Yes they did.. but not everyone is so forgiving simply because they apologized.. oh wait they didn't.. they grudgingly gave us our money back so we wouldn't sue them.. they fully intended to try to get away with defrauding their own customers.
which is why this isn't a consumer protection issue, and simply nerd rage going strong after 2 years. It's people holding a grudge, who actually lost absolutely nothing.
You should probably learn what "nerd rage" is before using it in a sentence.
This is "consumer rage" not frustration due to an overly difficult/obtuse game mechanic.
And a product being a good value doesnt give the producing company right to defraud customers. Whether its $50 or a million fraud is fraud. In this case though it would have been a class action suit making the combined damage in the range of millions easily.
The disclaimer is "experience may change during online play" not "product description may be fraudulent".
Yes they did.. but not everyone is so forgiving simply because they apologized.. oh wait they didn't.. they grudgingly gave us our money back so we wouldn't sue them.. they fully intended to try to get away with defrauding their own customers.
which is why this isn't a consumer protection issue, and simply nerd rage going strong after 2 years. It's people holding a grudge, who actually lost absolutely nothing.
BTW, it's more than a little amusing to me that a company who clearly provided you with more enjoyment than you've ever had in life (judging by the rage you're still carrying around 2 years later) for what, like 2 years...for next to no cost...becomes the anti-christ and a borderline criminal organization because they changed the game in a way they saw fit.
Why don't you just say "hey...thanks for the incredibly inexpensive fun you provided me...and good luck with your new thing".
Two years ago, it was a valid, actionable consumer issue.
That was solved by SOE reversing its long standing policy of "no returns, no refunds" on expansions in the case of those dissatisfied with the changes to ToOW that the NGE imposed, thus drastically altering the value of ToOW to many who had purchased it.
That solved the litigation issue.
However, the matter of SOE's lousy reputation persists to this day, and you'll find people dicussing it whereever the magic three letters NGE appear.
Companies that engage in this sort of consumer fraud may avoid being hauled into court over their actions, but they seldom manage to live down their reputations until the individuals responsible for those reputations move on, and the policies they supported are rescinded and the company makes amends.
Smedley not only has not moved on, he's publically stated that the NGE was a mistake, although not with the degree of candor, remorse, and action necessary to appease those who were very understandably angry as a result of SOE's actions.
Dismissing something like this that was prior to the offering of the refunds an actionable legal matter as "nerd rage" indicates that you've got some serious issues of your own.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Yes they did.. but not everyone is so forgiving simply because they apologized.. oh wait they didn't.. they grudgingly gave us our money back so we wouldn't sue them.. they fully intended to try to get away with defrauding their own customers.
which is why this isn't a consumer protection issue, and simply nerd rage going strong after 2 years. It's people holding a grudge, who actually lost absolutely nothing.
You should probably learn what "nerd rage" is before using it in a sentence.
This is "consumer rage" not frustration due to an overly difficult/obtuse game mechanic.
And a product being a good value doesnt give the producing company right to defraud customers. Whether its $50 or a million fraud is fraud. In this case though it would have been a class action suit making the combined damage in the range of millions easily.
YOU WERE NOT DEFRAUDED!!!!!
When are you going to get that???
IF YOU DIDN'T WANT TO PLAY THE NGE YOU CANCELLED YOUR SUBSCRIPTION...
IF YOU DIDN'T WANT THE EXPANSION YOU GOT YOUR MONEY BACK...
EVERYTHING ELSE YOU EVER PAID FOR YOU RECEIVED IN SPADES...
This is, in fact, nerd rage, because regardless of how many times you say "consumer" or "fraud" or anything else, those facts in caps above are just that...and the only thing that happened is they "nerfed" your game...and two years later you're still not over it.
IF YOU DIDN'T WANT TO PLAY THE NGE YOU CANCELLED YOUR SUBSCRIPTION... IF YOU DIDN'T WANT THE EXPANSION YOU GOT YOUR MONEY BACK... EVERYTHING ELSE YOU EVER PAID FOR YOU RECEIVED IN SPADES... This is, in fact, nerd rage, because regardless of how many times you say "consumer" or "fraud" or anything else, those facts in caps above are just that...and the only thing that happened is they "nerfed" your game...and two years later you're still not over it.
