMORPG thinking that it will be this perfect all mighty game (WoW).

MMORPG's are an ongoing work in progress that you as the player get to perticipate in, they are almost like a book that you get to follow along and progress in. Just like every game has it's downfalls AC2 was no exception, during the development it looked like AC2 had it all but when it was released it had some downfalls that caused populations to drop. Some of those issues are listed below and what has been fixed since then.

Keep in mind that these Developers that design Ac2 are IMO some of the most creative, Hard working, caring developers you will find in an MMORPG and this alone is what has caused AC2 to start getting a 2nd look by players!

What gave AC2 a bad reputation & how the devs have worked hard to bring this game back:

- Chat system crashed constantly due to Microsoft designing the Chat system (This hurt the population allot since people could not communicate). *Fixed turbine totally re-wrote the chat system and it now runs great

- Exploits Perching tyrants, etc. *Fixed Turbine has laid down the smack when it comes to most exploits, granted every now and then an exploit may appear but turbine does a great job at handling these.

- People reached high levels to fast *Fixed Turbine has fixed most of this by fixing the exploits.

- Some classes were not balanced *Majority of it fixed I am not going to lie to you and tell you that all the classes are balanced but what game out there does have a fully balanced system? Turbine has done a VERY good job at balancing out the classes and making each class have a role.

- AC2 was not AC1 What I mean by this is allot of players felt they did not meet the needs of the AC1 players, Ac1 players felt like AC2 was not an addition to Ac1. Turbine has stated that AC2 is a different game and it was never created to be the same as AC1. The same lore and world are still used however.

- Nothing to do Past 50 Allot of people hit the level cap of 50 and had nothing to do. This has now been addressed by turbine adding in 100 new HERO levels with new hero skills.

- Crafting did not work out like planned People found the crafting system lacking and didnt meet up to their standards. Turbine has now addressed this issue by releasing their new Crafting 2.0 system.

Now there were other issues when the game came out then what I listed above, but the majority of the issues that caused AC2 to loose many players have now been addressed.

There are still things that people want in the game and Turbine still plugs away month by month delivering to their player base. No other MMORPG out there other then Ac1 offers month by month content. This makes you feel like you are truly getting your moneys worth out of a MMORPG.

A big problem in AC2 today for allot of people are the population #s. At peek times the servers may look like this:

- Frostfell (White) 600 to 800+ Users
- Thistledown (White) 600 to 800+ users
- Darktide (PvP) 60 to 90+ users
- Coldeve (KvK)- 40 to 70+ users
- European Servers Not sure

Now these #s are not the total # of subscribers. Allot of players play on off hours. I would imagine the total amount of AC2 subscriptions is somewhere around 6,000 to 12,000 accounts.

According to #s AC2 is on the low end of the pole when it comes to population #s.

Does this mean Ac2 is a bad game because of the #s? I will let you answer that question by trying out the free trial located here:

http://www.turbinegames.com/download/ac2-freetrial

There are both ups and downs to population #s. In one aspect more #s mean easier groups to find, more of a feeling of a populated world & usually a better economy.

However with High populations comes more jerks to deal with, the sense that you are just one more peon in this great big world, most people do not know you by your name & you are just another Ranger, mage, Tank, etc to them.

Lower populations can offer a more friendly community, people help each other out more, etc.

There are both ups and downs to both scenarios and NOBODY can deny this. What you have to do as a player is decide what is best for you.

AC2s population #s are growing and they are growing on a daily bases now that Turbine has taken over the majority of the business and are starting to remarket the game.

Keep in mind the entire time turbine has went through this transition not once did they stop the monthly content. Turbine has been true to their fans and this is what will keep AC2 around for the long run.

The point is Turbine themselves have already stated that AC2 is here for the long run so you have no worries about them canceling your level account.

Some content that has been added in since release:

Click on the link below to check out Over 150+ quests that are in Ac2. With every month more and more get added in.

http://ac2vault.ign.com/?dir=quests

Now this write-up is not made to convince you to go out and pick up AC2 this is for users that have wondered about AC2 and what it has to offer.

Nobody is trying to paint a picture that AC2 is perfect or that it is better then games out there on the Market or games about to come out, but for 12.95 a month it sure does offer allot.

If you want to be part of a community and feel like everyone knows your name then AC2 is for you. (Allot of this has to do with the population #s), if you like the idea that the game changes every month with a story to follow then AC2 is for you.

If you need 500,000 players to make your game enjoyment fun then AC2 is NOT for you right now, if you would rather have quests that take you months to complete then again AC2 is not for you.

AC2 is what it is plain and simple! They are not trying to sale you something it isnt! They offer every possible way for a player to make there own decision on the game and if you do not like it you are free to leave with no strings attached.

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Below is a write up by a guy known as Doven:

I have been in and out of AC2's Life span three times thus far. And always in returning and reading the boards I find myself "pulling" to the negative. Doubting, challenging, exhausting plausible game changes, reading others that do the same. Constructed crits, moaning, anger, frustrations, and every once in awhile a breath of fresh air from somebody who has never played the game and is trying it for the first time or a vet who has discovered something they missed and has decided to return.

There have been so many changes to AC2 and its world that I have never really sat myself down and asked exactly what it is that keeps me coming back. I have also seen others that have moved on to other games and worlds, invested a good amount of time in them.. and have come back to AC2 and then left again. But I am almost certain that they will come back again as well.

Why is that? Why is it that I personally "miss" AC2? I find that many of the community here and other boards feel the same way that I do. Why?

