In retrospect it was a four day wait. At the time, it was we will never refund your money for this product we falsely sold to you as an expansion for a game that we secretly were planning to radically change for the last six months. You can't unring the bell, Vincenz. If you were actually a lawyer you'd be more than familar with that particular expression.
LOL...brutha if there's one thing you seem entirely unfamiliar with, it's retrospect.
And yeah, I'm familiar with "unringing the bell"...but that assumes that damage was done that can't be undone.
LOL...I have to chuckle a little everytime I'm called a "fanboi"... I quit SWG the day after the CU came out, and haven't played an SOE game since, for the record.
You know why I"m not in any of the other "NGE sucks" threads? Because they are filled with people who are at least being truthful. They're simply saying they miss the game they used to love and that the NGE ruined it. You two, however, want to claim that you're on an SWG forum 2 years after you cancelled, because you're so outraged by SOE business practices and are consumer advocates... It's kind of ridiculous. You're here just like everyone else, because you are still pissed that the NGE changed your game. Period. Nothing more, nothing less.
Never said I didnt miss the game but SOE changing it was their right and nothing to be angry about.
If that was the whole story I wouldn't be here.
SOE is a company that lies habitually to its customers.. I had become quite fed up with it when the TOOW debacle occurred. Adding fraud to the list of offenses against their customers was the final straw.
And actually "unringing the bell" refers to information that once given, cannot be simply ignored by the jury regardless of a judges instruction to disregard.
In a more general sense though it can refer to anything that cannot be "undone" once done usually its in regard to commiting a crime then trying to undo the damage in order to not be prosecuted.
Returning the money taken from a bank robbery doesn't "unring the bell" and negate the crime for example.
Never said I didnt miss the game but SOE changing it was their right and nothing to be angry about.
If that was the whole story I wouldn't be here. SOE is a company that lies habitually to its customers.. I had become quite fed up with it when the TOOW debacle occurred. Adding fraud to the list of offenses against their customers was the final straw.
LOL...I see. So you're here as a Public Service Announcement because of your years of accumulated outrage over the business practices of SOE.
It has nothing to do with the NGE.
RIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT.
Oh...btw, how do you possibly say
"No the problem is that the NGE removed 80% of what we loved of the game, didn't give anything back, and wasn't justifiable with anything but "we got greedy" in the first place. There was no reason for it."
or
subscribing to Vanguard?
or
"Its not that we don't want to like the NGE in fact many of us (myself included) still have an active SWG account and the game installed.. trust me.. every week or two I log in and try my hardest to find interest in the game again because it was a game that I loved"
or
" Until then its not that I'm angry or hate SOE they just don't have a game I like"
In retrospect it was a four day wait. At the time, it was we will never refund your money for this product we falsely sold to you as an expansion for a game that we secretly were planning to radically change for the last six months. You can't unring the bell, Vincenz. If you were actually a lawyer you'd be more than familar with that particular expression.
LOL...brutha if there's one thing you seem entirely unfamiliar with, it's retrospect.
And yeah, I'm familiar with "unringing the bell"...but that assumes that damage was done that can't be undone.
Can you show me that here?
Other than hurt feelings and sad pandas.
Vincenz, are you just prenatally obtuse, or is your obtuseness a nurtured condition?
You keep harping on the four day wait, but that's viewing the event from now, not at the time (that is, in retrospect).
At the time, SOE was being intransigent and telling its pissed off customers that no, we've taken your money, and we're not going to give it back, even though we advertised and sold this expansion with features we knew we were going to take away two weeks after we formally published it.
BTW, the damage has been done by SOE on hundreds of thousands of their former customers. The fraud, while mitigated by refunds, still occurred. SOE has had it in their power all along to react, as Coke did to a change in their product, and reverse the NGE decision, but have elected not to.
Unlike Coke, who managed to avoid torrential loss of market share by reversing their poorly thought out decision (the bell was not unrung, but at least they did something about it to make its ringing much less damaging) SOE has barrelled, full speed ahead, into well deserved laughingstock status in the MMO industry.
BTW, I know what retrospect is, and I'm using it correctly. You're problem is that what you're talking about is proportionality, and you're using retrospect in place of that concept. Your argument seems to be that those of us still talking about this have no sense of proportion. You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how blind it is to the feelings and hurt pandas of others.
The entire "get over it, it's just a game" argument is denigratiing and indicates that because you're not personally affected by it, no one else should be concerned either.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
LOL...lemme guess sio, just like your girl here, you're also still paying for a SWG sub and paying for Vanguard...while you're so outraged at SOE
jesus.
p.s. Fray's so outraged, she still give SOE money every month. How much do you give the evil ones?