Until SOE reversed its policy on "no refunds, no returns" on ToOW, we were not going to get our money back.
We HAD been defrauded by being promised a product that had many of its features removed by the NGE.
Up until the instant SOE reversed its policy because it was exposed to bait and switch fraud legal action.
Period.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
IF YOU DIDN'T WANT TO PLAY THE NGE YOU CANCELLED YOUR SUBSCRIPTION... IF YOU DIDN'T WANT THE EXPANSION YOU GOT YOUR MONEY BACK... EVERYTHING ELSE YOU EVER PAID FOR YOU RECEIVED IN SPADES... This is, in fact, nerd rage, because regardless of how many times you say "consumer" or "fraud" or anything else, those facts in caps above are just that...and the only thing that happened is they "nerfed" your game...and two years later you're still not over it.
This is about a disreputable company and shady business practices not about a specific incident or whether or not it was resolved.
When are you going to get that?
The NGE/TOOW fraud attempt was just the sidewinder missle that finally brought down the already bullet riddled plane called "customer trust".
Vincenz sounds like some 16 year old armchair lawyer that thinks he knows the Law. You know squat. SOE knows they broke the law and so did the other 300,000 people that wanted refunds. (300k subs lost so thats where im getting these numbers from).Thats why SOE offered refunds. Just because they were not sued didn't mean a class action lawsuit was not being pre-paired. Even if just a 150,000 people signed the class action lawsuit you dont think a judge would let this go to trial? Do the math you ignorant little troll.
However, the matter of SOE's lousy reputation persists to this day, and you'll find people dicussing it whereever the magic three letters NGE appear. Companies that engage in this sort of consumer fraud may avoid being hauled into court over their actions, but they seldom manage to live down their reputations until the individuals responsible for those reputations move on.
SOE is a profitable division of Sony with annual revenues around 150 million dollars. They continue to expand their holdings, and EQ and EQ II continue to be big successes. Pirates of the Burning Sea is looking to do quite well. Yeah...they're really struggling.
You can speculate all you like about what was actionable and what wasn't, but the simple fact is...they were never accused of or convicted of anything outside of an internet forum.
And if you'd like to discuss whether or not people's angered reaction in the few days between the release of the expansion and the refunding of the money was nerd rage or consumer reaction, it's a whole different discussion.
This is TWO YEARS LATER...TWO YEARS AFTER THE REFUND...TWO YEARS AFTER THE NGE...TWO YEARS AFTER NO ONE LOST ANY MONEY...therefore NOW, it is nothing but nerd rage.
Until SOE reversed its policy on "no refunds, no returns" on ToOW, we were not going to get our money back. We HAD been defrauded by being promised a product that had many of its features removed by the NGE. Up until the instant SOE reversed its policy because it was exposed to bait and switch fraud legal action. Period.
LOL...until SOE reversed it's policy we were not going to get our money back???
IT WAS FOUR DAYS between the announcement of the NGE and the announcement of the refund policy.
This is TWO YEARS LATER...TWO YEARS AFTER THE REFUND...TWO YEARS AFTER THE NGE...TWO YEARS AFTER NO ONE LOST ANY MONEY..
This is exactly the reason i think the SWG PRE CU community is the best in MMO ever.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
As for SOE's other holdings several of them are being dropped over the next couple years because they are no longer profitable.
EQ and EQ2s numbers jumped when the NGE happened and have been in decline since.
Every game that SOE has aquired since the fraud incident has been backed by fervent assurances by SOE executives that they have changed their ways and wont attempt to defraud their customers again.
Despite their assurances those games don't recover from their steeply declining subscription numbers.
They may still be netting 150 million but for a multi-billion dollar company thats barely keeping itself in the black.
The more you talk the more you sound like a shill and/or SOE fanboi.
However, the matter of SOE's lousy reputation persists to this day, and you'll find people dicussing it whereever the magic three letters NGE appear. Companies that engage in this sort of consumer fraud may avoid being hauled into court over their actions, but they seldom manage to live down their reputations until the individuals responsible for those reputations move on.
SOE is a profitable division of Sony with annual revenues around 150 million dollars. They continue to expand their holdings, and EQ and EQ II continue to be big successes. Pirates of the Burning Sea is looking to do quite well. Yeah...they're really struggling.