The frustrations and anger that I read here almost daily I believe is a real problem. Most new players, now days, spend a great deal of time researching about games before they play them because there are so many out there. It almost seems a daunting relationship that people who possibly come here to get information may only see the frustration and not the "motivation" for the frustration. Or rather, read why, vets that post in these forums WANT to see AC2 be the game that they feel was not when it published its ideas so long ago.

I have always felt that sharing frustration is perfectly normal, but sharing frustration then adding ideas to possible fixes or ways to making the posed frustration BETTER than what they are, is more respectable.

The industry of MMO's as a whole is way out of control right now. There are so many moves and changes that finding a suitable rest area is almost impossible. Better still, finding the "reason" why we play in the first place has been become an actual concern. Gamers of MMO's have become hybrids of this industry and for the most part have pushed the attention of producers of these games to new levels and thus newer ideas. But many of these "ideas", AC2 has had since the beginning. And yet even to this day, I am only discovering again what it is that makes AC2 (even though coming on 2 years in age), Just so impeccably wonderful.

I would like to share with whomever reads this "book", What I like about AC2 and its world. Some of these likes from the very beginning, while others still surprisingly enough, still being discovered.

World:

I just started again. Every time I start AC2, I create a new character. I find it easier that way for some reason. And every time I start new, I get to see things in the world I never had seen since the last time I started. AC2's world I feel, gets vastly un-recognized. Seems as though people are just too busy to see the little joys that make the world of Dereth just so damn cool. Every time I start new I see buildings that were once rubble. I ask myself, "is that maybe a possible house?" or "when did that get there?" I have since promised myself to find a spot and just sit there and look for about 15 minutes before I log and do this with all the graphics turned completely up.

You wouldnt believe how much respect I have for the design of this world I have since doing this. AC2's world is STUNNING. Yes, yes.. its always been pretty, or "eye candy". You know, since I've started practicing my Zen before logging out, its even cooler than that. I've watched birds fly random patterns in the sky. Been awe struck by burning skys and solemn moon scapes while listening to the hum of the LS. I have sat by a Drudge Cabalist while it sleeps/meditates and listened to it breath. Waterfalls. Lighting in caves and dungeons. Fire effects. Trees and bushes swaying to the wind. Its almost like the world is growing, and changing. Developing on its own course like a river, slowly but surely re-building and renewing itself. There is NO other game out there that does this and does it in such a subtle way as to actually feel as though its alive. I love this. I miss this when playing other games and have just recently discovered this about AC2.

The other aspect I definitely find refreshing is that its fantasy but not traditional, elf, ogre, pixie, dwarf, whatever. This is just played out. Dont get me wrong. I was a D&D nerd from way back, lol. But this has been a unique stamp since AC day one.

Monsters:

LOL.. I love the mobs in this game! Ever watch the mob while its fighting you? It grabs its wounds, yells, asks for healing, grunts, all sorts of really cool actions. Even when your not fighting the mobs, they forage, sit and look around, move to other locations, sleep, meditate, "I smeeeellll sooomethiiing", they stomp their feet, communicate too each other. My god, there are so many actions that these mobs act out that its truly unique to any other game.

Recently I was hunting in a remote area of Omishan, when another player (and I dont know how we bumped into each other, because I was trying to be alone) found me. To her surprise that I was there she asked.."what are you doing way out here?" I simply replied, "formulating a species article for a future Nova show".. she laughed. There is just too much to list here about what I like but I do know this. When I actually start "feeling" that drudges are the nuisance and gurogs are a mighty warrior class, and barun have a natural hatred to Tumerocks and are diseasing the land. It puts me in the game.

The mobs in AC2 play a role that accentuates the role that I play. Its very dynamic and completely Turbine. Its also very rare to see in other games, IF at all.

Community:

THIS has to be the number ONE reason why I miss AC2 when I am away. I can't express in words how wonderful AC and AC2's community is compared to other games, and I dont know why this is really. For some reason, and this has never changed since I started playing the AC line of games, have I seen any other community be as helpful, considerate, loyal, friendly, compassionate and giving. I still read peoples chats that affirm this. New players as well as Vets to the MMO world consistently chat how amazed they are to the friendliness of the AC community.

Just the other day, as an example, I started Honor Dvn, (my new luggy juggy woo!) and was hunting Vermins to craft some armor/weaps before going into Arwic mines, when another white dot appears on the radar. There is one vermin in both our view. I run to kill the vermin, the white dot does too. I get within melee range of vermin and see this Tummy is in melee range as well now. Vermin starts hitting me, I say, "sorry go head", He replies "no no.. you go", I argue, "its okay I get another", he replies "your going to die if you dont kill it", I reply "but you got here first", he replies "I think you got here first" (I am at 1/2 life now, level 4) "are you sure?" I ask, he laughs. I laugh too. LOL THIS is CRAZY. People in this game actually care about others.

Now this doesnt happen all the time hehe.. but it happen ALOT. In other games? This is something that is just too bad. In fact its so bad that WoW had to put the "tag" system in to elevate the potential problem. Now the "tag" system is cool, dont get me wrong. But having a considerate community is more important. And this considerate community helps others that are not used to this type of game play, "learn" what it means to play with honor. Simply priceless.

Crafting:

This is going with the new 2.0 craft update ideas. Since I havent played it and neither has most of us. I will go by what I have played in other games. To me the number one issue with crafting is economy and downtime. This new idea that will be implemented Wed. serves to be a possible a solution to both. I was there for the SWG fallout during beta. Was there for the Horizons hoopla during beta and NDA prevents me from going further.. . But I will suggest this.