Actually, I cancelled two accounts when the NGE came out, and I've not paid a penny to SOE or the Lucas empire for any of their products or services since.
When they've offered vet trials, I've taken them up on their offer, however.
But no money has changed hands, I doubt very much that even if they brought back the pre CU and swore up on down on a stack of bibles that they won't do anything remotely like the NGE ever again, I would not take them up on their offer.
At this point in time, their history of dishonesty is too well established for me to consider doing business with such disreputable entities ever again.
If they ditch Smedley, and turn over a new leaf, I'll reconsider. But Smedley is more concerned with ways of picking the pockets of gamers than enhancing their gaming experience.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
or the Lucas empire for any of their products or services since.
Well, that's a shame...and that kind of bitterness is exactly why I think this whole resentment is unhealthy.
I guarantee I'll be enjoying the hell out of The Force Unleashed myself.
till they decide to make it more "iconic"..
for the sake of developers and because "they see a way these fit to them" lol
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
or the Lucas empire for any of their products or services since.
Well, that's a shame...and that kind of bitterness is exactly why I think this whole resentment is unhealthy.
I guarantee I'll be enjoying the hell out of The Force Unleashed myself.
Actually, SOE and LA gave the players of SWG no other option but to withhold their patronage to send them a message. We pleaded with them not to do this, and they ignored our pleas.
It appears that even denying them the only thing they love...our money...isn't enough to send a message to them.
BTW, The Force Unleashed could be a tremendous stinking pile of bantha poodoo. So don't count your kaadus before they're hatched.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Umm.. none of that contradicts anything Ive said so far. I don't like the NGE so what? Who does? Even in the quotes you just pulled I say Im not mad about that.. I'm pissed at SOE for being a greedy lying cheating frauding company that cant be trusted.
As for the "giving money" accusations I haven't paid for my swg account in years but SOE doesn't turn it off and at the time I was playing Vanguard it wasn't an SOE game.
Did you actually read the post history or just pull out everything that said "SWG"?
I just think it's time for everyone to get over it now, SWG was only a game and shit happens, nothing lasts forever. Theres much more important things out there anyways like seeing the world."
Hypocrite.
Instead of trolling the SWG refuge forums, why don't you leave you're computer and go outside. LOL.
BTW, The Force Unleashed could be a tremendous stinking pile of bantha poodoo. So don't count your kaadus before they're hatched.
I've followed it pretty closely, know the story, have seen the engine, and am pretty optimistic. Either way, it earned my dollar already.
as far as Iconic goes...I truly don't care. I could give a rat's ass how "true to the SW universe" the game is, as long as I have fun playing it.
One reason to be pessimistic...
Julio "Tora! Tora!! TORRES!!!" is a producer on that project...
LOL.
When my guild picked up and moved lock, stock and bantha to WoW after the NGE, my little WoW tagline was "Founder, Julio Torres fan club".
Kai "Helliass"
Nancy "illiterall"
Jeff Friedmann
Julio "Tora! tora!" tores <---------
Rogue "plant a toilet in living room when boss order"
Smed
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
As for the "giving money" accusations I haven't paid for my swg account in years but SOE doesn't turn it off and at the time I was playing Vanguard it wasn't an SOE game.
Did you actually read the post history or just pull out everything that said "SWG"?
LOL...so you're saying you've had 2 free years of SWG subscription through some clerical error...and log on every month...for free...
but SOE is the crooks???
That makes you either a thief or a liar.
pick one.
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
one more time, I need to get my "Illegible to English" dictionary.
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
one more time, I need to get my "Illegible to English" dictionary.
please you will miss the fun else ....
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
If there's one piece of software that SOE/LA would be sure to have operating at zero bug tolerance, it's the billing system.
So it's interesting that such an error has not been corrected over such an extended period of time.
I mean, I can understand four days, but two years?
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
If there's one piece of software that SOE/LA would be sure to have operating at zero bug tolerance, it's the billing system.
So it's interesting that such an error has not been corrected over such an extended period of time.
I mean, I can understand four days, but two years?
who cares i mean "2 YEARS .." they a nerds if they would care about lol..
Seriously.. they have to get over it
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Comments
LOL...brutha if there's one thing you seem entirely unfamiliar with, it's retrospect.
And yeah, I'm familiar with "unringing the bell"...but that assumes that damage was done that can't be undone.
Can you show me that here?
Other than hurt feelings and sad pandas.
Never said I didnt miss the game but SOE changing it was their right and nothing to be angry about.
If that was the whole story I wouldn't be here.