You can speculate all you like about what was actionable and what wasn't, but the simple fact is...they were never accused of or convicted of anything outside of an internet forum.
And if you'd like to discuss whether or not people's angered reaction in the few days between the release of the expansion and the refunding of the money was nerd rage or consumer reaction, it's a whole different discussion.
This is TWO YEARS LATER...TWO YEARS AFTER THE REFUND...TWO YEARS AFTER THE NGE...TWO YEARS AFTER NO ONE LOST ANY MONEY...therefore NOW, it is nothing but nerd rage.
Two years later, people still are wary of SOE.
PotBS made it very clear that SOE would have no impact on the game play. They did that to insulate themselves from SOE's terrible reputation.
"Nerd rage" seems to be pretty powerful, Vincenz, since parties totally not connected to SWG take pains to make such distinctions.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Until SOE reversed its policy on "no refunds, no returns" on ToOW, we were not going to get our money back. We HAD been defrauded by being promised a product that had many of its features removed by the NGE. Up until the instant SOE reversed its policy because it was exposed to bait and switch fraud legal action. Period.
LOL...until SOE reversed it's policy we were not going to get our money back???
IT WAS FOUR DAYS between the announcement of the NGE and the announcement of the refund policy.
FOUR DAYS!
TWO YEARS AGO!
People still talk about the "New Coke" debacle of 1985 as if it were yesterday.
Coca-Cola moved swiftly to reverse its poor decision, but it's still talked about.
As the right way to deal with "nerd (consumer) rage".
SOE did not reverse the NGE.
So they're not being held up as a good way to deal with "nerd (consumer) rage".
SOE avoided the inevitable litigation by abandoning its "no returns, no refunds" policy on ToOW.
It did not avoid the reputation hit for drastically altering their product.
The meltdown of the account servers with cancellations was not mitigated.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
People still talk about the "New Coke" debacle of 1985 as if it were yesterday.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
BTW...just let it be what it's really about for god's sake, you even said it yourself in the last post:
"SOE did not reverse the NGE."
All this really boils down to is, the developers of Star Wars Galaxies changed my game in a way I didn't like, and I still want to scream about it 2 years later.
You didn't get "ripped off"...you're not "protecting consumers"...you're not "outraged by fraudulent business practices"...
you're screaming a 2 year long nerd rage about a game nerf to an MMO you used to play.
People still talk about the "New Coke" debacle of 1985 as if it were yesterday.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
Yes because whenever a company defrauds its customers we should just immediately forgive and forget and "let it go" that will most certainly prevent other companies from seeing the results and trying it themselves.
Oh and dont pretend to know us all and make such sweeping generalizations as saying were all just mad because they "changed the game in a way we didnt like". You've already proven yourself incapable of understanding simple facts and motivations when they are stated to you plainly. So you really shouldn't try to psychoanalyze us.
People still talk about the "New Coke" debacle of 1985 as if it were yesterday.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
Yes because whenever a company defrauds its customers we should just immediately forgive and forget and "let it go" that will most certainly prevent other companies from seeing the results and not trying it themselves.
LOL...so wait, now Coca Cola defrauded it's customers by changing the recipe for Coke...and advertising it as a changed recipe???
Wow...are you sure that the same reptillian, shape changing aliens aren't running SOE as were running Coca Cola...
BTW, you weren't defrauded...I say that again, because it's important. Can you point me to the lost dollars you suffered? Oh...that's right...you can't. A loss is kind of an integral part in claiming fraud...just so you know.
Until SOE reversed its "no return, no refund" policy, people were demanding a refund saying that SOE had defrauded their purchase of ToOW with the NGE, and were told to pound sand.
The fact that SOE saw the light and offered refunds does not change the fact that fraud was there and was actionable.
SOE avoided a bullet by reversing their policy.
That does in no way erase their actions at all. Fraud was committed, but never litigated, because SOE reversed their policy and gave people their money back.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Until SOE reversed its "no return, no refund" policy, people were demanding a refund saying that SOE had defrauded their purchase of ToOW with the NGE, and were told to pound sand.
...actually, they weren't told to "pound sand"...they weren't told anything...for that enormous FOUR DAY PERIOD OF TIME...LESS THAN ONE HUNDRED HOURS...THAT OCCURRED TWO YEARS AGO.