Every game thus far has had some good ideas but none have actually hit the nail on the head. Turbine may have had a blessing in disguise here with everyone elses development and being able to see, read and hear what it is that makes a great crafting system. I like the idea of teleporting to the resource area, the idea of "finding" the resource deposit, maps, tools, and the ability to become proficient in some medium of crafting without sacrificing class skills. There is NO limitation to how far you can go with it. And its super unique in that the combination of effects and graphing can be endless as well as flexible if/when balance changes occur. Its diverse, its socketable, its worth doing and looks fun and its new.

Now a player can actually RP a certain class by complementing that class with imbued items or effects that best "fit" the players playstyle or look. Robes for instance are considered flexible and have vigor enhancing properties. How appropriate for the mage idea. . I can't wait to see where this goes but crafting 2.0 hits on a few "key" aspects that many games crafting exercises dont.

1. Discovery
2. Less downtime
3. Moderate costs
4. Everyone can do
5. No limit to possible changes and levels.
6. Diversity
7. No fighting over traits and harvesting.

Level Caps, Skills, Abilities:

I hate easily attainable level caps. Not that I will get there before you. But just the idea that an end is easily in sight leaves me limp. In DAoC for instance, I knew exactly what kind of character I was going to be at 50 and even knew exactly what I was going to be up to RR10. Bah!.

Games like AO I liked allot simply because of the high level caps. (200 I believe) and AC with 126 (back in the day). I don't ever want to feel as though I will "max". And when I do "max" it feels special! When I achieved my first level 126 in AC I was absolutely thrilled! When I reached 50 in DAoC, I was no where near as thrilled as in AC. (but happy none the less). But not Thrilled! AC2 gives hope for a future while playing the game. It has been said by many that even Turbine itself doesnt have any idea where its going. That is awesome! I am happy they dont, IF they dont, but I bet anything they do. The idea of being able to grow within certain parameters I think is important.

Games that offer no levels or ways to gauge your progression simply do not interest me. When I look at the skill tab in game and scroll up to the "hero" skills, I notice that scrolling could very easily keep going up. UP. This makes me very happy. And importantly does not give the ever increasing "analyze the hell out of whats the best class" player an easy motive. There simply is no way to tell but there is a whole bunch of ways to speculate. LOL.. go head speculate.

I used to think that AC2's skill system was kind of blah. But recently I have discovered that even though its vastly simple. It can become very complex. The idea of being able to change my template or my RP styles without too much time sacrifice makes it even better. The game evolves so does the players option to evolve their skills to fit their needs. This is dynamic, in many games its just called.. re-roll. Bottom line for me is that I am tired in pigeon holing myself into a certain class only to find that I change my interests and feel stuck. I dont feel that at all while playing AC2.

In fact, I dont think about this at all unless I am playing a different game than AC2. The Juggy I just made is the first I have ever played, (I have played all the rest except hive keeper), and I am having a blast! Is it the best class? Who the hell cares. LOL...hahahhaa. It is super cool though..

In Closing:

As I have posted before here. There are a thousand and one ways to simply "down side" a game. Even the best game. And for me personally, I have yet to see another game, even come close to the fun and community and world that I "expect" to be better than it is. AC2 has so many gifts that I have re-discovered that I am finding myself feeling the same way I did when I beta tested AC1 so long ago having never played a MMO. I only have to slow down and look at it.

Everyone is different. But I myself have come to realize personally that I have been so consumed with picking at every detail with this game and other "new" games, that I have lost sight of the big picture and why I play this type of game in the first place. No other game really compares to the level of detail that I find in AC2. And though WoW and EQ2 are coming out and I will no doubt try them, I still cant bring myself to pass away the fact that AC2 was doing this stuff from its beginning.

In other words, for me, while new games can use other games "short comings" to become better, AC2 already was "better", but somehow I lost sight of it. Turbines commitment to AC and its future games has always been about passion. You can see it in its foundations and you can see it in their non-stop concern for trying to make AC better than it is. Some of us (including myself at times) may have given up hope, or lost sight of the vision, but Turbine never has. They bought AC for the players, they continue to build AC (through all the challenges) for its players, and they work very hard with a very tight budget (my guess), BECAUSE of its players.

This is what I pay 12.95 a month for. And that seems a small price to pay for that kind of commitment.

Again here is the link to the 15 day Free trial:

http://www.turbinegames.com/download/ac2-freetrial]15

Slanger · July 2004

A lot of good information in Greyloops post. Very good facts, and not just opinions being stated as facts. There's really no reason not to give Asheron's Call 2 a shot. There's a 15-day free trial that you can simply download and try. And you don't even have to give your Credit Info.

Currently Playing:
AC2, WW2Online, SWG

Retired:
Everquest, DAoC

Sevenwind · July 2004

I agree! Was trying to convince myself not to run out and spend 40 bucks on COH so I downloaded the trial. I'm loving it at the moment. It has issues, but every game does.

They will be getting my 12.95 when I milk this free trial for all it's worth. ::::28::

COH will have to wait for awhile.

Unknown · July 2004

Greyloop,

Tell us this:

In exactly what way or ways, is AC2 different from all the other major MMORPGs? (other than new graphics?)

UO? EQ? AC? DAoC? SB? Lin? Lin2? FFXI?