SOE is a company that lies habitually to its customers.. I had become quite fed up with it when the TOOW debacle occurred. Adding fraud to the list of offenses against their customers was the final straw.
And actually "unringing the bell" refers to information that once given, cannot be simply ignored by the jury regardless of a judges instruction to disregard.
In a more general sense though it can refer to anything that cannot be "undone" once done usually its in regard to commiting a crime then trying to undo the damage in order to not be prosecuted.
Returning the money taken from a bank robbery doesn't "unring the bell" and negate the crime for example.
LOL...I see. So you're here as a Public Service Announcement because of your years of accumulated outrage over the business practices of SOE.
It has nothing to do with the NGE.
RIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT.
Oh...btw, how do you possibly say
"No the problem is that the NGE removed 80% of what we loved of the game, didn't give anything back, and wasn't justifiable with anything but "we got greedy" in the first place. There was no reason for it."
or
subscribing to Vanguard?
or
"Its not that we don't want to like the NGE in fact many of us (myself included) still have an active SWG account and the game installed.. trust me.. every week or two I log in and try my hardest to find interest in the game again because it was a game that I loved"
or
" Until then its not that I'm angry or hate SOE they just don't have a game I like"
MAN...posting history's a bitch, huh?
LOL...brutha if there's one thing you seem entirely unfamiliar with, it's retrospect.
And yeah, I'm familiar with "unringing the bell"...but that assumes that damage was done that can't be undone.
Can you show me that here?
Other than hurt feelings and sad pandas.
Vincenz, are you just prenatally obtuse, or is your obtuseness a nurtured condition?
You keep harping on the four day wait, but that's viewing the event from now, not at the time (that is, in retrospect).
At the time, SOE was being intransigent and telling its pissed off customers that no, we've taken your money, and we're not going to give it back, even though we advertised and sold this expansion with features we knew we were going to take away two weeks after we formally published it.
BTW, the damage has been done by SOE on hundreds of thousands of their former customers. The fraud, while mitigated by refunds, still occurred. SOE has had it in their power all along to react, as Coke did to a change in their product, and reverse the NGE decision, but have elected not to.
Unlike Coke, who managed to avoid torrential loss of market share by reversing their poorly thought out decision (the bell was not unrung, but at least they did something about it to make its ringing much less damaging) SOE has barrelled, full speed ahead, into well deserved laughingstock status in the MMO industry.
BTW, I know what retrospect is, and I'm using it correctly. You're problem is that what you're talking about is proportionality, and you're using retrospect in place of that concept. Your argument seems to be that those of us still talking about this have no sense of proportion. You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how blind it is to the feelings and hurt pandas of others.
The entire "get over it, it's just a game" argument is denigratiing and indicates that because you're not personally affected by it, no one else should be concerned either.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
LOL...lemme guess sio, just like your girl here, you're also still paying for a SWG sub and paying for Vanguard...while you're so outraged at SOE
jesus.
p.s. Fray's so outraged, she still give SOE money every month. How much do you give the evil ones?
...um...yes...I'm viewing it from now...know why?
it's now.
it's not 2 years ago.
Actually, I cancelled two accounts when the NGE came out, and I've not paid a penny to SOE or the Lucas empire for any of their products or services since.
When they've offered vet trials, I've taken them up on their offer, however.
But no money has changed hands, I doubt very much that even if they brought back the pre CU and swore up on down on a stack of bibles that they won't do anything remotely like the NGE ever again, I would not take them up on their offer.
At this point in time, their history of dishonesty is too well established for me to consider doing business with such disreputable entities ever again.
If they ditch Smedley, and turn over a new leaf, I'll reconsider. But Smedley is more concerned with ways of picking the pockets of gamers than enhancing their gaming experience.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
Well, that's a shame...and that kind of bitterness is exactly why I think this whole resentment is unhealthy.
I guarantee I'll be enjoying the hell out of The Force Unleashed myself.
Well, that's a shame...and that kind of bitterness is exactly why I think this whole resentment is unhealthy.
I guarantee I'll be enjoying the hell out of The Force Unleashed myself.
till they decide to make it more "iconic"..
for the sake of developers and because "they see a way these fit to them" lol
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Well, that's a shame...and that kind of bitterness is exactly why I think this whole resentment is unhealthy.
I guarantee I'll be enjoying the hell out of The Force Unleashed myself.
Actually, SOE and LA gave the players of SWG no other option but to withhold their patronage to send them a message. We pleaded with them not to do this, and they ignored our pleas.
It appears that even denying them the only thing they love...our money...isn't enough to send a message to them.