LOL...so wait, now Coca Cola defrauded it's customers by changing the recipe for Coke...and advertising it as a changed recipe??? Wow...are you sure that the same reptillian, shape changing aliens aren't running SOE as were running Coca Cola... BTW, you weren't defrauded...I say that again, because it's important. Can you point me to the lost dollars you suffered? Oh...that's right...you can't. A loss is kind of an integral part in claiming fraud...just so you know.
I'm not talking about Coke.
I lost $50 for 4 days while they emphatically told me to go fsck myself every time I asked for a refund. The fact they did eventually relent and make reparations doesn't change what happened or their intentions.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! "I lost 50 dollars for 4 days...2 years ago...and then I got it back...2 years ago...and I"m still enraged".
BTW, you know how I guarantee this is nerd rage?
IF SOE announced tomorrow a rollback to pre NGE, you two would be stocking up on red bull and pop tarts preparing for 72 hour gaming sessions immediately.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! "I lost 50 dollars for 4 days...2 years ago...and then I got it back...2 years ago...and I"m still enraged".
BTW, you know how I guarantee this is nerd rage?
IF SOE announced tomorrow a rollback to pre NGE, you two would be stocking up on red bull and pop tarts preparing for 72 hour gaming sessions immediately.
Again with the insults and assumptions.
Dont pretend to know me because you don't and it only makes you look like a fool.
I wouldnt play an SOE game again if they paid me.
And as I said before.. fraud is fraud the amount of money and time before it was returned doesnt matter if I want to still be pissed about it thats my right.
People still talk about the "New Coke" debacle of 1985 as if it were yesterday.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
BTW...just let it be what it's really about for god's sake, you even said it yourself in the last post:
"SOE did not reverse the NGE."
All this really boils down to is, the developers of Star Wars Galaxies changed my game in a way I didn't like, and I still want to scream about it 2 years later.
You didn't get "ripped off"...you're not "protecting consumers"...you're not "outraged by fraudulent business practices"...
you're screaming a 2 year long nerd rage about a game nerf to an MMO you used to play.
You know, petulant one, that some time back, a few months, there was a thread about the possiblity of a class action suit over the NGE itself, not the obvious fraud of bait and switch that took place with ToOW.
I pointed out in that thread that the legal basis for such an action was pretty thin, at best. That you'd have to find someone with pretty deep pockets and a passion for creating a new precedent...the hope of somehow importing legal precedent from China, of all places, into the US legal system.
You're also conflating two separate issues, one the ToOW fraud and second consumer outrage over the NGE in general.
SOE's rep is toast, justifiably so, and all your fanboi nonsense and childish crying of "nerd rage" will not change that.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
It was a sad sad sad day when NGE rolled out (well for us Jedi it was). All those months of grinding and grinding to master your jedi and then get a cheap "elder cloak" when NGE rolled. I remeber the forums back then saying this is what "stars wars" should have been. Oh well can't wait till the new KOTOR MMO comes out.
It's been 'only' 2 years, please create some more threads about the NGE.
Until SOE reversed its "no return, no refund" policy, people were demanding a refund saying that SOE had defrauded their purchase of ToOW with the NGE, and were told to pound sand.
...actually, they weren't told to "pound sand"...they weren't told anything...for that enormous FOUR DAY PERIOD OF TIME...LESS THAN ONE HUNDRED HOURS...THAT OCCURRED TWO YEARS AGO.
In retrospect it was a four day wait.
At the time, it was we will never refund your money for this product we falsely sold to you as an expansion for a game that we secretly were planning to radically change for the last six months.
You can't unring the bell, Vincenz. If you were actually a lawyer you'd be more than familar with that particular expression.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
LOL...I have to chuckle a little everytime I'm called a "fanboi"...
I quit SWG the day after the CU came out, and haven't played an SOE game since, for the record.
You know why I"m not in any of the other "NGE sucks" threads? Because they are filled with people who are at least being truthful. They're simply saying they miss the game they used to love and that the NGE ruined it. You two, however, want to claim that you're on an SWG forum 2 years after you cancelled, because you're so outraged by SOE business practices and are consumer advocates...
It's kind of ridiculous.