If you can state what AC2 has that each of those other major MMORPGs do not have, then that will make gamers think even more about checking out AC2.

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MMORPG games I've played:
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Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
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Seiffer · July 2004

Well i can only judgje ac2 with ffxi (in the list of games you named) Also did final fantasy have a advantage in my opinion to me ( i'm a pretty big final fantasy fan)

But sadly i must say the combat system of ac2 was far superior to that from ffxi also the crafting system and the way of leveling was far better in ac2 then that of ffxi. The only thing with what ffxi beats asherons call 2 is its auction house which was very good

Well i think most of ascherons call players like the way of leveling and the combat system of ac2 + ofcource the great montly update's which keeps renewing the game

thats all

Unknown · July 2004

Originally posted by Greyloop
An overview of Ac2! Is this the game for you?

A big problem in AC2 today for allot of people are the population #s. At peek times the servers may look like this:

- Frostfell (White) 600 to 800+ Users
- Thistledown (White) 600 to 800+ users
- Darktide (PvP) 60 to 90+ users

Time to consolidate the server!
- Coldeve (KvK)- 40 to 70+ users

  Time to consolodate the server!
- European Servers Not sure

A low end brand new server hardware costs anywhere from $10,000 to $25,000 and is made to easily hold 1,000 players online at the same time. A high line new server hardware can go for $100,000 and is made to hold 5,000 to 12,000 players online at the same time. Heck Runescape (the "cheapest" MMORPG) on just 1 server has more players than the entire game of AC2!

http://runescape.com/

Now these #s are not the total # of subscribers. Allot of players play on off hours. I would imagine the total amount of AC2 subscriptions is somewhere around 6,000 to 12,000 accounts.

You have a point there. But it is a small point. If your above numbers are number of players at peak time then IMAGINE how many players play during non-peak time

According to #s AC2 is on the low end of the pole when it comes to population #s.

   The industry standard for a MMORPG to be considered a bona fid success is having 100,000 players. The industry standard for a MMORPG to have a chance in heaven or hell of recouping the money invested into it, and of seeing the day of turning a true profit... is having 50,000 players. This is the standard for major MMORPGs. Ones that cost 1 million, 5 million, or more to make. That cost millions each month to upkeep and maintain.

Does this mean Ac2 is a bad game because of the #s? I will let you answer that question by trying out the free trial located here:

   AC2 can be the nicest MMORPG ever. BUT if the population of this major MMORPG never ever reaches 50,000 players then it will not last. Need more proof? Earth and Beyond, Motor City Online.... both had 20,000+ players. Both were considered by their current players and fans to NOT be bad games. But Mr. Reality said "I do not care! Real life economics say MMORPGs are a buisness. Buisnesses must make money to stay open. Time for EnB and MCO to close!".

AC2 does not have low population numbers. AC2 has dismally low population numbers. There litterally is almost no one playing! A server for a major MMORPG having 50 players on at peak time?!? 800? 1,000? Those are dismally low population numbers according to the industry.

There are both ups and downs to population #s. In one aspect more #s mean easier groups to find, more of a feeling of a populated world & usually a better economy.

Incorrect. There are only lows and downs to dismally low population numbers. The buisness is constantly in danger of closing up! MMORPGs require players to invest their irreplaceable time (money can be replaced) into their characters. AC2 at any moment can/will close up. Especially when the rest of the 4th Generation Fantasy-Themed MMORPGs get released in 6 to 8 months more. EQ2, WoW, Lin2 (gets past its growing pains), GW, and many, many, more.

AC2s population #s are growing and they are growing on a daily bases now that Turbine has taken over the majority of the business and are starting to remarket the game.

Turbine has had more share of AC2 for roughly the past 3 months. AC2's population has either remained the same, or slightly gone down even more. Check the threads in this here AC2 forum on pages 2 to 6 for past posts from current AC2 players who posted the population numbers. Numbers which are the same as the ones you posted in this thread.

BTW, MicroSoft still owns part of Turbine. A VERY important part of Turbine. By the time Turbine finnishes buying out the rest of itself by the end of this year, it will be too late because the rest of the 4th Generation MMORPGs will be otu.

The point is Turbine themselves have already stated that AC2 is here for the long run so you have no worries about them canceling your level account.

   Dude, go read the forums for Mythica, UXO, EnB, MCO, and the rest of the MMORPGs that got either vaporized, or closed. They ALL said the exact same thing. Heck you can still read the old UXO forums (the most recently closed MMORPG):

(check out the very last post heheh....)

http://ultimax.ogaming.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=1533&st=25

Nobody is trying to paint a picture that AC2 is perfect or that it is better then games out there on the Market or games about to come out, but for 12.95 a month it sure does offer allot.

WHAT!? You are saying there is not a single MMORPG out there that AC2 is better than? I leave it to you lurkers to continue the train of thought I am now thinking....

If you need 500,000 players to make your game enjoyment fun then AC2 is NOT for you right now, if you would rather have quests that take you months to complete then again AC2 is not for you.

   Now you are posting FALSE information. As well as grossly exaggerating! No one, no one, has ever stated a MMORPG must have 500,000 players inorder to be a success.

AC2 is what it is plain and simple! They are not trying to sale you something it isnt! They offer every possible way for a player to make there own decision on the game and if you do not like it you are free to leave with no strings attached.

   Many other MMORPGs also offer every possible way for a player to make their own decidison aka - FREE trials to play! DAoC, EQ, UO, AC, RS, AS3, to name a few. There are more too.