BTW, The Force Unleashed could be a tremendous stinking pile of bantha poodoo. So don't count your kaadus before they're hatched.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
I've followed it pretty closely, know the story, have seen the engine, and am pretty optimistic. Either way, it earned my dollar already.
as far as Iconic goes...I truly don't care. I could give a rat's ass how "true to the SW universe" the game is, as long as I have fun playing it.
Umm.. none of that contradicts anything Ive said so far. I don't like the NGE so what? Who does? Even in the quotes you just pulled I say Im not mad about that.. I'm pissed at SOE for being a greedy lying cheating frauding company that cant be trusted.
As for the "giving money" accusations I haven't paid for my swg account in years but SOE doesn't turn it off and at the time I was playing Vanguard it wasn't an SOE game.
Did you actually read the post history or just pull out everything that said "SWG"?
I've followed it pretty closely, know the story, have seen the engine, and am pretty optimistic. Either way, it earned my dollar already.
as far as Iconic goes...I truly don't care. I could give a rat's ass how "true to the SW universe" the game is, as long as I have fun playing it.
One reason to be pessimistic...Julio "Tora! Tora!! TORRES!!!" is a producer on that project...
I've followed it pretty closely, know the story, have seen the engine, and am pretty optimistic. Either way, it earned my dollar already.
as far as Iconic goes...I truly don't care. I could give a rat's ass how "true to the SW universe" the game is, as long as I have fun playing it.
Yeah, but LA managed to screw up KOTOR II despite all the good things that were seen during its development.
It could have been so much better if some marketing people at LA had been more patient and less greedy.
When you let marketing asshats make the final call over the good sense of your designers and developers, you're playing with fire.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
I've followed it pretty closely, know the story, have seen the engine, and am pretty optimistic. Either way, it earned my dollar already.
as far as Iconic goes...I truly don't care. I could give a rat's ass how "true to the SW universe" the game is, as long as I have fun playing it.
One reason to be pessimistic...Julio "Tora! Tora!! TORRES!!!" is a producer on that project...
LOL.
When my guild picked up and moved lock, stock and bantha to WoW after the NGE, my little WoW tagline was "Founder, Julio Torres fan club".
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
miffywiffy writes:
"Welcome to 2 years ago?
I just think it's time for everyone to get over it now, SWG was only a game and shit happens, nothing lasts forever. Theres much more important things out there anyways like seeing the world."
Hypocrite.
Instead of trolling the SWG refuge forums, why don't you leave you're computer and go outside. LOL.
No need to boycot LA , they simply have released crap games recently. (how can you hate the guys who created the Monkey Island series?)
LA can have some blame with the NGE mess, but $OE are the ones who actually crapped it out.
$OE I will boycott cause they are
<----- Yay finally used that emote, nancy would be proud of me, no reading, just picture. 
I've followed it pretty closely, know the story, have seen the engine, and am pretty optimistic. Either way, it earned my dollar already.
as far as Iconic goes...I truly don't care. I could give a rat's ass how "true to the SW universe" the game is, as long as I have fun playing it.
One reason to be pessimistic...Julio "Tora! Tora!! TORRES!!!" is a producer on that project...
LOL.
When my guild picked up and moved lock, stock and bantha to WoW after the NGE, my little WoW tagline was "Founder, Julio Torres fan club".
Kai "Helliass"
Nancy "illiterall"
Jeff Friedmann
Julio "Tora! tora!" tores <---------
Rogue "plant a toilet in living room when boss order"
Smed
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
LOL...so you're saying you've had 2 free years of SWG subscription through some clerical error...and log on every month...for free...
but SOE is the crooks???
That makes you either a thief or a liar.
pick one.
EDIT: p.s. The irony is, SOE gave you your money back...but you continue to steal from them.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
one more time, I need to get my "Illegible to English" dictionary.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
one more time, I need to get my "Illegible to English" dictionary.
please you will miss the fun else ....
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
If there's one piece of software that SOE/LA would be sure to have operating at zero bug tolerance, it's the billing system.
So it's interesting that such an error has not been corrected over such an extended period of time.
I mean, I can understand four days, but two years?
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
Especially an account they refunded for the expansion...
seems fishy to me.
funny huh , ironically you fail to see the fun here (capabilities and organisationlevel in collecting subscription fees) and all other things makes you obviously LOL
If there's one piece of software that SOE/LA would be sure to have operating at zero bug tolerance, it's the billing system.
So it's interesting that such an error has not been corrected over such an extended period of time.
I mean, I can understand four days, but two years?
who cares i mean "2 YEARS .." they a nerds if they would care about lol..
Seriously.. they have to get over it
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)