You're here just like everyone else, because you are still pissed that the NGE changed your game. Period. Nothing more, nothing less.
Comments
which is why this isn't a consumer protection issue, and simply nerd rage going strong after 2 years. It's people holding a grudge, who actually lost absolutely nothing.
You should probably learn what "nerd rage" is before using it in a sentence.
This is "consumer rage" not frustration due to an overly difficult/obtuse game mechanic.
And a product being a good value doesnt give the producing company right to defraud customers. Whether its $50 or a million fraud is fraud. In this case though it would have been a class action suit making the combined damage in the range of millions easily.
The disclaimer is "experience may change during online play" not "product description may be fraudulent".
which is why this isn't a consumer protection issue, and simply nerd rage going strong after 2 years. It's people holding a grudge, who actually lost absolutely nothing.
BTW, it's more than a little amusing to me that a company who clearly provided you with more enjoyment than you've ever had in life (judging by the rage you're still carrying around 2 years later) for what, like 2 years...for next to no cost...becomes the anti-christ and a borderline criminal organization because they changed the game in a way they saw fit.
Why don't you just say "hey...thanks for the incredibly inexpensive fun you provided me...and good luck with your new thing".
Two years ago, it was a valid, actionable consumer issue.
That was solved by SOE reversing its long standing policy of "no returns, no refunds" on expansions in the case of those dissatisfied with the changes to ToOW that the NGE imposed, thus drastically altering the value of ToOW to many who had purchased it.
That solved the litigation issue.
However, the matter of SOE's lousy reputation persists to this day, and you'll find people dicussing it whereever the magic three letters NGE appear.
Companies that engage in this sort of consumer fraud may avoid being hauled into court over their actions, but they seldom manage to live down their reputations until the individuals responsible for those reputations move on, and the policies they supported are rescinded and the company makes amends.
Smedley not only has not moved on, he's publically stated that the NGE was a mistake, although not with the degree of candor, remorse, and action necessary to appease those who were very understandably angry as a result of SOE's actions.
Dismissing something like this that was prior to the offering of the refunds an actionable legal matter as "nerd rage" indicates that you've got some serious issues of your own.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
which is why this isn't a consumer protection issue, and simply nerd rage going strong after 2 years. It's people holding a grudge, who actually lost absolutely nothing.
You should probably learn what "nerd rage" is before using it in a sentence.
This is "consumer rage" not frustration due to an overly difficult/obtuse game mechanic.
And a product being a good value doesnt give the producing company right to defraud customers. Whether its $50 or a million fraud is fraud. In this case though it would have been a class action suit making the combined damage in the range of millions easily.
YOU WERE NOT DEFRAUDED!!!!!
When are you going to get that???
IF YOU DIDN'T WANT TO PLAY THE NGE YOU CANCELLED YOUR SUBSCRIPTION...
IF YOU DIDN'T WANT THE EXPANSION YOU GOT YOUR MONEY BACK...
EVERYTHING ELSE YOU EVER PAID FOR YOU RECEIVED IN SPADES...
This is, in fact, nerd rage, because regardless of how many times you say "consumer" or "fraud" or anything else, those facts in caps above are just that...and the only thing that happened is they "nerfed" your game...and two years later you're still not over it.
Until SOE reversed its policy on "no refunds, no returns" on ToOW, we were not going to get our money back.
We HAD been defrauded by being promised a product that had many of its features removed by the NGE.
Up until the instant SOE reversed its policy because it was exposed to bait and switch fraud legal action.
Period.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
This is about a disreputable company and shady business practices not about a specific incident or whether or not it was resolved.
When are you going to get that?
The NGE/TOOW fraud attempt was just the sidewinder missle that finally brought down the already bullet riddled plane called "customer trust".
SOE is a profitable division of Sony with annual revenues around 150 million dollars. They continue to expand their holdings, and EQ and EQ II continue to be big successes. Pirates of the Burning Sea is looking to do quite well. Yeah...they're really struggling.
You can speculate all you like about what was actionable and what wasn't, but the simple fact is...they were never accused of or convicted of anything outside of an internet forum.
And if you'd like to discuss whether or not people's angered reaction in the few days between the release of the expansion and the refunding of the money was nerd rage or consumer reaction, it's a whole different discussion.