The REAL question/questions is/are ...... what does AC2 has that other MMORPGs do NOT have? What does AC2 has that makes it different from the other MMORPGs out there?

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Below is a write up by a guy known as Doven:

   How about you do your own write up. If Doven wants to come out of lurk mode and post, he should be able to do it himself. For all we know, Doven's opinions may have changed by now.

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MMORPG games I've played:
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Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
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flabair · July 2004

i did the 15 day trail and liked the game, crafting was a little hard but new system looks like it may have fixed it. was going to buy game but couldnt find it an any store and only saw it online at the turbine site where you just paid for the code, i didnt like that as i prefer to have a cd near me as i live in fla and with our thunderstorms and stuff i have fried a few hard drives, even with surge protectors.

Sevenwind · July 2004

Flabair you can still get the CD from Amazon.com and it's resellers. Lowest I saw was around 12 dollars I think. Hope that helps.

Skael · July 2004

Look xploror, we know about the low populations. A higher population would be nice but it's eally not that serious. As for the off-peak times, it does not drop that much. When I sign on at noon, I see 450 people on Frostfell. When I sign on at 8:00 at night ( eastern time ) there are 750 people on. It doesn't fluctuate in the same way games like DAoC or Shadowbane do, in DAoC the big servers like Merlin and Lancelot have 1200 people on off-peak, 2500 during peak. That's more than double.

While low populations are intimidating, it has not affected my game experience on Frostfell much. It's just that if I come to a quest that I can't solo, I might not find someone to do it with right away. But if I come back in a few hours I'll usually find three or four other people to do it with and I finish the quest easily. Same goes for vaults, if you advertise on the General chat "Anyone wanna do Cobalt vault?" Someone will usually send you a tell and meet you there, and when you get there you'll probably run into another person or two to join your fellowship as well.

With the players in AC2, it's not about quantity, but quality. Everyone I have met in the game has been nice and friendly, with the exception of two people I fellowed with who did not stay organized inside a quest dungeon, didn't stop to let my friend come and join the fellow, didn't respond to anything I said and told me to help attack the monsters, not understanding that I was busy healing them. Of course, I used all my vigor healing them, when the monsters attacked me they did not help, and without vigor to heal myself with and being a crappy fighter I died. It's not that they were directly rude or immature, they just weren't with it. Personally I prefer a low population of friendly people to a high population of rude, immature people who will flame me and kick me out of the group if they die because I had no vigor and couldn't heal them in time. ( DAoC, CoH )

Vendor buy us all a decent MMORPG bank guards recdu recsu

Unknown · July 2004

Skael,

Two things, it seems only when you respond to any post I make you defend AC2. But when you respond to posts by other people you agree with all my points:

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion.cfm/load/forums/loadforum/434/loadthread/16888/setstart/1/loadclass/144

[quote]

Skael:

Interesting, but I don't know how much more of it I can take.[/quote]

next thing........,

Enjoy AC2 for as long as you can. You have roughly 6 to 8 more months to enjoy it. (1 more year at the absolute max). Right now AC2 is the only major 4th Generation Fantasy-Themed MMORPG out. HZ is also 4th Generation, but it is not a major name brand. Plus it is still super brand new. 6 to 8 months from now, the remaining players in AC2 will be in either EQ2, WoW, the mighty VANGUARD, GW, and the rest of the heavy hitting big boy 4th generation MMORPGs.

But who knows, maybe the profits from AC will be enough to keep AC2 limping along even if the populations dip to 100 total players online at peak time.

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======= SIGNATURE =========
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MMORPG games I've played:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor

Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor_archives01

Skael · July 2004

it seems only when you respond to any post I make you defend AC2. But when you respond to posts by other people you agree with all my points:

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion.cfm/load/forums/loadforum/434/loadthread/16888/setstart/1/loadclass/144

Not true.

In your posts you bash AC2 because of the low population, how you think it is going to die soon, and how you think it is not as original as people make it out to be. I defend AC2 in those cases because I think the population doesn't matter, AC2 just might not die as soon as you say it will, and it is indeed very original and innovative compared to other MMORPGs.

In the posts where I attack AC2, I am referring to grinding, performance/rubberbanding issues, and awkwardness with movement and camera controls. In all of your bashings of AC2, you did not mention any of those things.

I never agreed with you. I think you need to take it easy with the population thing, whenever anyone tries to say anything positive about the game you plague the thread with a rant on population and the game's inevitable death. If we thought the populations were too low to be worth anything, and the game was dying too soon for it to be worth trying, none of us would be here talking about the game. Notice that no one on here has complained about the low populations being a problem but you.

Since you can't come out with any "facts" or pull any population numbers in order to refute this, I doubt you will reply at all.

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Tombs · July 2004

Farg, I made a long post and lost it somehow...maybe I will repeat it later ::::37::

Skael · July 2004

Happens to me a lot.. try pressing the Back button to go back to the reply screen and see if your message is still there, if not then just learn to always copy your posts to the clipboard before posting so that if it doesn't go through you can just do paste and try it again.

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Tombs · July 2004

Made a new thread.

Mag1ster · July 2004

Il have to take the AC2 side on that one. I, myself tried it and i found it really really great. I have not much to say as all the good point already stated, but i would like you to keep the positive attitude and stop trying to destruct what people do. It won't get you anything to destruct a low population game like AC2.

Believe me guys who read this post, give AC2 a chance, it's worth it if your looking for a new kind of mmorpg... a 4th generation one.

________________________________________________
By powergaming in an rpg games you are forgotting the true
essence of the rpg : Role. Playing. Game.

Unknown · July 2004

Originally posted by Skael

it seems only when you respond to any post I make you defend AC2. But when you respond to posts by other people you agree with all my points:

http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion.cfm/load/forums/loadforum/434/loadthread/16888/setstart/1/loadclass/144

Not true.

In your posts you bash AC2 because of the low population, how you think it is going to die soon, and how you think it is not as original as people make it out to be. I defend AC2 in those cases because I think the population doesn't matter, AC2 just might not die as soon as you say it will, and it is indeed very original and innovative compared to other MMORPGs.

Heh, even you admit (hesitatingly) that you agree AC2 will die (you put "might" aka you are not sure either way). I never said AC2 will die soon. I said AC2 right now will stay alive. until the rest of the 4th Generation Fantasy-Themed MMORPGs get released..... which will be roughly 6 to 8 months from now. By the end of this year December 2004, to early 2005. WoW is in solid Beta. EQ2 is in early beta. Lin2 is in its earliest growing pains stages after finnishing beta. I don't closely follow GW, or the slew of others listed "in development" in the left side menu, but many of them are within 1 year or less of completion (many of them have been in that menu for 6 months heheh.). Unless you personally define 6 to 8 months as being "soon". I see 3 months as being soon. Instead of saying that I think AC2 will die "soon" specifically quote me as saying "6 to 8 months" or "by December 2004 to June 2005".

In the posts where I attack AC2, I am referring to grinding, performance/rubberbanding issues, and awkwardness with movement and camera controls. In all of your bashings of AC2, you did not mention any of those things.

I've mentioned the bugs in AC2 too many times loooong ago. In the Beta forums, at the official site, and at this site. It is all old news to me. They didn't really matter back then because AC2 back then had roughly 50,000 players playing with a solid 5,000 players on each server. Bugs are no problem if tons of players are still playing and paying.

Better a MMORPG with some bugs and 50,000 players or more, than a MMORPG with few bugs and almost no one at all playing.

And telling the truth and facts is not = to bashing. LOL!

I never agreed with you. I think you need to take it easy with the population thing, whenever anyone tries to say anything positive about the game you plague the thread with a rant on population and the game's inevitable death.

1. I am NOT the only one who continues posting the complete truth about AC2, including how it has lost over 45,000 players and is currently an almost dead game.

2. Why are you sooo against me posting all of the truth about AC2? Yes or no, does AC2 right now have 50,000 players? Yes or no is the information about the number of players posted by other fans of AC2 true? Leaving out the truth about a game is not posting positive about it. It is being deceptive. Telling everyting about a game, the good and bad, is being postive about the game.

If we thought the populations were too low to be worth anything, and the game was dying too soon for it to be worth trying, none of us would be here talking about the game. Notice that no one on here has complained about the low populations being a problem but you.

What you decide to do with your irreplaceable time is up to you. What the lurkers and other gamers decide to do with THEIR irreplaceable time is up to them. Again, those 20,000 players who were still playing EnB, and MCO, all thought low populations ment nothing. They all were still having a fun time. But Mr. Reality made a visit and those games got shut down. Any new players in those games who knew the truth had nothing to complain about. But any new players in those games who did not know the truth felt jerked. Being deceptive about any game is not good for the entire MMORPG industry because those players very likely will never play another MMORPG. And they will tell their friends who will tell their friends. Better to always be 100% truthful with BOTH the good things and bad things, then let the lurkers and gamers make up their own minds, own informed decisions.

Since you can't come out with any "facts" or pull any population numbers in order to refute this, I doubt you will reply at all.

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Have you even been reading? Do you read? Do you read everything? Good grief, read the first post by Greyloop in this here thread! LOL!

Unless you think Greyloop, who created this thread, who IS a supporter of AC2, is a liar! In that case you are calling ALL AC2 supporters ..... liars. Including yourself.

=========================
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Storm. · July 2004

xplorer i just want to know why you are making a campaign of people not getting the game. I guess if I didn't like the game I would move on. I'm not sure if you're playing or not but I just want to know your logic behind making all these negative posts. I have both good and bad things to say about ac2 but I find it the mmorpg that is right for me. It obviously isn't right for everyone. I don't intend that as a flame but I just want to see why you haven't moved on.

Skael · July 2004

Heh, even you admit (hesitatingly) that you agree AC2 will die (you put "might" aka you are not sure either way). I never said AC2 will die soon. I said AC2 right now will stay alive. until the rest of the 4th Generation Fantasy-Themed MMORPGs get released..... which will be roughly 6 to 8 months from now. By the end of this year December 2004, to early 2005. WoW is in solid Beta. EQ2 is in early beta. Lin2 is in its earliest growing pains stages after finnishing beta. I don't closely follow GW, or the slew of others listed "in development" in the left side menu, but many of them are within 1 year or less of completion (many of them have been in that menu for 6 months heheh.). Unless you personally define 6 to 8 months as being "soon". I see 3 months as being soon. Instead of saying that I think AC2 will die "soon" specifically quote me as saying "6 to 8 months" or "by December 2004 to June 2005".