This is TWO YEARS LATER...TWO YEARS AFTER THE REFUND...TWO YEARS AFTER THE NGE...TWO YEARS AFTER NO ONE LOST ANY MONEY...therefore NOW, it is nothing but nerd rage.
LOL...until SOE reversed it's policy we were not going to get our money back???
IT WAS FOUR DAYS between the announcement of the NGE and the announcement of the refund policy.
FOUR DAYS!
TWO YEARS AGO!
This is exactly the reason i think the SWG PRE CU community is the best in MMO ever.
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
As for SOE's other holdings several of them are being dropped over the next couple years because they are no longer profitable.
EQ and EQ2s numbers jumped when the NGE happened and have been in decline since.
Every game that SOE has aquired since the fraud incident has been backed by fervent assurances by SOE executives that they have changed their ways and wont attempt to defraud their customers again.
Despite their assurances those games don't recover from their steeply declining subscription numbers.
They may still be netting 150 million but for a multi-billion dollar company thats barely keeping itself in the black.
The more you talk the more you sound like a shill and/or SOE fanboi.
SOE is a profitable division of Sony with annual revenues around 150 million dollars. They continue to expand their holdings, and EQ and EQ II continue to be big successes. Pirates of the Burning Sea is looking to do quite well. Yeah...they're really struggling.
You can speculate all you like about what was actionable and what wasn't, but the simple fact is...they were never accused of or convicted of anything outside of an internet forum.
And if you'd like to discuss whether or not people's angered reaction in the few days between the release of the expansion and the refunding of the money was nerd rage or consumer reaction, it's a whole different discussion.
This is TWO YEARS LATER...TWO YEARS AFTER THE REFUND...TWO YEARS AFTER THE NGE...TWO YEARS AFTER NO ONE LOST ANY MONEY...therefore NOW, it is nothing but nerd rage.
Two years later, people still are wary of SOE.
PotBS made it very clear that SOE would have no impact on the game play. They did that to insulate themselves from SOE's terrible reputation.
"Nerd rage" seems to be pretty powerful, Vincenz, since parties totally not connected to SWG take pains to make such distinctions.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
LOL...until SOE reversed it's policy we were not going to get our money back???
IT WAS FOUR DAYS between the announcement of the NGE and the announcement of the refund policy.
FOUR DAYS!
TWO YEARS AGO!
People still talk about the "New Coke" debacle of 1985 as if it were yesterday.
Coca-Cola moved swiftly to reverse its poor decision, but it's still talked about.
As the right way to deal with "nerd (consumer) rage".
SOE did not reverse the NGE.
So they're not being held up as a good way to deal with "nerd (consumer) rage".
SOE avoided the inevitable litigation by abandoning its "no returns, no refunds" policy on ToOW.
It did not avoid the reputation hit for drastically altering their product.
The meltdown of the account servers with cancellations was not mitigated.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
LOL..really? You pick that up in your sleep Kreskin? Can you post the winning lottery numbers for tomorrow as well?
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
BTW...just let it be what it's really about for god's sake, you even said it yourself in the last post:
"SOE did not reverse the NGE."
All this really boils down to is, the developers of Star Wars Galaxies changed my game in a way I didn't like, and I still want to scream about it 2 years later.
You didn't get "ripped off"...you're not "protecting consumers"...you're not "outraged by fraudulent business practices"...
you're screaming a 2 year long nerd rage about a game nerf to an MMO you used to play.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
Yes because whenever a company defrauds its customers we should just immediately forgive and forget and "let it go" that will most certainly prevent other companies from seeing the results and trying it themselves.
Oh and dont pretend to know us all and make such sweeping generalizations as saying were all just mad because they "changed the game in a way we didnt like". You've already proven yourself incapable of understanding simple facts and motivations when they are stated to you plainly. So you really shouldn't try to psychoanalyze us.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
Yes because whenever a company defrauds its customers we should just immediately forgive and forget and "let it go" that will most certainly prevent other companies from seeing the results and not trying it themselves.
LOL...so wait, now Coca Cola defrauded it's customers by changing the recipe for Coke...and advertising it as a changed recipe???
Wow...are you sure that the same reptillian, shape changing aliens aren't running SOE as were running Coca Cola...
BTW, you weren't defrauded...I say that again, because it's important. Can you point me to the lost dollars you suffered? Oh...that's right...you can't. A loss is kind of an integral part in claiming fraud...just so you know.
Until SOE reversed its "no return, no refund" policy, people were demanding a refund saying that SOE had defrauded their purchase of ToOW with the NGE, and were told to pound sand.
The fact that SOE saw the light and offered refunds does not change the fact that fraud was there and was actionable.
SOE avoided a bullet by reversing their policy.
That does in no way erase their actions at all. Fraud was committed, but never litigated, because SOE reversed their policy and gave people their money back.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
...actually, they weren't told to "pound sand"...they weren't told anything...for that enormous FOUR DAY PERIOD OF TIME...LESS THAN ONE HUNDRED HOURS...THAT OCCURRED TWO YEARS AGO.
I lost $50 for 4 days while they emphatically told me to go fsck myself every time I asked for a refund. The fact they did eventually relent and make reparations doesn't change what happened or their intentions.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! "I lost 50 dollars for 4 days...2 years ago...and then I got it back...2 years ago...and I"m still enraged".
BTW, you know how I guarantee this is nerd rage?
IF SOE announced tomorrow a rollback to pre NGE, you two would be stocking up on red bull and pop tarts preparing for 72 hour gaming sessions immediately.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! "I lost 50 dollars for 4 days...2 years ago...and then I got it back...2 years ago...and I"m still enraged".
BTW, you know how I guarantee this is nerd rage?
IF SOE announced tomorrow a rollback to pre NGE, you two would be stocking up on red bull and pop tarts preparing for 72 hour gaming sessions immediately.
Again with the insults and assumptions.
Dont pretend to know me because you don't and it only makes you look like a fool.
I wouldnt play an SOE game again if they paid me.
And as I said before.. fraud is fraud the amount of money and time before it was returned doesnt matter if I want to still be pissed about it thats my right.
LOL...who the hell are you hanging around with??? The last time I heard about the "New Coke Debacle of 1985" (other than right now) was in 1985...
Jesus man, let some things go in life...it's just too short.
BTW...just let it be what it's really about for god's sake, you even said it yourself in the last post:
"SOE did not reverse the NGE."
All this really boils down to is, the developers of Star Wars Galaxies changed my game in a way I didn't like, and I still want to scream about it 2 years later.
You didn't get "ripped off"...you're not "protecting consumers"...you're not "outraged by fraudulent business practices"...
you're screaming a 2 year long nerd rage about a game nerf to an MMO you used to play.
You know, petulant one, that some time back, a few months, there was a thread about the possiblity of a class action suit over the NGE itself, not the obvious fraud of bait and switch that took place with ToOW.
I pointed out in that thread that the legal basis for such an action was pretty thin, at best. That you'd have to find someone with pretty deep pockets and a passion for creating a new precedent...the hope of somehow importing legal precedent from China, of all places, into the US legal system.
You're also conflating two separate issues, one the ToOW fraud and second consumer outrage over the NGE in general.
SOE's rep is toast, justifiably so, and all your fanboi nonsense and childish crying of "nerd rage" will not change that.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
It's been 'only' 2 years, please create some more threads about the NGE.
...actually, they weren't told to "pound sand"...they weren't told anything...for that enormous FOUR DAY PERIOD OF TIME...LESS THAN ONE HUNDRED HOURS...THAT OCCURRED TWO YEARS AGO.
In retrospect it was a four day wait.
At the time, it was we will never refund your money for this product we falsely sold to you as an expansion for a game that we secretly were planning to radically change for the last six months.
You can't unring the bell, Vincenz. If you were actually a lawyer you'd be more than familar with that particular expression.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
LOL...I have to chuckle a little everytime I'm called a "fanboi"...
I quit SWG the day after the CU came out, and haven't played an SOE game since, for the record.
You know why I"m not in any of the other "NGE sucks" threads? Because they are filled with people who are at least being truthful. They're simply saying they miss the game they used to love and that the NGE ruined it. You two, however, want to claim that you're on an SWG forum 2 years after you cancelled, because you're so outraged by SOE business practices and are consumer advocates...
It's kind of ridiculous.
You're here just like everyone else, because you are still pissed that the NGE changed your game. Period. Nothing more, nothing less.