I said it MIGHT die, because who knows--Turbine could pull an EA and decide to give up on AC2 in order to put more effort in to MEO. You never know. The point I was making was that you said I was agreeing with you in other threads, which is totally wrong, I disliked entirely different aspects of AC2 for different reasons. There's a special latin name for the debate fallacy that you are using which I can't think of right now--it's where, instead of responding to the opposition's arguments, you nitpick at things like their wording in order to make it seem like they have less credibility, when in reality you are just ignoring/belittling the arguments they previously gave. I'm glad you don't play AC2 because I don't like to play with people who have attitudes like yours. When Tabula Rasa comes out, stay the hell away from that game cause I will be enjoying it too much for someone like you to spoil it.

I've mentioned the bugs in AC2 too many times loooong ago. In the Beta forums, at the official site, and at this site. It is all old news to me. They didn't really matter back then because AC2 back then had roughly 50,000 players playing with a solid 5,000 players on each server. Bugs are no problem if tons of players are still playing and paying.

I am not talking about bugs! Awkwardness in movement and the camera are just how the game operates. Rubberbanding isn't a bug, it's a lag issue. Here you go with the distractions again. I was never talking about population, which you can't seem to shut up about, and here you go with your population numbers that you think are the ultimate solution to any argument involving AC2. Don't tell me that I don't read your posts, as you seem to have quite a bit of difficulty reading mine yourself.

Better a MMORPG with some bugs and 50,000 players or more, than a MMORPG with few bugs and almost no one at all playing.

I don't see how this relates at all, and I don't quite understand the analogy you're making either.

And telling the truth and facts is not = to bashing. LOL!

The same "truth" and "facts" that you come out with in every freaking post. We heard you the first time. Population numbers do not = to me agreeing with your crazy logic, sorry.

I 1. I am NOT the only one who continues posting the complete truth about AC2, including how it has lost over 45,000 players and is currently an almost dead game.

Yes you are. Show me anyone other than you who has bashed the game relentlessly the way you have, for incredibly hollow reasons, in any of the recent threads.

2. Why are you sooo against me posting all of the truth about AC2? Yes or no, does AC2 right now have 50,000 players? Yes or no is the information about the number of players posted by other fans of AC2 true? Leaving out the truth about a game is not posting positive about it. It is being deceptive. Telling everyting about a game, the good and bad, is being postive about the game.

YES, it is a low population game. YES, we already know that. If people were not interested in playing what they already know to be a low population game, they would not be playing the free trial and posting their impressions of it on these boards! I'm against you posting your "truth" because it's a "truth" we are all aware of, and while you think you are doing people a favor by spreading the word of the low population you are just making a nuisance of yourself and give me opportunities to exercise my debate skills.

What you decide to do with your irreplaceable time is up to you. What the lurkers and other gamers decide to do with THEIR irreplaceable time is up to them. Again, those 20,000 players who were still playing EnB, and MCO, all thought low populations ment nothing. They all were still having a fun time. But Mr. Reality made a visit and those games got shut down. Any new players in those games who knew the truth had nothing to complain about. But any new players in those games who did not know the truth felt jerked. Being deceptive about any game is not good for the entire MMORPG industry because those players very likely will never play another MMORPG. And they will tell their friends who will tell their friends. Better to always be 100% truthful with BOTH the good things and bad things, then let the lurkers and gamers make up their own minds, own informed decisions.

How are we not being truthful? The only bad points you are capable of are the low population and the possibility of its death. We are all very aware of this, as I said before. The free trial enables people to spend their time trying the game, and not both time and money. I think you are wasting more people's time, including your own, by posting nonstop about population numbers!

Since you can't come out with any "facts" or pull any population numbers in order to refute this, I doubt you will reply at all.

Vendor buy us all a decent MMORPG bank guards recdu recsu

Have you even been reading? Do you read? Do you read everything? Good grief, read the first post by Greyloop in this here thread! LOL!

What's your point? The name of the first poster in this thread has nothing to do with whether or not I read posts, and I do read them by the way.

Unless you think Greyloop, who created this thread, who IS a supporter of AC2, is a liar! In that case you are calling ALL AC2 supporters ..... liars. Including yourself.

I don't see any "truth" here. HOW am I calling all AC2 supporters liars? Don't you know how to back up your claims? Learn how to debate man, people will take you more seriously when you post stuff like this.

This is getting really old now, if your next post isn't anything good I won't be participating in this flame war any longer.

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Seravajan · July 2004

One huge mistake Turbine have done with AC 1 and especially AC 2 is it was never sold in Europe!
Most available games was direct imports maded by few game shops.
There are german and french servers available and the game is translated as well (the translation is not very good) but there are seldom more than 200 ppl online at the same time. AC2 is now more fun than it was in beta!

Betatesting: Unknown game coming soon! :P
Betatested: AC2; Lords of Everquest; Horizons; Fung Wan Online; Wish; Saga of Ryzom.
Testing: AC1; AC2
Playing: Horizons
Retired: EQ; DAoC; SWG; Shadowbane; UO free shards, Ashen Empires
Attempt to test or play: Darkfall; EQ2; Dark & Light, WoW, Mourning

Unknown · July 2004

Originally posted by Skael

I said it MIGHT die, because who knows--Turbine could pull an EA and decide to give up on AC2 in order to put more effort in to MEO. You never know.

In order for Turbine to "pull an EA" they would have to see the light on AC2 and put more effort into AC a game already successful. EA is putting more effort into UO, a game already successful. (Though that is not the real reason UXO became vaporware.)

The rest of your comments I will say... you go your way and think what you want. I will go my way and think what I want. Let the lurkers decide and think what they want from reading what you and I already wrote.

And telling the truth and facts is not = to bashing. LOL!

The same "truth" and "facts" that you come out with in every freaking post. We heard you the first time. Population numbers do not = to me agreeing with your crazy logic, sorry.

Yes, you are correct, I keep repeating the Truth and Facts over and over. Not in every single post, but whenever I see a related reason to do so. Hey look at the new thread I made, in that post I talk nothing about AC2's dismally low population.

I 1. I am NOT the only one who continues posting the complete truth about AC2, including how it has lost over 45,000 players and is currently an almost dead game.

Yes you are. Show me anyone other than you who has bashed the game relentlessly the way you have, for incredibly hollow reasons, in any of the recent threads.

Simply read ALL of the first post on page 1 of this here thread. The guy who made this thread talks about the dismally low population numbers. I am not the only one.

2. Why are you sooo against me posting all of the truth about AC2? Yes or no, does AC2 right now have 50,000 players? Yes or no is the information about the number of players posted by other fans of AC2 true? Leaving out the truth about a game is not posting positive about it. It is being deceptive. Telling everyting about a game, the good and bad, is being postive about the game.

YES, it is a low population game. YES, we already know that. If people were not interested in playing what they already know to be a low population game, they would not be playing the free trial and posting their impressions of it on these boards! I'm against you posting your "truth" because it's a "truth" we are all aware of,

If it is a truth you are aware of, then it is not my truth, it is THE truth. Mr. Reality's truth. Playing a free trial in a dismally low population game is far different than paying to play it.

and while you think you are doing people a favor by spreading the word of the low population you are just making a nuisance of yourself and give me opportunities to exercise my debate skills.

Nooo problem. And thank you for admitting that AC2 has a dismally low population. Now let the lurkers and other gamers make their own informed decisions if they want to pay every month to subscribe and play AC2.

How are we not being truthful? The only bad points you are capable of are the low population and the possibility of its death. We are all very aware of this, as I said before. The free trial enables people to spend their time trying the game, and not both time and money. I think you are wasting more people's time, including your own, by posting nonstop about population numbers!

You are not being 100% truthful whenever you on purpose do not mention the dismally low population AC2 has.

Since you can't come out with any "facts" or pull any population numbers in order to refute this, I doubt you will reply at all.

Vendor buy us all a decent MMORPG bank guards recdu recsu

Have you even been reading? Do you read? Do you read everything? Good grief, read the first post by Greyloop in this here thread! LOL!

What's your point? The name of the first poster in this thread has nothing to do with whether or not I read posts, and I do read them by the way.

The point is..... you claim I am making up the population numbers for AC2. "Since you can't come up with any facts, or pull any population numbers....." LOL! R-e-a-d the first post on page 1 of this here thread! The guy who made this thread himself posted the current peak time population numbers for AC2!

Unless you think Greyloop, who created this thread, who IS a supporter of AC2, is a liar! In that case you are calling ALL AC2 supporters ..... liars. Including yourself.

I don't see any "truth" here. HOW am I calling all AC2 supporters liars? Don't you know how to back up your claims? Learn how to debate man, people will take you more seriously when you post stuff like this.

You say I am making up the population numbers. I tell you to read the post made by Greyloop on page 1 of this here thread. Remember Greyloop the guy who started this thread? If I am making up the population numbers, and I am getting them from Greyloop, and Greyloop is a full supporter of AC2, then you are calling me AND Greyloop liars! If you are calling a major supporter of AC2 a liar, then you are calling all AC2 supporters liars.

This is getting really old now, if your next post isn't anything good I won't be participating in this flame war any longer.

You have not yet resorted to calling me names. So of course I will not start calling you names. Not a flame war. You are on purpose ignoring the information Greyloop posted on page 1 of this here thread. Greyloop himself posted the dismally low population numbers that AC2 has... not me.

Vendor buy us all a decent MMORPG bank guards recdu recsu

And edit your sig so all of the message gets continued. Heheh.

=========================
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MMORPG games I've played:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor

Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor_archives01

Unknown · July 2004

Originally posted by Storm.
xplorer i just want to know why you are making a campaign of people not getting the game. I guess if I didn't like the game I would move on. I'm not sure if you're playing or not but I just want to know your logic behind making all these negative posts. I have both good and bad things to say about ac2 but I find it the mmorpg that is right for me. It obviously isn't right for everyone. I don't intend that as a flame but I just want to see why you haven't moved on.

Hello Storm,

Many have asked before, and I posted my answer. I will post it again. I simply want to make sure the lurkers, and gamers, know the full truth about AC2, so they can then make their own informed decision to buy it and subscribe to it...... or not, and wait for the rest of the 4th Generation Fantasy-themed MMORPGs to get released.

I am not against anyone buying AC2. I am against anyone buying AC2 without knowing enough about it to make an informed decision. If, after they first know AC2 has dismally low numbers of players, and can be canceled at any moment, and they still buy it, I fully support them and their decision. Because they are making an informed decision.

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MMORPG games I've played:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor

Star Wars Galaxies:
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http://community.webshots.com/user/capt_xplororor

More games:
-----------
http://community.webshots.com/user/xplororor_archives01

Skael · July 2004

I never said you were making up population numbers. It's just that for every point I make, you try to disprove it using the low population/dying game thing. What I meant by that was that I saw no way that you could argue with my post using population numbers, but somehow, like always, you did. When I quoted "facts", I was just referring to the population numbers. Whenever you claim to back something up with facts, it's either population numbers or business strategy which lead to the game dying.

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An overview of Ac2! Is this the game for you?

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